- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by mbbrutman＠brutman.com

Another VCF is upon us ... VCF PNW 2019 takes place March 23rd and 24th at Living Computers:Museum+Labs in Seattle. We have 30 exhibits (up from 20 last year) and six speakers, including Joe Decuir, IEEE Fellow. Our exhibits include: Josh Dersch with Three Rivers PERQ workstations David Cooper with a VAX cluster Vince Slyngstad demonstrating PDP-8 reapirs Foone Turing with his collection of floppy and optical disks Joerg Hoppe with BlinkenBone and UniBone (w/ Josh) Oscar Vermuelen with his replicas of the PDP-8, 11, and LGP-30 Ian Finder, over-achieving with two exhibits and helping on third Alan Perry with his SPARC clones Some rif-raff with their 8 bit home machines. ;-0 Admission is free once you pay to get into the museum. And of course the museum is worth checking out even without us, but we are going to make it that much better. We'll have a consignment room if you want to do some treasure hunting. (If you are looking to sell some treasure, that works too - you don't have to participate in the event to use the consignment room.) Full details can be found at http://vcfed.org/vcf-pnw/ . Or email me directly if you have questions. -Mike

6 years, 9 months

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1983 UBC PDP-11 Unix tools distribution

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Today's tape recovery gem. UBC's PDP-11 UNIX tools distribution ca. 1983 which includes UBC BASIC and their RT-11 emulation. It has a couple of bad blocks, but I couldn't find another copy of this anywhere. http://bitsavers.org/bits/UBC/ If anyone has a complete copy, it would be good to replace it, but most is better than none of it.

6 years, 9 months

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KansasFest 2019

by a2history＠gmail.com

For your interest: MARCH 8, 2019 ? KansasFest 2019, the 31st annual Apple II convention, is scheduled for July 16 ? 21 in Kansas City, Missouri. Mark Pelczarski of Penguin Software, well-known for numerous graphics utilities, books, and games, will join us with a keynote presentation to celebrate the Apple II. Pelczarski began publishing graphics-related Apple II software in 1978 while in his early 20?s under the brands Penguin Software and Polarware <http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/index.htm>. He is an entrepreneur, author, programmer, consultant, and professional educator. Mark is well known for the Graphics Magician <http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/graphics.htm> software, a toolkit for creating graphics that includes over 50 major software publishers as customers including Random House, Sierra Online, Spinnaker, and Mattel. He wrote monthly columns for Softalk and the book Graphically Speaking. Besides pioneering computer graphics, Polarware published numerous games including Transylvania <http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/adventures.htm>, The Coveted Mirror <http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/adventures.htm>, and Spy?s Demise <http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/arcade.htm>. After leaving Polarware in 1987, Mark turned his attention to computer music and to online courses. Mark once said ?I like to make computers do things,? <https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1985-03-01-8501120306-story.html> so he?ll surely fit in at KansasFest. KansasFest is an annual convention offering Apple II users and retrocomputing enthusiasts the opportunity to engage in beginner and technical sessions, programming contests, exhibition halls, and camaraderie. KansasFest was originally hosted by Resource Central and has been brought to you by the KFest committee since 1995. Any and all Apple II users, fans, and friends are invited to attend this year's event. Registration details will be announced on the KansasFest Web site, and registration will open on March 31. For photos, videos, and presentations from past KansasFests, please visit the event's official Website <http://www.kansasfest.org/>. CONTACT: KansasFest 2019 http://www.kansasfest.org/ <http://www.kansasfest.org/>http://twitter.com/kansasfest/ <http://twitter.com/kansasfest/> https://www.facebook.com/events/2286816188228271/ <https://www.facebook.com/events/2286816188228271/> -------------------------------------------------------------- Steven Weyhrich <IX0YE>?<

6 years, 9 months

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Unix tools, Bill Webb, UBC, TRIUMF

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

I recovered several pieces of Unix media ? all of which I think made it into TUHS/PUPS collection - at UBC in the mid-1990?s while I was working at TRIUMF. Those Unix disks and tapes came from a SERF sale (Surplus Equipment Recycling Facility) on UBC main campus, not from TRIUMF. Bill Webb was a common thread for Unix use in the biology department at UBC. TRIUMF extensively used Data General Nova, then Eclipse (both 16 and 32 bit), computers from opening through the 1990?s for both cyclotron control systems and data acquisition for experiments. They also had a fair number of PDP-11?s and VAXen running RSX-11, RT-11, and VMS. I myself had an Alpha workstation on my desk for the two users I was at TRIUMF. One of my favorite connections between TRIUMF and UBC, was the underground pneumatic tube used to rapidly carry short lived isotopes produced in the cyclotron to the main campus for biology and medical uses. It should not come as a surprise to anyone that I still work in moving things and people through underground tunnels ? Tim N3QE

6 years, 9 months

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Steve Leininger Interview

by pete＠pski.net

We interviewed TRS-80 designer Steve Leininger on the latest TRS-80 Trash Talk podcast. http://www.trs80trashtalk.com <http://www.trs80trashtalk.com/> Although he does not have the same recognition, Steve?s contribution to the history of personal computing is on par with Steve Wozniak (Apple I/II) at Apple and Check Peddle (PET 2001) at Commodore.

6 years, 9 months

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IBM 3174 C 6.4 Microcode Disks?

by Kevin＠RawFedDogs.net

Classic Computer Fans, I posted this to the IBM-Legacy-Hercules mailing list. I just realized it probably wouldn't hurt to post it here too. I'm finally in possession of a box that hopefully is capable or can be made capable of connecting a real terminal to Hercules. It's a 3174 11L. It was retired last year where I work. I finally got the okay to save it from being sent to a scrapper. I love the build quality of older IBM gear, except when I'm trying to move such gear. Between the 3174 and a 9406-520 I also acquired, I pulled or strained something in my left arm moving them into place. It's currently wired to run on 220v. I think I've seen mentioned somewhere that it can be changed to run on 110v. If that's the case, does anyone have a pointer to documentation on what's involved? It has dual floppy drives. At least one drive is a 2.4MB drive. But, all the microcode disks I have are at level B 4.6. Does anyone know where I can get a set of C 6.4 control and control extension disks. From what I've heard those are what's needed to enable an attached terminal to connect to other systems via telnet. It has a token ring card. I will probably be able to get the MAU it was connected to, and possibly the router that acted as a token ring to Ethernet bridge. I'm not sure how much memory it has. Does anyone have any tips on determining the amount of memory it has, and/or identifying its boards? These are the numbers on its boards: 9210 9351 9052 z2 9053 9501 Plus the boards for coax connections. -- Kevin http://www.RawFedDogs.net http://www.Lassie.xyz http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org Bruceville, TX What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works! Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum. ------------------------------------ Posted by: Kevin Monceaux <Kevin at RawFedDogs.net> ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ibm-legacy-hercules/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ibm-legacy-hercules/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: ibm-legacy-hercules-digest at yahoogroups.com ibm-legacy-hercules-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: ibm-legacy-hercules-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to: https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/ -- Kevin http://www.RawFedDogs.net http://www.Lassie.xyz http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org Bruceville, TX What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works! Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.

6 years, 9 months

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FS: Craigslist Apple 512K Lisa Computer

by marvin＠west.net

I just ran across this and while I'm not interested, someone on the list might be. https://santabarbara.craigslist.org/sys/d/apple-512k-lisa-computer-valuetec… It was posted about 14 days ago, and looks to be in Santa Barbara, CA.

6 years, 9 months

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Need some PDP-11 paper tapes

by couryhouse＠aol.com

I? would? love to have? focal 11 on paper? tape? too if? anyone can punch one up!? thx? ed# In a message dated 3/4/2019 2:52:32 PM US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk at classiccmp.org writes: On 3/1/2019 12:50 PM, Rich Gopstein via cctalk wrote:> I just picked up a Remex paper tape reader from eBay and will be> interfacing it to my PiDP-11/Simh PDP-11 simulator shortly.> > I've been looking for an affordable punch, but haven't found one yet.? In> the meantime, does anyone know where I could get paper tapes with the> absolute loader and standalone basic?> > I don't need originals, so if anyone has a punch and is willing to punch> them for me, that would be great!? I'd be happy to pay whatever is> reasonable.? If you have any other PDP-11 tapes too, that would be helpful.> > Thanks.> > Rich> I have some duplicates of what you have asked for, so I could probablyaccommodate you.? But not all that many, so they aren't free.? I*believe* (but would have to double check) that these are all actualDigital paper tapes I got with various machines, which increases the price. I'd be willing to let them go for $20 each: feel free to pick andchoose.? If I have any that are just copies and not originals, those Iwould let go for $5 each.? Plus shipping (they ought to all fit in onesmall flat-rate box, assuming you are in the US). If others can punch copies for you, so much the better.? (I have punchesthat worked when I first got them, but they need work.? Same goes for myreaders, unfortunately). Some of the items below (PAL, EDT, LINK) might be pretty useless withouta paper tape punch.? ;) I have a few others (IOX).? I have FPP (floating point package) - but noduplicates. Seehttp://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/www.computer.museum.uq.edu.au/pdf/DEC-11-XPTSA-B-D%20PDP-11%20Paper%20Tape%20Software%20Handbook.pdf (Surprised that wasn't on the CHM bitsavers site...) JRJ KIND??? ID??? MACHINE??? CONTENTS??? COMMENT??? Checksum??? Checksum 2??? FILENAME??? MFGSERIAL??? TRAY??? DATE??? AVAILABILI??? ERRORS??? PREVIOUS_C BASIC V007A PT??? DEC-11-AJPB-PB??? PDP-11??? PDP-11 BASIC V007A??? SA=16104 RA=0??? ??? ?? Digital??? ??? 55??? 11/5/1970??? ??? ?? BASIC V008A PT??? DEC-11-LBSUA-A-PB??? PDP-11??? BASIC.LDA V008A SINGLE USER BASICREPLACES: DEC-11-AJPB-PB??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 44??? 12/1/1972??? ??? ?? Absolute loader PT??? DEC-11-UABLA-A-PO??? PDP-11??? PDP-11 ABSOLUTE LOADER??? REPLACES:DEC-11-L2PC-P0??? ??? ??? uabla-a.rim??? Digital??? ??? 62??? 5/5/1977??? ??? ?? Absolute loader (no switch register) PT??? DEC-11-UABLB-A-PO??? PDP-11??? ABSOLUTE LOADER VB07.00??? NON-SWITCHREGISTER VERSION??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 36??? 12/5/1975??? ??? ?? PAL-11A V007A PT??? DEC-11-UPLAA-A-PB??? PDP-11??? PAL-11A.LDA V007A??? REPLACES: DEC-11-ASXB-PBSA=1516 RA=1516??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 39??? 11/3/1975??? ??? ?? PAL-11S V003A PT??? DEC-11-UPLSA-A-PL??? PDP-11??? PAL-11S.LDA V003A??? REPLACES: DEC-11-ASQA-PLSA=2066 RA=2066??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 42??? 12/1/1972??? ??? ?? EDIT-11 V005A PT??? DEC-11-UEDPA-A-PB??? PDP-11??? ED-11 V005A??? REPLACES: DEC-11-E1PA-PB??? ??? ?? Digital??? ??? 39??? 11/10/1975??? ??? ?? LINK-11S? V002A? (SA 22714) PT??? DEC-11-ULKSA-A-PL??? PDP-11??? LINK-11S.LDA V002A??? REPLACES:DEC-11-ZLQA-PL??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 41??? 12/1/1972??? ??? ?? ODT-11? V005A PT??? DEC-11-UODPA-A-PB??? PDP-11??? ODT-11.LDA V005A RE-ENTER=13032??? REPLACES:DEC-11-O1PA-PB SA=13026 RA=.30??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 44??? 12/1/1972?? DUMPTT? V001A PT??? DEC-11-Y1PA-PB??? PDP-11??? DUMPTT V001A??? SA=LOAD ADDRESS RA=LOADADDRESS??? ??? ??? ??? Digital??? ??? 43??? 11/10/1969??? ?? DUMPAB V001A PT??? DEC-11-Y2PA-PO??? PDP-11??? DUMPAB V001A??? SA=XX7500 RA=XX7500??? ??? ?? Digital??? ??? 44??? 11/10/1969??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??

