Don't say I didn't warn you Sam. I do not see in the FAQ that
discussions relating to the operation of the mailing list are off-topic...
especially when such discussions are started by you suggesting that the
list should die and be replaced by a list under your control.
I do see that *BILL WHITSON* is the operator of the mailing list and not you.
I am glad to see, at least in THIS particular message, you've
discontinued using foul language. Please not, however, in general you
post more foul language than I do supposedly off-topic messages.
Perhaps you will continue to reduce your use of foul language and add to
that the elimination of your harassment of me, insults directed at the
mailing list and the discontinuation of your self-appointed police
activities.
Anthony Clifton - Wirehead
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:23:53 -0800 (PST)
From: Sam Ismail <dastar(a)wco.com>
To: Wirehead Prime <wirehead(a)www.retrocomputing.com>
Subject: Re: Sam's Instructions in Private Email
Once again, you are egregiously off-topic. Once again, allow me to quote
the FAQ so that perhaps you will begin to understand that the message you
posted is not acceptable discussion material.
1.1 What is ClassicCmp?
It's a mailing list for the discussion of classic computers. Topics center
on collection, restoration, and operation. It is also an appropriate place
for stories and reminiscences of classic computers. Lofty discussions
dealing with the philosophical and/or metaphysical aspects of computers are
often better handled in private e-mail.
1.4 Who runs this thing?
That would be me, Bill Whitson - email bcw(a)u.washington.edu.
2.10 Can I use obscene language in my posts?
Yes. Although I'm sure many people would prefer you did not. A number of
people have complained about this. I'm not going to outlaw swearing - now
that I've informed you that it bothers people you can make your choice.
> I gave you fair warning that I would post your private emails and, if
> they do not discontinue IMMEDIATELY, I will do so in every case so that
> others can see that you are simply a bully and nothing more.
Well, I'd say we needn't be ashamed of our personalities, this IS a
social, not business, list. Does anyone know how many people are on this
list?
> Let's keep on topic and keep personalities off the list and private.
> Abide by section 2.8 and all of us will benefit.
>
> Marty Mintzell
>
>
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Before everyone runs off...
I just picked up two Fortune Systems' computers. A Fortune 32:16 SX
and a Fortune 32:16 XP. These were 68K based Unix systems but
I only have the base units. The XP system should have a monitor and
keyboard that plug into it but those are missing. As usual with many
old systems, these also came without doc and software. I helped the
previous owner as much as I could with these (which was not very
much) and he was able to get one up and logged in but that was about
it. Does anyone out there have any info on these; specs, doc,
software or a monitor and keyboard for the XP?
Also, I've set up a server and registered my own domain;
trailingedge.com. As this is my own hardware, connection and
domain, I intend to run web and ftp services here with as many links
to other classic computing sites, info and whatever files I can
receive permission to place here. I hope to cover as many systems
as I can add space for. So far I've only begun to move my old web
pages from my ISP over to the new server but plan to update the
site as I go along. I'd be happy to hear what people would like to
find there or services people would like to see.
You can email me at my old address dlw(a)neosoft.com or my new one
dlw(a)trailingedge.com. The new web site is
http://www.trailingedge.com of course. Sorry but the site isn't
currently very "text friendly", (though I did view it with the
current version of lynx from a Unix shell without too much trouble)
but that will be changing shortly too.
Thanks for your time.
-----
David Williams - Computer Packrat
dlw(a)trailingedge.com || dlw(a)neosoft.com
http://www.trailingedge.com || http://www.neosoft.com/~dlw
Go to Aple's web site, apple.com, and search in the tech support TIL
(technical information library). You'll find everything you need and
more...
Marty Mintzell
email:marty@itgonline.com
______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: RGB monitor
Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet
Date: 3/18/98 5:02 PM
Sorry, I don't have the answer.
I have a 12" RGB monitor that works with a IIGS but when I plug it into
my Mac IIsi, I get nothing.
Please let me know if you find out where you can get technical info on
Apple monitors.
Thanks,
jstorm
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From: "Storm, John" <jstorm(a)RFPP.com>
To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers"
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Subject: RGB monitor
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>
>This is a Practical Peripherals 2400SA, right? Little white plastic
>modem with a sloped front with modem-blinkenlights?
Yep
>I think this is the kind of modem that taught me that when they label
>one jack "line" and the other jack "phone" they may mean it. When I
>got it wrong the modem behaved as above: it would go off-hook and dial
>but not connect.
>
>Except that they didn't label the jacks on the modem, you had to look
>in the manual if you wanted to know which was which. But there's only
>two ways to do it, so put the cable that goes to the wall jack in the
>*other* modem jack and see if that makes it work.
If it isn't plugged in correctly, I think it says "NO DIALTONE", but I
will check
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
A good mailing list / BBS / forum / whatever has a benevolent dictator.
A moderator. Someone who rules with a light hand, and who has the time
and good nature to police unruly threads. A simple solution is to reject
the person's message, but this requires human intervention.
It's usually pretty easy to shift these mail lists from automatic
to moderated, but then there's a posting delay as the moderator
approves messages... and I think it's too much to ask for someone
to volunteer 10+ hours a week to trim and approve postings.
