15 Jun
2015
15 Jun
'15
8:26 a.m.
The revival process of the 11/750 continues. The power supplies is working
good and then I started testing the actual machine. But that was not a very
smooth journey to success. I have in total at least three complete CPU
board sets and just after quite a lot of board swapping it got running (I
think).
I had error like:
* Bright red error light
* No response at all on the console
* %C microverify error
* %O microverify error
* An hexdump prompt which non like above bot still not correct.
* etc
Finally I had the
%% which meant that it passed microverify.
Then I used the (second) RDM module (the first one had RAM error) to run
the DPM and MIC test which passed.
The I ran the "Hardcore VAX instruction test" / TU58#7 which also passed
fine.
BUT the Cache / TB diag, TU58#5, give me this:
%%
00000000 16
>>B
%%
@?ECKAL -- VAX 11/750 Cache/TB Diagnostic
00003488 06
>>
I am running a BE-S198Q-DE tape image.
Anyone has a listing or description for the ECKAL diagnostic? Is there any
know incompatibilities with certain revisions of boards? Or known bugs?
The machine manage to boot the console tape so I get the BOOT58> prompt.
But I am not sure if that indicate that it is indeed working or not.
So, some help with the Cache/TB diagnostic would be very much appreciated.
/Mattis
15 Jun
15 Jun
8:32 a.m.
I wasn't aware that you are working on a 750 repair. Congratulations on the progress
you have already made! Are you using real console tapes, tu58em, or something else?
11:06 a.m.
2015-06-15 17:32 GMT+02:00 Mark J. Blair <nf6x at nf6x.net>:
I wasn't aware that you are working on a 750
repair. Congratulations on
the progress you have already made! Are you using real console tapes,
tu58em, or something else?
Well. I am probably working on to much simultaneously. But this machine is
100 km away so it is just now and then I do something with it. Like this
weekend. The real console tape tape drive is in questionable status
although not tested. I tried to use the mockup I did based on the TU58
emulator by Bela T?r?k. But I wasn't successful (I had it working
previously on an LSI-11 so I am not sure what is wrong - I guess that I
told that it was working perfectly previously - well I was wrong).
Then I compiled your fork of tu58em on github. And it worked perfect. I
didn't need to use the special vax mode that you have implemented though.
Ma?be it is required only by 11/730?
The bad thing with the 11/750 is that is has so many socketed TTL gate
array chips. Sockets are bad. And gate arrays are bad. In that sense I
think the 11/730 is better since it is AFAIK based on mostly standard off
the shelf chips.
In a way I am happy that is indeed running the BOOT58 program and several
of the diagnostics but it sure would be very interesting to know why this
Translation Buffer / Cache diagnostic fails. Were there any listings
available for the VAX diagnostics? The micro diagnostics run in the RDM
module is pretty well described in a document on bitsavers. There are no
details though. But for the native VAX-11 diagnostics I can not find
anything.
Next step would be to create a SCSI disk with a VMS installation on it.
Hopefully I manage to do that using SimH. I don't have any nice TU80 to go
with the machine so it is not possible to do an install from tape. I do
have a lead on a TU81 PLUS, but it is some 900 km away currently...
/Mattis
11:16 a.m.
On Jun 15, 2015, at 11:06 , Mattis Lind <mattislind
at gmail.com> wrote:
Well. I am probably working on to much simultaneously.
I am very guilty of that, too! :)
Then I compiled your fork of tu58em on github. And it
worked perfect. I
didn't need to use the special vax mode that you have implemented though.
Ma?be it is required only by 11/730?
You could probably use Don's original tu58em, then. The 730 appears to have one 20ms
timeout in a critical part of the drive initialization routine (which is entered
repeatedly in normal operation, not just at power-up), and stock tu58em has a delay in
that spot that is problematic. Maybe the 750 console code either lacks the timeout check
or has a longer timeout period?
The bad thing with the 11/750 is that is has so many
socketed TTL gate
array chips. Sockets are bad. And gate arrays are bad. In that sense I
think the 11/730 is better since it is AFAIK based on mostly standard off
the shelf chips.
Mostly, if I'm not mistaken (I haven't gotten too deeply involved with the PCBs
yet). There are a number of PROMs.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
11:33 a.m.
