3 Mar
2002
3 Mar
'02
4:06 a.m.
Hi,
this weekend, we have been unsuccessful trying to get one of the ancient Unix
versions (V6 or V7) to run on a PDP-11/34. The plan is to have an ancient
PDP-11 on the VCFe in Munich running a proper version of Unix.
THe machine has two RK05 drives, RX01 floppy and a TS03 tape drive. Our first
problem is that we have been unable to find or make up a TS03 bootstrap.
We considered using RT-11 to transfer disk images to RK05 drives, but we could
not figure out how to get the image straight to the disk without having to
store it in an intermediate file and writing a RT-11 program to access the
disk sector-by-sector.
We have a lot of hardware at our disposal, so we took a Emulex TC12 Pertec
tape controller from a 11/44 (the 11/44 would also be nice as demonstration
CPU, but it has a SMD disk controller for which we have no drives). Not
having any documentation on the TC12 we just put it into the 11/34, but it did
not work (bus error LED lit).
So we're kind of stuck. Any ideas, hints or pointers (especially to a TC12
print set) would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Hans
--
finger hans(a)huebner.org for details
3 Mar
3 Mar
5:06 a.m.
On 3 Mar, Hans H?bner wrote:
(the 11/44 would also be nice as demonstration
CPU, but it has a SMD disk controller for which we have no drives).
This problem
can be solved. I can trade a 350MB 5,25" SMD disk to you.
When the Symbolics are salvaged today, I may be able to gat a Fujitsu
eagle for you... Stay tuned. :-)
--
tschuess,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz
6:20 a.m.
On Sun, 3 Mar 2002 jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de wrote:
On 3 Mar, Hans H?bner wrote:
> (the 11/44 would also be nice as demonstration
> CPU, but it has a SMD disk controller for which we have no drives).
This problem can be solved. I can trade a 350MB
5,25" SMD disk to you.
This is cool and we'll gladly take the disk if everything else fails. The
real goal of course is to have a PDP-11 in an 1970ies configuration, way
before SMD was invented.
When the Symbolics are salvaged today, I may be able
to gat a Fujitsu
eagle for you... Stay tuned. :-)
Yikes! That one will look cool on one of our QBUS VAXen and provide for the
proper noise level. :)
-Hans
--
finger hans(a)huebner.org for details
6:43 a.m.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans H?bner" <hans(a)Huebner.ORG>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34
On Sun, 3 Mar 2002 jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de wrote:
the
On 3 Mar, Hans H?bner wrote:
> (the 11/44 would also be nice as
demonstration
> CPU, but it has a SMD disk controller for which we have no drives).
This problem can be solved. I can trade a 350MB
5,25" SMD disk to you.
This is cool and we'll gladly take the disk if everything else fails. The
real goal of course is to have a PDP-11 in an 1970ies configuration, way
before SMD was invented.
When the Symbolics are salvaged today, I may be
able to gat a Fujitsu
eagle for you... Stay tuned. :-)
Yikes! That one will look cool on one of our QBUS VAXen and provide for proper noise level. :)
There's nothing quite like the sound of an RA81 spooling up. It's almost
gas turbine....
Cheers
Geoff in Oz
11:08 a.m.
On 2002.03.03 13:43 Geoff Roberts wrote:
There's nothing quite like the sound of an RA81
spooling up.
It's almost gas turbine....
I can imagine...
When I got my first SMD disk, a 9" NEC D2363, I layed it on my BA123.
machine + disk = 100kg.
When I untared the OS, the whole shebang started to move, due to the
backstroke of the moving disk heads. I was very amused. :-)
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
11:53 a.m.
Jochen Kunz wrote:
When I got my first SMD disk, a 9" NEC D2363, I
layed it on my BA123.
machine + disk = 100kg.
When I untared the OS, the whole shebang started to move, due to the
backstroke of the moving disk heads. I was very amused. :-)
--
The Good Old Days .... when you gave the HD's a their little morning
exercise.:)
That is disks are so flaky today... the never had their walk.
