test-drb November 1998

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

185 participants
940 discussions

by rhblake＠bigfoot.com

Take a look at this on C/Net http://cnet.com/Resources/Topdownloads/PC/Result/Download/0,162,57820,00.ht… If it runs good on an XT, imagine what it's like on a 286!

25 years, 8 months

Honeywell machine ID needed

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

I'm looking for an ID on this Honeywell ????. The main board is wire wrapped and the chips date from 1970,1971. On the bottom is a 3 pin (2 used) female Molex connector I assume is for power. And a 6 pin male. Pictures are at: http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw6.jpg http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw5.jpg http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw4.jpg http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw3.jpg http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw2.jpg http://www.best.com/~dcoward/hw1.jpg Of course, I forgot to take a picture of the inside. Thanks ========================================= Doug Coward Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA =========================================

25 years, 8 months

Spring Cleaning

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

I know it's not spring but it is time for me to thin out my collection. I'm offering these for sale here first before sending them off to ebay. Email me with offers to anthony.dellett(a)staples.com. I dont get time to check the list much so posing a reply there will get you nowhere. Atari 800 (not working, parts?) Atari 1050 Disk Drive (two of them) Commodore 64 (complete in box, I have two like this) Commodore 1541 Disk Drive (2 in box, one works, one doesn't) Commodore 1541 II Disk Drive (complete in box) Commodore 128 (complete in box) Commodore 1571 Disk Drive (complete in box) Compupro S-100 Enclosure (motherboard and PS only, no cards) IMSAI 8080 W/8080 Processor Card, SIO4 (Godbout w/docs), RAM64 (Godbout w/docs), PIO8 (IMSAI) Kaypro I (incl. boot disk) Kaypro II (incl. boot disk) Kaypro IV (incl. boot disk) NorthStar Horizon (not working) NorthStar Advantage (works completely, with boot disk) Osborne I (not working) Osborne Executive (incl. boot disk) Processor Technology SOL w/SOLOS personality module Sanyo CP/M System (with software) TI-99/4A Computer (beige model, in box) TRS-80 Model III (with some software) 8" DS/DD Floppy Drive (in wooden enclosure) and Controller (Godbout w/docs) 8" SS/SD Floppy Drive (no enclosure) 8" SS/SD Dual Drive Subsystem (ICOM) 8" Hard Disk Drive in enclosure w/controller (Fujitsu Hard Drive, Godbout Controller w/docs) I also have some random Commodore stuff that I cant remember (modem, paddles, trackball, etc...) I can take a closer look if anyone is interested. A word of warning... I'd like to sell these things to someone on the list but I'll only accept "reasonable" offers. Tony

25 years, 8 months

Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd)

by Marty＠itgonline.com

Hi Doug, Regarding the Apple I, no I'm not confusing it with the Lisa 1 to 2 upgrade. I'll see if I can locate the source of the Apple II upgrade for the faithful that had bought the original Apple I. Concerning my brain-dead software, this IS a list devoted to obsolete technology isn't it? I don't have to use edlin or copy con to reply however............. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd) Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 11/3/98 2:25 PM On Tue, 3 Nov 1998, Marty wrote: > I don't know if this is actually true but I seem to recall reading > somewhere that Apple gave free Apple II's to those Apple I purchaser's > that sent in their original Apple I. Does anyone know if there is any > truth to that? I've never heard that. Sure you're not thinking of the Lisa 1 -> Lisa 2 upgrade program? BTW, Marty, how can I help you upgrade to a mail reader with a built-in quoting mechanism? Are you using an old version of some brain-dead Microsoft product? -- Doug ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists3.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Nov03.142550.1767.75047; Tue, 03 Nov 1998 14:25:51 -0500 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists3.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with SMTP id LAA00824; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 11:23:38 -0800 Received: from mxu1.u.washington.edu (mxu1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.8]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id LAA54022 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 11:23:24 -0800 Received: from behemoth.host4u.net (behemoth.host4u.net [209.150.128.29]) by mxu1.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id LAA25 532 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 11:23:23 -0800 Received: from localhost (yowza@localhost) by behemoth.host4u.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA03404 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 13:23:21 -0600 Message-Id: <Pine.LNX.3.95.981103132045.16880C-100000(a)behemoth.host4u.net> Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 13:23:12 -0600 (CST) Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd) In-Reply-To: <1998Nov03.140835.1767.155763(a)smtp.itgonline.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> X-Sender: yowza(a)behemoth.host4u.net X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