> The bad thing with the 11/750 is that is has so
many socketed TTL gate
> array chips. Sockets are bad. And gate arrays are bad. In that sense I
Years ago I was offered an 11/750 and turned it down as soon as I saw
inside the cardcage. No way would I want to maintain that mass of
custom gate arrays
> think the 11/730 is better since it is AFAIK
based on mostly standard off
> the shelf chips.
Mostly, if I'm not mistaken (I haven't gotten
too deeply involved with the PCBs yet).
There are a number of PROMs.
There are 2 custom ICs in the 11/730 CPU (by 'CPU' I mean the 3 board set, DAP,
MCT, WCS)
They are the memory ECC chips and are IIRC, the same as the ones in an 11/750, in other
words DEC used the same memory error correcting system. There are no custom ICs on
the IDT (disk controller), FP730 (floating point) or memory boards AFAIK. What is on
Unibus
peripheral cards depends on what you have :-)
The rest of the CPU (and IDT, FP) is some TTL, an 8085, standand RAMs (SRAM and DRAM),
2901
bit slice ALUs, PROMs (in general the bit-dumps are in the printset, the only ones not
there are the
4K firmware for the 8085 console processor) and lots of PALs, again the logic equations
for these
are in the printset. Oh yes, the TU58 controller board has a PROM on it that you don't
get a dump of
but it is a standard TU58 controller so I assume somebody has dumped it.
So I am happy to try to keep an 11/730 running
The R80 disk drive has again, lots of TTL and analogue parts, an 8085 system using the
Intel
8155 RAM/IO and 8355 ROM/IO chips (alas no dumps of the firmware in the prints ), a
couple
of other sets of PROMs (no dumps :-() and a few custom head switching and servo preamp
ICs _inside the HDA_ where you can't really replace them. My view is that the R80
electronics is
repairable (and I must make a dump of the ROMs) but that the HDA is likely to be a problem
area
anyway.
There are some good 11/730 manuals on bitsavers. As well as the printsets (worth reading
with a hackish
eye) there are technical descriptions of the CPU, Disk controller and floating point
board. They refer to
a similar manual for the PSU which is, unfortuantely, not on bitsavers. Said manuals
explain a lot of things
that are not totally obvious from the printset.
Things that I would love to see (but I suspect were never published) are a source of the
8085 firmware in
the 11/730 and a source of the standard microcode for said machine. Oh, and a source for
the R80
firmware.
-tony
11:58 a.m.
On my phone right now. Might type more after lunch.
I think I have some 730 manuals that are not yet on Bitsavers. Some original and some
photocopies. I plan to scan all of them.
I also may dump the console firmware PROMs at some point. I've already done some
preliminary disassembly of the TU58 firmware.
11:59 a.m.
I also may dump the console firmware PROMs at some
point. I've already done some preliminary
disassembly of the TU58 firmware.
I am pretty sure I dumped all the PROMs and PALs in the CPU of my 11/730 (but not the ones
in the
R80) long before there was a bitsavers. I can see if I can find the dumps. What I
don't have is the
Remote Diagnostic ROMs (this was another pair of 2K*4 ROMs that plug into sockets on the
WCS
board and which run on the 8085). So no dumps of that.
-tony
1:07 p.m.
On Jun 15, 2015, at 11:59 , tony duell <ard at
p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote:
I have three WCS cards, including the one in my machine, but none of them have the remote
diagnostic option.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
I also may dump the console firmware PROMs at
some point. I've already done some preliminary
disassembly of the TU58 firmware.
I am pretty sure I dumped all the PROMs and PALs in the CPU of my 11/730 (but not the
ones in the
R80) long before there was a bitsavers. I can see if I can find the dumps. What I
don't have is the
Remote Diagnostic ROMs (this was another pair of 2K*4 ROMs that plug into sockets on the
WCS
board and which run on the 8085). So no dumps of that.
16 Jun
16 Jun
12:59 a.m.
In my efforts to understand the problem with the Cache/TB Diagnostics I
tried to run it under 11/750 simulator in SimH. It fails too!
ECKAL -- VAX 11/750 Cache/TB Diagnostic
HALT instruction, PC: 00002608 (MTPR #F,#26)
Although not the same location.
