- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

Is there a magic word to format a 8" Altos hard disk?

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Picked up an Altos 8600 that I bought on eBay yesterday, amazingly the Xenix actually came up, but the drive failed as I was tarring off the file system. I had another Quantum 2040, put it in, tried to run the formatter, but it says to call Altos, asks for a confirmation but just returns to the menu if you type 'y' 'Y' or 'Yes' so I'm assuming there is a magic word you have to enter. This is the same controller that the Z80 system uses (8000-14) so I'm guessing someone must have run into this before. I'm going to paw through the diagnostic binary to see if there is something that looks magical. Sound familiar?

9 years, 6 months

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FP11-C Engineering Drawings?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Al Kossow > i'll see about getting CHM's set scanned Oooh, great; thanks very much, _much_ appreciated! Noel

9 years, 6 months

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FP11-C Engineering Drawings?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Is there a set of FP11-C Engineering Drawings online anywhere? Our favourite search engine didn't turn one up, and according to Manx: http://manx-docs.org/details.php/1,9306 there are none online. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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Searching for a lost Macintosh TV (Texas)

by tothwolf＠concentric.net

I'm not really active in any of the classic computing communities apart >from classiccmp, so I would appreciate it if others could pass this message around and see if this computer ended up in the hands of a fellow collector. A good friend of mine who lived in Spring, TX (north of Houston) owned a black Macintosh TV (1993 vintage). During a move many years ago (late 2010), it mistakenly ended up turned in as ewaste. I only found out late this year (2016) that this had happened. Given how rare/uncommon these machines are, chances are very high that it ended up resold on eBay or similar instead of being scrapped. I have no records of the serial number of the machine, but according to my archives, I installed Mac OS 7.6.1 on it on May 5, 1998. It was also upgraded with an 8MB SIMM but still had the factory hard drive. If by some chance a fellow collector ended up with it, and if it still has its hard drive and files intact, my friend would really like to obtain a copy of her files (a disk image of the hard drive would be ideal). I happened to still have a backup of the machine on a zip disk from May 24, 1998, but she had continued to use the machine off and on for many years after that. I would also just like to know that the machine didn't end up scrapped.

9 years, 6 months

3
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Searching for a lost Macintosh TV (Texas)

by ian.finder＠gmail.com

Props for for having a good sense of humor. It made me laugh. Seriously though I hate to say it but your quest feels pretty damn futile. I wish you luck either way, and would offer you my MacTV but it is long gone. If you can provide names of unique files or something that was on the drive- identifiable but not sensitive- it might help you. Like I said, there's nothing to key off of in your original post. I've hunted far rarer specific systems- smbx machines and the like that went missing from universities with good inventory control only one or two years ago- and had zero luck. Also do try Low End Mac and 68kmla, this is more relevant to those audiences. Cheers, - I On Monday, December 5, 2016, Tothwolf <tothwolf at concentric.net <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tothwolf at concentric.net');>> wrote: > On Mon, 5 Dec 2016, Ian Finder wrote: > > They sold 10,000 Apple TVs. That's a lot. >> >> You lost track of one ten years ago, and have given no real methodology >> for discerning it from any other- the number out there with OS 7.6 or 8mb >> of ram will be significant. >> >> Perhaps you should go door-to-door, or hang flyers. It would probably >> yield better results. >> > > [Sorry Jay, but I'm going to do this on-list.] > > Wow, Ian, you sure are helpful! Would you be willing to help me print up > and distribute those fliers? > > <insert giant ascii finger> > > :) > -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ian.finder at gmail.com');> -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com

9 years, 6 months

2
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Troubleshooting spooky & intermittent instability after power-up: Symbolics XL1200

by ian.finder＠gmail.com

Hi folks, I know this is a long shot but... I'm having a rather curious issue with one of my Symbolics XL 1200 CPUs, which I suspect may have a far more general cause. I have narrowed the issue down to the specific Merlin II CPU card I'm running- not the RAM, Jumper, I/O, backplane, power supply or any of that good stuff. My friend Doug has a rather pretty picture of the board in question on his site: https://symbolics.lisp.engineer/koken/albums/merlin-ii/content/img-4316/lig… It's basically a big wedge of PGA ASIC encapsulations and PALs, for those unfamiliar. The symptom is this. After a cold boot- a fresh power-up from no power applied- the system will hang after 30-40 seconds into the startup with a hard lock and sometimes memory bus issues. If I wait 10 more seconds or so, and hit reset, the system usually comes up fine for hours. If I hold the system in reset for a few minutes during the cold boot before proceeding, the system works fine. The repro rate is close to 100%. If the machine is off for a few minutes, then cold booted, the issue repros. It sounds as if something has gone thermally sensitive in a very deterministic manner. Can that happen with the tantalum caps on the board? Perhaps they are shorting intermittently for the first few dozen seconds? Again, the rest of the system is good- the issue follows this board and only this board no matter which chassis it runs in. All socketed ICs have been reseated. I know this isn't much to go off of, but anyone out there have experience with spooky "intermittent" yet 100% repro-able cold-power-up issues? I'll debug further of course, but thought I'd ask here. Thanks, - Ian -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com

