>They confirmed my order. Fingers crossed they actually ship them, and it doesn't
>turn into an argument about honoring transactions. Though probably, a higher postage
>cost would be fair. 88 floppies and covers will weigh a bit. (Should have bought 100.)
>4 Pack of 5.25" Floppy Diskettes with Sleeves
>COM1147 22 $0.89 $19.58
>Subtotal: $19.58
>Shipping & Handling: $6.95
>Tax: $0.00
>Order Total: $26.53
They DID ship them. Just received notice of shipment.
You know, the postage from Garland, Texas to LA, CA for a box of 88 floppies would
have been more than $6.95. How much more, I don't know.
Could they have made a loss on that transaction, hence the price bump?
> That's not the same BG Micro we bought stuff from in the
> early 80's, is it?
> bill
>The one with the yellow photocopied catalog? That's the same one.
>The owner/founder passed away a year or two ago and I believe his daughter is running it now.
>Will
Can anyone estimate the likely US postage for that package? Please let me know.
If BG Micro are badly out on that transaction, I'll contact them and make it up to them.
Would not if it was some big corp, but BG Micro are clearly honest. Such a rarity.
Funny, I was thinking of Diogenes and his lantern just the other day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes
Guy
Hi, All,
Another recent find, a Tallgrass Technologies "Shortcut", 80286
upgrade for 8-bit PCs. I've found several reviews online but no docs
and no software (to enable the onboard 16K cache).
One thing that concerns me is that on this unit, the 24-pin socket at
U18 is empty. It might be nothing. This one does not have the memory
daughtercard on J1, so perhaps they are related.
If anyone has docs or has one and could tell me if their U18 is empty
(and if not, what goes there), that would be great.
Thanks!
-ethan
I have a set of boards from a data General nova 3 triple option
Location: Vancouver Island Canada
If interested please email Jeffreybirkin at hotmail.com
Sent from my iPhone
I am looking for the mating male connector. Anyone that has an idea what
connector this is? There is nothing indicated on the connector itself about
what the manufacturer it is.
https://i.imgur.com/YzAfB2g.png
/Mattis
Hi, All,
I recently picked up an item I've been looking for for quite some
time, a handheld configuration "terminal" for a LeCroy 1440 HV
chassis, called a "Model 1447 Local Diagnostic Controller". It's
superficially like the DEC hand-held used in the field for internal
RA81 diagnostics but it's not the same model.
The 1447 is described in the 1440 docs, so I have the pinout (DA-15
with TxD and RxD on pins 2 and 3, plus ground and +5V on certain
pins). A sticker on my 1447 indicates it's a "Termiflex" product but
all I can find online are pictures and docs from the later LCD display
units. This one has a 1x16 LED alpha display.
Does anyone have any docs on older LED Termiflex units? Again, I have
the pinout but I'm curious about the innards. Unfortunately, the 4
case latches are difficult to unlock without some magic shim tool or
I'd just open mine and reverse-engineer the PCB (there are four 2mm x
8mm slots with some sort of metal barbs at the bottom that seem to
need a specific tool to open - a small blade has been unhelpful so
far).
Pinouts (cf J3)
https://prep.fnal.gov/catalog/hardware_info/lecroy/high_voltage/images/fig2…
>From the LANL docs for the 1440 I've found so far, it's unclear at the
moment if TxD and RxD are +/-12V or +5V and GND but that's easy to
check on the TxD line before I put anything on the RxD line.
Thanks for any info.
-ethan
> From: Eric Smith
> two separate backplanes that are combined for the RH20s (if
> present), one backplane for the A through D positions (upper 2/3 of
> each module slot), and one for E and F.
How odd. DEC was quite happy to do hex backplanes elsewhere, and it looks
>from the photo (EK-108OU-PD-002, pg. 3-8) like the MASSBUS connector are
wired to both backplanes, so they had to stay together.
>> On the -PA to -PV upgrade, could the backplane really be done with
>> some wraps? I ask because I saw in one manual, talking about a
>> KL10-C to -PV upgrade, it calls for a backplane swap-out.
EK-0KL20-IN-001 ("KL10-Based DECSystem-20 Installation Manual"), in
Section 10.2 "KL10-PV Upgrade Procedure for KL10-C", if anyone wants to
look.
> I'm not entirely sure, so I easily could have been mistaken. I know
> -PV to -PW just needs some wraps. -PA to -PV may have required more
> significant backplane changes. Definitely they have different part
> numbers for the -PA and -PV backplane assemblies.
Yeah, DEC was quite happy to have the FS guys do wirewrap on install (e.g.
for the NIA20). So my guess is that if the default upgrade for at least
one -PA to -PV (above) was to replace the backplane, that would have been
the standard way, because of some issue.
Whether it was just too many wires to do manually, or if there were also
trace issues, it would be interesting to know. Oh, it's also possible that
since the -PA to -PV involved a faster clock, I wonder if some backplane
lines turned into twisted pair, or coax?
Noel
These do not come available very often. Not affiliated with seller, etc.