On the real machine:
@?ECKAL -- VAX 11/750 Cache/TB Diagnostic
00003488 06
Trying to disassemble at 3488 in SimH gives me:
EXTZV @-1D(R7),#0,#0,(R8)+
The EXTZV is supposed be "Extract Zero-Extended Field"
I have never done any VAX-11 assembly coding so this is very new ground for
me... As far as I understand the diagnostic starts at address 200. But then
understanding what it does without the listing... Well. A long journey for
me.
/Mattis
2015-06-15 22:07 GMT+02:00 Mark J. Blair <nf6x at nf6x.net>:
(but not
the ones in the
On Jun 15, 2015, at 11:59 , tony duell <ard at
p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> I also may dump the console firmware PROMs at some point. I've already
done some preliminary
disassembly of the TU58 firmware.
I am pretty sure I dumped all the PROMs and PALs in the CPU of my 11/730 R80) long before there was a bitsavers. I can see
if I can find the
dumps. What I don't have is the
Remote Diagnostic ROMs (this was another pair of
2K*4 ROMs that plug
into sockets on the WCS
board and which run on the 8085). So no dumps of
that.
I have three WCS cards, including the one in my machine, but none of them
have the remote diagnostic option.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
4 Jul
4 Jul
1:35 p.m.
Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it actually booted both VMS 6.1
and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. Yes, the gate arrays can be a problem. But until
now I haven't found one that is faulty. The problem is usually bad contact
in the sockets which can be solved easily by removing them and clean the
chip and socket with isopropanol. A DPM (L0002) board that failed the
microverify at %C, passed straight away after that treatment.
The gate arrays themselves are ceramic chips which I think will keep up
many years if not abused. And since they are TTL and not MOS the likelihood
of damage due to static electricity is small.
BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
(L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is the optional
RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
A booting 750:
>>B
%%
@@
Patch Control Store is Present
Done loading Patch bits and PCS
Ultrixboot - V4.0 Sat Mar 31 04:11:56 EST 1990
Loading (a)vmunix ...
Sizes:
text = 593304
data = 100864
bss = 320516
Starting at 0x2d4d
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) System #1: Thu May 20 23:26:51 GMT+0100 1976
real mem = 8388608
avail mem = 5921792
using 204 buffers containing 838656 bytes of memory
VAX 11/750, hardware level = 0x8c, microcode level = 99
mcr0 (MS750) at address 0xf20000
uba0 at address 0xf30000
uda0 at uba0
uq0 at uda0 csr 172150 vec 774, ipl 15
ra1 at uq0 slave 1 (RA81)
ra0 at uq0 slave 0 (RA81)
WARNING: todr too small -- CHECK AND RESET THE DATE!
Sun Jun 20 23:35:50 GMT+0100 1976
Automatic reboot in progress...
/dev/ra0a: 596 files, 5592 used, 9959 free (143 frags, 1227 blocks, 0.9%
fragmentation)
/dev/rra0d: umounted cleanly
check quotas: done.
savecore: checking for dump...dump does not exist
local daemons: syslog sendmail.
Removing remnant Opser files
preserving editor files
clearing /tmp
standard daemons: update cron accounting network snmpd.
start errlog daemon - elcsd
Sun Jun 20 23:36:51 GMT+0100 1976
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
login: root
Password:
Last login: Sun Jun 20 23:35:25 on console
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) System #1: Thu May 20 23:26:51 GMT+0100 1976
Digital Equipment Corporation
Nashua, New Hampshire
*** SOFTWARE INSTALLATION PROCEDURE COMPLETE ***
The following files were created during the installation procedure:
/vmunix - customized kernel
/genvmunix - generic kernel
/usr/adm/install.log - installation log file
/usr/adm/install.FS.log - file systems log file
/usr/adm/install.DEV.log - special device log file
2015-06-16 9:59 GMT+02:00 Mattis Lind <mattislind at gmail.com>:
In my efforts to understand the problem with the
Cache/TB Diagnostics I
tried to run it under 11/750 simulator in SimH. It fails too!
ECKAL -- VAX 11/750 Cache/TB Diagnostic
HALT instruction, PC: 00002608 (MTPR #F,#26)
Although not the same location.
On the real machine:
@?ECKAL -- VAX 11/750 Cache/TB Diagnostic
00003488 06
Trying to disassemble at 3488 in SimH gives me:
EXTZV @-1D(R7),#0,#0,(R8)+
The EXTZV is supposed be "Extract Zero-Extended Field"
I have never done any VAX-11 assembly coding so this is very new ground
for me... As far as I understand the diagnostic starts at address 200. But
then understanding what it does without the listing... Well. A long journey
for me.
