27 Apr
2011
27 Apr
'11
7:23 a.m.
At 18:59 -0500 4/26/11, ard wrote:
If you are really crazy, use containers of salt water
with suitable
electrodes in them :-). Just don't knock them over and spill the liquid
into the machine under test.
...and do work in a ventilated area. The bubbles evolving off the
salt water will be, er, flammable, yes?
Did this with the kids, 12V supply = jump cables from my car,
foil "electrodes" in salt water, inverted test tube on a long holder,
and a candle to verify the type of gas (used the holder to move the
tube over the candle). Lucked out and collected the Hydrogen on the
first try (well, it wasn't really luck. The electrode with twice as
many bubbles had to be the H2.) They were suitably impressed. I was
impressed how fast the aluminum foil went away (into solution).
--
- Mark 210-379-4635
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Asteroids headed toward planets
inhabited by beings that don't have
technology adequate to stop them:
Think of it as Evolution in Fast-Forward.
27 Apr
27 Apr
7:45 a.m.
On Wednesday 27 April 2011 10:23:50 am Mark Tapley wrote:
At 18:59 -0500 4/26/11, ard wrote:
I did something similar way back when, only I used carbon rods scavenged from dead
"D" cells for the electrodes. Tried it first with batteries, and that was
awfully slow. So then I got this bright idea of using a selenium rectifier and a line
cord I had handy...
It was *amazing* how fast it went at that point!
I had to keep adding water, of course, and since "stuff" in the water stayed
put as the electrolysis proceeded, the water got darker and darker. This was right out
of the tap, and it put me off of drinking water for quite some time. :-)
--
Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and
ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can
be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters"
-
Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James
M Dakin
If you are really crazy, use containers of salt
water with suitable
electrodes in them :-). Just don't knock them over and spill the liquid
into the machine under test.
...and do work in a ventilated area. The bubbles evolving off the
salt water will be, er, flammable, yes?
Did this with the kids, 12V supply = jump cables from my car,
foil "electrodes" in salt water, inverted test tube on a long holder,
and a candle to verify the type of gas (used the holder to move the
tube over the candle). Lucked out and collected the Hydrogen on the
first try (well, it wasn't really luck. The electrode with twice as
many bubbles had to be the H2.) They were suitably impressed. I was
impressed how fast the aluminum foil went away (into solution). 
9:08 a.m.
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 10:45:54AM -0400, Roy J. Tellason, Sr. wrote:
On Wednesday 27 April 2011 10:23:50 am Mark Tapley
wrote:
When I did that way back, I also used scavenged carbon rods from old batteries
and the water aquired a nice blackish/grayish tint. On closer inspection,
that seemed to be caused by carbon being eroded off the electrodes. They
sure weren't as smooth as originally after a while.
Kind regards,
Alex.
--
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and
looks like work." -- Thomas A. Edison
At 18:59 -0500 4/26/11, ard wrote:
I did something similar way back when, only I used carbon rods scavenged from dead
"D" cells for the electrodes. Tried it first with batteries, and that was
awfully slow. So then I got this bright idea of using a selenium rectifier and a line
cord I had handy...
It was *amazing* how fast it went at that point!
I had to keep adding water, of course, and since "stuff" in the water stayed
put as the electrolysis proceeded, the water got darker and darker. This was right out
of the tap, and it put me off of drinking water for quite some time. :-) If you are really crazy, use containers of salt
water with suitable
electrodes in them :-). Just don't knock them over and spill the liquid
into the machine under test.
...and do work in a ventilated area. The bubbles evolving off the
salt water will be, er, flammable, yes?
Did this with the kids, 12V supply = jump cables from my car,
foil "electrodes" in salt water, inverted test tube on a long holder,
and a candle to verify the type of gas (used the holder to move the
tube over the candle). Lucked out and collected the Hydrogen on the
first try (well, it wasn't really luck. The electrode with twice as
many bubbles had to be the H2.) They were suitably impressed. I was
impressed how fast the aluminum foil went away (into solution). 
29 Apr
29 Apr
8:35 p.m.
I did something similar way back when, only I used
carbon rods scavenged
from dead "D" cells for the electrodes. Tried it first with batteries,
and that was awfully slow. So then I got this bright idea of using a
selenium rectifier and a line cord I had handy...