9 years, 6 months

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Black anti-static foam corrosion

by aek＠bitsavers.org

I was curious what the compound is that corrodes IC leads in old black anti-static foam adipic acid https://www.febo.com/pipermail/time-nuts/2008-July/032531.html and google for polyurethane and adipic acid https://www.jstor.org/stable/20619421 Corrosion on Metallic Tokens Stored in Polyurethane Foam

9 years, 6 months

4
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Double Buffer RK11-C

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Fritz Mueller > Also, clues about an 11/20 interface for the FP11-B that were noticed > recently. I don't recall this; more details, if possible? Thanks! Noel

9 years, 6 months

2
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HP 9872 Refurbishment

by cruff＠ruffspot.net

I hauled out my second 9872C today to clean it of rodent leavings and to scavenge the high voltage chart hold power supply board for my first 9872C. The table has some gouges in the surface, which appears to be a plastic film adhered to the table surface. Does anyone have experience repairing gouges, or found a suitable replacement film? Also, since I have it apart, I thought it might be good to image the firmware ROM set. They are marked Mostek MK36647N-5 and MK36648N-5, along with the HP part numbers. From the schematic, they appear to be 5V 8KB ROMs, so nothing fancy should be required to read the contents. It appears these might be MK36000N-5 mask programmed ROMs? P.S. It appears list submission doesn?t like digitally signed emails.

9 years, 6 months

2
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Double Buffer RK11-C

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> look at the lower right line of lights on the panel: ... and three bits > of Major State; now look at the RK11-C prints, connector B32: > ... Postamble, Checksum, Data, Header, Preamble. > ... > One thing I have been wondering about is that "RK11-C" - that implies > that there was a -B, etc. I wonder if this panel goes with one of them? Well, now that I look at a few more things I'm pretty certain the panel in that image goes with some currently-unknown RK11 predecessor to the RK11-C. Note those 5 'state' lines/lights, and then look at the 'Major States' RK11-C print (RK11-C-04, pg. 14 of the PDF version, RK11-C Enginering Drawings Feb1971). In the upper left corner there are a row of 6 flops, each labeled with one of those states (plus one for 'Idle'), arranged in a chain. So one light for the output of each flop... Now look at that display panel: 3 bits for 'Major State' - implying it is binary coded - likely implemented with a counter? Notice also the signal "COUNT MSR" ('Major State Register', I expect) - just what you'd expect to see if the major state had previously been held in a counter, not a string of flops. Why go to all the trouble to synthesize that signal (on the next page, RK11-C-05, "MSR Control") when you cou;d have used the individual composing signals to clock each flop? So my _guess_ is that in the previous version, they'd used a counter, but had had some problems (perhaps it was a binary counter, not Gray code, and the decoding into states was producing glitches), and had therefore switched to the string of flops. (This whole process makes me feel like a paleontologist, reconstructing some unknown dinosaur from a fragment of one bone, using a lot of complex reasoning >from small clues contained therein! :-) It would be most interesting to know if there are any signs anywhere of predecessors to the RK11-C. My suspicion is that they were produced in very small numbers - perhaps as prototypes, only internal to DEC. (If they'd had problems with glitches in the major state counter, they would not have wanted to release it as a product.) Or if it was released as a product, perhaps they were all recalled and replaced with RK11-C's because of the issues. As evidence for this, I point to the Spare Module Handbook, which lists only the RK11-C and -D - but _does_ list the KT11-B, a rara avis indeed. (More dinosaur bones... :-) This argues that the predecessor did not exist in the wild... Noel

9 years, 6 months

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cctalk Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5

by mark＠markesystems.com

>> least.. but yeah.. might be impossible to ever really know. I'm just >> wondering why the price jumped to $40+ each all of a sudden! > a very large number of schlock IC sellers all communicate with each > other. They all have a continuous stream of wants or needs that they > exchange. but they make their own prices. The probability is that you > may have hit the original stocking guy with your first query. Querying > any others will result in them looking at the wants that others shared, > or buys, and he saw someone else had it and quoted you the same info. It takes surprisingly little to trigger this effect/behavior. I did a bulk buy of some 1960's era miniature vacuum tubes (500 pcs) for around 50 cents each; the next time I looked, the price from all vendors who had them had jumped to around $3, and it's up to $6 now. (Fortunately the vendor I purchased from originally extended approximately his original pricing to me again.) I think I was - and still am - virtually the only volume buyer of these parts, but the price remains high. I've also had the same experience with other vintage new-old-stock parts. ~~ Mark Moulding

9 years, 6 months

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FTGH: HP 100/150 Series Memory Boards (45632, 45631)

by hugh＠blemings.org

Hi, I've been assisting a friend with the deceased estate of a local ham radio operator. In among the myriad RF related items were the following; Qty 5 HP 45632-60001 384kB Memory Module 150 Qty 1 HP 45631-60001 256kB Memory Module 150 http://www.hpmuseum.net/display_item.php?hw=383 We have no way to test, but given the condition we would assume they are working ok. Free for the cost of postage to anyone who wants them provided you cover freight (From Belconnen, ACT, Australia 2616) Happy to ship overseas - contact me off list and I can give dimensions and weight etc. They will be off to generic computer recycling two weeks from now. Cheers, Hugh