/Mattis
2015-06-15 22:07 GMT+02:00 Mark J. Blair <nf6x at nf6x.net>:
11/730 (but not
the ones in the
On Jun 15, 2015, at 11:59 , tony duell <ard at
p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> I also may dump the console firmware PROMs at some point. I've already
done some preliminary
disassembly of the TU58 firmware.
I am pretty sure I dumped all the PROMs and PALs in the CPU of my R80) long before there was a bitsavers. I can see
if I can find the
dumps. What I don't have is the
Remote Diagnostic ROMs (this was another pair of
2K*4 ROMs that plug
into sockets on the WCS
board and which run on the 8085). So no dumps of
that.
I have three WCS cards, including the one in my machine, but none of them
have the remote diagnostic option.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
1:40 p.m.
On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote:
Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it
actually booted both VMS 6.1
and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ...
BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
(L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is the optional
RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
A booting 750:
...
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
login: root
Password:
As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you!
--Toby
2:41 p.m.
As a random guy who thinks that VAX-11 machines are neat, I also salute you!
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
6 Jul
6 Jul
8:03 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
On 7/4/15 1:40 PM, Toby Thain wrote:
On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote:
Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it
actually booted both
VMS 6.1
and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ...
BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
(L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is the
optional
RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
A booting 750:
...
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
login: root
Password:
As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you!
--Toby
8:17 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 6 July 2015 at 23:03, Alan Perry <aperry at snowmoose.com> wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't mind
knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you are
interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
Sorry for the scope creep; but perhaps it might be more
useful/interesting to make it a registry of any VAX that has a name of
the form "VAX-11/7xx"? (Which could also include the VAX 8600 and VAX
8650, since were originally to be called the VAX-11/790 and
VAX-11/795.)
Thoughts on that idea?
Regards,
Christian
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.
7 Jul
7 Jul
7:09 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-06 11:17 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
On 6 July 2015 at 23:03, Alan Perry <aperry at
snowmoose.com> wrote:
I'd vote for "big VAX" list. The minutiae of marketing names is pretty
boring and irrelevant to such a list isn't it?
--Toby
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't mind
knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you are
interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
Sorry for the scope creep; but perhaps it might be more
useful/interesting to make it a registry of any VAX that has a name of
the form "VAX-11/7xx"? (Which could also include the VAX 8600 and VAX
8650, since were originally to be called the VAX-11/790 and
VAX-11/795.)
Thoughts on that idea?
Regards,
Christian
8:21 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
Sorry for the
scope creep; but perhaps it might be more
useful/interesting to make it a registry of any VAX that has a name of
the form "VAX-11/7xx"? (Which could also include the VAX 8600 and
VAX
8650, since were originally to be called the
VAX-11/790 and
VAX-11/795.)
I'd vote for "big VAX" list. The minutiae of marketing names is
pretty
boring and irrelevant to such a list isn't it?
--Toby 
12:23 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
----
Should the requirement be weight,
physical size,
or what tools are lost in it?
----
BTU requirements.
11:54 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
I'd vote for "big VAX" list.
I'd say any VAX with a UNIBUS, SDI, BI or XMI bus, at least, should qualify. I
think that would include all the 7xx, 6xxx, 8xxx, and 7xxx/10000 machines. I don't
really know what was in a 9000...
BTW, is this list limited to machines that are in operable condition?
Bob
1:50 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
BTW, is this list limited to machines that are in
operable condition?
I would include machines that were clearly restorable. OK, anything can be restored, but
you know what I mean :-). In other words an 11/730 or 11/750 that needs its TU58 rollers
replaced, or an 11/780 that needs somebody to go through the logic and find the
TTL chip that's died. Something like that.
But probably not the VAXbar :-)
-tony
8 Jul
8 Jul
2:50 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 7/7/15 1:50 PM, tony duell wrote:
Is the serial number still on the VAXbar?
I just wanted to know how many machines were still out there. Actually,
I wouldn't mind keeping track of 780s as well if it lets me know where
(the former) ucbvax is now ;)
alan
BTW, is
this list limited to machines that are in operable condition?