6 years, 9 months

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Need some PDP-11 paper tapes

by rich＠ourowndomain.com

I just picked up a Remex paper tape reader from eBay and will be interfacing it to my PiDP-11/Simh PDP-11 simulator shortly. I've been looking for an affordable punch, but haven't found one yet. In the meantime, does anyone know where I could get paper tapes with the absolute loader and standalone basic? I don't need originals, so if anyone has a punch and is willing to punch them for me, that would be great! I'd be happy to pay whatever is reasonable. If you have any other PDP-11 tapes too, that would be helpful. Thanks. Rich

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11/60 manuals needed

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Jay Jaeger > I have EK-11060-OP-003: "PDP-11/60 installation and operation manual" > and an update EK-11060-OP-C1. Yeah, that's the one I referred to as "the general -11/60 manual"; generally, there's one such for all the -11 models, but the exact name varies from model to model (unlike, say, the CPU tech manuals, the name for which is pretty predictable). > let me know and I will scan it in and stick it on my Google drive in a > day or two or three That would be great; thanks very much! No rush at all... > I also have a spare processor handbook, EB-06498-20/77 We do have that one, thanks. BTW, looking a little more closely at the cabinet/power-supply manual (pg. 1-7), the KD11-K TM might _only_ be available on fiche. If so, that'll be the first time I've ever seen that. Oddly enough, further down the page, the FP11-E TM seems to be available in printed form (EK-FP11E-TM). > From: Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> > I've seen Tech Manuals printed as 2-up on C-sized paper Yeah, generally things from the -11/20 era are like that (e.g. the RK11-C manual). Nothing later than that that I've ever seen, though. >>> I have the two BA11 cabinets for an 11/60, the PSUs, and the front >>> panel (I'm missing the rack). > "the rack" is just the outer box with rails (not an H960 - whatever the > designation is for the odd 11/60 cabinet). I think it's the H9500 low-boy corporate cabinet, per Chapter 5 in the cabinet/power manual. > The backplanes are in the BA11s. I seem to have both MOS and core > memory and, I am fairly sure, an RK611, along with the CPU. I need to > take a module inventory. You seem to have most of the crucial bits, although you might be missing the power harness. Do you have the optional WCS module (M7870)? There are also ROM modules, and a diagnostic module, that can go in that slot - only one of the three at a time, though. Noel

6 years, 9 months

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Craigslist Apple 512K Lisa Computer

by marvin＠west.net

On the off chance that someone on the list wants it and doesn't like the idea of shipping, I'll be going to VCFMW in September and could bring it along. My route will be Santa Barbara, Las Vegas, north to I-80, and I-80 to the Chicago area. After that, I'll be headed to Pittsburgh, PA and it can be dropped off along the way. I can also head out to Goleta (basically Santa Barbara) and check out what this person has. Marvin >> On Mar 3, 2019, at 10:35 AM, Ray Arachelian via cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote: >> >> On 03/03/19 12:58, Marvin Johnston via cctalk wrote: >>> I just ran across this and while I'm not interested, someone on the >>> list might be. >>> >>> https://santabarbara.craigslist.org/sys/d/apple-512k-lisa-computer-valuetec… >>> >>> >>> It was posted about 14 days ago, and looks to be in Santa Barbara, CA. >>> >> That doesn't look like it's a Lisa, it may be a tempest hardened Mac 512. > > An interesting system. Someone needs to save this. Based on the description, and the way it looks, I think you?re right about it being designed for TEMPEST hardening. There were some TEMPEST versions of the Mac II. > > Zane

6 years, 9 months

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Old SunOS distributions recovered

by aek＠bitsavers.org

http://bitsavers.org/bits/Sun/SunOS 1/2" distribution tapes for 0.4 beta, 1.1, 2.0 and the 2.2 update, circa 1983-85

6 years, 9 months

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DECtalk-PC Schematic

by kylevowen＠gmail.com

Hi all, I recently got one of these DECtalk-PC ISA cards from eBay ( https://www.ebay.com/itm/183684666377, no affiliation with seller other than a happy customer) and was wondering, does anyone have a schematic for this? Thanks! Kyle

6 years, 9 months

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Data Systems Design DSD-4140 microcode PROMs

by jzatar2＠illinois.edu

Hello Everyone, We found a PDP-11 QBUS card cage with a KDF11 and some other cards (RAM, ROM, some basic peripherals) which included a DSD-4140 card. Unfortunately, the DSD-4140 is missing one of it's microcode PROMs for some reason. Does anyone else have one of these cards? It'd be really helpful if we could get some dumps of the 4 microcode PROMs so we can compare what we have and look into replacing what we don't have with an adapted modern part. (and if anyone goes to the trouble to read the 4 microcode PROMs, there's also an 82S137 that deserves to be dumped). Here's a picture of the card in question: https://i.imgur.com/tzYjPYF.jpg Regards, Joe Zatarski

6 years, 9 months

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KA650 VAX memory error

by jzatar2＠illinois.edu

On Sat, Mar 2, 2019 at 3:16 PM Glen Slick via cctalk <cctalk_at_classiccmp.org> wrote: >On Sat, Mar 2, 2019 at 12:02 PM Joseph Zatarski via cctalk ><cctalk at classiccmp.org <http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk>> wrote: >>//>>/On a somewhat related note, I don't suppose anybody knows or has />>/documentation on the pinout of the C/D interconnect on these RAM boards? />>/The pinout for the ribbon cable is in the manual, but the C/D />>/interconnect doesn't seem to be documented in any of the manuals that />>/are online. /> >650QS Field Maintenance Print Set, MP-02538-01, Rev C1 >http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/vax/650/MP02538_650QS_Sep88.pdf <http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/vax/650/MP02538_650QS_Sep88.pdf> > >Page 65 of the PDF, KA650 Circuit Schematics Page 23 of 40 >MA0 - MA9 >CAS0 - CAS3 >RAS0 - RAS3 >WE >SE >XADDR20, XADDR21 >+5 >GND > >Page 47 of the PDF, Page 5 of 40 is an overview block diagram of those >signals originating at the DC357 CMCTL Memory System Controller. OK, thanks, that's great. Now I won't have to bother tracing things out if I decide to go that route. Didn't realize there was a printset for the KA650, but I guess I didn't even bother to check.

6 years, 9 months

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KA650 VAX memory error

by jzatar2＠illinois.edu

Hello Everyone, I've got a KA650 with a MS650-AA 8MB memory module. When we initially started messing with this VAX, it was giving a memory error. We were able to track down first the bad bank, and later the individual bad ZIP RAMs with the help of my logic analyzer. For now, I kludged an SOJ DRAM in there that seems to be working without issue. The machine no longer gives memory errors during POST, but if you run one of the more thorough memory tests like #48 (MEM_Addr_shrts), it fails. My initial thought was that this RAM test checks for shorted address lines, which would cause writing to one location to change another location perhaps. However, I haven't been able to replicate the error with DEPOSITs and EXAMINEs on the console. Without having to disassemble the VAX ROM, does anybody know what this test does? Once I know what I'm looking for, I can probably convince the logic analyzer to see the error with some fancy triggering, and get this board 100% fixed before I order some ZIP DRAMs. On a somewhat related note, I don't suppose anybody knows or has documentation on the pinout of the C/D interconnect on these RAM boards? The pinout for the ribbon cable is in the manual, but the C/D interconnect doesn't seem to be documented in any of the manuals that are online. With the price of MS650's these days, it seems like the cheaper route (albeit more work) is to build a new RAM board rather than buy one (especially if a single 64MB board could be made). I suspect it's not too complex anyway, and it can probably mostly be traced out, and the rest inferred and then verified with a logic analyzer. Thanks, Joe Zatarski

6 years, 9 months

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HP logic analyzer QFP132 interposer and DSD-4140 microcode ROMs

by jzatar2＠illinois.edu

Hello everyone, I've got two unrelated things I'm looking for: The first is an HP logic analyzer interposer for the emulation adapter for an MC68332. This would have a PGA socket on it, and sort of a reverse socket for the QFP132 package (attaches to a chip from the top, to interface to a chip soldered onto a board). I believe the part number would be HP E3417A. I already have the QFP160 adapter, but the chip I want to interface to is a QFP132. This adapter supposedly exists, but I've had no luck trying to find it through the usual channels. The second that I'm looking for, is if there's someone out there that owns and can dump the microcode ROMs from a DSD-4140 QBUS floppy controller. We've got a card here that's missing one of the ROMs, and we're also not sure if the ROMs are mixed up, so a dump of all 4 ROMs would be appreciated. They are 82S181, but they should read in any EPROM burner with a breadboard and some wiring to adapt the pinout. Burning them is another story, but we'll worry about that later... Here's a picture of the card in question: https://i.imgur.com/tzYjPYF.jpg And if anyone has one of these and is kind enough to dump it for us, there's also an 82S137 on the card that probably deserves a dump as well. Thanks, Joe Zatarski

6 years, 9 months

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UK: FF : 2 x Sun Enterprise M4000

by silvercreekvalley＠yahoo.com

Hi all I have a couple of near identical Sun Enterprise M4000 servers fitted with SPARC64 VI 2.1GHz CPUs, 16GB and I think 2 x 146GB disks. I *think* these are working but have never powered them up. I purchased them surplus a year or so ago. Available free of charge to any Sun fans - these are collection only sorry. I?m not too far from Cambridge location wise in the UK. PM me if interested. First come first served. Thanks Ian

6 years, 9 months

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eBay: RCA CDP1802

by anders.k.nelson＠gmail.com

IIRC someone on this list was asking for an 1802 some time ago... https://www.ebay.com/itm/CDP1802-CPU/132727125007 =] -- Anders Nelson +1 (517) 775-6129 www.erogear.com

6 years, 9 months

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V6 cc needs hash before whitespace before first include?

by fritzm＠fritzm.org

So, I've been having some fun playing around with V6 Unix on my 11/45 a bit after that last repair. I've just been tripped up for a little over the fact that the C compiler barfs if there is whitespace/comentary before the first #include; the workaround seems to be to add a lone '#' at the beginning of the file. It took me a while to notice that this was done, for example, in all of the device driver sources. I found this curious. Anybody know what the story is there? --FritzM.