9 years, 6 months

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Looking for small quantity of grip rings for Boxer fans

by ethan.dicks＠gmail.com

Hi, All, I'm refurbing some of my DEC equipment and I found some dirty/sticky Boxer fans, no surprise. I managed to get one apart, cleaned and lubed and spinning freely, then one of the grip rings shot off into space. I found this reference... http://www.cirteq.com/pdfs/cirteq_technical_manual.pdf The style in question covered on pages 85-86 (metric then standard) One of the comments is next to a diagram of the correct type... "Lug design for sizes 7-9-11-19-23-27" Based on that, it's probably an NG023, since the shaft looks to be 0.250 or slightly smaller not slightly larger. d1 == 0.236" (shaft diameter) d3 == 0.224" (clip ID) s == 0.039" (clip thickness) Has anyone had to buy grip rings for their fan refurbs before? Do these numbers sound right? -ethan

9 years, 6 months

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Double Buffer RK11-C

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Fritz Mueller > But then over at bisavers, I see this: Yes, that's the panel I found the picture of in the RSTS-11 brochure a while back: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2016-November/029104.html The picture in the brochure is not very very hi-res, but Al Kossow recently located some original photos in the DEC section of the archive, and the image you sent the URL for is one of them. I've been puzzling over what this thing is. It looks 'kinda-sorta' like an RK11-C panel (the registers it shows are sort of the RK11 registers), but if you look at the print for the "RK11-C Indicator Connectors: RK11-C-23" (page 34 of the RK11-C Engineering Drawings PDF), you can see the pinout, and it doesn't match. E.g. look at the lower right line of lights on the panel: 4 bits of Bit Counter, a blank, 8 bits of Internal Word Counter, a blank, and three bits of Major State; now look at the RK11-C prints, connector B32: 4 bits of Bit Counter, 8 bits of Internal Word Counter, a blank, Postamble, Checksum, Data, Header, Preamble. Close, but different. One thing I have been wondering about is that "RK11-C" - that implies that there was a -B, etc. I wonder if this panel goes with one of them? (Or perhaps it is a custom prototype?) I have never been able to find out anything about an earlier version of the RK11: the earliest Peripherals Handbook that I have is the 1972 Red/White one, and it only talks about the -C. Also, the Spare Module Handbook (a fantastic resource, it lists the boards in almost every PDP-8/10/11 option) mentions the -C and -D, but no other ones. However, given the example of the KT11-B, which was totally unknown until the documentation for one showed up with the -11/20 in Arizona, thereby proving that there _was_ a KT11-B before the KT11-C (the -11/45's MMU), I would guess that there likely _was_ an RK11-B, and perhaps this panel goes with that (or an earlier one). Any further information would be most welcome. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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Double Buffer RK11-C

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> I'm working on the prints now. OK, done and uploaded: http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/tech/pdp11/RK11-C-DB_EngrDrws_Dec72.pdf I haven't had the time to pore over them to figure out exactly what the changes do, but they add two buffer registers (ABUF and BBUF), so they probably offer greater resilience to DMA contention on the UNIBUS. I don't yet know if they are used for write as well as read (the RK11-C-DB block diagram in the prints suggests not, as it doesn't show a path from any RK registers to the ABUF, just from the UNIBUS - i.e. only usable on reads), or if there are any user-visible programming changes (I suspect not). For those with an RK11-C, these prints are somewhat clearer than the prints for the 'basic' RK11-C which are online, so although there are a number of changes (see: http://gunkies.org/wiki/RK11-C_disk_controller#Engineering_drawings for info on which sheets have changes), use of these can help decipher some of the hard-to-read pages of the 'basic' RK11-C drawings. Also, the prints for the 'basic' RK11-C are missing a couple of pages: 18 - Disk Cable and Termination 19 - Bus "D" Drvrs and Rcvrs which are present (albeit perhaps modified, for the second one) in this set. Noel

9 years, 6 months

2
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Black anti-static foam corrosion

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

let me know if you have a 90 mm summacron f2(?) a nice working one is great! I not good inside but looks ok on the outside let me know... we need it to go on an M2 in a display. Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 12/3/2016 8:24:48 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cisin at xenosoft.com writes: On Sat, 3 Dec 2016, drlegendre . wrote: > Interesting find, thanks for posting this. I've seen this as well. with a > batch of old ICs which had been stored (in black foam) for some 20-30 > years. The leads kind of just stayed behind in the foam.. > My assumption was that the foam was simply hygroscopic, and held enough > atmospheric moisture & pollutants to foster corrosion. There are numerous black foam formulations. I inherited some lenses (including a Leitz Tele-Elmarit 180mm (<250 made)) that had been stored for a few decades in an essentially airtight case with black foam. When I first opened the case, it seemed as though there was liquid in the case, with an intense vinegar? smell. Second time that I opened the case, a few hours later, it was dry and crumbly, and the outer painted surfaces of the lenses were badly pitted and had to scrape bits of the foam off, but NOT at all like water damage. It turned that lens from mint condition and a major rarity, into usable but POOR cosmetic condition (a loss of more than a thousand dollars in value!). (Three other cases had simply disappeared between the time my buddy died and the time that the county let us go through the house.)