I would include
machines that were clearly restorable. OK, anything can be restored, but
you know what I mean :-). In other words an 11/730 or 11/750 that needs its TU58 rollers
replaced, or an 11/780 that needs somebody to go through the logic and find the
TTL chip that's died. Something like that.
But probably not the VAXbar :-)
-tony
7 Jul
7 Jul
1:51 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
There is a HECNET list
http://madame.update.uu.se/~bqt/nodedb?search=&field=0&sort=0
With that in mind, a more list of "live" VAXen of any type, operating
hours, IP/domain, hardware, owner, location. I realize it's not a list of
every known VAX out there, but "live/operational/networking status" is a
good way to trim things down.
On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 2:54 PM, Robert Armstrong <bob at jfcl.com> wrote:
I'd vote
for "big VAX" list.
I'd say any VAX with a UNIBUS, SDI, BI or XMI bus, at least, should
qualify. I think that would include all the 7xx, 6xxx, 8xxx, and
7xxx/10000 machines. I don't really know what was in a 9000...
BTW, is this list limited to machines that are in operable condition?
Bob
2:47 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-07 20:54, Robert Armstrong wrote:
9000 is also XMI. Several of them, if I remember right. SDI on the other
hand is just a disk interface. I don't think it makes sense to include
that here, as SDI controllers existed for Qbus machines as well, meaning
we're now including almost everything but pizza boxes. :-)
I'd vote
for "big VAX" list.
I'd say any VAX with a UNIBUS, SDI, BI or XMI bus, at least, should qualify. I
think that would include all the 7xx, 6xxx, 8xxx, and 7xxx/10000 machines. I don't
really know what was in a 9000... BTW, is this list limited to machines that are in
operable condition?
If you were to ask me, I would find it interesting to find even
inoperable ones. But on the other hand, I would probably abuse such a
list to try and collect a few more bits for the 8650 machines I'm
involved with. (More memory first and foremost.) Which might not be what
others think would be the purpose of such a list... :-)
(I'll also happily help anyone else who want to try and get an 86x0
machine running. There are a bunch of things people usually needs help
with if they are trying this.)
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
2:49 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
I'd say
any VAX with a UNIBUS, SDI, BI or XMI bus, at least, should qualify. I think that would
include all the
7xx, 6xxx, 8xxx, and 7xxx/10000 machines. I don't really know what was in a 9000...
9000 is also XMI. Several of them, if I remember right. SDI on the other
hand is just a disk interface. I don't think it makes sense to include
3:06 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-07 23:49, tony duell wrote:
Perhaps SDI is a typo for SBI, as in the 11/780?
Good point. SBI would make much more since in there. But this also
becomes a question of what kind of buses are we interested in. The I/O
buses, or the CPU buses, or something else? Unibus was always just an
I/O bus for the VAX. Should we then also mention Massbus? How about CI?
And on some of the 8000 machines, the CPU sat on a bus called NMI, on
which you then had the VAXBI adapters.
I honestly don't have a good idea of what defines a "large" VAX. Buses
feels unsuitable. Power connector maybe? :-)
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
I'd say any VAX with a UNIBUS, SDI, BI or XMI bus, at least, should qualify. I think
that would include all the
7xx, 6xxx, 8xxx, and 7xxx/10000 machines. I don't really know what was in a 9000...
9000 is also XMI. Several of them, if I remember right. SDI on the other
hand is just a disk interface. I don't think it makes sense to include 
4:25 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 07/07/15 23:06, Johnny Billquist wrote:
I honestly don't have a good idea of what defines a "large" VAX. Buses
feels unsuitable. Power connector maybe? :-)
If the intention is to avoid a huge list then excluding MicroVAXes and
VAXstations should produce a list of VAXen
that you probably cannot easily simply carry home on the bus.
That would unfortunately exclude the VAXstation 8000, which is pretty
rare AFAIK. It would also exclude the VAXstation I,
which I imagine is also relatively rare these days.
I don't think you can easily come up with a simple set of criteria based
on power connectors or buses or similar.
Perhaps "too big to hug" is what you really want :-)
Antonio
4:35 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-08 01:25, Antonio Carlini wrote:
On 07/07/15 23:06, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Yeah...