6 years, 9 months

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V6 cc needs hash before whitespace before first include?

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

On Thu, 2/28/19, Fritz Mueller via cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote: > I've just been tripped up for a little > over the fact that the C compiler barfs if there is > whitespace/comentary before the first #include; the > > I found this curious.? Anybody > know what the story is there? My recollection is that it's documented in the 6th Ed C manual that # has to be in the first column. Beyond that, I vaguely recall something to the effect that if the first line isn't a preprocessor directive, then it skips any preprocessing at all. BLS

6 years, 9 months

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V6 cc needs hash before whitespace before first include?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Phil Budne > I'm betting it was a speedup to not fork/exec another process if it was > going to be a null transform! It's worse than that! In vanilla V6, the pre-processor is built into 'cc', not a separate command. Here's the relevant code (from expand()): if (getc(ibuf1) != '#') { close(ibuf1[0]); return(file); } The code to implement the directives is, ah, entertaining. Noel

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11/60 manuals needed

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Hi, does anyone have any PDP-11/60 manuals? I went to do articles on the -11/60 and its CPU (KD11-K), but there isn't much online. Bitsavers has EK-KD11K-TD-PRE, but it only covers the maintenance features, not the whole CPU; there is a tech manual - KD11K-TM-001 (I have it in fiche, but my fiche reader has a burned out bulb which I have not yet been able to replace, so it doesn't do me much good). There is a user manual for the FP11-E, which has a certain amount of useful details, but it refers to the technical manual, which is not there. And there's EK-11060-SV-01, which covers the cabinet and power supply. So if anyone has the general -11/60 manual, or the KD11-K tech manual, those would be super useful. The FP11-E tech manual would be nice to have, but isn't as important as the others. Thanks (I hope!)! Noel

6 years, 9 months

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HP 85 tapes

by Martin.Hepperle＠MH-AeroTools.de

Christian, there is the document "9915-TapeDuplicationAndEPROMProgrammingSoftware-09915-10011-46pages-Jul83.p df" on the HP-.Museum web site. I think the associated software is not available, but it also uses the TAPDUP binary (pg. 1-2) and the same IMAGE program. The binary itself was part of this and is not documented (it was considered part of the whole package). What is available via M. Craggs web site are the files from a "Hybrid ROM Creation Pak", which includes TAPDUP. The IMAGE program (pg 2-2) contained there is probably similar or the same. The Master/Slave programs and some more are not in this package. >From the "Hybrid ROM Creation Pak" AUXROM.ASM AUXROM.BAS AUXSHELL.BAS CREATEROM.BAS DATAIO-19.BAS DATAIO-29A.BAS EPROM2.BAS IMAGE.BAS --- 20 ! (program "IMAGE", 09915-90022, p.5-5...5-6) (these page numbers do not refer to the manual 09915-10011) MAINBASIC.BAS RBUILD85S.ASM RBUILD87S.ASM ROMSHELL.ASM TAPDUP.ASM Martin

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11/60 manuals needed

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Bill Degnan > The 11/60 handbook doesn't have that kind of designation. It's EB06498 Yeah, that's the processor handbook, which is the paperback-sized thing which is mostly a programmer's reference; I've got that, its the 8-1/2x11 sized things I'm after. > From: Ethan Dicks > Is it by any chance EK-KD11K-TM-001? > That part number is for a print-set Uhh, no. Looking at the fiche version, EP-KD11K-TM-001, it has lots and lots of text blocks (which I can't read without a fiche reader, of course). We do seem to have the print sets: MP00166 11/60 System (chassis, power contoller, etc) MP00409 KD11-K CPU MP00500 WCS (M7870) MP00429 FP11-E but I'm not desperate enough to learn the -11/60 by looking at them! > I'm following the discussion because I have the two BA11 cabinets for > an 11/60, the PSUs, and the front panel (I'm missing the rack). And by 'the rack', I'm guessing that includes the backplane? Looking through the prints, I think I didn't see details on it (alas). Noel

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11/60 manuals needed

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Josh Dersch > I recently picked up a copy of the PDP-11/60 Processor Handbook, not > sure if that's useful for your research Yes, it almost certainly is (without seeing it, I can't be 100%, but it sounds like it is). Is it by any chance EK-KD11K-TM-001? Thanks! Noel

6 years, 9 months

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Another DEC UNIBUS signal adapter: UniProbe

by j_hoppe＠t-online.de

Hi, most people dealing seriously with older PDP-11s have found means to monitor the UNIBUS traffic. My latest approach is www.retrocmp.com/tools/uniprobe UniProbe is a M9302 terminator, a LED display, a probe for logic analyzer. It can be mounted in Standard or Modified UNIBUS sockets. I'm ordering a batch of PCBs in a few days and will show this and other stuff (UniBone, BlinkenBone) at VCFPNW in Seattle. https://vcfed.org/wp/festivals/vintage-computer-festival-pacific-northwest/ best regards, Joerg

6 years, 9 months

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DECserver 700 PSU fix, H7881-AA

by w9gb＠icloud.com

Adrian - ASTEC is now owned by Emerson Power (UK address below). Emerson Power Catalog (find the 57 watt models): https://www.mouser.com/catalog/supplier/library/pdf/Emersonpower_catalog.pdf PowerClinic in Dallas/Fort Worth area services a large number of Switch-Mode power supplies. http://portal.powerclinicinc.com/web/services Power Clinic Inc. 3732 Arapaho Rd Addison, TX 75001 USA == H7881-AA (Refurbished), $177.00 USD https://www.tamayatech.com/parts.php?g=H7881AA H7881-AA Power Supply, 57 watt , $450.00 USD https://www.ipsystemsinc.com/shopping/pgm-more_information.php?id=630 ASTEC - Europe (UK) Waterfront Business Park Merry Hill, Dudley West Midlands, DY5 1LX United Kingdom Telephone: +44 (0) 1384 842 211 Facsimile: +44 (0) 1384 843 355 == From: Adrian Graham To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Subject: DECserver 700 PSU fix, H7881-AA Hi folks, My trusty DECserver has bitten the dust in a silent and non-violent way with the fuse still intact so has anyone got tips on troubleshooting? I know it's the PSU because I 'borrowed' another PSU from work and the unit is running again. It's an ASTEC unit under the hood, and in my experience of fixing the older types like the AC8151 (Memotech, TRS80 II/III, Osborne etc) the chief culprits on an utterly dead PSU are the input caps and/or the small 220uF or 330uF startup cap in the feedback circuit. I haven't checked bitsavers etc for a schematic yet, does such a thing exist? Hopefully the ASTEC board has a model number on it. Cheers -- adrian/witchy Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest private home computer collection? t: @binarydinosaurs f: facebook.com/binarydinosaurs w: www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk

6 years, 9 months

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Mystery old computer & terminals on eBay UK

by lproven＠gmail.com

I don't recognise this, but I'm no expert. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/113665872765 -- Liam Proven - Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lproven at cix.co.uk - Google Mail/Hangouts/Plus: lproven at gmail.com Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven - Skype/LinkedIn: liamproven UK: +44 7939-087884 - ?R (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053

6 years, 9 months

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HP 85 tapes

by Martin.Hepperle＠MH-AeroTools.de

Christian, the TAPDUP binary and associated utility programs in BASIC was used to create EPROMs with programs and data for the 9915 Series-80 box. It can be used to read the directory record and then to read tokenized PROGrams as data on a file-record base - not at low record level. The package also contains programs to massage the PROG data into BASIC DATA statements for creating EPROM burner files. You could use it to read the tape directory and individual PROG files but right now I am not aware of a program which would write this data back to a tape. You would open the directory, look up a file and then OPEN IMAGE it. Next you would READ RECORD IMAGE$ the program record by record. In the end you have not gained much compared to the simple COPY statement. Except for the copy of the directory with attributes and security flags. Alternative: There are also READSECTOR binary programs for reading raw 256 byte records/sectors from disks. They also work on the tape ":T" but seem to start their record count after the directory records. On disks, record 0 is the first real sector. So, to get the complete binary content one could use C$=CATALOG$ from TAPDUP to read the directory record READSECTOR N,R$,D from to read the subsequent raw "data" records. Here are my notes on some of the functions in this binary program: The TAPDUP Binary (Notes by M. Hepperle) This binary contains functions to read tapes (HP-85, 9915) at low level. It does not handle disks. The program was part of the "Tape Duplication and EPROM Programming Pack" (09915-10010). As the original software was not available the binary was re-assembled from an assembler source file. This source file was obviously created by disassembling the original binary. It was found at M. Craggs web site: http://www.biblewitness.org/technical/HP_Series-80/HP-85/ASSM . Martin Craggs home-made disassembler produced many unnecessary DRP and ARP statements, which could be cleaned up to improve readbility. Functions in the TAPDUP binary: C$=CATALOG$ Return the directory record of the tape in form of a 512 byte buffer (2 records). C$ must be DIMed to at least 512. OPEN IMAGE F$ Find the file F$ and open it for reading. ERRN=67: file not found T=READTYPE Return the file type of the currently opened image (the file image must be opened by a preceding call to OPEN IMAGE) 34 = PROG N$=READNAME$ Return the file name of the currently opened image (the file image must be opened by a preceding call to OPEN IMAGE) R$=READ RECORD IMAGE$ Read the next record of the currently opened file. The record has a length of 256 bytes. Reading can be continued by another READ RECORD IMAGE$ until ERRN=71 indicates a read behind the end of the file. See lines 440 ff in IMAGE program for a typical reading loop. (the file image must be opened by a preceding call to OPEN IMAGE) ERRN=71: end of file reached. CREATE IMAGE S$,I,J,K 3 numeric parameters WRITE IMAGE R$ Write record to (where?) "Error 244: No file open" WRITE CATALOG C$ Writes the catalogue back to disk. C$ must contain a valid catalog structure, otherwise your tape will be unreadable afterwards. READLOGLEN Read the logical record length, which is 256. Another useful function in the Program Development ROM C$=CHECKSUM$(S$) Return the IBM SDLC CRC checksum of the given string (the length of the checksum is two bytes). Example: dumping the tape catalog Each catalog entry is 12 bytes 10 DIM C$[512] 20 C$=CATALOG$ 30 K=1 40 FOR I=1 TO 504 STEP 12 50 FOR J=1 TO 12 60 PRINT C$[K,K]; 70 K=K+1 80 NEXT J 90 PRINT 100 NEXT I 110 PRINT 120 END Tape documentation lifted from Everett Kaser's Series-80 Emulator (I hope Everett won't sue me for this blatant copyright infringement): TAPE LAYOUT ------------------------------------------------------- The HP-85 tape cartridges contained at most 43 files. File 0 was always the TAPE DIRECTORY, and was always 4 records long. Files 1-42 were the user-created files. The tape itself had 2 TRACKS, 0 and 1. There were TWO COPIES of the TAPE DIRECTORY, one in records 0 and 1 of file 0, and a second in records 2 and 3 of file 0. Record 2 was an exact duplicate of record 0, and record 3 was an exact duplicate of record 1. Only one record of the directory could be read into memory at a time, so the system had to keep track of whether the first 1/2 or the second 1/2 of the directory was in memory (or neither). Each DIRECTORY RECORD consisted of 21 12-byte directory entries, which equals 252 bytes. The final 4 bytes of each record as follows: 252 directory segment flag (0 or 1). 253 FILE# of file that wraps from the end of TRACK 0 to the beginning of TRACK 1. 254 (2 bytes) RECORD# of first record of the split file 255 that's on TRACK 1. Each DIRECTORY ENTRY consists of 12 bytes, allocated thusly: BYTES DESCRIPTION ----- --------------------------------------------- 0-5 ASCII FILE NAME, blank filled 6 EXTENDED File Type 7 FILE TYPE 8-9 # RECORDS in the file 10-11 # BYTES in each record The FILE TYPE is thus: BIT DESCRIPTION --- ----------------------------------------------- 0 No directory name listed 1 Soft write protect 2 Extended file type (****) 3 Binary Program (BPGM) 4 Data file (DATA) 5 BASIC Program (PRGM) 6 Empty file (NULL) 7 Next available file The most significant bit of the EXTENDED FILE TYPE byte will signify extended file type as well as BIT 2 of FILE TYPE, but it shouldn't be used, as a bug in the system doesn't clear that bit if you purge the file. The lower seven bits allow the differentiation between various extended file types (****).