WTS EVEREX SYSTEMS PCT04, REF, qty 5, CALL, TAPE CONTROLLER 16 BIT ISA
Sajjad Mukhi
Sales/purchasing
FML Computers Inc
Phone: 407-637-2922 Toll: 407-637-2922
Fax: 407-362-7826 Cell: 407-718-8778
Mukhi at fml-computers.com
Cindy Croxton
Electronics Plus
1613 Water Street
Kerrville, TX 78028
830-370-3239 cell
sales at elecplus.com
---
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Thanks for that link Charles and also thanks to Mark Kahrs for
obituary on Roger Abbott. I started out on PDP-8 in 1968 which was
the first time I had hands on access to a computer at
UofCalgary. Would have loved to have had access to one when I did my
MSc in neurophysiology in 1975 but obviously Oxford in 1972 had much
better funding than Uof0 (University of Ottawa). Roger Abbott had a
PDP-8 to acquire data from his insect muscle preparations and noticed
that 1972 Journal of Physiology papers no longer behind a paywall
when was looking what type of research he was doing. Uof0 was still
using rotating smoked drum cylinders to record muscle twitches in
some labs and the lab I was in had a high speed oscilloscope camera
which one could use to shoot long strips of neuron spike activigy
>from a mouse cerebellar culture. A technician was available to
measure the time intervals between spikes and that's how I was
supposed to do my project to look for connections between
simultaneously recorded cells in the cultures. My request for a
computer was denied and I was given $200 to build an electronic
device to time the spikes and send them to the Uof0 360 mainframe
where my FORTRAN code generated cross-correlograms and other neat
graphs on a line printer
http://drgimbarzevsky.com/Computers/UofOTerminal/TerminalCircuitBoards1.html
Despite comments that I seemed to be working on a graduate degree in
electrical engineering rather than neurophysiology, what I learned
doing large scale TTL state-machine devices was invaluable when I
moved to Vancouver and worked at UBC Pharmacology where lab computers
were the norm and did my last bit of PDP-8 programming on a PDP-12 to
speed up gathering data from a mouse diaphragm preparation which was
easily done by rewriting the whole thing in PDP-8 and Link-8
assembler. The researcher whose machine it was used FOCAL for
everything which made for horrendously slow data analysis. That
done, I finally got to play on what I still view as one of the best
computers ever made, the PDP-11.
Fortunately at UBC there were a lot of researchers who mixed writing
code and building their own hardware with doing their
electrophysiologic experiments. That was a neat time when dicussions
we'd have were whether a particular bit of data acquisition was to be
done with optimized assembler code vs building our own dedicated
board which would plug into Unibus on 11/34. I liked the latter
approach but it was easier to debug PDP-11 ASM than chasing down
bugs on a custom interface board having to spend time writing custom
diagnostics to see if things were really working as designed.
Have an old Algol book around from early 1970's and remember reading
it then but liked FORTRAN more but most of my code was FORTRAN
calling PDP-11 ASM functions on a PDP-11. All my PDP-8 programs from
early 1970's are on paper tape and have never been transferred to
other media. Algol 60 looks interesting enough to use given compact
code and neat architecture that will try running it on PDP-8
simulator someday. Problem with simulators is that almost all of
PDP-8 and PDP-11 code I wrote was to interface to A/D's and D/A's or
parallel ports to run experiments. Once got a C64, wrote graphing
code in C64 Basic and photographed my TV which was way faster than
writing code in PDP-11 ASM to display graphs and data on oscilloscope
screen from D/A's. Got into VB once PC's were cheaper than Macs and
notice there's a lot of VB5 and VB6 code on Roger Abbott's final
code. VB6 is something I still use and once I get my VB6 code
running under Wine, windoze will be a distant memory.
Was neat to see where other physiologists had been in early 1970's
where it seemed I spend more time building the tools I needed to get
the data I wanted than to do the experiments.
Boris Gimbarzevsky
>I played around with this algol 60 compiler for the PDP8 and succeeded in
>getting it to run. I have not found any other notes, so I thought that I
>would give a leg up to the next one that wants to work on it.
>
>-chuck
>
>--------
>
>This ALGOL 60 implementation for the PDP8 was written by Roger H. Abbott
>while he was at Oxford.
>
>The bits are here:
>http://www.bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp8/papertapeImages/russ.ucs.indiana.edu…
>
>A copy of the manual here:
>https://archive.org/details/hack42_ROG_ALGOL_Compiler
>
>A paper here:
>http://pdp8.de/download/RogAlgol.pdf
>
>Mr. Abbotts business is here:
>http://www.angelfire.com/biz/rhaminisys/index.html
>
>The website or the host is a bit sketchy. The business is probably defunct.
>I found a link that said Mr. Abbott died in the early 2000.
>
>The system is two parts: the compiler and the runtime.
>
>This is all assuming the use of OS/8.
>
>To create the SV file for the compiler:
>.R ABSLDR
>*INTRUN.BN,ALGCOM.BN,COMOS8.BN$
>.SAVE SYS:ALGCOM.SV
>.R ALGCOM.SV
>
>To create the SV file for the runtime system/loader:
>.R ABSLDR
>*FPP.BN,ALGRUN.BN,RUNOS8.BN
>.SAVE SYS:RALGOL.SV
>.R RALGOL.SV
>
>There are other options for the FPP.BN for other hardware possibilities.
>FPEAE8.BN for the classic pdp8 EAE and FPPEAE.BN for the PDP8/e EAE. This
>needs some testings.
>
>Running an ALGOL program:
>
>.TYPE FLOAT.AL
>'BEGIN'
> 'REAL' A,B;
> TEXT(1,"HELLO WORLD!");
> SKIP(1);
> A := 3.141592;
> B := COS(A);
> TEXT(1,"A = ");
> RWRITE(1,A);
> SKIP(1);
> TEXT(1,"B = COS(A) = ");
> RWRITE(1,B);
>'END'
>$$$$$
>
>.R ALGCOM
>
>ROGALGOL MK40
>OUT<IN*FLOAT<FLOAT
>
>SIZE 39
>
>.R RALGOL
>
>ROGALGOLOADER
>INPUT FILENAME ?*FLOAT.AC
>
>ENDS 0251
>^^PHELLO WORLD!
>A = +0.314159E+001
>B = COS(A) = -0.999999E+000
>^^PHELLO WORLD!
>A = +0.314159E+001
>B = COS(A) = -0.999999E+000
>^^C
>.
>
>The source AL file must end with a few $$$$ or an odd fault code will
>result. The fault codes are embedded in the source files as addresses.
>
>The compiler output file has the AC suffix.
>
>After the loader runs it will pause with a ^ prompt and the user will have
>to enter a ^P to proceed or ^C to quit.
>
>The manual is the best description for the user.
BG Micro, a surplus electronics dealer I buy from sometimes, has diskettes for sale. I don't know anything about them, but thought it may be of interest. I have no affiliation other than being a customer on their mailing list.
Here is a link to the site:
https://www.bgmicro.com/4-pack-of-5-25-floppy-diskettes-with-sleeves.aspx
Will
I have a ton of DEC boards that I will probably never use. I sell off what
I can, when I can, but have large quantities of some and no need for them.