9 years, 6 months

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DMMCheck (Now a word from a non-sponsor)

by drlegendre＠gmail.com

Quick FYI for the bench-techs in the group. A few months back, I became aware of this device, as well as the others produced by the same fellow: http://www.voltagestandard.com/DMMCheck_Plus.html He's producing several types of low-cost, precision voltage / current / frequency references. Prices are reasonable, especially when you consider the re-cal program. Any of these should be more than adequate for the vast majority of our reference / cal requirements. (I have no connection to the mfr. But I do like the product, and wanted to pass it along.)

9 years, 6 months

2
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Black anti-static foam corrosion

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

a loss indeed... Well we have the M2 body and light meter to go on top. All we just need the lens so if you ever find another please let us know! Thanks ! Ed# In a message dated 12/3/2016 8:46:15 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cisin at xenosoft.com writes: > > (Three other cases had simply disappeared between the time my buddy > > died and the time that the county let us go through the house.) On Sat, 3 Dec 2016, COURYHOUSE at aol.com wrote: > let me know if you have a 90 mm summacron f2(?) > a nice working one is great! I not good inside but looks ok on the > outside let me know... we need it to go on an M2 in a display. The Summicrons (I know there was a 50mm and a 90mm, but I don't know about 35mm) and the M series bodies, had been in those three cases. And his two PBM-1000's (Micropro computer) were dumpstered.

9 years, 6 months

1
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ISO Tekelec Chameleon 32 mfm disk

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Slim chance, but does anyone have a working Chameleon that I could clone the software off of? They are 40mb MFM drives, I just bought two, and both units are missing the drives, making them boat anchors. Or, slimmer yet, if someone has the software on floppy

9 years, 6 months

2
2
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Growing the hobby

by cctalk＠snarc.net

Hello cctalk'ers, We at the Vintage Computer Federation would like to thank everyone for making 2016 an incredible year. Most of you know us by now, but just in case you don't -- we're a 501(c)3 non-profit created a year ago to organize the Vintage Computer Forum, VCF East, VCF West, and the official VCF Museum (at our NJ headquarters). Our goals are simple -- to empower collectors and spread awareness of computer history. We accomplished great things in 2016. We doubled the size of our museum, hosted the 11th edition of Vintage Computer Festival East, resurrected the former Vintage Computer Festival West, and joined forces with the Vintage Computer Forum. Now we?re asking for your help to keep the momentum going. Can you make a tax-deductible gift to us this holiday season? Over at our contributions page you?ll find four options ? Binary ($10.00), Phreaker ($26.00), 555 Timer ($55.50), S-100 ($100), and Variable (enter your own amount). If you?d like to do something truly awesome, and you happen to live in or will be traveling to the San Francisco / Silicon Valley area, then bid on lunch with Lee Felsenstein through our friends at CharityBuzz (https://www.charitybuzz.com/catalog_items/lunch-for-3-with-personal-computi…). Lee is a technical and social media legend ? he was a spark behind Community Memory, moderator of the Homebrew Computer Club, and a top engineer for both the Processor Tech Sol-20 and Osborne-1. Bring a few friends, have lunch with Lee at your mutual convenience, and we?ll pay the bill! Where will your money go? We are planning even more things for 2017 and beyond. Vintage Computer Festival East XII will be held March 31 through April 2 at our museum. We are currently planning Vintage Computer Festival West XII and will announce the dates soon. We?re considering expansion of the Festival to other cities, we?re looking to incubate additional regional chapters, we are planning to offer more resources online, and we?re preparing a slew of improvements to the physical museum. If you thought we were active this year, then 2017 is going to exhaust us ? but we love every minute of it! If you want even your news even more frequent and granular, then you?ve got options! Read our blog at vcfed.org, join the discussion forum there, like us at facebook.com/vcfederation, and follow us through twitter.com/vcfederation. Finally, if you have questions or comments, then please feel free to contact me directly. Thank you, Evan Koblentz Director, Vintage Computer Federation Evan at vcfed.org

9 years, 6 months

1
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Winchester-style coax connectors?

by derschjo＠gmail.com

Hey all -- Due to a small miracle I now have 8KW of perfectly functioning core in my long-ill Imlac PDS-1D. The last hurdle is devising a replacement for the missing display (an X/Y vector display). For the time being I'm going to attempt to use an oscilloscope, but first I need to build a cable. The Imlac uses a Winchester connector (14 position) for the display and while they're not as common these days the parts can still be found so I thought I was in the clear, but what I failed to notice is that three of the "pins" (for the X, Y and Blank signals) are actually tiny coaxial connectors that fit within the Winchester housing (i.e. they're the same diameter as a Winchester pin). I haven't been able to track these connectors down anywhere. Anyone have any ideas? Failing that, I can always just tap into the backplane to pick up these signals and ignore the connector on the bulkhead, but it would be nice to be able to use the original connector... - Josh

9 years, 6 months

5
7
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Ersatz-11 V7.2

by wilson＠dbit.com

V7.2 of Ersatz-11 is done. New features include: - Intel gigabit Ethernet driver (ASSIGN XH0: IGBE:). - FTP server in DOS and stand-alone versions (FTPSERVER START /ACC=users.txt). - Filename completion with TAB key. - Stand-alone .ISO file is dual-bootable (copy to CD-R or flash drive). - Inactivity timeout for Telnet connections. - Linux full version has DCI1300 driver (for emulating DR11C/DRV11). Bug fixes and tweaks as always. As usual, the Demo version can be downloaded from: http://www.dbit.com/demo.html Updates have been mailed to commercial users with current subscriptions. John Wilson D Bit

