And the "AOS Windows" Disk is NOT MS-Windows... the ONLY reason that any of
the disks say anything about MS is that at that point Xenix was still owned
my Microsoft....
At 03:39 AM 2/28/02 -0600, you wrote:
>On Thu, 28 Feb 2002, Bill Dawson wrote:
>
> > This page says it all:
> >
> > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2004856941
> >
> > And check out the TOS! ROLF.
>
>Gosh, what an idiot... I might even have a similar set of disks around
>somewhere.
>
>-Toth
Is there info somewhere that shows how symbols are encoded onto paper
tape?
Ideally it would include the actual hole positions like so:
8 4 2 1
A: *
B: *
C: * *
(Note: this is not an actual example but just an example of the format
I'm looking for. Of course.)
Thanks!
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
Once upon a time....
There were a bunch of these in the early hobby channel,
say, around 1981... the seller had complete instructions
for interfacing them, and included some rudimentary code
for using overstrikes to simulate characters bot available
in its 5-level (Murray?) coding scheme.
They were going for $150 at the time, and I still could
kick myself for not grabbing one, they looked pretty cool.
Anyone got a garage full of them?
-dq
> > Peart came in, and while they were impressed with his
> > drumming abilities, they were also thinking, "Hey! This guy can READ!"
Reminds me of the guy who went to an audition and was asked by the band
leader if he could read music.
He replied, "Not enough to screw up my playing."
Also reminds me of "programmers" who can "write code" but seem unable to
read other people's code. Has anyone else had this experience? I run into
this sort of person all the time . . .
Glen
0/0
Do you have any pictures of this telecompaq? I have a chance to buy one and
was wondering what it looked like. What is it, 286, 386, 8088 or something
else? Thanks for any help!
Nathan
Ok, Here's what I am doing for backup to DC tape drive..
~500 mb per tape:
tar -cvf /dev/st0 -L 500000 /root /etc (... mention many directories)
is this correct for backup or do I need any other flags?
How do I do an incremental?
(This is assuming that I am using a "Classic" system running
unix...)
How do I recover a file?
Thanks.
On Feb 28, 6:16, Tothwolf wrote:
> Cat5 (category 5 rated) cable is more appropriately called UTP
(unshielded
> twisted pair) cable. UTP cable is not shielded, and for serial
> applications, the category rating isn't very important. Keep in mind that
> category '5e' cable is much more difficult to work with compared to
> category 5/4/3 if you are planning to install RJ45 connectors yourself,
> due to molded pairs.
I've only seen one brand of Cat5e with pairs bonded. Almost all the Cat5e
I've worked with is very easy to untwist. "Cat6" is usually bonded,
though.
> As far as wire colors go, UTP cable has a standard
> color code for the individual pairs, but the pinout varies depending on
> the application for the cable.
There are three standards for that, TIA 568A, TIA 568B, and USOC.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Feb 28, 14:48, Sean 'Captain Napalm' Conner wrote:
> Do you mean for the outside sleeve, or the individual wires in the
cable?
> For the outside, there is no real standard color that I'm aware of,
although
> there is a standard ordering for the wires when crimping (I think it goes
> orange, green, brown, blue (solid followed by white and color) but don't
> quote me on that---it's been awhile since I've crimped CAT5 network
cables).
Not quite. It's white-with-colour then plain colour (or colour with a thin
white stripe or rings), and the common order in Europe is T568B (aka 258A):
white/orange pin 1
orange
white/green
blue
white/blue
green
white/brown
brown pin 8
I believe the common order in the States is to swap orange and green pairs,
which is T568A. If you use one scheme at one end and the other scheme at
the opposite end, you have a standard Ethernet crossover cable. ie, pins 1
and 2 are swapped with pins 3 and 6 but pins 4+5 and 7+8 are
straight-through.
> But for a regular CAT5 cable, as long as you use the same order for each
> end, it'll work fine.
Almost. You need to keep the pairs as pairs, on pins 1/2, 3/6, 4/5, and
7/8.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
Commands such as FORMAT, DISKCOPY and DISKCOMP ignore drive reassignments.
Perhaps the MS install program did something similar to these commands.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 2:04 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Multiple floppies in one system?
<snip>
BUT, ...
The INSTALL program of MS-DOS 6.00 would NOT work with an ASSIGNed drive!
Thought it would be interesting to do a Windows screen driver for the HP
95LX :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Douglas Quebbeman [mailto:dhquebbeman@theestopinalgroup.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 10:08 AM
To: 'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org'
Subject: RE: Windows 3.1 DDK
>
> Does anyone have the Windows _3.0_ SDK/DDK?
>
Interesting request... planning on writing any
real-mode Windows drivers?
-dq
I've got the scanner and adapter box for the Macintosh Thunderscan that
I no longer want. $5.00 including Priority Mail shipping in the US (they
include the box :)!) Email me if interested.
Hello, all:
Does anyone have the Windows 3.1 DDK (device driver deveopment kit)?
I'm looking for it to do some spleunking of Win3.1 kernel code. I already
have the SDK, but I need the DDK.
Thanks.
Rich
Does anyone have a line on old office chairs with FOUR
legs instead of the fscking OSHA-mandated FIVE legs?
It is impossible to roll around in one of these
without, when you roll back forward, having a
single leg protruding such that it hits *anything*
that might be in the way, like a table leg...
grrr...
I am attempting to recover some files from a DECTAPE II cartridge.
They are in RT-11 format, so the most useful drive would be a TU-58.
Does anyone have a spare drive that they are willing to sell or at
least rent for a long time? The one that I prefer is a dual desk
top box with its own internal power supply and a 10 pin header on
the back for connection to an RS-232 channel so it can be connected
easily to a DLV11-J (or any other DL channel on a PDP-11 with some
wiring changes).
A TU-58 is normally standard with a PDP-11/44, so if the 11/44 is not
in a state to be rescued, that at least if there is a TU-58 available,
please contact me. They may also have been used with a VAX 11/780.
On Feb 28, 16:04, Douglas Quebbeman wrote:
> Once upon a time....
>
> There were a bunch of these in the early hobby channel,
> say, around 1981... the seller had complete instructions
> for interfacing them, and included some rudimentary code
> for using overstrikes to simulate characters bot available
> in its 5-level (Murray?) coding scheme.
>
> They were going for $150 at the time, and I still could
> kick myself for not grabbing one, they looked pretty cool.
>
> Anyone got a garage full of them?
Nope, my first printer was a 7B -- about 1981 -- but it's long since gone.
It cost me a lot less than $150! I'm sure I've mentioned before how I
wrote a driver for a Sorcerer for it, and how I changed the positions of
some of the type slugs to make overstrikes easier.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
any body know what the instuction set for the MZ3850 CPU is or better still
sourse code for the racal RA6790/gm or variant of that rx so i can change the
cpu for one that works.
On Feb 27, 22:48, Andreas Freiherr wrote:
> Also, the last three locations are slightly different, but this
> shouldn't present a problem:
>
> 2130 005000 CLR R0
> 2132 005007 CLR PC (my favourite PDP-11 instruction, really!)
> 2134 000000 HALT
I've seen one like that too.
> > sectors, not two. The reason for missing the even-numbered sectors is
> > because they are software interleaved to give time for the memory
transfers
> > between reads.
>
> I thought this is done by spacing the sectors on the disk surface (like
> 1, 13, 2, 14, etc.) and having drive electronics deal with the sector
> number from the preamble? Consequently, this would be a property of the
> floppy that would be implemented when the media was formatted.
RX02s are usually formatted with the physical sectors in strict order, so
software interleave is used.
> > Some versions actually have the HALT elsewhere. I once spent ages
trying
> > to work out the shortest variation on this bootstrap, IIRC I managed to
> > save just one word.
>
> I think more significant savings could perhaps be obtained by
> initializing a stack at the beginning and then using a subroutine like
>
> WAITRX: BIT R0, (R1)
> BEQ $-4
> BMI ABORT
> RTS PC
> ABORT: HALT
>
> to wait for any of the TR, ERR or DONE bits to come up, instead of
> repeating these instructions every time.
Possibly. But if you work it out completely, I think you'll find you save
very little. Not all of the tests are checking for an error, either.
> Since you never set the INTR ENB bit in the RX2CS register, you just
> need to keep your fingers crossed so no other device will issue an
> interrupt request... ;-)
Yes :-)
> Yes. But this is neither a typo nor a printing error. If you read four
> blocks of 200(8) _words_ each, starting at zero, you fill exactly
> 2000(8) _bytes_, and the next free location is 2000(8). As you state,
> the printed version is prepared for conversion to single density (by
> clearing the 400 bit in locations 2036 and 2072, right?) by reading in
> four blocks... - So, the reason is somewhat similar to that for the
> TS-11.
Yes, but if it's single density, which is the only reason you'd read four
sectors, the sectors are 128 bytes [100(8)] not 256, so it's still only
1000(8).
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Feb 28, 0:16, Ethan Dicks wrote:
> --- Johnny Billquist <bqt(a)update.uu.se> wrote:
> > On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Jochen Kunz wrote:
> > > On 2002.02.27 05:04 Gunther Schadow wrote:
> > >
> > > > I have the UDA50 manual
>
> Would that be EK-UDA50-UG-003? That's all I could turn up after
> pawing through stuff that isn't in storage.
> > I would really like to get my hands on the UDA50 programming manual. It
> > seems to be extremely rare.
>
> I'd say so.
I have two manuals that are relevant:
"MSCP Basic Disk Functions Manual
AA-L619A-TK Version 1.2
A part of UDA50 Programmer's
Doc. Kit
QP-905-GZ
First Edition
April 1982"
and
"Storage System Diagnostics
and Utility Protocol
AA-L620A-TK
A part of UDA50 Programmer's
Doc. Kit
QP905-GZ"
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
> > > The Assign command works wonders in cases like these. Unfortunately
> > > MicroSoulth dropped it from their later versions of DOS. Still you can
> > > probaly use a copy from an older DOS and use other DOS cammand (that I
> > > can't think of the name of) to fake it into thinking that it's running
> > > under it's native DOS version.
> >
> > Could you be thinking of 'setver' (or was it called something else?)
>
> The MS-DOS ASSIGN command let you assign a drive letter for a drive, sort
> of like an alias.
>
> I think the syntax was:
>
> ASSIGN D: C:
>
> Meaning D: would be the equivalent of C:
Wow, sounds just like the DOS/CMD.EXE (NT, 2000) command called
SUBST
as in identical syntax...