6 years, 9 months

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HP 85 tapes

by cc＠informatik.uni-stuttgart.de

Hi, what is the recommended way to image HP 85 tape cartridges? The best would be including headers and whatsoever, and to be able to recreate tapes from the images and have a 1:1 duplicate from the original cartridge. I'm almost done with rebelting and imaging our 264x cartridges and would like to continue with the other tapes (85 and 9845). Christian

6 years, 9 months

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BASIC for HP 1000, 21xx series

by gerardcjat＠free.fr

Back in ''70, sometimes we were running "basic" BASIC ( NOT Time sharing ) on 2116B, 2100A, just for FUN. Is there some copy still around ?? I had a look in Google, Bitsavers, HPmuseum, with NO success. Thank for help and/or advise.

6 years, 9 months

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New high-resolution Alpha Micro manual scans

by aek＠bitsavers.org

http://bitsavers.org/pdf/alphaMicrosystems/amos

6 years, 9 months

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Seeking 4067 DRAM ICs

by drlegendre＠gmail.com

Howdy friends, In need of 8 pcs. MT4067-15 or equiv. to fill out the RAM board in a Tandy 1000 EX. These are 64k x 4bit I believe. Just checking to see if a group member might have some stashed away?

6 years, 9 months

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looking for a couple of alpha micro things

by aek＠bitsavers.org

CHM has a 1072 with a AM-100L 68000 processor and a scsi interface. one of the boot proms has gone bad, has anyone imaged these? I'm also trying to locate the hardware manual for the AM-620 QIC cartridge tape interface.

6 years, 9 months

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DECserver 700 PSU fix, H7881-AA

by binarydinosaurs＠gmail.com

Hi folks, My trusty DECserver has bitten the dust in a silent and non-violent way with the fuse still intact so has anyone got tips on troubleshooting? I know it's the PSU because I 'borrowed' another PSU from work and the unit is running again. It's an ASTEC unit under the hood, and in my experience of fixing the older types like the AC8151 (Memotech, TRS80 II/III, Osborne etc) the chief culprits on an utterly dead PSU are the input caps and/or the small 220uF or 330uF startup cap in the feedback circuit. I haven't checked bitsavers etc for a schematic yet, does such a thing exist? Helpfully the ASTEC board doesn't have a model number on it. Cheers -- adrian/witchy Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest private home computer collection? t: @binarydinosaurs f: facebook.com/binarydinosaurs w: www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk

6 years, 9 months

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Fw: BASIC for HP 1000, 21xx series

by gerardcjat＠free.fr

Thanks Guys, You are amazing. I got more informations than I can use over the next four weeks ! THANKS.

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11 LDA BFD backend for gnu binutils

by fritzm＠fritzm.org

I've been thinking it might be nice to have an LDA BFD backend for gnu binutils, so gas, ld, objdump etc. could deal with LDA's directly without having to use separate conversion utilities. Before jumping in on that, though, I thought I'd ask here to see if anybody might have already started or done this? I've noticed several of the folks here also have contributions on some of the binutils lists. thanks, --FritzM.

6 years, 9 months

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BASIC for HP 1000, 21xx series

by couryhouse＠aol.com

DID YOU CHECK? HP MUSEUM DOWN UNDER?? THEY HAVE A FAB? ONLINE COLLECTION OF? SOFTWARE... In a message dated 2/24/2019 3:04:03 AM US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk at classiccmp.org writes: Back in ''70, sometimes we were running "basic" BASIC ( NOT Time sharing ) on 2116B, 2100A, just for FUN. Is there some copy still around ?? I had a look in Google, Bitsavers, HPmuseum, with NO success. Thank for help and/or advise.

6 years, 9 months

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IBM 3174 C 6.4 Microcode Disks?

by seefriek＠gmail.com

re: Cisco and IBM protocols If you're really interested, all of this is exhaustively documented under the umbrella of Cisco's "IBM Feature Set". There's a *lot* here under the hood, but the last time I looked (admittedly, a while) a number of folks had web sites that documented the correct incantations for Hercules and common hardware. You can bridge between TR (and FDDI) and ethernet on a Cisco, generally for non-routable protocols (e.g. NetBIOS); see: 'translational bridging'. If you're trying to get these protocols across an intermediary 'alien' network (like the corp FDDI backbone, or the Internet), there are things like DLSw. If you're trying to get TCP/IP from TR to ethernet and vice versa, routing generally works better/is simpler (IME), but Cisco has all sorts of bizarre encapsulation/translation features for different use cases should you need them. You can also make the router look like an SNA concentrator (PU?). KJ

6 years, 9 months

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Compaq 9000 Rack Thumb Screw

by cctalk＠ibm51xx.net

Slightly off topic for list although the rack and equipment are almost 20 years old now.... I got me a hand me down Compaq Proliant StorageWorks UE Rack. Basically it is a rack case that can hold 14 drives. The case is secured to the cabinet with two thumb screws (see attached pictures). These are like standard thumb screws except there is a spring component to them as well (I assume to give wiggle so it is easier to match screw to cage nut). You can see pictures of the screws in this VCF post: www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?68556-Compaq-Rack-Thumb-Screws&p=559354#p ost559354 On my hand me down the one on the left is missing. I have looked and there doesn't seem to be a Compaq part number (I think the screws are press fitted into the metal frame so not really user replaceable). I don't think there is anything special about the screw and I can always use a standard M6 screw for the missing side. However, I'd like to try and match/restore the original. I have tried googling for theses screws but I am not coming up with the right item. I am guessing I am not using the right terms or names for the screws. So does anyone have some broken/parts Compaq rack equipment where I can have the screws? Or can point me to a source online to get a replacement? TIA! -Ali

6 years, 9 months

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Anyone have spare DipStik sockets?

by carlclaunch51＠gmail.com

In the early 1970s a socket to hold multiple DIP chips was being sold under the brand name DipStik. Up to six chips were inserted in a trough in the socket, a top screwed on with thumbscrews on the ends. It had solder lugs on the top and bottom for each of the chip pins. We are restoring an old electronic device that was built in part with these, but due to some corrosion we could use replacement DipStik units if anyone has them. Carl

6 years, 9 months

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VT52 stand

by cramcram＠gmail.com

Does anyone on the list have or have seen the stand that DEC sold with the VT52? I'm just curious; does the stand screw into holes on the monitor or does it just sit on top? >From what I've seen before it just looks like an office chair base with a top that is the correct size. Thanks, Marc

6 years, 9 months

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TI Explorer Lisp machine tapes

by aek＠bitsavers.org

http://bitsavers.org/bits/TI/Explorer/cartridge_tapes the 2.6.0 diag 6.0 bootable and 6.0 patches are probably the most interesting has there been ANY posts about the Explorer simulator in the last decade? I've also not verified any of them are what the label says I ran into a couple that were overwritten. Some I know are correct, because there were multiple copies.

6 years, 9 months

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IBM 6360 - Filesystem(ish) info?

by anders.k.nelson＠gmail.com

Hi Ali, I'm planning on a USB controller, but I've seen ISA projects that are also microcontroller based so I think it wouldn't be awfully difficult to replace the USB data pipe with an ISA one. Zooming out, I have a list of USB controllers to build: - Kennedy 9800 tape drive - IBM 6360 8" floppy drive - IBM <something> 5 1/4" floppy drive My friends think it's silly, and they're probably right. =P On Tue, Feb 19, 2019, 1:18 PM Ali <cctalk at ibm51xx.net wrote: > > > > Now that I have my glorious disk toaster (2D model I think, says "2D" > > on > > the drive levers), I want to build a controller for it. I found pinouts > > and > > some description of the media organization here: > > > > http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/ibm/6580_Displaywriter/S241- > > 6248-3_Displaywriter_6360_6580_Product_Support_Manual_Feb1983.pdf > > Congratulations! Those are nice looking drives. The problem of course is > they don't work with anything "standard". > > > I'd like to actually store data to these disks in the same manner the > > original systems did, and I'm proficient in hardware/firmware. Has > > anyone > > made a controller for this already? How about emulating the filesystem? > > Wow. That is going to be big endeavor.... A question what is your target > system (i.e. are you planning on implementing this on a controller > connected to a modern system w/ USB or are you planning on a nice ISA card > so these drives can be used on older systems?) I wish I could help you > technically but my background is far removed from engineering... However, I > will follow with great interest specially if you go the ISA route... > > -Ali > >

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11 disk image question

by bill.gunshannon＠hotmail.com

So, I used SIMH to do an install of a complete OS on an RA81 disk. I would like to move this to a real disk and try it on a real PDP-11. Is there a way to do this using dd on a BSD machine? I tried but it created a non bootable system. Well, actually, it starts to boot but then fails very early in the startup process. I used "dd if=filename of=raw-device bs=1024". Could it be that the block size needs to be something else? I know that VTServer and PDPGUI can move disk images but it would take a week at 9600 baud and I think very little likelihood of it ever completing successfully. bill

6 years, 9 months

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VCF Midwest 14: Date Announcement

by silent700＠gmail.com

Hello everyone - since people have already been asking (we even had someone call the hotel to try to register - that's some refreshing pro-activeness), we can confirm the date of this year's Vintage Computer Festival Midwest will be: September 14-15, 2019 2019 will bring a NEW LOCATION which will be announced in the coming weeks. So don't call the old hotel - they're already sad that they lost us*. Updates will be posted first to our site at http://vcfmw.org, as well as our mailing list, which you can join there. Thanks to all who have attended in the past and are considering it this year. This one will be something special**, for sure. -jht * Nothing wrong with the old place - we just outgrew it! ** Note that that is a measure of magnitude, not direction.