9 years, 6 months

1
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Intel iUP-201 repair

by john_a_s2004＠hotmail.com

Hi, I have an Intel iUP-201 EPROM programmer which is giving a 'Power Supply Failure' error. I think it is failing a self check for one of the output voltages from one of its uA723 precision regulators, which are set from resistor networks and multi-turn pots. I have checked all the electrolytic caps and they seem fine, and voltages from the linear power supply look reasonable. I have a user manual but no schematic or service manual, so am a bit in the dark as to where the problem is. I found a range of similar manuals here: http://www.intel-vintage.info/inteldevelopmenttools.htm Please can anyone with further documents for the iUP-201 (or similar iUP-200) please get in touch, Regards, John Intel Development Tools - Intel Vintage<http://www.intel-vintage.info/inteldevelopmenttools.htm> www.intel-vintage.info This Site about Intel old staffs like ICs ,Manuals,Tools

9 years, 6 months

1
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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

-------- Original message -------- From: allison <ajp166 at verizon.net> Date: 2016-12-02 2:23 PM (GMT-08:00) To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff On 12/02/2016 12:33 PM, Brad H wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Rich Alderson > Sent: Thursday, December 1, 2016 1:34 PM > To: 'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts' <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Subject: RE: Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff > > From: Brad H > Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2016 8:18 AM > >> My Intellec 230 though might give a PDP a run for its money. > See, I'm trying to get you to stop saying "a PDP".? There's no such thing. > There are families of PDP-n things, but there are wide differences in size, weight, and capabilities. > > Your Intellec 230 would fit inside one memory cabinet of a PDP-10 with room to spare.? The entire PDP-10 system weighs tons. > >???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? Rich > Rich Alderson > Sr. Systems Engineer > Living Computers: Museum + Labs > 2245 1st Ave S >> Seattle, WA 98134 >> >> http://www.LivingComputers.org/ > Sorry.. I was being lazy.. I should have said 'a PDP 8/E'.? Obviously there are some pretty large PDP-# systems. > That's more than lazy!? Just don't! The PDP-8 and the PDP11 and PDP10 were beating the pants off of Intellec 2xx systems for years before the first one was made.? Remember Billy Gates used a PDP10 cross assembler and simulator to create BASIC.? The market those DEC system were in demanded far more performance than the 8080 from 1974 could deliver. An 8e running WPS was typically a multi-user system. A PDP-8E running TSS could service 8-16 users in what appeared to them as real time. That was the original Boces Lirics system of 1969 a whopping three racks of PDP-8i The PDP-8e was a tad faster.? Fast forward to the early 90s and my Decmate-III with APU and running OS278 likely make the I230 look poor and it was much smaller.? FYI the DMIII is a PDP-8 on a chip (cmos 6120 cpu).? The APU was a z80 at 4mhz with 64K ram and could still easily outrun the I230 and gave me the choice to use 0S278 (a version of OS8), WPS (word and list processing), and CP/M-80. A PDP-10 (BOCES LIRICS system 1970!) serviced over 300 users.? A 36bit monster. The CPU and the memory was eight 6ft racks long by two rows big not including the four RP06s. That system used the old PDP8i to keep it fed (data concentrator). A PDP-11/23 with a 10MB disk in a single 50inch short cab running TSX or other time sharing system usually? supported 4-8 users. It was a 16bit system at that. They usually fit in the corner. A Intellect 230 was handily beat by my NS*Horizon system in 1980. That's allowing for the fact that the I230 was 8080 powered and ran at 2mhz (2:1 handicap). I know the system well as I used it to develop programs for 8048/9, 8085, 8088, and other micros of the day till we retired it for a faster box (multibus 8086 at 8mhz in 1981). So a knowledge of computer history and performance is is something to >consider. >Allison Sorry.. when I said 'beat'.. I meant weight only. ?And only for the main PDP-8e system unit. ?Was not comparing processing speed. ?But I appreciate all the info you gave me there for sure. :)

9 years, 6 months

2
1
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Digital circuits and analog devices

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

So I have this memory of a set of law promulgated by an engineer at DEC, one of which was something to the effect that 'all digital circuits are made out of analog devices'. However, my memory doesn't recall where I saw this, and my Google-fu is not strong enough to turn it up. Can anyone help? Noel

9 years, 6 months

10
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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Brad H > So I wondered what PDP guys did to keep interested and how much they > actually used the machine over the course of, say, a year. Well, I have to get all mine running first... ;-) Seriously, though, I'm looking at several years of work to get them all running. (And there are also various peripherals to do, like tape drives, etc.) And then there's the project Dave B and I have to creat new blinkenlitz panels (not to mention SD-card based mass storage to replace those cranky old disk drives for every-day running, the original purpose before the blinkenkraze hit us :-) for the PDP-11's... Seriously, though, like all hobbies, it's primarily to amuse me, not to create anything useful. And it's _very_ successful at that. Noel

9 years, 6 months

7
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Digital circuits and analog devices

