- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by marco＠familie-rauhut.eu

Hello; I have here my first Sinclair ZX81 Computer with 16K Ram extension. To check if the Ram extension works properly i want to write an small Basic program to check each byte. The first thing i struggle on is that 1 could not type in a for next statement. 10 FOR I = 17000 TO 32768 if I type in this line, the ZX81 mark an inverted "S" just before "TO". 10 FOR I = 17000 "S"TO 32768 I found out that the ZX81 "think" that there is an Sytax Error with the TO. So i tryed all combinations with and without spaces in that basic line.... Nothing matters. Is there someone who knows about that behaviour? Marco * Englisch - erkannt * Englisch * Deutsch * Englisch * Deutsch <javascript:void(0);><#>

10 years, 10 months

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Available: HP3000 serie 52 parts

by anders＠abc80.net

Hi, I have a bunch of PCB's from a HP3000 series 52 computer. Is some one interested in those? The machine itself was still working when it was taken out of service in the late 1990's. No guaranties are given though. The location is in south of Sweden, but I'll guess I can pack them and send them elsewhere. There is also a power supply available. A disk station and some kind of a tape drive, each sitting in a cabinet of their own. Free for pickup. Don't know more than this, but I can find out more details if anyone is interested. /Anders

10 years, 10 months

1
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Fwd: How to disassemble the DEC PC05 puncher unit?

by j_hoppe＠t-online.de

Hi, I have an broken DEC PC05 puncher unit here. It seems the shaft which transfers motor power to the excenter mechanism is broken in the inside. So i need to dissassemble the whole unit, but have no idea where to start. I've read somewhere the mechanical puncher unit is not made by DEC but by some other company. Is there any known documentation about the DEC PC05 puncher ? Thanks, J?rg

10 years, 10 months

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using new technology on old machines. Was: PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM

by kspt.tor＠gmail.com

On 15 June 2015 at 22:55, Mark J. Blair <nf6x at nf6x.net> wrote: > >> On Jun 15, 2015, at 13:46 , Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at Update.UU.SE> wrote: >> >> On Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 04:55:57PM +0000, tony duell wrote: >>> >>> Unfortunately I believe you. Use at least a thousand times more components than >>> you need to. >> >> Actually it's just two, a Teensy and a usb cable. (Sorry, I couldn't >> resist). > > LOL! I must admit that I used to scorn those durned kids using Arduinos to do the job of a 555. But then I pulled my head out of my ass and realized that times change, nowadays a microcontroller is as cheap and common component as a 555 was[..] I think I'm reasonably well into the pragmatic camp (ref. Chuck G.'s post). But one point about 555s and Arduinos is that I couldn't build a 555 more easily than I could build the MCU on an Arduino board (a more relevant comparision might be a 555 vs a Propeller chip) - they're all black boxes to me. Even a transistor, to some extent - I know exactly how it works, well, as much as any other EE anyway, but I couldn't build one. Or a vacuum tube..

10 years, 10 months

2
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FS: Telecom Gear- Switchboard, Phones, PBXes & More

by slandon110＠gmail.com

Clearing out the phone collection as well 1 Western Electric 551B PBX Switchboard. Fully Functional with a 24V Power Supply- Switch calls like a BOSS 1 Panasonic 616 PBX 1 Plexus by BBS Telecom PBX- Highly programmable with IVR About 100 vintage telephones, all kinds, 500 sets, trimlines, princesses, explosion proof, australian phones you name it its here. 3 totes of telecom cable, over 500ft of 25pair wire with 66 blocks 1000ft of aerial wire and outside network stuff. 1 Asterisk Server with TDM400p Card About 10 Analog Telephone adapters. You name it I have it. Make an offer on it

10 years, 10 months

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FS: HP 9836C System- Make an offer on it

by slandon110＠gmail.com

I picked this up last year, sat in the closet ever since.. Its an HP 9836C, In perfect condition with Owners Manual, Some software, Long HP IB Cable and some sort of weird network interface. The disk drives need lubed to work. Make an offer on it Its a heavy beast, Id prefer not to ship it, but I can if need be.. I live near Mount Pleasant Michigan, but could meet anywhere in Michigan for the cost of gas. Id like to see this go to someone who would appreciate it and use it. Thanks Steve

10 years, 10 months

1
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IBM 5120

by ggs＠shiresoft.com

I had acquired an IBM 5120 a few months ago but I didn?t have time to really check it out. It?s a fairly pristine example (32KB) with dual 8? floppies. It also came with a few manuals including the Maintenance Information Manual as well as the Computing System Logic Manual (still shrink wrapped). It also has a serial I/O diskette and a diagnostic diskette. It also came with a printer but I have not yet unboxed that yet. When I originally unboxed the 5120 I was a bit disappointed in that the shipper didn?t pack it as well as I would have liked (styrofoam peanuts) but there was other packing material so it wasn?t a complete disaster. Since it was a working unit prior to shipment, after an initial inspection, I powered it up only to have nothing happen. :-( I proceeded to take the covers off and noticed that the fuse for the display had blown. It was likely vibration related since I didn?t see nor smell any burnt components. Replacing the fuse, I saw that the cathode filament was lit but still nothing on the display. :-( After removing the logic chassis and removing all of the foam ?gunk?, I noticed that a couple of the boards as well as the connectors for two of the boards were loose. After reseating everything, success! I haven?t yet done a complete checkout yet, but I did enter a small BASIC program and it ran successfully. Now I have to find some IBM formatted 2D diskettes for this so that I can save what ever programs I enter. ;-) TTFN - Guy

10 years, 10 months

3
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PDP 11 - how to lock heads in a rx01 and rx02 - seeking advice

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell > I find [RL0x's] easier than RK05s Try taking out an RA81! (Somewhere I have pictures of the rig I built to take a couple of RA81's out of some racks I was sent. I should post them...) Noel

10 years, 10 months

7
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Altos ACS 8000-15A

by fozztexx＠fozztexx.com

Last week while bored and browsing eBay looking at things that are ending soon something I had never heard of caught my eye: an Altos ACS 8000-15A. I looked at the pictures and googled the brand and model and it didn?t seem to be a very common computer and there were no bids on the item so I put in a fairly low bid. I ended up winning! :-) The seller asked if it would be ok to bring the item to me the next time he was in my area. I figured that was fine since I was concerned that since it has a large 8? hard drive in it that it would be more likely to be damaged in shipping. I actually didn?t even need to wait very long! Friday he set out to drive across 2 states and dropped off the computer at my front door on Saturday morning. Talk about excellent service! I buy lots of untested items on eBay and usually they work just fine. But luck hasn?t held for me this time and so far the Altos doesn?t work. I can hear the drives spin up and all the voltages from the DC power supply are perfect. But nothing spits out on the Console 1 RS232 port. From what I understand the serial ports are wired DTE (which seems odd since you use it with terminals) and so I?m using a null modem adapter. Although with the null modem or without I get nothing. Anyways, I posted an album with lots of pictures here: http://imgur.com/a/9X8Gh Yay another project for me to fix! :-) -- Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

10 years, 10 months

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PDP-12 at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

J. Victor Nahigian donated some M221 and M222 boards for the processor and TC12 LINCtape controller. They are in pretty bad condition, but are repairable. Warren wrote a test program for the M222 boards, and some of the just donated boards actually work OK. It will be nice to have some spares. Dan (the donor) brought over the now lubricated top of cabinet fan. He had to make some special tools to disassembled it but was able to lubricate the dry bearings. We will reinstall it next week. He also dropped off the system logbook and more diagnostic manuals. More scanning for Bitsavers! It is really interesting to see the service history of this system since it was new. The LICM scanned some of the missing MAINDEC documentation so we were able to run: MAINDEC-12-D1AC-D Extended Memory Control (EXTMC12) MAINDEC-12-D8CC-D_KW12A_Clock_Test Fails test #11 where the AC should be 0000 and is 7777 on the CLRB instruction. MAINDEC-12-D8CA-D-(D) KW12 Real Time Clock Diagnostic (KW12TST) shows the same failure mode as D8CC. MAINDEC-12-D6BA VR12 Display Test Runs, but we have no display connected. We connected the 'scope to the outputs of the VC12 display controller when MAINDEC-12-D6BA was running. Without a way to interpret the intensify signal, and no persistence in the phosphor, the resulting image was not too good. At least we know that the display controller is responding to commands and outputs signals that look reasonable. We reran MAINDEC-12-D3AD-D-D Tape Control Test Part 1 of 2. It still fails at 3400 with the error message "LGP GP=GPC PRESET" printed. We reran MAINDEC-12-D3GA-D-D Tape Control Test part 2 of 2. That runs fine. I bought the matching terminator for my current probe and was able to give it a try today. The normal setting for PDP-12, PDP-8/I, and PDP-8/L core is 320mA. When we debugged the core we set the voltage regulator to the middle of the high and low voltage settings that caused periodic errors. The low going part is the read current and the high going is the rewrite current. The result turned out to be 316mV for the read. Not too bad! -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

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80s magazines at Huntington Beach, CA estate sale

by brendan＠bslabs.net

I bought the two old Macs there this morning, but there's *years* of 80s magazines still there: BYTE, nibbles, MacUser, Softalk, Creative Computing, Personal Computing, Call-A.P.P.L.E, a few Macworld and PC Magazine issues, probably some others I'm forgetting. Only one more day for the sale, they'll probably let you haul them away for (close to) nothing on Saturday. Also there's a Toshiba T1000 and Apple II+ probably still there. http://www.estatesales.net/CA/Huntington-Beach/92646/931308 Brendan

10 years, 10 months

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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by steven＠malikoff.com

Following the recent discussion here on the 'DEC logo' topic, I've been mucking about with my own efforts to produce a replica PDP11 masthead panel for the DEC H960 rack. The idea is basically to make an SVG for a vinyl stencil which looks 'good enough' until I can find an orignal one. I've drawn CAD (vectors and arcs only - no splines) over images I've found on the web, from scratch, without relying on the Batchelder examples. So far the output is virtually complete but I need some help from the list, if possible - I would like the dimensions of the width and height. I know it's larger than a DEC filler panel. With thise I can adjust the drawing to the final size and continue on the project. As I need to mix a blurb with example images I've placed it under a blog entry on the VCF board at http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/entry.php?544-A-good-enough-replica… Please take a look, and thanks for any help or comments, Steve.

10 years, 10 months

5
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FS: Misc Computer Items.. 3 Intel Machines with OpenStep 4.2- Make an offer on Anything you are interested in

by slandon110＠gmail.com

Im just trying to clear out some excess stuff to make room for the SxS Telephone switch im getting. Everything listed below just make an offer on. Ill more than likely accept it :) I just want this stuff to go to someone who will use it. Plus i need space in my basement as an SxS Telephone switch is huge. IBM AT Clone. 640KB RAM 40MB MFM Hard Drive. Ethernet Card, set up with mTCP. 1.44 3.5 HD Drive and 5.25 HD Drive. Has ATI VGA/EGA Card as well Make A Fair Offer Toshiba Satellite 4010 CDS 32MB RAM 2GB HDD.. Has 3.5 drive, CD-ROM and Ethernet Card. Make a Fair offer Dell Dimension M233a. 32MB RAM 8GB HDD. Ethernet. This is running OpenStep 4.2 with fully supported video, networking and sound. 233Mhz Pentium MMX Processor. It runs it really nicely. Hp Pavilion 6630 500mhz Celeron 64MB RAM 10GB HDD. Runs OpenStep 4.2 with Networking and video fully supported. Dell Dimension XPS T450. Pentium 3 450mhz 128MB RAM 10GB HDD, ATI Rage 8MB Graphics, SB Awe32 Sound, 3C905 networking. And A USB Card.. All Fully Supported in OpenStep 4.2. This is a beast of an OpenStep 4.2 and with the 8mb graphics card, It does 1280x1024 at 32 bit color on any LCD you throw at it. It Looks great. Microsoft Systems and Development CD-ROM Circa 1994 Windows For Workgroups 3.11 Disk Set Windows NT For PowerPC, Intel, MIPS 6000, Alpha MS-DOS 6.22 Disk Set IBM Cartridge Basic for PCJr Windows 95 Original Release on CD-ROM and Floppies with Book and Key Code Thanks. eBay feedback upon request and I accept PayPal. Or if you are in Michigan and want to come pick it up you are more than welcome to come. I am in Central Michigan, North of Mount Pleasant Thanks Steve

10 years, 10 months

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SGI Indy available for collection in Sao Paolo, Brasil

by classiccmp＠crash.com

I think we've got a few active list members in Brasil, and somebody's got a nicely configured SGI Indy available for collection in Sao Paolo. > it has irix 6.2 installed (maybe) and (may still have) Maya and > Photoshop 1 with licenses. and medias for irix only. two hdds inside. > maxed ram. external cd rom. camera. 24 bit graphics card. (i may be > able to find the 8bit card). all cables (scsi, monitor, ...) > > if anyone want it, must pick it up in sao paulo soon. [...] oh and > everything is very, very clean. Original post is at: http://forums.nekochan.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16729781 Please check the original post for contact details - I have nothing to do with this except for the re-posting. Hope somebody manages to rescue the beast, --S.

10 years, 10 months

2
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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Pete Turnbull > z = about 0.5mm - you're trying to measure the taper on the edge of > the flange? Not easy to be accurate. Ah, I've just realized I made a mistake in a previous message. I thought 'z' was calling for the distance between the inner edge of what I'm calling 'the flange' (i.e. the edge the left-hand arrow of 'x' is pointing to), and the upright at the right end of what I'll call the 'bottom plate' (when the piece is mounted on the H960, the bottom plate is in a plane parallel to the ground - i.e. it's in a plane perpendicular to what I'm calling 'the flange'). That upright is the vertical (in this picture) axis at one end of 'z'. Having called up a flat plate, and a square, to help measure accurately, the width of the flange ('x') is 1.26 cm, and the distance from the outer edge of the flange to the vertical at one end of 'z' (i.e. the end of the 'bottom plate') is 1.57 cm at the 'bottom' of the plate (i.e. in this image), making the distance from the inner edge of the flange to the vertical edge of the bottom plate 3.1 mm - at the 'bottom' of the bottom plate. At the _top_ of the bottom plate (i.e. the inner edge, when the unit is mounted on an H960), the distance to the outer edge of the flange is 1.62cm, making the 'flange inner edge' to 'bottom plate side' distance 3.6 mm, at the 'top' of the bottom plate. So 'z', the variance between the two, is indeed 0.5 mm. Pete's spot on! Noel

10 years, 10 months

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OT: Pentium processor sizes

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

a 486 jump to p5~ impressive!! now to find one.... Collecting microprocessors is fun, and I am,trying to figure a way display the entire array in one large glass panel over it. Perhaps use a half of a sliding glass door as a cover over the display rack.frame. Any other ideas>> Ed # _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 7/10/2015 9:56:24 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, scaron at umich.edu writes: There absolutely was a P5 Overdrive from Intel for 486 motherboards ... I saw a few of them in the wild back in the day...

10 years, 10 months

1
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80s magazines at Huntington Beach, CA estate sale

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

good for searching... but if you want sharp images... get them on paper! In a message dated 7/10/2015 9:52:40 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, rdawson16 at hotmail.com writes: Most of the Byte magazines are here: http://www.americanradiohistory.com/Byte_Magazine.htm > Subject: Re: 80s magazines at Huntington Beach, CA estate sale > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > From: jws at jwsss.com > Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2015 21:33:39 -0700 > > > > On 7/10/2015 7:45 PM, Brent Hilpert wrote: > > On 2015-Jul-10, at 5:39 PM, jwsmobile wrote: > >> <snip> > >> Gizmo > >> http://pictures.estatesales.net/931308/21760158/1.jpg > > That's the rear of a 70s colour TV, the stuff on the side looks like either/both convergence control or an early electronic tuning system with individual channel tuning. > > > > Actually, it looks like a Heathkit with the plug-in modules along the rear chassis, the manuals on top look like the right colour with the little title window cut in the cover of Heathkit manuals. > > > > Here we go, compare: > > https://www.flickr.com/photos/34737609 at N07/sets/72157613423708701 > > > > I think the estate one is an earlier model, probably early 70s, with the flickr-pics one probably a couple years later. > The thing that made me ask was that the grey thing was possibly a 1/4 or > larger motor, and maybe it was some oddly skinned disk drive. Now I see it. > > My cousin built one of those and had the best workshop TV in full color > till his wife made him put it in a box in the living room. Great fun > with the controls that pulled out after that, but not near as fun as a > 25" or so color tv on your bench. > > thanks for the info. > > I will try to get there tomorrow, may call you, Brendan and let you > distribute the Bytes. I'm looking for a particular ad in the 70s thru > 80's magazines and if I find it that would be all I want to keep. > > thanks > Jim =

10 years, 10 months

1
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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

PS: To clarify (if needed) what I mean by 'the flange': orient the piece as it would be if it were on the H960 (i.e. with the little interior tabs at the top, and the coloured panel on the front); the 'flange' runs down one side, along the bottom, and up the other side: it's a continuous piece, towards the back of the unit, in a plane parallel to the plane of the coloured front panel. HTH. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Steven Malikoff > I'm not sure I interpret Pete's measurement of 33.1mm from the back of > the flange to the front of the box, correctly. Noel also says the same > 'from the back of the flange' so I must be missing something here. Hmm. I thought for a moment I'd misread my calipers, but I checked again, and 3.80 is correct for the thing I measured, which is (on your IMG_3161) from the lower end of i/j to the upper edge of d/g. So clearly we must be using different definitions of 'flange', or something - or maybe his unit is somewhat different from mine? Here are the rest of the measurements from that image: 'k' = 'm' on mine, at 1.15 cm. That downward projecting flat (at one end of 'l' and 'm', which is at 90 degrees to the thing I'm calling the 'flange', the thing with thickness 'i', which is completely horizontal - along two axes - in that image) is cut back a bit, in the direction normal to the screen, from the end of the upper part (at the left edge of 'k'), which is why they look, from the slight angle in that image, like they aren't in a common vertical plane (normal to the screen) - but they are. 'l' = 2.6mm; 'h' is 10.64 cm; 'd' is 5.73 cm; 'i' is 2.70 mm. 'g' looks to be about 4.6 mm; I should mention that the corner below it (at the upper end of 'i') is not a right-angle, but a rounded thing with a fairly considerable radius - something on the order of 3.5 mm. 'j' is 3.35 cm. The edge labelled 'flush with bottom edge' is indeed flush with the left-hand end of the horizontal flange. On IMG_3162, 'q' is 1.16 cm; note that the left edge of 'q' is almost, but not quite, in a plane with the right hand edge of 's'. The left edge of 'q' is about 3.4 mm to the left of the right edge of 's'. 'u' is 1.13 cm. (This turns out to be 'z' in the third image.) Note that the little tab (the thing you're measuring 's' on) projects up under the 'plate' which you're measuring 'u' on; i.e. the maximum width of that tab, 't', is up underneath that plate. I can't measure it because it's not a sharp angle where it meets the vertical surface (i.e. in the plane normal to the screen) up under there; rather, it's a radiused corner (which you can see in the next picture). On IMG_3144, 'y' is about 1.56 cm (bit hard to measure that one; I should have used a flat to give me good end point at the RHS to measure to); 'x' is 1.25 cm; 'v' is 9.1 mm (ditto); 'w' is 2.85 mm. 'a' I can't really give you directly, but I can give you the distance from the upper end of a, to the upper end of 'w', which is 7.96 cm; add that to 'w' and 'v' and that will give you 'a'. Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
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Schematics/Service Manual for Yamaha C1

by ethan＠757.org

I'm just going to toss a feeler out there. One of my more recent most sought after machines was the Yamaha C1, a 286-12mhz MS-DOS "laptop" with 11 midi ports. I picked one up off of ebay, not cheap in it's non-working condition. I'm now working on getting it running. I'm looking for schematics or service manual. It's a long shot :-) I contacted Yamaha of USA already and they said they don't have documentation going back that far. Both paper or digital. My unit when powered on never seems to do a floppy seek, or boot. Caps lock and num lock don't trigger the LEDs. And it has an internal or external display dip switch. The unit always comes up set for external display, even though dip switch is set internal. I hunted inside and found 9 electrolytic caps were leaking. I cleaned up the mess and replaced them, but still no go. The traces I can see that look on the fence all continuity test okay. I have more caps on the way to replace all of the capacitors, and next step will be to look at the power supply output on an oscope to see how good or bad it looks. I have already archived the eprom data, and will be scanning all the documentation and archiving the floppies. I will make it all available online. I have some of the programming docs, some dip switch info, pinouts for the expansion connector (but unfortunatly no hard drive controller connector afaik) and more. Schematics would be good to go with that, as the mainboard has more than 2 layers. -- Ethan O'Toole

10 years, 10 months

1
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OT: Pentium processor sizes

by starbase89＠gmail.com

Hey. I'm sorry for the off topic post, but I couldn't think of another forum to ask my question. I'm just looking for information as to whether there are different sizes Pentium processor dependent upon whether the processor is for a desktop or laptop. I want to see if I can give my old Hewlett Packard OmniBook a little more juice.

10 years, 10 months

4
5
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PDP 11 - how to lock heads in a rx01 and rx02 - seeking advice

by lyokoboy0＠gmail.com

I asked for advice a while back on what to expect with moving a pdp 11, I was told to lock the heads in the rx01 and rx02 drives. I'M getting pretty lost in all the information about the drives, are there any good guides or sites with lots of pictures of the drives taken from different angles apart so i can get a better idea of what im going to be working with? Also, people tell me getting the drives off the rails and out of the rack is a pain, where would i find the appropriate information on how to do that? I really don't want to take the drives out of the rack, but if it comes to it, i would like to know how. I am scheduled to pick this stuff up in 5 days. --Devin

10 years, 10 months

3
2
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by bob＠jfcl.com

> But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all makes and models. Linux, a web page form, some PHP scripts and MySQL and we're done. Any volunteers ??? :-) One problem is going to be authentication. If it has any contact information (and it seems like it would need to in order to be useful) then it's gonna become a target for SPAM. Bob

10 years, 10 months

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PDP 11 - how to lock heads in a rx01 and rx02 - seeking advice

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: devin davison > I was told to lock the heads in the rx01 and rx02 drives. Err, I think we told you to lock the heads the RL0x's, not RX0x's; the former use large rigid packs, the latter are 8" floppy drives. AFAIK, there is no need to lock RX heads when moving them - there is nothing in the manual about RX drives being shipped from DEC with the heads locks. > are there any good guides or sites with lots of pictures of the drives > taken from different angles apart so i can get a better idea of what im > going to be working with? Not that I know of, but the DEC manuals (mostly available online) are adequate. > Also, people tell me getting the drives off the rails and out of the > rack is a pain, where would i find the appropriate information on how > to do that? See above. > I really don't want to take the drives out of the rack, but if it comes > to it, i would like to know how. That's very wise - my last removal, it _really_ helped that I had read the DEC manuals before-hand, as I wound up performing a removal I hadn't planned on, and that had a tricky step I probably never would have found on my own, but which I had luckily read about in the manuals. Good luck on the move! Noel

10 years, 10 months

3
3
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Fwd: [SunRay-Users] Surplus SunRay 2 and SunRay 3

by toby＠telegraphics.com.au

via The Rescue List ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Aaron Browne <gopodge at gmail.com> Date: Wed, Jul 1, 2015 at 7:43 PM Subject: [SunRay-Users] Surplus SunRay 2 and SunRay 3 Units - Victoria/Australia To: SunRay-Users mailing list <sunray-users at filibeto.org> The company I work for is about to undertake a total endpoint replacement. We are replacing all of our SunRay 2 and SunRay 3 devices - hundreds of units of both types. All units are in working order. Is anyone interested in providing a new home for any of these devices? Otherwise, they are going to be recycled. Victoria/Australia is preferred destination but we can talk other parts of Australia if required. Cheers, Aaron _______________________________________________ SunRay-Users mailing list SunRay-Users at filibeto.org http://www.filibeto.org/mailman/listinfo/sunray-users -- raspberry-python.blogspot.com - www.pyptug.org - www.3DFutureTech.info - @f_dion _______________________________________________ rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Steven Malikoff > It appears the top edge projects further than the bottom by a tiny bit > leading to a tapered appearance, but I assume the plane of the printed > inset panel is parallel to the exterior mounting surfaces. By top edge I assume you mean the top edge of the unit (we need a common term for the entire injection-molded plastic thingy), as it would be when mounted on the rack? And the distance you're talking about is the distance from the very front of the unit to the flange that projects out around the unit on three sides (sides and bottom), right? OK, I'm measuring mine (with calipers :-), and from the back of the flange to the front of the rim around the coloured insert, it is 3.80 cm at the top, and... 3.80 cm at the bottom. So no tapering. (And it's the same on both sides.) > A common method of determining radii is to use an engineers radius > guage. Which I don't happen to have... something to add to my tool wish-list! :-) > Failing that, try fitting a series of circular objects (coins etc.) > which can then be measured with calipers or micrometer. I did try with the butt ends of a number of large drill bits, but I didn't get really good results. I mean, you can tell when it's way off (too small, and the object 'lifts' off the surface at the outer edges of the object, too large, and you get a gap in the middle), but there's a range in the middle where it's hard to tell - it all depends on where you decide the ends of the curved part are. Oh, one note: when I gave the gap between the coloured insert, and the sides of depression it sits in ("it's slightly smaller than the inset in the plastic housing, by about .5 mm"), that .5 mm is on each side, not total. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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VCF Midwest visitors

by useddec＠gmail.com

I have requests from several list members to stop b y and do some shopping/ trading. I'm still on the mend from my latest replacement shoulder and will be out of commission for quite a while yet. While not quite up to the show, I have no problem with members stopping by. But I still have doctors appointments, PT, etc. I can see I-74 from my house and am about 10 miles west of I-57 by Champaign, IL. There are several good routes to Chicago from here, which is about a 3 hour drive. If anyone wants to stop by I only ask that you make a ball park appointment that will not interfere with my medical appointments. If I have an idea of what you want (LA120s, monitors, other large things) I can have it out and ready. I should be able to have some of my high school helpers to help pack and load. I'm not a morning person, but can make it work. Nighttime doesn't bother me at all. If I missed anything or have general comments, please reply. If you want to set up a time or have specific questions, please contact me off list. Many Thanks, Paul