25 years, 8 months

Apple I clone (was Re: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd))

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>The Apple 1 discussion reminds me of some (evil) thougts I had a while back. >What do the people on this list think of building an Apple I as a "homebrew" >project? Without much work, I was able to dig up a schematic and boot rom >listing for an A1, and the parts are all (mostly) readily available. What about the dynamic MOS shift registers in the video? When I had to do Apple I repairs in the early 80's these were "out of production" parts, but I could always start tearing apart some early-to-mid-70's video terminals and find some in there. >If the purpose is education rather than collector's value, have I still sold >my soul to the devil? What if I then tell people I have "an Apple 1 (-ish) >computer", thereby letting me brag about building it myself, if not the >actual authenticity? If you like the Apple I architecture, sure, it's a fine thing for you to do. I'd put my own efforts into other architectures (the TIMSAI is one obvious example), but I readily admit that the choice is obviously up to the whims of the builder and nothing else! Tim.

25 years, 8 months

PDP11 training troubleshooting

by pechter＠shell.monmouth.com

re: PDP11 troubleshooting class (AKA PDP11 Systems new hire) > From: ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu > Subject: Re: PDP-11/44 boot prompt > > [Sticking tape on an edge connector to introduce a fault] > > > It wasn't a repair procedure... it was a call it broken and try to > > find/fix it class exercise. Sometimes when a bad board was a available > > they would be used. > > Hmmm.. This actually wouldn't have worked for me, if I'd been allowed to > do what I liked to the machine. Well, the class wasn't 8-(... You worked with scope, diags, front panel lights and were not allowed to pull the boards to look at the fingers. A couple of instructors began to request real bad boards from the in-house maintenance techs who maintained the machines at Crosby Drive. (I wonder if Jack Whitford at DEC's reading this one now. Thanks for the PDP11 new hire course Jack -- it got me to where I am now...) The Vax course wasn't even this good. The 8600 was too fast and to scope. The 11/780 too large. Those were microdiag courses... Run the micro's and let 'em call out the errors. Not too useful when the A B C cables to the Unibus are swapped by a bad installer or if AC/LO and DC/LO from the BA11 cause micros to fail. I remember seeing folks choke on that stuff in the field. You would scope out problems with the 465 scope, get diagnostic errors, figure which signal line was wrong and recommend which board needed swapping. The instructor would say yes or now to the board. Sometimes you got it... some times the signal was floating due to other causes -- even when he pulled the tape. These were the worst maintained most beaten to death 11's at DEC. They were machines left over from in-house duties elsewhere and often they were old prototypes. 11/40's with the old power distribution and such. Machines that would delight in driving a student nuts. You see, the tape often would rub off a board during class and stick into the backplane connectors at random locations. Often the machines would develop intermittants due to massive amounts of board pulls and reseats. >> >> You see, one thing that's always taught in books of fault-finding is to >> use a logical approach, make tests, etc. And yes that's an _extremely_ >> valuable skill to learn. Yup. >> >> However, in the real world I'm more likely to start with a 'lucky dip'. >> Unplug all connectors/boards, clean contacts, look for bent pins. Check >> all fuses. Power up and check the power rails with a voltmeter. > True... if you know someone's been playing inside. But in Field Service with machines under maintenance most folks keep their hands out of them. (except for printers and terminals) This means something broke. Check power and work from there. >> >> By doing that I've probably found 75% of common faults (bent pins on >> those 0.1" header plugs like you find on 3.5" floppy drives, IDE drives, >> SCSI drives, etc) are very common). > I've never seen an IDE drive or SCSI drive with bent pins where no one ever played with the cable. >> Then, if there's still a fault I use the logical approach. Get out the >> 'scope and analyser, sit down with the printset, and start tracing the fault. >> >> So, of course I'd have spotted a taped over pin very early on. Not if you couldn't remove the boards from the backplane. >> >> Allison >> >> > >-tony Bill Proud survivor of the company formerly known as Digital ex-DEC Field Service 1981-86 Somerset, NJ, Piscataway, NJ, Princeton, NJ DEC Branch 79J Former District Installation Team 1981-82 DEC Branch 7HT +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Bill and/or Carolyn Pechter | pechter(a)shell.monmouth.com | | Bill Gates is a Persian cat and a monocle away from being a villain in | | a James Bond movie -- Dennis Miller | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+