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Tony Duell > It's one of Don Vonada's laws. Ah, thank you, thank you, that's the one I was looking for! I knew _you_'d know it! :-) > A related one ... came from Professor M. V. Wilkes That one I _did_ remember (although I couldn't remember if it was Wilkes or Wheeler - I knew it was one of those Cambridge guys :-), but it's not quite as pithy as the Vonada one. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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Base 64 posts to the list

by jonas＠otter.se

Lately, some list posts have begun appearing in Base 64 format. I read the list in daily digest mode, and these posts are not converted to anything sensible, all I get is a long string of hex codes. This is slightly frustrating, since I have to look up the post in the list archive if I want to read it, and then it may turn out to be something that doesn't interest me at the moment. Is there a way of dealing with this, apart from humbly requesting posters to not post in Base 64? Jonas

9 years, 6 months

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Digital circuits and analog devices

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Eric Smith > The full set from the book (any typos are mine) Since you'd done all the hard work (typing them in), I uploaded them (less typos :-), to: http://gunkies.org/wiki/Vonada's_Engineering_Maxims Interestingly, there's a typo in the originall: "worse-case". :-) Noel

9 years, 6 months

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PDP-8e power switch key?

by w2hx＠w2hx.com

Hi folks, What are people doing for keys for the 8e? Is there a standard key used for all of them? Or do I need to have one made with some specific serial number of my key lock? I did some googling of this issue but wasn't able to get info. Thanks Eugene W2HX

9 years, 6 months

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Winchester-style coax connectors?

by pete＠petelancashire.com

Can you take a picture of the side you have ? I have a few On Dec 1, 2016 11:27 AM, "Josh Dersch" <derschjo at gmail.com> wrote: Hey all -- Due to a small miracle I now have 8KW of perfectly functioning core in my long-ill Imlac PDS-1D. The last hurdle is devising a replacement for the missing display (an X/Y vector display). For the time being I'm going to attempt to use an oscilloscope, but first I need to build a cable. The Imlac uses a Winchester connector (14 position) for the display and while they're not as common these days the parts can still be found so I thought I was in the clear, but what I failed to notice is that three of the "pins" (for the X, Y and Blank signals) are actually tiny coaxial connectors that fit within the Winchester housing (i.e. they're the same diameter as a Winchester pin). I haven't been able to track these connectors down anywhere. Anyone have any ideas? Failing that, I can always just tap into the backplane to pick up these signals and ignore the connector on the bulkhead, but it would be nice to be able to use the original connector... - Josh

9 years, 6 months

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ISO Xebec S1410A fw #104792 or 104793

by aek＠bitsavers.org

I just started cataloging and dumping firmware my SASI/SCSI disk and tape boards starting with Xebec. It would be nice to find images for the two alternate fw proms for the S1410A, particularly the 8k 104793 version so I can compare it to the one used on the S1420

9 years, 6 months

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Looking for Philips P2000C P-Systems discs

by hp-fix＠xs4all.nl

Hi, I just acquired a Philips P2000C and I'm looking for a copy of the p-systems disc(s) to run UCSD Pascal on it. If someone has a copy of those I would be very happy ;) -Rik

9 years, 6 months

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HP Draftmaster RX pen plotter needs love

by michael.newton＠gmail.com

I acquired a working HP Draftmaster RX (HP part # 7596B). An awesome machine, 36" roll feed and 8 pens, complete with several pen carousels, user manual, and hundreds of working pens. I was very excited to make a splash in the art world with this thing. I did get it to perfectly draw a 3 color demo page from the front panel. Thereafter it started displaying errors on the display such as "200" which means it needs "mechanical calibration". Thanks to hpmuseum.net I acquired the service manual <http://www.hpmuseum.net/document.php?hwfile=1292>, which catalogs many calibrations and self-tests to run from the front panel, including the aforementioned "mechanical calibration". So I power up with the appropriate front panel keys depressed to run this calibration. The paper drive motor starts making noise, but the paper rollers aren't turning, and the LCD display is blank. Since that moment, the LCD display is always blank so it is currently a boat anchor. It's a terribly sad state of affairs. I have basic electronics and mechanical skills and an oscilloscope so following the troubleshooting procedures in the manual I might be able to identify a part to replace. But of course, parts for sale online are are rare, expensive, used and probably untested. Probably better would be lower-level repair of whatever parts are faulty but that's probably more than I can manage at my skill level. I'm in Seattle, WA. Is there anyone alive in the pacific NW who will pay a visit and help me fix this thing? (The only company I found that admits to working on pen plotters is 360tech in Austin, TX.) Or someone elsewhere I could ship electronics parts to for test and repair? Or provide guidance, or help in any form at all? thanks M.

9 years, 6 months

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manual for Microtec META29M meta-assembler

by spacewar＠gmail.com

Does anyone have a manual for the Microtec META29M meta-assembler? This was generally used to assemble microcode for microprogrammed systems, including bit-slice systems. It was apparently compatible with AMD's AMDASM, but added additional features.

9 years, 6 months

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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by barythrin＠gmail.com

Argument goes both ways. Does anyone really do practical things with any home computer?? On the vcf forums I enjoyed two folks who eventually got their two PDP models running chess and had them play eachother. ?I'd like to see a rematch or maybe some new vintage competitors approach :-) If they can run holiday lights they could also probably use it for x10? home automation if one considers that practical. -------- Original message --------From: Brad H <vintagecomputer at bettercomputing.net>So I wondered what PDP guys did to keep interestedand how much they actually used the machine over the course of, say, a year.

