- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

OT(ish): Need 4 Gig RAM for your HP9000?

by zmerch-cctalk＠30below.com

Under 10 years old I'd guess, but hopefully I won't get lambasted due to the "kewlness" factor... Dunno if it's a "great" deal or anything, I know nada about HP9K systems, but if you just hafta have 4 Gig of RAM in yours... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140009204616 Laterz, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger | Anarchy doesn't scale well. -- Me zmerch at 30below.com. | SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers

19 years, 11 months

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Paper tape Utilities/Images

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Paper tape Utilities/Images > From: "Dave Dunfield" <dave06a at dunfield.com> > Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2006 05:49:15 -0500 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> Dave wrote..... >> > I have posted the utilities I created to read paper tapes to my site in >> > the Software/Images section (near the bottom of the main page): >> ...snip... PTR/PTC ...snip... >> >> Dave.... have you considered supporting serially attached paper tape >> reader/punches instead of just parallel devices? > >Hi Jay, > >I'd be happy to ... but I don't have a serial reader, so I need info on >the details of the interface (does it just send the raw serial stream as >read from the tape or is there some protocol around it). Dave, Most of the serial PTR/PTP I used were not unlike the ASR33, The only protocal was the usual; start and stop bits of serial comms. So for every byte read by the reader you got a byte in serial form. It's just a stream of chars (7 or 8bit) as punched on the tape. Reminder, leader on most of those will be read as zeros so the average tape will have a long line of zeros preceeding the content. There was one I'd used (deep memory test ca1977) that used the CTS line on the serial output to a corospnding line on the serial input (both for punch and reader) as hardware flow control (their manual called it hardware restraint). For that case CTS gated read(send bytes) no read and for the punch case CTS gated the hosts ability to send the next byte until the punch was ready for the next character. This was only needed for slow (read case) hosts that could not accept the 300cps read or a fast (relative) host that could over run the 75cps punch. Oddly enough the unit (punch reader was Remex with custom third party board) only had 4800 baud serial rate! Only saw one like it and the closest Remex model was parallel only. That's the hardware.. The tapes them selves could be Intel hex format, Moto S records, binary, ASCI text or some vendors format (relocatable binary or hex in some cases). Never minding DEC BIN and RIM formats. The oddest and is old Intel BNPF! FYI: for those not familiar that was a ROM submission format and Xasm output format. Each byte was recorded on Ptape as example: 11000011 C3h BPPNNNNPPF (yes 10 chars on tape!) 00000000 00h BNNNNNNNNF 00010000 10h BNNNPNNNNF The small advanatage is human readable. It was self cehcking at the char level as anything other than BNPF was invalid. I was wasy to do a simple reader needed only to sense three holes (sprocket and two bits) to discern if the character was B,N,P or F making it very easy to serialize. I had to do that back in '74 as a lab EE for a controller (8008 based) project. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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cctalk Digest, Vol 37, Issue 55

by gkaufman＠the-planet.org

From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > By 'out', I assume you mean towards higher numbered tracks -- that is > with the head closer to the spindle. Yup, sorry - typically the worse errors are after track 50ish. > I can see no obvious reason why you'd get more errors on inner tracks if > the alignment was off. The errors would be on all tracks I would think. > Unless your leadscrew is so warn that the head is not properly postiioned > (I have _never_ seen that happen). > > A worn/dirty head might give more errors on the inner tracks where the > bit density is higher (shorter tracks), though > Thanks, all very good thoughts! - Gary

19 years, 11 months

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Paper tape Utilities/Images

by dave06a＠dunfield.com

In case anyone is interested: I have posted the utilities I created to read paper tapes to my site in the Software/Images section (near the bottom of the main page): Paper Tape Reader (PTR) reads data from a reader connected to a PC parallel port. It was tested with an OAE OP-80A, however it should work with any reader which provides parallel data, a "data ready" strobe, and accepts an ACK pulse to reset for the next byte. Paper Tape Compare (PTC) is a utility to identify differences between paper tape image files. It a little brighter than "comp" for examining paper tape streams - useful to confirm multiple reads. Source code is included so you can modify to suit your own setup as required. I have also started a section of Paper Tape Images - currently only the processor technology VDM drivers are there, however I anticipate obtaining and reading addional tapes later this fall - as always, submissions to the archive from other sources would be very welcome. -- dave06a (at) Dave Dunfield dunfield (dot) Firmware development services & tools: www.dunfield.com com Collector of vintage computing equipment: http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/index.html

19 years, 11 months

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2940 Taxonomy; was: Re: SCSI cable needed

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

Roger Merchberger wrote: Ah, no. The latest transfer rate is Ultra 320 - it's been out for at least a few years now. >I think the 80 pin SCA is only a matter of the hot plug >spec and connector, and can be dealt with by adapters >from the 50 pin or 68 pin cables to the SCA back >plane connectors. It also deals with the device address >in the connector. Although there are 50-pin to 80-pin adapters, remember that 50-pin is only an 8-bit-wide bus and so your throughput would not be any faster than with an 8-bit-wide device (of the same bandwidth). Hope this helps, Roger "Merch" Merchberger ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Billy: I first started working on Ultra 320 at Quantum in 1999; but they never shipped a product until 2001. 160 wasn't a clean intro - lots of controller/system problems. Don't know how 320 was on initial release, but given the same cast of characters, it might have been rough too. SCA 80 pin has a lot of adaptors to go to/from 68 pin. I even have an old Apple system using an SCA drive on a 50 pin bus via an adaptor PCB. If using SCA, key point to remember is that power is inside the 80 pin connector. SCA drives don't normally have the legacy 4 pin Molex power connector. And I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned the early Apple SCSI, that was 25 pin. I'm still using some 50 to 25 pin cables on my G4 to drive some old Epsom scanners. And even have one scanner on an Initio wide controller doing a double conversion, 68 pin to 50 pin, then a 50 pin to 25 pin cable! SCSI is FUN! - Old lapel pin I picked up at some Comdex. Billy

19 years, 11 months

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HP 110+

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I'm apparently google-impaired.... is anyone aware of an electronic copy of the HP 110+ computer owners manuals? Thanks in advance! Jay West

19 years, 11 months

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SCSI cable needed

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

Roy J. Tellason wrote: ________________________________ I've been going through a whole mess of stuff trying to get a CD burner working here, one I have won't work at all, one won't open and close its drawer reliably, and what I finally got to work was an external unit, a Yamaha CRW4260tx. Not new, but hey, it works... The thing is, I've currently got it hooked up by having the cover off, using a 50-wire ribbon cable from the rear of the actual drive assembly to the internal connector of the Adaptec 2940 that's in the computer, which also has its cover off. I'd like to put the covers on again, particularly since someone mentioned in here that cooling is critical with those drives, but to do that I need the right cable. The person I got this stuff from gave me *all* of their SCSI stuff, they ssy. And included in that was a ribbon cable, but that's apparently for internal use as it has three connectors on it and they're all the same size. I do have the book for the burner handy, and the cable shown in there is round. And the connector on the burner (2 of them actually) is *smaller* than the external connector on the 2940, I don't know exactly what you'd call this one. Anybody have such a cable they'd be willing to part with? I don't have much cash to work with at all, but could probably cover postage, or maybe trade some stuff. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Roy, I've read this twice but couldn't figure out which cable you need. Where does the cable go - drive to external box, external box to PC connector or internal to PC? How many pins on each end, what kind of connector etc. I can help you, albeit slowly, since the stuff is up North, 400 miles away. I have three of the Yamaha units that you are welcome to. I'll even ship them free. But all three have a bad laser diode. It was one of the early burner designs and has a limited number of on-hours. I really liked the Yamaha externals, but they wore out quickly. The flat cable with the three connectors was used on one of the Yamaha boxes to go from the drive to the TWO connectors on the back of the external box. My other two Yamahas had the two rear connectors soldered together with loose wires going into a 50 pin connector plugged into the back of the drive. I also have boxes of SCSI cables, all types, and terminators. But because of the wide variation in types, I need to know exact pin count and connector types. I have a few down here in Orange County, so maybe we'll be lucky. Just send me a detailed description. So let me know exactly what you are looking for. And if you want the other Yamahas, I'll be going up 3rd week in October and can send them to you then. Billy

19 years, 11 months

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2940 Taxonomy; was: Re: SCSI cable needed

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 19:19:55 -0400 >From: "Roy J. Tellason" <rtellason at verizon.net> >On Tuesday 26 September 2006 07:03 pm, Sridhar Ayengar wrote: >> Roy J. Tellason wrote: >> >> I do have the book for the burner handy, and the cable shown in there >> >> is round. And the connector on the burner (2 of them actually) is >> >> *smaller* than the external connector on the 2940, >> >> If I'm right that you're running a 2940W (or 2940UW or 2940U2W) instead >> of a 2940, the cable you're looking for is HONDA68 -> HONDA50 *with >> high-byte termination*. > >I understand the need for the high-byte termination you mention here, as that >may be at the root of some of the problems that I've seen others mention in >this thread. What I don't understand is why a card that has only a 50-pin >internal connector would have a 68-pin connector on the external bracket. > >It also came as a bit of a surprise to me that when I pulled out my box of >those cards I found that even though all three of them had the same model >number that they were apparently three different cards... Adaptec used the same circuit board for several different products. In every case the circuit board has the same markings, but by populating the board in different ways they made different products. I'm going from memory here, so if I get some details wrong feel free to nitpick me. The 2940UW has an external HD68 pin connector with screw fasteners and internally it has an IDC50 ribbon cable connector and a 68 pin ribbon cable connector. The 2940U has an external HD50 connector (with clips) and an IDC50 ribbon cable connector internally. The Macintosh version of the 2940UW is just like the PC version, except it has a 1Mb (as opposed to 512Kb) Flash chip programmed with different firmware. There was also a Sun version of the card with Open Firmware code on board. You used to be able to download the firmware updater back in the good old days when Adaptec had a very comprehensive ftp site accessible to the public (why did so many companies shut down their public ftp sites?). I think there was also a differential (HVD) version of that card on that board, but I may be misremembering. The 2940 (no U) is a slightly different card because there's only a position on board for a DIP packaged Flash (or EPROM) chip and no PLCC nor (I think) SOIC position. To further complicate matters there were at least two later variants of the 2940UW, the 2940UW Dual and the 2940UW Pro. AFAICT, these two later variants used a different controller chip than the X940U[W]. The X940U[W] uses an AIC-7880. I think the two later variants use a 7895, but that's a low reliability memory on that last part number. While the 2940UW uses a 68 pin external connector with screw fasteners, there are versions of the 68 pin external connector with clips. It is found on the FWB (Stream Logic) NuBus JackHammer SCSI card, for example. And 68 pin external terminators exist in both variants to correspond with both types of connectors found in the wild. Jeff Walther

19 years, 11 months

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List stats

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

> Out of interest, are the stats for daily list traffic recorded anywhere? >I've not seen any obviously missing messages, I just don't seem to be >seeing much list traffic right now (since hopping the pond a couple of >weeks back and using a different ISP) The digests haven't been quite right, I've missed a couple (issue 51 just recently), so it's possible that stuff's being lost somewhere.