I've always thought a much more sensible approach is the private
news server. It allows pruning of unruly threads, either by the
reader (ignoring off-topic subjects) or by a B.D. who trims
away junk messages. It allows auto-archiving. It doesn't clog
mail routes and mail boxes. You can read it with any Usenet news reader,
just point to someone else's server. It would be easy to split
into .hardware, .software, .culture sub-groups.
Wirehead Prime <wirehead(a)retrocomputing.com> wrote:
>2. Who's fault is it that you've apparently never learned to use a
>delete key?
Uhm, so why did you decide it was useful to include a quoted
copy of Sam's post? Excess bytes vex me more than swear words, but
almost as much as conspiracy theories.
- John
Jefferson Computer Museum <http://www.threedee.com/jcm>
a)This is itself off-topic
b)One needs to have some kind of knowledge and ability just to join
the list
>Well Sam - you know me 8-) I will reserve judgement for the moment.
>Most of what you said - I agree with - How you said it - well...
PS I hope the new list will be accessible via a classic computer
>
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
From: Charles E. Fox <foxvideo(a)wincom.net>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: 16 March 1998 22:51
Subject: Microsoft&Windows
> At the risk of getting incinerated, I would like to put in my two bits on
>the great MS debate.
> You fellows tend to resemble a lot of Grand Prix drivers running down
>Fords and Chevvies. What it comes right down to is that there are a whole
>bunch of people who are doing useful things with computers who would not be
>if they had to depend on the equipment and software that was available
>before PC's, Mac's, MS-Dos and Windows.
> I saw the same thing with the introduction of self threading 16mm
>projectors about twenty five years ago. The National Film Board of Canada
>banned them because they chewed up film, but they made it possible for
>thousands of teachers to use film in their classes.
> Someday possibly we can run our modern computers with an operating system
>that comes on one single sided floppy, but until then lets appreciate what
>we have.
Hey, we've already had that - it was called DOS (albeit versions prior to
about 5.0) ;-p
-------------------------------------------------
- ICQ: 9761376 page 9761376(a)pager.mirabilis.com -
- http://wwp.mirabilis.com/9761376 -
-------------------------------------------------
It is much easier to suggest solutions when you know nothing about the
problem
http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/CCS/ssem/ssemhome.htm
We're coming up to the 50th anniversary of the first program run on the
world's very first stored program computer, the Manchester Mark I. I've
visited this page a bit, and its quite fascinating. They are running a
competitiion for the best program written on this machine by the end of the
month - emulators available. With just 6 instruction types, and just 32
words of memory (each instruction takes 16 bits of the 32 bits), no add, no
bit shift, and rudimentary branching, you will be sorely pressed for space.
But that's just what classic computing is all about. The winner gets to run
their program on the reconstructed MkI that will be debuting in a few
months. I toyed around with a packer that would let the unused bits of
memory hold additional instructions, but found it damn difficult to do in 32
bytes and still end up with more than I started with!!!! The biggest killer
for me was no add, no and or xor, and no bit shift!
I recommend a visit.
Cheers
A
> -----Original Message-----
> From: lisard(a)zetnet.co.uk [SMTP:lisard@zetnet.co.uk]
> Sent: March 18, 1998 15:19 PM
> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
> Subject: Re: Robots again
>
<snippage all over the place>
> however, we'd urge you to take a look at some other object oriented
> languages. smalltalk, common lisp, self, oberon, etc. *much* nicer.
> and
> then grab a forth and roll your own :>
>
I have done some lisp, (in (mostly Emacs)), so I'm a bit
confused about you grouping Common Lisp with object oriented
languages... could you elaborate? I am somewhat amused by your mention
of forth. I maintain that HP managed to create a good implementation of
an object oriented Forth - RPL. (Maybe they should have called it FORTH
1 +) (Objoke: there is now an object oriented COBOL. It's called ADD 1
TO COBOL GIVING COBOL (yes, before you flame me there are better ways to
increment a variable but I've luckily never had the displeasure of
having to use COBOL. (ObCC: but I _do_ have a COBOL interpreter for my
C= SuperPET - but I only fired it up once to see if the disk was OK. I
also have APL which is _way_ cool.)))
> :I'be not tried VB, and almost zero Java, but I had to use Ada for
> :three years.
>
> oh, someone else. we had to do that, thanks to bradford university's
> oh
> so wonderful degree course. and to think that the oxonians were
> moaning
> about modula-2...
>
I remember the hilarious (mis)feature of Moduala-2's
"dual-tasking"... This was the language we had to use for "Intro to
Operating Systems"... <shudder>
> ada is a disgusting language, not because it is verbose or hard to
> program, but because it introduces another language - and a vast one
> at
> that - without giving anything *new*; it doesn't give value for money.
> size without content.
>
The going joke is that somwhere inside Ada is a wonderful,
small, efficient language screaming to get out... anyone remember who
wrote this?
--------------------------------------------
Joachim Thiemann
DSP Coder, Castleton Network Systems
I doubt therefore I might be.