-dq
In the "useless trivia" category, DEC Rainbows all support 4 floppies (= 2
x RX50 drive) out of the box, though most came with only one RX50.
IMPDRV, by Warner Losh, will let you hook up a 3.5" drive in place of one
of those RX50's.
However, I know of no way to get "normal" 5.25" or 8" drives hung onto the
Rainbow, so I strongly suspect this is not of much use to you.
- Mark
The format depends on the program writing the tape, binary or text.
In "Binary" tapes, the eight holes correspond to a "byte", which is just loaded into memory, byte-by-byte.
The problem is that paper tape readers are error prone and any binary error was a potential crash.
To solve this problem, the Altair Basic "Boot" loader starts with a straight binary tape.
The straight binary formart continues for a few hundred bytes during which a "checksum loader" is read.
Then a special binary code on the tape triggers a jump from the "boot loader" to the "checksum loader".
You can recognize the blocks of the checksum loader on the tape, because every foot or two, you see a code that consistently repeats.
Text format paper tapes are almost always simple, standard ASCII codes translated into binary.
Text format can be recognized because, in those days, ASCII was almost always limited to 7-bits.
This means that the tape has a column on one edge with very few holes -- that is the column 8.
The other side is column 1.
Here is a link to an excellent 7-bit ASCII table that I just found:
http://www.neurophys.wisc.edu/www/comp/docs/ascii.html
Here is a clip from it:
Decimal Octal Hex Binary Value
065 101 041 01000001 A
066 102 042 01000010 B
067 103 043 01000011 C
068 104 044 01000100 D
069 105 045 01000101 E
So with column 8 on the left, you read like this:
(Holes in the tape translate to binary "1"s.)
xOxxxxxO translates to 01000001 binary -- which is the octal 101 -- which is a capital "A".
xOxxxOxO translates to 01000101 binary -- which is the octal 105 -- which is a capital "E".
Most of us found "Octal" codes easiest to work with manually -- Hex became popular later.
Got It ?
-----Original Message-----
From: Vintage Computer Festival [SMTP:vcf@vintage.org]
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 5:51 AM
To: Classic Computers Mailing List
Subject: Need paper tape encoding format
Is there info somewhere that shows how symbols are encoded onto paper
tape?
Ideally it would include the actual hole positions like so:
8 4 2 1
A: *
B: *
C: * *
(Note: this is not an actual example but just an example of the format
I'm looking for. Of course.)
Thanks!
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
> Robert F Schaefer wrote:
>
>Apparently the thought was to sell/bundle the 90 degree cable, to
force the
>purchaser to `upgrade' to the straight cable when it was necessry
to plug
>in more than one SCSI device. I cursed it soundly when I realized
it
>obstructed the pass-thru connector on the back of the TK50 I have.
As all
>my other SCSI toys have the HD connectors, I might have to end up
getting a
>50-pin centronics-like :) M-F cable to connect things.
Sometimes the 90-degree cable works best and sometimes
the straight one works best. The 90-degree ones work
nicely at the back of a VS4000 ... not so much
spce is needed at the back of the box (vents
are at the sides!).
Same deal goes with the 90-degree vs straight
ethernet connectors.
Horses for courses.
Antonio
ASSIGN (with the format such as "assign a=c" -- no colons allowed)
"Instructs DOS to route disk I/O requests for one drive into disk I/O
requests for another drive" (IBM DOS 3.30 Ref Manual).
SUBST (with the format such as "subst g: c:\foo\bar") "Allows you to use a
different drive specifier to refer to another drive or path." It's useful
where a program does not recognize paths, but does recognize different drive
letters.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: Douglas Quebbeman [mailto:dhquebbeman@theestopinalgroup.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 1:27 PM
To: 'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org'
Subject: RE: Multiple floppies in one system?
> > > The Assign command works wonders in cases like these. Unfortunately
> > > MicroSoulth dropped it from their later versions of DOS. Still you can
> > > probaly use a copy from an older DOS and use other DOS cammand (that I
> > > can't think of the name of) to fake it into thinking that it's running
> > > under it's native DOS version.
> >
> > Could you be thinking of 'setver' (or was it called something else?)
>
> The MS-DOS ASSIGN command let you assign a drive letter for a drive, sort
> of like an alias.
>
> I think the syntax was:
>
> ASSIGN D: C:
>
> Meaning D: would be the equivalent of C:
Wow, sounds just like the DOS/CMD.EXE (NT, 2000) command called
SUBST
as in identical syntax...
-dq
Well, I've been searching for RK05 alignment packs, and though I've been
very successful, I was hoping to find some at a cheaper price (hey, it
never hurts to try...)
Anyways, so far i've found 3 RK05 alignment packs available at various
DEC resellers, but they are $150 each. And both 12 and 16 sector packs
for $50 each for that matter. If someone is desperate enough to be
interested at these prices, just let me know.
-Lawrence LeMay
lemay(a)cs.umn.edu
On Feb 28, 12:26, William S. wrote:
> By shielded do you mean CAT5 cable? I was planning on
> using that. Speaking of which, is there a proper
> color to use? ie) grey, red, blue? This will only
> be a home setup but was wondering if there is an
> official color code.
Cat5 and Cat5e are UTP (unshielded). There is an equivalent shielded (STP)
cable but it's a slightly different impedance so it's not Cat5 standard.
No, there isn't an official colour code, though many sites have a local
convention. Ours is to use black for serial, purple for crossovers, yellow
for student network, pink or brown for telecomms, and other colours ad-hoc
to distinguish various subnets in areas where more than one is in use.
Where I worked before, the code was
grey normal network
purple crossed cable
orange uplink cable, not crossed but connected to one that is
yellow student network in a staff area (or vice versa)
pink management network
green telephone connection
blue ISDN connection
red temporary connection -- do not touch
black serial connection
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
Wow, that's amazing!! I haven't seen anything like it from JDR
since the 80's! A JDR product offering with something resembling
a reasonable selling price!
Are you sure that's not a typo on their webpage!?!?
I think I'm going to faint . . .
;^)
Jeff
On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 00:06:32 GMT pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com (Pete
Turnbull) writes:
> On Feb 27, 17:23, Russ Blakeman wrote:
> > Well SOB - they still sell the MCT 8 bit 4 floppy controller -
> about
> 1/5th
> > of what it used to cost in 85...here's a link to it:
> >
> > http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=MCT-FDC-HD4
>
> Interesting. Anyone know if it supports single density, and/or
> works with
> 8" drives (in conjunction with suitable cable adaptor)?
>
> --
> Pete Peter Turnbull
> Network Manager
> University of York
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.
Because of the NatSemi 32000 manuals described on my web site
at http://www.threedee.com/jcm/library/, I received this inquiry:
"I am collecting manuals for RISC-type processors of the early 1990s.
I haven't been able to find Power/Power 2 (the processor/s inside the
IBM RS/6000 computers)... Why is that? "
I know nothing of those machines. Can someone help me with
an answer I can forward?
- John
At 08:49 AM 2/28/02 -0600, you wrote:
>On Thu, 28 Feb 2002, Joe wrote:
>
>> The Assign command works wonders in cases like these. Unfortunately
>> MicroSoulth dropped it from their later versions of DOS. Still you can
>> probaly use a copy from an older DOS and use other DOS cammand (that I
>> can't think of the name of) to fake it into thinking that it's running
>> under it's native DOS version.
>
>Could you be thinking of 'setver'
Yes, that's it. I couldn't remember the name.
Joe
On Feb 28, 1:06, Ethan Dicks wrote:
> > the "systematic" name (used almost everywhere *by chemists*)
> > is "propan-2-ol"...
>
> Since it's been years since I've been in a chem lab... when did this
> naming convention hit the States? In 1985, I'm fairly certain we
> called it isopropanol. Perhaps my education was behind the times.
Dunno. Perhaps it never did, but that's the systmatic nomenclature form.
To be fair, though, the systematic names are more useful for more complex
molecules, where there would otherwise be amiguity.
> > > Even "aluminum" is different, but I don't remember how different...
> >
> > You mean "aluminium" :-) Like sodium, potassium, uranium, ...
>
> Platinium... err, wait... nevermind. ;-)
Why do you think I didn't use that example? :-) Or molybdenium, tantalium,
lanthanium. There are 65 elements whose names end in "ium", only four that
end in "um" not "ium", and just one that varies according to geography :-)
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
In a message dated 2/28/2002 11:23:42 AM Central Standard Time,
geneb(a)deltasoft.com writes:
> On Thu, 28 Feb 2002, Tothwolf wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 28 Feb 2002, Bill Dawson wrote:
> >
> > > This page says it all:
> > >
> > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2004856941
> > >
> > > And check out the TOS! ROLF.
> >
> > Gosh, what an idiot... I might even have a similar set of disks around
> > somewhere.
> >
> Ahh, but were they hand carried to "Prevent Pirate Copy's"? *snicker*
>
> g.
>
here is his reply to me. I asked about collector qualifications, prepaid
accomodations to out-of-area people to meet him and the provenance of the
disks.
>I asked for a collector, due to keeping the ppl away that tend to
pest......the >exchange part just prevent eg: you buy the software and I send
you, you copy then >send back to me and say it dosent work, nothing fancy,
just like selling a Porche >and not letting every Tom, Dick and Hairy drive
it.
www.nothingtodo.org
I second the motion -- this is getting ridiculous.
I also volunteer to assist in moderation duties. Since I've run out of
space, time, and money I have no desire to acquire any more machines, so I
won't be tempted try to beat the list out of a fair shot at getting
equipment offered by non-subscribers.
And while I'm on a roll, here: Doc, how about coughing up the name of the
list-member who tried to pull a fast one on you so that the rest of us can
know how to deal with this person in future transactions? Kinda like Ebay
feedback??
Glen
0/0
----------
> From: John Allain <allain(a)panix.com>
> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: Re: Stanco della solita routine quotidiana??
> Date: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:06 AM
>
> Untitled DocumentChrissakes, no nonsubscribers!
>
> John A.
>
I'm putting together an old 486 system, one of whose main purposes will be to
read/write floppies of several formats. Like 5.25" 360K, 720K, 1.2M, RX50, etc.,
and 3.5" 720K and 1.44M. I also want to be able to copy RX50s disk to disk on
the appropriate drive type.
So I figure it'll take 4 drives (or maybe 3 drives where one is a 3.5"/5.25"
combo). All of these would be in one enclosure.