I have to do something and I like recycling cans and plastic, but not
computer parts. If anyone can use these or any other DEC board, feel free
to contact me off list.
I would prefer to sell in qty, but will consider all requests. If you are
parting them out and don't want them, I will reduce the price and keep the
fingers.
Thanks, Paul
Hi there.
I just acquired a board with the number M7609. It was advertised as an M630-CA which my research tells me is supposed to be 16MB. How do I tell on the board if this is 8MB or 16MB? There does not seem to be a suffix on the board that I can see.
What to look for?
73 Eugene W2HX
> On Jul 9, 2019, at 10:00 AM,Tomasz Rola wrote:
>
> BTW, you would like a ride to the past? I would like a ride to the
> future. Although from what I have seen so far, maybe not...
Spider Robinson did a story about this, entitled ?The Time-Traveler.?
The method, while as easily-implemented now as it was then, is not pleasant.
Adam
Here's pot stirrer for a holiday Friday afternoon:
How many different protocols / methods can we collectively come up with
for how email can be transferred?
I'm primarily thinking about between servers (MTA-to-MTA). But I'm also
willing to accept servers and clients (MTA-to-MUA). Where you can /
could run at least one server yourself.
? SMTP(S)
? UUCP (rmail)
? MMDF
? X.400
? Microsoft Exchange proprietary protocol
? Novell GroupWise proprietary protocol
? Lotus (IBM) Domino proprietary protocol
? FidoNet (FTN)
? BITNET
? Direct file access - group Post Office
? Direct file access - mail spool
--
Grant. . . .
unix || die
> Erom: Eric Smith
Hey, thanks for taking the time to provide all those details.
As you no doubt saw, our emails crossed; I had managed to work out my own
what the difference was. I'd been looking at this page:
http://corestore.org/DEC2065.htm
and saw the two backplanes, and assumed one was the EBox, and one the
MBox - wrong! But eventually I got it straight...
One some other points you covered:
> The 1080 was intended to replace a KA10 or KI10 ... It only needed a
> single DTE20 for the internal console PDP-11, and it didn't need an
> RH20 because the disk would be attached via an RH10
Got it; makes sense.
Could an -A be upgraded to a -B by swapping the I/O backplane? (Yes, the
wiring to the I/O connectors would have to be changed too, and that might have
been too difficult.) But could the APR handle it (perhaps with one or more
board changes)?
> The -PA and -PV designations .. are for the "arithmetic processor"
> (APR), which is the main CPU portion of the KL10.
Useful terminology to know. Do you happen to know what 'PV' stands for -
or is it just a random letter code?
>> my new theory is that it's the MBox ... that is the
>> difference between the KL10-A and the KL10-B.
> It's not just the MBOX; there are significant EBOX differences as
> well. Various modules from the entire CPU are different, and the
> backplane wiring is slightly different. It was possible to upgrade a
> -PA to -PV by swapping modules and adding some wraps to the
> backplane
Do note I said "KL10-A and the KL10-B", not 'Model A and Model B'... I
assume the APR's in the -A and -B were identical, it was just the I/O
backplane, etc which were different.
On the -PA to -PV upgrade, could the backplane really be done with some
wraps? I ask because I saw in one manual, talking about a KL10-C to -PV
upgrade, it calls for a backplane swap-out.
I've also got some open questions on the later things like the KL10-R, -PW,
and MCA25, which are not covered well in the documentation avilable in
bitsavers; do you know about the later variations?
Noel
Today I can announce that 10 original Apple 1 computers will be
displayed at VCF West, and we're working on getting more. Several of
these will be up-and-running. Original and current owners will join
early Apple employees in a panel to discuss the computers, why they were
purchased, how they were used, and what the owners plan to do in the
future. So, buy your tickets online now. :)
http://vcfed.org/wp/festivals/vintage-computer-festival-west/
-Evan
Does anyone here have any sort of guide on how to get QEMU working
emulating a sparc or sparc64 machine WITH networking that actually works?
I've been banging my head against zillions of guides that are dreadfully
outdated or just don't work.
--
David Griffith
dave at 661.org
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
I have a small stack of Sun 3 Administrator, Networking and Diagnostic
manuals, from about 1990.? Contact me if you think anyone would want them?
? Thanks
/guy fedorkow
> So my new theory is that it's the MBox (either the backplane, the
> boards, or the wiring from it to connectors, etc) that is the difference
> between the KL10-A and the KL10-B.
So I wuz confused; the second backplane is not the MBox (which is apparently
on the main CPU backplane), but an 'I/O backplane'. The one in the KL10-B is
different+larger and holds the RH20s, etc.
Noel
So I'm a little puzzled by something, and I was wondering if anyone
here knows the answer.
So early KL10's (KL10-A's, to be precise) only support a single DTE20, and
no RH20's. Later ones supported up to 4 of the former, and up to 8 of the
latter.
I always supposed this to be part and parcel of the 'Model A/Model B' CPU
difference, but no... EK-0KL10-02 Part 1 (no title, seems to be notes for
F/S) pg. 9, says both KL10-A and KL10-B's are PA (DEC jargon for the Model
A CPU - below), but the former has no RH20's, the latter does.
(A note at the bottom of the page says that a PA is a 'Model A', and
describes it as having "internal channels". The PV is a 'Model B' -
extended addressing, larger ucode, faster clock.)
So my new theory is that it's the MBox (either the backplane, the boards,
or the wiring from it to connectors, etc) that is the difference between
the KL10-A and the KL10-B.
Can anyone confirm this and/or provide details of the differences? Pictures
of the MBox in a KL10-A would be good, too.
Noel
Hi All,
First post here.? I have a HP9000 Series 320 computer with a HP Drive
system.? It uses the HPL 2.1 (I think) operating system. I'm trying to
get some ASCII files out of the system using the RS232 port.? The port
is female DB9, so I'm assuming it's DCE.? I got an HP cable DB9 to DB25
which reorients the pins to PC standard RS232 DTE.? I can get a
connection with the HP. but when I try to send a file it just shows the
word "PROMPT" on the PC. I'm not sure what to do at this point.? I'm
currently using Tera Term.? Any advice is appreciated.