19 years, 11 months

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RX02 Problem solved...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RX02 Problem solved... > From: Gary E Kaufman <gkaufman at the-planet.org> > Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 22:10:26 -0400 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >Tony and others - > >The head load pad looks visually fine. The head load spring tension >appears pretty normal , and the solenoid pulls in nicely. > >The drive consistently reads the first 10 or so tracks, then tosses >various number of errors as it goes further out. > >I've cleaned the head, and cleaned/lubed the spindle. The track 0 >sensor appears fine. Also make sure the rails the head travels on are clean. The whole mess should move very smoothly. >It is indeed possible that the alignment is off - that would probably >explain the poor performance as it steps out. If it's bad on the outer tracks then it will be bad elsewhere. The only way it can get worse is if the lead screw or the follower is worn to the point of looseness. >I guess a worn out head would have the same symptoms. That can be visually inspected under a magnifier. Never seen that happen. > I the 70's I had a neat Dysan digital alignment disk that I used to >realign a few SA901 and SA801 drives. >Unfortunately I no longer have it. I suppose I could mark the position >of the stepper and slightly rotate it in each direction to see if it >improves things. Shugart made one too. > >If someone can point me to an actual alignment procedure I'm game - I >have reasonable scopes etc here. Without the disk or a known good disk you not going to get the best results. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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RX02 Problem solved...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: RX02 Problem solved... > From: "Roy J. Tellason" <rtellason at verizon.net> > Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 13:35:52 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On Monday 25 September 2006 03:30 pm, Allison wrote: >> Before I'd run out and kill a RX. I'd try cleaning and relubing the >> leadscrew and making sure the head load pad is still there. >> >> I had one that once both were taken care of it was perfect. > >Speaking of head load pads, way back when I was still bumping into a lot of >single-sided stuff I had one heck of a time tracking any of those down. I >have *no* idea now, several decades later, where the heck I got 'em from. >Are they available anyplace? And how critical are their characteristics, >anyhow? > >Not that I have any particularl *need* for them right now, just wondering... I use a peice of felt, real stuff not any of the cheap fakes.. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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RS DRAM chips?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RS DRAM chips? > From: "Roy J. Tellason" <rtellason at verizon.net> > Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 13:43:48 -0400 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >I have some chips here, I'm pretty sure they're DRAM, marked with both a >Motorola logo and a "T/C" (Tandy Corp.?) logo, and with the part number >8040016 followed by what I'm pretty sure is a data code of QQ8301. Anybody >know what these are, exactly? > >I have a bunch of them, and no particular use for them, if anybody needs >some, though I'm curious as to what they are. Those are moto housenumbered 4116 16kx1 three voltage dynamic rams used in TRS80 and other machines of the time. Note: RS used slow parts. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Fixing PCB runs

by steerex＠mindspring.com

Hey Guys, I have several PCBs that have damaged runs. The damage was done as a result of dirt/moisture in contact with the boards while energized. I am going to fix the boards by splicing a short piece of copper wire to the existing runs, bridging the section where the run is broken. That's no problem. In order to physically secure the patch to the board and protect the exposed copper from corrosion, I need to apply some kinda coating / adhesive. What would you recommend? I don't want to spray the whole board with lacquer or anything like that. Just the areas where the copper is exposed. I was wondeing if something like fingernail polish would work? Any suggestions? Thanks, SteveRob

19 years, 11 months

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RX02 Problem solved...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RX02 Problem solved... > From: Gary E Kaufman <gkaufman at the-planet.org> > Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 13:55:45 -0400 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >Thanks to tremendous help from several folks I've isolated my formatting >problem. > >Turns out to be a hardware issue with the DY1: drive. I've tried >cleaning heads etc. The read/write boards are fine ( I swapped them >with my Decmate I to check). > >So now I need a single drive for an RX02. Any idea's of a source? > >Many thanks! > >- Gary Yes and no. The Drives are same as RX01 and also same as those used in the PDT-11/150.. Before I'd run out and kill a RX. I'd try cleaning and relubing the leadscrew and making sure the head load pad is still there. I had one that once both were taken care of it was perfect. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Getting started with HP9000/200

by walkerpa＠ihug.co.nz

Tony, > OK, HP Pascal may be worth a try sometime. Is it related to any other > Pascal (like, say, the UCSD P-system)? HP Pascal is also very powerful, and modular, i.e.: allows compiled modules, or units in Borland Pascal terminology. It includes UCSD file IO, and it has an assembler and debugger. I think in terms of HP hardware supported, Pascal 3.1 is roughly equivalent to Basic 5.1. All of this is gleaned from the various documents at http://bitsavers.org/pdf/hp/9000_200/ as my Pascal knowledge is a little rusty! > you get the idea)). And floppy / floopy drive wear has to be balanced, I > guess, agaisnt the possiblity of a headcrash on the hard drive... It was with this in mind that I did an RS232 byte transfer of all three volumes of my 9153 to files on PC. It took a while! But at least I have a form of archive besides for floppies. I believe that the HP LIFUTIL program will allow connecting an HP drive to PC via HPIB, but I don't have one of those cards currently! > As regards convenience, if I can fit a BASIC configured the way I want > (with the necessare I/O drivers) on one disk, and have a second disk for > my programs, that should be quite useable. I can make backups/images of Suggestion: you could have Basic on the 1st disk, with a startup program that loads drivers from the 2nd disk, and then loads main program(s) from subsequent disks. Regards, Peter -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.9/457 - Release Date: 26-09-2006

19 years, 11 months

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Manchester "Baby"

by stimpy.u.idiot＠gmail.com

On 12/09/06, Andy Holt <andyh at andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk> wrote: > > > What about Science & Industry museum in Manchester? They've got some > early > > Manchester Uni hardware, haven't they? > > > They may have (I believe they have the replica of "Baby"); but, as I > discovered on Friday, they have absolutely none of the computing history > on > normal public display - this is a disgrace! > > Andy Especially given the amount of spare exhibition space they seem to have in the big warehouse that backs onto Coronation St.(1). I didn't get enough time today to have a proper look but given the Manchester Uni/Ferranti/ICL connection you'd think they could put something together. However, the replica "baby" can be seen every Tuesday, respect is due to the volunteers running the demo, they're ex Ferranti and ICL and know their stuff. It's definitely worth a visit, but be aware the gallery isn't open at all other days of the week. (The whole museum is worth a look btw, mostly free too) -- Pete Edwards "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future" - Niels Bohr (1) Set of popular UK TV soap opera.

19 years, 11 months

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another test

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

test2 - please ignore this.

19 years, 11 months

1
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Dymo Labelwriter 330 Turbo (data)

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

--- "John R." <jhoger at gmail.com> wrote: > On 9/25/06, aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk > <aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > > > > Hi folks, > > > > I was wondering if anyone has any data on > > the Dymo Labelwriter 330 Turbo? > > > > I seem to recall downloading the command format fr om > their website. > Keep looking. Did you try downloading the SDK > through the Developers > tab? Maybe there's a document in there. > > If you can't find it you can always use a machine > with two serial > ports (serial protocol analyzer to snoop the > traffic. HP serial > protocol analyzers up to 19200bps units go pretty > cheap on ebay these > days if you want a stand-alone. This is not a task > you can con someone > else into doing if it ain't already done (well, yo u > could pay them, I > guess). It is a challenge that you will have to me et > yourself if you > cannot find documentation. > > -- John. > Thanks for that, if no-one can help I'll look out for that piece of kit on eBay and get myself a laptop (I hate MS & Windoze) I did some research before buying myself the Labelwriter, and some guy (I forget his name) has written a driver for a modern printer so he could use it with his retro one. He used software to intercept the data being sent/recieved, rather than some equipment. I also hooked up the Labelwriter to my Amiga 600, and used AMOS BASIC to try and get it to print something by sending random data (perhaps a bad idea) to it with no luck. I did, however, confirm that the Amiga recognised that the printer was connected. Regards, Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

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pdp8's,11/05, 11/34, Documentation, etc

by useddec＠gmail.com

I just picked up a ton of dec stuff including, 8's 11's, hardware, prints > and manuals. If you have any interest, please phone me or contact me off > list for details. Thanks, Paul Anderson 217-586-5361

19 years, 11 months

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1
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another test

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Please ignore.

19 years, 11 months

1
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RS DRAM chips?

by rtellason＠verizon.net

I have some chips here, I'm pretty sure they're DRAM, marked with both a Motorola logo and a "T/C" (Tandy Corp.?) logo, and with the part number 8040016 followed by what I'm pretty sure is a data code of QQ8301. Anybody know what these are, exactly? I have a bunch of them, and no particular use for them, if anybody needs some, though I'm curious as to what they are. -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin

19 years, 11 months

1
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SCSI cable needed

by rtellason＠verizon.net

I've been going through a whole mess of stuff trying to get a CD burner working here, one I have won't work at all, one won't open and close its drawer reliably, and what I finally got to work was an external unit, a Yamaha CRW4260tx. Not new, but hey, it works... The thing is, I've currently got it hooked up by having the cover off, using a 50-wire ribbon cable from the rear of the actual drive assembly to the internal connector of the Adaptec 2940 that's in the computer, which also has its cover off. I'd like to put the covers on again, particularly since someone mentioned in here that cooling is critical with those drives, but to do that I need the right cable. The person I got this stuff from gave me *all* of their SCSI stuff, they ssy. And included in that was a ribbon cable, but that's apparently for internal use as it has three connectors on it and they're all the same size. I do have the book for the burner handy, and the cable shown in there is round. And the connector on the burner (2 of them actually) is *smaller* than the external connector on the 2940, I don't know exactly what you'd call this one. Anybody have such a cable they'd be willing to part with? I don't have much cash to work with at all, but could probably cover postage, or maybe trade some stuff. -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin

19 years, 11 months

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list stats

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

Out of interest, are the stats for daily list traffic recorded anywhere? I've not seen any obviously missing messages, I just don't seem to be seeing much list traffic right now (since hopping the pond a couple of weeks back and using a different ISP) Although maybe this is in relation to the DoS attack on the classiccmp servers, and things still aren't 'quite right'... cheers Jules -- A. Because it destroys the natural flow of conversation. Q. What's wrong with top posting ?