The question is, how to do this without having to unplug/plug drives every
time you want to make a configuration change? It would be nice to just be
able to throw a switch or two to re-configure. Not having to get into the
enclosure would be nice, too.
I've thought of two ways to do it, but I'm not sure they'll work, or if there
might not be a better way.
1) Plug all the drives into one control cable and switch on/off the power
to the drives to select them.
2) Plug all the drives into one control cable and select the drives by
switching a control line on the control cable.
Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Dave
--
David C. Jenner
djenner(a)earthlink.net
Does anyone have the Windows _3.0_ SDK/DDK?
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Holley [mailto:swtpc6800@attbi.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:52 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Windows 3.1 DDK
I have a complete July 1995 Microsoft Developer Network CR-ROM set. It has a
Windows 3.1 DDK CD. Send me an email with your address and I will mail you a
copy of the DDK CD.
Michael Holley
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cini, Richard" <RCini(a)congressfinancial.com>
To: "'ClassCompList'" <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:06 AM
Subject: Windows 3.1 DDK
> Hello, all:
>
> Does anyone have the Windows 3.1 DDK (device driver deveopment kit)?
> I'm looking for it to do some spleunking of Win3.1 kernel code. I already
> have the SDK, but I need the DDK.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Rich
>
>
On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:48:02 -0600 (CST) Tothwolf
<tothwolf(a)concentric.net> writes:
> On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 jeff.kaneko(a)juno.com wrote:
>
> > Wow, that's amazing!! I haven't seen anything like it from JDR
> since
> > the 80's! A JDR product offering with something resembling a
> > reasonable selling price!
> >
> > Are you sure that's not a typo on their webpage!?!?
> > I think I'm going to faint . . .
>
> I donno, that seems kinda high to me... Especially considering a
> pair of ISA floppy controllers could be had for $10 ($5ea), or less.
Well, consider that it's somewhat specialized (not 'stock'), NOS,
and that the asking price is only 100% over what it's worth looks
like a milestone to me!
> JDR's "house brand" boards were nothing but re-badged major brand
> and 'cheap junk' boards. They used to peel/scrape stickers and markings
> off of boards made by companies such as Adaptec, Diamond, Promise, and
> others before taking photos for their catalog. I might still have some
of
> those old catalogs around somewhere, but I probably tossed them.
Hah! Reminds me of a reseller I used to work for. This Bozo would
re-label *everything* (including the manuals). It was embarassing.
Jeff
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.
As seen on Slashdot:
Senators propose recycling fee on new PCs:
http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1103-843109.html
A proposed bill like this one tends to cause me to worry...
I've already seen firsthand the mess that the Texas bill that was passed
for 'Data Processing Equipment' has caused.
-Toth
The Teletype and IBM manuals I posted a couple weeks ago are being sent off to
a good home. Thanks to everyone who expressed interest!
- Dan Wright
(dtwright(a)uiuc.edu)
(http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright)
-] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [-
``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread,
For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.''
Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan
> 2) Plug all the drives into one control cable and select the drives by
> switching a control line on the control cable.
This is how I'd go, but the BIOS will only understand units 0 and 1,
you'll need a device driver for units 2 & 3.
Oh, and you'll need a *real* floppy interface cable, instead of
the butchered IBM-style floppy cable that *every* PC I've seen
has, except for the Zenith Z-150 family.
-dq
Joe,
I think I remember using a Videologic DVA-4000. It was used to overlay NTSC
video over VGA video. If I remember, you setup a specific color "block"
through the VGA, and the NTSC came through that "window." Kinda like my
understanding of Chroma-keying (sp?) Another thing it could do was overlay
the VGA with "transparent" NTSC.
We used it for demos of a ruggedized PC we were building at the time. It
could do some impressive (at the time!) stuff. I don't recall the
programming particulars, but don't remember it being that difficult.
Let me know if you want further info.
Gary
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe [mailto:rigdonj@cfl.rr.com]
> Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 8:09 AM
> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: Re: Multiple floppies in one system?
>
>
> At 03:56 PM 2/27/02 -0800, Dave wrote:
> >Wow, thanks for all the good ideas, and there's probably
> more to come!
> >
> >I like the idea of getting a controller that will handle four drives.
> >One of my 486 boards requires an ISA controller card, and the other,
> >I think, lets you disable the onboard floppy controller, if
> necessary.
> >
> >As Russ pointed out, there still is one available at JDR.
> (I'll also
> >check the bins at RE-PC.) Is the Compaticard IV available anywhere?
>
> Yes, they turn up on e-bay occasionallly. I frequently find them in
> surplus stores. I go to one store in particular that rips
> apart PCs and
> puts all the cards out on the shelves without sorting through
> them. I've
> found several Compaticards there. The other thing that I do
> is to ALLWAYS
> look at the backs of all the PCs that show up in the scrap
> places that I
> visit and look for unusual connectors. I've found lots of
> intersting cards
> that way including a $30,000+ GPS reciever card.
>
>
> >It looks like the neatest solution, especially if I can hook
> 8" external
> >drives to it, too.
>
> I think it's the best way especially if you want to play
> with unusual
> formats. You can get the optional Uniform software that the
> manufacturer of
> Compaticard sold (sells?) and it will let you read all kinds
> of odd formats.
>
> Speaking of odd cards, a few days ago I spotted a strange
> one. It's a
> full length PC card with a long cable coming out of the back.
> The other end
> of the cable splits out into three pigtails, two have RCA
> plugs and the
> other had a BNC connector. The card was made by Video Logic
> in the UK and I
> think it was a model DVA 4000. Is anyone familar with it?
>
> Joe
>
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> Wow, that's amazing!! I haven't seen anything like it from JDR
> since the 80's! A JDR product offering with something resembling
> a reasonable selling price!
>
> Are you sure that's not a typo on their webpage!?!?
> I think I'm going to faint . . .
The beancounter founder must have finally croaked...
;)
Sorry for the intrusion folks :-)
Colin,
Tried to send a message but your mail server bounced my email. I have the
remainder of the books packaged and need your mailing address.
Reply directly to me at:
STEVEN_J_ROBERTSON(a)HOTMAIL.COM
Thanks,
SteveRob
_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com
In a message dated 2/25/02 12:36:36 PM Pacific Standard Time,
gkicomputers(a)yahoo.com writes:
> whether it was recycled or not is irrelevent, either
> way it would be illegal in USPS eyes and thats the
> only thing that, legally speaking anyway, is
> i
I am not sure I understand you? I use Priority mail and order boxes by the
carton.
For me to turn a NEW box inside out and use it to ship some other way would
be illegal.
If my customer who receives a priority mail package, opens it and then reuses
the box (by folding it inside out), I don't think they are breaking the law.
Most of the Priority mail boxes use a glue to self seal. You then pull a tear
strip to open the box. Technically the box is destroyed. However the small
video tape size boxes really lend themselves to reuse by turning them inside
out and taping them. I suspect this secondary use is not illegal. I call this
recycling.
Now a friend of mine bought a bunch of new USPS Priority Mail supplies in a
lot at an auction. For him to use these inside out would be illegal even
though he is not signed up with the Post Office Priority Mail.
He was actually after the 26 pallets of new blank cardboard boxes with them
which he sold on the secondary market.
Paxton
Astoria
--- Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> wrote:
> "iso-propyl alcohol" is the "old" name for it; "iso-propanol" is a more
> modern version of the same name;
Agreed.
> the "systematic" name (used almost everywhere *by chemists*)
> is "propan-2-ol"...
Since it's been years since I've been in a chem lab... when did this
naming convention hit the States? In 1985, I'm fairly certain we
called it isopropanol. Perhaps my education was behind the times.
> > Even "aluminum" is different, but I don't remember how different...
>
> You mean "aluminium" :-) Like sodium, potassium, uranium, ...
Platinium... err, wait... nevermind. ;-)
-ethan
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion!
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On Feb 27, 20:49, Zane H. Healy wrote:
> OK, what I see that concerns me is the fact you're using a 11/03 box.
> Unless I'm mistaken the 11/03 was only Q16, which has me wondering how
> you're even running a 11/23 CPU, which should be Q18, in it (it's
possible
> someone upgraded the backplane to be 18-bit).
An 11/03 backplane is already 18-bit. BDAL16 and BDAL17 are bussed so it
can use parity memory.
It's also easy to upgrade to 22-bit, by soldering wrirewrap wire onto the
extra 4 lines, though any 11/23 or 11/23+ will work fine (as an 18-bit
system) without doing that. I can't think of anything that will fail to
work on such a system, apart from software that needs more than 124KW of
memory, obviously. Specifically, I/O page access will work coreectly for
any properly designed device, and RT-11, RSX-11, etc will just see it as a
normal 18-bit system.
Oh, and an 11/23 would work fine on a 16-bit backplane, unless you wanted
to use parity memory. The MMU wouldn't be useful (you could take it out,
though you don't have to; an 11/23 will work fine with 28KW and no MMU
chip).
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
Hi.
Now that my RX01/02 driver for NetBSD and the accompanying "NetBSD
device driver writing HOWTO" is nearly finished, I am looking forward
for further challenges. I think will stay in the disk (and tape)
department and write support for DSSI. I know that this is not a trivial
task, but I will give it a serious try. So I have the usual problem:
docs.
I need docs about DSSI, the protocols that are used on it, the host
adapter chips (SII and SHAC), MSCP, SCS, ... The KA6[46789]0 CPU and
KDA50 / UDA50 programmers manuals should be a good start. So if this
docs are online somwhere on the net, please give me a link.
Thanks for your help.
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
> [TOPS-20...]
>
> Well, I'd like to run a TOPS-10 instead, seeing as there are already two
> perfectly good TOPS-20 machines (Toad and XKLeTen) on the net, but TOPS-10
> does not support TCP/IP, and therefore won't run multi-user under KLH10.
SIMH can do this now with a bogus DZ11 implementation, similar to
what you were previously doing with Tim Stark's emulator...
-dq
Having what appears to be some sort of "applications processor" made
by NEC, model 3401, class 5451, as well as another box labeled "class
H6830-STD1-01-46," and not being able to obtain any information or
documentation about this equipment, I'm not quite sure what do with
them other than take them apart for parts. On the 3401, there are
three ports labeled "LS Link," four labeled "HS Link," two labeled
"System Bus" (channel A and channel B) and a diagnostics port.