Or maybe we should start by asking what would the purpose of the list
be. Once that has bee figured out, I'm sure we can come up with some
criteria, or explicit list of models to include...
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
I honestly don't have a good idea of what defines a "large" VAX. Buses
feels unsuitable. Power connector maybe? :-)
If the intention is to avoid a huge list then excluding MicroVAXes and
VAXstations should produce a list of VAXen
that you probably cannot easily simply carry home on the bus.
That would unfortunately exclude the VAXstation 8000, which is pretty
rare AFAIK. It would also exclude the VAXstation I,
which I imagine is also relatively rare these days.
I don't think you can easily come up with a simple set of criteria based
on power connectors or buses or similar.
Perhaps "too big to hug" is what you really want :-)
8 Jul
8 Jul
2:56 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 7/7/15 4:35 PM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
On 2015-07-08 01:25, Antonio Carlini wrote:
My reason for doing a registry is to figure out who many are still out
there and provide a somewhat central location for owners to find other
owners. I have a non-running 750, so I figured that I would get some
benefit from this as well. I don't have time to track this list as much
as I would like, so I often miss 750 discussions that happen here.
alan
On 07/07/15 23:06, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Yeah...
Or maybe we should start by asking what would the purpose of the list
be. Once that has bee figured out, I'm sure we can come up with some
criteria, or explicit list of models to include...
I honestly don't have a good idea of what defines a "large" VAX. Buses
feels unsuitable. Power connector maybe? :-)
If the intention is to avoid a huge list then excluding MicroVAXes and
VAXstations should produce a list of VAXen
that you probably cannot easily simply carry home on the bus.
That would unfortunately exclude the VAXstation 8000, which is pretty
rare AFAIK. It would also exclude the VAXstation I,
which I imagine is also relatively rare these days.
I don't think you can easily come up with a simple set of criteria based
on power connectors or buses or similar.
Perhaps "too big to hug" is what you really want :-)
Johnny
2:44 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 7/6/15 8:17 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
On 6 July 2015 at 23:03, Alan Perry <aperry at
snowmoose.com> wrote:
Just saw this as my filter that collects cctalk postings hid it away.
I am mostly interested in keeping track of 750s since I have one. But I
guess that I could keep track of the others as well.
I just saw this thread and it looks like there are a bunch of other
posts, so let me see where the discussion has gone ...
alan
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't mind
knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you are
interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
Sorry for the scope creep; but perhaps it might be more
useful/interesting to make it a registry of any VAX that has a name of
the form "VAX-11/7xx"? (Which could also include the VAX 8600 and VAX
8650, since were originally to be called the VAX-11/790 and
VAX-11/795.)
Thoughts on that idea?
Regards,
Christian
9 Jul
9 Jul
12:29 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
Sorry for top-posting but having read this thread I feel you are
discriminating for no real reason.
Certainly, if the registry is a plain old text file with one
maintainer then some limitations is probably good.
But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all
makes and models.
Some filtering on the output and bobs your uncle.
/P
On Mon, Jul 06, 2015 at 08:03:12PM -0700, Alan Perry wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If
you are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
On 7/4/15 1:40 PM, Toby Thain wrote:
On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote:
Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it
actually booted
both VMS 6.1
and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ...
BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
(L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is
the optional
RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
A booting 750:
...
ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
login: root
Password:
As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you!
--Toby
2:28 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-09 09:29, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Sorry for top-posting but having read this thread I
feel you are
discriminating for no real reason.
Certainly, if the registry is a plain old text file with one
maintainer then some limitations is probably good.
But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all
makes and models.
Some filtering on the output and bobs your uncle.
Ooo. Nice one. You almost tempted me into writing this under RSX, until
I caught myself and reminded me how many other projects I have that I
should waste time on... :-)
Johnny
/P
On Mon, Jul 06, 2015 at 08:03:12PM -0700, Alan Perry wrote:
> Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't
> mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If
> you are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
>
> alan
>
> On 7/4/15 1:40 PM, Toby Thain wrote:
>> On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote:
>>> Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it actually booted
>>> both VMS 6.1
>>> and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ...
>>>
>>> BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
>>> (L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is
>>> the optional
>>> RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
>>>
>>> I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
>>>
>>> A booting 750:
>>> ...
>>>
>>> ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> login: root
>>>
>>> Password:
>>>
>>
>>
>> As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you!