19 years, 11 months

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New computer nostalgia/history/collecting podcast . . .

by dgreelish＠mac.com

Hello everyone, what I once did in the print form, I am now starting as a "radio" show. If you are not familiar with podcasting, it is essentially an mp3 talk-show (usually). This can be downloaded to your iPod or mp3 player, or simply listened to online from the below link. All that is needed is QuickTime. http://web.mac.com/tgreelish/iWeb/ClassicComputingPodcast/Classic%20Computi… I hope my work can be an enjoyable and useful addition to the hobby/community. Thanks, David Greelish The Classic Computing Podcast classiccomputing.com The Home of Computer History Nostalgia

19 years, 11 months

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360kB HH Floppy Drive

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: 360kB HH Floppy Drive > From: Sridhar Ayengar <ploopster at gmail.com> > Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2006 15:08:35 -0400 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > > >Does anyone have an extra 360kB HH 5.25" PC-compatible floppy drive >lying around? Or maybe two? > >Peace... Sridhar Yes, a bunch. Are they rare around there? Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Getting started with HP9000/200

by walkerpa＠ihug.co.nz

Tony > How much memory? My 9817 has 2 megabytes. Should be ample. > Of course the drive unit in the 9154 is very much HP custom, with a > _strange_ interface (parallel 8 bit data bus for head > positioning/control, and then the raw data lines for read/write). So no > real chance of using something else there. > > How useful is a hard drive? I know the previous owner of my 9817 ran it > from a 9122 floppy drive only. Convenience, I suppose, to eliminate disk swapping / floppy drive wear / grease problem. My 9153 continues to function, and I am religious about cleaning the floppy drive. And using new or newish floppy disks. Regards, Peter -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.9/456 - Release Date: 25-09-2006

19 years, 11 months

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Commodore keyboards and PCs

by dm561＠torfree.net

--------------Original Message: Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2006 07:47:11 +0100 From: Gordon JC Pearce <gordon at gjcp.net> Subject: Re: Commodore keyboards and PCs >M H Stein wrote: >> Not to take any business away from Jim and they are a little expensive, >Erm... If you just wanted to encode switch presses to a PS/2 input, why >not just buy an el-cheapo keyboard for about ?2 from your friendly >neighbourhood computer shop and set about it? Bit better than the $100... >Gordon -------------Reply: True enough, but you don't have the look & feel or the C64 key labels & layout; I think the idea is to use a defunct C64 and use it as a keyboard for the emulator. In fact, since it's a snap to upload different conversion tables into it you could use it for several different emulators of systems using RS-232 or matrix (and probably ASCII as well) keyboards, all on the same computer; just plug in the appropriate keyboard, upload the matching table and it's just like the real thing but without the "real" hardware. Also I thought I'd mention it for the RS-232<>PC keyboard option, something I've found useful for several applications; interfacing to otherwise inaccessible systems and replacing terminal keyboards are two examples. Finally, the folks at Hagstrom have always been friendly & helpful and I thought I'd give 'em a plug :) m

19 years, 11 months

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Dymo Labelwriter 330 Turbo (data)

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

Hi folks, I was wondering if anyone has any data on the Dymo Labelwriter 330 Turbo? I would like to use it with my Amiga 600, but alas Dymo haven't made a driver for it! I tried writing to them attempting to get some technical documents on the printer with no luck. Has anyone attempted to write (or written) a driver for it for retro computers? Does anyone have one and (sorry!) a PC/laptop? I nee d some kind person to intercept and retrieve the data sent from the PC to the printer when printing a blank label and a completely black label, so I can compare the data between the two. Regards, Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

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RX02 Problem solved...

by gkaufman＠the-planet.org

Thanks to tremendous help from several folks I've isolated my formatting problem. Turns out to be a hardware issue with the DY1: drive. I've tried cleaning heads etc. The read/write boards are fine ( I swapped them with my Decmate I to check). So now I need a single drive for an RX02. Any idea's of a source? Many thanks! - Gary

19 years, 11 months

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Fwd: [clue-tech] OT: Old equipment to give away / donate

by rtellason＠verizon.net

Found on another list... ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: [clue-tech] OT: Old equipment to give away / donate Date: Sunday 24 September 2006 03:19 pm From: "Chris N. Brown" <katanacb at comcast.net> To: "CLUE tech" <clue-tech at cluedenver.org> Sorry for the off-topic posting. I've got some old Sun and Intel-based equipment that I'd like to get rid of. I'm not sure if they are of value to anyone (if so, email me and I'll let you know what I've got) but I was wondering if anyone had any ideas or information on places to dispose of it all. Things range from a Sun 17" monitor to misc peripherals to towers. I'm planning to put an ad up on, say, craigslist saying "if you want them come get them" but on the chance that no one does, was looking for some pointers on proper disposal. (recycling, donation, give 'em to Goodwill, etc). Cheers, Chris _______________________________________________ clue-tech mailing list clue-tech at cluedenver.org http://www.cluedenver.org/mailman/listinfo/clue-tech ------------------------------------------------------- -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin

19 years, 11 months

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Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11)

by bqt＠softjar.se

Allison <ajp166 at bellatlantic.net> wrote: >>Subject: Re: Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11) >> From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh at aracnet.com> >> Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:30:40 -0700 >> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org>, >>cctech at classiccmp.org >> >>At 7:09 AM -0400 9/19/06, Allison wrote: >> >>> > >>> >>>>Subject: Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11) >>>> From: Julian Wolfe <fireflyst at earthlink.net> >>>> Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 00:07:49 -0500 >>>> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" >>>><cctalk at classiccmp.org> >>>> >>>>As of September 30, 2006, the last PDP-11 that rolled off the line >>>>will finally be 10 years old. >>>> >>>>The PDP-11 EOL was actually September 30,1996. >>> >>>Mentec continued it and you can still buy new 11 based boards. >>> >>>Allison >> >>Is Mentec still selling them? From the last time I looked at the >>website, it looked like they were only reselling emulators instead of >>real hardware now. >> >>Still up until recently they were selling new boards. >> >> Zane > > > They may well have stopped cpu production but only recently.The only CPUs > that have been around near as long in production are: > > PDP-8 (cmos 6100 and 6120) > 1802 > Z80 Well, you can maybe still buy Quckware PDP-11 boards, so there are still new PDP-11 systems shipped. http://www.quickware.com/ Also, I'm not sure what I would call Strobe Data's Osprey systems... (http://www.strobedata.com/) But yeah, I think Mentec have stopped selling hardware. None of the CPUs mentioned above comes near the PDP-11 in longevity, even though they are long runners. The best candidate is maybe the Z80, since it's still in production and going strong. Not sure if the 1802 still is around, both the 1802 and Z80 came years after the PDP-11. The PDP-8 systems stopped manufacturing quite a while ago, and while they started before the PDP-11, I think the PDP-11 have passed them now. Johnny

19 years, 11 months

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RX02 drives / RT11

by gkaufman＠the-planet.org

I'm relearning RT-11 on an 11/23 I was kindly given (thanks David!). I'm having trouble with the RX02 drives. I can boot RT11, and .format DY1: About 1/3rd of the time I get an error while formatting, this is on known good 8" SS/DD media that has been extensively tested on a CP/M system in both SD and DD modes. On media which does format fine, I get gobs of bad blocks using .initialize/badblocks DY1: The only media that seems to work fine is "real" RX02 media. Is the RX02 incapable of formatting it's own media? Is there a common hardware problem that I should look for? Filter caps? Clean the stepper motor? Many thanks. - Gary

19 years, 11 months

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Getting started with HP9000/200

by walkerpa＠ihug.co.nz

Hi Tony > 1) What softwware do people recomend? HP BASIC looks reasonable, > actually, it does at least support named procedures with formal > parameters. Anything else reocmended? HP BASIC is quick to put together and powerful. The documentation is good and available (as you've seen, or got). I think the documentation was one of HP's strong points with these machines. HP Pascal gives you the speed, but you'll definitely need more memory ... > 2) How much RAM do I reasonably need. If I pulled one of the 256K cards > from the 9816 so I could add a DIO I/O card, would the machine still be > useful? My programming career started with HP9816s' with only the 256K on-board RAM; that was using Basic 2 originally, then Basic 3. And we got by - the company didn't want to spend any more than it had too! That was in civil engineering & construction where we were able to put together costing, critical path planning, and some envelope & pre-stress design software. Whilst it is certainly constraining, so you'll probably be ok with one add-on RAM card for a lot of things. Later on, I got involved with a land surveying package, which besides being able to do a multitude of cadastral calculations, included a fairly comprehensive CAD facility. That definitely needed more RAM, and was standardised with a 1MB add-on card. For all above software, the only IO we did was RS232 for HPGL plotting, so only needed the built-in port. > 3) I've been reading the 9836 service manual [2]. I makes reference to > the 'Developer's Documentation' or some such, which apparently contains > information for people who want to design DIO cards and/or port OS's to > the machines. Does anyone have this (it's not on bitsavers or the > Australian museum that I can see). It certainly sounds like something I > should read if I can. Haven't seen or heard of this. > 4) Anything elase I need, or should keep an active lookout for? Probably 913x/915x spare hard drives, unless you're able to get the drives at http://www.bering.com/main.htm Regards, Peter Walker --HP9000/200 tinkerer, and still looking for Pascal 3.1! -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.8/455 - Release Date: 22-09-2006

19 years, 11 months

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New find, Heathkit H89 computer.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: New find, Heathkit H89 computer. > From: "Bob Shannon" <bshannon at tiac.net> > Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 20:44:31 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >I've just come across a new vintage system. > >I've been given a Heathkit H-89 computer with some documentation and one >bootable diskette. > >Its booting HDOS, but I don't have any HDOS specific documentation, just the >'Operation' and >assembly manuals (the 'Operation' manual is really theory of operation >material). > >Does anyone have the ability to make a set of 'distribution' HDOS disks >(100K floppy)? > >Is CP/M also available, or the Heathkit diagnostics disk? > >I've not been able to find much HDOS documentation on-line, does anyone have >pointers? CP/M was available. One thing, which disk controller does it have? If memory serves there were several different ones between heath and aftermarket. Allison >

19 years, 11 months

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Data General Nova 3 manuals needed

by g-wright＠att.net

Hi, I have a Nova 3 that I would like to get to know a little better. I do not have any manuals and a quick search came up with a dead end. Info on testing and how to interface to the console port ?? (external term). Is it TTY or RS232 and of coarse which pins or ??? Bruce are you out there ???? ;-) Below is the card lay out Thanks, Jerry Function MFG No. EK No. -12 Transport 4190/4041/4044 063-130 -11 FMDET 4190/4041/4042/4044 063-147 -10 <- B side oneida, Vanes A side -> MBD 4042 063-131 -09 -08 Disk Cartridge Controller DG 6030 -07 -06 -05 Mos Memory DG 8543 -04 Cassette I/O DG 4075 4077 4078 4079 -03 Mos Memory DG 8543 -02 Nova 3 Triple options bd. DG 8553/8531/8535 -01 Nova 3 CPU DG 8530/8531 W/ARST. APL

19 years, 11 months

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360kB HH Floppy Drive

by Mzthompson＠aol.com

Try the following link: http://marina.mfarris.com/theref/theref.html Text from the search engine: > TheRef(tm) is also available in file form. The latest version is 4.5a, > released on 6 May 1996, which is a partial update to the last full > version, 4.3. ... Has info on FDD, HD and optical drives. As it says above "available in file form", but I did't look for it when I was there just now. If it is not available anymore in file form, I have the files from downloading them back in 1997. Mike