Roger Addy
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Hi...I am arriving at Gatwick Airport this weds evening1045pm and I have a
17 hour layover. I'd like to visit the national computer museum at
bletchley park about an hour north. I see I can rent a car from the
airport and drive to a hotel near the museum. There are a few hotels with
24/7 desks. Concerns? Total time in England is 17 hours, 8 of which
needed for sleep, plus travel to and from the airport and museum. Not sure
how efficient the car rental return process is, etc. Need some buffer for
unknowns
Thanks in advance
Bill
I played around with this algol 60 compiler for the PDP8 and succeeded in
getting it to run. I have not found any other notes, so I thought that I
would give a leg up to the next one that wants to work on it.
-chuck
--------
This ALGOL 60 implementation for the PDP8 was written by Roger H. Abbott
while he was at Oxford.
The bits are here:
http://www.bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp8/papertapeImages/russ.ucs.indiana.edu…
A copy of the manual here:
https://archive.org/details/hack42_ROG_ALGOL_Compiler
A paper here:
http://pdp8.de/download/RogAlgol.pdf
Mr. Abbotts business is here:
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/rhaminisys/index.html
The website or the host is a bit sketchy. The business is probably defunct.
I found a link that said Mr. Abbott died in the early 2000.
The system is two parts: the compiler and the runtime.
This is all assuming the use of OS/8.
To create the SV file for the compiler:
.R ABSLDR
*INTRUN.BN,ALGCOM.BN,COMOS8.BN$
.SAVE SYS:ALGCOM.SV
.R ALGCOM.SV
To create the SV file for the runtime system/loader:
.R ABSLDR
*FPP.BN,ALGRUN.BN,RUNOS8.BN
.SAVE SYS:RALGOL.SV
.R RALGOL.SV
There are other options for the FPP.BN for other hardware possibilities.
FPEAE8.BN for the classic pdp8 EAE and FPPEAE.BN for the PDP8/e EAE. This
needs some testings.
Running an ALGOL program:
.TYPE FLOAT.AL
'BEGIN'
'REAL' A,B;
TEXT(1,"HELLO WORLD!");
SKIP(1);
A := 3.141592;
B := COS(A);
TEXT(1,"A = ");
RWRITE(1,A);
SKIP(1);
TEXT(1,"B = COS(A) = ");
RWRITE(1,B);
'END'
$$$$$
.R ALGCOM
ROGALGOL MK40
OUT<IN*FLOAT<FLOAT
SIZE 39
.R RALGOL
ROGALGOLOADER
INPUT FILENAME ?*FLOAT.AC
ENDS 0251
^^PHELLO WORLD!
A = +0.314159E+001
B = COS(A) = -0.999999E+000
^^PHELLO WORLD!
A = +0.314159E+001
B = COS(A) = -0.999999E+000
^^C
.
The source AL file must end with a few $$$$ or an odd fault code will
result. The fault codes are embedded in the source files as addresses.
The compiler output file has the AC suffix.
After the loader runs it will pause with a ^ prompt and the user will have
to enter a ^P to proceed or ^C to quit.
The manual is the best description for the user.
> From: Evan Koblentz
> what the owners plan to do in the future.
Sell the Apple I and retire to a tropical island on the proceeds, if
they have any sense! :-)
Noel
?Hi all,
I have a crashed RL01 disk (very crashed). I'd like to remove it from the plastic cover to display it. I opened up the case but cannot figure out how to remove the platter? I took 4 philips screws out which only served to remove a metal ring.
It seems that the handle is somehow attached to the platter and seems it is preventing me from removing the platter.
Whats the trick?
Thanks
Eugene
> From: Nigel Johnson
> Anybody have any docs on the DEC LSI 11/93 (KDJ11-E)?
Info on the -E is thin on the ground. The User's Manual (EK-KDJ1E-UG-001)
is available online, though, which is a start - it gives info on how to
configure it, etc.
> I am trying to run it in a BA23 backplane and seemingly geting bus
> hangs as is there is something that it is looking for that is not
> there!
QBUS 11's are pretty resistant to hangs, unless you have an interrupted
grant chain. A simple missing device should give a NXM fault.
I"d try getting the whole system working with another CPU, and then plug in
the -E; reduce the number of unknown variables. Although with memory and
console line on-board on the -E, it shouldn't need too much else for at least
basic functioning.
Noel
Bill,
If I were on such a tight schedule, I would as you say rent a car,
but one-way, from Gatwick - drive that night late to a hotel in
Milton Keynes about five miles north of Bletchley.
About 90 miles Gatwick to Milton Keyes - two hours or so late at night.
Avis has a return site at Milton Keynes. Leave the car there at Avis.
Thursday morning, I would take a taxi to Bletchley Park - the place opens 0930.
Spend 1.5 hours or some such max at Bletchley - Train back to Gatwick.
I know that you can easily get to London Euston from Bletchley -
trains run about every twenty minutes I recall, but I do not know how
to get to Gatwick from Euston - figure that out.
It would all be very tight, but Bletchley Park is an amazing place to
see and only 1.5 hours there would be better than nothing.
Here is a snap I took of the "Mansion" when there 15 years
ago: http://frobenius.com/bletchley/bl012.jpg
If I could see only a couple of things: Hut 8 where Turing used to
do his thing and, of course, the Colossus rebuild.
It is easy to spend two days there, which I did 2004.
Best,
Jack Harper
Evergreen, Colorado USA
At 03:54 AM 7/6/2019, Bill Degnan via cctech wrote:
>Hi...I am arriving at Gatwick Airport this weds evening1045pm and I have a
>17 hour layover. I'd like to visit the national computer museum at
>bletchley park about an hour north. I see I can rent a car from the
>airport and drive to a hotel near the museum. There are a few hotels with
>24/7 desks. Concerns? Total time in England is 17 hours, 8 of which
>needed for sleep, plus travel to and from the airport and museum. Not sure
>how efficient the car rental return process is, etc. Need some buffer for
>unknowns
>Thanks in advance
>
>Bill
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Harper, President
Secure Outcomes Inc
2942 Evergreen Parkway, Suite 300
Evergreen, Colorado 80439 USA
303.670.8375
303.670.3750 (fax)
http://www.secureoutcomes.net for Product Info.