6 years, 9 months

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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by jfoust＠threedee.com

Old tech, but not computers: https://madison.com/business/galesville-antique-phone-dealers-looking-to-of… - John

6 years, 9 months

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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by couryhouse＠aol.com

lots? of? piles? of? phones... some? areas? a? real? mess... this? guy? gets the hoarder? award? for? ?wooden? phone? cascaras back? when? the payphone? biz? went? privatized and legal? also? ?that? way? ?Ron had? conversion kits...? he? did? well in the? ? ?make? your? kitchen into a? country? kitchen? craze....? sold? lots? of? cobbled? to? ?work? ? oak? phones? ?for? ? the? kitchen.? there? was a? good? market? back in the? 70s? ?not? much? now? though? the old? people that remember the 'LASSIE"? ?wood? phone in? their? house as? kids? are? dying off? now... really interesting? ?guy....? ? ?very? odd business model.... ed# In a message dated 2/20/2019 11:26:20 AM US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk at classiccmp.org writes: So...how 'bout them phones? (hint, hint) Does anyone know if they have any CO stuff? (only a tiny, tiny fraction of telephone collectors care, even a tiny bit, about CO stuff) -- Will

6 years, 9 months

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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Grant Taylor > I agree with your logic. > However your valid logic Anyone who thinks logic starting from common sense has anything to do with the workings of legal systems is likely in for a rude awakening at some point. Noel

6 years, 9 months

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Ultimate FDC? (Was: IBM 6360 - Filesystem(ish) info?

by cctalk＠ibm51xx.net

Fred, Are we being a little sarcastic or serious? :)Honestly, a sw implementation would be interesting but would it work on vintage hw? Or are you suggesting for use only with a modern system??For example here is my dilemma: my stinkers, whom you have met, are getting old enough to want to mess with my stuff. *shudder* i mean cool! but I really don't want them ruining my one actual original disk for any programs I own. So what I do is make backup copies just like in the old days. And before someone suggests emulators, it is just not the same. I mean if we wanted to emulate everything why bother even preserving hardware?Problem is when we have copy protection, as many games or old SW do, then you need a Copy II PC board. I have one and they are fairly common but ridiculously expensive now a days. So it would be nice if the functions could be duplicated in an easy to use manner. Kyro Flux is powerful but not for everyone. I want an FDC that would cover 90% of the vintage hobby (i.e. Apple II, Mac, and IBM). An FDC that combines a CompatiCard IV with a copy ii pc deluxe and a Match Point card would cover all of the above plus then some.Just a thought.... ;D

6 years, 9 months

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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by technoid6502＠gmail.com

I got a laugh out of this anecdote. Of course, folks heard me chuckle and I tried to share the joke but.... Way too geeky for public consumption. Back in 2000-ish, I was upgrading my DG MV4000/dc to 8mb so as to be able to run the snazzy AOS/VS II tapes I'd got along with the 9 track drive I hacked onto the machine... The install would start and then bomb at a certain point every time. I decided to work the machine hard and then pull the board and give a good SNIFF. This is a 15x15 inch board populated with 256kx1 drams. The time in the machine got the board cooking nicely, and when I smelled a certain charred smell in the vicinity of a 74ls04, I knew it was that magic black smoke. I pulled a 74HCT04 from a known-good isa card, socketed the spot and viola! Working 8mb board. It isn't ALLWAYS the most expensive chip, thank God, and sometimes even us not- as-bright guys come off with a win. I really enjoy reading this list even though I don't contribute all that often or anything of much value. It is a pleasure to watch you guys work. Jeff On Thu, 2019-02-14 at 12:00 -0600, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > Re: PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem > When our 11/45 failed in the MMU in 1975, my classmate Josh Rosen traced the failing path on the schematics. When Jim Newport the field service engineer showed up, Josh described the diagnostics result that pointed at the failed path, and added "This is the failed chip" (pointing to one particular chip. Jim asked "Why that one?" Josh answered "because that is the most expensive chip". It turned out he was right. paul

6 years, 9 months

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Ultimate FDC? (Was: IBM 6360 - Filesystem(ish) info?

by cctalk＠ibm51xx.net

Fred,> Are we being a little sarcastic or serious? >:)>>A lot of BOTHJust making sure. ;)>I would like to see software for flux >transition hardware that would >extract sectors.>THEN, I would like to see that software as >a >subroutine, with an interface similar to >INT13h.>THEN, I would like to see that ROMable, >either on a physical ROM, or >loaded into RAM, with the INT13h vestor >repointed to it.That would make for a very powerful tool but as you pointed out yourself how many users would learn to use it? Unless it is a simple driver that gets loaded and the user has to simply put in a couple of generic parameters, e.g. "device=c:\drives\emudsk.sys APPLE", and it is up and running most users won't be able to make use of it.>My preference would be REAL MODE (DOS).As would mine but would a 286 be able to do it? And if you have a machine that runs real mode DOS why not make use of the HW that is there?>Match Point could be implemented in >software on the Central Point board.Great. Then if the DOB HW is duplicated then that part can be SW and no need to have Match Point HW duplicated. I am surprised the Copy II PC DOB card did not handle Apple II disks along with Mac disks.?>CompatiCard was just an ordinary FDC, >without the crippling corners cut.True, but if you are building the ultimate FDC then you don't want crippling corners cut. So something functionally equivalent.>SO, you are asking for FDC plus flux >transition, but better integrated, >rather than flux transition hardware >interrupting the drive cable.Yes! All on one card. Throw in FDADAP functionality to properly write 8" disks and you have a controller that handles most if not all IBM, Apple II, and Mac disks. As I understand it, in my limited way, having both FM and MFM should allow for many CP/M formats including SD. Will some formats be left out? Sure. Will it be as powerful as a Kyro Flux for archiving? Heck no. But will it let me pop in my original 123 disk and copy it for use with out too much hassle and work? Of course.?>There are a few exceptions, such as Pro-lock.Well then you had the ENHANCED Deluxe Board. :)>But, in quite a few cases, people have >disassembled (now illegal under >DMCA!), found the vulnerabilities and >simply disabled the copy protection.?Yes but that is harder and harder to find. They were never public but each city had multiple BBSes offering such altered programs. And of course the other problems w/ this method is you are confined to the one altered version? (even if you own a later version). Also there is no guarantee the alterations will not cause a bug that will crop up later due to a lack of total testing.-Ali

6 years, 9 months

3
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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by couryhouse＠aol.com

go? to? garage? sales? ?' thy? turn up there. In a message dated 2/19/2019 1:57:35 PM US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk at classiccmp.org writes: On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 09:58:00AM -0600, John Foust via cctalk wrote: > Old tech, but not computers: I have a fondness for old rotary dial phones, especially ones like they used in movies and TV shows set in the '40s and '50s.? I've never managed to acquire one.? I'd love to have a few of them, but not that many.? :-) -- Kevin http://www.RawFedDogs.net http://www.Lassie.xyz http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org Bruceville, TX What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works! Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.

6 years, 9 months

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tracometer model 6a

by tdk.knight＠gmail.com

anyone ever herd of one? mines searial number 002 says national research councle of canada made by eda electronics https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5723/Bnz2VF.jpg https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6783/nHesKB.jpg https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5776/wimiv2.jpg

6 years, 9 months

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A History of Engineering & Science in the Bell System TRANSMISSION TECHNOLOGY and ELECTRONICS TECHNOLOGY

by couryhouse＠aol.com

A History of Engineering & Science in the Bell System TRANSMISSION TECHNOLOGY and ELECTRONICS TECHNOLOGY A History of Engineering & Science in the Bell System TRANSMISSION TECHNOLOGY and A History of Engineering & Science in the Bell System ELECTRONICS TECHNOLOGY? ( the? transistor? and devices? etc...) 60 for the? Pair? plus? 16.95? priority? mailing? insured? tracked and? signature? confirmation? payment to be? made? via? pay? pal? friends and? family...only? after? we? ok? who? gets them . both? ?tight? beauty? copies? with? ?great? jackets on them! Let me? ?know? asap? ?if? you? want. extra? copies? help re-roof museum buildings!Thanks? Ed#

6 years, 9 months

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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Grant Taylor > I do know that there are a lot of companies here in the US that are > filtering their website like this. It does go both ways; a while back, a vintage rail site I read regularly ('Weekend Rails') moved to a new hosting service, and that service filtered out and refused attempts from the US to read any of the sites they hosted (it wasn't at the site owner's request; I asked). So I had to use a European-based proxy for a while to get to it. Noel

6 years, 9 months

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Free: 2x DEC Alpha workstations - 164LX and XP1000

by karbak＠gmail.com

Hello, I have a couple of Alpha workstations that were last used 5-6 years ago with some version of Tru64 on them. They haven't been turned on since, and may need some work to get running again. They're free to anyone who thinks they can use them, and can pick them up from the 78722 zip code (near UT Austin). Please contact me off-list to co-ordinate pickup. Thanks, Arun

6 years, 9 months

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RS/6000 7043-140 boot floppies

by aperry＠snowmoose.com

Is there some trick to making boot floppies for the RS/6000 7043-140 (a mid-90s PReP architecture machine)? I initially tried to install Solaris 2.5.1 on it and created the boot floppy by dd'ing the image using a SPARCstation (running NetBSD). I dd'ed the image over, dd'ed it back and verified the SPARCstation could read back what it had written to the floppy. The RS/6000 loads what is on the floppy, but hangs transferring control to what it loaded. The 7043-140 does not appear on the list of supported systems in the Solaris 2.5.1 release notes, so, even though 2.5.1 supports PReP and the 7043-140 is a PReP machine, maybe they aren't compatible, so I tried NetBSD. The 7043-140 is listed as a supported system. The NetBSD boot floppy images are confusing to me. The files are too large to fit on a 1.44M floppy. I didn't see instructions on how to make boot floppies out of the .fs files one can download in the install instructions. I went ahead and tried to dd the part that fits onto a 1.44M floppy and try to boot that and of course that failed. I have e-mailed the NetBSD prep mailing list and no response from that. The system does boot the AIX install on one of its hard disks, but this is a recycled system and I don't have usernames/passwords for that install. Does anyone here have a suggestion on how to proceed? alan

6 years, 9 months

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IBM 6360 - Filesystem(ish) info?

by anders.k.nelson＠gmail.com

Ah, cool thanks! I'm interested in storing arbitrary files in the manner close to the original as possible. Sounds like the extent list and allocation map would be useful for this; not so much the document content format. -- Anders Nelson +1 (517) 775-6129 www.erogear.com On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 2:44 PM Chuck Guzis <cclist at sydex.com> wrote: > On 2/19/19 11:12 AM, Anders Nelson wrote: > > Hi again, > > > > Is there a description of the DW filesystem somewhere I can look at? > > Hi Anders, > > Not that I'm aware of, unless Al has some document squirreled away that > we don't know about. > > What I know is from a lot of examining DW floppies and trying to > reverse-engineer it--and what little I could find on the web. > > The DW filesystem is basically a linked-list sort of structure. There's > a volume header block that contains an extent list and allocation map, > from which documents are treed from. Each document, in turn, links to > other entries that describe various properties of each document. For > example, the dates of the document, its name, the list of positions of > lines within the document, the document text, the formatting information > for the text, and so on. It's pretty complicated. > > One aside is that even though the DW is an 8086 system, numeric > quantities are big-endian. > > --Chuck > >

6 years, 9 months

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CDC modules

by peter＠vanpeborgh.eu

Guys, I am wanting to determine which CDC (or possibly other) computer some of my modules came from. If you were a CDC employee around the time of CDC 6xxx computers, let me know where I could send my photos for identification of these items. Many thanks, peter || | | | | | | | | Peter Van Peborgh 62 St Mary's Rise Writhlington Radstock Somerset BA3 3PD UK 01761 439 234 || | | | | | | | |