If anyone has a need for these boxes, or can provide me with any
information about using them, then I'll consider not taking them
apart, as tempting as that option is, considering that: they're taking
up a fair amount of space, and have some useful ICs, wire, fans, PSUs,
LEDs, memory, etc. inside, and the one case could be modified to hold
several 5-1/4" hard drives and the PSU. I'd really like to find a way
to use this equipment in it's present assembled form, however. :-)
--
Copyright (C) 2001 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals:
All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature &
rdd(a)rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such
http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.
On Feb 27, 10:48, Tom Leffingwell wrote:
> It does look like it wants to go back to track zero. If I manually line
> it up just right, it will power up correctly, but as soon as it wants to
> go somewhere, the problem starts over. Meanwhile, the other drive lines
> itself up just fine.
Then it's possible that the drive to the stepper motor that turns the
leadscrew is, er, screwed. It might only be one phase; if you can turn it
easily by hand when it's powered up, then it's probably not being driven at
all so look for a destroyed driver or lack of 12V (or is it 24V? ). If it
tends to settle into certain positions and won't step but does sort of
vibrate and isn't very easy to turn by hand when the power is on, it's
probably just one phase; look for a blown driver transistor (if the drive
has such) or a faulty stepper driver IC. It's also possible (though
unlikely, in my experience) that one of the coils in the motor has burnt
out. You can check that with an ohmmeter, comparing it to the working one.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Feb 27, 17:23, Russ Blakeman wrote:
> Well SOB - they still sell the MCT 8 bit 4 floppy controller - about
1/5th
> of what it used to cost in 85...here's a link to it:
>
> http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=MCT-FDC-HD4
Interesting. Anyone know if it supports single density, and/or works with
8" drives (in conjunction with suitable cable adaptor)?
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Feb 27, 12:21, Andreas Freiherr wrote:
> Darn! - I disassembled the whole stuff manually yesterday evening!
:-) I apologise for the slightly non-standard syntax used, notably for
octal constants; it was rewritten for (and then assembled by) a home-grown
cross-assembler.
> Non-obvious is that only two sectors (1 and 3) need to be read: the code
> in the manual continues up to sector 7 (constant in word 2124, or in
> your copy, at 1124), in steps of 2 (BTW, why are even sectors skipped?).
I think there were actually three errors in my original copy. Anyway, the
version on my website is now correct. It's not the only way to do it, I've
seen other versions (there are similar versions, not identical, but
interestingly enough with mostly the same errors, in various RT-11 manuals,
the Microcomputer Peripherals Handbook, and the RX02 Pocket Service Guide).
The reason for the number of sectors is that you can use the same bootstrap
with trivial alterations for a single-density boot, but then you need four.
sectors, not two. The reason for missing the even-numbered sectors is
because they are software interleaved to give time for the memory transfers
between reads.
> The most non-obvious error is using the word at location 1132 either as
> a HALT instruction (when aborting bootstrap due to an error detected by
> one of the BMIs) or as a constant to load into R0 (when finishing
> bootstrap and passing control to address zero, for which a CLR PC is an
> excellent JMP @#0 replacement). My copy of the LSI-11 manual had this
> completely wrong - it would fail to abort properly.
Some versions actually have the HALT elsewhere. I once spent ages trying
to work out the shortest variation on this bootstrap, IIRC I managed to
save just one word.
> Starting the bootstrap might be easiest with a 1000G (or in the original
> copy, 2000G). one command shorter than setting R7 to 1000 and then
> <P>roceeding.
The reason for the <P> instead of <G> is to avoid a bus reset, which makes
the RX02 and some processors "do things". And you're supposed to disable
interrupts by setting a mask in RS first. It doesn't use the stack,
though, and any decent second-stage boot should set R6, so I suspect that's
redundant.
I'm surprised your version starts at 2000. By convention, all normal
bootstraps and similar start at 1000 -- the best-known exceptions being
XXDP code (starts at 200, same as on a PDP-8) and the TS11 bootstrap which
starts at 10000 (to allow space for larger tape blocks).
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Feb 26, 13:41, Tom Leffingwell wrote:
>
> The first message I normally see is RT-11 loading...I never have to do
> anything, it just boots from DY0:. If I don't have a disk in, or its
> messed up for whatever reason, I get:
>
> 173326
> @
>
> I looked a little closer inside the unit, and it doesn't seem to have a
> belt. There's a worm actuator that shakes when on power up when it tries
> to move back to its starting place. It can be moved by hand easily, so
> it doesn't seem to be binding.
That's the head positioner leadscrew. On powerup or a Bus Init, it should
move back to track zero (maybe only if there's a disk in ithe drive,
depending on the controller). The drive belt is on the underside of the
drive. They often fall off.
A quick way to test if the drive is turning, is to take a floppy, trun the
disk in the jacket until the sector hole is visible in the round hoe in the
jacket, put it in the drive, close the door, open the door, take the disk
out, and see if the sector hole is still visible. Most 8" drives rotate
all the time, so closing the door (which clamps the disk to the spindle)
should turn it. The odds of the sector hole ending up in exactly the same
place after this are minimal. It doesn't tell you if the drive is running
at the correct speed, but it will tell you if it's not turning at all.
If not, the most common causes are that the drive belt has slipped off the
pulley, or that the plastic collet which clamps the disk has broken and
isn't clamping, or not well enough.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
> Until I have a pressing need for 64 bits, I will probably keep this
> box at a low priority, but if any of the PDP-10 emulators would
> rather be on a medium to slow-speed 64-bit machine rather than on a
> medium to fast 32-bit machine, I might dust it off. I just don't see
> where it's anything besides cool for the sake of cool right now.
I've not tried running KLH10 on the AlphaStation 200 4/233 running OpenBSD I
have, but I've run the PDP-10 version of SIMH on it. You really don't want
to do that. It was usable, BUT it was *CONSIDERABLY* slower than a KS10.
I've got a 500Mhz Celeron w/256MB RAM, and a 8MB HD plugged into a bare
MicroATX i810 board sitting on a shelf. It makes a killer PDP-10, and can
run two copies of SIMH (TOPS-10 7.03 and TOPS-20 4.1) at or faster than KS10
speeds. Of course what I really like is the 1Ghz PIII running KLH10 running
TOPS-20 V7.0, especially since I can telnet directly into it :^)
Zane
PS anyone looking for information on emulating DEC systems should see:
http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/decemu.html especially for PDP-10 emulation.
Jochen wrote:
> You mean it is possible to speak MSCP on a DSSI bus without
> an additional protocol layer?
> Or do you mean that (only?) non-DSSI controllers a la RQDXx and
> KU]DA50 can speak MSCP without SCA/SCS?
And Roar wrote:
I have got a very strong feeling I was wrong. (Sorry)
> But if you have to talk SCA/SCS with the DSSI-devices, that might
> be a
> problem, since SCA/SCS is not published, and no implementations are
> available.
In my experience with the SII chip you set up a buffer in its shared memory
with the MSCP "packet" layed out, and the node number of where you wanted
it to go at the front. Then you write the that address into the descriptor
register and the SII chip picks it up and drops it off at the drive.
In my case I was writing the equivalent of the SCSI INQUIRE command, and
then a bit later, the SII chip interrupts you to tell you that there is a
new descriptor in its buffers and if you look at it (which I did from the
kernel debugger because I had just panic'd on the interrupt :-) you can see
that the drive has returned to you the information you requested.
Questions that were unanswered in my mind when I put this down about this
time last year were:
1) maintaining the physical/virtual mapping between the 128KB buffer
and main memory.
2) Hooking the MSCP code that was there so that it could fill in
the packets.
3) Writing the bus "enumerator" for config so that I could create
a device instance for each disk I found (tapes I would ignore
for now)
4) Hooking send and receive queues through a top level structure that
would feed/retrieve them from the SII chip.
So I tried last night to get a 'diff' of my build tree from the cvs tree
but since its from 1.5.1 pre-release, the number of diffs is _huge_
relative to the 1.5.2 tree. I'll put a tarball of my sys tree up later
today for anyone who might want to look at it. What I've not been able to
find was my code that set up the INQ command. It shouldn't be too hard to
recreate however.
--Chuck
Folks --
I made the ghastly mistake of bidding on an IBM 5360 ($25). The sale closes
today, and it doesn't look like there'll be other bidders to get me off the
hook. So I thought I do the seller a little favor and spread the publicity
around for him, in case any of you have some unused warehouse space and
were stumped for a way to fill it. I, of course don't. All you need do is
outbid $25 on item 2004672608. ;->~
Seriously (or slightly more seriously) if I'm landed with this thing I'll
probably want to make copies of all the disks and manual then donate it to
a museum collection -- should any be interested. Or a private collector if
their not. The real reason I bid on it was to ensure it's survival of
course. I wasn't actually planning on testing the floor joists in my
1-bedroom apartment. As far as I can tell it's complete, with two printers
and two tape drives. And it's located in Connecticut. If anyone else has a
better idea for preserving it, or wants to lend me a hand (I'm in
Massachussetts) please chime in.
Thanks,
Colin Eby
Senior Consultant
CSC Consulting
Umm, IIRC, I just stuck it in. Yes, you're supposed to have done
some hardware changes, but I thought I'd try anyway. ARCconsole reports it
right, but I haven't done any real benchmark to see if it really is running
at 233...
I'll have to dig up the info. And maybe someone here can burn a new
chip for me?
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
> ----------
> From: Megan
> Reply To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 6:09 PM
> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: RE: MicroVAX 4000/VLC
>
> > I have a 233 MHz CPU from a dead Multia in my AXPpci33
>
> What did you have to do to get it working? I was under the impression
> that using a faster processor required some board modifications...
>
> If it will simply work, I guess I need to locate a 233 Mhz CPU.
>
> Megan Gentry
> Former RT-11 Developer
>
> +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
> | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
> | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
> | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
> | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
> | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
> | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg KB1FCA |
> +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>
>
On Feb 26, 19:00, Jerome Fine wrote:
> I seem to remember someone saying that the DSD 440 reads block zero
> of drive zero on power on, then times out and jumps to location zero
> to start.
That's how most 3rd-party RX controllers seem to work, in my experience.
> Try typing in the MSCP bootstrap.
Why? The RX02/DSD440 is a DY: device, not DU:
> The standard RX02 bootstrap uses UNIT=0, so it may need to
> be modified to use UNIT=1 for DY1:, however that stuff is not
> accessible to me right now. Does anyone have the release
> notes for RT-11? It may be there.