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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what IBM system is this?

by simski＠dds.nl

found in the archives of CERN, this image is beautiful! but what IBM system is this. https://cds.cern.ch/record/1847692 -- Met vriendelijke Groet, Simon Claessen drukknop.nl

10 years, 10 months

17
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CDC disk drives (was Re: what IBM system is this?)

by seefriek＠gmail.com

During my mid- to late-80s tenure at Georgia Tech, we had 2 x Cyber 180/855, 2 x Cyber 180/830 and 1 x Cyber 180/990. I'll have to ask around for someone with better memory than me as to how many, but we had quite an ocean of disks. KJ

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

will this include micro vax also? Ed# In a message dated 7/6/2015 8:03:25 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, aperry at snowmoose.com writes: Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com). alan On 7/4/15 1:40 PM, Toby Thain wrote: > On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote: >> Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it actually booted both >> VMS 6.1 >> and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ... >> >> BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards, >> (L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is the >> optional >> RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters. >> >> I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board. >> >> A booting 750: >> ... >> >> ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> login: root >> >> Password: >> > > > As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you! > > --Toby >

10 years, 10 months

5
4
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A 'good-enough' H960 |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| PDP11 masthead replica

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Steven Malikoff > a replica PDP11 masthead panel for the DEC H960 rack. That would be great! (I'd buy one! Or more!) But how are you going to produce the plastic housing? I suspect that's going to be harder than the inset coloured panel. > I need some help from the list, if possible - I would like the > dimensions of the width and height. The inset (the coloured part) is 8.45 cm high (it's slightly smaller than the inset in the plastic housing, by about .5 mm); alas, I don't have a metric ruler long enough to measure the width directly, but in Imperial it's 3-21/64" by 18-9/16". I don't have a good way to accurately measure the radius in the corners, but it seems to be about 8.5 to 9.5 mm. > I also would like to know of the outer edge of the masthead is a beige > colour, or even silver. The raised edge around the inset panel is painted a dull silver - like the old silver paint, but with a touch of grey in it. The edge itself is 4.1mm wide, according to my calipers. > The panel would be the inner bit with the radiused corners, the edges > being a seperately cut panel which is in front of the the detailed one. Not sure I follow this? The entire top unit, including the raised edge around the coloured inset, is a moderately complex injection moulded plastic piece; behind the front, it's kind of like a box that's open at the back, and there's a ridge around the back edge on three sides; the bottom edge is shorter, and the top edge is extended further back. Finally, there are a couple of internal tabs where it actually connects to the H960. If you want an original to copy, TopLine has one for sale on eBay (ignore the ridiculous price they've got on it, they are very reasonable). > I would also like to know how deep the recess is for the front. I > suspect the same as the filler panel bezel edge, about 3mm. 4.0 mm by my 0.5 mm ruler. > And also the depth of the plastic backing. You mean, how thick is the plastic in the housing? 2.7 mm in one place, 2.8 mm in another, 2.3 mm in a third? Interestingly, IYWR, in previous thread we'd mentioned how other people produced their own insets; one for a terminal server, and one for the LISP Machine. I looked at my LISP Machine one, which I had assumed was in a similar housing, but it's not! It does indeed fit on an H960 (the early LISP Machines were built in H960's), but it's quite different. It's in an extruded aluminium unit (of constant cross-section), with no end pieces (although the bottom plate has small squared cut out of the corners); the extrusion's cross-section is exact a capital 'F', but upside down. There are little square 'serifs' on the 'back' of the 'F' (the front side, when installed), and the printed panel fits in between them. Now that I look at it, it looks very similar to me to some things I seem to vaguely recall being used on earlier DEC machines (either a PDP-6, or a KA-10, I don't recall where it looks familar from). It being a more-expensive aluminium extrusion makes sense; that was back when that sort of thing (along with lots of lights! :-) was acceptable. Noel

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY source of web content?

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

>Liam Proven wrote: >>On 3 July 2015 at 18:22, Jerome H. Fine <jhfinedp3k at compsys.to> wrote: > > >>I understand that Netscape has been replaced by Mozilla. HOWEVER, >>since CHROME seems to be the most widely used, would CHROME >>be able to support the retention of ALL of my old e-mails and posts >>from usenet? Over the past 15 years, I probably have accumulated >>over 100,000 e-mails and posts in about 130 folders! So I would like >>an easy upgrade path which supports being able to view and modify those >>old e-mails and usenet posts. Can CHROME support that? >> >> > > >Chrome is just a web browser. It does not do email at all. > >However, the program that was called Netscape 6.x & 7.x is alive and >well. It was the "Mozilla Internet Suite" -- the final Netscape >releases were Mozilla, rebadged. As Mozilla Inc now focuses on >Firefox, the old Internet Suite was forked and is now called >SeaMonkey. > >http://www.seamonkey-project.org/ > >SeaMonkey will run fine on Windows 7. > >What you may have to do is this: > >[1] Use an old version of Thunderbird (Mozilla's standalone email >client) to import your Netscape 7 profile. Details here: > >http://kb.mozillazine.org/Migrate_from_Mozilla_Suite_or_Netscape_to_Thunder… > >[2] Use a newer version of Thunderbird to import the profile from old >Thunderbird: > >http://kb.mozillazine.org/Profile_migration_-_SeaMonkey > >This should import your entire Netscape profile and continue to work just fine. > >However, in the first instance, copy your whole Netscape 7.2 profile >from the Win98 machine to your unused Win7 machine. Reinstall Netscape >7.2 on the new machine and check it works. > >You can download it here: >http://sillydog.org/narchive/full67.php > >Then install SeaMonkey. It *should* notice and import your profile. > >It is very important to install Netscape *before* SeaMonkey. > Check

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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[SPAM key] - Re: How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY source of web content?

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

>Jerome H. Fine wrote: > >Terry Stewart wrote: > >> I'm engaged in a Retrochallenge project where I'm recoding my >> classic-computers.org.nz site to make it suitable for mobile >> platforms. I >> want to modernise the code as well, making it as close to HTML5 >> standard as >> I can >> >> The RetroChallenge blog site is here. >> http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/2015-06-29-recoding-classic-comput… > > > I checked this site under WinXP and found no problems. The software > is very old, but a quick search did not locate the version. As I mentioned, I backup up my Win98SE system, then accessed all of the links under Netscape 7.2 without any problems. >> In doing this, I will probably need to say goodbye to old browser >> compatibility. As in old I mean Netscape 4 or earlier, and other >> pre-2000 >> browsers (and possibly IE 6, as it's not very standard). > > As I noted in the statistics, I am one of the VERY, VERY, VERY few > still using 32-bit Win98SE and Netscape 7.2 for e-mail and sending this > reply. While I prefer to stay with Win98SE, I may upgrade to 64-bit Win7 > so I can use a faster computer to run the emulator that I use: Ersatz-11. I understand that Netscape has been replaced by Mozilla. HOWEVER, since CHROME seems to be the most widely used, would CHROME be able to support the retention of ALL of my old e-mails and posts >from usenet? Over the past 15 years, I probably have accumulated over 100,000 e-mails and posts in about 130 folders! So I would like an easy upgrade path which supports being able to view and modify those old e-mails and usenet posts. Can CHROME support that? >> The website does have a few articles and resources of interest to >> vintage >> computer hobbyists, which I wouldn't want to make inaccessible. The >> question is, how many guys like us, those who dabble with old tech, are >> likely to use ancient browsers as their ONLY source of web content. I >> suspect not many. Should I worry about it? Any comments welcome. >> >> On a related note, I'd be interested if anyone on the list CAN'T read >> this >> page properly: >> http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/temp.html > > This link also found no problems under WinXP. > > I have not checked out either of the links under Netscape 7.2 since > any problems might be difficult to correct. After I perform a backup > of my C: drive and it will be possible to easily restore my system, I > will try them. As I mentioned, I backup up my C: drive, then accessed all of the links via Netscape 7.2 and found then all without any problems. >> It's a new blog page template I've developed using HTML5 and is mobile >> friendly. If it doesn't show up properly I'll be interested to know >> what >> browser you're using. >> >> Please be kind about the HTML5 and CCS code. I don't do this for a job, >> and it's a big learning curve for me. >> >> P.S. Here are some interesting stats. For myself, I've been a Chrome >> user >> for a number of years now. >> http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp >> >> Terry (Tez) > > Obviously, I am in the negligible category for still using Win98SE and > Netscape 7.2 along with 1280 by 1024 for my video display. However, > at least I upgraded to a flat screen monitor after both of my previous > tube monitors died a few years ago. As I mentioned above, I will access > the 3 links you provide after I backup my C: drive. I normally avoid any > links to the internet on this Win98SE system and always restore the > C: drive after I do so. If there is a link that looks interesting, I > send > an e-mail to the WinXP system and check the link there. And just in case, I did perform a restore to my C: drive again. However, under Netscape 7.2, I am able to CLEAN CACHE and that did seem to restore everything back to before I accessed the links. At the very least, all of the files that were placed into the \cache\ sub-driectory were removed and the total number of files and sub-directories reduced to the original value from before the links were accessed. I don't know if making sure that there are no extra files and sub- directories around after I use Netscape 7.2 to download my e-mail, but I use that criteria to determine if anything that should not be present has been added to the C: drive. I realize that pre-existing files could have been corrupted, but I can't monitor everything. Also, after I download the incoming e-mails, I physically disconnect the cable to the router so that any e-mails with links that could be activated to files that might cause a problem can't be completed without the internet being available. If anyone who has read this far has any comments or suggestions, they would be very much appreciated! > Under WinXP, I looked over your page on emulators. I don't know > if you consider the PDP-11 and the VAX as classic, but they were not > included. The PDP-11 has many emulators including Ersatz-11 produced > by John Wilson at dbit. The SimH emulator also supports the PDP-11 along > with the VAX and a number of other hardware platforms. > > Do you not consider the PDP-11 a classic system? I realize that most of > the software is still legally proprietary, but hobby users are allowed to > legally use early versions of the software under SimH. Mentec, who > acquired most of the frequently used software from DEC, is no longer > active with the PDP-11. The software IP seems to be with another, > but that is difficult to verify, let alone to confirm whom to contact. Terry, I have not seem any response yet. Did you see my reply? Jerome Fine

10 years, 10 months

3
2
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > Date: Wed, 08 Jul 2015 00:25:01 +0100 > From: Antonio Carlini <a.carlini at ntlworld.com> > Subject: Re: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750) > > If the intention is to avoid a huge list then excluding MicroVAXes and > VAXstations should produce a list of VAXen > that you probably cannot easily simply carry home on the bus. > > That would unfortunately exclude the VAXstation 8000, which is pretty > rare AFAIK. It would also exclude the VAXstation I, > which I imagine is also relatively rare these days. > > I don't think you can easily come up with a simple set of criteria based > on power connectors or buses or similar. > > Perhaps "too big to hug" is what you really want :-) > > Antonio > My VAXstation 8000 (Missing the E&S chassis) is too big and heavy to carry home on a bus. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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FW: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by bob＠jfcl.com

>Perhaps SDI is a typo for SBI, as in the 11/780? Yeah, exactly. Sometimes the fingers are faster than the brain :-) Synchronous Backplane Interconnect - the system bus used on the 78x and some of the 8000 machines. Bob

10 years, 10 months

2
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by bob＠jfcl.com

>Johnny Billquist bqt at update.uu.se wrote: >some of the 8000-series stuff are probably the biggest ... Not all of them. The 82xx/83xx family was just one 10-1/2" chassis for the CPU - the same physical size as a 11/730, yet they were genuine single or dual CPU BI bus VAXen. Of course, many of their brothers were quite a bit bigger. And don't forget the VAXstation-8000... Bob

10 years, 10 months

12
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cctech Digest, Vol 13, Issue 5

by clemc＠ccc.com

On Sun, Jul 5, 2015 at 1:00 PM, <cctech-request at classiccmp.org> wrote: > Having the primary CPU just stall, and have the second CPU normally just > be idle until a page fault happens on the other hand is something I can see > how it could be done. ?Indeed that is exactly how it was done on the Masscomp MC-500 and I believe the original Apollo - this was know as "Forest Baskett Mode" - who wrote up the idea in a letter/comment to one of the architecture groups in the late 1970s when the chip was first released. The primary processor is called the "executor" and the second ?is called the "fixer." The fixer is either halted or runs a small loop keeping the translation buffer (TB) full. When the TB logic detects a fault for the executor, it is put in wait state and the fixer is restarted (if ned be) and refills the TB. When it's valid the executor is allowed to come out of wait state (a very slow memory fill). When the 68010 was released we make a small change the CPU board (a couple of PALs) and allowed the executor to actually fault. But the fixer still did the TB fill. But the executor could do a task switch and run some other code, while the fill was taking place. I'm not sure if Apollo updated their original CPU board or just designed a new one with the 68010, I would have to ask some one like Les Crudele to find out for sure. And Sun never did the Forest Baskett dual 68K trick. Sun-1's with 68000 ran a V7 version of swapping Unix (originally from Unisoft) until the 68010 came out when they could support VM on the "SUN-2" and Joy et all moved BSD 4.1 to it. One other note about the MC-500. If was the first commercial Multiprocessor UNIX (predating the 386 bases symmetric boxes but a few years) as well as being the first real time UNIX box. I still have working one in my basement. It has 4 CPU boards in it with a 68010 and 68000 on each, plus a 68000 in the display processor, a number of 29000's in the FP and APP's units, more 29000 logic in the Data Acq Unit, as well as 80186 in the network processor. All in all, a pretty neat federation of processors each doing their thing. Pretty cool for early 1980s' Clem

10 years, 10 months

3
2
0 0

List Gripes

by chocolatejollis38＠gmail.com

Well, I am once again re-subscribed to this list. Why it or its moderators decide to unceremoniously unsubscribe me every few months without warning is beyond me. Especially annoying when subscription requests always take 2-3 days to process. It would be _really_ nice to do a warning message to people who haven't broken any list rules and haven't asked to be removed before dumping them, especially if this is an automatically-triggered event based on the member's lack of posting activity. Just my two cents.

10 years, 10 months

22
45
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SDK-86 Chess source code, anybody?

by rdawson16＠hotmail.com

I have the docs and the ROM images from Nigel, but not the source. I did my share of googling, nothing but a piece or two, and not the whole thing. Anybody have this? Thanks, Randy

10 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

Looking for SGI Onyx parts

by ian.finder＠gmail.com

I recently picked up a full rack ( https://instagram.com/p/4yEZlYNSxx/?taken-by=tr1nitr0n) It was an awesome project, now that I have a home where I can install 220v. Unfortunately, one of the 4x R4400 @ 150mhz boards is shot, and the System Controller is shot. I borrowed the latter from another Onyx system, but don't like leaving systems in inoperable states. Does anyone have these or other ONYX parts they'd be willing to part with or sell? Thanks! - Ian -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com

10 years, 10 months

2
2
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email gripe

by jws＠jwsss.com

On 7/7/2015 5:43 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote: > On Jul 7, 2015, at 3:43 PM, jwsmobile <jws at jwsss.com> wrote: > >> If there were a technical reason to keep it in a simple format that would be fine, but as Al K pointed out quite some time ago, Google already indexes all of this quite fine as it and most search engines do, so the list is text searchable. > There are (at least) two fallacies here: > > 1) The entire planet has 24x7 ubiquitous and effectively free internet connectivity, and > > 2) All the visually impaired have software that can cleanly, accurately, and efficiently scrape the browser results these various web search pages display, and can articulate them clearly in an alternate format. This also goes for figuring out how to use the search pages to begin with. > > --lyndon > Not sure what fallacy you see here. The list goes to a location online that is searchable. Search engines index the information from there. Near as I can tell Jay plans on it being online 24/7 and there are no blocks to search engines reading the information and including it in their indexes. Nothing about html format prevents search engines from capturing the information as accurately as text formatting. My point is, that keeping it in text format is not a requirement to make put it in a form that it can be indexed. And I pointed out that some people had warned that all of our discussions were being included in search engines <Google>, as a possible source of objection. I only included that point because the same people lobbying for text form may also be the ones who may not want list traffic in search engines, and I conceded that is a separate point. Apologies to Al for dragging his name into the thread. Not sure where your 2 points came from. thanks Jim

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by bob＠jfcl.com

>P Gebhardt p.gebhardt at ymail.com wrote: > wonder how the ratio of VAX 6000s and 7000s in enthusiasts' hands > compared of VAX 11's in terms of numbers is? I guess that /780 and > larger systems are rare, but I'd guess that there are some more /730 > and /750 around. No idea if my gut feeling reflects facts, though. I know there are several people around with the larger VAXes in storage. That's why I asked about the "working condition" - I'm sure the number of big VAXes that could be switched on, say, this afternoon, is quite a bit smaller. FWIW, most 6000 machines weren't even that big. They're smaller than a 780 by quite a bit. I don't know about a 7000 or 10000 - I never actually used one of those in real life. Bob

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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List Gripes

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Dwight, yes I think so as I am on many lists and some hate the aol address more than others do Ed# In a message dated 7/7/2015 7:29:43 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, dkelvey at hotmail.com writes: As providers get more crowded, they will have more bounces. They tend to happen at times when a lot of messages are being handled. It seems that the list parameters were set when only a few bounces happened. Times have changed. I've only been back on the list for about a week and already it has determined that my address has too many bounces. There must be a parameter that can be set to adjust the sensitivity. Dwight =

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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PDP-11/23, accessories, software, manuals and IBM portable available (South Africa)

by steve＠cosam.org

I was contacted by a chap in South Africa (Pretoria area) who has the following kit available. If interested, please reply to me directly and I'll put you in touch. * PDP-11/23, with dual RL02 drives and 9 disks * 2x VT100, one modified to VT125 * DecPrinter III * HP 70470A plotter * RSX11-M 4 with manuals * RSX11-M 3.2 (I think manuals only) * Fortran 77 with manuals * IBM portable (ca. 1982) -- Steve Maddison http://www.cosam.org/

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)

by couryhouse＠aol.com

Great idea! ? Ed# Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Christian Gauger-Cosgrove <captainkirk359 at gmail.com> Date: 07/06/2015 8:17 PM (GMT-07:00) To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Re: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750) On 6 July 2015 at 23:03, Alan Perry <aperry at snowmoose.com> wrote: > Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry?? I wouldn't mind > knowing who else out there has one and where they are now.? If you are > interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com). > Sorry for the scope creep; but perhaps it might be more useful/interesting to make it a registry of any VAX that has a name of the form "VAX-11/7xx"? (Which could also include the VAX 8600 and VAX 8650, since were originally to be called the VAX-11/790 and VAX-11/795.) Thoughts on that idea? Regards, Christian -- Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove STCKON08DS0 Contact information available upon request.

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Anyone in SE US with a working 3B2?

by alan＠alanlee.org

Anyone in the southeastern US with a working 3B2 (any series) that would let me connect my 3B2 bus analyzer to it? Thanks, -Alan Hightower

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

FS: IBM 5250 8 Bit ISA Terminal Emulator Card With Software. Also IBM AT Clone System and Other PC Things

by slandon110＠gmail.com

Clearing out some excess stuff here I have an ISA IBM 5250 Terminal Emulator Card. Comes with the DOS software on a CD. Make A Fair Offer IBM AT Clone. 640KB RAM 40MB MFM Hard Drive. Ethernet Card, set up with mTCP. 1.44 3.5 HD Drive and 5.25 HD Drive. Has ATI VGA/EGA Card as well Make A Fair Offer Toshiba Satellite 4010 CDS 32MB RAM 2GB HDD.. Has 3.5 drive, CD-ROM and Ethernet Card. Make a Fair offer Dell Dimension M233a. 32MB RAM 8GB HDD. Ethernet. This is running OpenStep 4.2 with fully supported video, networking and sound. 233Mhz Pentium MMX Processor. It runs it really nicely. Make a fair offer Everything here is 15 bucks each shipped in the USA Microsoft Systems and Development CD-ROM Circa 1994 Windows For Workgroups 3.11 Disk Set Windows NT For PowerPC, Intel, MIPS 6000, Alpha MS-DOS 6.22 Disk Set IBM Cartridge Basic for PCJr Windows 95 Original Release on CD-ROM and Floppies with Book and Key Code Thanks. eBay feedback upon request and I accept PayPal. Or if you are in Michigan and want to come pick it up you are more than welcome to come. I am in Central Michigan, North of Mount Pleasant

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY source of web content?

by terry＠webweavers.co.nz

Hi, I'm engaged in a Retrochallenge project where I'm recoding my classic-computers.org.nz site to make it suitable for mobile platforms. I want to modernise the code as well, making it as close to HTML5 standard as I can The RetroChallenge blog site is here. http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/2015-06-29-recoding-classic-comput… . In doing this, I will probably need to say goodbye to old browser compatibility. As in old I mean Netscape 4 or earlier, and other pre-2000 browsers (and possibly IE 6, as it's not very standard). The website does have a few articles and resources of interest to vintage computer hobbyists, which I wouldn't want to make inaccessible. The question is, how many guys like us, those who dabble with old tech, are likely to use ancient browsers as their ONLY source of web content. I suspect not many. Should I worry about it? Any comments welcome. On a related note, I'd be interested if anyone on the list CAN'T read this page properly: http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/temp.html It's a new blog page template I've developed using HTML5 and is mobile friendly. If it doesn't show up properly I'll be interested to know what browser you're using. Please be kind about the HTML5 and CCS code. I don't do this for a job, and it's a big learning curve for me. P.S. Here are some interesting stats. For myself, I've been a Chrome user for a number of years now. http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp Terry (Tez)

10 years, 10 months

10
13
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out-of-mainstream minis

by mark＠markesystems.com

OP (about the 68000 box) here ? thanks for all the informative comments! I did spend some time using the 68010-based Apollo workstations, and as I understood it they were equipped with two processors, one shadowing the other, because not enough information was saved to completely restart an instruction ? particularly a block transfer ? if a memory paging operation was required. Apparently the 68020 somehow fixed this problem. (The 68008, BTW, was just a 68000 with limited address space and an 8-bit data bus. It was primarily targeted at deeply embedded systems, not ?general purpose computing? applications.) Thanks for the clarification about V7 Unix not requiring demand paging; this makes complete sense, since it was never mentioned in any of the documentation I read. And yes, it it was Unix V7, not ?System 7? (sorry, it was a while ago...). Thanks for the pointer to the Convergent Technologies boxes. This wasn?t them (the case was different: it was black, and horizontal-profile), but the functionality looks very similar; they could easily have had the same motherboard or other guts. Also, I forgot to mention in my original post that there was a 5-1/4? floppy on this thing, too. ~~ Mark Moulding

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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out-of-mainstream minis

by mark＠markesystems.com

In the late 80?s, I bought from a surplus/junk shop a (by then somewhat obsolete) Unix computer, branded UniSys, I think. It had 10 serial ports; one was the primary console, one was intended for a printer, and the other 8 were regular user TTYs. The processor was a 68000 (not 010, 020, or anything else), I don?t remember how much memory, and it had an integral full-height hard drive as well (60 mB, maybe?). When I say Unix, I mean real System-7 Unix ? not Linux or any other *nix. I thought it was really a pretty neat system ? 8 (or 9) users and a printer, just perfect for a small office ? or my apartment at the time, which had a terminal or two in every room. I learned how to program in Unix on that machine, since it matched exactly the System 7 manuals I had. Sadly, time moved on, I got married, and got rid of a bunch of ?useless junk?, like that computer. Recently, I?ve been reminiscing and poking around some on the Web to try to find information about it, but it seems to have vanished completely with nary a ripple. Has anyone else stumbled across this unit, or at least have any knowledge of it? It was a black case, about the size of a standard IBM-PC, with ten serial ports on the back and not much else. I?d sure be interested to know where I might locate data about that unit, or (gasp!) possibly even an existing one... ~~ Mark Moulding

10 years, 10 months

18
33
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11/73 CPU board print set

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

So I have a couple of busted KDJ11-A cards (M8192), and it would be nice to have a FMPS to look at, if I try and get them running. (I know it's not the DCJ11 chips - I have tried them in a known good board, and they all work fine.) Does anyone know the whereabouts of one? Does one even exist? I have not found any reference to one. The KDJ11-A User's Guide (EK-KDJ1A-UG-001) does not mention one. (BTW, that UG is more like a Tech Manual - it contains a lengthy chapter with detailed description of internal circuits.) Thanks in advance (hopefully :-)! Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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My book is in print

by evan＠snarc.net

Last month I debuted the electronic version of my book, "Abacus to smartphone: The evolution of mobile and portable computers". Now it's available on old-fashioned dead trees. The best place to get it is https://www.createspace.com/5596053. The second-best place is Amazon.com. Price is the same at both sites ($19.99) but CreateSpace sends me twice the royalty that Amazon does (even though CS is owned by Amazon... weird.) The book's web site is http://www.abacustosmartphone.com.