6 years, 9 months

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IBM 6360 - Filesystem(ish) info?

by anders.k.nelson＠gmail.com

Hi friends, Now that I have my glorious disk toaster (2D model I think, says "2D" on the drive levers), I want to build a controller for it. I found pinouts and some description of the media organization here: http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/ibm/6580_Displaywriter/S241-6248-3_D… I'd like to actually store data to these disks in the same manner the original systems did, and I'm proficient in hardware/firmware. Has anyone made a controller for this already? How about emulating the filesystem? Any help is appreciated, and I'd open-source whatever I make (PCBs, firmware, etc.). Thanks! -- Anders Nelson +1 (517) 775-6129 www.erogear.com

6 years, 9 months

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OT: Phone museum seeks new owner

by couryhouse＠aol.com

this guy? ?is? amazing....? ? In a message dated 2/19/2019 10:03:23 AM US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk at classiccmp.org writes: > Old tech, but not computers: > > https://madison.com/business/galesville-antique-phone-dealers-looking-to-of… >

6 years, 9 months

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Kemners Surplus - Real time walkthrough

by anders.k.nelson＠gmail.com

Hi everyone, I heard Kemners Surplus in Pottstown, PA was going away so I decided to pay them a visit. I'm taking pictures of as much vintage computing gear as I can as we speak. I'll be here until they close today at 5pm EST, so if you see something you like feel free to give them a call and I'll help them navigate. Photos updated as I walk through, here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/4Q8Jx7n36fmVczLN8 If you see something you like it'd be great if you could check if I'm interested first until I'm finished today. ;] Hope this helps someone, they shut down soon!

6 years, 9 months

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Q: Plotter bed repair with MonoKote?

by cruff＠ruffspot.net

> On Feb 18, 2019, at 11:00 AM, dwight wrote: > > There were a couple hp XY plotters that had the mylar plate delaminating. I've reworked these with model airplane mono coat. Are you referring to MonoKote (www.monokote.com <http://www.monokote.com/>)? That looks perfect for repairing the gouged bed of one of my 9872C plotters. Is a hot air supply suitable for applying the film, or did you use their heating iron? I'm guessing a bit of pressure to adhere the film is necessary?

6 years, 9 months

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corvus mirror

by bandit1921＠conbuilder.com

Anybody know where I can find a working Corvus Mirror? I have several h89/90 and 2 h8's, most still work.

6 years, 9 months

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Kemners Surplus - Real time walkthrough

by guykd＠optusnet.com.au

Oops, this was meant to go to the list _and_ William. Sorry for duplicate Will. At 09:10 AM 18/02/2019 -0500, Will wrote: >> I see 4 Boxes of punch cards. All blank? >> >> https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipN-btB2yizsHBmabHb7xtHr_zUWZlS6QENHMHb… >> >> Too bad he wants $25 a box. > >25 dollars for a full box of blank cards is actually a really good >price - but those cards are probably too far gone. Jam city. Maybe, maybe not. And there they are, as opposed to being mythical, somewhere else. Anyway, if someone was to go to Kemners and offer $10 a box for all 4, arguing that "they are pretty far gone, jam city, dusty, in a mess, maybe some blocks are OK, etc." Then I'd pay for them and pack & postage to my US reshipper in CA. At this address: Guy Dunphy 3503 Jack Northrop Ave Ste J8637 Hawthorne, CA 90250 USA And then be facing the postage to Australia too. Hence my low offer. Reason: As part of the Australian Computer Museum Society equipment dispersal, I have an IBM 028 and three IBM 026 card punches to restore. Eventually. Plus that Documation TM200 card reader. Which I'm still seeking a manual for btw. Guy

6 years, 9 months

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Kemners Surplus - Real time walkthrough

by john.h.blake＠gmail.com

Any idea what that blue Data General machine was?? Some kind of terminal server?

6 years, 9 months

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Kemners Surplus - Real time walkthrough

by guykd＠optusnet.com.au

At 01:51 PM 16/02/2019 -0500, you wrote: >Hi everyone, > >I heard Kemners Surplus in Pottstown, PA was going away so I decided to pay >them a visit. I'm taking pictures of as much vintage computing gear as I >can as we speak. I'll be here until they close today at 5pm EST, so if you >see something you like feel free to give them a call and I'll help them >navigate. > >Photos updated as I walk through, here: > >https://photos.app.goo.gl/4Q8Jx7n36fmVczLN8 That's a lot of visual fun, thanks for the photos. There is NO SUCH THING in Australia. There were still a small number when I was a child (1960-70s), all long gone now. >If you see something you like it'd be great if you could check if I'm >interested first until I'm finished today. ;] > >Hope this helps someone, they shut down soon! I see 4 Boxes of punch cards. All blank? https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipN-btB2yizsHBmabHb7xtHr_zUWZlS6QENHMHb… Too bad he wants $25 a box. And it's on the East coast, not West coast near my LA reshipper (to Australia.) And I'm near broke again, after this: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-8594e-spectrum-analyzer-at-last-i-… http://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/hp-8594e-spectrum-analyzer-repair-%28i-… Guy

6 years, 9 months

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Speaking of sounds made by machines

by technoid6502＠gmail.com

Of all machines I've used, the beloved Atari 8-bit is most vocal. It has the feature of 'i/o noise' by default. It can be disabled with a Poke, but every kind of io has distinctive sounds and actually represents the data being sent/received. If you disable it and crank the volume on your TV, you can STILL hear it, but very muted. I think this feature was created to conceal this fact... It isn't just the Atari8 that has this 'feature' in its muted version, all of the RF-TV-type machines from the 80's produce it. In theory, I think you could snoop the actual data, Tempest-like, using some radio gear. One gets very attuned to the noise and can tell the type of data being sent, (Text, vs Binary, for example) by ear. Of course, tracking noises from floppies and hard disks are also very useful indicators. In the 90's I got the hpfs386 driver out of a warp server pack and hung it on my warp 4 client. I LOVED hearing it hit the drive at boot. Boy howdy what a performance increase that gave. Best regards, Jeff On Fri, 2019-02-15 at 12:00 -0600, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > Speaking of sounds made by machines

6 years, 9 months

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3B2 Simulator Ethernet - Looking for Testers

by web＠loomcom.com

Hi folks, I think the NI Ethernet device is ready for some real world beta testing. I have put up a page here with details about how to build SIMH and how to install the "NI" ethernet drivers and TCP/IP software here: https://loomcom.com/3b2/networking.html If you're interested in helping out, you can build the current "3b2-ni" feature branch from GitHub and give it a test. If you run into any problems, I'll walk you through how to do some debugging and get logs for me to look at. If you have any questions or need any additional help, please don't hesitate to email me! Best Wishes, -Seth -- Seth Morabito Poulsbo, WA, USA web at loomcom.com

6 years, 9 months

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Dumping contents from MC68701

by kylevowen＠gmail.com

Has anyone been successful in dumping the EPROM contents from an MC68701? As I understand it, this MCU requires executing a particular program from external memory to access the internal EPROM, both for programming and reading. I will write a utility to dump the contents if necessary, but I am happy to refrain from reinventing the wheel if a solution already exists. Thanks! Kyle

6 years, 9 months

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8-Update

by pbirkel＠gmail.com

>I have an .slt for the PDP-8/e lever >Rod Please publish/share? paul

6 years, 10 months

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Shock and vibration are legitimate diagnostic tools.

by technoid6502＠gmail.com

> > On Fri, 2019-02-15 at 12:00 -0600, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote:> > as These hardware wizard stories remind me of a legendary repair wizard, > non-computer industrial devices I think. He was called in to fix a > tricky problem at the customer site. Studied it for a while, took > out a small hammer, whacked the device at some spot, and reported > "fixed". He then sent in a bill for $500 That has been my line any time I've needed to know if a machine had a 'flaky'. Sometimes, on the phone, ask a customer to give the machine a kick. They always balk, but I tell them "Shock and vibration are legitimate diagnostic tools", and that usually convinces them. In situations I suspect the problem is a flaky, it often results in a 'working' system and the customer says "oh wow! you Fixed it!". To which I say NO NO NO. It is not Fixed, only the problem is now revealed. I'll be over shortly to actually bolt down what needs bolting or otherwise make the machine immune to shock and vibration..... Best, Jeff

6 years, 10 months

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Intel Universal Prom Programmer UPP 103 documentation

by andrewsofbg＠gmail.com

Hello, I need to do some work on my intel UPP-833 personality card in my UPP and am looking for documentation This document: 9800133F_Universal_PROM_Programmer_Reference_Manual_1977 has schematics for personality cards available in ?77 but does not include the UPP-833 I am having trouble with my UPP-833 and could use some documentation. Documentation on the UPP-832 would probably be helpful if nothing on the 833 There may be a newer version of 102448-001 I do not know about. There are two Documents that should have the information are: 102448-001. Printed Wiring Assembly UPP-833 Personality (drawings and schematics), L1002488, 123832, 2000966 123832-001. Printed Wiring Assembly UPP-833 Personality (drawings and schematics), L1002488, 123832, 2000966 Can anyone help? Regards Craig

6 years, 10 months

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Fwd: Latest Batch of Items from Sellam's VWoCW

by ljw-cctech＠ljw.me.uk

Sorry, moderation fail. Forwarding to cctalk: -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: Latest Batch of Items from Sellam's VWoCW Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2019 20:27:12 -0800 From: Sellam Ismail via cctech <cctech at classiccmp.org> Reply-To: Sellam Ismail <sellam.ismail at gmail.com>, General Discussion: On-Topic Posts <cctech at classiccmp.org> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Hello Folks! I've put together another batch of items as I continue to wade through my warehouse and winnow out the wonders: HP 2116C System Manual #1 HP 2116C System Manual #2 HP 2116C System Manual #3 HP 2116C Power Cord Using the HP 3000: An Introduction to Interactive Programming Tandy WP-2 Portable Word Processor M7859 KY11-LB Console Interface Kraft 3-button PC Mouse Mouse Systems 3-button PC Mouse Zenith Z-Box External ISA Expansion Chassis Novell IBM NIC ShareNet Board Epson External 5.25" Floppy Drive SuperMac Technology DataFrame DF20 20MB external hard disk ClubMac C104 External SCSI CD-ROM Drive Midiman Mini MacMan Macintosh MIDI Interface Passport MIDI Interface for Macintosh Neutronics Hexadigit S-100 Bus Monitor Gimix Ghost 32K RAM Compaq SLT/286 portable VTech The Equalizer Laptop IBM Model M Keyboard IBM Model M Keyboard IBM Model M Keyboard IBM Model M Keyboard The main index for these and other fine items is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1I53wxarLHlNmlPVf_HJ5oMKuab4zrApI_hi… I've put some work into the index and improved it so that links keep properly updated as new items are added or sold items are removed (whereas before the index links in the New Arrivals Niche would get hopelessly out of sync). However, I believe there might have been some problems with the links before so if you saw an item you liked and the link did not lead to it and you assumed it was sold, please check again. From this point going forward, all links (above the notice in the sheet) should stay in sync. I've been preoccupied for the last few months with personal business and haven't been able to put a lot of time into curating the collection for sales but I am trying to catch up. There are a couple people that are waiting on me and I haven't forgotten about you. I will get caught up shortly and I thank you for your patience. As always, please contact me directly by e-mail via <sellam.ismail at gmail.com> to make an order or an offer. Thanks! Sellam

