Something to do in the quiet times between the Xmas pies and the
festive cheer: Make a YouTube video on the most classic of my classic
computers. The IBM-PC
http://youtu.be/Xw5uRmjESMc
Terry Stewart (Tez)
On 25 August 2012 15:29, Jules Richardson <jules.richardson99 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 08/23/2012 04:02 PM, Tony Duell wrote:
>
>> Does a non-CP/M box count? The Tatung Einstein? It runs soemthing called
>> XtalDOS which is very CP/M-like (I think most of the calls are the same).
>
> I think that was true of Torch CP/N too, wasn't it? Which makes me wonder
> how common "almost CP/M" variants were...
That's a really interesting question, actually, I would say.
[Does a bit of Googling]
There were, it seems, various Torch Z80 addons for the BBC Micro.
The only one I saw or used was a Disk Pack:
http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/docs/Torch/Torch_Z80DiscPack.pdf
There was a time, when I was about 13 or 14, when I thought that this
was about *the* most powerful and desirable computer setup I'd ever
seen or heard of. ;?)
What I had not appreciated until now was that Torch's version of CP/M
was a special one, which ran from ROM. That is apparently why they
called it CPN instead.
There was also a standalone 2nd processor, no disk drives:
http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/8bit_Upgrades/Torch_Z802ndproc.html
There's a user manual for a CPN system here:
http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/docs/Torch/Torch_ZDPUG.pdf
It contains a little non-technical info:
?
the TORCH CPN operating
system, (a 16K ROM containing a CP/M compatible "look alike")
?
?
INTRODUCTION
The TORCH CPN operating system which is a CP/M "look alike" has
much more flexibility than conventional CP/M. It has more "built in"
commands and is easier to use. The most significant advantage of the
TORCH CPN operating system, is that it is stored in ROM (Read Only
Memory) rather than on disc. This means that on "power up" the TORCH
disc pack and BBC micro are automatically ready to accept instructions
typed in at the keyboard.
?
Another CP/M compatible OS I was aware of was Pro-DOS for the MGT SAM Coup?:
http://www.samcoupe-pro-dos.co.uk/whatisprodos.html
?
What is Pro-DOS?
Pro-DOS could be thought of as a Disk Operating System (DOS), However,
it is more than this, it is a full Operating System that Provides
compatibility with CP/M 2.2.
In simple terms this means that a whole world of software that was
designed to run under CP/M 2.2. will now run on the SAM Coup?. Pro-DOS
uses the same Disk format as the Amstrad PCW 8256 and, as a result, it
can read disks from this machine direct, this also Means that there is
a vast range of software already available from sources such as Public
Domain libraries.
?
I hadn't realised it was by virus writer Chris "The Black Baron" Pile,
who was imprisoned for writing Queeg, SMEG and Pathogen:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Pile_(programmer)
It is an admitted reverse-engineered effort as you can find from this
interesting review, complete with an account of nostalgia-destroying
8-bit compatibility problems:
http://www.samcoupe-pro-dos.co.uk/pdreview.html
As for the Tatung, I've found very little info on XTal DOS, apart from
something calling it " a compatible but beefed-up version of CP/M
called Xtal DOS."
http://www.tuicool.com/articles/myEBvq
Anyone got more?
Any more CP/M-compatible Z80 OSs?
--
Liam Proven ? Profile: http://lproven.livejournal.com/profile
Email: lproven at cix.co.uk ? GMail/G+/Twitter/Flickr/Facebook: lproven
MSN: lproven at hotmail.com ? Skype/AIM/Yahoo/LinkedIn: liamproven
Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 ? Cell: +44 7939-087884
Hello, this is my first post to this ml, so please bear with me...
I've become something of an DEC enthusiast since I pulled a VT220 out of a
dumpster of my university. I have two VAXstations by now, one of those is a
VAXstation 3100/M76 and it has always been a project to max-out the RAM and
get a new hard drive for it.
Getting that stuff on Ebay is (a) increadibly expensive and (b) mostly not
possible at all, because they only sell to companies.
I need RAM modules (at least four of them), hard drives, those weird flat
screws with their rubbery-plastic gromits, and possibly a terminator for
the external SCSI bus. I got spare RTCs (DS1387), it was no problem getting
the drop-in replacements for that from Maxim.