19 years, 11 months

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Heathkit H89

by jack.rubin＠ameritech.net

> Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 20:44:31 -0400 > From: "Bob Shannon" <bshannon at tiac.net> > Subject: New find, Heathkit H89 computer. > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Message-ID: <001e01c6df72$d19c6030$0100a8c0 at screamer> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > I've just come across a new vintage system. > > I've been given a Heathkit H-89 computer with some > documentation and one > bootable diskette. > > Its booting HDOS, but I don't have any HDOS specific > documentation, just the > 'Operation' and > assembly manuals (the 'Operation' manual is really theory of > operation > material). > > Does anyone have the ability to make a set of 'distribution' > HDOS disks > (100K floppy)? > > Is CP/M also available, or the Heathkit diagnostics disk? > > I've not been able to find much HDOS documentation on-line, > does anyone have > pointers? > > Come on by and visit us at www.sebhc.org , a site dedicated to the Heathkit 8-bit computers (mostly H8 and H89, but the 680x trainers as well). We have extensive online archives with docs and software. Also, be sure to take a look at Eric Rothfus' SVD ( www.thesvd.com/SVD ) which includes HDOS and CP/M boot images ready to plug and ply on the H89. Jack -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.8/455 - Release Date: 9/22/2006

19 years, 11 months

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360kB HH Floppy Drive

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: 360kB HH Floppy Drive > From: "Charles E. Fox" <cfox1 at cogeco.ca> > Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 16:33:21 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > > > Is there any easy way of telling a 360 K from a 1.2 Meg? I >have a bunch of 5 1/4 drives. > > Charlie Fox Yes. The model numbers on the drive. 360k drives are 40 track, 2 sided 48tpi. Here are a few... For Teac: FD55A Full height FD55B 48tpi 40 track two sided FD55c ???? FD55D ???? FD55E 96tpi 80 track single sided. FD55F 96tpi 80 track two sided FD55G 96tpi 80 track two sided dual speed Fujitsu 2851A 40 track 2 sided Toshiba 5425 40 track 2 sided Shugart SA400 35 track 1 side full height SA400L 40 track 1 side full height SA450 40 track 2 side full height Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Commodore keyboards and PCs

by joachim.thiemann＠gmail.com

> From: Jim Brain <brain at jbrain.com> > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2006 17:10:39 -0500 > Subject: Re: Commodore keyboards and PCs > Technically, C=Key is designed to work inside a perfectly functional C64 > or C128. If the 64 is on, it will convert PS2 inputs to C64 keypresses > (in combination with the current 64 KB). If the 64 is off, it will > convert the C64 KB actions to PS2 KB events. I was thinking... isn't the PS/2 keyboard protocol simply a low-bitrate serial protocol at TTL levels? Could the 6510 then not act as the microcontroller? That is, why not connect the user port to the PS/2 port and run a program on the C64 to send the keypresses to the PC? Of course, this runs dangerously into the direction of a "why use an emulator if you have the real thing" kind of debate... :-) Joe.

19 years, 11 months

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Getting started with HP9000/200 series machines

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

I seem to be getting interested in HP9000/200 stuff.... So far I've got (IIRC) : HP9816 with the compact keyboard. This has 768K RAM (256K on the CPU board, 2 off 256K RAM boards, one in each DIO slot). HP9817 + HP-HIL keyboard and monitor. 2M RAM (2 off 1M RAM cards), text and graphics video boards. And therefore 2 empty DIO slots, both with external access [1] [1] These machines have expansion slots called 'DIO'. Some cards have brackets with connectors on them, for example an RS232 board. The spacing of the slots in the backplane is half the height of the connector bracket, so such cards go in every alternate slot. The intermediate slots can be used for RAM cards, the DMA controller, and so on. The video card in the 9817 takes a pair of slots, the text card has a bracked with aBNC connector fro video output, the graphics card fits in the slot immediately above it, and carries a ribbon cable that links to the text card. HP9836A. This one is hard to get to at the moment, so I am working from memory. I think it has 1M RAM (4 off 256K cards), and therefore 4 avaialbe DIO slots, all with external access. I have the monitor, and of course it has 2 built-in 5.25" floppy drives. Assorted DIO cards. The useful ones are a couple of GPIOs, a low-speed HPIB DMA controller,, and an RS232 card. The last will almost certainly end up in the 9836, which doesn't have RS232 as standard (my other 2 machines do). As regards drives, I have a 9122 with the normal grease problem (hut the heads are OK). I can probably find a few 9121a, a 9133H, and a 9154, if they're going to be useful. I also have HP BASIC 5.0 and 5.1 on original 3.5" disks. I'll prboably use these machines (as far as I use them at all) in much the way HP intended -- as control/logging systems. Questions : 1) What softwware do people recomend? HP BASIC looks reasonable, actually, it does at least support named procedures with formal parameters. Anything else reocmended? 2) How much RAM do I reasonably need. If I pulled one of the 256K cards >from the 9816 so I could add a DIO I/O card, would the machine still be useful? 3) I've been reading the 9836 service manual [2]. I makes reference to the 'Developer's Documentation' or some such, which apparently contains information for people who want to design DIO cards and/or port OS's to the machines. Does anyone have this (it's not on bitsavers or the Australian museum that I can see). It certainly sounds like something I should read if I can. 4) Anything elase I need, or should keep an active lookout for? [2] Yes, it's a boardswapper guide. No, I don't approve of boardswapping. But that doesn't mean I don't read the manuals. There are some useful points in it. -tony

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2006 23:42:29 +0100 (BST) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >> >Are they really that common in the States? They are not at all common in >> >the UK any more, so don't think of that as being a source for 50Hz pulleys... >> >> If you were her than 50hz pulleys are a non issue. ;) > >Sure, but if anyone was mad enough to bring their collection across to >England, they would not be able to find the right pulleys... > >> >> Lifes rough. The solution I used once for a 50hz and later a 400hz motor >> was a simple transformer output pushpull amp fed with a wein bridge osc, > >Sure. > >I am told (and probably have the service sheet for) there was an AC/DC >mains radiogram sold in the UK that had an AC motor for the record >turntable. There was a unit, only used on DC mains, that consisted of 3 >valves, acting as an oscillator and push-pull output (the last 2 valves >were probably 50L6s.). Of course there was no HT rectifier, since it was >only used on DC mains (The radio/amplifier section was the normal >series-string heaters and half-wave rectifier type of thing). > Not the same thing though may be the same idea. What I have is a unit I designed as a variable frequency power source (115-125VAC) self contained that runs off line power (has own PS) and run AC motors to 100W in the range of 25-500hz. Very handy for older audio tape decks that are slightly off speed or if you slew the tape while hearing it (off speed). Mine is a proto I built 30 years ago and the production version was used to run a 3M 1" 8track commercial deck for studio use. Many of the multitrack decks had DC motor contros but not all. That variation allowed for a computer interface to alter speed off spec to find and sync timecodes on the tape. The controller also managed the deck for FF, forward, rewind, speed select and stop. Very impressive to see two decks running 14 tracks of music and this would sync both perfectly or offset as desired (for effects). That system used sinewave drive to keep noise out of the system as we found square waves worked fine but the amps and all tended to hear it.. and harmonics of it. I also have a smaller version that runs from 12V battery for smaller motors to 30watts. Most motors tolerate a squware wave source so efficientcy can be very high. The trick of running AC motors off variable frequency also is used for my antenna rotator (ham radio) so I can make large changes in azmuth with acceleration and deceleration as most rotator are AC motors and the antennas have some interta (15 and 18 foot booms). This also has a microcontroller (8749) to manage the position and motor controls. Doing it with a solidstate converter is far more efficient than motor driven alternators for frequency conversion at low power. Much quieter too. I've since seen the same thing for done for large (10hp and up) motor controller. The whole show comes from the days of doing audio consoles both analog and early digital. Obviously the method could also produce 230V AC if desired. So 50hz pulleys, no problem! Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Amiga 2000

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

intererted if it works...located in NE Pennsyltucky LOL __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 11 months

1
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Amiga 2000

by tpeters＠mixcom.com

I need to get rid of an Amiga 2000. Any interest? IF there's a few buck in it for me, hurrah, else I'd like it to have a decent home with someone who's interested in Amiga. It was Don's. -T

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2006 23:16:24 +0100 (BST) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >> >> On Tuesday 19 September 2006 18:57, Tony Duell wrote: >> > > I also have/had a horrible one, originating from a Philips mini (PTS6000) >> > > which used 115VAC for one of the motors >> > >> > Most [1] 8" droves had mains-operated spindle motors, often 115V >> > (although 230V versions did exist). Note that the spindle speed depends >> >> Actually, I've got one that is set to run on 240V, 60Hz. It's out of a > >Needless to say the voltage is not that critical. 220V, 230V, 240V are >all the same :-) > >> (broken and now disassembled) IBM 3274 terminal controller (for the microcode >> floppy, of course). >> >> > [2] One reason I wouldn't conssider moving my collection to the States. >> >> Oh come on, The Great Dr. Duell isn't afraid of replacing SMT chips on boards, >> but is afraid of having to change a few pulleys? Something sounds fishy >> here... > >Oh, I'd be happy to change the pulleys and reset the belt tensions. The >problem is _getting_ the pulleys. Do you want to be the chap who phones >Seagate and says 'Hello, I think you used to be Shugart, do you have the >60Hz conversion kits for the SA801, SA851 and SA4000 in stock' Pft! If you brought them here you'd find spares from used drives or even working domestic versions. Non of those floppies are exactly rare and even the SA4000 is still around. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Commodore keyboards and PCs

by dm561＠torfree.net

Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 09:13:18 +0100 From: Gordon JC Pearce <gordon at gjcp.net> Subject: Re: Commodore keyboards and PCs >>> Erm... If you just wanted to encode switch presses to a PS/2 input, why >>> not just buy an el-cheapo keyboard for about ?2 from your friendly >>> neighbourhood computer shop and set about it? Bit better than the $100... >> >>> Gordon >> >> -------------Reply: >> >> True enough, but you don't have the look & feel or the C64 key labels & layout; >> I think the idea is to use a defunct C64 and use it as a keyboard for the emulator. >That's why you use an el-cheapo keyboard and pull the board from it, and >hook up your own matrix... Ah, I misunderstood; I thought you meant just relabel the keys. Mind you, rewiring the matrix would make the keyboard incompatible with the C64 (although it'd be a relaxing project for a Saturday afternoon...) I didn't mean that it _had_ to be defunct, just that if you only had a non-repairable C64 this'd be a good way to have its equivalent; if your PC had video out as many of them do these days, you could even hook it up to a Commodore monitor for the real look&feel. But if all you need is input from a few buttons or switches like for a dedicated MP3 player for example, using the guts from a keyboard is a quick & easy way to go (as ethan described); have done that too for a few projects. Interesting to see how they've shrunk over the years, from 2 or 3 LSI and a half-dozen TTL glue chips to a tiny blob of epoxy... mike

19 years, 11 months

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360kB HH Floppy Drive

by ploopster＠gmail.com

Does anyone have an extra 360kB HH 5.25" PC-compatible floppy drive lying around? Or maybe two? Peace... Sridhar