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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PDP-12 at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

Two transistors on the front panel that turn on PC and MA lights failed. They were painful to replace. Hopefully this won't be a weekly ritual. We ran more of the LINC mode processor diagnostics. All that we could figure out with no documentation worked OK. Hopefully someone has the missing documentation that we need. We worked on the TC12 LINCtape controller problem where it had a "LGP GP=GPC PRESET" fault during diagnostics. We are not exactly sure what this part of the TC12 does, something to do with tape groups, a LINC thing. It looks like the diagnostic turns the GP=GPC flip-flop on, then presets (clears) it, then tests to see that it was preset. Most of the time it works OK, and always works OK when run in single step. We replaced the M216 module that contains the GP=GPC flip-flop, but that didn't change the behavior. One of the M222 modules in the TC12 controller routes the GP=GPC signal to the status register. The IC on the M222 that accepts this signal is a SN7453. We have seen lots of failures of this unusual IC on other restoration projects. We swapped the M222 that routes the GP=GPC signal and the diag behavior changed. Next week we will replace the SN7453 and see if that fixes this issue. It will take quite a bit of work to fix the VR14, so we will try to use an oscilloscope in X-Y mode as a display. It might even work! -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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Front Panel Update

by rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com

Hi Guys Well I'm back from holiday. I'm now sorting out what I'm calling the PDP 8/e B model panel. This has the markings for the latest type of selector switch, vertical lines between lamp groups and the line round the selector switch area. If anybody has not got an order in and wants one please let me know. I'm going through the wish lists to see whats next. Probably 8/f or 8/m One off's for old systems where there are very few examples in existance and need custom one off's please email me to discuss. Rod

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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what IBM system is this?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Simon Claessen > what IBM system is this. Now _that_ is a mainframe!! :-) :-) Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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IBM Mainframe update

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Guy Sotomayor > my IBM Multiprise 3000 S/390 mainframe. > ... > I moved the MP3000 into a more convenient location in my office Dude! If it doesn't take the whole room, it's not a _real_ mainframe! :-) Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Codex 6000 intelligent network processor ?

by jdr_use＠bluewin.ch

Is this something a classicmp'er should be interested in ? What is it anyhow ( since it seems to predate ethernet ) Jos

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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IBM Mainframe update

by ggs＠shiresoft.com

It?s been a while, so I thought I?d update folks on what?s been going on with my IBM Multiprise 3000 S/390 mainframe. I?ve updated the webpage for it at: http://www.shiresoft.com/new-shop/Shiresoft/IBM_Mainframe.html#grid <http://www.shiresoft.com/new-shop/Shiresoft/IBM_Mainframe.html#grid> to indicate it?s current status. I?ve managed to boot it up into the version of z/OS (V1R5) that was installed. I discovered that some of the standard users were still present with their default passwords so I was able to log in and do stuff under TSO. I also figured out that one of the standard users had administrative capabilities, so I?m able to fully manage z/OS and make the changes necessary to have it work in my environment and to be able to perform any administrative tasks that I might need to perform. I?ve configured the OS/2 side of things to be on my home network, so I can at lead use one of the various tn3270 programs to log in rather than having to sit as the OS/2 screen and do things. I also reconfigured my 3174 controller so that it could ?talk? to the MP3000 so I can also use my 3179 terminals to log in (which IMHO are much better than the tn3270 programs). During all of this I acquired 8 more 18GB SSA drives so I have enough for a second 72GB array with some spares. I felt really fortunate to have found these drives as they are in no way standard (524 byte sectors) and you need the special carriers to work properly in the MP3000. Not to mention that they are SSA drives! I have put the drives into the MP3000 but have yet to configure them for use. During the checkout of the drives, I discovered that the drive that had been assigned for the ?hot spare? was dead. One of my next tasks will be to assign one of the new drives as the ?hot spare?. Since I have most things working now, I moved the MP3000 into a more convenient location in my office (see picture on the above link) rather than being in the middle of the traffic area of my shop. I?m still going to be doing some ?tinkering? with z/OS before I really knuckle down to (re)learn the various aspects of MVS and TSO. Then off to write some mainframe programs! TTFN - Guy

10 years, 10 months

3
3
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TTY 33 - Finally - UPDATE

by rickb＠bensene.com

Happy Independence Day to USA readers, and good day to all others, I found out what the problem was with the tape reader on the 33ASR Teletype. This morning I had some time to do some diagnostics. It appeared that reader trip contacts that are triggered by the cycle clutch were making contact just fine (thanks for the recommendation to check this first). However, there was no sign that there was any current flowing through the contacts, and there was no sign that the reader solenoid was activating. So, I started backtracking, and found the tape reader power supply circuit board. There's a 1/2 Amp Fast-Blow fuse on the board that I tested right away. It was open. I inspected the fuse under a microscope, and there was no sign that the fuse was blown...the filament looked intact. I then found by jiggling the fuse around, it would intermittently show continuity. There was absolutely no sign that the fuse had blown due to an overcurrent condition -- it was more like the fuse had some kind of mechanical fault. So, I grabbed a 1/2 A SB fuse out of my parts bin and installed it, and powered up the Teletype. Put a tape in it (STARTREK listing from OS/8 BASIC), and started the reader. It immediately started reading the tape and printing out the program listing. Good stuff! I have subscribed to the GreenKeys list, and am waiting for approval, which probably may take a little extra time due to the holiday. I need some ribbons, paper, and a new pad for the printhead hammer, but figure I should easily be able to find pointers to sources for these on the GreenKeys list. Now to see if I can find out how to make a facsimile of the tape reader control gizmo that DEC used to allow the PDP 8 to control the paper tape reader, so I can get this terminal properly interfaced to the 8/e. In the meantime, I'm going to hook it up to the Altair 8800 for a little immediate nostalgia. Thanks to all. -Rick

10 years, 10 months

3
2
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out-of-mainstream minis

by johnwallace4＠yahoo.co.uk

For the UNIX/68k box possibly labelled Unisys, and in the absence, so far, of anything more definitive: Have a look at Convergent Technologies Miniframe. A reasonable amount of info around. The pictures at http://niki.hammler.net/wiki/Convergent_Systems_MiniFrame may be helpful - one is of a back panel with multiple serial ports and a couple of others. That website is in German but others are available in other languages, and anyway a picture speaks approximately 1K words. No guarantees, but worth a look by the sound of it. I had the mixed fortune to use one of these briefly in the mid 1980s, primarily to use troff/nroff etc for documentation generation and software testing. Real development work was done in a platform-independent manner on a VMS box before being tested on the UNIX box. The System-V-based (?) Minframe software at the time was so unproductive that most of the document production was also done on the VMS box (a VAX11/725, for goodness sake, more productive than a hip/trendy UNIX box). Write in troff/nroff using EDT on VMS, put through a simplistic translation from troff/nroff to RUNOFF, check the output, repeat till it was about right, with only the final version being generated from troff/nroff on the CT box. My recollection is that the 68K OS we had didn't do demand paging, just swapping, even though if it really did have a 68010, demand paging would have been possible (and preferable). I believe these boxes were rebadged by various other vendors; the one I had was reportedly a prototype prior to being rebadged by Gould. Maybe Unisys were doing the same. It may have been Gould's (not CT's) software. Have a lot of fun john wallace ==================================================================== Re: out-of-mainstream minis Saturday, 4 July, 2015 0:54 From: ? ? "mark at markesystems.com" <mark at markesystems.com> To: ? ? cctalk at classiccmp.org In the late 80?s, I bought from a surplus/junk shop a (by then somewhat obsolete) Unix computer, branded UniSys, I think.? It had 10 serial ports; one was the primary console, one was intended for a printer, and the other 8 were regular user TTYs.? The processor was a 68000 (not 010, 020, or anything else), I don?t remember how much memory, and it had an integral full-height hard drive as well (60 mB, maybe?). When I say Unix, I mean real System-7 Unix ? not Linux or any other *nix.? I thought it was really a pretty neat system ? 8 (or 9) users and a printer, just perfect for a small office ? or my apartment at the time, which had a terminal or two in every room.? I learned how to program in Unix on that machine, since it matched exactly the System 7 manuals I had. Sadly, time moved on, I got married, and got rid of a bunch of ?useless junk?, like that computer. Recently, I?ve been reminiscing and poking around some on the Web to try to find information about it, but it seems to have vanished completely with nary a ripple.? Has anyone else stumbled across this unit, or at least have any knowledge of it?? It was a black case, about the size of a standard IBM-PC, with ten serial ports on the back and not much else.? I?d sure be interested to know where I might locate data about that unit, or (gasp!) possibly even an existing one... ~~ Mark Moulding

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Codex 6000 intelligent network processor ?

by jdr_use＠bluewin.ch

Is this something a classicmp'er should be interested in ? What is it anyhow ( since it seems to predate ethernet ) Jos

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY source of web content?

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

>Jerome H. Fine wrote: > >Jerome H. Fine wrote: > >> >Terry Stewart wrote: >> >>> I'm engaged in a Retrochallenge project where I'm recoding my >>> classic-computers.org.nz site to make it suitable for mobile >>> platforms. I >>> want to modernise the code as well, making it as close to HTML5 >>> standard as >>> I can >>> >>> The RetroChallenge blog site is here. >>> http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/2015-06-29-recoding-classic-comput… >> >> I checked this site under WinXP and found no problems. The software >> is very old, but a quick search did not locate the version. > > As I mentioned, I backup up my Win98SE system, then accessed all > of the links under Netscape 7.2 without any problems. Sorry about the SPAM KEY being included in the Subject line. The server which handles my e-mail frequently does that and I forget to remove it from the Subject line when I reply. Jerome Fine

10 years, 10 months

5
6
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Apollo systems

by linimon＠lonesome.com

You know ... I might still have some boards pulled from an ancient Apollo in the garage that I had forgotten about. IIRC dual 68k. Is anyone still maintaining one of those machines? mcl

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

seeking advice on moving PDP 11 and related gear

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell > OK, I've done it many times, but ... I had the drives out in under 5 > minutes. It is not that hard... With a previously un-seen rack, it is _not_ guaranteed to be that easy, as Bill D and I can attest! Twice I've been up to get racks with stuff in them from him, and both times I had the same thought: 'Oh, no problem, we'll just whip the units out of the racks, and then load the resulting smaller objects.' Not so fast, kemo sabe. On both occasions there was an hour-long struggle to get things out of the rack; in both cases some of the bolts that held the slides onto the rack (removing them being the usual approach when something won't come out of the slides - detach the slides from the rack) were not all accessible without... getting the unit in the slides out. (Catch-22...) One time, we had an RK05 hang up because the front size Dzus fastener on the RK05 cover had popped out, and it was in the vertical channel of the H960 where i) we couldn't get to it, and ii) it prevented movement of more than an inch either way. The worse (worst) one was a BA11K that had one of its slides rust, and freeze. We finaly had to give up on getting that out, and load the rack with the BA11 still in it. That particular slide is _still_ frozen; my son and I finally resorted to partially disassembling the rack (one of the lowboy corporate racks) by punching out a couple of rivets, to get the BA11 out of it with the entire slide still attached; once out, we could then get the slide off the BA11. So I will echo the advice to take tools. Lots of tools. Noel

10 years, 10 months

4
3
0 0

PDP-12 at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

We are missing the documentation for many of the MAINDEC-12 diagnostics. MAINDEC-12-D0AB-PB PDP-12 CP TEST 2 MAINDEC-12-D0BA-PB INSTRUCTION TEST PART 1 MAINDEC-12-D0CB-PB PDP-12 CP TEST 3 MAINDEC-12-D0SA-PB Auto Priority Interrupt MAINDEC-12-D1AC-PB Extended Memory Control MAINDEC-12-D1BA-PB JMP SELF MAINDEC-12-D1CA-PB Address Test MAINDEC-12-D1DA-PB PDP-12 CHECKERBOARD MAINDEC-12-D1FA-PB PDP-12 BASIC MEMORY CONTROL TEST MAINDEC-12-D3EB-PB TC12-F Option Test MAINDEC-12-D8CC-PB KW12A Clock Test Anyone have the docs? -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

List Gripes

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

I get them too Jay is this because it is AOL mailbox? thanks Ed# In a message dated 7/3/2015 11:40:52 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, dj.taylor4 at comcast.net writes: I've been getting those unsubscribe messages on a regular basis, they appeared after I changed my mail from verizon to comcast. I was blaming it on comcast, gave them holy hell! But the email does get thru. On 7/3/2015 2:41 PM, Vincent Slyngstad wrote: > From: John Willis: Friday, July 03, 2015 8:52 AM >> Well, I am once again re-subscribed to this list. Why it or its >> moderators >> decide to unceremoniously unsubscribe me every few months without >> warning >> is beyond me. Especially annoying when subscription requests always take >> 2-3 days to process. It would be _really_ nice to do a warning >> message to >> people who haven't broken any list rules and haven't asked to be removed >> before dumping them, especially if this is an automatically-triggered >> event >> based on the member's lack of posting activity. > > I frequently get messages with this silliness: > > Your membership in the mailing list cctalk has been disabled due to > excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated > 01-Jan-1970. You will not get any more messages from this list until > you re-enable your membership. You will receive 3 more reminders like > this before your membership in the list is deleted. > > To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message > (leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at > > Maybe yours are being routed to a spam folder somewhere? > > Vince > > (01-Jan-1970? Really?) >

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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Have manual: "Operating Instructions for the Remington Rand Automatic Printing Calculator Model 96"

by alexeyt＠freeshell.org

It's a 32 page pamphlet, in good condition. "Revised 10-46", but does not appear to have a proper copyright. I found it recently at a used book store. I don't see it online anywhere. I am willing to scan it and/or send the physical copy to someone who needs it. $5 plus shipping to a private collector, free to a museum; museums (e.g. bitsavers) get dibs. Alexey

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

TTY 33 - Finally

by rickb＠bensene.com

Hello, all, Today I received a very nice, (mostly) operational Teletype ASR-33. It is in really stunning condition...no cracks, very little discoloring, everything is there, and the best part is that it is very clean inside, and it works great as far as I can test it in local mode, except for one thing: The paper tape reader has a problem. Put a tape in, clip down the cover (not this is all done in LOCAL mode), and press the lever to START, and the tape reads one frame, prints the character, the reader stops, and the printer acts like it is receiving a BREAK signal...just free-runs without printing anything more. Only way to stop it is to power it off, then power it back on again. I know there is the Green Keys list, but I'm not a member (though I probably should be now), but knowing the knowledge base of folks on this list, I figured I'd ask here first, and see if anyone has any ideas. The TTY came with a neat General Electric TDM-114 Acoustically Coupled Data Set. There's a cable that comes out of the terminal (it's a table top model, not a pedestal model) that has a six-pin connector that plugs into a socket on the back of the dataset. The acoustic coupler cups aren't very deep, and are a relatively hard rubber-like material, but there are little spring loaded rollers that are designed to grab onto the handset and press it securely against the coupler cups. Quite different from many of the pressure-fit acoustic couplers that I've seen. This one requires the use of on original-style Western Electric telephone...anything else won't latch into the coupler. Fortunately, I've got a few of the old Western Electric telephone sets around here so I can test it out. Not much information out there about this modem...when I get it working, I'll have to take some pix and maybe a video of it running with the terminal, and post a little video about it on YouTube. I'm wondering if perhaps TTL or (I'd never get so lucky) RS-232 signals are used for the coupler. I haven't taken the cover off the unit yet to determine if how the cable is connected into the terminal, as I'm really itching to hook this thing up to my PDP 8/e and do some "period-correct" computing. If the terminal only does current-loop, I think that I can make a cable that'll work with the serial card in the 8/e to get the terminal going (I seem to remember the serial card (can't remember the M number) can do both current loop and RS-232), but if the TTY could easily do RS-232, then it'd be a snap to hook it up. Last week I did order a nice little Black Box Current Loop to RS-232 converter, which will make things easier, but it'll be a few days before it gets here. Fortunately, the TTY also came with original Teletype technical docs, so once I get it open, I should be pretty easily able to figure things out. Along with the TTY, also came two TI Silent 700 780-series data terminals and an old TI calculator for the museum. Anyway, I'm really happy to have finally after so many years to have got my hands on a trusty old Teletype ASR-33. Happy Independence Day to all! Rick Bensene The Old Calculator Museum http://oldcalculatormuseum.com

10 years, 10 months

3
3
0 0

OT: Reading Mac Floppies

by starbase89＠gmail.com

Greetings, I know this may be OT, but can someone tell me if a modern PC (with a USB floppy drive) could read 1.44MB floppies from a 68k Mac? I want to use a Powerbook 190 for some word processing and need a means of transferring data. Thanks Joe

10 years, 10 months

3
2
0 0

list consolidation

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

FYI - in the fairly near term, I plan to get rid of the "two views of the same list" configuration on the classiccmp server. It has always created a rather large administrative burden, but also lately just has not been working right (problems subscribing, duplicate emails, a continuous stream of bounces, etc.). The list would go back to the way it used to be - one list, one view, at classiccmp at classiccmp.org. The primary reason for the "two view" paradigm was due to (at the time) some very substantial off-topicness, flamewars, etc. For a period of time I was not regularly reading the list and thus missed those things when they were occurring. For the past year or so (and it will very likely continue that way) I have been back to regularly watching/reading the list - so on my part I will do a better job monitoring the list for "outbreaks", and will email the involved parties off-list whenever (if) it starts to occur. In addition, many of the most vocal flamers are no longer here. Separately, those who are more irked by off-topicness I would ask to get slightly more familiar with the DEL key J Best, J

10 years, 10 months

5
4
0 0

AMT DAP 500/600 software available

by derschjo＠gmail.com

Hi all -- Last December I picked up an AMT DAP 600 (64x64 distributed array processor) which came with a set of manuals and QIC tapes; the manuals are on Bitsavers, the tapes were just recently (carefully) recovered by Bear and I thought I'd make them available in case anyone out there has a DAP 500 or 600 and is looking for software, since this seems to be pretty hard to come by. The archive is at: http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/dap/ (I'll be forwarding this on to Al as well so that it might someday make it onto Bitsavers). Tapes 1 and 2 are the vital ones, these include the Sun-based host software (SCSI driver, host diagnostics and tools, assemblers and FORTRAN-PLUS compiler). The rest are additional libraries (Image Processing, DSP, etc) and a few backup tapes with what look like interesting demos (I haven't tried them yet). In other news, thanks to Bear's efforts my DAP 600 is now running nicely, if you want to see a (crummy cellphone) video of it rendering the Mandelbrot set, check this out: http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/dap/mandelbrot.mp4 Thanks, Josh

10 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

BA23 Cab Kit for a Microvax 3400 (KA640)?

by rob＠bitscience.ca

Hi folks, I?ve got an empty BA23 (originally used for a 11/23 system), and a KA640 with the appropriate memory. I know that the KA640 was more commonly used in the larger BA213 cabinets, but is it reasonable to put it in the BA23? Is there a cab kit for that combination? What would it include ? just the rear panel, or was there a replacement front panel as well? If such a kit exists (in either form), does anyone have a spare they might be willing to part with? Thanks, Rob

10 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

8/e panel

by dfnr2＠yahoo.com

Rod, I received the panel, and thought I'd share with anyone on the fence, it's stunning!? It fit's my 8/m perfectly.? I think the rotary switch is has the smaller angles of the 'B' style panel, and I'm looking forward to checking those out as well. Since this one doesn't have holes for the keyswitch and selector switch, I'm wondering what the best way is to mark the spot for drilling.? At first I was thinking of making a template, but probably I can just mark and trill at the midpoint between the top and bottom marks of the selector switch; and for the keyswitch, which is not PCB mounted, and therefore a bit more flexible, just drill the center of the middle colored rectangle in the group of 3 on the left. Not being mechanically giftec, I figure I will make the mark, and do a tiny pilot drill, then cover over with painters tape before drilling the full-size holes. Any suggestions? Thanks again for the effort you have put into these beautiful panels! Dave

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

seeking advice on moving PDP 11 and related gear

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Sean Caron > I think there's a lot of good advice here Lots of good advice here; any chance we can capture it (and the rest in this thread) in a Wiki page? (Hint, hint... :-) Noel

10 years, 10 months

7
6
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seeking advice on moving PDP 11 and related gear

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Sean Caron > Anyone got a spare set of rails? It turns out the company that built rails for the 11's BITD is still in business, and still selling rails. I don't think they still make the exact model used on various -11's, but they have almost identical units. (Now, whether they have holes in the right places, I'm not sure. I was going to buy one to see if the coating on the modern ones looks to be the same thing as the old ones, but they were kind of pricy - $130 or so, IIRC - so I'm holding off at the moment.) The company is General Devices, and you can see their slides here: http://generaldevices.thomasnet.com/category/solid-bearing-slides?plpver=10 I think the model we'd want would be like the CTHS-124 or CTRS-124 or something. They don't sell retail, but they gave me the name of a dealer who will: Newark/element14 North America National Distributor 1-800-4-NEWARK (1800-263-9275) If you went this route, you'd probably have to replace both sides, but I think they big issue would be the holes. Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

out-of-mainstream minis

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Christian Gauger-Cosgrove > The other 1ESS/1AESS switch is a complete and functional unit, still in > service, last I heard. But there are plans to scrap it and put in a > modern switch in its place. Saving it would be a difficult proposition, > to say the least. I'd try to get the Smithsonian involved. This is a _very_ significant machine, of national importance, and a national institution like the Smithsonian should have one. Let me know if I can help, e.g. by getting heavy hitters like Vint Cerf involved. Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

out-of-mainstream minis

by fjkraan＠xs4all.nl

On 2015-07-02 02:36 PM, tony duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote: >> > I share your favourite(s). In the danish IT-museum-to-be (www.datamuseum.dk) we have two >> > P857-based systems running. We have lots of spare parts and nearly all documentation, so >> > if you need something, you are welcome to ask. > Unfortunately I don't own anything in that series :-(. What I have is : > > P850 in the 6U rack box. I have the CPU technical manual and user manuals for it. > > P851 in card cage with quite a bit of I/O and twin 8" floppies. I have the user manual, CPU and I/O > technical manuals and manuals for the floppy drive unit, including the CDC manual for the drives themselves > > P854 in cardcage with floppy drives and hard disk controller. Alas the X1215 hard disk was scrapped before > I got it. I have a preliminary CPU technical manual, and of course I/O boards are the same as the P851 ones. > > Quite a few spare boards including complete P851 and P854 CPU board sets, I/O, RAM, extender board, > prototyping boards (some have been used, I think I even have a brand new one), a single-chip P800 CPU, > and so on. > > The manuals I am looking for (some hope!) are : > > The full P854 CPU technical manual (the one I have does not include the microcode source, that is 'to be > supplied'). > > Information on the hard disk controller for the X1215 in the P854 chassis. This is one eurocard with > an 8X305 or something on it. I have some handwritten notes + a block diagram nothing more. > > P850 Core memory module technical manual > > P850/855 series I/O board technical manuals. > > It is possible I could get the manuals I have scanned if there is any serious interest > > -tony There are some manuals online, but those are from the software side: http://www.theoengel.nl/P800/ and http://electrickery.xs4all.nl/comp/divcomp/doc/index.html. > > > > P850 I/O board technical manuals Fred Jan

10 years, 10 months

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How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY sour...