6 years, 10 months

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Zenith Z-90 startup

by andrewsofbg＠gmail.com

Hello, I am reading through message archives and came across your post. Did you get your h90 sorted out? Craig

6 years, 10 months

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Intel PC-BUBBLE Card documentation?

by cmhanson＠eschatologist.net

Does anyone have documentation stashed away for the Intel PC-BUBBLE Card? The PC-BUBBLE is an 8-bit ISA card that Intel produced for prototyping bubble memory applications in the mid-1980s, the ROM on mine is v3.0 and says it?s copyright 1986. I don?t want to insert this into a system until I?m sure all the (many) jumpers are configured reasonably, and I?m sure that the empty 40-pin socket at U5 isn?t something that?s critical to its operation? -- Chris

6 years, 10 months

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a timer for the PC - screen tme for the kids

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 01:17 AM 2/15/2019, Randy Dawson via cctalk wrote: >What we have, is the screen time problem with the kids. If we are not there hounding and policing them, they will be on for hours. There are also consumer firewall/routers that have time-based limits. When I've had clients ask about this, or also ask for content filtering, it's such a difficult world these days. The kids don't have tablets or phones or iPods that do WiFi and can get the Internets from cellular connections or the neighbor's WiFi? Kids rapidly figure out solutions to bypass limits. High schools have WiFi, block social media, the kids install VPNs on their phones. - John

6 years, 10 months

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a timer for the PC - screen tme for the kids

by rdawson16＠hotmail.com

Before I develop this, I thought it may already exist, and the classiccmp mail list might be the place to ask. What we have, is the screen time problem with the kids. If we are not there hounding and policing them, they will be on for hours. All the medical community says, we need to limit their screen time, as it contributes to their AD disorder and schoolwork, homework failures. My idea was initially do this in hardware, with a timer, and a solid state relay to gate the AC to the PC. On further thought, I should be able to do this in software, with a timer that lets the PC run for an hour, and then shuts the PC down until the next 24 hour cycle. (Installs itself on windows startup) Has anybody seen this, before I re-invent the wheel? Randy

6 years, 10 months

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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Paul Koning > Studied it for a while, took out a small hammer, whacked the device at > some spot, and reported "fixed". That reminds me of an amusing story from the first time I went to see 'Star Wars; I went with a group of people from Tech Sq. It has that scene where they're about to make the jump to hyperspace in the 'Falcon', and it won't go; so one of them (I think Solo) jumps up and whacks a particular spot on the bulkhead with his fist, and away she goes. We all found this terribly amusing, since one of the DEC time-sharing systems on the 9th floor had a sticky relay in the power controller, and when you'd try to power it on or off from the front panel, the relay would stick, and nothing would happen. So the procedure was to go around the back, open a particular door, reach in, and whack the power controller behind it in a particular spot with the side of your fist, and away it went! Noel

6 years, 10 months

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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Paul Koning > or a backup team of subsystem experts at the home office to call on. Actually, the actual hardware problem wasn't too hard for Fritz to find, I gather, once we knew exactly was failing (the RK11), and how (at 0170000, the XM incremented). It's not like it was a comes-and-goes kind of problem (it was quite solid and repeatable), or anything like that, so I'm not sure a 'team of experts' would really have helped. And the exact details on the failure were also pretty easy to find, once we got past a lot of other distractions! Once it became clear that the pure text was getting trashed, it was pretty easy (modulo some confusion caused by the differing OS images in the 'Ritchie' and 'Wellsch' distros :-) to stop the machine once it had a) assembled the pure text in main memory, and b) swapped it out. Looking at the copy in main memory verified it was good _before_ it was swapped, looking at the arguments on the stack gave us the disk block it was written to, and looking at the actual contents of the RK (which PDP11GUI has a mode to do) showed us the first 02400 bytes were good, and then it was trash. Bingo! Then, looking at the RK registers after the transfer had completed showed something had gone wrong in the hardware - the address left showing afterward was not the start_address+size - the XM had incremented inappropriately! And since the start address for the transfer in physical memory was 0165400, and 0165400+2400 = 0170000, that sounded pretty suspicious! So, that all happened pretty quickly. Really, the part that took the longest was getting past all the confusing noise: my confusion about R5, the malfunctioning front panel, the different versions of the OS, etc, etc. Noel

6 years, 10 months

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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by pechter＠gmail.com

> Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2019 15:03:41 -0500 > From: Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net> > To: Jay Jaeger <cube1 at charter.net>, "General Discussion: On-Topic and > ??? Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Subject: Re: PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem > Message-ID: <C07861A6-BFD8-4AD0-AAB9-F4715904BB60 at comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset=us-ascii > > > > On Feb 13, 2019, at 1:20 PM, Jay Jaeger via cctalk > <cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > > ... > > Maybe that story about FE's using Unix as a test to confirm operation > > even when diagnostics said the machine was OK was not so much just a > > legend? > > It still fels like a legend.? My experience with DEC field service > engineers is that they used the diagnostics.? In the PDP-11 era, Unix > knowledge around DEC was pretty sparse, especially early on when it > could be found only in the Telephone Products Group (Armando > Stettner).? RSTS would be more plausible, but I never saw that in the > hads of FS engineers either. > By and large diagnostics would find problems. I've seen a number in > the 1970s, including a messy data path failure in the 11/45 MMU where > we (college students) did the initial diagnosis while the FS engineer > was on his way. My suspicion is that things not solved by diagnostics > would be escalated to the "wizard from Maynard". And they'd probably > start replacing whole subsystems. I've seen that once, when our > college RSTS-11 system (11/20, 16 DL-11 lines) was crashing on average > once a day for months. DEC brought in several of those "wizards". The > "fix" was to replace the 11/20 by a "spare part" -- an 11/45 with more > memory, a DH11, and RSTS/E. Decades later I was told that the wizards > actually pinned the blame on the college FM broadcast transmitter, > about 200 feet down the hall from the computer center. That may well > be, though I didn't heard that at the time. RSTS did get used in > manufacturing, at Final Assembly & Test sites like Westminster MA and > Salem NH, where PDP-11 systems large enough to run RSTS/E were > subjected to a load test of exerciser programs running under that OS. > The way it was explained to us is that a system that would be happy > with such a test would also be happy with any customer application. > It's not clear if that was because RSTS would load things more than > most, or was more finicky about hardware glitches than most, but it > certainly was the practice for quite some time. Of course, not all > PDP-11 configurations could be tested that way. paul I guess the experience in NJ was a bit different since AT&T had two dedicated Field Service offices who handled their sites including Bell Labs. I was on the Commercial/Government side from 81-86 and we didn't get to play with RSTS on customer sites at all (but sometimes we got to play in the in-house machines in Princeton or on our own hardware). It was a bit different in the Vax side since many diags were run under VAX/VMS and as a brand new hire I was doing Vax installs -- including installing the VMS 2.x and 3.x on 11/780's and 11/750's at install time. If they had paid for software installation -- the software guys would wipe and reinstall. If not we left the pack and prayed the customer wouldn't wipe the diags that we installed on the disk when we build the VMS pack.? Realistically the only thing the customer needed to do after we got done was tweak the systen parameters, check the swap etc. and lay on the layered products like languages. Things got much more interesting when the VMS3.x and 4.x got CI780's and HSC50's.? That was more involved than the easy VMS 2.x-3.x install. As far as the 11/70's -- I'm building a pidp1170... My last 11/70 install was around 84 or so when I put in a late DECDatasystem 570 blue 11/70 with the FCC Cabinets at AT&T in Freehold. As far as the Wizard from Maynard -- one story from my branch support guy (rumored to be about his brother on the 11/70 line in (I think in Westminster MA... not Salem or other NH plants) had an intermittant 11/70 that would crash every couple of days and they could run all the diags and DEC X11 with no issues.? They called over their in-house wizard who ran toggle-in programs from the front panel -- playing the switches like piano keys with both hands.?? After about a half hour his comment was "Clean the terminator fingers." Machine ran like a SOB once the gold fingers were cleaned. Weirdest 11/70 mess I had was after I left DEC to work for a third party maintenance group.? Their regional support was in Dallas.? I was in NJ.? They couldn't find their support guy so they rushed me on a plane to Chicago to work with two techs who were babysitting a mess they had no clue on. The site was WW Granger in Skokie and I arrived at 3AM...? They had a 5 or 6 story warehouse which was a totally robotic automated site picking water heaters and other industrial equipment from what looked like an over-sized 6 floor tape library.? Two 11/34's running RSX11 ran the picker.? One was down for weeks.? Their 11/70 was half disassembled with two techs working on it.? They were VAX trained at a third party school but they weren't PDP11 techs.? An RM03 on the 11/34's was down as well. The 11/70 was a RSTS/E box doing all the billing and inventory for Granger at the site. I walked in at 3AM with my Digital truckers cap on and found they couldn't boot XXDP+ from tape. The OS wouldn't come up either. The customer gave me a pile of error logs dating back over six months -- (I think Sept through March) and they all showed memory management error aborts and retries. The techs who thought they were changing memory never found the MOS memory box... they were swapping cache boards thinking they were memory. Went to 10000 and deposited 014747 and ran it... It either failed on addresses ending in 0 or 4 or 2 or 6. The MOS on the 11/70 had two controllers and interleaved the memory.? Pulled one of the interleave controllers -- ran the toggle in and it worked.? Aha... bad memory controller. Booted diags and sent for the board spare. Decided the RM03 would be a bitch to work on without the tester or tools and the management found a spare locally at a used DEC joint in the area.? Swapped the drive once we carried the new one up the stairs. The 11/34 had a problem... the machine wouldn't boot and the run light (IIRC) was on all the time. The machine had two full unibus dd11-dk boxes even though it didn't need them all. Terminated at the CPU backplane and did toggle-ins.? OK.? Worked... jumpered out the next UNUSED segment of the Unibus backplane with a Unibus ribbon cable and the problem was gone. The guys had been there over two weeks digging themselves a hole.? Third party service on DEC stuff varied with the person.? Some were ex-DEC genius types who were consultant level experts on the hardware.? Some just knew to swap the board with the Red Led lit. Another time I ran into an engineer who told me (chip info here faked -- don't pull the prints...too many years to have kept TE16/TM03 prints). A call comes in to dispatch with the following information: "The TE16 at Naval Air Propulsion, Trenton is down.? It doesn't come on line.? The light is lit but the system doesn't see it.? I put the board on an They supposedly changed memory on the 11/70 -- but wextender and U34 pin 12 is low and doesn't go high. I need someone to come out and change the chip." I call the site back.? I'm in Princeton 15-20 minutes away.? I get the customer on line and tell him I'll be there in 3 weeks or so.? DECservice 2 hour response won't cover the call since he wants a chip changed in 1985 and we don't stock them -- so it will be a special source issue for logistics and we'll get back to him.? Or... I can swap the M8916 Logic And Write board in about15 minutes.? Does he want it fixed or does he want to prove he called the correct chip... Bill