I live in Germany, there haven't been too many DEC users here, DEC was
mostly USA. I'll pay for shipping and basically any price you ask, except
it's those comical prices on ebay (4000 USD for a VAXstation main board
with CPU, no RAM, no case, no drives; or 60 USD for a single RAM module).
Please, if you're willing to send some of your stuff over to Old Europe,
please let me know...
Cheers,
--polemon
>On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 1:18 AM, Tom Sparks <tom_a_sparks at yahoo.com.au>wrote:
>
>>
>> > Certainly, as I said, he and Dabney were inspired by the PDP-6 version of
>> > Spacewar they saw at SAIL. They were originally going to go the
>> > mini-computer route and have an actual copy of Spacewar running on a coin
>> > modded mini, which turned out to be too expensive to have mass produced.
>>
>>
>> it more of cost issue, the mini was not able to run the number of
>> terminals that was needed to recover cost of the mini
>> I think it was two terminals to break even, three to make a profit
>>
>>
>Tom, cost of production. This is per our direct talks with Bushnell and
>Dabney for the Atari book (Atari Inc. - Business is Fun). In fact, Curt and
>I had the pleasure of driving around with Ted Dabney to some of the
>original locations for a day while he reminisced everything. It had nothing
>to do with the number of terminals to make a profit, the cost of the mini
>alone would have prohibited them from sales in the coin industry at a time
>when typical coin-ops cost in the $500-$1500 range. For even the cheapest
>mini at the time (the Data General Nova they considered), you're talking
>around $4000 just for an entry level Data General Nova - without enough RAM
>let alone the cost of the terminal stations. They decided fairly quickly
>that besides the Nova being too slow to run the game on multi-terminal
>stations, the cost was way too prohibitive. And this was precisely why
>Nolan felt Pitt and Tuck's Galaxy Game (around $17,000) wouldn't go
>anywhere, it was impossible for it to scale to mass sales let alone the
>cost in upkeep on loctaion. Let alone how long it would have taken an
>operator to even begin to recoup those kinds of costs.
thanks that explain it more to me as the video I heard were short and to the point
>from one of those Atari Anthology cds
>
>
>--
>Marty
tom
Great, thanks. I DL'd the book and will read through it (your second
link). The III operates somewhat differently than I expected. Sounds like
my first step is to get SOS on a floppy so I can test the III and make sure
there are no disk drive issues before proceeding to the CFFA. Based on my
experience with the CFFA and the Apple II, I was thinking it was going to
be a bit more straightforward. Thanks for the info.
Win
---
Unlike the II, which is relatively easy to configure to boot to any
(bootable) storage device in nearly any slot, the Apple III tries to
boot only from the internal floppy drive, and as Eric pointed out,
you'd have to roll your own ROM to change that behavior. The CFFA3000
works nicely in the III, but you lose the Drive ][ emulation
capability and you can't boot directly to it.
In the Apple III, everything is seen as a device and requires a driver
that SOS loads as it boots in order to be accessible to the system
during operation. You can't (easily) boot directly to the CFFA because
SOS requires a driver to be able to recognize it. Fortunately, SOS is
close enough to ProDOS that you can use the CFFA in an Apple II to
create floppies from the images you downloaded.
I'd suggest reading this PDF for more on how the III works:
http;//apple2scans.net/scans/manuals/3rd.party/OMHGYA3.pdf
It's the Osborne McGraw Hill Guide To Your Apply III. Pay special
attention to Chapters 3 and 4.
LMK if you have any questions about all this.
- Mike
> Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2012 09:20:49 -0500
> From: allison <ajp166 at verizon.net>
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only <cctech at classiccmp.org>
> Subject: Re: Fans for a PDP-9?
> Message-ID: <50DC5941.3000500 at verizon.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> On 12/26/2012 03:22 PM, Michael Thompson wrote:
>
>> Does anyone know of a source of fans for a PDP-9?
>> You can see one of the fans at the right of this image:
>> https://sites.google.com/a/ricomputermuseum.org/home/Home/equipment/dec-pdp…
>>
>>
>
> Just take them apart and lube the bearings with light machine oil. Using
> WD40 only dries them out further.
>
> If tha tis too hard then Rotron should have something that bolt pattern.
>
These are from pre-boxer fan days, the old "phonograph style" motor.