I've had it online for a long time, at
http://www.dunnington.u-net.com/public/ODT/Listings/RXV21BootD
I recently made a minor correction (almost all the DEC printed copies have
several errors). It's a Unit 0 bootstrap, but changing the word at
locations 001036 from 407 to 427 should make it work for Unit 1. At least,
I think so; I used it recently and I think that's what I did.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, Alan Pearson <alan.pearson(a)cramer.com> wrote:
> I'm looking for a DEC BC09J cable to hook up a VS3100 to a CD drive...
That's the same cable as used with the DECstation 2100/3100. A couple
DS3100s I hauled home had a different cable, p/n BC56H-03. This one is
a few inches longer and the cable comes straight into the 50 pin
Centronics connector as opposed to the BC09J which is right angle.
HTH
Mike
> I came across this ebay item, its some sort of Control Data tape drive.
> I'm just mentioning it in case someone in the Virginia area is interested.
I see he's relisted it... I considered buying this last year when he
ran it previously, but he's not interested in shipping it, and I don't
have a Virginia connection likely to help out.
:(
-dq
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nerdware(a)ctgonline.org [mailto:nerdware@ctgonline.org]
> I remember reading an early interview with Geddy and he was
> talking about auditioning drummers after Rutsey left. He said
> Peart came in, and while they were impressed with his
> drumming abilities, they were also thinking, "Hey! This guy can READ!"
I suppose that is kind of impressive these days, sadly... on the other
hand, if he reads that much Rand, I would have been more disappointed in
the quality of his books, than concerned with whether he could read.
Personal opinion, of course.
Chris
Christopher Smith, Perl Developer
Amdocs - Champaign, IL
/usr/bin/perl -e '
print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n");
'
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeffrey S. Sharp [mailto:jss@subatomix.com]
> I vote you call this new breed of VAXen the SuperVAX. Start
> out with the
> SuperVAX 1000 and see where it takes you. Whatever the name,
> I want one.
Or perhaps you could call it something like "Extended VAX"
--err, well, I suppose that one will still be in use for a
couple of years... :)
Chris
Christopher Smith, Perl Developer
Amdocs - Champaign, IL
/usr/bin/perl -e '
print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n");
'
My turn. Where did the saying "better living through chemistry!" come
from? The answer will surprise you.
Joe
At 12:30 PM 2/26/02 -0700, you wrote:
>I have it on the Easy Rider movie soundtrack album. Could look it up tonight
>if you want.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu]
>Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 1:00 PM
>To: 'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org'
>Subject: OT: Stoned? [was: RE: Rush! ( was: RE: Once in a Lifetime...)]
>
><snip>
>
>Quick quiz!
>
>"Don't bogart that joint, my friend. Pass it over to me."
>
>Who wrote it, and what albumn? Really, I can't remember the answer!
>
>--- David A Woyciesjes
>--- C & IS Support Specialist
>--- Yale University Press
>--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
>--- (203) 432-0953
>--- ICQ # - 90581
>Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
>Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
>
> For those who don't know, 2112 is a Sci-Fi type story song
>Yes. They got the idea for it from an Ayn Rand book.
Neil Peart got it from "Anthem." A lot of his lyrics are inspired by Rand.....
I remember reading an early interview with Geddy and he was talking about auditioning drummers after Rutsey left. He said Peart came in, and while they were impressed with his drumming abilities, they were also thinking, "Hey! This guy can READ!"
That little fact also blew away my one high school English teacher...I had just gotten into Rush at that point, a fact which just boggled the minds of the stoners in school because Paul, the science-club-president, ham-radio-operator, A/V nerd had more Rush albums than they did....anyway, I knew my one teacher would really get into Peart's lyrics. I lent her AFWTK and Hemispheres, and she took 'em home to listen. She said that while she didn't care for the music that much, she was really impressed by Peart's writing. Really threw her when I told her that the drummer wrote the lyrics....
One day, during class, one of the stoners had somehow thrown out a Rush lyric during a discussion. The teacher said, "Oh! That's from "A Farewell To Kings" from Rush, isn't it?"
If I had only had my camera with me....the look on his face was timeless.
Paul
ORIGINAL MESSAGE FOLLOWS:
On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, David Woyciesjes wrote:
> Ahh, you should've made it to their last show, the Test For Echo tour,
> "An Evening With Rush". They played all 20 minutes of 2112, the first
> time in about 20 years. And a lot of other classic Rush tunes as well.
Well, first let me apologize for the off-topic post, but I simply *must*
respond. Please forgive me.
Rush is tied with Dream Theater (a Rush-influenced group) as my favorite
band. I'm young enough to never have been at a Rush show, but I *will* be
at at least one show on this upcoming tour, since it may be their last.
Since it seems that there are some other Rush fans here, let me throw out
this link:
http://www.rushpetition.com/
That's an online petition to communicate fans' desire to hear some
rarities in the set list. They have a list of songs that have not beel
played live for at least a decade, and you get to vote for 5 of them.
The final results will be submitted to Rush's record company when the new
album is released. If you are a Rush fan, it is your _duty_ to go sign
the petition now!
> For those who don't know, 2112 is a Sci-Fi type story song
Yes. They got the idea for it from an Ayn Rand book.
--
Jeffrey S. Sharp
jss(a)subatomix.com
Doc wrote:
>On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, Sleet, Edward B wrote:
>
>> Can anyone tell me if a network interface card exists for a MicroVax
3100?
>
> If my information is correct, the MV3100-90 is the same system board
>as the VAX4000-100, and has headers for a QBus backplane. I _think_
>that all the higher models - m95, m96, etc. - have them.
> I could be wrong.
The uV3100-9x all have the connectors for Q-bus
(and DSSI) but will not use them (AFAIK) until
you issue the console command that convinces
them that they are a VAX 4000-10x. Then you'll
need to wire up the connectort to a Qbus
expansion box. (The VAX 4000-10x case has a connector
on the back that connects to the expansion cab via
a suitable cable. Internally some sort of ribbon cable
connects the connector on the case to the MLB).
All these machines have an on-board ethernet
anyway, so unless you need a second (or even
thrid) ethernet, you really should use the
built-in one.
Antonio
Bob,
Glad you got home safely. I guess next time you'll bring a BIGGER truck ;-)
SteveRob
>From: Bob Shannon <bshannon(a)tiac.net>
>Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
>To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
>Subject: Long distance HP haul completed!
>Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 16:42:15 -0500
>
>Is driving 3,220 miles for 3 HP minicomputers unreasonable?
>
_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2004360621
Anyone know what this is? It looks like a test probe maybe, one of those
things that they press against an IC under test and which brings out all the
leads for probing? Or, what? Doesn't look like it has anything to do with
disk drives.
At 02:11 PM 2/26/02 -0700, you wrote:
>DuPont advertising, 1939 to 1980's:
>http://heritage.dupont.com/touchpoints/tp_1939/overview.shtml
Close. Actually it was the theme of their exhibit in the 1934 World's
Fair. That's when they first announced/exhibited Nylon. But in the '60s it
took on an entirely different meaning! :-)
Joe
On February 26, James Willing wrote:
> ...a programmer that can do a dump from a MC68701S-1 microprocessor?
I believe my Data I/O 2900 will do it.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire
St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf
Gunther Schadow
>I have the UDA50 manual (BTW: anyone have a UDA50?)
> that I can copy for you.
Been there, done that, did a maintenance ps too.
http://208.190.133.201/decimages/moremanuals.htm
Now if whoever has that UDA50 programmers guide
were to scan it and make it available ...
Antonio
> too bad, you're running TOPS-20. Certainly a fine operating system, I
> heard several really nice things about it, but I don't have any personal
> experience with it. Is it true there is an UNDELETE command that can be
> used until you PURGE or log out?
The KLH10 is an emulator, not real iron (and while the em is named KLH10,
the proper name for the emulated machine is "KN10").
> You don't possibly have a machine running TOPS-10? - It would be great
> fun to meet such a monitor again. I _loved_ that reply when you said
> /M/P to FILDDT: "[patching the running monitor]" - try that with any
> machine today!
Dan does indeed have a KS10 (or two?), but I think he's still having
trouble getting it properly operational.
OTOH, he's had TOPS-10 up on the TS10 em before, and I thought Zane
Healy was doing likewise. And I'll have one of the -10 ems up for
my historical simulation of the IU Computing Network, but not for a
year or so...
> Etc., etc... - If I only had more time, I'd really need one of those
> emulators!
Once you get the emulator build done and the DEC tape images downloaded,
it takes less than an hour to install TOPS-10 7.03... well, a little
longer to get *all* the cusps and product set stuff loaded...
-dq
On February 22, Doc Shipley wrote:
> And today, one enterprising soul, a long-standing list subscriber,
> found MDR's website from my email address. He both emailed and called
> my boss today trying to buy the machine out from under me.
Oh shit...Asshole alert!!
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire
St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf
Hello, for those of you who are not (or no longer :-) subscribed to the
Quasijarus list, you still want to read this. This is Michael Sokolov
as we all love him: Passionate and knowledgeable about VAXen, and just
that. The project sounds kinda cool, if he delivers I'll want to get it.
regards
-Gunther
Hi there,
It's me again, your faithful 4.3BSD-Quasijarus maintainer. Sorry that I've been
silent for a while... but guess what, I've got something cool, something that
may raise your hair...
So, what is it? Well, after whining and whining to myself about being deprived
of the past 10 years worth of technological advances (NVAX, the last thing from
DEC as far as classical VAXen go, came out in 1992), I've decided it's time to
stop whining and start doing something about it. We've got to bite the bullet
and design and build a new VAX that would use today's technology, be comparable
in performance to today's CPUs, and still be a fully compliant VAX. Design the
CPU, the system bus, the console and other support facilities, etc. and build
it all on a sparkling shiny board.
Since for the past 10 months I've worked for a company building single-board
computers with today's technology (PowerPC CPUs, system bus at 133 MHz, memory
SDRAM at system bus speed, I/O the fastest PCI chips they could find) and was
involved in most phases of board design and bring-up, I know now what's
involved in building such a beast and I've decided I'll give it a try. The
major difference of course will be having to design the VAX CPU instead of
having a ready-made PowerPC or MIPS or Sexium or whatever chip.
Not having six to seven digit cash to build an ASIC, I'll have to settle for
the CPU on an FPGA. As those are field-programmable, there are no big bucks to
pay someone to fab it, and there's plenty of room for debugging and
experimentation. I'll just have to take the VAX Architecture Reference Manual
and implement it, in VHDL or Verilog or somesuch. Scary, I know. But what the
heck, I'll give it a try.