19 years, 11 months

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11/34 failing trap test

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Aug 19 2006, 9:38, Wolfe, Julian wrote: > I got the 11/34 up and running, and I loaded XXDP. It fails the trap > test. The instructions state you should examine the stack pointer > (777706) which shows it to be a value of 000470. This is supposed to > tell you the address of the Program Counter, right? So I load address > 470, and the value is 000330. What instruction is failing? Am I > reading this right? Yes, the stack pointer points to the last address used on the stack, and that will be the value of the PC when it called the error subroutine, or to put it another way, the address of the next instruction to be executed had the JSR not been taken. It's failing at whatever test was just before location 330 -- which is surprisingly low. You'd need to look at the listing to see what the test was. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2006 22:28:09 +0100 (BST) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >> >Oh, I'd be happy to change the pulleys and reset the belt tensions. The >> >problem is _getting_ the pulleys. Do you want to be the chap who phones >> >Seagate and says 'Hello, I think you used to be Shugart, do you have the >> >60Hz conversion kits for the SA801, SA851 and SA4000 in stock' >> >> Pft! If you brought them here you'd find spares from used drives or even >> working domestic versions. Non of those floppies are exactly rare and even >> the SA4000 is still around. > >Are they really that common in the States? They are not at all common in >the UK any more, so don't think of that as being a source for 50Hz pulleys... If you were her than 50hz pulleys are a non issue. ;) >And those were the easy drives. I guess RK05s wouldn't be too hard to >find 60Hz pulleys for either. What about RX01s/02s? Do RK07s need >converting? RL's I know don't. But my ASR33 would. And all my audio tape >recorders (some of which may never have had 60Hz varients). Lifes rough. The solution I used once for a 50hz and later a 400hz motor was a simple transformer output pushpull amp fed with a wein bridge osc, a very good way to generate variable frequency sinewavs in the <100W class. so happens I had a 12.6V CT (12A) transformer with the requisite 120V primary. Into a lamp load it was under 1% THD and voltage stability was as good (5%). I ended up using it for all sorts of AC motor control solutions. Didn't require special parts or machine shop either. >Don't worry, I am not going to move to the States. It would be totally >impractical for a lot of other reasons. Whats practicality got to do with anything? :) Allison

19 years, 11 months

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1
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Commodore keyboards and PCs

by dm561＠torfree.net

Not to take any business away from Jim and they are a little expensive, but wouldn't an off-the-shelf keyboard encoder do the job? I've used Hagstrom's KE24s ($99.99) for years, albeit in RS-232<>PS/2 mode. User-programmable matrix or discrete switch inputs to PC keyboard or RS-232, as well as RS-232 to/from PC keyboard. www.hagstromelectronics.com/modules.html mike -----------Original messages: Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2006 07:27:40 -0400 From: "Richard A. Cini" <rcini at optonline.net> Subject: RE: Commodore keyboards and PCs To: "'General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only'" <cctech at classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <005901c6dd70$f2f2c570$6401a8c0 at bbrrooqpbzx6tz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Yep, saw the DIY package. I was looking for the boards already done. This is not a front burner project for me just yet (other things in the hopper right now), so I'll keep an eye out. Any idea of timing for boards? Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Lead engineer, Altair32 Emulator Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ Web site: http://www.altair32.com/ /***************************************************/ -----Original Message----- From: cctech-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctech-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jim Brain Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 10:07 PM To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: Commodore keyboards and PCs Richard A. Cini wrote: > All: > > > > I'm playing around with VICE, the Commodore emulator and I > wondered how others who use it deal with key remapping. Sometimes I find it > hard locating the mapped keys because I look at the keycap and of course, > the key is wrong (like TAB is CTRL, ESC is RUN/STOP, etc.) > > > > I'm looking for suggestions beyond sticking little labels on my > keyboard :-) > > www.jbrain.com/vicug/gallery/c=key/ Jim

19 years, 11 months

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2
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DG Nova 3 wanted (UK)

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

Had a query from a chap looking for a DG Nova 3 in the UK, as part of a museum project for English Heritage. I'm still gathering details, but I'm getting the impression that the look is far more important than operational status, as the software (and associated network) that used to run with the particular system he's trying to recreate is long-gone. (Hence I've mentioned just getting a mock-up done as one possibility) Anyone have a line on any Nova 3 systems left in the UK though? They never did seem that popular outside the US; I know all we have at the museum are a few stray boards. cheers Jules -- If you've ever wondered how you get triangles from a cow You need buttermilk and cheese, and an equilateral chainsaw

19 years, 11 months

1
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Expensive VT420 on Ebay.

by fryers＠gmail.com

Hey all, Just saw this on ebay uk - a VT420 with a buy it now price of ?50. Makes the one I got for free seem quite valuable! Item number 110034030429 Simon -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Well, an engineer is not concerned with the truth; that is left to philosophers and theologians: the prime concern of an engineer is the utility of the final product." Lectures on the Electrical Properties of Materials, L.Solymar, D.Walsh

19 years, 11 months

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C64 Serial Port finished!

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

Well, I finally finished the MAX233 based User Port Serial interface (it was basically finished Sunday). In case anyone is curious, here are a couple pictures. http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/MAX233-1.jpg http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/MAX233-2.jpg Of course I finally get it so I can get my Commodore 64 online only to find out that Quantum Link Reloaded is down at the moment :^( So far I've connected to a BBS in Toronto :^) Seems strange logging into a BBS for the first time in nearly 13 years. Zane PS the real question is who can identify what I built it into :^) -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |

19 years, 11 months

11
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68000 chips

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

Hi --- Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote: > On 9/18/06, aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk > <aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I got some 68000 DIP chips for ???3.00 off of > www.vint > > agecomputermarketplace.com the other week. I > finally > > got around to checking that they are of use to me > ( > > by comparing them with notes I have on the > internals > > of my old A600 Rev 1.1) and discovered that the y > ma > > y not be of use to me! :( > > Not of use how? I've never owned an A600 (I have > just about every > other model)... do they have PLCC (square-package) > CPUs? Aye, the main CPU is square. > > Were you trying to aquire these chips for spares o r > for an upgrade? Yeah, I just wanted them as spares for the existing co-processors on my Amiga's. Besides, for $3 (USD) I'm sure you couldn't resist either (if you own a 68K-based machine). > > > Here's the low-down on them: > > > > MC68000P10 > > 2 C91E DIP chip (rectangle with pins on > long sides) x 2 > > QEDB9215 > > Sounds like a Motorola CPU that can run as fast at > 10MHz (they marked > them as high as 12MHz, but I think those can be > clocked at 16MHz). > > > S (large logo S) SCN68000CAN64 > > 2208N19 DIP chip x1 > > 9035KE > >> snip << > > > -ethan > > Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

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RR-Net + WarpCopy = :)

by bpope＠wordstock.com

With Zane H. getting productive with his C64, I thought I would throw in what I finally got working on my C64 setup... Last night I was *finally* able to update one of the banks in my Retro-Reply with "The Final Replay" rom. This gives you the command "CODENET" which allows you to send and execute code on the C64 from another computer over TCP/IP. I sent the WarpCopy server and now I am able to archive disk to my PC or send D64 files to be wrote to a floppy. It takes only 22 seconds to send the whole contents of a disk to my PC! Now I just need to find three more drives... WarpCopy can be found here: http://www.oxyron.de/html/wc64.html . (The Final Replay rom is also available there.) Cheers, Bryan

19 years, 11 months

2
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Restoration of 8/M

by root＠parse.com

For those interested in restoring old PDP-8's... I received an 8/M in very rough shape; you can read the adventures of restoration at: http://www.parse.com/~museum/pdp8/pdp8m/restore.html Cheers, -RK -- Robert Krten, PARSE Software Devices Realtime Systems Architecture, Consulting, Books and Training at www.parse.com Looking for Digital Equipment Corp. PDP-1 through PDP-15 minicomputers!

19 years, 11 months

1
0
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Commodore keyboards and PCs

by rcini＠optonline.net

All: I'm playing around with VICE, the Commodore emulator and I wondered how others who use it deal with key remapping. Sometimes I find it hard locating the mapped keys because I look at the keycap and of course, the key is wrong (like TAB is CTRL, ESC is RUN/STOP, etc.) I'm looking for suggestions beyond sticking little labels on my keyboard :-) Thanks. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Lead engineer, Altair32 Emulator Web site: <http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/> http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ Web site: http://www.altair32.com/ /***************************************************/

19 years, 11 months

3
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New home for my Sol-20 website -- www.sol20.org

by frustum＠pacbell.net

This past spring I took up Jay's offer of free hosting for classic computer web sites (thanks, Jay!). I had been sitting on some domain names for a while doing nothing with them, but his offer got me in motion. Unfortunately, things heated up at work and at home and I couldn't find the time in the past few months to finish off that last 3% before publishing the new web site. It is finally ready for action. http://www.sol20.org The old web site pages just redirect to the new web site. The content is slightly reorganized but for the most part is identical with the old site. The only new, but interesting, addition is a scan of the Sol schematics and PCB artwork that were offered for SASE in the Popular Electronics article that introduced the Sol. The production Sol had further changes after the article was published. The new web site makes use of CSS, but no javascript. The layout pretty much assumes that you have at least 800 pixels of horizontal resolution. I've tried it out in firefox, IE 6, and opera 9 and it looks pretty much as intended. I've even added some code to make the css disappear if the site is viewed with netscape 4.x. If you notice anything weird about the new look in a modern browser, please let me know about it. Thanks.

19 years, 11 months

1
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Old IRIX wanted

by sethm＠loomcom.com

Hi folks, I'm curious if anyone has media for older IRIX releases. Specifically, I'm looking for IRIX 4.0.5E, 4.0.5F, 4.0.5IOP or 4.0.6IPR on CD. Anyone know if this is still floating around somewhere? It's for a restoration of an Indigo running period software (instead of IRIX 6.5.22 or 5.3, both of which I already have, but are more recent). -Seth

19 years, 11 months

1
1
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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: Fred Cisin <cisin at xenosoft.com> > Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:00:18 -0700 (PDT) > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> > >> keep all the FDC features you could put a 8" on a PC and read SSSD! >On Mon, 18 Sep 2006, Bryan Pope wrote: >> You would need quite the desktop case to house an 8" floppy >> drive! :) > >It says put an 8" ON a PC, not IN it. >If you use two side by side drives horizontally, >then it is a lot more stable to put the PC on the 8" Of course starting with the half height 8" drives helps. They are only about 2.5" tall. What is more interesting is what a PC with two 8" drives would weigh in at! Most of the good 8" drives were a very solid hunk of aluminum. I have a heath H207 dual drive. That's two half height doubled sided drives one atop the other and a linear power supply. Weighs more than full up NS* Horizon (wood case)! It's only 13.5x5.5x17 inches. Allison

19 years, 11 months

8
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Jcmparts clearing out stuff

by aek＠bitsavers.org

For people who have dealt with Joe before, they've uploaded a metric buttload of stuff to their eBay store jcmparts. He claims they're going to scrap whatever doesn't move in the next two months. At his listed prices, it will probably be most of it.