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

the fun think about the old lunx browser is you could run it on a pc 8088 old system! I have a pc speed little laptop and used the lynx in on the road applications we had a free net here in phx and many people used it for ages... it was fun to use old machine with lynx but if I wanted to really work though out came IE explorer or netscape get the fastest machine I could get and a t1 LINE OR EVENTUALLY MY OWN CABLE AND DSL CONNECTION. Ed# In a message dated 7/2/2015 5:14:33 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, billdegnan at gmail.com writes: I have been using Mosaic on my OpenVMS system, almost unusable, but fun. It's more important in this day and age to keep up with the web publishing standards than maintain backward compatibility. Google penalizes sites that are not mobile friendly in their rankings. If you can't be found, what's the point? On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 7:24 PM, Chuck Guzis <cclist at sydex.com> wrote: > On 07/02/2015 03:26 PM, Terry Stewart wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I'm engaged in a Retrochallenge project where I'm recoding my >> classic-computers.org.nz site to make it suitable for mobile platforms. >> I >> want to modernise the code as well, making it as close to HTML5 standard >> as >> I can >> >> The RetroChallenge blog site is here. >> >> http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/2015-06-29-recoding-classic-comput… >> . >> >> In doing this, I will probably need to say goodbye to old browser >> compatibility. As in old I mean Netscape 4 or earlier, and other pre-2000 >> browsers (and possibly IE 6, as it's not very standard). >> > > I've got a couple systems with IE 6.1, but generally I go for Opera 10.64 > or thereabouts. Still very useful and not very demanding on system > resources. > > I'll let you know about your web page later. > > --Chuck > > >

10 years, 10 months

6
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How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their ONLY sour...

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

wasn't lynx before even Internet explorer 1.0? Heck if you have retro computer site make it look as old fashioned as you can then it is retro... then if people don't like it... well... you know the rest <grin> lynx might be too primitive... no screen graphics on page as you scroll make the retro site early graphical with nasty looking fonts... lots of 'under Construction signs some nasty lo res motion gifs Ed _www.amecc.org_ (http://www.amecc.org) In a message dated 7/2/2015 5:21:03 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, mouse at Rodents-Montreal.ORG writes: > Subject: Re: How many use old browsers (e.g. =< Netscape 4 or IE 6) as their > ONLY source of web content? I didn't see the original of this, probably (based on the headers) because it was sent through gmail. But, assuming the Subject: is an accurate guide to the content, I may qualify. My use of the Web falls into four categories: (1) At work, for work purposes, on work-owned and work-administered machines. This is minimal and done when the job in question has some internal tool that desn't provide any saner interface. (2) Over others' shoulders, as it were; for example, I have had people hand me palmtop comput...umm, "smart phones", displaying something I suspect was obtained as a Web page. (3) Scripted fetching of, eg, webcomic image files. (There are a handful of webcomics which I find worthwhile enough to bother setting up such scripted fetches for.) (4) lynx. So far, I haven't run into anything that I care enough about to provoke me to bother finding/building anything more elaborate than lynx for my own use. Does lynx count as "=< Netscape 4 or IE 6"? Is my sample size of one relevant for your purposes? Only you can say. :-) /~\ The ASCII Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML mouse at rodents-montreal.org / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B

10 years, 10 months

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Solstice (or Solaris) Disk Suite 4.0 software

by lbickley＠bickleywest.com

I'm looking for a copy of Solstice (or Solaris) Disk Suite 4.0 software. A bounty is available... Cheers, Lyle -- 73 AF6WS Bickley Consulting West Inc. http://bickleywest.com "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

10 years, 10 months

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seeking advice on moving PDP 11 and related gear

by lyokoboy0＠gmail.com

Ive been trying to get a pdp 11 for quite a few years now, I recently found someone selling a 11/34 with related gear in a couple of racks Here in my state of florida. I jumped at the chance and bought it, i have not found anything for sale this close to me before, yet alone in my state. The plan is to go get it all later this week. It is a 11/34 in a rack with a bunch of related Rl drives and a couple of big reel to reel tape drives. Not sure the specifics anymore, after I paid him he took down the ad, and i did not write down the details. What I want to ask is is there anything i should look out for, any precautions I can take to make sure this all gets back in one piece? Especially in relation to the RL drives, ive never dealt with any of this equipment before and am not sure what to expect. The plan is to rent a uhaul trailer and go over there in a truck, and to take everything delicately out of the racks and put it into the trailer, and to put the empty racks into the truck. Any advice that could help or prepare me for what i should expect to need to do once i get there would be much appreciated.

10 years, 10 months

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seeking advice on moving PDP 11 and related gear

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: devin davison > any precautions I can take to make sure this all gets back in one > piece? Especially in relation to the RL drives Other people have covered most of this; my additional advice is to download the RL01/RL02 manual, and read it thoroughly. It covers the process on how to open an un-powered RL0x drive (it's not obvious/trivial), and how to lock the heads for moving the drive. > From: Jerome H. Fine > make sure that a fast (emergency?) stop does not shift the load. True; stack all the stuff along the front wall of the truck enclosure, and use shipping straps, etc, liberally. Noel

10 years, 10 months

5
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Recommendations for Packers/Freighters near Fresno, CA?

by derschjo＠gmail.com

Hi all -- I have a full-height rack of computer stuff I need to get packed up and shipped from near Fresno, CA (Reedly, to be specific). I was hoping to use Craters & Freighters as I've used them before and they seem to do OK work, but they don't have a location near enough. I'm not too familiar with other options -- anyone know of anyone in that area that they'd recommend? Or maybe a long road trip is in my future. And a truck... Thanks, Josh

10 years, 10 months

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48mb NeXT slab ram up for grabs

by salgernon＠me.com

2 x 16mb 72 pin 70ns 2 x 8mb 72 pin 70ns pulled from a working next slab that I upgraded; I've no use for them, so FFFS. (Invent an acronym that doesn't involve you having to send me $.73 via paypal and send me your mailing address, or pick up in Ben Lomond, CA) Cheers, --sma

10 years, 10 months

1
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equipment available

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Some have asked if I'm just posting gear from ads I see online in my "equipment available" deals. The answer is no; I very frequently get individuals emailing me directly about systems they want to dispose of, so unless I was blind-CC'd, these equipment available deals are generally not known elsewhere (not ebay, craigslist, etc.). When I pass these deals on to someone, I don't ask anything in return. Just want to see the gear saved by an interested party. So. a new email just crossed my desk for HP fans. A service company is wanting to divest (ie. $ell) their legacy HP inventory consisting of.. . (3) HP1000 A900 2199E chassis. . (41) A900, (12) A990, and (12) E-Series PCB boards such as sequencer, memory controller and memory, data path, cache controller, interface boards (Mux, HPIB, Serial, 802.3 LAN). . Tape Drives (7979 and 7980). . Terminals (2392A, 700/94). . Disk Drives (7937XP, C2203, 670XP). I have no interest in A series machines myself. I always have an interest in spare E-series boards, so that part of it I may pursue. If anyone is interested in the rest, please contact me off-list and I'll put you directly in touch with the seller/owner. For fans of the 1000 21MX M/E/F, please note that the A-series are fairly "different" machines and not interchangeable with M/E/F boxes. Best, J

10 years, 10 months

4
4
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list consolidation

by cctalk＠beyondthepale.ie

> > FYI - in the fairly near term, I plan to get rid of the "two views of the > same list" configuration on the classiccmp server. It has always created a > rather large administrative burden, but also lately just has not been > working right (problems subscribing, duplicate emails, a continuous stream > of bounces, etc.). The list would go back to the way it used to be - one > list, one view, at classiccmp at classiccmp.org. > Excellent. Thank you Jay for providing this unique resource and for putting up with all the grief that goes with it. I've looked after a few mailing lists in a previous life but only on the technical side. It was difficult enough at times and I am well aware how hard it is to please everyone but I've never had to deal with the flamefests, feuds, off-topicness and other human issues so I can only admire your patience, tolerance and ability to achieve the seemingly impossible as a matter of routine, not to mention managing to keep the level of spam which gets through to as near to absolute zero as it gets. > > The primary reason for the "two view" paradigm was due to (at the time) some > very substantial off-topicness, flamewars, etc. For a period of time I was > not regularly reading the list and thus missed those things when they were > occurring. For the past year or so (and it will very likely continue that > way) I have been back to regularly watching/reading the list - so on my part > I will do a better job monitoring the list for "outbreaks", and will email > the involved parties off-list whenever (if) it starts to occur. In addition, > many of the most vocal flamers are no longer here. Separately, those who are > more irked by off-topicness I would ask to get slightly more familiar with > the DEL key J > I hope that we will all do our best to restrain ourselves and keep things civil and on-topic and to think carefully about whether what we are about to post will be a useful contribution to the discussion that at least a portion of the membership will be likely to be interested in reading and that we will bear in mind that some effort in presentation has only to be made once by the poster but will be greatly appreciated by the all of the many recipients when they find the conversation that much easier to follow. For me, the DEL key simply does not function as a solution to those who prefer to have write-only access to mailing lists and I tend to reach for the UNSUB key instead. Thankfully this has never been necessary here, due in no small part to the behind the scenes hard work of Jay and the list moderators. Regards, Peter Coghlan.

10 years, 10 months

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Logos and typefaces and fonts (oh, my!) [was: RE: DEC Logo]

by RichA＠LivingComputerMuseum.org

From: Dave G4UGM Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 8:43 AM >> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Toby Thain >> Sent: 30 June 2015 14:10 >> On 2015-06-30 4:44 AM, simon wrote: >>> On 29-06-15 14:56, Toby Thain wrote: >>>> On 2015-06-29 3:54 AM, simon wrote: >>>>> the front of the internal bus options maintenance manual in front of me. >>>>> But looking at the f in 8/f gives me the impression they mixed some >>>>> fonts for the logo and taking a closer look at the line: >>>>> "digital equipment corporation . maynard. massachusetts" >>>>> is proving both of us wrong. the y in maynard is a rounded version, >>>>> but both futura and avant garde hve a straight y. >>>>> "...the search continues..." >>>> Can you scan the page you're looking at? >>> tada.wav: https://hack42.nl/mediawiki/images/a/a7/Dec_footer.png >>> it is also used on the front of the pdp8/f here at our museum. > If it?s the oldest logo why do Straight Eights have a serifed font... > http://dustyoldcomputers.com/pdp8/images-3C8F62C8/R3378-hp.jpg http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/text/DEC/pdp-1/DEC.pdp_1.1960.… This early brochure for the PDP-1 features the vertical d e c logo in a picture, as well as a serif face for titles and *on the machine*. Our PDP-7 likewise has a serif face for "Digital Equipment Corporation" on its name plate, with an outline block sans-serif "PDP-7". A brief survey of the manuals for the 18-bit systems on Bitsavers shows that the change from a serif face for titles occurred during the development of the PDP-7 documentation: The preliminary edition of the User Handbook has the system name in a block serif typeface, while the release edition has the name in a block sans-serif. The PDP-6 (36-bit system) also uses the serif face; the PDP-8 is schizophrenic, and the PDP-9 et seq. use sans-serif. Note that I use the terms (type)face and logo, not "font". Until Apple bastardized the term, a _font_ was a package of metal type in a particular _typeface_, and was the unit by which type was ordered from a foundry. A _logo_ was a special item, cast as a single unit for printing, not a collection of individual pieces of type. Someone in this thread mentioned having been in the graphics design trade, and can certainly back me up on this, as well as on the fact that advertising houses and departments generally designed their own lettering for lithographic reproduction rather than using commercially available typefaces; the latter were used for printed materials consisting of large stretches of text rather than one-offs. (A company might adopt a face, or commission one, as part of the house identity, in which case the lettering done by the graphics people would probably resemble the face, but it's unlikely that it would be cast at the large sizes needed for advertising, since each size requires a set of steel punches to be engraved and a set of matrices to be produced.) Rich Rich Alderson Vintage Computing Sr. Systems Engineer Living Computer Museum 2245 1st Avenue S Seattle, WA 98134 mailto:RichA at LivingComputerMuseum.org http://www.LivingComputerMuseum.org/

10 years, 10 months

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Front Panels Personal Update

by rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com

Hi Guys I'm just about done sending first batch front panels Needless to say I have had some feed back on reqirements. As well as the variations of 8/e panels, 8/f 8/i 8/L and 8/m have been mentioned. ; Of these the 8/f seemed like a good place to start. I have the white border and DEC logo in place. When it came to the address an interesting issue arose. DEC used their own font, It can be identified like this The letter a is formed by a circle with a vertical bar on the right hand side. This font is used for titles and the like in handbooks of this period. I'm going to have go at building this font as a nornal windows font and adding it those available on windows. If anybody has aready done this I'd like to hear from them. I'm on holiday from 25-JUN-2015 to 2-JUL-2015. We go to the big Ham Radio meeting in Friedrichshafen every year. I should be able to do email but not much else Finally I am in need of the following cards for my 8/e -- M8330 - KK8E Timing board (system clock) -- M8340 \_ optional KE8E EAE board 1 -- M8341 / optional KE8E EAE board 2 xx M8310 \_ KK8E CPU control (/I already have this/) -- M8300 / KK8E CPU registers -- M837 - KM8E or MC8E extended Memory & Time Share control Can I get a basic system up without the 8340/41 and the M837? If yes then I just need the M8330 AND M8300 _Can you help bring my 8/e back to life?_ Rod Smallwood

10 years, 10 months

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list consolidation

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

ditto but I never complained as I was grateful that it existed in the first place! Ed# In a message dated 6/30/2015 6:35:05 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, healyzh at aracnet.com writes: On Jun 30, 2015, at 11:35 AM, "Jay West" <jwest at classiccmp.org> wrote: > FYI - in the fairly near term, I plan to get rid of the "two views of the > same list" configuration on the classiccmp server. And there was much rejoicing! Personally I've always hated the two list view. Zane

10 years, 10 months

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Request for web development (ccmp)

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I have a rather long list of enhancements to the classiccmp website that I'd like to make, and IANAWD (I am not a web developer). In the past I have always had one of the staff web developers here make minor changes around the edges, but my list of enhancements is now "bigger than that". Are there any experienced web developers on the list that have some free time (*chuckle*) and would like to contribute some time to the hobby? I'd rather a fellow hobbyist work on this as a labor of love than one of my web developers who really doesn't "get it". I may be able to put together a few clams to help entice. If there's any interest, please contact me off-list. Best, J

10 years, 10 months

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equipment available

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

A gentleman in Miami Springs, FL emailed me and has the following available: Two DEC H960 cabinets with headers & side panels containing the below 11/34 cpu Three RL01/RL02 drives (picture seems to show 1 rl02 and 2 rl01?s, can?t be sure) TE10W ? mag tape drive Full library of RSXM manuals Spare 11/34 cpu Spare power supply ?Many spare circuit boards, disks, and tapes? Two VT100 terminals Two LP11-VA line printers ?Single owner, known to be working? Owner is asking $600, does not want to pack/ship If interested, email me off-list and I?ll get you contact information. Please, only people that are serious about the system and are able to pick it up safely. Best, J

10 years, 10 months

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Advice Requested on Life Expectancy of a PC Windows System

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

I would appreciate some advice on both the software and the hardware life expectancy of a PC Windows System. While the hardware / software of the second and third system are almost 10 years old, I don't consider them, let alone the first system, topics for this list. But since my goal is to support running legacy software, especially including the RT-11 operating system for the PDP-11 computer, I request your indulgence. At present, I have three systems that I am running: (a) A 12 year old system that I am very pleased with that runs 32-bit Windows 98SE. I really only use it for e-mail under Netscape 7.2 and to run the DOS variant of Erstaz-11 in FULL SCREEN mode. It consists of a 0.75 GHz Pentium III with 768 MB of memory and 3 * 131 GB ATA 100 hard drives. The power supply has been replaced, but is still inadequate, so a separate PC power supply is used to run the hard drives which were also replaced about 5 years ago - the original hard drives were only 40 GB each. Note that while this system is a bit slow as compared to the next two systems (which are about 4 times faster), it really does everything I need to do. PLUS, the backups are a breeze since I use Ghost 7.0 to back up the C: hard drive in about 5 minutes every other day producing a single image file of about 1 GB. (b) A 7 year old system that my wife uses which runs 32-bit WinXP with 4 GB of memory and 2 * 500 GB SATA hard drives. The CPU is a 2.67 GHz E8400 with 2 cores and 6 MB of L2 cache, so it still runs reasonably well. My wife uses it for e-mail, watching youtube videos and google searches. The system has probably been used about 16 hours every day and turned off every night. The battery probably needs to be replaced since the boot each day needs to reset the date / time when the boot hangs at the very start, but otherwise the hardware seems OK. The software is very out of date and needs to be replaced. Note that if 7 years is not a really long time for a WinXP system (specifically the motherboard, video card and power supply) which has been used for between 20,000 and 30,000 hours, then I could upgrade this system to 64-bit Win7, double the memory to 8 GB and, if appropriate, also replace the disk drives and the power supply. The mother board, video card (which supports two monitors) and CPU would be retained. System (c) has the identical motherboard as system (b) and was considered a replacement. (c) A 7 year old system which runs 32-bit WinXP with 4 GB of memory and 3 * 1 TB SATA hard drives. The CPU is a 2.83 GHz Q9550 with 4 cores and 12 MB of L2 cache, so it runs reasonably well. The system was never used very much, probably a total of 200 to 500 hours and sat in its box for the past 4 or 5 years until I have finally been persuaded to upgrade to 64-bit Win7 and double the total RAM to 8 GB, the maximum the mother board supports. I just turned on the system yesterday and it runs correctly. My assumption at the moment is to upgrade to 64-bit Win7 and replace my wife's system. One aspect that puzzles me is that the video card, the same video card as in system (b), no longer supports two monitors (which it did and was correctly tested with 5 years ago). My first question is if a 7 years old system such a (c) would be likely to have any serious hardware problems after sitting idle for 4 to 5 years. I can't see that any current I7 CPU from Intel is likely to be much better, so why buy another system? The hardware has been used sufficiently, so infant mortality should finished. But, would a new I7 system be a sufficient improvement to justify spending the money? So I intend to replace (b) hardware and software with (c) hardware plus 4 GB of memory (for a total of 8 GB of memory) and switch to 64-bit Win7. Is this a good plan? Or is it likely that the motherboard and video card in system (b) is still sufficiently reliable after 7 years to upgrade system (b) to 64-bit Win7 and use system (c) for something else? My second question is just how thin is the ice that I am skating on for system (a)? If the answer is VERY, then I have one alternative to buying a new I7 system which would be used to run 64-bit Win7. On the other hand, if the motherboard in system (b) is not too old at 7 years and 30,000 hours, then system (c) would still be available. A lot of choices and things to consider. Jerome Fine

10 years, 10 months

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Spacewar paper has been published!

by dmonnens＠gmail.com

> > > > On page 24 of the slides, the computer should be an IBM 1130 not 1160. > Bob Ah! Thanks for pointing that out, Bob. The slides aren't used anymore outside of the presentation, but I will fix that. (I think there's one or two other errors in those slides...check the Spacewar demonstration photo!)

10 years, 10 months

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Spacewar paper has been published!

by dmonnens＠gmail.com

It gives me great pleasure to inform you that the Spacewar paper I wrote with research from Martin Goldberg and responses from many people on this list has finally been published. The paper, "Space Odyssey: The Long Journey of Spacewar from MIT to Computer Labs Around the World" is available for free on Kinephanos, a bilingual Canadian journal about film, games, and new media. The paper explores the use and distribution of Spacewar after its creation at MIT and provides a detailed look at several computer labs, including those at Harvard, University of Minnesota, University of Michigan, and of course MIT and Stanford. http://www.kinephanos.ca/2015/space-odyssey-the-long-journey-of-spacewar-fr… The paper was presented last year at the International History of Games Symposium in Montreal. The slides are available here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B22gYL7qHwW9dWMwQkNiWFlCMDA/view?usp=shari… Thank you to everyone who participated in the survey and provided help for our research. Martin and I would appreciate any feedback you have on the paper, including anything we might have missed or gotten in error and any new insights or memories you wish to share. Note we are still interested in collecting data through our survey, which anyone here is welcome to participate in. http://ataribook.com/book/spacewar-questionnaire/ Enjoy! -Devin Monnens -- Devin Monnens www.deserthat.com The sleep of Reason produces monsters.

10 years, 10 months

3
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Advice Requested on Life Expectancy of a PC Windows System

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Jerome H. Fine > just how thin is the ice that I am skating on for system (a)? > ... > if the motherboard in system (b) is not too old at 7 years and 30,000 > hours One data point for you: I have a whole flock of old HP desktops (actually, minitowers) from the late 90's (not sure of the exact date, but I _think_ they were released before Windows 98 came out) which I'm still running. (They've been upgraded with the PowerLeap iP3/T CPU insert with 1.4MHz Celerons, and Promise IDE controllers to run faster disks.) Although I laid in spare motherboards, CPU chips, etc so far the only problems I've had are that one of the iP3/T's died, and a mouse port died (easy to work around, using a USB mouse). Of course, these are HP machines, and relatively well engineered, so I can't extrapolate to other brands, but... Noel

10 years, 10 months

1
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Spacewar paper has been published!

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

>Devin Monnens wrote: >It gives me great pleasure to inform you that the Spacewar paper I wrote >with research from Martin Goldberg and responses from many people on this >list has finally been published. > >The paper, "Space Odyssey: The Long Journey of Spacewar from MIT to >Computer Labs Around the World" is available for free on Kinephanos, a >bilingual Canadian journal about film, games, and new media. The paper >explores the use and distribution of Spacewar after its creation at MIT and >provides a detailed look at several computer labs, including those at >Harvard, University of Minnesota, University of Michigan, and of course MIT >and Stanford. > >http://www.kinephanos.ca/2015/space-odyssey-the-long-journey-of-spacewar-fr… > > >The paper was presented last year at the International History of Games >Symposium in Montreal. The slides are available here: > >https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B22gYL7qHwW9dWMwQkNiWFlCMDA/view?usp=shari… > >Thank you to everyone who participated in the survey and provided help for >our research. > >Martin and I would appreciate any feedback you have on the paper, including >anything we might have missed or gotten in error and any new insights or >memories you wish to share. Note we are still interested in collecting data >through our survey, which anyone here is welcome to participate in. > >http://ataribook.com/book/spacewar-questionnaire/ > >Enjoy! > >-Devin Monnens > > Check

10 years, 10 months

1
0
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Digital featured on MST3K: Beast of Yucca Flats!

by dmonnens＠gmail.com

I never expected to see this one today: footage of Digital's Puerto Rican plant on MST3K: The Beast of Yucca Flats! The PDP-8 is featured. https://youtu.be/BRhGW53eoxY?t=26m33s -- Devin Monnens www.deserthat.com The sleep of Reason produces monsters.

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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"Computer museum seeks BBC Micro fixers"

by hilpert＠cs.ubc.ca

If you're handy with a screwdriver and soldering iron, and near TNMOC: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-33291036

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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Cray J932SE system for sale

by ethan＠757.org

Hello everyone! I have a J932SE system I am interested in selling. It has 32 CPUs and if I remember correctly 2 megawords of memory. IOS-V chassis (4x VME sparcstations that network boot from Sun Sparcstation 5 SWS that provide io path to disks.) 4x 9GB hard drives. Seagate full height with Cray firmware. The chassis exist for 24 hard drives. I have Unicos 10.0.0.1 and 10.0.0.2. Not original media. I've gotten it to the point where the SWS side comes up (those run VxWorks) then Unicos starts to boot for install then kernel panics. I haven't had a ton of time to troubleshoot it. System was located in a hackerspace in Norfolk where there was needed power but went back into climate controlled storage after we lost the space. The CPU rack is around 6' deep and 23" wide internally. Has 5 x 5000 watt Pioneer Magnetics power supplies. Uses two 30 amp 220v feeds. The Disk/IOS rack is shallower (Same depth as the smaller J916 system) and 19" wide internally. Uses a single 220v 30 amp feed. It is the peak of my computer collecting hobby, but younger generation screwed out of housing opportunities so owning stuff like this is hard when you rent and get bumped around. So looking to find it a new home and stick with the plastic computers. Note, it probably need to be on a concrete floor. It weighs 2000+ pounds. Movable with a penske truck with liftgate by removing all of the boards. Looking for around $9000. Located in Norfolk Virginia. I relocated to a better area so pick up would have to be on weekends, I can drive down to facilitate purchase. Always stored in climate controlled storage. A much better deal when compared by weight to the Altair, IMSAI and Apple I systems. ;-) Rare opportunity to pick up a rare system! Thanks. -- Ethan O'Toole

10 years, 10 months

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Fwd: unable to post to list (From Cindy at ElecPlus)

by mtapley＠swri.edu

All, forwarded from Cindy, who isn?t able to post for some reason. Any advice I should offer her for posting from her other ISP? - Mark Begin forwarded message: From: <sales at elecplus.com<mailto:sales at elecplus.com>> Subject: unable to post to list Date: June 29, 2015 at 8:42:42 AM CDT To: Mark Tapley <mtapley at swri.edu<mailto:mtapley at swri.edu>> HI Mark, I sent this email to the list admin, but apparently my emails do not get through to the list. Could you help me out please? Previously I was able to send messages to the list from my work computer, but I have closed the warehouse, and now my postings never appear. I have no clue why! Perhaps because I use a different ISP at home than I did at work? At any rate, I have pile of old stuff still to move out. Many free; a small charge for some things. Could you please post this list for me, and let me know how I can do it directly in the future? Thank you! Cindy Croxton Master Handbook of 1001 Practical Electronic Circuits, Solid State Edition, $10 + shipping Quarterdeck expanded memory manager 386, includes 5.25" floppy and 2 books, $5 + shipping Getting Started with TRS-80 BASIC For Use With Models I, III, and 4, $10 + shipping Using Super Utility+ 3.X. Super Utility 4/4P, and PowerTool, $5 + shipping Radio Shack Hard Disk System Startup TRS-80 Model 4/4P $5 + shipping Earl's Word Power for RadioShack 32K Model, III, or 4 computers, includes 5.25" disk and manual, $10 + shipping TRS-80 Data File Programming, A Self-Teaching Guide, $7 + shipping Radio Shack Introduction to Your Disk System for Model 4 Free + shipping MISOSYS Catalog 86-2 lists software for the TRS-80 Free + shipping All are in excellent condition.

