On this list 'doesn't work' means 'smashed into three thousand pieces'
In most places, 'doesn't work' means 'it doesn't do what I want it to'
Almost anything that goes wrong with an Osborne (besides physical
damage) is fairly trivial to fix for people on this list anyway.
>< "Again, the unit TURNS ON!! Incredible considering
>< the age of the thing. "
>Gee, the NS* Horizon that turned 20 years old last march must really be
>unusual in that I still use it and it's still reliable!
>Then again I have a battery portable TV I bought in '71 that still
>too. I see little majik in all that. I expect it to work and if it
>didn't I'd fix it.
>What scares me more, is the bozo thinks it turns on and lights and fans
>mean it works.
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I have been told by the software house who supply us at work that there
might be some old PX4s and PX8s in their storeroom which no-one wants any
more. Does anyone know what these are?
I gather that htey may be some sort of intelligent terminal as the chap
comcerned said they they used to be used on site and then plugged into a
modem to upload the data to their main database.
It's not that weird. Everyone knows that 286 and 386 machines are
crap ;) In fact, one reason is that noone gets attached to them, and
also because Pentia aren't that much different from 386s. So, no
nostalgia. And, I think that early PCs were a lot less useful than
some other machines of the time (like Commodores and Apples)
>> At 06:49 AM 10/31/98 -0800, Seth wrote:
>> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=38897455
>> >> ...with a broken disk drive and still 6 days to go!
>> >Aaah, my favorite quote from the auction posting:
>> > "Again, the unit TURNS ON!! Incredible considering
>> > the age of the thing. "
>> >I guess I should consider my PDP-11/04 a bloody miracle then ;)
>> And I'm going out to the garage to bow in humble supplication to me
>Isn't it something that you try to sell the obscure in your local area
>people ask what you'd pay them to throw it away for you but newer items
>reasonable amounts. Get on something like ePay and the weird and no
>desirable (by the average person) goes for weord amounts and newer
>rarely get a look (ie 286 and 386 machines).
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< I have been told by the software house who supply us at work that there
< might be some old PX4s and PX8s in their storeroom which no-one wants an
< more. Does anyone know what these are?
I assume the are Epson. The PX8 is a portable z80 based CP/M laptop.
If memory is correct the PX$ was an earlier predecessor of same.
I have a PX8 and it's a nice machine.
< "Again, the unit TURNS ON!! Incredible considering
< the age of the thing. "
Gee, the NS* Horizon that turned 20 years old last march must really be
unusual in that I still use it and it's still reliable!
Then again I have a battery portable TV I bought in '71 that still works
too. I see little majik in all that. I expect it to work and if it
didn't I'd fix it.
What scares me more, is the bozo thinks it turns on and lights and fans
mean it works.
...with more than a day to go!
...with a broken disk drive and still 6 days to go!
I would say "sign me up" to officially endorse Haggle, but I was browsing
the listings and it seems that everyone starts their auctions at very high
prices (at least the antique section, I didn't check anything else)...
Aaron C. Finney Systems Administrator WFI Incorporated
"UNIX is an exponential algorithm with a seductively small constant."
--> Scott Draves
Thanks for the info. Any idea what the two cables are for? If you find the
brochures, I'd like to get a copy.
At 06:24 PM 10/30/98 -0800, you wrote:
>On Fri, 30 Oct 1998, Joe wrote:
>> I was wondering through a trift store the other day and found a odd
>> keyboard. It's labeled "CompuNET 2000" and looks like a regular 101 key
>> keyboard for a PC but it has two extra cables with miniture phono plugs on
>> the ends. One with two contacts and the other with three. It also has two
>> phone jacks on the back of the keyboard. There are a couple of extra keys
>> on the board. One is marked PHONE and the other is marked LINE. Some of
>> the numeric key pad keys are marked REDIAL, MUTE, VOL, OPER, etc. anyone
>> know what this is for?
>I think this was a keyboard with a built-in phone. This is pretty recent
>(within the last two years). It was good for call centers (i.e.
>operations with lots of telephone operators for telemarketing or what
>not). I have brochures for it somewhere.
>Sellam Alternate e-mail:
>Always being hassled by the man.
> Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0
> See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details!
> [Last web site update: 09/21/98]
I keep meaning to post a "reaction to the VCF" message. Since I have to do a
lot of compilers homework at the moment, now is the perfect time. :)
I enjoyed the VCF and will come next time. (I may bring my Kaypro to show to
people, or perhaps just software -- there were other Kaypro demos there.
I will probably bring my HP-97 if I still have it. I will definitely bring
my electromechanical Marchant desk calculator if it's working then.)
I do have to say that it was a little disappointing, because I didn't see some
of the machines I wanted to see (or if I did see them, e.g., at the Computer
Museum, they weren't running). Those would be old machines that are cool by
modern standards, instead of being cool by old standards -- Amiga, Perq, Acorn,
Symbolics, Be, NeXT, maybe AT&T 3B, Blit, Sony with NeWS, PDP-10, PDP-11 with
GT40, PDP-12, LINC, PDP-1.
The speeches were fantastic and I should have gone to more of them.
The flea market was useful but not as cool as I had hoped. Also some people
were selling worthless stuff or were obviously non-hobbyists who were drafted
to sell things. (I don't object to non-hobbyists with knowledge and interest
nearly as much as I object to non-hobbyists who have no clues or scruples.)
It concerns me greatly that I didn't meet many people my own age (24) and that
many people there were in fact much older than I am.
Now, as for the "system design" part of the title... I have this ongoing ideal
(crusade, project, romantic vision) of designing a fantastic new computer, or
at least a *sensible* new computer. We now have computing power to spare for
frills as well as function; many design ideas have been tried before and their
consequences are known to some degree; disasters have been proved to be dis-
asters (often more than once!).
It surprises me that I haven't seen much interest in this. BTW, the VCF is
quite relevant to this topic because the concept of "look at all these
computers at once and compare them" is extremely useful.
I can think of two problems, though:
- We had a thread about designing your own CPU. We've also had
discussions about the lack of schematics and technical info.
So it seems that hardware is less accessible to the individual
amateur, and it's very difficult for the amateur to break through
to the next generation.
I don't know if it's true, but it seems that way.
- Also, information is disappearing. There's relatively copious
documentation about old hardware, but not much about old software
(or old software itself). Didn't someone try to put together an
archive of software info? I haven't heard much about it.
Although hardware is important and my ideal computer is going to
have super-kick-butt hardware, the hardware designers seem to be
working things out on their own -- it's the software market that
needs a poke or two.
Let me know what you think.