I have an Apple /// that I've had for many years; it's never worked.
When you power it up, you get a checkerboard screen, where half the squares
are solid white, and the other half have a little mosaic pattern in them.
Looks like this:
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0NHNkEG9ssPsi65ojivBteKaQ
Does this failure mode ring any bells? Obviously the video signal is being
generated well enough to sync a composite output. Any idea whether I
should start by replacing the CPU or the ROMs?
Adam
Anybody have any docs on the DEC LSI 11/93 (KDJ11-E)?
I have a suspect one and am looking for schematics, configuration data
etc. I am trying to run it in a BA23 backplane and seemingly geting bus
hangs as is there is something that it is looking for that is not there!
cheers,
Nigel
On 06/07/2019 13:00, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote:
> Send cctalk mailing list submissions to
> cctalk at classiccmp.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of cctalk digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: gunkies.org is down or?... (Noel Chiappa)
> 2. Re: gunkies.org is down or?... (ben)
> 3. Email delivery protocols / methods. (Grant Taylor)
> 4. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Dennis Boone)
> 5. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Diane Bruce)
> 6. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Diane Bruce)
> 7. Question about Apple /// (Adam Thornton)
> 8. Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (Evan Koblentz)
> 9. Re: Question about Apple /// (Jecel Assumpcao Jr.)
> 10. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Dennis Boone)
> 11. RE: Email delivery protocols / methods.
> (newsgroups at micromuseum.co.uk)
> 12. RE: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Dave Wade)
> 13. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Bill Gunshannon)
> 14. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (John Herron)
> 15. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Peter Coghlan)
> 16. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Peter Corlett)
> 17. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Jason T)
> 18. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (ED SHARPE)
> 19. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (ED SHARPE)
> 20. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (Evan Koblentz)
> 21. Re: Question about Apple /// (Jim Manley)
> 22. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (Evan Koblentz)
> 23. Re: Question about Apple /// (ED SHARPE)
> 24. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (Evan Koblentz)
> 25. Re: Lots of Apple 1 computers @ VCF West (Guy Dunphy)
> 26. Re: Question about Apple /// (Bill Degnan)
> 27. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (Noel Chiappa)
> 28. Re: Wtd: advice upcoming visit to Bletchley Park / comp
> museum (Mattis Lind)
> 29. Re: Question about Apple /// (ED SHARPE)
> 30. Re: Wtd: advice upcoming visit to Bletchley Park / comp
> museum (Peter Corlett)
> 31. Wtd: advice upcoming visit to Bletchley Park / comp museum
> (Bill Degnan)
> 32. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (David Bridgham)
> 33. Re: Email delivery protocols / methods. (David Bridgham)
> 34. QSIC, was: Re: Email delivery protocols / methods.
> (emanuel stiebler)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2019 13:33:38 -0400 (EDT)
> From: jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu (Noel Chiappa)
> To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
> Cc: jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu
> Subject: Re: gunkies.org is down or?...
> Message-ID: <20190705173338.C9ACB18C0B6 at mercury.lcs.mit.edu>
>
> > From: Tomasz Rola
>
> > Is it really down?
>
> I suppose this is actually good news, in a way - someone must have been
> trying to use it, to notice that it was down! :-)
>
> So let me take this opportunity to appeal once again for people to contribute
> content; I've added a lot of PDP-11 stuff, and Lars and I sporadically add
> PDP-10 stuff (not that very many actually have a hardware -10 :-), but
> _everything else_ could use more content. So if you have a particular focus -
> please consider contributing your knowledge in that area!
>
> Noel
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2019 11:46:30 -0600
> From: ben <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca>
> To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
> Subject: Re: gunkies.org is down or?...
> Message-ID: <fef4a9ac-4bee-acee-5bdd-e7fbfbdc5647 at jetnet.ab.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> On 7/5/2019 11:33 AM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
>> > From: Tomasz Rola
>>
>> > Is it really down?
>>
>> I suppose this is actually good news, in a way - someone must have been
>> trying to use it, to notice that it was down! :-)
>>
>> So let me take this opportunity to appeal once again for people to contribute
>> content; I've added a lot of PDP-11 stuff, and Lars and I sporadically add
>> PDP-10 stuff (not that very many actually have a hardware -10 :-), but
>> _everything else_ could use more content. So if you have a particular focus -
>> please consider contributing your knowledge in that area!
>>
>> Noel
> It looks up from here. Wow all those banks of EVIL computers behind that
> man in the photo. Ben.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2019 15:05:32 -0600
> From: Grant Taylor <cctalk at gtaylor.tnetconsulting.net>
> To: cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> Subject: Email delivery protocols / methods.
> Message-ID:
> <ff892b2d-b7f1-01e8-a59c-f60f890f4f77 at spamtrap.tnetconsulting.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> Here's pot stirrer for a holiday Friday afternoon:
>
> How many different protocols / methods can we collectively come up with
> for how email can be transferred?
>
> I'm primarily thinking about between servers (MTA-to-MTA). But I'm also
> willing to accept servers and clients (MTA-to-MUA). Where you can /
> could run at least one server yourself.
>
> ? SMTP(S)
> ? UUCP (rmail)
> ? MMDF
> ? X.400
> ? Microsoft Exchange proprietary protocol
> ? Novell GroupWise proprietary protocol
> ? Lotus (IBM) Domino proprietary protocol
> ? FidoNet (FTN)
> ? BITNET
> ? Direct file access - group Post Office
> ? Direct file access - mail spool
>
>
>
--
Nigel Johnson
MSc., MIEEE
VE3ID/G4AJQ/VA3MCU
Amateur Radio, the origin of the open-source concept!