10 years, 10 months

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TI 914 keyboard

by jws＠jwsss.com

I thought I'd seen a call for a keyboard for some terminal in the recent past. This one may be of interest on its own, or may be a good starting point for building up a keyboard for a system. Texas-Instruments-914-Keyboard-943632-1B-Vintage http://www.ebay.com/itm/221811058146

10 years, 10 months

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CPU for Ultra 10

by lists＠y42.org

Hello Folks, I have an Ultra 10 "Creator 3D" with everything but the CPU. I have: - case - motherboard - DIMMs - IDE CDROM - CPU daughtercard (without CPU or CPU positioner) - CPU heatsink and backing plate I need to get this system working again. Please don't ask why only the CPU (and the positioner) are missing. What is the simplest way to get this Ultra 10 running again? What CPUs are compatible, and how can I get a positioner? Or if someone has a Ultra 10 s/he'd like to sell to me, please make me an offer. cheers, Rob P.S. by "positioner" I mean the springy little plastic thing that drops into the 4 holes at each corner of the socket and causes the CPU contacts to be correctly positioned over the daughtercard contacts.

10 years, 10 months

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Difference between MBASIC51 and 52 for CP/M?

by thrashbarg＠kaput.homeunix.org

Hi list, I'm implementing my own CP/M-80 work-alike using the FAT16 file system. So far it's working nicely but there's a curious problem with Microsoft BASIC. MBASIC51.COM will load files fine, but MBASIC52.COM won't, behaving like the files are 0 bytes long. It calls the open-file routine and that's it. I'm just curious about the differences between version 5.1 and 5.2. I'm assuming I'm not returning correct information in the FCB, but I'm unable to figure out what that might be. Here's a video of it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT4dBda2CKw Cheers, Alexis K.

10 years, 10 months

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PDP-12 at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > The processor and core memory in the PDP-12 are working very well now, so > we spend some time with the TC12 LINCtape controller. The TC12 is very > intelligent compared to the more modern TC01/TC02/TC08, and the lobotomized > TD8E DECtape controllers. The TC12 designers included lots of back-doors to > make diagnostics more effective. You can even emulate the data coming from > the TU56 to see if the TC12 processes it correctly. > > The MAINDEC-12-D0GA-A Tape Quickie ran OK and just tests that the TC12 > registers can be written and read back. > > The MAINDEC-12-D3AD-D-D Tape Control Test Part 1 of 2 ran for a long time > and then displayed "LGP GP=GPC PRESET". It pointed to an M216 module that > uses the SN7474 ICs that have caused lots of trouble on other modules. It > tested OK, so we put it back in. We will consider replacing it anyway if we > see further problems. > > The MAINDEC-12-D3GA-D-D Tape Control Test Part 2 of 2 ran OK as long as > you held the MARK switch on the console down. The MARK switch on the > console allows a program to turn on the MARK Track flip-flop in the TC12. > This is not documented in the manual, but was a hand written note in the > margin. > > The MAINDEC-12-D3FB-PB Tape Data Test ran for a long time writing patterns > to tape and verifying that they were written correctly. This means that > lots of the TC12 LINCtape controller is working, as well as the TU56 tape > drive. It eventually failed when it tried to verify the block numbers. We > are not sure that the scratch LINK tape that we used is good, so that may > be a contributing factor. Maybe we can get the MARK-12 program working and > we can reformat the scratch tape. We have just a few LINC tapes and need to > image all of them before we write on them. > > Two more lights on the front panel stopped working. We tested the SN7400 > ICs that send the signal from the registers to the front panel, and they > are OK. The bulbs are OK, so the transistor that turns on the bulb probably > failed. We already replaced one for the LINC light, so we know the > procedure. > > We are getting close to the point where we will need the VR14 display > working to continue our work. Getting the display working will be quite a > project. The PVA between the CRT and the shield has degraded and is nearly > opaque. We will need to remove the outer CRT glass shield and remove the > degraded PVA. Most restorers just put double-sided tape between the shield > and the CRT so that it will have the right dimensions in the clamp. We are > considering replacing the PVA to make is safer. That will be quite a > project. > > Warren modified the current-loop to RS-232 adapter that he made so it will > run at higher speeds. We needed to remove "C1" from the W076 console module > so we could run baud rates faster than 110. After testing, it looks like > 1200 baud is the best compromise between reliability and performance. Now > we can load diags 10x faster. Very nice! > We scanned some of the PDP-12 diags, and Al put them on Bitsavers. We will scan more this week and send them to Al. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

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Austin Goodwill computer works

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Well, hopefully things will end well and things will find the highest and best use. Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/28/2015 12:04:35 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, scaron at umich.edu writes: Yeah, I figured something like this would have happened eventually; running a computer museum is pretty far out of Goodwill's charter. That is what happens when you give your old stuff to Goodwill; they sell it. Hopefully some of the cooler stuff gets back to the original owner, and there's always the proverbial "guy with deep pockets" but I would be disappointed had I been a donor or volunteer. It's sort of disappointing to see how the whole thing was handled. Best, Sean On Sat, Jun 27, 2015 at 3:01 AM, <COURYHOUSE at aol.com> wrote: > maybe someone has a copy on disc > if so lets get it > > thrift shop = computer museum? > >>???? > > > In a message dated 6/26/2015 11:58:28 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, > jws at jwsss.com writes: > > > On 6/26/2015 11:46 PM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote: > > I had a private conversation with Stephen(who started the > > nekochan thread) and he said that some things have gone back to > > donors and that they will keep some select items. The 8/s is one > > of the machines that they are keeping. > > > > I get the imprwssion that it's a rather controlled an > > responsible shutdown. > > > > /P > If they are retaining the PDP 8/S they just dumped the original history > of the restoration in the auction I posted. not so good. > > I would be open to suggestions that his is not a unique artifact, given > the appearance of the cover. But that speculation is contradicted by > the fact that the pages are all in individual slip covers. Again if the > 8/s went somewhere this should have gone with it. > > http://www.ebay.com/itm/221805321988 > > > thanks > Jim > > > >

10 years, 10 months

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Austin Goodwill computer works

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 03:01:58 -0400 > From: COURYHOUSE at aol.com > Subject: Re: Austin Goodwill computer works > > maybe someone has a copy on disc > if so lets get it > > thrift shop = computer museum? > >>???? > > When the RICM started working on their first PDP-8/S I was sent a copy of the a Word document of the Goodwill PDP-8/S Restoration Log to use as a starting point. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

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Austin Goodwill computer works

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

maybe someone has a copy on disc if so lets get it thrift shop = computer museum? >>???? In a message dated 6/26/2015 11:58:28 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, jws at jwsss.com writes: On 6/26/2015 11:46 PM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote: > I had a private conversation with Stephen(who started the > nekochan thread) and he said that some things have gone back to > donors and that they will keep some select items. The 8/s is one > of the machines that they are keeping. > > I get the imprwssion that it's a rather controlled an > responsible shutdown. > > /P If they are retaining the PDP 8/S they just dumped the original history of the restoration in the auction I posted. not so good. I would be open to suggestions that his is not a unique artifact, given the appearance of the cover. But that speculation is contradicted by the fact that the pages are all in individual slip covers. Again if the 8/s went somewhere this should have gone with it. http://www.ebay.com/itm/221805321988 thanks Jim

10 years, 10 months

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Austin Goodwill computer works

by jws＠jwsss.com

Does anyone have access to the museum that was at Austin Goodwill? It seems to be going out on ebay as we speak. Also there is a bidder for the good stuff that has vacuumed up 90% of the stuff, so I'm smelling some sort of thing going one. They have a PDP8/S and they just sold off a significant artifact related to that, which is what has me wondering. I'm going to call and see if anyone has a story that way, but wondered if anyone here has any info too. There are a lot of nice things going out which could have explanations as being recent donations, but not the 8/s artifact. It seems to be custom related to the 8/s. thanks Jim

10 years, 10 months

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VCF Midwest registration is open!

by silent700＠gmail.com

We're just about at the two-month point to the Vintage Computer Festival Midwest, so now we need to get people their tables and speaking slots. If you need one or both of those, there's a fancy(?) new form for you to fill out here: http://vcfmw.org/signup.html If you already talked to/emailed me about a table, please take a moment to fill out the form anyway. This will be a huge help in getting all of our info in one place. If you're normally on the ECCC/Commodore side, please use this form also. VCF is handling reservations for both sides of the show this year. If I don't hear from you via this form, it may be difficult or impossible to place you at the show. We have a new venue this year and (we hope) much greater attendance. This equals a less predictable room layout. Thank you and we'll see you in August! -j Some answers to recent FAQs: - Speaking topics are pretty flexible - we have generally had mostly product/software announcements and demos in the past and we'd like to diversify a bit (while still including those, of course.) Your restoration saga, tales from the computer revolution, something you're an expert on/at, personal experience in early industry or hobbyist clubs, how you're inspiring the next generation, your 'leet hardware hacks...whatever you have, let us know! - Speaking slots are generally 30 minutes long but if you have a particularly juicy topic, we can work to find extra time. - Talks will be videoed and put on YouTube, unless you ask us not to - Tables are a mix of 6' or 8' by ~30". If you have a precise amount on linear table inches in mind, let us know in the topic box and we'll get in touch and/or reserve a specific size. - Hotel rooms are still available at the block rate. Use the link on the main page. If the show rate is not shown, perhaps our block was filled. Contact me and I will get it extended, if possible (we've had to do it twice already.)

10 years, 10 months

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Nopecraft - was Re: OT: learner kits

by mtapley＠swri.edu

On Jun 19, 2015, at 10:55 PM, Toby Thain <toby at telegraphics.com.au> wrote: > On 2015-06-19 11:21 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote: >> On 19 June 2015 at 22:38, William Donzelli <wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote: >>> Let him play Minecraft. Start with simple redstone contraptions, then >>> move to command blocks. >>> >> I'm not ashamed to admit I (24 y/o) play Minecraft now and again (with >> friends on their own private servers). I'd suggest anyone serious >> about trying to get someone "into" logic and programming with >> Minecraft ... > > ... NOT do that. > > Sorry, had to be said. > > Minecraft has nothing to do with logic or electronics and would just be an unnecessarily obtuse way of approaching it. > > For an adult with too much time on their hands? Sure... > > ?Toby ?minecraft physics? is already a derogatory term around the house. And, whether I encourage it or not, he?s already into building complicated redstone sequencers. I?m hoping at least to expand his horizons into real-world projects. Minecraft computing has the asset that his ?logic? is easy to interface to the ?real? (ack, spit!) world, so that makes me realize that a stepper motor or something similar (suggested in the original thread) is a pretty good idea to add to the stack at some point. Generally speaking, I?m with you, Toby, but we are already there trying to get back?.

10 years, 10 months

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AT&T terminal keyboards?

by seefriek＠gmail.com

From: Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> >I just picked up a couple of AT&T terminals, a 730+ and a 5620 "Blit" >terminal. Some people have *all* the luck. >I read on one of the several FAQs that I can use an AT&T 4410 terminal >keyboard with the 730+. It's been a long time, but I'm pretty sure the keyboard is the same across the AT&T 600 & 700 series terminal lines. I'm pretty sure the 4410 is the same. >I've found the trove of old Blit apps, etc. and see how tortuous the >path is to get layers working, etc., Not sure if anyone has tried to build it in a decade or so, but it did at one time build on BSD 4.x. Obviously SVr3 and SVr4 are easier. No idea about Linux, but I suspect it would be painful. >but for now, I've got a couple >old terminals that are entirely unlike any of the DEC terminals >I have, so that by itself is cool. Rub it in :-) KJ

10 years, 10 months

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Austin Goodwill computer works

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

the buyer also trafficked in these areas Computers/Tablets & Networking > Vintage Computers & Mainframes 1 Seller 1 <1h Video Games & Consoles > Other Video Games & Consoles 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Keyboards & Keypads 1 Seller 1 <1h Musical Instruments & Gear > Parts & Accessories 1 Seller 1 <1h Video Games & Consoles > Video Game Consoles 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Other Vintage Computing 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Vintage Manuals & Merchandise 1 Seller 1 1d 16h Toys & Hobbies > Space Toys 1 Seller 2 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > iPods & MP3 Players 1 Seller 1 <1h Video Games & Consoles > Video Game Consoles 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Mice, Trackballs & Touchpads 1 Seller 1 <1h Toys & Hobbies > Electronic Learning Toys 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > Internet & Media Streamers 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Vintage Parts & Accessories 1 Seller 1 <1h Musical Instruments & Gear > Signal Processors/Rack Effects 1 Seller 1 <1h Health & Beauty > Other Mobility & Disability 1 Seller 1 <1h Business & Industrial > Point of Sale Equipment 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Vintage Computers & Mainframes 1 Seller 3 8h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Graphics Tablets/Boards & Pens 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Other Computer Software 1 Seller 1 <1h Computers/Tablets & Networking > Scanners 1 Seller 1 <1h Consumer Electronics > Vintage Calculators 1 Seller 1 <1h Video Games & Consoles > Controllers & Attachments In a message dated 6/26/2015 2:45:35 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, jws at jwsss.com writes: That is pretty sad to hear. The item is the notebook / diary detailing the restoration of their PDP8/s (or I think it is of theirs). Undoubtedly donated by someone who may have thought it would remain there. I suspect unless the items are going to organizations, they will show up soon on ebay. The buyer in this case showed he had done 90% of his recent business all over items from there, and if you look at their queue it is easy to see why. http://www.ebay.com/itm/221805321988 <https://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fitm%2F221805321988 &usd=2&usg=AFQjCNH-hrxHjmQnJE9doH0QtvgjGgzvmg> I just hope it's not one of the psychos on ebay that one has to deal with with a lot of items, but it probably is. I'm going to go back thru the AGCW feedback given to see what else they got, but I suspect its not a collector. Any word where such items as the PDP8/s and such stand? If the recent example of the Apple 1 donation is any indication the people that are doing the selling are probably not getting the best for their dispersion of the collection. In the Apple case 200k is way under what it probably could have fetched, and whoever got it (and probably whoever sold it) make out like banditos. thanks Jim On 6/26/2015 12:27 PM, Brendan Shanks wrote: > Yep they started selling/giving away their collection few months ago: > http://forums.nekochan.net/viewtopic.php?t=16729439 > > Brendan > > On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 11:58 AM, jwsmobile <jws at jwsss.com > <mailto:jws at jwsss.com>> wrote: > > > Does anyone have access to the museum that was at Austin Goodwill? > It seems to be going out on ebay as we speak. Also there is a > bidder for the good stuff that has vacuumed up 90% of the stuff, > so I'm smelling some sort of thing going one. > > They have a PDP8/S and they just sold off a significant artifact > related to that, which is what has me wondering. I'm going to call > and see if anyone has a story that way, but wondered if anyone > here has any info too. > > There are a lot of nice things going out which could have > explanations as being recent donations, but not the 8/s artifact. > It seems to be custom related to the 8/s. > > thanks > Jim > >

10 years, 10 months

1
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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by johnwallace4＠yahoo.co.uk

[huge snippage for brevity, apologies for rubbish formatting] I'm not 100% sure I'm right in what follows (it's been a long time) but improvements are welcome. It builds on much of what has already been said. Termination has been covered by various contributors - termination reduces (but may not completely eliminate) reflections. Reflections in a single segment setup (two boxes, one cable) are relatively simple to cope with in a setup from the Qbus era where things aren't particularly fast. In a three box (two cable) setup my recollection is that the configuration rules require the cables to be of significantly different lengths, and the reason for this is to ensure that the two sets of reflections are timed signifcantly differently and canot make Bad Things happen by arriving at the same time as each other. Consider the middle box (of 3) is driving a bus transition. Signals will propagate from the middle box to each of the ends. When the moving rope er sorry voltage transition reaches the end of the cable, it will be reflected to some extent. If the cable segments are both the same length(ish), the reflections will come back to the middle box at round about the same time, superimpose on each other, and potentially cause confusion. (Does that sound plausible?) If the cable segments are of significantly different lengths then the reflections will arrive back at the middle at significantly different times and the reflections will be more manageable - less risk of Bad Things happening when they superpose. Or something along those lines. Anyway, hopefully the "different cable lengths so the reflection timings are different" will ring a few bells even if it's not actually right. Have a lot of fun John Wallace

10 years, 10 months

2
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XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

by andy.holt＠tesco.net

>From my local paper: The last flying Vulcan bomber will be flying over the (non flying) Vulcan at Southend Airport on Sunday. It doesn't get much better than TWO Vulcans together - it's unique in fact - the Southend Vulcan bomber will be overflown by XH558 (the last flying Vulcan) in a tribute to the V-Force in a mini-flying display THIS Sunday! The local Vulcan will be open for visitors and cockpit tours all day.

10 years, 10 months

2
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Northtop Flying Wing, inflight computing

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> On 2015-06-26 12:47 AM, Robert Ollerton wrote: > Im pretty sure there is a book on this, perhaps from the Smithsonian > Air and Space Museum. As it so happens, within arm's reach of where I'm sitting I have what is probably the book you refer to: Gary R. Pape, John M. Campbell, "Northrop Flying Wings: A History of Jack Northrop's Visionary Aircraft", Shiffer, 1995 It's a large-format book on glossy paper with tons of illusrations; it covers the prototypes as well as the bombers, and in great detail. Highly recommended. > Much later, Jack was given a vip tour of the secret B2 factory and > presented with a model of the design in Lancaster CA before his death. Yes, a famous story in the aviation world. Somebody had a lot of class. The book has a picture of Jack with the B-2 design team. {Hope I got the attribution right here: I didn't get the intermediate messages, so I'm picking this out of a later reply.} >> On 2015-06-19 3:05 PM, geneb wrote: >> it's my understanding that the program was cancelled because at the >> time, the USAAF (USAF?) mandated stall testing as part of their >> development programs. Without serious flight control computers, >> stalling a flying wing just ends up in a freshly planted aluminum tree. Umm, not quite. See pp. 160-161; they did deliberately stall a YB-49 as part of the flight test program; it was pretty benign unless the CG was way aft, in which case it became a handful. The Air Force did lose one during flight testing, it is thought perhaps as the result of a spin; it is further thought that perhaps Northrop's guidance on how to handle spins in this very unusual flying device wasn't given to the test pilots - one of whom was Glen Edwards, who the Edwards AFB is named after. The book isn't clear on why the wings were dropped; it seems to have been a combination of DoD budget limitations, cost over-runs in the wing program, the loss of the two YB-49 prototypes in accidents, etc. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell >> So every other wire on the 40-conductor flat cables should be ground - >> that's even better than the classic BC11A, where almost every other >> line is, from what I can see, simply left floating (which is better >> than nothing, but not as good as grounding them, is my understanding). > I am surprised. DEC didn't waste copper like that. It's been a long > time since I worked on a BC11A, but I thought alternate wires were > grounded. Maybe a track right along the edge of the PCB where the cable > comes off (so you can't see it). You're right, the alternates are grounded (ohmmeter shows it). I cannot see how they did it; I think there must be a comb-shaped trace along the top of the card, where it's hidden once the Flexprint cable is soldered down. The intermediate ground conductor on one trace, on one end, _is_ connected to ground, so the rest could pick it up via a comb-shaped trace. >> I would have assumed that it's the _change_ from one impedance level >> to another that's the issue (you can get a reflection off the >> junction), so whether one's using long or short cables between a pair >> of M9014's, it shouldn't be _that_ big a deal (modulo propagation >> delays, which _are_ an issue with length). > Well, Unibus is terminated into 180 Ohms and 390 Ohms, isn't it? Yes. > The thevenin equivalent is thus around 123 Ohms. DEC spec for UNIBUS is 120 +/- 18 ohms. > Most ribbon cables have a characteristic impedance when used with > alternate wires grounded of around 100 Ohms (I seem to remember that is > certainly right for the twist-n-flat ones). What's the number for the regular flat? (I have a ton of the latter, but none of the twisted kind. And speaking of the twisted kind, I've always wondered what kind of machine they used to produce it - the mind reels!) By definition, regular flat must work 'OK', because DEC created these cards, and specified the use of ordinary BC05L-xx cables, so whatever its number is, it must be acceptable! :-) > That's a small mismatch, but I don't think it is going to cause big > problems. BTW, is my understanding that the issue is the _junction_ of the two different impedences, and not so much the length of the section with a different impedance, correct? (The sound-based mental model I'm using is two different diameters of pipe - going from a larger cross-section to a smaller could produce echos - aka reflections - from the junction, but after that, it should be OK.) Noel

10 years, 10 months

2
1
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cctech cctalk mail filtering algorithm

by aek＠bitsavers.org

I subscribe to both lists. From examining the mail headers, here is a mail filtering algorithm that seems to deal with duplicate posts showing up from the other group. Create a cctalk and cctech saved mail folder in this order: put msgs with "To" header of either cctalk or classiccmp into cctalk put msgs with "To" header of cctech into cctech if "To" == cctalk and "Reply-To" == cctech, delete the message if "To" == cctech and "Reply-To" == cctalk, delete the message there are a couple stragglers for the case where "To" == classiccmp but this got the bulk of the dups.