Part of designing a CPU is designing the bus coming out of it. This brings us
to the next part of our VAX design: what should its system bus be? As you may
remember from discussions on this list a few years ago and from my writings
about VAX hardware on the Quasijarus WWW pages and elsewhere, in order to have
a true VAX, one must have a real VAXist system bus. It has to follow all the
VARM rules as to memory and cache coherency, VAX native memory and I/O address
spaces (512 MB each usually), interlocks, interrupt messaging, transaction
ordering, nice and orderly machine check exceptions when accessing a non-
existent address, etc.
So, what bus are we going to use? I believe that in order to be a true VAX, we
have to natively support all traditional DEC buses and peripherals with the
top-level bus meeting the above requirements. Having just PCI or somesuch would
make a very poor man's VAX. Our new VAX should of course be top of the line:
completely supercede all earlier VAXen and support everything that DEC ever
supported. This my friends means XMI. That's what DEC's last top-of-the-line
VAXen (6600 and 9000) had. XMI gives you a 14-slot backplane which you can
further expand with an XMI-to-VAXBI adapter and a VAXBI-to-UNIBUS adapter, and
between UNIBUS, BI, and XMI you've got the whole DEC universe covered. This
plus how nicely these buses work together plus the closeness of this design to
the original VAX pillars of 780 and 8600 makes me believe that XMI is the way
to go.
So, should we use XMI as our top-level system bus? Not necessarily. While
architecturally beautiful, XMI by its age alone will be a performance
bottleneck in our SuperVAX. I think even on the 6600 (NVAX-based, the last VAX
>from DEC with XMI as its top bus) they were already feeling it squeeze, that's
maybe why they went from 6600 to 7000 (Alpha bus, very ugly) so quickly. (The
7000's Alpha bus makes it so ugly because the software can't directly access
XMI or any other I/O bus, just memory, as the Alpha bus doesn't support I/O
transactions, just memory.)
What we need then is our own top-level bus of new design with year 2002
performance characteristics with XMI and other buses (see below) attached to
it. The top-level bus will have CPU(s) and memory on it. The memory should of
course be modern SDRAM. To make this kosher by VAX standards this top-level bus
will have to meet all VARM requirements with all downstream buses interfaced to
it as proper VAX nexi. If it's done right, it'll be the same design as the last
Ultimate VAX from DEC had. The last Ultimate VAX from DEC was the 9000, folks.
We'll have basically the same design but on one board. Cool!
I also mentioned having other buses besides XMI and its subordinates. I'm
thinking about PCI (ideally 64-bit 66 MHz, the top) and VME. Yes, PCI is
decidedly not a DEC bus and it's very substandard compared to real VAX buses
like VAXBI or XMI, but I think we need to support it to be competitive and to
be able to take advantage of all the devices that come in the form of PCI
chips. Now support it doesn't mean make it our main bus. If it sits by the
side, doesn't stand in the way of data flowing through real DEC buses, and its
use is entirely optional, it should be OK I think. As for VME, while we should
faithfully reproduce everything that DEC made that's holy and pure, we don't
need to reproduce their screw-ups. In particular, their deliberate blocking of
third parties doesn't need to be reproduced. There's nothing wrong with
supporting an open standard multivendor bus.
The last point applies not only to VME. It applies even more so to SCSI. DEC's
stubborn refusal to support it except in low-end systems definitely doesn't
need to be reproduced in our new VAX. DEC only supported SCSI on low-end
BabyVAXen, but not on anything higher-end: not on Q-bus, not on BI, not on XMI.
As there seems to be no place for SCSI on the XMI side of our new VAX, we can
go for the obvious alternative: if we are going to have PCI in there, just
stick your favorite PCI UltraSCSI chip on the board.
So we are going to have our new fast system bus with XMI and PCI hanging off of
it, and eventually VME too. So what should this system bus be? Well, I've been
thinking about it for the past few days and I've come up with a design that I
think is sound and I think I can implement. After working for 10 months with
screaming fast PowerPCs, I've been spoiled by their 133 MHz system bus. I've
been even more spoiled by some of the chips available for this bus.
I've been particularly impressed by Galileo GT-64240 and GT-64260 system
controllers for MIPS and PowerPC respectively. So far I've only worked with
PowerPCs and GT-64260 and haven't looked at the 240 yet, but as I understand it
the MIPS and PowerPC system buses are very similar and the 240 and the 260 are
essentially the same chip with minor mods.
These system controllers are not PeeCee stuff. They are specifically designed
for high-end systems with heavy I/O requirements, which is exactly what we
would want in our VAX. Each GT-642x0 system controller includes the CPU
interface running at up to 133 MHz, an SDRAM controller running at full CPU bus
speed, 2 64-bit PCI interfaces running at up to 66 MHz, 3 10/100 Mbps Ethernet
ports, 2 high-speed serial ports running at up to I believe 55 Mbps (!), and
support for all system glue logic one can think of: ROMs, random logic devices,
I2C, you name it. All interfaces run simultaneously in parallel and are
interconnected by a "pizza arbiter", a crossbar switch with a 64-bit data path
running at 133 MHz. This is the kind of stuff I have in mind when I talk about
using year 2002 technology. I believe the GT-642x0 is the most powerful chip of
this kind available today. (The cost is a bit high by PeeCee standards but
should be fine for a high-end SuperVAX: GT-64260A costs $170 IIRC.)
After thinking about it for a while, I have come up with my VAX design based on
either GT-64240 or GT-64260 (haven't yet decided which). It took some hard
thinking, but I think I've got it right. The most challenging thing of course
is to gerrymander the MIPS/PowerPC system bus into a VAX bus, i.e., make it
meet all VARM requirements. OTOH, the benefits from using those chips are
significant: using the same system bus used in today's fast CPUs would assure
comparable performance for our VAX at least as far as the bus goes, the time to
market is reduced as some important components (the SDRAM controller, the PCI
interface, and some of the support logic) will be ready-made, the chip is among
the best one can pick for this purpose, and we'll have the Ethernet and fast
serial interfaces for free.
To understand how I'm going to use the MIPS/PowerPC system bus as the VAX main
bus and still call it a VAX, one needs to consider the board design. It'll have
this system bus interconnecting the CPU, the GT-642x0, the XMI interface chip,
and other stuff later. One nice thing about the GT-642x0 is that it's
specifically designed to support being not the only system controller, but one
of many. It doesn't mind seeing transactions on its interfaces that it doesn't
understand and that are meant for someone else. As it turns out, the MIPS/
PowerPC system bus is not that alien to the VAX, it's basically a subset of
what the VAX needs. Since it's a subset, it needs to be extended. As I'm going
to implement the CPU and the XMI interface on FPGAs, I'll have the freedom to
tweak it as I want. Of course the GT-642x0 won't understand my extensions, but
it won't need to: we need strict VARM compliance when talking to XMI, but not
necessarily to PCI, as PCI is alien to VAX anyway. Now the GT-642x0 will be the
main memory controller, so it better be VARM-compliant as far as memory goes.
At first I thought this was going to be a show-stopper, as I couldn't figure
out how I would communicate the special bus transactions for the BBCCI, BBSSI,
ADAWI, INSQHI, INSQTI, REMQHI, and REMQTI instructions. But then a solution
struck me. It's hard to explain without going too much into the PowerPC cache
coherency model, but basically the CPU can hoard a little chunk of memory (32-
byte granularity) and not let anyone else touch it until it's done with
whatever it wants to do with it. In my case the whatever will be implementing
the above 7 VAX instructions as prescribed by VARM. Voila!
(If you are reading this babbling about using a MIPS/PPC system bus in a VAX
and wondering how is it different from VAX 7000 using an Alpha bus that I
denounced so loudly, you're right, it isn't, except for one detail. That Alpha
bus doesn't support transactions smaller than a full word (don't remember if
that was 32 or 64 bits, but you get the idea), so if you wanted to dink an 8-
bit or 16-bit register on an I/O bus, you would be out of luck. That's one of
the main reasons they didn't support direct CPU access to XMI and other I/O on
the 7000. The PowerPC system bus doesn't have this problem, it supports all
transfer sizes, and the GT-642x0 chips move data of different sizes between
their interfaces all the time.)
Since we are going to have our own top-level bus with the CPU(s), memory, and
bus adapters sitting above XMI, PCI, and VME, it'll need its own backplane of
our own design to hold the CPUs, memory modules, and bus adapters. There are
many possible designs, but here is the one I've chosen from considerations of
ease of implementation, time to market, and cost, as well as some marketing
considerations.
The backplane will be active, and will have the GT-642x0 on it. The slots on it
will be PCI, nexi, and SDRAM DIMMs. It will be mechanically compatible with an
ATX motherboard, but past the same mechanics it'll have enough differences to
assure anyone looking at it that it's not a PeeCee. Of the 7 slots allowed for
by ATX mechanics, 3 will be PCI and 4 will be nexi. The nexus slot connectors
will be of my own design. The first nexus slot will always have to have a CPU
card in it, which will be the master CPU, and the other 3 nexus slots will
support identical CPU cards (slave CPUs) and bus adapters such as XMI and VME.
The active backplane will also provide most of the system support logic,
including the console FEP (front end processor, a small cheap microprocessor
which I haven't yet selected) and the console port. Each CPU card will have
just the VAX CPU with minimum support logic on it, which will reduce the
incremental cost of adding CPUs. The FPGA-based CPU will only implement the VAX
architecture as a running processor, and will truly halt like a 780 rather than
implement halt microcode. This will certainly make it cool in a VAX hacker's
eyes and reduce the time to market by moving the halt complexity from the
harder to design FPGA into the easy to write FEP software. The CPU FPGA will
communicate halts and architectured console IPR accesses to the FEP via the
Inter-IC bus (I2C) or a similar bus.
The active backplane will also provide Ethernet (GT-based) and SCSI (PCI-based)
interfaces. (The high-speed serial interfaces of the GT-642x0 may also be
routed out to external 50-pin connectors of the type DEC has used on sync
serial options.) Thus in the minimal configuration with only one CPU card and
some SDRAM one will have a fully functional system. Since such a system will
fit entirely in an ATX enclosure and offer ready PCI expansion, it can be used
to introduce the VAX architecture and this high-end product into new markets
not previously exposed to VAXen. We'll be able to build and sell these systems
in any required quantity entirely from current parts, no dependence of
exhaustible stockpiles of old DEC parts. OTOH, since when equipped with an XMI
adapter the system will be a fully compliant VAX and will be highly compatible
with top of the line systems from DEC, this system should be acceptable even to
the most ardent DEC purist.