25 years, 8 months

A record?

by jon＠techniche.com

Well I certainly can't compete with 75 tons, but I picked up an old Tandem system that consisted of two EXT 25 Cabinets (each approx 4'w x 5'h x 3'd weight unknown, but probably about 1000 pounds each). It also had a Kennedy 9300 tape drive in a similarly sized cabinet and 2 8 bay disk drive cabinets (not quite as big but just as heavy). My plan was to put them in my Cellar. However the only access was a narrow wooden stairway. The solution? Rip through the cement floor of my attached garage removing a store room wall that was in the way and then dig a ramp into the floor that drops 4 feet to the cellar floor level. Finally have the cement experts come in and cut 4 foot doorway in my 10" think foundation wall and then have the whole lot re-cemented and the doorway framed up. I didn't actually lift any of the items, they are all on rollers. So I guess I cheated. This doesn't count the new electrical wiring and building a raised floor. Jon ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------- >Oh, come now... B^} The king of gear moving is (and probably will remain >for some time) Paul Pierce (keeper of the mainframe collection). > >Estimated to be around 75 TONS in overall weight (as noted in a Wall Street >Journal (!) article on Friday), Paul has moved the entire collection at >least three times that I can think of, before it arrived in its current >(permanent) home. > >Some might want to have a look at the WSJ article. It also features quotes >from a number of names that most will be familiar with. Its (the article) >easy enough to find... it begins on the front page! > >-jim > >--- > >At 10:19 AM 11/1/98 +0000, Pete wrote: >> >>On Sun, 1 Nov 1998, Computer Room Internet Cafe wrote: >> >>> I thought I did well moving a Vax 8530/6310 cluster, complete with >>> 2 HSC50's, TA78/TU78 and about 15 RA8x and some RA7x drives from >>> a warehouse to my parents house, then getting it up a narrow gap into a >>> vacant granny flat. Over gravel. >>> But we did have a forklift load it on the vehicle for us. >>> >>> I think the PDP effort beats that one. >>> >> >>What about my uVAX II? I collected it from the 2nd floor (3rd floor in >>US terms I think), 2 of us carried 2 RA81s and the 19" rack unit down a >>steep, narrow, winding staircase and the out through the owner's garden >>before loading it all into a medium six UK hatchback (Vauxhall Cavalier). >>My other 3 RA* drives came from an old established University down even >>narrower staircases. At this end I cheated, as I was moving them on my >>own by then I brought them into the house by wheelbarrow :) >> > >--- >jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com >The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw >Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174 > > >

25 years, 8 months

NAC(Need a copy) MicroAngelo manual

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

Yesterday, while digging around for a Interfacer 1 board, I came across my Micro Diversions MicroAngelo S-100 board. If anyone can make me a copy of the manual, I can send you a few $s. I may also need images of the EPROMs. It only has 3 of the 4 sockets filled and the windows have been uncovered for years. If it helps, the board also says Rev 1. ========================================= Doug Coward Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA =========================================

25 years, 8 months

Classic != IBM AT

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

model 30 286 has 1.44 on disk drive eject button. mode 30 xt does not as it only has 720k drive. david In a message dated 11/4/98 10:57:45 AM Pacific Standard Time, kaikal(a)MICROSOFT.com writes: << > -----Original Message----- > From: John Ruschmeyer [mailto:jruschme@hiway1.exit109.com] > There was also, however, a 286 version of the Model 30 which came out a > little later. (I'll let the IBM experts come up with the model#.) "Model 30/286", strangely enough :) Kai >>