10 years, 10 months

1
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Persci 299 with unknown Persci dual S-100 cards?

by santo.nucifora＠gmail.com

Hello, I recently acquired a Persci 2142 dual disk drive with two S-100 controller cards. The 2142 is a Persci slim-line case that fits the internal Persci 299 drives but also included were to Persci S-100 cards. The only thing that makes sense is that one or both of these are the Persci 1170 controller card (set) but I have not been able to find a picture of such a card anywhere. There is an 1170 card picture at the Computer History Museum but it suspiciously looks like a Vector S-100 prototype board with components on it (and not the right amount compare to my cards). That page is here: http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102712583 I have pictures in my latest post of the front and back of both cards along with the Persci 299 drive mechanism and the complete 2142 unit. If anyone knows what a Persci 1170 controller looks like, I'd love to know if that's what I have. Is it both cards? I am assuming so because there's a marketing brochure out there with a description of the 1170 controller and the Z80 CPU, as described, is on the second card (not the main card) as is the memory. Pictures of what I have are here: http://vintagecomputer.ca/persci-drive-is-a-299-what-are-the-controller-boa… I can try to read the EPROMS on the second board (they are B2716s) but the first board has a 2708 and I've nothing that will read it. Maybe that will give a clue? I would assume that's where Persci DOS is? I will be taking the 299 drive mechanism apart and refurbishing this drive as I did the Persci 270 in my Processor Technology Helios II (big thanks to Martin Eberhard for his awesome guide and his help!). Hopefully it's close enough to the 299 that the guide will still be useful. I have yet to check if the glass gauge is intact in this drive or all of this will be for nothing. I'll do that when I take it apart. Should be a fun project. If you have any info, please let me know. It would be much appreciated. Santo

10 years, 10 months

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Northtop Flying Wing, inflight computing / was Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

by rollerton＠gmail.com

>From memory, so please forgive a mistake or two: The TB-49 Wings would Yaw (side to side motion) while in flight, sometimes just enough to make the crew seasick, sometimes enough to be dangerous when in formation with other aircraft and always unable to stay on track to be a useful bomber. I recall someone saying the yaw was several wing spans in length in each direction. The autopilots of the time couldn't dampen it fast enough let alone keep it under control. Jack Northrup and his team knew they would have to wait for something both programmable, more data inputs and faster. there were about 4 or 6 piston engined, and 4 or 6 jet engine versions. Stored on the ramp at Ontario California airport for many years and then sold for salvage, I think in the late 60s or mid 70s. Jack Northrup continued to be enthusiastic about the tail-less design even in retirement. Much later, Jack was given a vip tour of the secret B2 factory and presented with a model of the design in Lancaster CA before his death. Im pretty sure there is a book on this, perhaps from the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum. On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 2:40 PM, Brent Hilpert <hilpert at cs.ubc.ca> wrote: > On 2015-Jun-19, at 9:07 AM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote: > > > > Bringing this topic full circle, does anyone know if any minicomputers > > (DEC PDP-8s or 11s, DG Nov?, HP 21XXs, et cetera) were ever used on > > aircraft? Not transported by one, but I mean setup and used on one. > > > On 2015-Jun-19, at 12:09 PM, Toby Thain wrote: > > On 2015-06-19 3:05 PM, geneb wrote: > >> On Fri, 19 Jun 2015, Toby Thain wrote: > >>> > >>> "in 1949 the Air Force ordered all the flying wings destroyed, all > >>> the jigs and tools destroyed, every trace of the flying wing > >>> eradicated. A few years later even the engineering drawings were all > >>> destroyed by new Northrop management." > >>> > >> I don't know why they went to those lengths, but it's my understanding > >> that the program was cancelled because at the time, the USAAF (USAF?) > >> mandated stall testing as part of their development programs. Without > >> serious flight control computers, stalling a flying wing just ends up in > >> a freshly planted aluminum tree. Even WITH good computers, stalling a > >> flying wing is a Bad Idea(tm). AFAIK, the B-2 has never been stalled > >> (on purpose), even during development. > > > > Thanks. I knew there must be more to it... I wonder if the cited book > covers this angle. > > > > To tie these two lines of question together (and bring it back very much > on-topic), the BINAC (amongst the first stored-program computers, 1949) > was supplied to Northrop for research into airborne flight control (quick > web search says part of the Snark missile project), > > I'm not suggesting the BINAC and YB-49 (the flying wing) were connected, > but it's interesting they were contemporary projects both at Northrop, and > computer control was just what the flying wing needed. > >

10 years, 10 months

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AT&T terminal keyboards?

by ethan.dicks＠gmail.com

Hi, All, I just picked up a couple of AT&T terminals, a 730+ and a 5620 "Blit" terminal. The 730+ powers on, passes self-test and probably would work great if I had a keyboard for it. The 5620 lights the CRT but doesn't appear to work outside of presenting a huge green dot the size of the raster. It also lacks a keyboard. I have hopes that it's something simple like wonky internal connectors that need to be reseated (vs bad components). I read on one of the several FAQs that I can use an AT&T 4410 terminal keyboard with the 730+. The box has an 8p8c jack. Additionally, from the same source, I got a 3B1/7300 keyboard and mouse. It happens to have an 8-pin 0.1" female connector in a barbed-lock housing. Outside of the connector, the key layout is superficially the same as a picture I saw of a 730+/4410 keyboard. What I'm curious about is if they are electrically compatible - i.e., could one make an 8p8c->2x4 pin header pin swabber and have the 3B1 keyboard work on the 730+? I won't shocked if they are entirely different, but there are enough superficial similarities that I'm minded to at least ask. I've found the trove of old Blit apps, etc. and see how tortuous the path is to get layers working, etc., but for now, I've got a couple old terminals that are entirely unlike any of the DEC terminals I have, so that by itself is cool. Thanks for any deep knowledge of these guys that isn't already covered on the FAQs. -ethan

10 years, 10 months

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Imaging TRS-80/III single-sided disks

by alexandre.tabajara＠gmail.com

Dear sirs, Imagedisk is my savior, and I image all kind of disks I know with it :) But now I got a pair of TRS-80 model III single-sided disks. How do I image it using imagedisk? Can I use a double-sided floppy drive to image it? Or do I need to put the single-sided drive on my PC? Please, help! :) Thanks Alexandre --- Enviado do meu Apple IIGS (pq eu sou chique) Meu site: http://www.tabalabs.com.br Meu blog: http://tabajara-labs.blogspot.com

10 years, 10 months

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Memory options for an HP 1000 (HP 21MX / 2112A)

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

My soon to arrive HP 2112 has a 2102A memory controller and 3x 2102A cards of 8k memory each. I suppose I could add more 2102As to fill it up the 5 remaining slots and bring it up to 64k. But the recently posted IO manual says it can support way more - up to 1.28M. I'm not sure yet how the HP 1000 memory works. Can I put larger (>8k) capacity HP 1000 memory boards in there to expand memory beyond 64k? Do I need to replace the memory controller with one that matches the larger capacity cards then? Marc

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Paul Koning >> Right, but the very similar QBUS does have terminations (of a sort - >> the rules for when you need terminations on QBUS extensions are so >> complex that I don't really grok them yet) 'in the middle' > That doesn't seem likely. ... the definition of 'termination' is > something that you learn in EE 101 and are unlikely to forget. I agree with your sentiments, _but_ all I know is that if you look at, e.g. the 1982 'microcomputers and memories' handbook, pg. 251, you'l see a three-backplane system, with terminations at the start _and_ end of the first backplane (and also at the end of the third backplane). I've seen other similar diagrams elsewhere, that's merely the first one I ran across in a quick search for this post. Like I said, I cheerfully admit that I don't really fully understand what's going on there in the analog domain, but I've seen this in more than one place in the DEC QBUS multi-backplane configuration instructions. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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Transmission lines Was: UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: John Wilson > I chose the digital version of EE as my major precisely because I knew > I'd flunk Fields and Waves. Transmission lines are black magic as far > as I'm concerned! I too have a hard time with analog in general, but transmission lines I seem to be OK with. The way I think about them is to model them as pipes, and the signal as a sound (single pulse) sent down the pipe. Proper termination is like a piece of cotton at the end of the pipe, it sucks up the sound and you don't get a reflection. If you just cap off the end of the pipe (i.e. no termination), the sound bounces, and you get an echo. So if you have a small un-terminated branch, part of the pulse bounces off the end, and comes back out, and then propogates both ways, so the original pulse gets a messy trailer tacked on the back of it. Etc, etc. I dunno how accurate this model of mine is, but it seems to work OK! :-) Noel

10 years, 10 months

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organizing a trip to Cuba

by billdegnan＠gmail.com

http://millennialmainframer.com/2014/12/ibm-still-waiting-cuba-pay-mainfram… Who's up for it? B

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell > There are 3 40 pin Berg headers, one row of each appears to be ground Ah, hadn't noticed that! But then again, I hadn't looked at them closely yet! :-) Yes, they do connect to ground - all the UNIBUS ground pins are ganged together, and connected to the A-row Berg pins on all 3 connectors. So every other wire on the 40-conductor flat cables should be ground - that's even better than the classic BC11A, where almost every other line is, from what I can see, simply left floating (which is better than nothing, but not as good as grounding them, is my understanding). >> I was wondering if maybe the M9015 was an M9014 with termination >> resistors, or something (the way the QBUS versions come with and with >> termination) > I would be very surprised. Unibus is normally terminated at the ends > and not in the middle. Right, but the very similar QBUS does have terminations (of a sort - the rules for when you need terminations on QBUS extensions are so complex that I don't really grok them yet) 'in the middle', so... I just couldn't find out _anything_ about M9015's, so I was just guessing in the dark. Real data gratefully received. > From: John Wilson > I was kind of assuming that there's some impedance-matching (etc.) > problem with using ribbon cables for more than one hop. Hmm. Well, I dunno; that may be beyond my (minimal :-) level of analog expertise. I would have assumed that it's the _change_ from one impedance level to another that's the issue (you can get a reflection off the junction), so whether one's using long or short cables between a pair of M9014's, it shouldn't be _that_ big a deal (modulo propagation delays, which _are_ an issue with length). Perhaps someone else can opine? But I hope we can do fairly long runs with the 40-conductor (aka BC05L-xx), that could save us when we run out of BC11A's, if that strange Flexprint flat white cable the BC11A uses is no longer available. Noel PS: From what I can see so far (done half the pins), the M9014 and M9042 do have an identical pinout on the Berg connectors.

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Alan Perry > FYI, in my 750, the UNIBUS expansion has a L0010 in the main cabinet > and a M9014 in the expansion cabinet. > From: tony duell > If it's any help I pulled an M9014 out of the Unibus Out slot of my > 11/730. There's currently an M9302 in there. Very interesting! Thanks for the data. This seems to indicate that the M9014 could function as either end of the cable. I was wondering if maybe the M9015 was an M9014 with termination resistors, or something (the way the QBUS versions come with and with termination), so I tried to find a picture of one, but... I can't even find a picture! Has anyone even seen an M9015? >> I see 'three' different kinds of 'UNIBUS to cables' cards listed: >> M9014 UNIBUS to 3 H854s >> M9015 3 H854s to UNIBUS >> M9031 UNIBUS to 3 3M cables for 11/74 >> M9042 UNIBUS to 3 H854, Dual So I have compared an M9014 and an M9042; the former is a 'normal' height dual module, the latter is a 'short' dual module. I suspect that they have the same pinout on the Berg headers; I tried a couple of UNIBUS signals, and they led to the same pin on the Bergs on the two different units. If and when I get energetic I will make a complete pinout list for the two units (I haven't been able to find any documentation on any of them online). Some day I'll even try joining a BA11 to an -11 with a pair of M9014's, and see if it does indeed work. Also, does anyone out there with an 11/70 know what the M9031 is used for? (I.e. does your system have one/more, and if so, where are they?) Noel

10 years, 10 months

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cctalk Digest, Vol 12, Issue 5

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

Good info David. Thanks once more. ------------- "J. David Bryan" <jdbryan at acm.org> said: Subject: Re: HP 2113e Battery resistor >I might put NiMH batteries instead.... That may not be advisable, given the continuous constant-current trickle charger in the CPU power supply. The Panasonic "Nickel Metal Hydride Technical Handbook" recommends charging for no more than 10-20 hours, saying: "The overcharging of nickel-metal hydride batteries, even by trickle charging, causes a deterioration in the characteristics of the batteries. To prevent overcharging by trickle charging or any other charging method, the provision of a timer to regulate the total charging time is recommended." Panasonic's "Nickel Cadmium Batteries Technical Handbook," on the other hand, says explicitly that continuous trickle charging for Ni-Cds is a recommended charging method. -- Dave ------------

10 years, 10 months

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George!

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Great save! By the Way Evan I like the photo of that self contained Syston Donner Analogue computer in your book! Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/22/2015 1:01:29 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, evan at snarc.net writes: Here's a new picture of "George" -- aka the Philbrick analog computer that MARCH rescued two months ago. It was used at M.I.T. from 1958-1970. http://snarc.net/george.jpg

10 years, 10 months

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Strange DEC PC05 paper tape reader: doc for M705 needed

by j_hoppe＠t-online.de

Hi all, I could acquire *four* rotten PC05 Papertape Reader/Punches for PDP-11. I'm now restoring them. One of these is strange: Normally, the feed hole (between data hole 3 and 4) is used to clock in bits from the data holes. But this very special PC05 does not have a phototransistor for the feed hole, so the data clock signal must be generated by the stepper motor driver. Maybe it's a very old model: the READER CONTROL module is M705, not the usual M7050. And there's no doc for it. Does anybody has a FPMS with schematics for the M705 modul? Perhaps as part of some PDP-8 doc? Thanks, Joerg

10 years, 10 months

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1990 Era computer room

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

hp drives yes... data printer no... correct name is data products and a neat printer if you were just printing the first 20 col zone I remember something about this model banging it out at 800 or 1000 lpm at full 80 col it was 300 LPM ( This was the first formal sale our computer company had was to sell a used one of these to a consultant / programmer that did stuff on apple II systems ... I t had one bad hammer coil and he moved it to col. 80 and swapped the good one into the mid field he used the thing for years... we were to later have one of these that came in with a HP 2000 system and it served us well until replaced by a 600 LPM Data Products line printer as we wanted to print wider than 80 col. OK another odd thing - note tapes but lack of tape drives. If only we could see what was in the rest of the room! Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/22/2015 1:49:38 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, jws at jwsss.com writes: On 6/22/2015 9:16 AM, Douglas Taylor wrote: > I saw this newpaper photo on ebay, item 191606970872, where these 2 > big wigs are proudly standing in front of their computer system > looking over some printout. > > The actual computers in the picture don't look familiar to me, can > anyone ID them? > > Doug The printers look like Data Printer 80 column printers. Can't tell about the systems, but they appear to have what look like analog meters on the panels, which is interesting.

10 years, 10 months

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Front Panel Update A and B panels

by pbirkel＠gmail.com

Can anyone recommend suitable rotary switches for either the A (vertical) or B (angled) configuration? On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 7:16 PM, Rod Smallwood < rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote: > Hi Guys > I am off to Friedrichshafen for a few days and will be back > on 1-JUL-2015. > > The next two batches of front panels will be: > > 8/e Type A > > 1. Old switch position markings (1 and 6 vertical) > > 2. Line around switch Area > > 3. Vertical lines between groups of three lamps > > 4. Holes for switch shaft and lock predrilled > > > 8/e Type B > > 1. New switch position markings (1 and 6 angled) > > 2. Line around switch Area > > 3. Vertical lines between groups of three lamps > > 4. Holes for switch shaft and lock predrilled > > Price as before > > > $95.00 + $15.00 Shipping > > Rod Smallwood > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

10 years, 10 months

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Computers ... ARMY COMPUTERS! early & beastly with Friden What is it?

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Computers ARMY COMPUTERS! early & beastly with Friden What is it? I had a chance to buy these photos so I did! Be fun to find the people and talk to them! What ever this thing is I guess I need to devote a page on it! Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org/) http://www.smecc.org/teleprinters/milita1dgdddf_small.jpg http://www.smecc.org/teleprinters/milita2_small.jpg

10 years, 10 months

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PLATO Empire source?

by mouse＠Rodents-Montreal.ORG

Back in the late '70s, I played a game called -0empire- on a PLATO system hosted, IIRC, at UIUC. Reading http://www.daleske.com/plato/empire.php, the best match to my memory is Empire IV (IIRC, the 0 prefix indicates that the lesson was installed system-wide, rather than being a relatively meaningless part of the name), and http://www.daleske.com/plato/empire-control.php says, inter alia, "You are welcome to look at the source code under Open Source Commons.". However, it appears my search-fu is too weak to _find_ that source code. So my question for the collective wisdom here is, anyone know where I might be able to find it? /~\ The ASCII Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML mouse at rodents-montreal.org / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B

10 years, 10 months

3
6
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1990 Era computer room

by dj.taylor4＠comcast.net

I saw this newpaper photo on ebay, item 191606970872, where these 2 big wigs are proudly standing in front of their computer system looking over some printout. The actual computers in the picture don't look familiar to me, can anyone ID them? Doug

10 years, 10 months

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Computers ... ARMY COMPUTERS! early & beastly with Friden What is it?

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

yea know about friden.. but that tape drive and all the massive cabinets next to guy and friden??? In a message dated 6/24/2015 1:26:17 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, nico at farumdata.dk writes: Hi ED I only know Friden as the makers of the Flexowriter. It was something like a Teletype, but with many more characters. It was used heavily in the typesetting industry /Nico ----- Original Message ----- From: <COURYHOUSE at aol.com> To: <cctalk at classiccmp.org>; <General at classiccmp.org>; <Discussion at classiccmp.org>; <On-Topiccctalk at classiccmp.org> Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 10:13 AM Subject: Computers ... ARMY COMPUTERS! early & beastly with Friden What is it? > > Computers ARMY COMPUTERS! early & beastly with Friden What is it? I > had > a chance to buy these photos so I did! Be fun to find the people and > talk to them! What ever this thing is I guess I need to devote a > page on > it! Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org/) > > http://www.smecc.org/teleprinters/milita1dgdddf_small.jpg > > http://www.smecc.org/teleprinters/milita2_small.jpg -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. SPAMfighter has removed 1412 of my spam emails to date. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len Do you have a slow PC? Try a Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen

10 years, 10 months

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Printer ribbons [Was: Re: 1990 Era computer room]

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

you re ink the old ribbon... used to do that with tty ribbons.... the 14 inch line printer width...... messy but doable.... I remember having to make a dried ribbon a bit juicer one time strung it between to poles in the parkinlot and sprayed I think it was a litte wd-40 on it.... an rolled her back up! I was lucky when I had computer business... printer would come in with extra ribbons I would keep a few for shelf stock... in 13 years never had to buy any.... It was the absolute filters I always had to be buying new! only once did I get a drive with a couple extra new ones Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/24/2015 1:20:05 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, pontus at Update.UU.SE writes: On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 10:14:00PM -0700, jwsmobile wrote: > The only reference I could find that separated them are to google > for the printer ribbons. I find a lot of the companies who list > ribbons don't purge their databases of even the most ridiculously > old products, and they list models. > I just experienced the same thing with my newly found DATASAAB D16. Google turns up three worthwhile mentions and whole host of ribbon resalers. I kind of assumed that the printer ribbon was the same as something else and still awailable. Assuming I am wrong, what should I do to get a printer ribbon with fresh ink? /P

10 years, 10 months

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1990 Era computer room

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

the only one that did the hi speed reduced cols was that table top 80 col one for dataproduicts that I know of. our larger ones did not. by the way that small dataproducts also had a floor pedestal that made it a tall tower and you could open door for paper box... http://www.smecc.org/hewlett_packard/hewlet10.gif you can one of ours here.... form eons ago this photo was all stuff for parts sale we have rooms for off this stuff.... wish we have more of it left ed sharpe In a message dated 6/23/2015 10:13:56 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, jws at jwsss.com writes: Also I don't recall the Data Products ever scaling as fast by restricting columns. At least our 2230, 2260 and 2290 UC only and 96 character set printers didn't. Got the same speed regardless of the columns on those Data Products printers. They were drum, as were the Data Printers, but apparently the hammer logic vs. the line feed was not coupled as far a speeding up with fewer columns. Thanks jim

10 years, 10 months

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HP 2113e Battery resistor

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

Thanks David. My go to place for batteries is http://www.all-battery.com/. They are in the Valley, very cost effective, associated with Tenergy I believe. I receive my batteries in one or two days usually. Always had very good luck with them, and they have all possible cells in all possible grades and finishes, from cheap Chinese to premium brand name, complete with data sheets. I might put NiMH batteries instead, but they have the original format NiCd: http://www.all-battery.com/ni-cdbatteries.aspx They also have Li-Ion that I use to restore battery packs for older portables (usually doubling the capacity while I am at it). Marc ------------------------------------------- "J. David Bryan" <jdbryan at acm.org> said > Now if I can find similar cells I will be able to reconstruct the pack > inside the same shell. Ni-Cds are still available from Allied Electronics, Mouser Electronics, and others, although they are declining in availability compared to a few years ago. ------------------------------------------

10 years, 10 months

2
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[RANT]False Beeprog. AGAIN.

by alexandre.tabajara＠gmail.com

Some years ago, I wrote about a clone of the Beeprog (made by Elnec) I bought here locally in Brazil. Now, seems chinese are cloning the Beeprog PLUS (!!!) I got a Beeprog+ in the used market here in Brazil. Asked for Elnec warranty, since the programmer was manufactured in (month)11(year)2012. It all went well up to the serial number. It was made past the stop manufacture date. It stopped manufacturing in 07/2012. Seems I got another hot potato on my hand :'( Pay atention on that! --- Enviado do meu Apple IIGS (pq eu sou chique) Meu site: http://www.tabalabs.com.br Meu blog: http://tabajara-labs.blogspot.com

10 years, 10 months

15
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Megaprocessor - built from individual transistors

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

well how many transistors does our table top straight pdp-8 have?! In a message dated 6/23/2015 4:26:38 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cclist at sydex.com writes: On 06/23/2015 04:11 PM, drlegendre . wrote: > When it's done, I hope he mounts it all on a black rectangular table with > 20 shiny metal legs on each the opposing longer sides. I seem to remember that the Packard-Bell PB250 used only about 400 transistors. (Magnetostrictive delay line memory). Lotsa diodes. So not totally out of the question, even today. --Chuck

10 years, 10 months

1
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Front Panel Update A and B panels

by rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com

Hi Guys I am off to Friedrichshafen for a few days and will be back on 1-JUL-2015. The next two batches of front panels will be: 8/e Type A 1. Old switch position markings (1 and 6 vertical) 2. Line around switch Area 3. Vertical lines between groups of three lamps 4. Holes for switch shaft and lock predrilled 8/e Type B 1. New switch position markings (1 and 6 angled) 2. Line around switch Area 3. Vertical lines between groups of three lamps 4. Holes for switch shaft and lock predrilled Price as before $95.00 + $15.00 Shipping Rod Smallwood

10 years, 10 months

1
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What are the differences between the DEC RP11-C and RP11-E controllers?

by p.gebhardt＠ymail.com

Hi list, the subject sais it all: While seeking for information on the RP11-C on the web (I saved a RP03 from being scrapped 3 years ago), I came across a hint, that there was also a RP11-E controller. At least using google, there is practically not a single information/document on the RP11-E other than its existence in the past. Is the difference maybe just a different input voltage specification (110V vs. 220V)? Who knows anything on the difference between the C- and the E-type, Google doesn't? :) I'd be happy on any hints. Kind regards, Pierre ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pierre's collection of classic computers moved to: http://www.digitalheritage.de

10 years, 10 months

5
5
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[Simh] [HECnet] Announcing TCP/IP for RSX-11M-PLUS