19 years, 11 months

6
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DEC Manuals Available

by maxwell＠acsu.buffalo.edu

Hi All, I have a number of boxes with DEC-related material available. These are systems I no longer have or have no real possibility of obtaining. These are available near Buffalo, NY for pick-up. I will entertain shipping these, but the boxes are heavy and would require arrangements to reimburse me for shipping costs. I will be regretfully forced to recycle these documents if I receive no response by 8 October, 2006. I don't want these to be disposed of but I need the space that they currently occupy. If interested, please contact me via e-mail or telephone as I don't get to read newsgroups as often as I'd like. Here's what I have at present: R80 User's Guide (EK-00R80-UG-001) R80 Service Manual (EK-00R80-SM-001) R80 Technical Description (EK-00R80-TD-001) RL02 Field Maintenence (RL02-TK) Field Maintenence (CFG PKG #76) {I believe for the VAX11-730} Field Maintenence (11730-Z) VAX-11/750 Print Set VAX VMS Manual Set v4.0 {I believe to be complete} RSX-11M v4.1 {I believe to be complete} RSX-11M+ v3.0 {I believe to be complete} RT-11 v4.0 manual set {I believe to be complete} Misc VMS v5.5 manuals Misc PDP-11/24 prints Misc PDP-11/44 prints Thank you, -John P.S. I need power supply repair tips for my PDP-11/84 or if you happen to have a spare supply. :-) I suspect dried-out caps, but still would like to know if anybody else has any ideas to try. A power supply print set would be welcome, too. Any help would be appreciated! -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | John Maxwell | Disclaimer - | | Equipment Repair Tech | "I know you believe you understand | | SUNY at Buffalo | what you think I typed but, | | B10 Lockwood Hall | I am not sure you realize that what | | Buffalo, NY 14260 | you have read is not what I meant." | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | V-Mail: (716) 645-3900 x116 | | E-Mail: maxwell at acsu.buffalo.edu | | W-Site: http://www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~maxwell | ----------------------------------------------------------------------

19 years, 11 months

2
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CP/M for Fairchild F8 : resolved.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: CP/M for Fairchild F8 : resolved. > From: Jos Dreesen / Marian Capel <jos.mar at bluewin.ch> > Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 20:03:24 +0200 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >I asked around and, as many posters suspected, the box was part of a >larger system : A Sentry IC tester, made by Fairchild. That would >explain the use of the F8. > >The row of DRAMs I thought to have seen was, at closer inspection, a set >of bipolar PROMs. Total real ram on the board : 4 x 2114. So no CP/M for >sure.... > >Still, I have never before seen a floppybox with printeroutput ! > >The CP/M disks (SSSD) are therefore most probably from another, unknown >system. > I'd bet they are from an old Intel MDS800 development system [big blue box]. They ran ISIS but CP/M was ported to them as the first system and standard distrubution CP/M for years after had the MDS800 bios in the text (CP/M alteration guide). Allison

19 years, 11 months

2
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C64 Serial Port finished!

by stimpy.u.idiot＠gmail.com

On 20/09/06, Zane H. Healy <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote: > > PS the real question is who can identify what I built it into :^) TK50 box? Good for dice too :) -- > Pete Edwards > "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future" - > Niels Bohr

19 years, 11 months

2
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Personal Iris IRIX issues and other related questions...

by derschjo＠msu.edu

I recently picked up an SGI Personal Iris 4D/35 and I'm struggling to get IRIX installed and working (with emphasis on "working"). I currently have at my disposal a copy of IRIX 4.0.5 and a copy of IRIX 5.3. I've tried installing both, and the installation succeeds in both cases, but neither installation works after install. The symptoms are: IRIX 4.0.5 installs. On reboot I get the typical chatter in the console window (UNIX banners, fsck, "The system is coming up," etc.) after which the screen goes black and stays that way forever and ever. Nothing I do causes any response from the machine. IRIX 5.3 installs. On reboot I get the same chatter as above, after which the screen goes black, except with a red SGI-shaped mouse cursor which I can move around with the mouse. After about 5 seconds the screen turns light blue (the same light blue as the console screen at power-on). At this point I can hit esc to bring up the console, and the characters I type on the keyboard are echoed to it but nothing I do has any effect. Any suggestions? I'm also looking for earlier versions of IRIX to run on this machine -- any good places to find them? Thanks! Josh

19 years, 11 months

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Latest find

by quapla＠xs4all.nl

I have scored a few nice items this day, a PET 2001-8k with lots of extra's like a lightpen, a sort of digitiser keypad, an large expansion board which contains a compuware floppy interface, a compuware dual floppy drive, about 3 dozen tapes, 4 boxes with floppies and a heavy Centronics printer. Also a little gadget which allows me to select 3 different character roms using a little switch. And the best of all is that the machine works and the keyboard just looks as new :) and that all for a bargain price of just 100 Euro's ($128).

19 years, 11 months

2
5
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SAIC V2-LC computers, need hard drives

by deebee＠mts.net

Patrick I saw your site on the web re; Saic V2-LC portable computers. I have one (without a hard drive) and the PIN # is: 56357. Can you tell me what CPU processor this would be? Thanks Don deebee at mts.net

19 years, 11 months

1
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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RE: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: "Richard A. Cini" <rcini at optonline.net> > Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 14:27:00 -0400 > To: "'General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only'" <cctech at classiccmp.org> > >The board has all sorts of jumpers which is good. So I can pick and choose >which ones to change with no problem. > >When reading the book it seems that if you want to use a "minifloppy" drive, >there are several components you need to change -- a bunch of resistors, a >crystal and a coil. I presume this is to change the recording frequency and >spindle speed for 5.25" disks. I'm going to try it without modifications >first, but since the HD drive is equivalent to an 8" drive for recording >purposes, I don't think I have to change them. Those parts are for the Clock, PLL, and write timing. They do not alter spindle speed as thats the job of the floppy. FYI the 1.2mb floppy appeard about 6 years after that board was sold. If you doing 1.2mb 5.25 (or any 8" format) then you DO NOT change those parts. If you want the conventional 360k two sided (40 track 2S DD) or 720k (80 track 2S DD) then you have to. Those parts changes are why there was a Disk1A. >As much as I dislike PeeCees, at least they have the benefit of >standardization. Ah, it's using the definitive PC FDC. It was developed well before PCs standardized. PCs however don't offer much choice and if they did keep all the FDC features you could put a 8" on a PC and read SSSD! Allison

19 years, 11 months

5
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CP/M for Fairchild F8 ?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CP/M for Fairchild F8 ? > From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2006 00:00:24 +0100 (BST) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >> The Z8 has nothing in common with the F8 > >Sure it does. They're both silicon chips, they're both microprocessors, >they both normally come in 40 pi DIL packages. But that's about it :-) >:-) :-) > >> and it's remarkable that there are even these two. From a programmers point >> of view the F8 was a real abortion: the only processor that I've heard of in >> which a Jump corrumpts the contents of the accumulator. > >It does _what_??? Thank %deity I've never had to design with that thing. If that were the only horror it would be ok. It's pretty poor but it was one of the first controller chip that was 8bit and low chip count. The 8048/9 was vastly better! Allison

19 years, 11 months

1
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UK Science Museum Exhibition features PDP-1?

by stimpy.u.idiot＠gmail.com

Does anyone know if this is a real working PDP-1 or a mocked up, emulated thingy? Might be interesting for the games nostalgia for those (like me) whose classic computing interest overlaps to classic gaming. http://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/exhibitions/gameon/ Precis below: *21 October 2006 - 25 February 2007* Explore the history, technology and culture of computer games in this new special exhibition. From the *PDP-1* of the 1960s to the latest consoles, *Game On* examines the technologies that have revolutionised the gaming world. See the ten most influential consoles of all time, learn about the design process behind games such as *Tomb Raider*, investigate the relationship between films and gaming and play over 100 games including classics *Space Invaders* and *Super Mario Brothers*! -- Pete Edwards "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future" - Niels Bohr

19 years, 11 months

5
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CP/M for Fairchild F8 ?

by jos.mar＠bluewin.ch

I found a scrapped box today at work : 2 8" floppydrives , RS232 and printer interfaces. Internally an F8 chipset ( F3850 / F3852 / F3854) with a WD1771 fdc. Strangely enough a set of floppies lay on top, labeled Cp/M, Basic CP/m Pascal etc. Was there ever a CP/M version for the F8 ?? Jos Dreesen

19 years, 11 months

8
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OT: Stepdown convertor

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

--- Gordon JC Pearce <gordon at gjcp.net> wrote: > aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I have been having problems with my Dreamcast > > (that I use to surf the 'net) resetting randomly . > > > > After checking out the power lines, it seems > > that the stepdown convertor is at fault. It > > has a crack and 2 bulging bits (where the > > plastic has been molded with lumps instead of > > flat) on the underside. > > > > How dangerous is this if it is the cause of > > the problem? > > Sounds like it's overheating. > > > It converts a 240V input to a 110V output (not > > been able to check the exact specs on it, as > > it's in use and very hot), as my Dreamcast I > > am using is a Japanese model (my UK model > > isn't fully functioning). > > I'm not well up on Dreamcasts. Do they have an > external power supply? > If they do, then you could use your UK PSU. > > Other than that, you might get an old switchable > 220/110v psu and make > it into an autotransformer. > > Gordon. > The one I am currently using is Japanese one and they (like the USA?) have 2 pin plugs into the mains, whereas our (UK) plugs have 3 pins so I can't use a UK power supply on a Japanese one. Like I stated in another post (I think?) I got a replacement off eBay which I received today, so all is well again. Regards, Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

3
2
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Unidentified ISA card

by teoz＠neo.rr.com

I recently got this card in and have no idea who made it. Anybody have an idea of what it is (I browsed through th99 with no luck, and google didn't help much either)? Pictures: http://home.neo.rr.com/unknownk/images/100_0897.jpg (the cable with in/out that goes on the end). http://home.neo.rr.com/unknownk/images/100_0896.jpg (The card itself) The main card is LV-007 and the TV tuner part is LV-008 Major chips are CHIPS F82C9001, Phillips Saa 7151B, Phillips 9065. I am pretty sure it is a video capture/TV tuner card but I need to find out who made it to find drivers. The cable on top would be to connect to a VGA card I would think, but it looks like it also has VGA cable to put inline with VGA output (redundant?). The little connector on the bezel side bottom looks like a mini headphone jack. The card came a little bent (they used a padded mailer and not a box for shipping) and EC4 is gone (but not found in the mailer, you can see what's left of the cap pins floating in air above and to the right of the 24.576 oscillator top middle of the card), wonder if that cap is even needed. Any ideas?

19 years, 11 months

4
5
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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

Someone said (lost attribution) >The original IBM PC version was a an abortion. Perhaps "abomination" would be a less-charged word... certainly applicable in this case.