9 years, 6 months

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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

Sent from my Samsung device -------- Original message -------- From: "Ian S. King" <isking at uw.edu> Date: 2016-11-29 7:19 PM (GMT-08:00) To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Re: Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff On Tue, Nov 29, 2016 at 5:17 PM, Brad H <vintagecomputer at bettercomputing.net > wrote: > > > That sounds interesting.? I imagine they'd be worth even more than an 8/E? > > > Keep in mind that the 8/I is a fairly substantial investment in space and weight.? Also, if you want to add something, it's not as easy as plugging a card into a backplane.? The 8/I requires wirewrap work. -- Ian S. King, MSIS, MSCS, Ph.D. Candidate The Information School <http://ischool.uw.edu> Dissertation: "Why the Conversation Mattered: Constructing a Sociotechnical Narrative Through a Design Lens Archivist, Voices From the Rwanda Tribunal <http://tribunalvoices.org> Value Sensitive Design Research Lab <http://vsdesign.org> University of Washington >There is an old Vulcan saying: "Only Nixon >could go to China." I'm curious.. what do people do with these things? ?I've seen videos of some in large racks being used to play music, etc. ?The rack ones seem like a a pretty substantial investment in space for something that doesnt (or does it?) have much practical use today.

9 years, 6 months

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VAX 4000-100 QBUS cables

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Peter Coghlan > Can anyone suggest an existing, simple QBUS device that I could study > the documentation of to figure out what a basic QBUS device needs to > have and to give me some ideas on how to implement one? Depends. Do you want to be able to do interrupts? Do you want to be able to do DMA? Each is a significant increment in complexity. Later DEC QBUS devices may not be the best things to look at, since they tend to use special DEC QBUS control chips (I'm _not_ talking about bus transceiver chips here) which are of course no longer available. If all you want is master/slave (i.e. the ability to read/write registers), try this: http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/tech/QSIC/test.pdf It implements a single 16-bit register. (Changing it to support a single block of registers would of course be trivial.) The switches (and associated comparators) in the lower left allow one to set the bus address it responds to; the 3 latches on the right hold the register contents; the drivers/buffers below them drive LEDs to display the register contents. The control logic is about as simple as it can be; one latch, and a couple of gates. You should probably read the QBUS description in any QBUS PDP-11 manual before attempting to understand it, but having done that, it should be pretty self-explanatory - the signal names should clue you in to what they mean. > From: Glen Slick > I have an M9405-PA. It has one male and one female 3-row 50-pin > D-shell connector. That's on the metal plate, right? The board itself should have a 2x25 Berg header. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Brad H > I was thinking about trying to acquire something early 70s... Anything DEC early 70's is going to be fairly expensive, alas. Only once one gets to QBUS -11's does the price come down. > if it is feasible to buy in pieces .. but is dependent on parts > availability I would not recommend this route. Those machines are a lot of bits and pieces, and if you buy a few, unless you're incredibly lucky, it will take forever for the rest of them to show up. There will be a few things that just never show. (Even when buying a 'complete' system, one will often find that it has been robbed of a few critical components, probably cannabilized to keep another machine running BITD.) There might be a rare exception (I see the guys in Mahwah selling a PDP-8 chassis, and also a front panel with switches, and it _might_ be possible to round up all the boards - but that's more like the exception than the rule.) Noel

9 years, 6 months

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Macintosh Portable

by barythrin＠gmail.com

Did you end up trying anything yet? Isn't there some requirement for a working battery for it to power on or was that just the power routing through the battery so a corroded one isn't a simple run without it fix? -------- Original message --------From: Chris Pye <pye at mactec.com.au> Date: 11/26/16 12:26 AM (GMT-06:00) To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Macintosh Portable Does anyone know off hand what polarity that Mac Portable requires? I know that the original was 7.5V @ 1.5A, but not sure of the polarity.

9 years, 6 months

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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

That sounds interesting. ?I imagine they'd be worth even more than an 8/E? Sent from my Samsung device -------- Original message -------- From: william degnan <billdegnan at gmail.com> Date: 2016-11-29 5:13 PM (GMT-08:00) To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Re: Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff On Tue, Nov 29, 2016 at 7:28 PM, jim stephens <jwsmail at jwsss.com> wrote: > > > On 11/29/2016 3:51 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote: > >> There might be a rare exception (I see the guys in Mahwah selling a PDP-8 >> chassis, and also a front panel with switches, and it_might_? be possible >> to >> round up all the boards - but that's more like the exception than the >> rule.) >> >>???????? Noel >> > He sold the boardset first, now has broken up part of the rest. parts of > the backplane were sold earlier as well. > > I've watched this vendor for a while and bought some things, which were > clean.? He also sold a complete 8/E > recently and as noel said, went for $$$ > > thanks > Jim > I am working on liberating 10 PDP 8i's...but the guy has fallen off comms. I plan to make a trip to the location, see what I can do.? I don't want these, just want to help find a good home for them. b

9 years, 6 months

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Woz signed Apple IIGS system for pickup only near Dallas

by sales＠elecplus.com

http://dallas.craigslist.org/ndf/sys/5890446928.html

9 years, 6 months

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Woz signed Apple IIGS system for pickup only near Dallas