by bqt＠softjar.se

Aw, chucks. After reading the other day about someone who was talking about VMS and the wish for DHCP, I actually decided that it was time that BQTCP/IP also got DHCP. So, without further ado - I cut a new release. One bugfix for a bug in the TCP state machine, which could get stuck, but otherwise the big reason is that DHCP is now implemented. Read the documentation, or ask me questions. The IPGEN procedure will create installation files for use with DHCP, but if you are upgrading >from a previous version, you might want to make comparisons with the new command files, and merge any new stuff in, if you want to use DHCP. If you don't care about DHCP, then nothing needs to change in the current configs. DHCP tries to be clever, and handle some different options, but there are parts that I do not use myself, that I have not tested, or sometimes implemented. In such cases you might see some messages on the console. Pass such information on to me, and I can improve things. DHCP is written in PDP-11 C. If you do not have that compiler, you will not be able to recompile the code. Sources are provided, along with a binary that runs, and do not depend on any shared libraries. The DHCP code also makes use of some functions and interfaces to the IP stack and the interface drivers that others might find useful to reference to if they are interested in doing low level stuff with TCP/IP. (Such as reading/writing interface configs and routing tables.) As usual, the distribution is available from: ftp://madame.update.uu.se/bqtcp.dsk ftp://madame.update.uu.se/bqtcp.tap ftp://ftp.update.uu.se/pub/pdp11/rsx/tcpip/tcpip.dsk The documentation is also available through ftp on Madame, or also at http://madame.update.uu.se/tcpipdoc I hope people will find this latest release useful, and my next project right now is telnet (this time really...). Johnny On 2015-06-08 19:03, Johnny Billquist wrote: > About three months since I last announced anything. There have been > various development since, and I figured I should encourage people who > are using BQTCP/IP for RSX to upgrade to the latest release. > > A short list of changes: > ICMP: > . ICMP packets accidentally lost the source IP address informaton when > returning information to a program. - Fixed. > > TCP: > . User timers on TCP sockets could erroneously stop. - Fixed. > . User timers now reset on completed reads, so that you do > not get a timeout if you are constantly completing reads. > . Sockets in Fin-Wait-2 could sometimes get stuck in that state. > - Fixed. > . If a TCP session got an RST, it could get into a bad state. - Fixed. > . Added the ability to send URGENT data in TCP. (Receive ignores any > URGENT flags.) > . Added a special I/O function to read from TCP without formatting. > > DNS: > . Improved stability of DNS client daemon code. > > FTP: > . FTP client and server performance improved. > . FTP server logging added. > . Improvements in FTP server and client for handling files with implicit > CFLF. > . Implemented primitive handling of Unix file paths implemented in FTP > server. This allows most web browsers to access FTP repositories > under RSX. > > I also did some performance testing using FTP. > > FTP from a modern Unix system of BQTCP.DSK in binary mode to both RSX > and 2.11BSD, running under simh on the same physical machine: > 2.11BSD: 210s > RSX: 141s > > From RSX (E11) to the same machines: > 2.11BSD: 240s > RSX: 137s > > I honestly do not know why transfer from RSX to 2.11BSD took longer than > from Unix, but transfer from RSX to RSX was faster compared to Unix to > RSX. I would have expected both to be slower or faster. But the numbers > are interesting, and show that the RSX TCP implementation is doing > fairly well, even through it goes through the DECnet ethernet driver, as > compared to 2.11BSD which runs TCP/IP more "native". > > As usual, the distribution is available from: > ftp://madame.update.uu.se/bqtcp.dsk > ftp://madame.update.uu.se/bqtcp.tap > ftp://ftp.update.uu.se/pub/pdp11/rsx/tcpip/tcpip.dsk > > The documentation is also available through ftp on Madame, or also at > http://madame.update.uu.se/tcpipdoc > > I hope people will find this latest release useful, and my next project > right now is telnet. > > Johnny > > On 2015-01-16 04:47, Johnny Billquist wrote: >> There have been lots of positive comments, and obviously some people >> have even tested using the software. >> >> Of course, a bug was also found. A really weird corner case with >> severely loading the network stack and having a socket in listen state >> programatically could trigger a corruption of kernel memory. >> >> So I've cut a new release with the bug fixed. >> >> While I'm at it I also realize that I forgot to mention that included in >> the distribution is also a simple IRC client as well as a simple IRC >> robot. >> >> I've also taken a little time to slightly improve the documentation, and >> the documentation is now also available directly by ftp from >> Madame.Update.UU.SE, so you do not need to get the whole distribution >> and unpack it to just read something. >> >> So - same as before. Disk image and tape image are available at >> Madame.Update.UU.SE. Use anonymous ftp. >> Disk image is also available at >> ftp://ftp.update.uu.se/pub/pdp11/rsx/tcpip. >> The disk image is a virtual RL02 disk. Can be used with any emulator, or >> also directly inside RSX if you have virtual devices available. >> >> Happy hacking. >> >> Johnny >> >> >> On 2015-01-14 00:40, Johnny Billquist wrote: >>> Well, it's been a long time project, but I'm happy to finally announce a >>> more public initial release of TCP/IP for RSX-11M-PLUS. >>> >>> This is the result of over 20 years of development. Needless to say, >>> I've been doing a lot of things over the years, and this code have been >>> through four reimplementations over the years. >>> What I now release is something that I believe is a nice and useful >>> piece of software. I am aware of the fact that most people do not use >>> these machines any longer, but if someone actually wants to talk to me >>> about support for this or other RSX software, let me know. >>> >>> Also, feel free to spread this information to anyone who might be >>> interested, anywhere. >>> >>> So - what is in this release? >>> It is a complete implementation of ARP, IP, UDP, and TCP for >>> RSX-11M-PLUS. It has been tested on RSX-11M-PLUS V4.6, but should work >>> on any V4 release. There might be some small tweaks or fixes required, >>> but nothing major. >>> It do require a system with split I/D-space, or else at least the TCP >>> part will not fit. >>> For Unibus machines, it should be possible to run without any additional >>> software except what is in a base RSX distribution. >>> For Q-bus machines, DECnet is required for ethernet networking. >>> The TCP/IP stack can co-exist with DECnet. >>> Some utilities also utilize RMS for file access. >>> >>> A bunch of tools, utilities and libraries are also included. These >>> include: >>> . IFCONFIG network configuration tool. >>> . NETSTAT network information tool. >>> . PING >>> . TRACEROUTE >>> >>> . DNS client >>> . FTP daemon >>> . FTP client >>> . HTTP server >>> . TELNET client (rudimentary) >>> . TFTP client >>> . TFTP server >>> . INET server that can do SINK, ECHO, DAYTIME, QUOTE, and IDENT >>> . NTP client >>> . LPR client that sits in the queue manager (rudimentary) >>> >>> . FORTRAN-77 library >>> . BASIC+2 library >>> . PDP-11 C library >>> >>> The implementation fulfills most of the requirements put forth in RFC >>> 1122. There are a few limitations because of restrictions in the PDP-11, >>> but none of them should really cause any problems. >>> >>> Documentation is still on the thin side, but example configs are also >>> provided, along with installation scripts. >>> >>> A bunch of test programs and example programs are also included, as well >>> as the sources of all tools and libraries. >>> >>> The TCP/IP stack itself only comes in binary form. >>> >>> All tools are also included precompiled in the distribution, so an >>> installation only have to build the stack itself for your system, and >>> then you should be ready to go. >>> >>> The API only have a slight resemblance to the Unix sockets API. However, >>> if someone sits down to write code to use TCP/IP under RSX, I'm sure >>> they will discover that it is extremely easy to use the libraries, or >>> the basic functions. >>> >>> The TCP/IP implementation is mostly written as device drivers. This also >>> have some other interesting implications, such as it is possible to >>> access TCP as a normal file. You can, for instance do something similar >>> to the Unix netcat command by issuing the MCR command: >>> >>> > PIP TI:=TC:"foo.com";4711 >>> >>> which would open a connection to foo.com, on port 4711, and any data >>> sent from that machine will be shown on the terminal. >>> >>> The resources used by TCP/IP are modest. A memory area (size selectable >>> at generation/startup) is used internally. The amount of memory in the >>> private pool limits the amount of data that can be buffered. Normal pool >>> is used in a small quantity for each TCP port that is open. >>> >>> People are welcome to play around with this, and make improvements. >>> Contributions of code is most welcome. >>> >>> There are still lots of things to do. The programs marked as rudimentary >>> should be rewritten. >>> The most obvious thing still missing is a telnet daemon, which probably >>> is my next step. >>> >>> However, the reason for now announcing the release is that it can >>> finally be distributed natively from an RSX host. >>> >>> The main locations to download the TCP/IP for RSX are: >>> >>> Madame.Update.UU.SE (anonymous ftp). >>> >>> This is one of my development systems for this software. It runs under >>> E11, and if things are down, I blame E11. :-) >>> When connected, you are already in the right directory. There is both an >>> RL02 disk image there, which can be downloaded by anyone. If you happen >>> to have an RSX system which you are conneting from, you can also try >>> getting the BQTCP.TAP tape image. Such an image will not transport >>> cleanly to a non-RSX system, however. Sorry. >>> >>> ftp.Update.UU.SE (anonymous ftp) - /pub/pdp11/rsx/tcpip >>> The disk image is normally duplicated to ftp.update.uu.se as well, so >>> the same file can be found there. >>> >>> I hope some people will find this useful/amusing. :-) >>> >>> Johnny Billquist >>> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Simh mailing list > Simh at trailing-edge.com > http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh

10 years, 10 months

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organizing a trip to Cuba

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

whenever I see video from there is to full of 50s cars! Neat! Ed# In a message dated 6/23/2015 4:24:37 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, billdegnan at gmail.com writes: I don't know, but there could be some WOW stuff there. I have to admit, the day I heard Barak Obama said the US was going to free up restrictions with Cuba I thought about the cars....and the COMPUTERS!...UNIVAC? IBM 701? Anything could be there. On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 6:46 AM, Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote: > I wonder to what Soviet equipment they would have upgraded? > > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 5:06 PM, william degnan <billdegnan at gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > http://millennialmainframer.com/2014/12/ibm-still-waiting-cuba-pay-mainfram… > > > > Who's up for it? > > > > B > > >

10 years, 10 months

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A 10-Second Trick Lowers High Blood Sugar, REVERSES High Blood Glucose-Without A Doctor!

by dr_dave＠determinationbig.com

A 10-Second Trick Lowers High Blood Sugar, REVERSES High Blood Glucose-Without A Doctor! http://www.determinationbig.com/e5d86Noe3z3NMMVKyxFMyKnnvMMhk0jmt725/little Update Preferences- http://www.determinationbig.com/form/bact86ljqeI37MMVKyxFMyKnnvMMhk0jmt5ha

10 years, 10 months

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HP 2113e Battery resistor

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

And I opened the pack up, and you are 100% right! It's just a plastic shell containing 10 big C-size cells, 3.5 A.hr each, indeed from the time period it must be NiCd! Now if I can find similar cells I will be able to reconstruct the pack inside the same shell. It will even look like the original. Thanks again. Marc ------------------------------ "J. David Bryan" <jdbryan at acm.org> said > On this machine the battery connectors are just two pronged, + and -, > so no thermistor connection apparently. That marks it as an "A-version" power supply. > I just need to find new small 12V lead batteries that fit. Note that the "A" supply used a 12 Volt nickel-cadmium battery pack (per page IXA-1 of the M/E/F-Series ERD), and the charger is a constant-current supply. The pack is not broken down in the parts list but presumably would have contained ten 1.2-Volt cells. The "B" supply used a 14 Volt lead-acid battery pack (ERD IXB-5), so seven 2.0-Volt cells, and the charger is a constant-voltage supply. If you use lead-acid batteries with the "A" power supply, you may wind up overcharging them and shortening their life. -- Dave ------------------------------

10 years, 10 months

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M68K Prog Ref Man (4th Ed)

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

I have a spare copy of this if anyone wants it (1984 edition). Noel

10 years, 10 months

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6 historic tech items that were rescued from the trash

by lbickley＠bickleywest.com

Thought this article from Infoworld would encourage all of us whose goal is rescuing vintage computers from scrap heaps: http://www.infoworld.com/article/2937725/computer-hardware/6-historic-tech-… Lyle -- Lyle Bickley Bickley Consulting West Inc. http://bickleywest.com "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

10 years, 10 months

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X11 expertise on ancient HW sought... (4-plane visual (overlay) via X-server on MS-WIndows)

by lists＠y42.org

[also posted to comp.graphics.x today] Hello Folks, I'm trying to get an application that currently uses a local display on an ancient DEC Alpha workstation with a (for the time) mid-to-high-end graphics controller (ZLX-E2) to instead use an X-server running under MS-Windows. The application is complaining that it cannot find a "4/5-bit visual". It almost certainly wants to use this visual for an overlay, as the application displays moving objects superimposed on a map. On the original hardware, xdpyinfo tells me: > [...] > supported pixmap formats: > [...] > depth 4, bits_per_pixel 8, scanline_pad 32 > [...] > screen #0: > [...] > depths (4): 8, 12, 24, 4 > [...] > number of visuals: 21 > [lots of other visuals here, but no 4-plane except for the following] > visual: > visual id: 0x36 > class: PseudoColor > depth: 4 planes > available colormap entries: 16 > red, green, blue masks: 0x0, 0x0, 0x0 > significant bits in color specification: 4 bits and "xprop -root" tells me: > [...] > SERVER_OVERLAY_VISUALS(SERVER_OVERLAY_VISUALS) = 0x36, 0x1, 0x0, 0x1 As you can see, there seems to be exactly one overlay, whose visual id (0x36) corresponds to the single 4-plane visual listed by xdpyinfo. When I use the above commands to retrieve the capabilities of the MS-Windows X-server (Exceed, in this case), xdpyinfo does not list a 4-plane visual at all. "xprop" lists lots of overlays, 24 in total, all of them 8-plane visuals. The MS-Windows box is running Windows-7 (64bit) and has a Nvidia Quadro 400 GPU. I used the "Nvidia Control Panel" to set "Enable overlay" to "on" in the "Manage 3D settings" section. Also, in the Exceed X-server configuration I enabled "OpenGL", and within that enabled "Overlay Support" and "GLX 1.3 Support". I conclude that the MS-Windows SW/HW system (X-server, MS-Win GPU driver, GPU) cannot offer 4-plane visuals. However, I don't know what system component(s) is/are the cause the problem. I have tested VcXsrv, Reflection-X, Exceed (with 3D option), X-Win32 and even the ancient DEC Pathworks X-server eXcursion with no success. I'm working on getting an evaluation copy of PTC's MKSTools X/Server. Of the X-servers I've tested, Exceed seems to offer the most configuration parameters. I'm not even sure the Quadro 400 can handle 4bpp "visuals", or whatever MS-Windows calls them. In fact, I wonder if any modern hardware offers 4bpp capability. On my Linux box with a GeForce GT 430 I don't have any 4-plane visuals, and xprop doesn't mention any overlays either. I'm somewhat confused about where overlays fit into the X scheme. I have seen lots of references to overlays in an OpenGL context, however the Alpha seems not to have any OpenGL capability: GLX is not in the list of extentions printed by xdpyinfo. Can someone clear this up for me? Am I correct to assume that the GPU must support 4bpp in order for it even to be possible for the X-server to propagate a 4-plane visual to a client? If yes, how can I determine if a GPU supports 4bpp? Nvidia is very sparing with the information in their specs for the Quadro 400 GPU. Assuming I can find a GPU that supports/offers 4bpp, does anyone know an X-server product/project that can provide 4-plane overlays? thanks, Rob

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets Was: Looking for info on National Semiconductor RAM board (VAX 11/730)

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell > a 'Unibus Out', you can plug a Unibus cable in there to link to an > expansion box. The official way involved special dual-height cards at > each end with 3 40-way Berg-type cables linking them. So I'm trying to look into this (BC11 cables being unobtainium these days, at least at prices which are less their weight in gold). I see 'three' different kinds of 'UNIBUS to cables' cards listed: M9014 UNIBUS to 3 H854s M9015 3 H854s to UNIBUS M9031 UNIBUS to 3 3M cables for 11/74 M9042 UNIBUS to 3 H854, Dual I assume the M9014/M9015 are a pair, one used at the start of the cable, and one at the end? Does anyone know the difference between these three, and is my guess about the M9014/M9015 being a pair correct? (I did look for documentation to answer these, but couldn't find any - although maybe I didn't look in the right places.) Noel

10 years, 10 months

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Tru64 LSM

by BHuntsman＠mail2.cu-portland.edu

Hi there! Anyone remember much about Tru64 + LSM? It's been a while since I've done much with Tru64, and I never used LSM before. I got some new 36GB disks and am doing a fresh install, and wanted to mirror them with LSM, as the SCSI controller is not a RAID card. Initially, the installer picked really stupid defaults, choosing to use only about 3GB of the 36GB available. I was hoping to do something like have the LSM be in total control of the disk, with all filesystems and swap being on LSM volumes. The LSM documentation says this would be called a "sliced" disk. I'm a little rusty on my disklabel specifics, but the Tru64 docs seem to suggest that the 'a' slice is usually used for the / filesystem, 'c' is the whole disk, and g or h is usually used for the LSM private data. So, my questions are: 1. Is it possible to install to and boot from an LSM sliced disk (as opposed to an LSM "simple" disk)? 2. Is it possible to have swap be on an LSM volume, or does it have to be on a slice (like dsk0b or something) 3. Is the 'a' slice strictly required for anything? 4. Would the best (or a good) way to go be to do something like a & b unused, c whole disk, g all the space except 2MB, and h 2MB for LSM data? Thanks and sorry for the stupid questions! -Ben

10 years, 10 months

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UNIBUS extension card/cable sets Was: Looking fo

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: John Wilson > I've seen M9014s only at the far end of the UBAs on a KS10, so it > wasn't taking the place of a BC11. ??? If it wasn't take the place of a BC11 (i.e. proving a path for the UNIBUS out), what was it doing? > it'd certainly be easy to make replacements for the M9014 and/or M9015. Indeed. Probably more feasible than trying to make more BC11's. Which is another aspect of my interest in these things. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

by mhs.stein＠gmail.com

----- Original Message ----- From: "William Donzelli" <wdonzelli at gmail.com> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 8:43 PM Subject: Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc >> Don't forget Cromemco: > > I think we can forget Cromemco. > > The original poster wanted examples of minis > "setup and used on one". > I doubt a Cromemco would survive long in flight > service. This is why I > also pointed out "combat service", as opposed to > being part of a test > set in an air and power conditioned hangar. > > Military aircraft (and marine) service is > *really* hard on equipment. > > -- > Will ----- Reply----- Well, regarding marine service, from one of many histories of Cromemco, e.g.: http://infolab.stanford.edu/pub/voy/museum/pictures/display/3-5-CROMEMCO.ht… "The Z-2 line was the first commercially marketed microcomputer certified for use by the U.S. Navy for use aboard ships without major modification." Memory's not what it used to be and I could be misremembering, but I'm pretty certain that some Z-2s were installed in military aircraft for data collection (admittedly not in combat service); ISTR one of those appearing on eBay a few years ago, bristling with many-conductor cables and military-style Cannon connectors. I'll dig through the literature to see if I can find an official reference. m.

10 years, 10 months

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HP 2113e Battery resistor

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

Thanks a lot for the detailed answer Glen. I have looked in more detail into my machine and its rear connectors. It's a 21MX (2112A), and it has two battery holders at the back. The old batteries even came with it (!). On this machine the battery connectors are just two pronged, + and -, so no thermistor connection apparently. At first glance I thought two other 9 pin connectors were similar to the ones you described and needed to be wired up with the thermistors. But they apparently are totally different things, labeled POWER CONT IN and POWER CONT OUT. After a bit of bitsaver hunting, I gather these are for power control interconnection with optional I/O racks extensions. So I think I am thermistor free. I just need to find new small 12V lead batteries that fit. They are an odd "construction brick" form factor, standard modern gel batteries are too tall. Marc ------------------------------ Glen Slick <glen.slick at gmail.com> said: Subject: Re: HP 2113e Battery resistor I have only looked at the "B" version of the power supply as that is what I have in my 2117F. (Now that I think of it I'm not sure what version of the power supply I have in my 2113B). The details for that are covered in the 5061-1356 section of the 92851-90001_Jun79_9.pdf manual referenced below starting on page 84 of the PDF. As described in section 3-9 on page 105 of the PDF the Power Fail Recovery System (PFRS) option consists of the Battery Charger Board (A3A3) and the Battery Backup Board (A3A4) which are mounted internally in the power supply, and the external mounted Battery/Status Assembly. If the PFRS option is not present the Jumper Board (A3A4) is installed internally in the power supply instead of the Battery Charger Board (A3A3) and the Battery Backup Board (A3A4). If you open up your system far enough to remove the lid on the power supply you can visually inspect the installed boards to determine whether or not the PFRS option is installed in the power supply. The battery pack over-temperature thermistor is integrated into the battery pack. It ends up being connected to the TEMP1 and TEMP2 signals shown on the Battery Charger Board (A3A3) schematic Sheet 6 on page 136 of the PDF. If the PFRS option is not installed the Battery Charger Board (A3A3) is not present and there is nothing that would connect to the battery pack thermistor so it is not necessary for the operation of the power supply. If the PFRS option is installed but the thermistor or resistor equivalent is not connected the CPU will power on but will not be functional. I think all of the front panel lights turn on and none of the switches have any effect. It's been a long time since I looked at that in detail to figure out what was going on. I think some of the voltages are at the correct level, but maybe the memory voltages are not, and some of the power supply status signals (PSU?, PON?) indicate the power supply is not ready and that holds the system in the inactive state. -Glen ------------------------------

10 years, 10 months

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PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

The LINK indicator light on the front panel of the PDP-12 failed two weeks ago. The indicator light bulb failed, briefly shorted, and destroyed the transistor that turns the indicator on. An new transistor and bulb, and all is well. We have been chasing a transient problem in the PDP-12 core memory for a few weeks. We checked the timing last week, and it was OK. This time we checked the core voltage and it was a little low. We increased the core memory power supply voltage until the checkerboard starting working without errors. Next time we will explore the high and low limits of the core voltage to find a reasonable center voltage for both core stacks. The next step is to run all of the processor diagnostics and make sure that everything is works. If the diags run OK, it is time to fix the TU56 tape drive and see if the drive and controller work. We visited the RCS/RI crew today to look at their LINC-8 and both PDP-12s. Both PDP-12s are earlier than ours. One has floating-point and an RK05. The other has a really interesting RAM buffered AD converter. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 10 months

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Place for a build log?

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

>> And I have not found the equivalent of our "Builder Logs Thread" on the >> Vintage Computer Forums which I just "discovered". >Maybe Erik would consider adding a category on VCF for build logs? That's a good suggestion. On the R2 group, the Builders Log section was actually added after I suggested it. It is now the most viewed section. But on VCF (that's how you call it?), I think I am way too new to make such a proposal and have it taken seriously... And I don't have yet a good sense of the VCF constituents and interests to understand if this proposal would have any traction either. Someone else would have to ask for me... Where do people that do "heavy duty" or longer lived restoration projects (mainframes, minis, pre-1970 machines) gather on the web? Here I guess :-)?

10 years, 10 months

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Looking for info on National Semiconductor RAM board (VAX 11/730)

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

I am looking for any information on a National Semiconductor RAM board that I think goes in a VAX 11/730. My 11/730 (which admittedly I have not run) has 2 DEC MS730 boards and 2 of these NatSemi boards, I found another one while unpacking stuff today. It's a hex height DEC-type board with the ejector handles. Connections to fingers on A and B as you might expect, also the grant continuity strapping on C and D, grounds on D (only) and a couple of signals on C (I've not figured out what yet). The only identification I can find on it is in the etch : PWB 551109464-002 B PWA 980109464 (I assume the first is the part number for the bare PCB, the second for the stuffed board) There seems to be one RAM too many!. The main RAM array is 4 rows each of 32 4164-like DRAMs. There is a second block of 28 such DRAMs, presumably 7 bits for each row of the main array to provide the ECC bits. And then a further single RAM off to one side. The DEC MS730 doesn't seem to have this, and I wonder what on earth it is for. Rest of the board is TTL drivers, etc. There are 2 LEDs, one green, one yellow. And a momentary pushbutton switch. I have no idea of the functions of those. Does anyone recognise this board? A related point, I am thinking of removing the TSU05 from my 11/730 and putting an expansion box in place of the tape drive in the rack. In which case I can install this memory board. Is 5MBytes (the maximum an 11/730 can take) worth having over 4MBytes? -tony

10 years, 10 months

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Place for a build log?

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

I like to do build logs for my more complex and long lived restorations or builds, so people can inspire themselves from what I do, and give advice (and encouragement, that helps too!). In one of my many other hobbies (hum, R2-D2 robot replica building, yes, there is such a thing), everyone puts their build log as a thread on a Forum. Very easy to search and follow. Members of the forum also have a place to store files. The best build logs get a lot of hits. Do you have an equivalent for classic computer restorations? I see some people have their own blog on regular blog sites. But I dislike the format - it's posted reverse latest first, you can only see the latest posts at once. Not anywhere as good as a thread. Or people have their own website, which is a bit of a pain as you have to discover them one by one - and spend time making a web site. And I have not found the equivalent of our "Builder Logs Thread" on the Vintage Computer Forums which I just "discovered". Any other/better/smarter solutions you can point me to? - Marc

10 years, 10 months

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Components Data Books

by radiotest＠juno.com

At 12:30 PM 6/16/2015, Mattis Lind wrote: >I have compiled a list of them, mostly for my self, so that I somewhat easier would find what I look for. That is a nice list, and includes many that are not among my ~80 (which does not include my ~60 vacuum tube manuals). Could you post the original spreadsheet somewhere? It would be a reference that would be much easier to use than the online version. Dale H. Cook, Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA Osborne 1 / Kaypro 4-84 / Kaypro 1 / Amstrad PPC-640 http://plymouthcolony.net/starcity/radios/index.html

10 years, 10 months

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Front Panel Tech Note 5 - Options

by rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com

Hi Guys The combination of shipments going out and resposes to the survay (thanks everybody) have shown up some diffences between 8/e's. The first and most important one is the change of markings for the selector switch where they must have changed switch type at some point. Its the case that you will have one or the other. I can get another screen made up with the angled markings at switch positions 1 and 6. When you order you can then specify which one you require. The other two are cosmetic and have no impact on operation. Firstly there is sometimes a line around the area where the selector switch is located. Secondly vertical lines dividing up the lamps into groups of three are sometimes present. I can't yet work out if there's any pattern to where they do and dont appear. (not enough data) The easiest way to fix this is to either add the markings to all the panels or none of them. Comments please.... Rod

10 years, 10 months

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HP 2113e Battery resistor

by marc.verdiell＠gmail.com

Ah thanks, this is what these are for, thermistors. They are supposed to monitor the temperature somewhere I suppose? Attached to the batteries? The power supplies? The computer won't start without these I understand? Sorry I am a bit of a newbee with HP 1000's. Have not tried to power mine quite yet. Marc >Glen Slick <glen.slick at gmail.com> said >The Temperature Sense Thermistor RT1, normaly 815 ohms, is wired >across the two outside pins of the middle row, pins 4 and 6. >http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/hp/1000/1000_MEF_EngrRef/92851-90001_Jun79_9.p df >Description page 111 >Schematic page 168

10 years, 10 months

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Need DZQ11 (M3106) Print Set

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

{Re-send, since apparently a lot of mail to CCTalk yesterday went into the bit bucket...} I guess I've struck out here? That's such bad luck; other things, there are multiple copies out there, but apparently none at all of this one... Oh well, I guess I'll start with the DZQ11 TM, and with an ohm-meter try and trace out the initialization circuitry (which is clearly broken) at least. Noel

10 years, 10 months

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Wright Line punch manual

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Yes, that is the one we have here at the museum! yea pretty easy ( compared to a teletype) but we just like to have manuals or copies of them for everything we have here in the various collection areas. Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/20/2015 9:39:45 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, tony.aiuto at gmail.com writes: Like this one? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wright-Punch-Model-2600-/331580084313 I'm not sure it really needs a manual. I repaired one with a careful disassemble and cleaning. On mine, the cord linking the tension spring to the mechanism had broken. A trip to the hardware store found something similar. It took a few tries to get the right length and tension, but it works now. On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 8:27 PM, Dennis Boone <drb at msu.edu> wrote: > Does anyone have routine maintenance information (e.g. user or service > manuals) for the Wright Line manual punches? My newly acquired unit > seems to need a little lubrication. I'll guess if I have to, but... > > This is the variety with the large grey wheel on the side to select the > desired character, and a sort of "wheelhouse" in the middle to hide the > cams, ribbon mechanism, etc. There's no model number sticker on it. > > Thanks! > > De >

10 years, 10 months

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OT: learner kits (was: Re: using new technology on old machines)

by nf6x＠nf6x.net

> On Jun 19, 2015, at 19:19 , Tapley, Mark <mtapley at swri.edu> wrote: > He has a Raspberry Pi, which he pretty much contempts in favor of his laptop, which will play the modern version of MineCraft :-P, but presumably hooking those together might be fun. I suspect that boards like the Raspberry Pi, Arduino, etc. might get a lot more interesting if they can affect the real world. See if a servo motor adds some appeal. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net> http://www.nf6x.net/