You can reach me by voice on Skype: TILBURY2591
If time travel ever will be possible, it already is. Ask me again yesterday
This e-mail is not and cannot, by its nature, be confidential. En route from me to you, it will pass across the public Internet, easily readable by any number of system administrators along the way.
Nigel Johnson <nw.johnson at ieee.org>
Please consider the environment when deciding if you really need to print this message
> From: Grant Taylor
> How many different protocols / methods can we collectively come up with
> for how email can be transferred?'
Hey, this is the classic computers list, so you should only list early stuff,
(say pre-1990), and leave out all the modern crap (but I repeat myself).
So here's one I'm not sure anyone else will catch: TFTP has an email mode!
Why? Well, FTP is gargantuan (compared to TFTP) and needs a working TCP to
boot, so if all you have is a working TFTP, and no email...
Noel
> From: Tomasz Rola
> Is it really down?
I suppose this is actually good news, in a way - someone must have been
trying to use it, to notice that it was down! :-)
So let me take this opportunity to appeal once again for people to contribute
content; I've added a lot of PDP-11 stuff, and Lars and I sporadically add
PDP-10 stuff (not that very many actually have a hardware -10 :-), but
_everything else_ could use more content. So if you have a particular focus -
please consider contributing your knowledge in that area!
Noel
> From: Diane Bruce
> Works fine.
Probably a left-over cached entry; neither my ISP's DNS, nor MIT's ("Host
gunkies.org not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)") can resolve it at the moment.
One year Tore was off hiking or something, and it took a few days, but past
experience is that he will get to it. (But I'd like to not have to depend on
him.)
Noel
> Tomasz Rola
> However, I have added this line to my /etc/hosts:
L-rd, I must be getting old - it never dawned on me to do that. Anyway,
that shows the server was fine, it was just the missing DNS entry.
Back now.
Noel
> From: Tomasz Rola
> Is it really down? Could it come back?
Tore forgot to pay the bill for his DNS entry; this is the third year in a row
the exact same thing has happened, on the exact same date! :-) :-( I've
already sent him an email about it, this morning; hopefully he'll get with the
program shortly.
If I knew the IP address for gunkies (it used to be 92.242.140.2, not sure
if it's still at that hosting service - the hosting and DNS entry are
separate) I'd be really tempted to pay it myself - and switch the
registration to myself in the process, so I can pay it in the future! Not
sure how long a bill has to be unpaid before you can hijack an entry,
though.
Noel
I have just noticed that.
=> (885 3): host gunkies.org
Host gunkies.org not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
Looks like it fell off the edge of the world. Gog still has pages in
cache, time of caching for one particular page I am reading is May
30th, 09:38:55 GMT.
Is it really down? Could it come back?
--
Regards,
Tomasz Rola
--
** A C programmer asked whether computer had Buddha's nature. **
** As the answer, master did "rm -rif" on the programmer's home **
** directory. And then the C programmer became enlightened... **
** **
** Tomasz Rola mailto:tomasz_rola at bigfoot.com **
Hello Peter,
you have a nice list of interesting things.
I'm very interested in DEC machines,
which I collect and repair for preservation purposes.
Among others, I could be interested in those:
DECmate
assorted QBUS boards (do you have a list?)
VAX 4000/90A
VAX 4000/96
VAX 4000/100A
VAX 4000/105
DEC RFxx disks, TK50 and TU58 tapes if available
Commodore dual FFDs 4040 or 3040
Possibly Amiga 1000/1200/2000 for a friend of mine.
I would have an idea about prices, however...
If you prefer, please contact me privately.
I see you here a long list of burnable ISOs. I already have several of
those, but it would be very nice to merge with yours... could you share
them somewhere over the net?
Thanks
Andrea
Dear all,
Apologies for this semi-spam message from a long-time appreciator of classic computers and nostalgic obsolete products, but I hope this will be of interest to at least a few people here.
So, yes, by way of context, I?ve been acquiring what I consider to be characterful and/or historically interesting computers for coming up to, maybe, 15 years now, with the intention of being able to curate multiple, interactive temporary exhibits on the history of computing, but since moving continents (amongst other things), my paths and passions have changed, so I am currently in the process of re-testing (and repairing) my machines, and will be trying to sell them off in the coming weeks and months. Under different circumstances, finding people (or groups) with similar interests and plans would have been an equal-first priority, but given my more recent ?life changes', sale price ? and the ability to better pursue my new focuses ? is now more of a factor.
But before I list them on eBay (and/or by way of a heads up), I wanted to let people here know, just in case I have something that someone here particularly wants / needs / could use. The current list of systems I will be parting with is accessible at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QqUrO11gnn4fwAPDxqO_phKDt1M0O15G7wJ… but some (hopefully) highlights include (*big breath*):
DEC: MicroPDP-11/53+; MicroVAX 2000; VAXstation 4000 VLC/60/90A/96; VAX 4000 100A, 105; DECstation 5000/240, 260 (MIPS-based); DEC 3000/300X; Personal Workstation 600au; AlphaServer 4100; AlphaServer DS20, DS25 systems; Letterwriter 100; VT 101, 220, 520 terminals
HP: HP rx2800 Integrity2; 9000 715/100 and Visualize C110 PA-RISC systems
SGI: Indy and O2 systems
SUN: ELC, SPARCstation Voyager (the portable one), 5 and 20; Ultra 1; Ultra 5; Netra T1-105; Enterprise T5240
Apple: IIc, IIe Platinums, IIgs; Mac 512ke, Mac Pluses; SE/30 and Quadra 700s (also for running A/UX); iMac G3s and a G4
Commodore: PET 3000 systems, PET 8032-SK; various C64 / C64C and 128D systems; SX-64; Music Maker keyboards (the big one, inc. SFX modules); Amiga 1000
Apologies again, please feel free to contact me with any queries or reasonable offers, or even if you?d just like to be kept in the loop as more machines become available, and all the best.
Thanks in advance,
Peter
> From: Liam Proven
> This is *epic*.
Indeed. I was blown away by the complexity of his technique for reading
the digits.