>>
>> --Toby
>>
>
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
6:13 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-09 5:28 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
On 2015-07-09 09:29, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Writing code is the trivial part.
Keeping it accessible (let alone up to date) is harder.
--Toby
Sorry for top-posting but having read this thread
I feel you are
discriminating for no real reason.
Certainly, if the registry is a plain old text file with one
maintainer then some limitations is probably good.
But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all
makes and models.
Some filtering on the output and bobs your uncle.
Ooo. Nice one. You almost tempted me into writing this under RSX, until
I caught myself and reminded me how many other projects I have that I
should waste time on... :-)
Johnny
>
> /P
>
6:33 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-09 15:13, Toby Thain wrote:
On 2015-07-09 5:28 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Well, it would be an interesting exercise for my webserver in
combination with Datatrieve.
On 2015-07-09 09:29, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Writing code is the trivial part. Sorry for top-posting but having read this thread
I feel you are
discriminating for no real reason.
Certainly, if the registry is a plain old text file with one
maintainer then some limitations is probably good.
But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all
makes and models.
Some filtering on the output and bobs your uncle.
Ooo. Nice one. You almost tempted me into writing this under RSX, until
I caught myself and reminded me how many other projects I have that I
should waste time on... :-) Keeping it accessible (let alone up to date) is
harder.
Web interface - people update their own records. The machine is normally
always online, so I don't think there would be any problems from that side.
Johnny
10 Jul
10 Jul
9:42 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
In the registry that I was planning on creating, I was going to include
a lot of 11/750-specific fields. Does it have a Unibus expansion
cabinet? What control store does it have? From the responses that I have
received so far, I have already run into questions about what should be
listed as an 11/750.
If someone wants to create a more general registry, I will support that
effort as well.
alan
On 7/9/15 12:29 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Sorry for top-posting but having read this thread I
feel you are
discriminating for no real reason.
Certainly, if the registry is a plain old text file with one
maintainer then some limitations is probably good.
But with an rdbms and a nice front then it could encompass all
makes and models.
Some filtering on the output and bobs your uncle.
/P
On Mon, Jul 06, 2015 at 08:03:12PM -0700, Alan Perry wrote:
> Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't
> mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If
> you are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
>
> alan
>
> On 7/4/15 1:40 PM, Toby Thain wrote:
>> On 2015-07-04 4:35 PM, Mattis Lind wrote:
>>> Well. Despite all recent VAX-11/750 bashing it actually booted
>>> both VMS 6.1
>>> and Ultrix-32 4.0 today. ...
>>>
>>> BTW. The CPU of the 11/750 is contained on five extended HEX boards,
>>> (L0002, L0003, L0004, L0008, L0011/L0016/L0022). Then there is
>>> the optional
>>> RMD (L0006) module and possible MBA and extra unibus adapters.
>>>
>>> I used a SCSI2SD card connected to a Emulex UC17 board.
>>>
>>> A booting 750:
>>> ...
>>>
>>> ULTRIX V4.0 (Rev. 161) (vax)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> login: root
>>>
>>> Password:
>>>
>>
>> As a fellow 11/750 owner (sadly, not yet restored), I salute you!
>>
>> --Toby
>>
10:10 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
Alan Perry [aperry at snowmoose.com] wrote:
... I was going to include a lot of 11/750-specific fields.
Does it have a Unibus expansion cabinet?
That would apply to all 7xx VAXes, as well as many of the 8xxx family. I
don't think any others had a UBA option, but I could easily be wrong.
What control store does it have?
I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. Are you asking for the
microcode revision? That would also apply to pretty much all VAXes.
What other questions did you have in mind?
Bob
11:45 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
What control store does it have?
I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. Are you asking for the
microcode revision? That would also apply to pretty much all VAXes.
Probably referring to the L0005 CPU Control Store vs. L0008 Patchable
Control Store. There's also a few types of L0008 (-YA, -YB, and -YC, IIRC),
distinguished mostly by whether or not they contain any writable control
store.
jpw
11:49 a.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 7/10/15 10:10 AM, Robert Armstrong wrote:
That was
just an example. I would like to keep track of system
configurations, running status, aspirations for running status, and
whatever else the folks who own these systems would like tracked.