19 years, 11 months

2
1
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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RE: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2006 11:32:01 -0700 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >On 9/16/2006 at 4:30 PM Allison wrote: > >>Ah, it's using the definitive PC FDC. It was developed well before >>PCs standardized. PCs however don't offer much choice and if they did >>keep all the FDC features you could put a 8" on a PC and read SSSD! > >You could?!? (if I'm parsing your statement correctly). IIRC, the original >PC FDC card had IBM's proprietary data separator on it (several hybrid >packagaes) and couldn't read SD/FM to save its life. It also had the 8272 >(non "A") part, so it had other problems with "alien" formats. Many can. The original IBM PC version was a an abortion. I'd always felt they worked hard making that mess. As to the A/nonA part thats less a problem than often thought. If it really was a problem you could change out the part. I have a few mid range ISA-8 FDC boards that use the 9216 data sep and they do read SD 8" and a bunch more. >Unless, of course, we're talking about PCs in the generic sense and not the >5150 per se. There, it's a crapshoot as to what capabilites any given FDC >card has. In my original statement I was refering to the generic and as "Standard" its still anything but. When you consider the number of drives and configurations the floppy whent though on PCs over the years it's a big mess. It's only that it's all behind us that was know where the bodies lie and we can assemble it from known history. but it lead to 3.5" drives with out drive select jumpers/switches and other "innovations". Over the lifetime of PCs I've worked with: 5.25 180k single sided 5.25 360k 2 sided 5.25 720k 2 sided 80 track 3.5" 720k 3.5" 1.44mb 3.5" 2.88mb Syquest, Zip, Jazz and other higher density removeables The only thing they didn't do stock was 8" SSSD and 8"DSDD, and hard sector! The aftermarket added those! Standard, really, more like a computer version of a leatherman.. ;) Allison

19 years, 11 months

4
11
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SCSI CD burner

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

For a while, I thought it was a requirement that the laser be turned off at least when the drive was open, so power-down circutry was required. Not sure if this requirement was relaxed.

19 years, 11 months

1
0
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bad keys on terminals

by dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu

So, I'm fooling around with my Tandy PT-210 printing terminal again. Upon disassembly, these switches are revealed to have rubber domes inside that electrically connect two isolated semicircles by pressing a circle of conductive rubber. Wiping with alcohol and blowing them out gives a closed resistance of around 300 ohms, which is good enough to trigger the keyboard circuitry. I've come to one that refuses to work at all, regardless of how I clean it. So, I have two choices: 1) Glue tiny discs of aluminum to the bottoms of the rubber domes. A preliminary test of this using water as "glue" suggests this won't work for long. 2) Find some switches with the same footprint, height, and cross-shaped acutator. The first two seem easy to get. Mouser lists absolutely no switches with a cross top. So, has anyone here any pointers? -- David Griffith dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?

19 years, 11 months

6
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Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11) > From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh at aracnet.com> > Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:30:40 -0700 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org>, > cctech at classiccmp.org > >At 7:09 AM -0400 9/19/06, Allison wrote: >> > >>>Subject: Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11) >>> From: Julian Wolfe <fireflyst at earthlink.net> >>> Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 00:07:49 -0500 >>> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" >>><cctalk at classiccmp.org> >>> >>>As of September 30, 2006, the last PDP-11 that rolled off the line >>>will finally be 10 years old. >>> >>>The PDP-11 EOL was actually September 30,1996. >> >>Mentec continued it and you can still buy new 11 based boards. >> >>Allison > >Is Mentec still selling them? From the last time I looked at the >website, it looked like they were only reselling emulators instead of >real hardware now. > >Still up until recently they were selling new boards. > > Zane They may well have stopped cpu production but only recently.The only CPUs that have been around near as long in production are: PDP-8 (cmos 6100 and 6120) 1802 Z80 Allison

19 years, 11 months

1
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LGA CPU feature (may or may not be on-topic) (REPOST)

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

Found a USIIi/440, went to put it in, my PROM didn't support it, had to have an update using a 300-333 MHz CPU. So it goes. Anyway, that's not a problem. I took a second look at the old card and got it working. For some computers that are almost on topic now, there's a bit of a hidden catch on the CPUs- they aren't firmly attached, and on some of them (I know that SGI PMT5 modules do not fall into this category, but HP PA-8000s and USIIis do) the connection is effected with a sheet of something with conductive rubber blips on it (sound familiar? Wonder how these will work in ~20 years). If you are not careful to go round-and-round the merry-go-round with the device to snug up the heatsink, the processor becomes canted and does not make good contact, and becomes generally unhappy and huffy and will not work (how's that for a run-on!) End of story- I now have an OT Sun Ultra 10 440MHz with Solaris 10 on it- Solaris is much happier on SPARCs than PCs. Western Digital IDE drives from the late '90s to early 2000s seem to be going bad at shocking rates now, also. Beware.

19 years, 11 months

4
3
0 0

Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11) > From: Julian Wolfe <fireflyst at earthlink.net> > Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 00:07:49 -0500 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >As of September 30, 2006, the last PDP-11 that rolled off the line >will finally be 10 years old. > >The PDP-11 EOL was actually September 30,1996. Mentec continued it and you can still buy new 11 based boards. Allison

19 years, 11 months

2
1
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UK Science Museum Exhibition features PDP-1?

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> Does anyone know if this is a real working PDP-1 It is a non working machine on loan from the Computer History Museum.

19 years, 11 months

2
1
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ATT 3b1 mouse

by innfoclassics＠gmail.com

> > > Does anyone know what sort of interface the AT&T 3b2 uses for its mouse? > > > I found one which is missing its mouse. > Sorry. I meant the 3b1 (aka Unix PC) I think it was a logitech two button rectangular wedge shaped mouse used by lots of vendors. They came in both serial and parallel, I think the AT&T one was serial. It has been a long time. Both had a D 9 pin connector. A picture search on google "3b1" brought up a poor picture of the mouse with one. Hard to see what it actuually is. I had several 3B1s go through my hands in the early 1990s.

19 years, 11 months

3
2
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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: "Dave Dunfield" <dave06a at dunfield.com> > Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 05:45:43 -0500 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> >> You would need quite the desktop case to house an 8" floppy >> >> drive! :) > >> What is more interesting is what a PC with two 8" drives would >> weigh in at! Most of the good 8" drives were a very solid hunk >> of aluminum. > >There *IS* a (somewhat) PC with dual full-sized 8" drives mounted >in it - the Nec APC: > > http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/nec/index.htm > >I can tell you that this thing is big and HEAVY - especially the >color one. Having used a color one it was a much better machine than the PCxt (this is back when they were both new). The Color CRT besides being big was way over my lift limit! Allison

19 years, 11 months

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CP/M for Fairchild F8 ?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: CP/M for Fairchild F8 ? > From: Jos Dreesen / Marian Capel <jos.mar at bluewin.ch> > Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 20:15:05 +0200 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > > >I found a scrapped box today at work : > >2 8" floppydrives , RS232 and printer interfaces. Internally an F8 >chipset ( F3850 / F3852 / F3854) with a WD1771 fdc. >Strangely enough a set of floppies lay on top, labeled Cp/M, Basic CP/m >Pascal etc. > >Was there ever a CP/M version for the F8 ?? > > Jos Dreesen No. The F8 at best was a microcontroller. If anything the unit was a smart floppy controller for a CP/M system. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RE: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 09:22:52 -0700 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >On 9/18/2006 at 8:06 AM Allison wrote: > >>3.5" 720k > >There were two "standard" versions of the 720K 3.5 format, differing in the >cluster and FAT size. One was the definition put out by IBM sometime >around MS-DOS 2.1 and the other, by Microsoft in MS-DOS 4.00 (which was an >abomination). > >So, you haven't used 3.5" 1.3MB DOS diskettes? (2x8x1024)? Many USB >floppies and Superdrives support the DOS-V format under Windows 2K and XP; >though FORMAT doesn't appear to understand how to initializae blanks. > >...and let's not forget the short-lived "special" distribution formats from >IBM and Microsoft that got around 1.8MB per 3.5" floppy by using more >sectors per track+interleave+skew(MS DMF) or differing sector sizes (IBM >XDF). I suppose you could call those "standard", since they were >officially-endorsed formats. > Just goes to prove PCs and what standards. ;) They were all over the map just like all the other boxen on storage. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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OT: Stepdown convertor

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

Hi, I have been having problems with my Dreamcast (that I use to surf the 'net) resetting randomly. After checking out the power lines, it seems that the stepdown convertor is at fault. It has a crack and 2 bulging bits (where the plastic has been molded with lumps instead of flat) on the underside. How dangerous is this if it is the cause of the problem? It converts a 240V input to a 110V output (not been able to check the exact specs on it, as it's in use and very hot), as my Dreamcast I am using is a Japanese model (my UK model isn't fully functioning). Reply to me directly if you believe it isn't of interest to the other listmembers. I have just been on eBay to get a replacement. Regards, Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

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SCSI CD burner

by technobug＠comcast.net

On Mon, 18 Sep 2006 13:58:47 -0500, John Foust <jfoust at threedee.com> wrote: > At 02:35 PM 9/16/2006, CRC wrote: >> The basic problem with commercial CD burners/players is that they >> keep the laser diodes on when powered, although at the low power >> required for reading. The life of run-of-the-mill laser diodes is on >> the order of 10,000 (10.000) hours. Consequently, if you keep your >> system on all the time you can expect one to two years of useful life >> from the beast (some longer, some shorter). From <http:// >> www.wtec.org/ loyola/opto/ad_rohm.htm>: > > That document dates from 1994. You'd think that manufacturers would > want to increase MTBF and eliminate failures as quickly as possible, > so I find it hard to believe that LEDs are left on inside today's > CD/DVDs just because it's hard to turn them off and they don't want > to improve lifetimes. This info may be entirely relevant for > 1980s drives, who knows? My intent was to address classic computer equipment. MTBFs of Laser Diodes (LDs - not LEDs) has definitely increased over the last 10 years. However, access to information of the ones used in current CD equipment is privy only to large scale manufacturers. Looking at LDs that are used in fiber optic transmission shows a substantial increase in MTBF over the past 10 years. However, I would hold off on buying into the BlueRay recorders - blue LDs are still have low MTBFs. CD equipment production has progressed to commodity class and every penny represents a margin change of $10k / 1M units - design is done by taking out things until the unit doesn't work :=)). Adding the circuitry to turn off the laser is not difficult, but it costs money... > What sorts of other ancedotes and > claimed facts do we have? > > From the CD-R FAQ: http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq05.html > > Subject: [5-2] How long do CD recorders last? (1998/04/06) > > The MTBF (Mean Time Between Failures) on these drives is > typically 50,000 > to 100,000 hours, and they come with a 1 year warranty. Compare > that to > hard drives rated at between 500,000 and 1,000,000 hours with a 3 > or 5 > year warranty and that should give you some idea. Most of the drives > available today weren't meant for mass production of CD-Rs. The only > exceptions are the venerable Philips CDD 522, Kodak PCD 600, and > Sony CDW-900E. > I assume that the FAQ uses manufacturers stated MTBF - there is no citation for their source. > By 2004, MTBF for consumer CD/DVD were up to 60K to 100K hours: > > http://www.computingondemand.com/reviews/storage-LiteOn-LDW-411S/ > page1.shtml > > And perhaps their MTBF was calculated with a 2% duty cycle, which > would still mean they expect a consumer DVD-R to be able to burn > several thousand discs. I suspect consumer losses are due more to > dust and crud on discs... unless of course you simply don't want to > trust manufacturer-provided MTBFs. In most cases, the criteria for the MTBF is not stated as indicated by your suposition. One has to look at MTBF at temperature since Optek shows a factor of greater than 25 in MTBF between 25 and 70 C. If the tests were run at 20C and you run the device at 50C you can expect 6K and 9K hours vs 70K and 100K hours respectively (based on ratios from the Optek MTBF data for their OPV200 series high reliability LDs). At 70C it's around 1.5K and 2K hours. It's not that I don't trust the manufacturer, it's just that there is insufficient info and the manufacturer's shills will present their most favorable data. Besides the mechanical/electrical failures, which there are many, the LDs power loss generally results in the inability to record and read reliably. Note that the LD does not touch the disk and unless it is used in a smoky/cruddy atmosphere there should be no failure in the optical link. In trying to repair a good number of CDR/W I have recovered only several units by cleaning the LD lens. Recording generally uses virgin disks and an occasional brushing of the lens does help. > > Your average $50 Wal-Mart DVD drive has a 70K MTBF: > > http://www.liteon.com/prod/getProduct.do? > cid=1_7_13&xml_id=4_2&menu_id=4_2_7 Note that the stated MTBF is in POH - power on hours - not usage hours. I guess if you use it all bets are off :=P CRC