--
Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu *
www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html
11:42 a.m.
On 2002.03.03 13:20 Hans H?bner wrote:
configuration,
I can bring my two 9" NECs. Stereo!
The Eagle is still in Davids hands, located in Ludwigshafen. You can
have it.
BTW: We needed three people to put the big Symbolics into Stefans trunk.
Than he filled the last gap with an Apollo Domain... The color monitor
for his Symbolics is in my trunk, because it and the machine where to
big for Stefans car. Unfortunately all symbolics consoles are borken.
One 3640 was left by Manuel, because the PSU is broken. We will salvage
the boards, including a tape controller. A tape that should fit to this
controller is in my attic. So look out for Genera tape images and
installation instructions... :-)))
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
This problem
can be solved. I can trade a 350MB 5,25" SMD disk to
you.
This is cool and we'll gladly take the disk if everything else fails.
The real goal of course is to have a PDP-11 in an 1970ies way before SMD was invented.
I can understand
this very well. 11/34 = 1975. What DEC disk systems
where current in that time? Massbus? RL01/02?
Hmm. You may ask David for his d|i|g|i|t|a|l washing machine. Once he
told me that he has a big disk drive from DEC. RK07? RP07? ??? Perhaps
he still has it.
When the
Symbolics are salvaged today, I may be able to gat a
Fujitsu eagle for you... Stay tuned. :-)
Yikes! That one will look cool on one of
our QBUS VAXen and provide
for the proper noise level. :) 
1:21 p.m.
On Sun, 3 Mar 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
BTW: We needed three people to put the big Symbolics
into Stefans trunk.
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a trunk??? I know it
couldn't have been a 3600, and not even a 3620.
What model of Symbolics was this?
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
4 Mar
4 Mar
4:21 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Sun, Mar 03, 2002 at 07:21:29PM +0000, Sellam Ismail wrote:
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a
trunk???
The car was a "Kombi", sorry I don't know the english
expression.
How to explain? Hmm. ASCII art.
normal car:
____
___/ \___
|o________o| (front)
Kombi version of the above:
_________
| \___
|o_________o| (front)
How do you call this type of car?
What model of Symbolics was this?
A 3670. The
two even biger 3600 are still there...
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
1:52 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
On Sun, Mar 03, 2002 at 07:21:29PM +0000, Sellam
Ismail wrote:
Aha.
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a
trunk???
The car was a "Kombi", sorry I don't know the english
expression.
How to explain? Hmm. ASCII art.
normal car:
____
___/ \___
|o________o| (front)
Kombi version of the above:
_________
| \___
|o_________o| (front) How do you call this type of car?
A Hearsh (used to carry dead people to the cemetary :)
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
10:33 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Mon, Mar 04, 2002 at 07:52:32AM +0000, Sellam Ismail wrote:
Yes, thats it. But please used with that particular smell and that
nice curtains at the windows. ;-)
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
How do you
call this type of car?
A Hearsh (used to carry dead people to the cemetary :)
8:19 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
On Sun, Mar 03, 2002 at 07:21:29PM +0000, Sellam
Ismail wrote:
Lines & O's? An ASCII-mobile? ;)
I think you have a "station wagon". A very important piece of
equipment for the collector.
Doc
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a
trunk???
The car was a "Kombi", sorry I don't know the english
expression.
_________
| \___
|o_________o| (front)
How do you call this type of car? 
9:16 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Doc wrote:
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
ROFL, Doc.
Uhm, A hatch-back? Sort of like a car turned wanna-be SUV. Of course,
anything that could fit more into it than my Camry is enviable to some
extent.
-- Pat
On Sun, Mar 03, 2002 at 07:21:29PM +0000, Sellam
Ismail wrote:
Lines & O's? An ASCII-mobile? ;)
I think you have a "station wagon". A very important piece of
equipment for the collector.
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a
trunk???
The car was a "Kombi", sorry I don't know the english
expression.