10 years, 10 months

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Wright Line punch manual

by tony.aiuto＠gmail.com

Like this one? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wright-Punch-Model-2600-/331580084313 I'm not sure it really needs a manual. I repaired one with a careful disassemble and cleaning. On mine, the cord linking the tension spring to the mechanism had broken. A trip to the hardware store found something similar. It took a few tries to get the right length and tension, but it works now. On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 8:27 PM, Dennis Boone <drb at msu.edu> wrote: > Does anyone have routine maintenance information (e.g. user or service > manuals) for the Wright Line manual punches? My newly acquired unit > seems to need a little lubrication. I'll guess if I have to, but... > > This is the variety with the large grey wheel on the side to select the > desired character, and a sort of "wheelhouse" in the middle to hide the > cams, ribbon mechanism, etc. There's no model number sticker on it. > > Thanks! > > De >

10 years, 10 months

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OT: learner kits (was: Re: using new technology on old machines)

by mouse＠Rodents-Montreal.ORG

> Is there a reason to prefer 7400 series over CD4000 series logic? If you can find real TTL, yes, I would say so. It's less static-sensitive and it's more tolerant to things like hooking two outputs together by mistake. But note that there are many chips that have more or less TTL interfaces (TTL voltages, TTLish numbers, and in some cases switching thresholds) but are actually CMOS - the 74ALS series comes to mind. Of course, if someone somehow builds CMOS chips with TTL's ESD tolerance, short-circuit tolerance, etc, then great. But that's not what I've seen. /~\ The ASCII Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML mouse at rodents-montreal.org / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B

10 years, 10 months

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Intel ipsc/860 [QIC tapes recover]

by plamenspam＠afterpeople.com

I managed to rescue few tapes containg installation sw+c compilers, fortran and forge. While I was trying to make a backup all cartriges broke st some stage due to too old belts. The magnetic tape of 2 of 4 cartriges seems ok. So I'm looking for somone within EU who has experience in this to try to save whatever is possible. Regards, Plamen

10 years, 10 months

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OT: learner kits

by jws＠jwsss.com

On 6/19/2015 8:21 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote: > On 19 June 2015 at 22:38, William Donzelli<wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote: >> >Let him play Minecraft. Start with simple redstone contraptions, then >> >move to command blocks. >> > > I'm not ashamed to admit I (24 y/o) play Minecraft now and again (with > friends on their own private servers). When I visited ALR, a company in Irvine that evolved into making PC type servers and were absorbed into Gateway (name still is used) had a lab with a lot of hardware stations, and for the time good networking. At about noon or so one one of my visits for Sun Microsystems, about a dozen of the engineers showed up and proceeded to pull out hardware and cables, and displays at various stations and hooked them all up pretty quickly. This was in about 92 or 93, I'd guess. They converted the lab into a big Doom game for about an hour. I also found out the best time to round up and have casual consultations with them about things I wondered about with some systems. Thanks jim

10 years, 10 months

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RK06 alignment pack

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Anyone need an RK06 alignment pack: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Equipment-RK06-Aglinment-pack-/221803433215 Seems like something that should definitely get saved! Noel

10 years, 11 months

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Documation card readers for sale

by ball.of.john＠gmail.com

Just a heads up that both units are now pending a sale. If one or either completely fall through I'll bump this back up here on the list. Thanks to all who inquired. -John

10 years, 11 months

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Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

by fozztexx＠fozztexx.com

It?s Droste Week on RetroBattlestations! Inspired by a couple of different posts, I thought it would be fun to do a challenge where people don?t just post a picture of their computer, but they display the picture of their computer *on* their computer and post that! It?s going quite well and I really enjoy reading about the hoops people are having to jump through to get pictures converted and transferred and displayed. There have been photos of monochrome computers with high resolution, low resolution block graphics, ASCII art on CP/M computers, and even a mechanical typewriter! What can you come up with? http://retrobattlestations.com -- Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

10 years, 11 months

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Altos ACS 8000 8500 board Schematic

by billdegnan＠gmail.com

Altos ACS 8000 8500 board schematics/chapter from the 8000 hardware supplement posted here: http://vintagecomputer.net/altos/8000/ b

10 years, 11 months

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Documation card readers for sale

by ball.of.john＠gmail.com

Oh butts I sent that before I proofread. I'm in the Pacific Northwest, about three or four hours east of Vancouver BC. I have access to freight services should you take that route but for your wallet I'd strongly recommend some sort of local or negotiated pickup. ;0 >>Are the readers in question these ones in Canada? >>http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/showthread.php?45888-FS-Documation -M1000-Card-Readers Yes, that's me and those are the readers. >>>I'm also working on getting a cable made to hook up to the M843 CR8-E >>>punched card reader interface for the PDP-8/E, but that's a project for >>>another day (year?). That bloody EDAC connector is not cheap. I ended up sourcing one for like $60. On the other hand you can hunt around for scrap 50 conductor telco cable and you're all set for cabling. You can usually get it for its weight in copper from a scrapyard. -John

10 years, 11 months

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Components Data Books

by mattislind＠gmail.com

When repairing machines it is some times hard to find the data sheet for a particular component. Sometimes google hasn't been able to find the the data sheet for me. My father worked in the electronics business for his entire career and kept a lot of the data books that he received. I have compiled a list of them, mostly for my self, so that I somewhat easier would find what I look for. I publish it here. If you have searched everywhere (bitsavers , google etc) and not got a decent hit and think that one of the data books in my fathers archive would help I might be able to assist. No - I am not going to scan entire books. But a few pages is OK. The latency might be high since the archive is located 100 km away. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fTfBDLxl40e2iNrbwLv1ZGgIaXvz_toyvfc… I will add more to the list as time passes. There are quite a big bunch of data books left to do an inventory on. /Mattis

10 years, 11 months

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Front Panels - First shipments arrive in US

by rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com

Good Morning All Panel Fans!! According to the shippers the first consignments of PDP-8/e front panels were delivered in the US yesterday, Confirmations and comments to me please. Rod Smallwood

10 years, 11 months

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Documation card readers for sale

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

ok the m 200 and 600? tend to have gooey rollers... thus the reason I ask... In a message dated 6/17/2015 7:27:16 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us writes: I haven't replaced the rubber rollers on my M1000, yet. They're still in good shape. On Wed, 17 Jun 2015, COURYHOUSE at aol.com wrote: > Mike where did you get new rubber roller things for the card > reader? > Thanks for the link on the interface. Ed# _www.smecc.org_ > (http://www.smecc.org) > > > > In a message dated 6/17/2015 7:21:15 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, > mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us writes: > > On Wed, 17 Jun 2015, Kyle Owen wrote: > >> On Wed, Jun 17, 2015 at 7:14 PM, John Ball <ball.of.john at gmail.com> > wrote: >> >>> About six months ago I struck a deal with a place down in California for >>> four Documation M1000's that I've been able to tell so far they all > work >>> but >>> I really don't have space for more than one. >> >> >> If anyone here does get one, I've got a simple Arduino UNO program that >> interfaces to the parallel output and sends fully decoded information > over >> USB at quite high speeds. The M-1000-L is a great reader, very reliable, >> and easy to work on too (I did a little routine maintenance, but mine was >> in 100% working shape when I got it). >> >> Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N27Mr199I7g > > There's also Brian Knittel's USB interface for the Documation readers: > > http://media.ibm1130.org/sim/cardread.zip > > I built one, and it works well. > > > Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us > Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/ > > Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

10 years, 11 months

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Documation card readers for sale

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

Mike where did you get new rubber roller things for the card reader? Thanks for the link on the interface. Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 6/17/2015 7:21:15 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us writes: On Wed, 17 Jun 2015, Kyle Owen wrote: > On Wed, Jun 17, 2015 at 7:14 PM, John Ball <ball.of.john at gmail.com> wrote: > >> About six months ago I struck a deal with a place down in California for >> four Documation M1000's that I've been able to tell so far they all work >> but >> I really don't have space for more than one. > > > If anyone here does get one, I've got a simple Arduino UNO program that > interfaces to the parallel output and sends fully decoded information over > USB at quite high speeds. The M-1000-L is a great reader, very reliable, > and easy to work on too (I did a little routine maintenance, but mine was > in 100% working shape when I got it). > > Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N27Mr199I7g There's also Brian Knittel's USB interface for the Documation readers: http://media.ibm1130.org/sim/cardread.zip I built one, and it works well. Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Mark J. Blair > I could replace an M1 Carbine trigger spring on the spot, or a HMMWV > taillamp housing ... Should I criticize you for not having SAE grade 8 > hardware on hand, or Bristo wrenches I think Tony's point was that someone who's into vintage computers ought to have a stock of suitable parts for them. So unless he's into older guns, or cars, were he not to have things like SAE 8 hardware around, that would be understandable - he doesn't do them. Having said that, _I_ don't have 2N3904s nor NE555s around either! I do have a modest number of parts (e.g. 4164's, 40-ping Berg shells, .250 tab hardware, etc, etc) - a large enough collection that I just had to re-organize and add more parts holders (although that was mostly because I went berserk at the local Radio Shack in the 80% off sale). But it takes a long time to build up a really comprehensive collection of parts. It's funny, I was thinking of this exact topic last night - wondering if I could find someone who's selling off a large cabinet full of mixed spares! (I was thinking of the experience of one list member, who lucked into such.) I could certainly use it! Noel

10 years, 11 months

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RK06 alignment pack

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Pontus Pihlgren > How was alignment packs produced? On a special rig, I'm pretty sure. I don't know how the RK06 alignment pack works, but I am familiar with the RK05 (our machine had them, and we had to realign one after a head crash), and I assume it's probably similar; it had to have been created on a special rig (the exact nature of which I don't know, but I know a normal drive couldn't write it). For the RK05, the alignment pack has alignment tracks with alternating sectors written a couple of thousandths of an inch offset from the track's nominal center line; when one watches the head's output on a 'scope (at a timebase sufficient to show pairs of sectors), if the output for both sectors in a pair is at the same amplitude, the head is correctly aligned. If not, it's easy to see on the 'scope - one has higher output than the other. Noel

10 years, 11 months

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OT? Compaq 5/60M

by billdegnan＠gmail.com

I know I keep pushing the boundary of vintage lately but I wanted to report to those who care that I finally got my hands on a 1993 Compaq 5/60M - this is "a if not the" first desktop computer with a Pentium processor installed stock. it was the 1993 "dream machine - $9000+ It had an EISA bus and was otherwise a 486 system with a Pentium controller card, not on the motherboard. Pentium computers' contribution to the WWW era vintage is extremely significant. Pentium killed the minicomputer, or at a minimum merged into it, if you ask me. The interplay between DEC/Compaq/HP/Intel 1992-1995 culminating into the launch of Pentium processor systems is vital to understanding the WWW era of computing. How these companies worked or did not work together and how the Pentium vs. the Alpha processor came to be...a good tale of woe and $$. For those interested: Compaq 5/60: http://vintagecomputer.net/browse_thread.cfm?id=612 I have a bunch of articles to post on my site related to the first Pentium desktops which I will do asap. Bill P.S. while we're on this off-sh topic I also posted some photos of a Digital 486 laptop, DEC had a 486 laptop before it was absorbed by Compaq. 1994. Not really noteworthy other than the Digital name http://vintagecomputer.net/browse_thread.cfm?id=613 P.S.S. and related to Pentium and DEC ... here is one of DEC's early (but not the first) Pentium machine http://vintagecomputer.net/browse_thread.cfm?id=585

10 years, 11 months

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DEC RRD-42 CDROM drives

by richardlo＠admin.athabascau.ca

Somebody said something recently about wanting an RRD-42 or two. I just found two of them in my pile of obselete electronics and I don't need them. I also found two RRD-40s but my VAX3000/30 is fond of those. I did not find any RRD-45s which my AS4100 has a taste for. Speak up if you are looking for an RRD-42, I can also throw in the spiffy little CD carrier. -- Richard Loken VE6BSV, Unix System Administrator : "Anybody can be a father Athabasca University : but you have to earn Athabasca, Alberta Canada : the title of 'daddy'" ** richardlo at admin.athabascau.ca ** : - Lynn Johnston

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Dave G4UGM > I found it easier to think of it in DC terms. So the Cap charges > through R5 + R3 and R9 + R8. > As the Cap charges the voltage on the base of Q1 rises until it turns > on, which then turns on Q2. > At this point the cap is then charged (or discharged) in the reverse > direction via Q2, D5 and R4 until Q1 turns off..... I'm clearly never going to be any good at analog stuff! ;-) Even with what looks (on the surface) to be a wonderfully clear explanation of how the circuit works, I still can't really grok how it operates! I mean, I can tell from the polarity on the cap that the collector of Q2 must be at a higher voltage than the base of Q1, but I am utterly failing to understand how the cap discharges through Q2. And as the cap charges (i.e. the voltage across it increases), how does the voltage on the base of Q1 increase - surely it must be decreasing (since it's tied to the negative side of the cap, which is experiencing a voltage increase across itself)? Like I said, I apparently don't have the gene for analog... :-) Noel

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Pontus Pihlgren > One computer I could imagine would sparc interest is a new PDP-6. Umm, perhaps not the best choice! The original PDP-6 was known for being, ah, flaky. There's a reason DEC sold less of them than any other DEC machine! (Nothing wrong with the _architecture_, mind - the KA-10, which is basically identical, was _very_ successful. It was purely the implementation.) Noel

10 years, 11 months

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PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 19:42:42 -0400 > From: Michael Thompson <michael.99.thompson at gmail.com> > To: cctech <cctech at classiccmp.org> > > The M452 creates a 220 Hz clock for the TTY transmitter and a 880 Hz clock > for the TTY receiver. > The M405 for the DP12-B serial port generated a clock that is 16x the baud > rate which is then divided by an M216 module. > > Michael Thompson > > Just to prolong this discussion... The PDP-12 came to us with an M452 for the 110 baud TTY console and a home-made adjustable baud rate module for the second serial port. The adjustable baud rate generator was made by the original user of the system in the early 80s, and is just a crystal, rotary switch and a Fairchild 4702. I ordered a replacement Intersil IM4702 so we can repair the module. The original owner doesn't remember ever having an M405 for the second serial port. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 11 months

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Lee Felsenstein says you should read my book :)

by evan＠snarc.net

I am humbled (yes, it is possible!) .... got a very nice email from Homebrew Computer Club moderator / SOL-20 co-developer / Osborne 1 chief engineer (and many more): "This book presents the history of personal, portable computing from the abacus to the present day in a remarkably thorough, accessible fashion. Not only the winners are described but the also-rans and almost-made-its. Koblentz has done an admirable job of research and description in covering the field. I've always been careful to claim that my Osborne-1 design was only the "first commercially-successful portable computer" because I knew that a book like this would be forthcoming to show the time lines, descriptions and designers of earlier efforts. By nature a survey of the field, it is thoroughly researched and can provide pointers to more in-depth investigations." Evan again: still just eight bucks in PDF edition. http://www.abacustosmartphone.com. Also: This is version "1.0"; all first-batch readers will also get the PDF of version 1.x for free when it's ready.

10 years, 11 months

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On the Emulation of TU58s

by nf6x＠nf6x.net

As long as we're talking philosophy, what do y'all think about emulating the TU58 drive, vs. emulating the TU58 *tape*? I cannot properly express my opinion of that tape cartridge design even if I violate list rules about use of profanity. But the drive itself isn't all that bad, aside from not having enough motors to manipulate a well-designed tape cartridge mechanism. Emulating the whole tape drive is pretty easy since it helpfully interfaces over a plain old asynchronous serial port. But replacing the whole drive with an emulator, or worse yet tethering its computer to a modern computer, leaves a bit of an empty feeling if one likes their vintage machines to be original. There's something missing when you don't hear the drive whirring, and the system boot completes within a modern attention span. But what about emulating the tape cartridge, instead? Imagine a gizmo in the form factor of a TU58 cartridge, containing a wheel for the capstan roller to engage, but connected to an encoder instead of the ******* ************ ***** ** **** belt drive of an original cartridge? Where the tape would normally be exposed, there is instead a magnetic head which rests against the tape drive head like in one of those gizmos for injecting line level audio into an audio cassette drive. It might need an external power source, but for the sake of argument, let's pretend that a suitable rechargeable battery can be embedded. Maybe it has an SD card slot on the rear, or maybe it looks just like a real TU58 cartridge when inserted, and you swap the whole thing to change tapes (this is open for discussion). Would this be more or less acceptable in terms of keeping the system as close to original as possible, vs. unplugging the original drive and plugging in a drive emulator? No, I'm not going to build the thing. I'll just build my TU58 drive emulator to fit in the cartridge slot but plug into the computer in place of the original drive, with the cables snaked through the original drive mechanism. And I'll feel a little bit dirty, but the thing will work reliably and will be easy to implement. I'm just curious about the philosophical implications of my silly cartridge emulator idea. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net> http://www.nf6x.net/

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: wulfman > 2.47 per each ic is kinda expensive US$170 / 420 ICs = US$.40 per IC? (I suspect you swapped the numerator and demoninator: 420 / 170 = 2.47.) Seems not too unreasonable. I did order one, we'll see what it looks like (thanks to the OP for the tip). > i have 10s of thousands of each 74 series part there was ever made been > collecting on ebay for 15 years Want to get rid of some of the excess? :-) Noel

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: tony duell > One method that works for me is that if you are buying a fairly cheap > part, buy 10 of them and put the rest in stock. Or more than 10 if it > is something really common. I suspect a lot of us do that - that's why I have tubes of 4164's, etc, for instance. It makes a lot of sense, because it's trivial to implement - it's just as much work to order 10 of something, as 1. But that model isn't really the best, because a lot of the time one winds up needing something one doesn't already have. Which is why it's better to lay in a diversified stock up front. E.g. in wood screws (I do a lot of work in wood, mostly furniture), I have a fairly comprehensive collection; from #6 through #12, all the available lengths (not the very longest ones, though), counter-sunk and round-headed, with both slot and Phillips drive. But doing so in IC's - oi vey! Just in TTL alone, there are dozens of common parts (hundreds, if you count the more obscure ones), and then you get into the whole 74, 74S, 74LS, 74ALS, 74L, 74H, 74F, yadda-yadda. Of course, most of the variants one would never need, but one can't get by with just, e.g. LS; e.g. if I ever get my wish and wind up with a PDP-11/45, that's mostly S, IIRC. I wish there was some _easy_ way to lay in a stock of the most common TTL IC's - e.g. some kind of kit one could buy - but alas, I don't know of any. (Hence my dream of finding and acquiring someone else's collection! :-) Suggestions for the source of such a good diversified 'starter kit' welcome... Noel

10 years, 11 months

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Serial UNIBUS Repeater?

by nf6x＠nf6x.net

Has anybody ever made a UNIBUS repeater with a high speed serial link between the bus segments yet? I'm curious because my VAX-11/730 backplane is full, and it would be nice to be able to experiment with additional hardware without needing to pull out one of the existing boards, i.e., adding a TK50 interface without removing the DEUNA, adding a SCSI card to boot from a scsi2sd without pulling the integrated drive controller, etc. There's a blank spot in the TU80 cabinet that looks like it may be tall enough for an expansion chassis, but the thought of adding more big ribbon cables to the belly plate area and then routing them between racks doesn't appeal to me. Running something like a CAT5 cable between the two racks would be a lot easier. Another application would be for placing a small remote UNIBUS backplane on the test bench for easy access, and cabling it to a VAX or PDP-11 elsewhere in the room. This should be quite possible with modern hardware, but I'm curious about whether something similar has been done before. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net> http://www.nf6x.net/

10 years, 11 months

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Fairchild

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

Does anyone happen to know what sort of computers Fairchild would have been using in the late 60's for design work? Zane

10 years, 11 months

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PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 05:01:36 +0000 > From: tony duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> > Subject: RE: PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM (tony duell) > > > > Tony, thank you for your offer to supply replacement M452 Variable Clock > > modules for the console. We already have one jumpered for 110 baud for > the > > Teletype. The other two M452 modules should be jumpered for 9600 baud and > > 38400 baud. The second serial port uses a M405 Crystal Clock module with > a > > Do you want 3 separate modules, or one switchable, or what? > > > different pinout and clock outputs than the M452. We don't have any of > > these modules, so the three that we need should be jumpered for 110 baud, > > 9600 baud, and 38400 baud. The shipping address for the RICM is on the > WWW > > page. > > Hang on. I thought the M405 was just a crystal oscillator without a > divider. Are > you sure there is no extra division on other modules? 110Hz is very slow > for > a crystal oscillator, after all. > > -tony > The M452 creates a 110 Hz clock for the TTY transmitter and a 880 Hz clock for the TTY receiver. The M405 for the DP12-B serial port generated a clock that is 16x the baud rate which is then divided by an M216 module. Michael Thompson

10 years, 11 months

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using new technology on old machines

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Dave G4UGM > Trouble is that although smaller SD cards were available they were way > more expensive (being discontinued and therefore rare and valuable).. One wonders why some manufacturer didn't realize there was money to be made in smaller cards (now less competition, but still enough demand to drive the prices up) and keep making them. Noel

10 years, 11 months

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UA11s

by ggs＠shiresoft.com

For a while now, folks have been asking me about UA11s. I've been putting them off because I'm sure I have some boards but can't find them until I unpack the "basement" of my new shop. I figured that I'd have done that by now but it's *still* not done. :-( So, in the name of customer service, I'm going to fab another round of UA11 boards (just the boards, you'll have to source all of the parts yourselves). So that I know how big an order to place, can folks contact me (off list please: ggs at shiresoft.com) on if you'd like a board (or two or ??). I just want to have a rough idea of what the demand is (ie should I order 10, 25, 100?). Thanks. TTFN - Guy

10 years, 11 months

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First VAX-11/730 VMS Boot! (was: Re: VAX-11/730 %BOOT-F-Unexpected Machine Check)

by cctalk＠beyondthepale.ie

> > > I'm having trouble with the password reset procedure (but will resolve it by > the end of this message). When I run AUTHORIZE, I get this: > [snip] > $ set noon > set noon > $ spawn /nowait sys$system:startup.com > spawn /nowait sys$system:startup.com > %DCL-S-SPAWNED, process SYSTEM_1 spawned > $ > %DCL-W-NOLBLS, label ignored - use only within command procedures > \SYS$SYSTEM:\ > %DCL-W-PARMDEL, invalid parameter delimiter - check use of special characters > \.COM\ Did I say that? I meant: $ spawn /nowait @sys$system:startup.com (sorry) Regards, Peter Coghlan.

10 years, 11 months

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Vaxstation 4000/60 autoboot

by marco＠familie-rauhut.eu

Hello list! I try to autoboot my Vaxstation 4000/60. The reason is that i want to drive the vax headless. I have set Disk DKA300 as boot hdd in console mode. I SET HALT 2 ( reboot). In this configutarion the system starts into SYSBOOT>. There i have to give the command CONTINUE to boot VMS. Is there any way to overide then CONTINUE command? Marco * Deutsch - erkannt * Englisch * Deutsch * Englisch * Deutsch <javascript:void(0);><#>

10 years, 11 months

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VAX 11/730

by emu＠e-bbes.com

As usual, a long shot, but anybody in the list like to get rid of one? Preferably Colorado ;-)

10 years, 11 months

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Front Panel Tech Note 2

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Rod Smallwood > I can tell you what they were called internally at DEC. > ... > They were called Toggles or Toggle switches and their use was called > 'Toggling' hence 'To toggle in the bootstrap' Maybe because on the older machines (e.g. PDP-1) they really were toggle switches? > From: Kyle Owen > I hear them referred to as handles. That would work. Still, it would be nice to find a front panel mechanical drawing and see what they are called on the BoM. (I tried to find one for the 11/20 front panel, and although I found the tech manual for it, I couldn't the print set for the front panel.) Noel

10 years, 11 months

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Fix for duplicate (and triplicate) messages on cctalk?

by cclist＠sydex.com

I know that others have discussed the issue, but can someone tell me concisely how to avoid multiple copies of the same message on cctalk? Overnight, 54 new messages arrived in my inbox. The problem was that I'd seem a large number of them a day or two before. What's the trick to keeping things simple, people? --Chuck

10 years, 11 months

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PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM (tony duell)

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> > Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2015 15:25:08 +0000 > From: tony duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts" <cctech at classiccmp.org> > Subject: RE: PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM > > > Warren made an Arduino based programmable baud rate generator that works > > for both serial ports. After some debugging, it works nicely. > > I am sorry, but I find that obscene!. To use more components than the rest > of the machine > (probably) just for the baud rate clock is ridiculous. IMHO if you are > going to modify a > vintage machine, particularly one as rare as a PDP12, you should use the > components > that were available at the time. It's not as if a programmable buad rate > generator is hard > to make from TTL either. In fact given the Arduino thing needed 'some > debugging' it might > well have taken less time to do it in hardware. > > -tony > Tony, thank you for your offer to supply replacement M452 Variable Clock modules for the console. We already have one jumpered for 110 baud for the Teletype. The other two M452 modules should be jumpered for 9600 baud and 38400 baud. The second serial port uses a M405 Crystal Clock module with a different pinout and clock outputs than the M452. We don't have any of these modules, so the three that we need should be jumpered for 110 baud, 9600 baud, and 38400 baud. The shipping address for the RICM is on the WWW page. -- Michael Thompson

10 years, 11 months

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