In the future systems can be built in other form factors if ATX is unacceptable
or if more than 4 nexus slots are needed. The backplane will still have to be
active most probably, though, because such a high-speed bus cannot have more
than a few slots, and if we want to offer something like the 14-slot XMI
backplane for our new system bus, the only way I can think of to implement it
is to have several independent bus segments each with no more than 4 slots and
interconnect them with intelligent bridges. These bridges would be active and
quite sophisticated. But that's for the future, I think for a start a single
bus segment with 4 slots in the cheapest form factor (ATX) will be fine.
Proper design of the system support logic on the active backplane will ensure
that the memory and interrupt mappings are as close as possible to those of
next of kin DEC systems. The GT-642x0 will play nicely with this as its memory
map is completely programmable, and it'll have no problem with the physical
address space being only 30 bits instead of 32 (VAX architecture limitation).
That's what I have on my mind, folks. As you can see I've put a good deal of
thought into it and I'm serious about it. The next step is to better explore
FPGA technology to see if I can match or beat the NVAX in performance. On our
side we have 10 more years of technological advances since the NVAX, but OTOH
DEC had built the NVAX as a fully custom IC rather than an FPGA. We'll see.
Now here comes the part where I'll need your help, folks. While I have
everything I'll need to design the active backplane and the CPU card (for the
CPU card I'll just need the VARM which I have and the backplane is all current
technology, no DEC specs needed) and thus I think I'll be able to deliver the
base system in the ATX box, in my mind to make the project worth doing and thus
to maximise the chances of me actually doing it, we'll need an assurance that
the XMI adapter would follow shortly. I am prepared to design the FPGA and the
board, but it'll require the XMI spec. I know it conceptually which allowed me
to come up with the conceptual design outlined here, but to actually build it I
will of course need the full spec detailing each signal and all.
So, to make this project worth doing and thus see to it that I actually do it,
you folks with spare time on your hands may want to start looking into prying
the XMI specs out of DECompaq.
--
Michael Sokolov 786 E MISSION AVE APT F
Programletarian Freedom Fighter ESCONDIDO CA 92025-2154 USA
International Free Computing Task Force Phone: +1-760-480-4575
msokolov(a)ivan.Harhan.ORG (ARPA)
Let the Source be with you
Programletarians of the world, unite!
P.S. To the folks I've Cc'ed this to besides the Quasijarus list: your input
could be extremely helpful to this project and other great projects being
discussed on our list, and I would very much like to have you on the Quasijarus
list. To subscribe send a message to quasijarus-request(a)ivan.Harhan.ORG. TIA.
I have a pile of SMD disks, one Fujitsu Super Eagle and six (I think)
Fujitsu Eagles, which are taking up space. They're all 19" rackmount
units, most with rails, and since they weigh in at about 150 pounds each,
I can't ship them. Some were in service with me five or six years ago,
some I've never used; the condition of none of them is known for sure.
I would like to see at least some of them go to a good home as opposed to
going to the dump at the end of March, but one way or another they need to
go. They're free for pickup in Federal Way, WA, which is between Seattle
and Tacoma.
I also have an assortment of SMD cables available.
--James B.
> I have a 233 MHz CPU from a dead Multia in my AXPpci33
What did you have to do to get it working? I was under the impression
that using a faster processor required some board modifications...
If it will simply work, I guess I need to locate a 233 Mhz CPU.
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg KB1FCA |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
> OTOH, he's had TOPS-10 up on the TS10 em before, and I thought Zane
> Healy was doing likewise. And I'll have one of the -10 ems up for
> my historical simulation of the IU Computing Network, but not for a
> year or so...
I've got a system running two copies of SIMH for TOPS-10 7.03 and TOPS-20
4.1. I've got another system running KLH10 for TOPS-20 7.0. I've found
that those emulator/OS combo's are what work the best. SIMH supports
'virtual terminal lines' and 'printers', while KLH10 supports ethernet.
> > Etc., etc... - If I only had more time, I'd really need one of those
> > emulators!
>
> Once you get the emulator build done and the DEC tape images downloaded,
> it takes less than an hour to install TOPS-10 7.03... well, a little
> longer to get *all* the cusps and product set stuff loaded...
Take a look at http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html I've got links
to prebuilt emulator installs. Off the top of my head I think they're all
for TOPS-10.
Zane
I'm in search of 24 or more 1101 RAM chips so I can fully populate the
memory board on the Mark-8 I'm building. Anybody have a stash of
them? I've searched the web but have been unable to find any obsolete
IC dealers who have them.
Bill Richman
bill_r(a)inetnebr.com
http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r
Home of Fun with Molten Metal, technological
oddities, and the original COSMAC Elf
computer simulator!
Help me clean my apartment.
I have an 11/23 system running RSX 11M in a large Trimm pedestal chassis.
(Think world box - size of a two-drawer file cabinet).
It has a working TK50, RD53(?), and RX50 floppies, and 4 DL ports.
I can offer an extra ESDI controller if you're looking for more storage.
Too big to ship, I will help you carry it down the stairs.
Will trade for laptop(s) in good condition, or perhaps you can trade skilled
labor (assist in my rooftop antenna construction / design / installation).
Eliot
DuPont advertising, 1939 to 1980's:
http://heritage.dupont.com/touchpoints/tp_1939/overview.shtml
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe [mailto:rigdonj@cfl.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 2:14 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: RE: Stoned? [was: RE: Rush! ( was: RE: Once in a Lifetime...)]
My turn. Where did the saying "better living through chemistry!" come
from? The answer will surprise you.
Joe
<snip>
I have it on the Easy Rider movie soundtrack album. Could look it up tonight
if you want.
-----Original Message-----
From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 1:00 PM
To: 'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org'
Subject: OT: Stoned? [was: RE: Rush! ( was: RE: Once in a Lifetime...)]
<snip>
Quick quiz!
"Don't bogart that joint, my friend. Pass it over to me."
Who wrote it, and what albumn? Really, I can't remember the answer!
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
Hello. i need this book
6502 Assembly Language Subroutines (Leventhal)
Can you tell me the link to download it , or how to get it?
Can you upload it somewhere or send it as an attachement?
Regards, S.K
At 01:59 PM 2/26/02 -0500, you wrote:
>> From: Doc
>>
>> On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, David Woyciesjes wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Ohhh, wowww, man. Geddy Lee, yeahhhh....
>> > >
>> > > Doc
>> > >
>> > Doc? Hello? Sounds you're stoned man! And you didn't share either!
>>
>> Heh. I stayed that way from '74 till '89, but then I ran out.
>> Permanently, it looks like.
>> "No no no no, I don't smoke it no more; I'm tired of wakin' up on the
>> floor!"
>>
>> Doc
>>
> Heh. Sounds like my buddy, when he was growing up in Vegas....
>
>Quick quiz!
>
>"Don't bogart that joint, my friend. Pass it over to me."
>
>Who wrote it, and what albumn? Really, I can't remember the answer!
I don't know who wrote it but it was on the Easy Rider soundtrack. I
THINK The Byrds sang it there.
Joe
> From: Doc
>
> On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, David Woyciesjes wrote:
> > >
> > > Ohhh, wowww, man. Geddy Lee, yeahhhh....
> > >
> > > Doc
> > >
> > Doc? Hello? Sounds you're stoned man! And you didn't share either!
>
> Heh. I stayed that way from '74 till '89, but then I ran out.
> Permanently, it looks like.
> "No no no no, I don't smoke it no more; I'm tired of wakin' up on the
> floor!"
>
> Doc
>
Heh. Sounds like my buddy, when he was growing up in Vegas....
Quick quiz!
"Don't bogart that joint, my friend. Pass it over to me."
Who wrote it, and what albumn? Really, I can't remember the answer!
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
On Feb 20, 14:01, Roger Merchberger wrote:
> Rumor has it that Tony Duell may have mentioned these words:
> >> > > Or you can call it "Isopropyl alcohol" or just "rubbing alcohol"!
> >> > > (But you want the 90+% stuff, NOT the 70%)
> >> >
> >> > But I don't think either of those are official convention.
> >>
> >> In spite of not being "official convention" (and sometimes not even
> >> CORRECT), when telling somebody to get something, it just might be
useful
> >> to them to know what it is called at the places that they buy it.
> >
> >Unfortunately the 'local' names are just that. Local. I've never see
> >anything called 'rubbing alcohol' for sale in the UK. I have seen it
> >labelled isopropanol or propan-2-ol. Since this is an international
list,
> >it would seem to make sense to use the official name and then to look it
> >up in a local chemical catalogue if necessary.
>
> Although I agree with you totally, for many things there is *no*
> international name. If you send anyone over to Wal-mart or K-mart for
> isopropanol or propan-2-ol, they'll *never* find it. I've only ever seen
> labeled is "rubbing alcohol" (which I'll admit is much too vague) or
> "isopropyl alcohol" and the percentage (you can get 91% at Wal-mart, but
> most places stock only the 70% AFAIK. (I'm looking at a bottle as I type)
> Even under the ingredient listing (required by law in the US) it's
> "isopropyl alcohol".
"iso-propyl alcohol" is the "old" name for it; "iso-propanol" is a more
modern version of the same name; the "systematic" name (used almost
everywhere *by chemists*) is "propan-2-ol". In this particular case,
"iso-propanol" and "propan-2-ol" give exactly the same information, since
there are only three carbon atoms, so the hydroxyl group can be either in
the middle (iso-propanol/propan-2-ol) or at an end
(n-propanol/propan-1-ol). If there are more carbon atoms, there are more
possibilities for branches and aatachment positions, so the "old" names are
less informative.
> Even "aluminum" is different, but I don't remember how different...
You mean "aluminium" :-) Like sodium, potassium, uranium, ...
^ ^ ^ ^
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
> ----------
> From: Doc
>
> On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, David Woyciesjes wrote:
>
> > Ahh, you should've made it to their last show, the Test For Echo
> > tour, "An Evening With Rush". They played all 20 minutes of 2112, the
> first
> > time in about 20 years. And a lot of other classic Rush tunes as well.
> > For those who don't know, 2112 is a Sci-Fi type story song, well,
> > more of a composition I think. Normally, in concert, they play only
> about 5
> > minutes of it, since the opening act takes up some time in the night.