I can't believe there wasn't a much easier technique, though, e.g. using a
logic analyzer and a small program to read through the ROS!
Perhaps the challenge of doing it his way entertained him, though, like
George Mallory's famous line about climbing Everest.
Noel
Someone informed me that the Fileware diskette image I uploaded to
Wikipedia has unclear copyright status. See
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fileware-floppy.jpg. Would someone
with a good specimen please scan it and upload to Wikipedia or send it to
me?
--
David Griffith
dave at 661.org
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
Greetings Folks!
I have finalized the latest batch of items added to the inventory of my
Virtual Warehouse of Computing Wonders, and here it is:
Commodore 64
Exatron MM800 Internal Memory
IBM PCjr Power Expansion Attachment
IBM 74F3465 The 3270 Connection
Polaroid PerfectData DS/DD 8" floppy disk (10-pack)
Xidex Precision DSDD 8" Floppy Disks (10-pack)
Diablo Printwheel - APL 10
Diablo Printwheel - Courier 10
Diablo Printwheel - European Elite 12
Diablo Printwheel - OCR A
Diablo Printwheel - Pica 10
Diablo Print Ribbon (Carton of 12)
SmartPrint Printer Sharing Network Add-on Computer Module
Symantec Think C for Macintosh 6.0 (Upgrade)
Hayes Personal Modem 1200
Gravis Mac MouseStick II
Apple Power Mac Processor Upgrade (APMPU)
Orange Micro OrangePC MS-DOS Coprocessor
Radius Full Page Display SE
Corvus Systems Macintosh OmniDrive User Guide
Corvus Systems Qbus Interface
RT-11 System Reference Card
RT-11 System Reference Card
Convergent Technologies WK-100 WorkSlate
Convergent Technologies WorkSlate Travel Task Ware
Radio Shack TRS-80 Model 100 Portable Computer
Radio Shack TRS-80 Model 100 Cassette Interface Cable
TRS-80 Model 100 Calculator
TRS-80 Model 100 Bar Code Drivers
TRS-80 Model 100 Bar Code Writer
TRS-80 Model 100 Executive Calendar
TRS-80 Model 100 Function Plotter
TRS-80 Model 100 Personal Finance
TRS-80 Model 100 Portable Computing with the Model 100
TRS-80 Model 100 SCRIPSIT 100
TRS-80 Model 100 StarBlaze 100
TRS-80 Model 100 Tandy Code
Tandy 102 Owner's Manual/Applications and BASIC Reference Guide
IBM Personal Computer PCjr BASIC Reference
IBM Personal Computer PCjr Guide to Operations
Hands-On BASIC for the IBM PCjr
AST VGA Plus
Tall Tree Systems AT3-P w/JLaser-3 daughterboard
Western Digital WD7000-ASC FASST2 SCSI Controller
Ziatech IEEE 488 Interface for PS/2 Computers
Everex 24E+ External Modem
Epson FX-86e/286e Printer User's Manual
Citizen Color Ribbon
Okidata Okimate 20 Plug 'N Print for IBM PC and Compatibles
Okidata Tractor Feed Option Kit (boxed)
Memorex Epson MX-80 Printer Ribbon
3M DS,HD 5.25" Diskettes (10-pack)
Dysan 100 MD2HD floppy diskette 10-pack
Ohio Scientific 5.25" Mini Floppy Diskette (10-pack)
Verbatim Datalife SS/DD 5.25" Minidisks (7-pack)
Epson E95D0U External 5.25" Disk Drive
Compaq MS-DOS Version 3 Reference Guide
DEC PDP-8/L Instruction List reference card
Osborne dBase II Version 2.3b (manual only)
Altera MAX+plus II Programmable Logic Development System
FHR Industries 1200 Intelligent Modem
Commodore 64
HP 92220R HPIB Right Angle Cable (1ft)
HP10833B HPIB Cable (2m)
SunRize Industries Perfect Sound
Timex-Sinclair 1000
Sinclair ZX81 case
Apple Macintosh Plus (Platinum)
Apple Macintosh SE w/Targus Carrying Case
(Those are two different Commodore 64 units, one has a case "variation".)
Links to the newly arrived items are here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1I53wxarLHlNmlPVf_HJ5oMKuab4zrApI_hi…
I have discovered the myriad of Facebook vintage computing groups, so I
have begun posting my sale lists there as well. However, I will always
post notifications of new lists here and on the VCFed forums 24 hours
before I unleash them on the FB groups, which results in a deluge of
activity. In this way, I give you guys first stab at the action on the new
stuff before the hordes descend upon it. You are welcome.
As always, please contact me directly by e-mail to inquire about an item.
Thanks!
Sellam
I'll also vouch for Sellam. His prices are a bit higher than I might
prefer, but he's a straight dealer as far as I've ever seen; I bought
an Apple IIc from him and he gave me no trouble at all about
exchanging it when the board turned out to be cracked.
Hey all, i'm having a fair amount of trouble with my PS/2's floppy drive...
wanted to back up my BBS and none of the disks i put in would read or
format!
Oddly though, it WILL boot a disk that's inserted on power-on.
I hear it try and hit the disk a few times while in dos repeatedly before
failing with the R/A/F options ... and format tries to read it, then goes
attempts to format it, and can't find sector 0 .....
I'm really confused about those symptoms since it boots the only bootable
disk I had on hand - ironically spinrite 6 (I'm aware of how useful it
is...) - so i'm looking at replacing it ... or figuring out what's wrong
with it that it can boot a disk just fine, but not use one while in DOS ?
.... and by wiggling the floppy a bit I just got it to format a disk while
in the ... drive, and now it's making the noise it did before and stalling
occasionally.
Perhaps the disk just isn't catching fully?
--
Gary G. Sparkes Jr.
KB3HAG
FYI, it is unlikely there would have been a VCF without Sellam. He
basically started it (with his own money) and continued through the
first 10 years or so. Many others help support VCF (and continue to do
so even though Sellam backed out some number of years ago.)
I, for one, fully support Sellam in his effots to move out his
inventory, and have never seen him sell anything at 10x prices.