There were a
variety of control store modules used in the 750.
http://home.claranet.nl/users/pb0aia/vax/750faq.html#pcs
Alan Perry
[aperry at snowmoose.com] wrote:
... I was going to include a lot of 11/750-specific fields.
Does it have a Unibus expansion cabinet?
That would apply to all 7xx VAXes, as
well as many of the 8xxx family. I
don't think any others had a UBA option, but I could easily be wrong. What control
store does it have?
I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. Are you
asking for the
microcode revision? That would also apply to pretty much all VAXes.
What other questions did you have in mind?
The thing about volunteer efforts is that they are volunteer efforts and
subject to the whims of the people doing them.
alan
Bob
1 May
1 May
12:32 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 2015-07-06 11:03 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
Since I've heard of a few 11/750's having been rescued recently, I'm
reposting this in case anyone wants to regster with Alan or, if his list
is defunct, start a new registry...
--Toby
1:36 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
I have a vague recollection of this - have you reached out to Alan to
determine current status?
Lee C.
On Sun, May 1, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Toby Thain <toby at telegraphics.com.au>
wrote:
On 2015-07-06 11:03 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
--
Lee Courtney
+1-650-704-3934 cell
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
Since I've heard of a few 11/750's having been rescued recently, I'm
reposting this in case anyone wants to regster with Alan or, if his list is
defunct, start a new registry...
--Toby
1:52 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
I sold my VAX (and the buyer, Josh, has it running now!), but I am still maintaining the
registry. Only 4-5 people have sent me info.
I am away from my desk and don't have access to the URL/e-mail addr right now. I will
send it to you later.
alan
On May 1, 2016, at 13:36, Lee Courtney <leec2124 at
gmail.com> wrote:
I have a vague recollection of this - have you reached out to Alan to
determine current status?
Lee C.
On Sun, May 1, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Toby Thain <toby at telegraphics.com.au>
wrote:
--
Lee Courtney
+1-650-704-3934 cell
On
2015-07-06 11:03 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
Since I've heard of a few 11/750's having been rescued recently, I'm
reposting this in case anyone wants to regster with Alan or, if his list is
defunct, start a new registry...
--Toby
1:58 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
I just saw this was sent to the 750 email address I set up. I'll find the URL this
evening.
On May 1, 2016, at 13:36, Lee Courtney <leec2124 at
gmail.com> wrote:
I have a vague recollection of this - have you reached out to Alan to
determine current status?
Lee C.
On Sun, May 1, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Toby Thain <toby at telegraphics.com.au>
wrote:
--
Lee Courtney
+1-650-704-3934 cell
On
2015-07-06 11:03 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750 registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
Since I've heard of a few 11/750's having been rescued recently, I'm
reposting this in case anyone wants to regster with Alan or, if his list is
defunct, start a new registry...
--Toby 
2:03 p.m.
New subject: VAX-11/750 registry (Was: Reviving a VAX-11/750)
On 5/1/16 1:36 PM, Lee Courtney wrote:
I have a vague recollection of this - have you reached
out to Alan to
determine current status?
Lee C.
I actually ended up with Alan's 11/750 (which is now up and running,
thanks to help from people here), so I don't know if he's still
interested in running the registry, but maybe he can pass the mantle
onto someone else...
- Josh
On Sun, May 1, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Toby Thain <toby at telegraphics.com.au>
wrote:
On 2015-07-06 11:03 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
Is there any interest in starting a VAX-11/750
registry? I wouldn't
mind knowing who else out there has one and where they are now. If you
are interested, send me e-mail (vax11-750 at snowmoose.com).
alan
Since I've heard of a few 11/750's having been rescued recently, I'm
reposting this in case anyone wants to regster with Alan or, if his list is
defunct, start a new registry...
--Toby
2922
days inactive
3243
days old
41 comments
17 participants
participants (17)
-
a.carlini＠ntlworld.com -
aperry＠snowmoose.com -
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
billdegnan＠gmail.com -
bob＠jfcl.com -
bqt＠update.uu.se -
captainkirk359＠gmail.com -
chocolatejollis38＠gmail.com -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
derschjo＠gmail.com -
jwest＠classiccmp.org -
leec2124＠gmail.com -
mattislind＠gmail.com -
nf6x＠nf6x.net -
p.gebhardt＠ymail.com -
pontus＠Update.UU.SE -
toby＠telegraphics.com.au