_________
| \___
|o_________o| (front)
How do you call this type of car? 
8:23 p.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-1
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002 philip(a)awale.qc.ca wrote:
On 04-Mar-2002 Pat Finnegan wrote:
<pet peeve>
There were several years in which the Land Rover was (is?) the
suburbanites' town car of choice. There are several million dollars
worth of off-road British iron in this county that's never seen dirt.
My little sister, who grew up riding dirtbikes, shooting 12-ga
shotguns & chewing tobacco with her three brothers, got a Range Rover
for her birthday a couple of years ago. She lives in El Paso, center of
a HUGE unpopulated and unfenced desert.
She sold the Rover 9 months later because her hubby had a conniption
everytime she hopped a curb, and _once_ let her drive around a levelled,
graded construction area in 4wd. Forget taking it into the desert. She
bought a Miata, spent about the value of the Rover souping up the Miata,
and now he just screams about the tickets....
</pet peeve>
I personally believe that a 2-wheel-drive long-wheel-base 3/4-ton
pickup is the best ATV there is.
Doc
P.S. -- All of us grew out of the tobacco-chewing phase fairly early...
Uhm, A hatch-back? Sort of like a car turned
wanna-be SUV.
As opposed to a SUV turned into a wannabe minivan, driven by a wannabe
"backroader". 
10:36 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
The Kombiwagen is definitely a station wagon.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doc" <doc(a)mdrconsult.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
On Sun, Mar 03, 2002 at 07:21:29PM +0000, Sellam
Ismail wrote:
Lines & O's? An ASCII-mobile? ;)
I think you have a "station wagon". A very important piece of
equipment for the collector.
Doc
How the HELL do you fit a Symbolics machine in a
trunk???
The car was a "Kombi", sorry I don't know the english
expression.
_________
| \___
|o_________o| (front)
How do you call this type of car?
9:56 a.m.
New subject: Symbolics transport (was: Re: Getting Unix to run on a PDP-11/34)
Good art work.
car: before shopping
____
___/ \___
|o________o| (front)
Car: after shopping.
__
/ \____
| \__
|o_________o| (front)
--
Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu *
www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html
3 Mar
3 Mar
10:23 a.m.
The 11/34 system in Hans Franke's collection has several bootable Unix
RK05 packs - it ran at one time when the units were in my possesion.
Just an FYI; and now I have become unpopular w/Hans.
Varry sorry Saar...
Cheers
John
1:19 p.m.
On Sun, 3 Mar 2002, John Lawson wrote:
The 11/34 system in Hans Franke's collection
has several bootable Unix
RK05 packs - it ran at one time when the units were in my possesion.
This is probably a good bet for getting a PDP 11/34 running Unix at VCFe
in case Hans Huebner and crew are unable to get their's up and running.
Unfortunately, it'll probably take Hans a week or two to catch up with CC
messages and see this thread as he just left back for home this evening.
Just an FYI; and now I have become unpopular
w/Hans.
Varry sorry Saar...
As Hans always tells me, "You are a complete asshole!" :)
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
11 Apr
11 Apr
1:09 p.m.
The 11/34 system in Hans Franke's collection
has several bootable Unix
RK05 packs - it ran at one time when the units were in my possesion.
Well, there are some problems with the labeling ...
Just an FYI; and now I have become unpopular
w/Hans.
Varry sorry Saar...
You got to try harder on this ... boy.
:)
H.
--
VCF Europa 3.0 am 27./28. April 2002 in Muenchen
http://www.vcfe.org/
8299
days inactive
8338
days old
19 comments
11 participants
participants (11)
-
bfranchuk＠jetnet.ab.ca -
doc＠mdrconsult.com -
edick＠idcomm.com -
foo＠siconic.com -
geoffrob＠stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au -
Hans.Franke＠mch20.sbs.de -
hans＠Huebner.ORG -
jkunz＠unixag-kl.fh-kl.de -
jpl15＠panix.com -
pat＠purdueriots.com -
philip＠awale.qc.ca