Marvin
> From: Randy Dawson <rdawson16 at hotmail.com>
>
> Anybody try business with this guy?
> His prices are 10X off the chart
On 6/27/19 12:53 PM, jim stephens wrote:
> They don't have to be combined.
Agreed.
I've been running DNS servers for about 20 years. I /always/ prefer to
run my own DNS servers if I can.
I have never run across a situation where I was unable to do so for
/technical/ reasons. I have had clients that /chose/ to /not/ host
their own DNS for a /business/ reason.
> I have a friend running his and my DNS on a server at his house with two
> DSL feeds for good measure, one is primary DNS for our domains, second
> one is published as the secondary.
*nod*
I'd worry about DSL circuits and stability for DNS. But it will
probably work > 98% of the time. If you're comfortable with it, more
power to you.
I would likely do something more like I'm doing now, run the master name
server (MNAME field in the SOA record) on the DSL and have somebody else
with a more robust connection (DSL had issues where I'm from) do a slave
zone transfer and be the listed Name Servers (NS records) that the world
talks to.
I actually do that now with my VPS being the MNAME server and my VPS
provider doing slave zone transfers off of me.
Note how the registrar is not part of that mix. ;-)
> The biggest thing to watch for is the lax rules for transfering
> domains.? There was a problem with that, but most registrars allow locks
> now that impede the movement of domains w/o a bit of work.
That sounds like you're talking about moving domains between registrars,
which is decidedly different than and independent of where DNS is hosted.
Admittedly the registrar has to point (delegate) to the DNS hosting
provider. But it's fairly easy to move domains between registrars
without even logging into a portal at the DNS host.
> Used to take a couple of emails to highjack a domain, as there wasn't
> even a notification to verify that the transfer process email was
> requested by the owner.
Ya. Registrars have had some deficiencies over the years. I think they
are getting better.
> You are strongly encouraged to use a third party "professional" DNS
> service, but it only really need to be up reliably.
~whistling~ ? ~quiet~ ? I'm sorry, did you say something? No. Never
mind. I'll go back to what I was doing. ? ~whistling~
I mean that as a joke. I let a LOT of what companies that are trying to
sell to me go in one ear, sanity check it, and then go out the other ear.
I'm of the opinion that a static IP is the biggest requirement for
/most/ DNS service. I.e. somewhere to have the registrar delegate the
DNS to.
Beyond that, I'm happy to delegate sub-domains to people on dynamic IPs
if they want them.
It's possible to put DNS a LOT of places that don't qualify as "Best
Practice". Most of them will work most of the time.
> We have the dual providers for the node my friend runs, as we know from
> the phone companies and providers that though the DNS is over the same
> 12 pair wire into his house (another trick), the CO actually has the
> DNS switches on different racks and UPS's. Which isn't a bad precaution.
That's probably okay for most things. But it's still subject to Backhoe
Bob and the fade that he can induce.
That's why I have my master that I can do anything and everything I want
to, and outsource to slave secondaries. Linode, my VPS provider, has
five different DNS servers that (I belie) are geographically diverse.
It will be quite a bit harder to take out all five of their DNS servers.
Plus, I don't have to pay for connectivity in five different
locations. ;-)
I'm curious, you said DSL. But that could be anything from 1.5 Mbps
ADSL to SDSL to VDSL. Each of which have different capabilities and
SLAs. Other than the backhoe fade taking out both connections at the
same time, higher quality DSL with SLAs is probably okay to do.
I think the official recommendation for big (think root level) DNS
servers is to have each server in a different network, where network is
defined as /24 (or larger), preferably under different ASNs.
But that's not a /requirement/, especially for smaller DNS operators.
> thanks
You're welcome.
--
Grant. . . .
unix || die
I just finished taking pictures and dumping the firmware from a 730X terminal
but it turns out it has a Starlan and not an Ethernet interface. It would be
nice to get a firmware dump from an Ethernet card. A start of a 630 driver is
in MAME.
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/att/730/730X
It also appears the keyboards for the 630 and 730 aren't backwards compatible
with the other 6xx products and the 5620. 5620 keyboards need -12v which the 630 or 730
don't supply, and the 610 keyboard doesn't appear to work either. Josh took a couple
of pictures of his 630 keyboard and even though they look similar, the earlier keyboards
were made by Teletype and the 630 is made by Keytronic.
I picked up these boards many weeks ago, but haven't photographed them
until recently. Some of them are pretty disgusting, but some of the others
look alright.
Anyone have any idea what these came out of? Some are labeled Gould, others
are labeled Encore.
http://imgur.com/a/d9iK9qb
Thanks!
Kyle
That was a very interesting read! The type of
thing I could see myself doing over 40 years ago
when once I'd come up with a neat idea and either
did preliminary coding or hardware design
suggesting it would work I'd jump right into it
and find optimistic 1 month project timelines
stretching to 6+ months. My approach now would
be to just use a logic analyzer or a number of
Propeller boards to sample all of the lines from
ROS as very sedate clock speed that the 5100 uses.
Still, this has applications beyond original goal
and could use it to acquire patient lab data from
hospital EMR's which are increasingly locked
down. Used to be I could export a patients lab
results to a text file easily to graph them out
vs time or look at correlations between various
lab values. Now that's forbidden as one is only
allowed to look at them on the screen or use the
abysmal graphing functionality which is very
poorly coded and makes a PDP-8 doing the same
functionality seem like a
supercomputer. Thus, one could simply point a
cell phone camera at the screen, record the lab
results scrolling by and then do OCR on the
series of images to create a data file of all of
the lab results one is interested in. I've
just photographed results on a screen as takes
less room than another sheet of paper.
>This is *epic*.
>
>https://github.com/stepleton/5100NonExecutableROSDecode/blob/master/WRITEUP…
>
>--
>Liam Proven - Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
>Email: lproven at cix.co.uk - Google Mail/Hangouts/Plus: lproven at gmail.com
>Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven - Skype/LinkedIn: liamproven
>UK: +44 7939-087884 - ??R (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053