They have oilite (porous sintered bronze) bearings mounted in a
cotton oil wick. You can add a lot of oil to the wick material and let
it soak in, then clean and oil the bearing and shaft when reassembling.
By the time the surface oil is used up, new oil from the wick should
soak through.
Jon
On Sun, 23 Dec 2012 19:11:44 Chuck Guzis wrote:
>>On 12/23/2012 05:29 PM, Chris Tofu wrote:
>>
>> I have an Eagle 5151 clone. In my mind a far easier solution then vga.
>So you have a 6300 or M24 that you've used the Eagle 5151 clone with?
>I'm surprised that it worked
The AT&T 6300 can be operated with a monochrome monitor like a 5151 or a Hercules monitor. You have to install an MDA-card on the system bus and connect it to the mono monitor. Maybe that is the way the 5151 of Chris Tofu works with the 6300.
If you want to operate only with mda you have to set a dipswitch on the motherboard so it starts up in mono mode and not in "color mode" of the Indigeneous Board. I used both monitors at the same time with software I wrote and --for example-- the Microsoft Quick C compiler, which has the standard output through the Indigenious card and the compiler messages on the mono monitor.
Hendrik
----- Original Message -----
> I wonder what the state of the art in Atari emulation is?
atari coldfire project[1] and Hatari[2]
>
> I'm an old Amiga person rather than Atari one so every so often I get
> an urge to go buy an Amiga 4000. Instead I fire up my copy of E-UAE
> running AmigaDOS 3.9 and the urge goes away. It runs some old games
> better than my A500 ever did and I can run the AGA stuff my older
> machines never could without massive modifications.
>
> My eventual goal is to get an old netbook and dedicate it to just
> running WinUAE.
>
> Perhaps the OP might find an Atari emulator the same way?
emulation dose have its advantages (overclocking,? emulation of all systems)
but have physical system also has its advantages (engaging four senses (touch, smell, sight, hearing), bragging rights)
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_Coldfire_Project
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hatari_%28emulator%29
---
tom_a_sparks "It's a nerdy thing I like to do"
Please use ISO approved file formats excluding Office Open XML - http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
Ubuntu wiki page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/tomsparks
3 x (x)Ubuntu 10.04, Amiga A1200 WB 3.1, UAE AF 2006 Premium Edition, AF 2012 Plus Edition,
Sam440 AOS 4.1.2,? Raspberry Pi model B, Microbee?Premium Plus+, Roland DXY-1300 pen plotter,
Cutok DC330 cutter/pen plotter
Wanted: GEOS system (C64/C128), Atari ST, Apple Macintosh (6502/68k/PPC only)
Mike,
I wasn't sure how the driver worked and couldn't find any docs. I assumed
it worked in a way similar to the firmware updates...i.e. put the driver in
the root of the CF card. Apparently there is more to it. Do you have a
pointer to config docs for the driver?
I have no floppy disk software at all for the Apple III+. Only .dsk images
I downloaded online, so I was hoping to use the CFFA3000 to run the III and
perhaps make a few disks if the drive is working. So you're saying that
the CFFA3000 in the Apple III is different than in the Apple II. In the
II, I don't need any floppy disk software at all and can boot and run from
the CFFA....which is good because most of my floppy drives for the II are
intermittent at best. I'm not sure of the condition of the floppy drive in
the Apple III+. For the Apple III, are you saying that I cannot completely
dispose of the use of the floppy drive?
Thanks,
Win
--------
When you say, "tried the CFFA Apple III driver," what exactly do you
mean? The driver needs to be configured properly before the III+ will
recognize the card.
Also, what do you mean when you say you have no floppy software? None
at all? As is true of any Apple III, the III+ will only boot from a
floppy disk in the internal 5.25" drive, and you will need at least an
SOS floppy with the SCP to configure the driver and run the
partitioning program.
- Mike
Anyone have experience with the CFFA3000 in an Apple III+? I have one that
I've been using successfully in an Apple IIe, but have had no luck getting
it to work in the Apple III. I set switch 7 on, and tried the CFFA Apple
III driver, although I'm not sure exactly how that is supposed to work. I
have no floppy software for the Apple III+ and am not 100% sure it is
functioning properly. Any way to test the III+ without software or the
CFFA3000?
Thanks,
Win
wheagy at gmail.com
