31 Oct
1998
31 Oct
'98
7:59 a.m.
It's not that weird. Everyone knows that 286 and 386 machines are
crap ;) In fact, one reason is that noone gets attached to them, and
also because Pentia aren't that much different from 386s. So, no
nostalgia. And, I think that early PCs were a lot less useful than
some other machines of the time (like Commodores and Apples)
> At 06:49 AM 10/31/98 -0800, Seth wrote:
> >>
> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=38897455
> >>
> >> ...with a broken disk drive and still 6 days to go!
> >
> >Aaah, my favorite quote from the auction posting:
> >
> > "Again, the unit TURNS ON!! Incredible considering
> > the age of the thing. "
> >
> >I guess I should consider my PDP-11/04 a bloody miracle then ;)
>
> And I'm going out to the garage to bow in humble supplication to me
PDP-8/i!
Isn't it something that you try to sell the obscure in your local area
to have
people ask what you'd pay them to throw it away for
you but newer items
sell at
reasonable amounts. Get on something like ePay and the
weird and no
longer
desirable (by the average person) goes for weord
amounts and newer
machines
rarely get a look (ie 286 and 386 machines).
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31 Oct
31 Oct
8:16 a.m.
Max Eskin wrote:
It's not that weird. Everyone knows that 286 and
386 machines are
crap ;) In fact, one reason is that noone gets attached to them, and
also because Pentia aren't that much different from 386s. So, no
nostalgia. And, I think that early PCs were a lot less useful than
some other machines of the time (like Commodores and Apples)
Ok Max, will check back with you when the medication wears off.....
9:04 a.m.
Max Eskin wrote:
> It's not that weird. Everyone knows that 286 and 386 machines are
> crap ;) In fact, one reason is that noone gets attached to them, and
> also because Pentia aren't that much different from 386s. So, no
> nostalgia. And, I think that early PCs were a lot less useful than
> some other machines of the time (like Commodores and Apples)
The biggest problem these older machines had was microsoft operating systems.
(okay, I'm a Unix/VMS bigot at heart, but DOS and win3.0/3.1 really WERE that
bad.)
Part of what makes a machine appealing is how well you get along with the
OS. I've known DOS and win3.1 gurus, but I've never met anyone who really
LIKED these operating systems the way the apple-heads liked prodos and gsos.
Microsoft somehow managed to make these OSs without anything that endeared them
to their users and programmers.
As for 386s, there's the obvious linux plug waiting to happen, and I have to
say I'm fairly attached to Calico, my linux box, which is just a plain old
486/100 VLB machine. It's served remarkably reliably over the years.
Am I as attached to it as to the vaxen I used? No. Why? because Calico
is a hodgepodge of parts I picked up from surplus stores combined with a dx4
I bought while I was at Intel. (They used to have a great staff discount
program). It lacks the single unified personality of, say, a vaxstation 3100,
where every single piece either came from Digital or was at least built to
their specs so it *felt* like a Digital machine and *looked* like a digital
machine.
So how do I fit these two together? Um... er... Well, PCs never made friends
with people because of the bland (and poor) way they interfaced with people,
and because their bland (and frequently poor) hardware never had the unified
stamp that gives a machine an identity. They were engineered, both hardware
and software, to be generic computers. And I think the backlash from that
can be seen as part of (but certainly not all of) the driving force behind
the enormous number of I-Mac sales. Apple went to great lengths to make a
computer that IS different. That DOES have some personality to it. It
seems like this "personality" issue is becoming more and more important in
mass produced things - witness the new Beetle, the Imac, and so on.
Anyway, enough rambling for one message. :)
--
Jim Strickland
jim(a)DIESPAMMERSCUMcalico.litterbox.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Vote Meadocrat! Bill and Opus in 2000 - Who ELSE is there?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
9:14 a.m.
Jim Strickland wrote:
- witness the new Beetle, the Imac, and so on.
A reworked ugly Golf? I have an ATV with more appeal than that ugly death box. It
did however make the price of any existing real Beetles go through the roof. People
liked the older ones but they both quit being made and quit being popular (for the
most part) so the old bugs are just parked here and there and now people are
scooping them up by the dozens, at $4500 for a running 1965 stock Beetle. Whoda
thunk it?
Anyway, enough rambling for one message. :)
Same here, back on topic for me.
9:10 a.m.
It's not that weird. Everyone knows that 286 and 386 machines are
crap ;) In fact, one reason is that noone gets attached to them, and
also because Pentia aren't that much different from 386s. So, no
nostalgia. And, I think that early PCs were a lot less useful than
some other machines of the time (like Commodores and Apples)
I'm not sure I'd agree with the "crap" part, but I do think that there
are a few reasons why there is not more excitement on the 286 and
386 systems.
To begin with, the 8088 and 286 systems (and to a lesser degree 386
systems) are too new to have a "nostalgia" factor associated with them.
That is to say, because any software which ran on them can still be
run on a Pentium, there is little reason for someone to pick one up
just to run some beloved old game, as is the case with some buyers
of 8-bit Ataris, Apples, and Commodores.
Secondly, the fact is, 286 and 386 systems are just too ubiquitous.
Also, the clone factor means that many of them are nondescript and
contain nondescript parts. This mostly rules out the "rarity" factor
so common on EBay. This will continue until such time as older PCs
have the status of vintage Hot Rods and an Ebay description can say
such things as: "This is a fine example of a typical 80286-based PC,
equipped with a classic MFM 40mb drive and a genuine Hercules
monochrome graphics card. It is a wonderful specimen of a typical office
PC, circa 1987."
Lastly, I'm sad to say it but 286 and 386 PCs are not considered "useful"
by the mass market definition of "useful". Now I will be the first to
admit that a 286 running WP 5.1 can process words just as well (and
probably faster) than a Pentium 133 running Word97 and that a 386
with plenty of memory makes a fine Linux or FreeBSD box. But we are
talking about Ebay buyers here the sad truth is that if they don't see
a system as being "collectable" or "useful", then they will probably
just see it as "useLESS" (sort of like corporate America).
To be brutally honest, given the Ebay pricing on 486 and even early
Pentium MBs and CPUs, my first inclination when looking at a 386 is
to assess its usefulness as a case and power supply donor. Why not,
when I can upgrade a 386/33 to a 486/33 for under $20?
<<<john>>>
9316
days inactive
9316
days old
4 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
jim＠calico.litterbox.com -
jruschme＠exit109.com -
maxeskin＠hotmail.com -
rhblake＠bigfoot.com