> This
> > last tour, however, there was no opening act... Freeing up another 1 1/2
> > hours for Rush...
>
> Ohhh, wowww, man. Geddy Lee, yeahhhh....
>
> Doc
>
Doc? Hello? Sounds you're stoned man! And you didn't share either!
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
Well, folks, I'm a happy camper today. In a nice contrast against recent
reports of list members screwing over other list members, I have some good
news. Today, I met up with another list member in the mid-south USA. We
had a fund day hopping around a scrapyard, and each of use went home with
some cool gear.
We found all sorts of goodies: remains of some Interdata minis, a DG Nova
3, a MicroVAX II, TS05 tape drive, piles of RA8x and other drives, a
PDP-11/34, several VAX 4000-400s, some 8-bit stuff, and surely much more.
The main thing I ended up carrying away, though, due to my schedule and
the lack of space in my truck bed for anything else, was a PDP-11/70
carcass. I say 'carcass', because the scrappers had already yanked the
cards out of all the cages and because there were a few other things
missing. However, I've been lusting for a /70, and finding what I did put
me a good ways along towards having a complete system. Cost: $20 for two
H960 racks.
This /70 is disguised as a DECdatasystem 570. I've got some questions
about that, but I'll put them in another thread.
The list member and his party were extremely nice. To save me the trouble
of driving to a nearby ATM to get cash, a member of the party loaned me
the dough. I was also treated to lunch at a nearby restaurant after
leaving the scrapyard. Thanks for the hospitality, guys!
So now I'm driving around with this PDP-11/70 in my truck. For a bit of
fun, I showed it to a girl from work, being the evil bastard that I am.
Much to my surprise, she seemed to actually be *interested* in the
machine. No running away or screaming occurred.
I'll hopefully be going back to this scrapyard in a few weeks to get some
of the things I left behind this time.
--
Jeffrey S. Sharp
jss(a)subatomix.com
> Jerome Fine replies:
>
> "donor" diskette? Are we now harvesting computer parts?
I never had good luck cleaning the plastic shell of a 3.5 inch
diskette; most of them have a thin liner materials inside, a
type of plasticized frabric, that would disintegrate. So you
want to use a blank, new, or otherwise unused floppy from which
you remove the media and toss it. You insert the cleaned media
into that plastic diskette shell.
This is a very trivial operation, unless you're challenged in
the hand/eye coordination department...
> The person I am doing the recovery for may already have
> enough of the files. I will see how much further I should go.
>
> > > I have one floppy that has over 100 error blocks (can't be read)
> > > out of 988. Others have just a few. Is it possible to only spot clean
> > > the ones with a few errors without removing the jacket?
> > Dunno- let us know!
>
> Likewise for the answer above.
Ok, again, perhaps we're having a communication problem.
I have never tried anything other than what I described. Remove
the messed-up media from its original shell and put it in a
clean one. Clean the whole thing. This is what I've done,
and your suggestion of partial cleaning has never occurred to
me. And on reflection, I can't see any purpose in it.
Unless you're reading into this some difficulty that isn't
there.
> > > Will Formula 409 work with floppy media? Where can it be purchased?
> > Oh, it's a common household cleaner here in the U.S... a
> > comparable cleaner is Fantastik.
>
> We have Fantastik here in Canada. I am in Toronto. Windex
> is also a grease dissolving fluid and is used for glass. How
> might that do?
I would not make a recommendation regarding something I've
not only never tried, but never even considered trying.
Sorry!
> >Joe wrote:
> >If you just want to be able to read it long enough to recover it's data
> >then don't put it back in a jacket! Just put the bare disk into the drive
> >and copy it. I know several people that have successfully done this with 5
> >1/4" disk. However if your dirve has a spring loaded ejector, you may need
> >to open up the housing and push the ejector back by hand.
>
> I will try that also if I go that far.
for 5.25 inch floppies, I've done that too, but even still,
it's easier to use a donor sleeve than trying to get naked
media into the drive IMHO, although YYMV, etc.
-dq
I'm looking for a DEC BC09J cable to hook up a VS3100 to a CD drive... can
anyone point me to a likely source in the UK? Failing that, any hints about
making one up? I'm not sure about one of the parts that I would need - from
what I've heard the 68-pin connector is a "non-standard" DEC part? Sounds
like the other end is just a 50-pin centronics-style job so I guess getting
one of those won't be a problem.
TIA
Al
> From: Doc
>
> 2112 was the only album of theirs I really cared for, taken as a
> whole, but I'd break hell _and_ the bank to get to one of their shows.
> Anytime, amywhere.
> The last time I saw them was in Lubbock in '92?, the tour with the 30'
> bunny-rabbits on stage. The 5'2" teenybopper next to me, a total
> stranger, spent the entire show standing tippy-toe on my motorcycle
> helmet. One of the best rock shows I've seen since Black Oak Arkansas
> broke up.
>
> Doc
>
---
Ahh, you should've made it to their last show, the Test For Echo
tour, "An Evening With Rush". They played all 20 minutes of 2112, the first
time in about 20 years. And a lot of other classic Rush tunes as well.
For those who don't know, 2112 is a Sci-Fi type story song, well,
more of a composition I think. Normally, in concert, they play only about 5
minutes of it, since the opening act takes up some time in the night. This
last tour, however, there was no opening act... Freeing up another 1 1/2
hours for Rush...
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
Can anyone tell me if a network interface card exists for a MicroVax 3100?
Ed Sleet
Systems Analyst Tech.
Corning Incorporated
Harrodsburg, Ky
859-734-3341 x345 Fax: 734-5103
email: sleeteb(a)corning.com
> > For floppies, I just break 'em open any way I can,
> > and then use bare, clean hands with dish detergent.
> > Let dry on a lint-free rag and you're through.
>
> Jerome Fine replies:
>
> I am trying to recover some files from an DEC RX02 (8" SSDD)
> floppy. After you clean the media, how do you put it back into
> the drive?
Using a brand-new donor diskette, which gets the same Xacto-
knife treatment, I put the cleaned media in the new shell,
and with one or two carefully-placed drops of cyanoacrylate,
you have a reconstructed floppy.
> I have one floppy that has over 100 error blocks (can't be read)
> out of 988. Others have just a few. Is it possible to only spot clean
> the ones with a few errors without removing the jacket?
Dunno- let us know!
> Will Formula 409 work with floppy media? Where
> can it be purchased?
Oh, it's a common household cleaner here in the U.S... a
comparable cleaner is Fantastik.
-dq
> ----------
> From: Dave McGuire
>
> On February 25, David Woyciesjes wrote:
> > 'Rush' is for up-tempo rock, Great programming music.
> > "Power Windows" is a good album to start with.
> > Their lyrics are written by the drummer, if that's any
> > indication.
>
> Ahh yes, Rush is my all-time favorite band. Wonderful stuff!
>
> -Dave
>
> --
>
Ah-ha! So Dave does have interest in things other than wondering if
the girl is cute!
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
> ----------
> From: Cameron Kaiser
>
> > Hmmm... Being quite the Rush fan (waiting for them to finish the
> > albumn, and come around on tour!), I have to politely disagree with the
> > Power Windows recommendation. My suggestion is to buy the Chronicles 2
> CD
> > set. It's probably on tape too, maybe even vinyl! You should be able to
> find
> > it used. It covers Rush's first 20 years, and the style changes they've
> went
> > through.
>
> I actually prefer the Retrospective '74-'80 compilation CD. I think this
> covers all the classics in a smaller package.
>
Retrospective? Hmm, sounds kinda familiar. I'll have to go down to
Cutler's and find it...
> Myself the album I particularly enjoyed was Signals, but even more so than
> that was what I think was the peak of their art ... Moving Pictures.
>
Signals, yes that is some good music. Moving Pictures? Yes that was
definitely a high point. Then sadly it started to slide a little after that,
then picked back up around Counterparts...
Has anyone else heard the Working Man CD, a tribute to Rush? Some
pretty good versions of classic Rush tunes...
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
> From: Megan
>
>
> > I've sort of been wondering, since we're on AXP anyway, is anybody at
> > all still running Tru64 or NT on Alpha?
> > Everyone I know who owns AXP runs either *BSD or Linux or OpenVMS,
> > including me. NetBSD flat screams on the LX164.
>
> I have a PWS500a with 3x4Gb disks ... two are dedicated to Linux and
> one is Tru64... I can boot whichever I want whenever.
>
> My other alpha is an AXPpci33 166Mhz CPU overclocked to 200Mhz, rock
> solid and running Linux (working on getting RHL7.2 on it to do some
> testing)
>
> +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>
I have a 233 MHz CPU from a dead Multia in my AXPpci33 (WinNT4-SP6a)
box. 8-)
Just gotta find a way to get Win2K running on it...
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
> From: Doc
>
> On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, Ethan Dicks wrote:
> >
> > Did the guy doing the OpenVMS port to the AXPpci133 ever get it working
> > enough to use?
>
> I've sort of been wondering, since we're on AXP anyway, is anybody at
> all still running Tru64 or NT on Alpha?
> Everyone I know who owns AXP runs either *BSD or Linux or OpenVMS,
> including me. NetBSD flat screams on the LX164.
>
> Doc
>
Well, here at Yale University Press, we still have NT4 on an Alpha
Server. Runs pretty good, but since it's the PDC, Boss won't let me bump it
up to Win2K/Alpha-2128... Bummer...
--- David A Woyciesjes
--- C & IS Support Specialist
--- Yale University Press
--- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu
--- (203) 432-0953
--- ICQ # - 90581
Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001
Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash
At 08:46 AM 2/26/02 -0500, you wrote:
>> > For floppies, I just break 'em open any way I can,
>> > and then use bare, clean hands with dish detergent.
>> > Let dry on a lint-free rag and you're through.
>>
>> Jerome Fine replies:
>>
>> I am trying to recover some files from an DEC RX02 (8" SSDD)
>> floppy. After you clean the media, how do you put it back into
>> the drive?
If you just want to be able to read it long enough to recover it's data
then don't put it back in a jacket! Just put the bare disk into the drive
and copy it. I know several people that have successfully done this with 5
1/4" disk. However if your dirve has a spring loaded ejector, you may need
to open up the housing and push the ejector back by hand.
>
>> Will Formula 409 work with floppy media? Where
>> can it be purchased?
Umm. you're not in the US are you? If you were you'd know what that
stuff is. Anyway it's just a spray-on general purpose cleaner that you can
buy in the grocery stores.
Joe