25 years, 8 months

Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd)

by Marty＠itgonline.com

_____________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: RE: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd) Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 11/3/98 1:31 PM Different guy. This one's in San Diego. Mr SWTPC is in Santa Cruz. You know what I find very weird? The number of Apple 1's that appear to be out there. I've heard of or seen at least 10 of them, which is a much higher percentage than any other machine made. >>If only 200 machines were really made, somebody should be able to track >>down most of the original owners with a little detective work, and trace the sales of the machines with a little more work. If I were an >>Apple 1 owner, I know I'd want a pedigree. Who knows, you might even >>be able to buy a few of them for next to nothing while doing your >>research. I don't know if this is actually true but I seem to recall reading somewhere that Apple gave free Apple II's to those Apple I purchaser's that sent in their original Apple I. Does anyone know if there is any truth to that? Marty Anybody know the original distribution? 50 to the Byte Shop in Palo Alto, a bunch to Computer Mart in NY, did Apple sell direct? -- Doug On Tue, 3 Nov 1998, Kai Kaltenbach wrote: > Is this the guy I bought the SWTPC 6800 from at the VCF? He said he had an > Apple I he was going to auction, and he was talking prices like this. > > Kai > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bjorn T. Eng [mailto:bjorn@ktb.net] > Sent: Monday, November 02, 1998 4:28 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd) > > > > Hi! > > Anybody else see this one? I wonder what kind of documentation he has to > "support" that "The current value of an Apple I computer is $40,000+" Is > he referring to the one that was sold for a charity? > > Bjorn Eng > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: 2 Nov 1998 14:05:39 GMT > From: David Selinger <dave314x(a)sd.cts.com> > Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers > Subject: Apple I Computer For Sale > > Keywords: Apple 1 Apple I Wozniak Steve Jobs Computer > > Subject: Apple 1 Computer For Sale - Historic Rare Museum Piece > Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers > Organization: CTS Network Services (CTSNET), San Diego, CA > Summary: For Sale (FS) RARE Apple I (Apple 1) 1976 Computer System > Keywords: Apple I Apple 1 For Sale Antique Computer vintage computer > Wozniak Steve Jobs > > I am offering for sale to the highest bidder an original 1976 > Apple I (Apple 1) Computer System - museum quality (one is in the > Smithsonian in Washington, D.C. - see their web page.) > > It includes: > > Main processor board with original chips. > User Operations manual with schematic > BASIC programming User's manual which came with Apple I > Tape interface daughter board > BASIC cassette tape > Original one-sheet advertisement > > What it doesn't include (because Apple Computer Co. did not > sell this equipment with the computer -- the user supplied it > himself): keyboard, and TV. > > This computer is for display purposes only -- not for actual > use as a computer. Though I used it as a working computer in the > past, the ravages of time has likely make it inoperative. > > Important Additional Information: > > Only 200 were ever made (Steve Wozniak interview, Byte Magazine, December > 1984, page A69). > > Of those 200, many have likely been lost or destroyed, thereby > making the surviving computers worth much more because of their > increased scarcity. > > Minimum price for starting the bidding is $25,000.00. The current value > of an Apple I computer is $40,000+. Documentation to support this fact > will > be provided upon request. A color photo to interested parties will also be > provided upon request. > > I am also offering a 10% finder's fee to any person who finds a legitimate > buyer with whom I actually consumate the sale. For example, finding a > buyer who agrees to buy the computer for $40,000.00 will mean a $4,000.00 > finders fee to the person who finds the buyer. This offer of a finder's > fee however is valid for only two (2) months and expires on midnight Dec. > 31, 1998. > > Send email bids, or referrals to potential buyers to this > email address: dave314x(a)cts.com > > I reserve the right to reject or accept any and all bids. > > Dave. > > > > ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists2.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Nov03.133154.1767.75020; Tue, 03 Nov 1998 13:31:55 -0500 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with SMTP id KAA16768; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 10:29:25 -0800 Received: from mxu4.u.washington.edu (mxu4.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.8]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id KAA38346 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 10:28:11 -0800 Received: from behemoth.host4u.net (behemoth.host4u.net [209.150.128.29]) by mxu4.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id KAA09 432 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 10:28:09 -0800 Received: from localhost (yowza@localhost) by behemoth.host4u.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA27761 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 12:27:55 -0600 Message-Id: <Pine.LNX.3.95.981103121443.16880A-100000(a)behemoth.host4u.net> Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 12:27:43 -0600 (CST) Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: RE: Apple I Computer For Sale (fwd) In-Reply-To: <FFD1BA74C6A7D111A09500805F9F88F507C4BA6D@RED-MSG-43> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> X-Sender: yowza(a)behemoth.host4u.net X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

25 years, 8 months

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test-drb November 1998