19 years, 11 months

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Bet you didn't know...(PDP-11)

by fireflyst＠earthlink.net

As of September 30, 2006, the last PDP-11 that rolled off the line will finally be 10 years old. The PDP-11 EOL was actually September 30,1996. As an interesting tidbit, the life span of the PDP-11 still has the PC beat by two years at this point in time. Here's to many more years of enjoyable service...

19 years, 11 months

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ATT 3b2 mouse

by ken＠seefried.com

> From: David Griffith <dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu> > > Does anyone know what sort of interface the AT&T 3b2 uses for its mouse? > I found one which is missing its mouse. > I've never seen a 3b2 with a graphics display. While I've seen an awful lot of 3b2s (AT&T carpet bombed Gatech with them in the mid-80s), that doesn't mean there wasn't one. Do you perhaps mean the AT&T Blit family of graphics terminals (Jerq/Blit/5620/630/730) that were often serially attached to 3b2s? If so, http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/retrocomputing/att/5620/5620_faq.html should be a start, as well as any surviving archive of comp.terminals.tty5620. These things are nifty. Ken

19 years, 11 months

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C64 ASM Question

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

Now for what is no doubt a very stupid question that I'm hoping someone can help with. I'm using "Turbo Macro Assembler '05", and have verified that it works with the following simple little program that I got off the web: * = $1000 loop: inc $d020 ; increment $d020 jmp loop ; jump to label loop I can get <-- 3 "Assemble and run" to work just fine, however while <-- 5 "Assemble to disk" seems to work, how on earth do I execute the program that is created? Obviously I need to do a: LOAD"FLASH",8,1 It loads just fine, and I assume I need a SYS statement with an address to start it, but what on earth should that address be? Zane -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: RE: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: Fred Cisin <cisin at xenosoft.com> > Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 17:51:43 -0700 (PDT) > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On Mon, 18 Sep 2006, Chuck Guzis wrote: >> You've forgotten the original DOS 1.x 160K SS and 320K DS. I wonder if the >> conservative 8-sector approach on the part of IBM/Microsoft was the >> miserable track record of the original (IIRC, Shugart) drives. The one >While there might be regional variations, I NEVER saw IBM use a >Shugart in the 5150. For the first year or so, it seems like they were >all Tandon TM100-1, and later IBM contracted to have drives made with IBM >front panels by CDC? and others. Likely because every working SA400 (400L) I have has been repaired or lightly used, lousy track record for reliability. >But not Shugart. OTOH, TRS80 and Apple][ both used Shugart mechanisms >(SA400 for TRS80, SA390?? for Apple(with Apple's own board on them)) >Most of the early Shugart SA400s were 35 track, instead of 40. By 1980 the SA400 was always the SA400L 40 track version. One issue of the time was shortages of TTL ICs and disk drive getting scarce due to demand. Allison

19 years, 11 months

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CompuPro floppy controller differences

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: CompuPro floppy controller differences > From: Patrick Finnegan <pat at computer-refuge.org> > Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2006 12:42:54 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On Saturday 16 September 2006 16:30, Allison wrote: >> >As much as I dislike PeeCees, at least they have the benefit of >> >standardization. >> >> Ah, it's using the definitive PC FDC. It was developed well before >> PCs standardized. PCs however don't offer much choice and if they did >> keep all the FDC features you could put a 8" on a PC and read SSSD! > >I actually *can* do that on a K6-2 box I've got sitting at work (and >have done it several times). I have a few that can too, so much for standard. ;) Allison

19 years, 11 months

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Arcade Trackballs (was: Re: C64 Fuse?) (REPOST)

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

Regarding the patents: it is likely that what is being talked about is not the general "trackball" patent but a specific technique of ruggedizing a trackball for hostile situations. That would be my read, anyway. Scott

19 years, 11 months

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IRIS update / interesting Mac II/x/fx failure mode (REPOST)

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

Well, had a marathon evening over at Bear's place a week and a bit ago - brought over the disks from my ailing IRIS to see what we could scavenge. They had GL2-W2.5 on one disk, and assorted projects on the other (looks like this was one of the machines that Virginia Tech had (what was it's journey over here, I wonder...) and tried to port X11R5 to IRIS graphics on. (doesn't seem to have worked). Short answer - PSU seems OK, likely just noise from the improvised scope probes. Bad news: the pin headers on these beasts seem to be getting fragile. Bear's went out with the same symptoms (no memory seen, no graphics) after we tried a boardswap (to verify general functionality of a boardset, not to fix anything). If you have one of these beasts, pull your PSU apart and replace the 4 green paper caps on 2 boards (2 caps per board, one board is the 5v welder output, the other is the main chopper). They seem to be on their last legs, this is the second machine I've seen that suffered an olfactory capacitor failure. And the Mac stuff- IIs, IIxes and, perhaps, IIfxes have canned electrolytics on their logic boards that leak. This effluvium has, on two occasions that I have verified, eaten through the board trace that links the power-on circuitry to the power-on switch and keyboard port (one II, one IIx). If you have one of these machines, you might want to check your boards and clean them if they show signs of leakage. If you have a beast that will not power-on, I can point you where to look... it was the same area on both machines. No word yet if it messed with any of the other traces.

19 years, 11 months

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SCSI CD burner

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 02:35 PM 9/16/2006, CRC wrote: >The basic problem with commercial CD burners/players is that they >keep the laser diodes on when powered, although at the low power >required for reading. The life of run-of-the-mill laser diodes is on >the order of 10,000 (10.000) hours. Consequently, if you keep your >system on all the time you can expect one to two years of useful life >from the beast (some longer, some shorter). From <http://www.wtec.org/ loyola/opto/ad_rohm.htm>: That document dates from 1994. You'd think that manufacturers would want to increase MTBF and eliminate failures as quickly as possible, so I find it hard to believe that LEDs are left on inside today's CD/DVDs just because it's hard to turn them off and they don't want to improve lifetimes. This info may be entirely relevant for 1980s drives, who knows? What sorts of other ancedotes and claimed facts do we have? From the CD-R FAQ: http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq05.html Subject: [5-2] How long do CD recorders last? (1998/04/06) The MTBF (Mean Time Between Failures) on these drives is typically 50,000 to 100,000 hours, and they come with a 1 year warranty. Compare that to hard drives rated at between 500,000 and 1,000,000 hours with a 3 or 5 year warranty and that should give you some idea. Most of the drives available today weren't meant for mass production of CD-Rs. The only exceptions are the venerable Philips CDD 522, Kodak PCD 600, and Sony CDW-900E. By 2004, MTBF for consumer CD/DVD were up to 60K to 100K hours: http://www.computingondemand.com/reviews/storage-LiteOn-LDW-411S/page1.shtml And perhaps their MTBF was calculated with a 2% duty cycle, which would still mean they expect a consumer DVD-R to be able to burn several thousand discs. I suspect consumer losses are due more to dust and crud on discs... unless of course you simply don't want to trust manufacturer-provided MTBFs. Your average $50 Wal-Mart DVD drive has a 70K MTBF: http://www.liteon.com/prod/getProduct.do?cid=1_7_13&xml_id=4_2&menu_id=4_2_7 - John

19 years, 11 months

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ProPort 656 audio / DSP box and Sun interface board...

by jb＠seaengineering.com

Do you still have this ProPort 656 and scsi board? Thanks, Jim Barry Sea Engineering, Inc. (808) 259-7966 ext. 23

19 years, 11 months

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68000 chips

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

Hi, I got some 68000 DIP chips for ?3.00 off of www.vint agecomputermarketplace.com the other week. I finally got around to checking that they are of use to me ( by comparing them with notes I have on the internals of my old A600 Rev 1.1) and discovered that they ma y not be of use to me! :( Here's the low-down on them: MC68000P10 2 C91E DIP chip (rectangle with pins on l ong sides) x 2 QEDB9215 S (large logo S) SCN68000CAN64 2208N19 DIP chip x1 9035KE Any idea's what computer they are from/for? Regards, Andrew B aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 11 months

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HP 64000 PROM bucket manual

by jdbryan＠acm.org

Does anyone have a copy of the HP 64516A PROM Programmer Module manual? This is for the 27512 chip bucket, not the main control card. I'd like to build one of these, so I'm specifically looking for the schematic and parts list from the manual. Thanks. -- Dave

19 years, 11 months

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Personal Iris IRIX issues and other related questions...

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

4D/35 has a seperate fan on the compute side to cool the 35 MHz R3000. I have a 4D/25 that a prior owner let choke with dust and the heat ate the R3010 and the RE2 on the graphics side, cooling is definitely an issue on these beasts. Is it Express or Eclipse graphics? Express will have the stereo connector. If eclipse, is it Turbo or normal? Josh, did you get my offlist E-mail?

19 years, 11 months

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C64 Fuse?

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

How many Amps should the fuse in the C64 be rated for? The fuse I pulled is a 1.5A 250V fuse, yet "Troubleshooting & Repairing your Commodore 64" says to use a 1A 250V fuse. A quick bit of googling seems to indicate that it should be 1.5A. Zane -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |

19 years, 11 months

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Cabinet Question

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

How does one bolt one DEC corporate cabinet (RK07-PA/H9642) to another corporate cabinet (H9612-AA)? The H9612 has the removable black area of the side panel, so I was able to put them next to each other and it looks seamless. How does one attach them with hardware, and what do I need? Thanks Julian

19 years, 11 months

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