6 years, 10 months

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Sun dealer in CA

by sales＠elecplus.com

Ken Bush - IT Solutions Specialist Parallel Technology, LLC 23510 Telo Ave #7 Torrance, CA 90505 310-320-8477 x1 Trillian "kenbush4sun" Lots of old Sun gear, will configure as requested. Please contact him directly. Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-370-3239 cell sales at elecplus.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

6 years, 10 months

1
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Sun stuff in Canada

by sales＠elecplus.com

WTS sun T5220, USED, qty 10, CALL, We have a huge qty of sun available interested let me know sun equip available now: 1X STORAGETEK 3510 FC 1X x4100 m2 1X sparc t520 3 x enterprise 250 1X SUN SPARC 220r 2 X SUNFIRE V210 4 X ENTERPRISE T5120 1X ENTERPRISE M4000 1X SUNFIRE V4440 1X sunfire V880 3X X SUNFIRE 240 2X SUNFIRE V245 5 X SUNFIRE V490 1X SUNFIRE 280R 3 X SUNFIRE 440 1X SUNFIRE 4200 1X SUNFIRE 4100 1X SUNFIRE X4100 M2 5X SUNFIRE V120 25 X BLADE T6340 1X BLADE T6240 10 X BLADE CHASSIS 6000 2 X BLADE X6220 1X BLADE T6320 10 X BLADE T6300 Daniel Fecteau 6025 Arthur sauv? Mirabel, Quebec J7N 2W4 TEL: 450-969-1616 ext 101 Mail: save at savesysteme.com Does not have to be sold as a lot, you can pick and choose. Please contact Daniel directly if interested. Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-370-3239 cell sales at elecplus.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

6 years, 10 months

1
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Sun T5440 servers, configured

by sales＠elecplus.com

Hello Cindy. I did have some of the Sun T5440's in stock. I can cover at least 4 units that would be configured. The config and cost is listed below. Let me know if you need the config adjusted in any way. Thank you. (qty-4) T5440/4x1.4ghz/128gb/2x300gbhd/DVD: $525 each BEN WILLIAMS SUN - ORACLE BROKER REP P: 315-732-1420 EXT.304 F: 315-732-1502 SKYPE: BEN at ADIRONDACKNETWORKS.NET TRILLIAN: BENANET Please contact him directly to purchase. Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-370-3239 cell sales at elecplus.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

6 years, 10 months

1
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mainframes and other stuff

by sales＠elecplus.com

Mainframes and other stuff Recycle center in NC is willing to save out "stuff" for people. No, no one can go in the back and scrounge. No, he does not want a lot of emails from people. Yes, he gets big blue and orange and beige 6 foot tall OLD mainframes in all the time. They squash them at the moment. Yes, he will package small orders, and will properly palletize larger orders. Local pick up will be available after the new year. So, if u can send me a picture with description and some part numbers, along with what you want to pay, I will consolidate things and make arrangements. Please don't ask for specific boards from DEC; they don't want to go into that much detail. QBUS will mean nothing to him. Big orange cabinet that says xxxxx is much more likely to get saved. They are moving to new warehouse 1st of the month, so all this will start happening after the 1st of the year. Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-792-3400 phone 830-792-3404 fax sales at elecplus.com AOL IM elcpls

6 years, 10 months

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Vendor turned into recycler

by sales＠elecplus.com

Just outside Dallas is a very large warehouse. I have been there before, and have posted about it before. It has been acquired by a recycling company, sort of. The old man who owns the stuff thinks of the equip as his children. A week from Sat I will be going to the warehouse with 2 or 3 guys from San Antonio. We will arrive about noon, and hire a truck to bring stuff home before it turns into mincemeat. He will not sell to the public, but I have a license. If you want to attend, I can buy stuff for you. The address is 9525 Skillman St, Dallas, TX 75243 Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-370-3239 cell sales at elecplus.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

6 years, 10 months

1
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by frisbie＠flying-disk.com

Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote: > I have had an RK11-C for a long time that I've never tried to > power up (I got an RKV11-D and used that on Qbus machines > instead). Wow, someone else with an RKV11-D! I thought I was the only person who had one. I modified mine (using the dead bug technique) to add 18-bit addressing instead of just 16, and ran it successfully with RT-11 and RSX-11M on my 11/73 system. I have had DEC people visit my place, look at the RKV11-D, and say "DEC never made anything like that!". :-) Alan "and I don't exist either" Frisbie

6 years, 10 months

1
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IBM terminals with keyboards, 3174 controllers, 4700 controllers

by sales＠elecplus.com

Previously I have posted some vendors who have old hardware they are willing to sell. Earlier this week I was in San Antonio, and I stopped by an old friend to say hello. He has several 3174 controllers, and every imaginable add-on available for them. Pallets of them! Also IBM 4700 banking controllers, and 1 monitor. No keyboards. 8" floppy drives. IBM terminals, most models available, $85 tested and working with matching keyboard, no severe screen burn. Contact bfloyd at southtexasproducts dot com. Cindy Croxton Electronics Plus 1613 Water Street Kerrville, TX 78028 830-370-3239 cell sales at elecplus.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

6 years, 10 months

3
3
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Another dealer going under

by cctalk＠ibm51xx.net

> Calabasas, CA Well for a change it is someone just next door so I can definitely take a look. I wonder if they have anything available. Do you have contact info/address? -Ali > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ali [mailto:cctalk at ibm51xx.net] > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2019 2:57 PM > To: 'Electronics Plus'; 'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic > Posts' > Subject: RE: Another dealer going under > > > > I don't get replies from here yet, so I have seen no replies to my > > posts, > > nor the posts themselves. > > > > There is a shop that has been in biz for over 25 years that is > closing > > in > > California. > > > > Cindy, > > Where in CA? It's a big state :) > > -Ali

6 years, 10 months

3
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Jerry Weiss > I am trying to understand how the diagnostics didn't reveal this defect. Vondada #12: "Diagnostics are highly efficient in finding solved problems." :-) Noel

6 years, 10 months

1
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by fritzm＠fritzm.org

[oops, accidentally replied directly instead of to the list] On 2/13/19 12:54 PM, Ethan Dicks wrote: > It's interesting that it was a bad 7430 in [your RK11-C]. I find that for equipment of that vintage, my usual suspects are failed 7474s and failed 7440s, probably 80% of the total. Behind that, it goes 7420s and then maybe 7430s. Looking back over my repair log, my totals just within the RK11-C were: 2x 7430 (M119, M795) 1x 7420 (M141) 1x 7401 (M149) 1x 7400 (M203)

6 years, 10 months

1
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by frisbie＠flying-disk.com

> > > Likely some disk controllers did NOT SUPPORT crossing 64K boundaries! > > > > No; the RK11 spec says "[the two extended memory bits] make up a two-bit > > counter that increments each time the RKBA overflows". > > > > The actual error turns out to be slightly different to my guess; there's > > a spurious overflow from the low 16-bit register to these bits at 0170000. > > Maybe a problem with E29 or E34 on the M795 module? I am finding this entire discussion extremely fascinating! Every day I look forward to reading the latest twists in the plot. The ideas, hunches, tests, dead ends, and results are an excellent example of the debugging process. I am awaiting the exciting Perry Mason style conclusion, where the guilty chip stands up and confesses on the stand. :-) Alan "Where were you on the night of the crime?" Frisbie

6 years, 10 months

7
10
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Alan Frisbie > I am finding this entire discussion extremely fascinating! Every day I > look forward to reading the latest twists in the plot. I forgot to mention the most amazing part of the whole story: he first acquired the machine while he was a student (I think?) at CMU, decades ago, and has been dragging it around the country with him ever since! He's also had to do a tremendous amount of work on it to get it running, starting with building an entire new power harness. He's also had to find and fix a long list of failures, all over the machine; there were bad chips on almost every board in it. Fritz has written most of the whole adventure up: http://fritzm.github.io/category/pdp-11.html it's an incredible story. Noel

6 years, 10 months

2
1
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JPL Auction

by cclist＠sydex.com

Those of you in So. Cal. may be interested. Lots of Sun stuff: https://gsaauctions.gov/ATTACHMENT/REGN9/91QSCI19501806/806ListingofAvailab… -- --Chuck Sent from my digital computer

6 years, 10 months

2
1
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PDP-11/45 RSTS/E boot problem

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Alan Frisbie > I am finding this entire discussion extremely fascinating! Every day I > look forward to reading the latest twists in the plot. :-) > The ideas, hunches, tests, dead ends, and results are an excellent > example of the debugging process. Yeah, and it was a Duesie of a problem, too. Although once we got clear of the bad data from the console and my confusion about R5, and it became clear that in the Unix failure, the pure text was being damaged, from that point it was pretty straightforward to track it down (albeit one that needed detailed understanding of how V6 handled pure texts - and luckily I'd come to understand that part of the system a bit while getting the QSIC running). Fritz's lucky discovery, early on, that it was location dependent was also a big help. Noel

6 years, 10 months

1
0
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Looking for: 68000 C compilers

by classiccmp＠philpem.me.uk

Hi, I'm (still) trying to reverse-engineer a ton of M68K ROM code which was apparently compiled with a circa-1990 C compiler. Does anyone have copies of any of the following -- or any other C compilers for the 68K which were around at that time? * Sierra Systems 68000 C compiler (was part of some Sega Genesis developer kits) * HP 68000 C compiler (either the HP 64000 or MSDOS versions) (I believe this was sold as the "HP B3640 Motorola 68000 Family C Cross Compiler) * Lattice C * Anything not on this list ;) My game plan is to take the compiled standard libraries from these compilers and build up some patterns/"fingerprints" to try and make a better guess at what the code is up to. I figure if I can at least pin down the stdlib and floating-point code, I have a better chance at figuring out what the main code does. I've seen the HP cross compiler manual on Bitsavers, but the compiler itself doesn't seem to be on bitsavers/bits. Thanks. -- Phil. philpem at philpem.me.uk http://www.philpem.me.uk/

6 years, 10 months

16
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Wirewrap DIP sockets - any interest?

by wdonzelli＠gmail.com

Does anyone here still actively wire wrap circuits? I am thinking about dumping my inventory of nice machine pin wirewrap sockets. Lately they have been selling like lead balloons. Contact me off list. -- Will, in the Hudson Valley

6 years, 10 months

8
12
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Mounting HP7970e 9-Trk 1/2" Tape Drive

by frisbie＠flying-disk.com

jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu (Noel Chiappa) wrote: > > From: Alan Frisbie > > > Harbor Freight sells a nice hydraulic lift table for under $200 that I > > have found very useful for that sort of thing. It doesn't go up very high > > (like for the top of a rack), but I used it with some wood blocks > > Thanks for the tip! I got one on sale for about US$140; it's _very_ sturdy. > And the top is just large enough to hold two milk crates (available at > Home Depot, BTW), so it's guite easy to build up a stack as high as one > needs to reach the top of a 6' rack. Thank you very much for the feedback -- it makes me happy when I know that someone finds my suggestions useful. I've used the milk crate technique myself, with a piece of sheet metal on top to make it easier to slide the load off. I hope you secure such a stack tightly. :-) I used some of the inexpensive 1" wide Harbor Freight cargo straps. Alan "You can't have too many clamps or straps" Frisbie

6 years, 10 months

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