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

I saw one in a thrift shop years ago... I seem to remember Woz a stenciled on or printed on In a message dated 11/29/2016 6:40:43 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, ian.finder at gmail.com writes: I believe the "Woz" edition was actually produced in greater quantities than the normal one. Either way, even if it were a real signature- Woz is known to have low enough standards with a sharpie that his autograph may in fact devalue an item! - Ian On Tuesday, November 29, 2016, Electronics Plus <sales at elecplus.com> wrote: > http://dallas.craigslist.org/ndf/sys/5890446928.html > > > > > > -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com

9 years, 6 months

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VAX 4000-100 QBUS cables

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Peter Coghlan > Interrupts would be great to have If you decide you need interrupts, the DLV11 (MP-00055) has a simpile interrupt circuit built out of flops and gates. > However, I am puzzled by the BPOK and BINIT signals being connected to > U7 even though they do not seem to get used ... I wonder is this just > because two tranceivers were left over and they might as well have > something connected to them that might come in handy later or is it > because I am failing to understand something properly? Neither, but your first one is close! :-) Actually, that design started as a CAD file (for KiCAD) that I got from Dave B; I munged on it until it was what I wanted. Those two signals were connected to that transceiver in Dave's original circuit; my design doesn't (as you discovered) actually use BPOK or BINIT, so they just stayed connected up, but unused. > there are rather more than 50 QBUS signals listed on the top right of > the circuit diagram. As Glen indicated, it actually takes 2 50-pin connectors. > I suppose the power rails and those labeled "spare" are likely > candidates for omission. I don't think they'd have carried power through that connector. The spare lines might well be connected through. I haven't checked the pinout of the 50-pin Berg headers (which were the original, the 'D' connectors came later), but if they followed UNIBUS precedent, every other wire in the flat cable will be a ground, to help minimize cross-talk between lines with signals on them. > I was hoping that there would be lots of signal pairs like SCSI Well, the QBUS wasn't designed to go through a cable, originally it was backplane only; so it doesn't have differential pairs, or anything like that. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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dot matrix printers to be thrown out near Denver

by sales＠elecplus.com

Might already be gone, located in Longmont near Denver. Give him a call! $25 - Epson DXF5000 ( Longmont ) near denver We have some wide carriage dot matrix printers. They work and they are worth next to nothing. Come and get them intact or search the dumpster for parts If I have to throw these IBM, Epson and OKI dot matrix printers in the trash - they will be in pieces no larger than a candy bar. I promise to break them up so that no one can ever use them. I might give them away for free, but our dumpster will contain tiny bits if you think waiting is the better plan 303-651-7919 634 Main Longmont

9 years, 6 months

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Tektronix DVST Terminals & 4052's in sad shape

by pete＠petelancashire.com

http://petelancashire.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=7780 If interested in details click on thumbnail the click on the picture or upper right corner select the full size Will try to get and at least salvage the CRT's -pete

9 years, 6 months

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Thinking about acquiring PDP stuff

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

Apart from my Rainbow I don't really have any DEC stuff. ?So I was thinking about trying to acquire something early 70s... like a PDP8/E or similar. ?I don't see them for sale often and I notice that DEC stuff is hotly contested on ebay. ?Wondering what a complete 8/E would run in working or non working condition, or if it is feasible to buy in pieces (I did this with some other equipment I have.. allowed me to spread out the cost.. but is dependent on parts availability). Advice/thoughts most welcome. Sent from my Samsung device

9 years, 6 months

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DEC kit on offer in Sussex, England

by shadoooo＠gmail.com

Hello, I'm interested in Rainbow and DecMate, specially if there are monitor and keyboard. Eventually also vax2000 parts, for possible repairs. Thanks Andrea

9 years, 6 months

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DEC M9312 Configs for a 11/40

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: William Degnan > hit LOAD ADDR > address light 16 comes on, RUN/PROC/BUS/CONSOLE lights stay on. According to the KD11-A manual (pg. 3-2) the address lights on the console are driven directly from the CPU's Bus Address Register. So you've got an issue there. > If I hit START light 16 turns off. So it's not wedged on in the CPU. Maybe a console switch issue, then? > From: Josh Dersch > Try depositing a known word into a specific memory address, like 1000 > using the console PROM, then try reading it back with the front panel. The console emulator doesn't directly support access to memory about 56KB (as would be, with address bit 16 on). To look at that memory, one has to set up the MMU and turn on mapping - there's a section in the M9312 manual which shows how to do it. Noel

9 years, 6 months

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VAX 4000-100 QBUS cables

by glen.slick＠gmail.com

On Nov 29, 2016 9:22 AM, "Noel Chiappa" <jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu> wrote: > > > I have an M9405-PA. It has one male and one female 3-row 50-pin > > D-shell connector. > > That's on the metal plate, right? The board itself should have a 2x25 > Berg header. Same deal as a few other S-box handle boards. It's a standard dual wide M9405 board riveted to the S-box handle frame and a dual wide blank spacer for the CD half of the slot. The two 50-pin D-shell connectors on the metal frame are connected to the two standard connectors on the base M9405 board by two short ribbon cable jumpers.

9 years, 6 months

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