ROTFL!
I had to keep adding water, of course, and since
"stuff" in the water
stayed put as the electrolysis proceeded, the water got darker and
darker. This was right out of the tap, and it put me off of drinking
water for quite some time. :-)
ROTFL! 2.0 enhanced turbo plus version! :D
27 Apr
27 Apr
8:49 a.m.
On 27 Apr 2011 at 9:23, Mark Tapley wrote:
Did this with the kids, 12V supply = jump cables from
my car,
foil "electrodes" in salt water, inverted test tube on a long holder,
and a candle to verify the type of gas (used the holder to move the
tube over the candle). Lucked out and collected the Hydrogen on the
first try (well, it wasn't really luck. The electrode with twice as
many bubbles had to be the H2.) They were suitably impressed. I was
impressed how fast the aluminum foil went away (into solution). --
In the same vein, have you ever fooled with liquid rectifiers? The
anode is aluminum; the cathode is usually lead in a soluton of sodium
bicarbonate.
--Chuck
12:58 p.m.
In the same vein, have you ever fooled with liquid
rectifiers? The
anode is aluminum; the cathode is usually lead in a soluton of sodium
bicarbonate.
The Nodon valve? I've read about them, never had the urge to kmake one. I
thought hte electrolyte was more commonly ammonium phosphat, or at least
I think that's what the book I've read reocmmends.
-tony
2:01 p.m.
On 27 Apr 2011 at 20:58, Tony Duell wrote:
The Nodon valve? I've read about them, never had
the urge to kmake
one. I thought hte electrolyte was more commonly ammonium phosphat, or
at least I think that's what the book I've read reocmmends.
A wide range of electrolytes can be used.. Sodium phosphate,
carbonate, bicarbonate, ammonium sulfate, etc. In the US,
bicarbonate of soda was most frequently employed by amateurs because
it was cheap and easy to obtain.
The same apparently applies to the anode--aluminum is not the only
metal that exhibits the property.
--Chuck
28 Apr
28 Apr
11:06 a.m.
On 27 Apr 2011 at 20:58, Tony Duell wrote:
A book entitled 'small AC transformers' [1] gives the following
instructions for making chemical rectifiers.
"The satisfactory operation of this type of rectifier largely depends on
the condiiton of the electrolyte., and in its preparation the following
directions should be attended to. Make a saturated solution of commercial
phospate of ammonia in warm water , stiring thoroughly until disolved,
and when cold test with a slip of blue litmus paper. Probably it will be
found to be strongly acid and the paper will turn red. Drop in a little
liquid ammonia, stirring well until the precipuiate it forms is again
disolved, and take another litmus test. When the paper ceases to redden
the acid will bave been neutralised and the solution ready for use. Fill
each jar two-thirds full and then float half an inch of paraffin oil on
top of the solution. This prevents evaporation and creepage of the salds.
In course fo time the soltion will become acid again and then requires
neutralising with ammonia as before. Set up in this way the chemical
rectifier will give exceedingly good service; without these precaustions
it is a messy appliance and likely to earn a bad name for itself. Keep
it as cool as possible since the rectifying action falls off as the
temperature rises'
That's for a rectifier with aluminium and lead electrodes, BTW
[1] YEs, I know all staticve transformers only work on AC. At the time
this book was written, the term 'DC transformer' was used for a
motor-generator set.
-tony
The Nodon valve? I've read about them, never
had the urge to kmake
one. I thought hte electrolyte was more commonly ammonium phosphat, or
at least I think that's what the book I've read reocmmends.
A wide range of electrolytes can be used.. Sodium phosphate,
carbonate, bicarbonate, ammonium sulfate, etc. In the US,
bicarbonate of soda was most frequently employed by amateurs because
it was cheap and easy to obtain.
27 Apr
27 Apr
12:56 p.m.
At 18:59 -0500 4/26/11, ard wrote:
Indeed yes... And don't smoke :-)
On th whole I think I'll stick to sold metalic resistors fro this...
To the newcomer who startd this thread and who now probalby wonders what
the heck is going on, perhaps I can offer a little explanaition. This
list has some seriously knowledagable and well-qualified [1] people on
it, but topics tend to drift for just aogbut any reason. So a talk on PSU
testing can (and did) drift ot a discussion of HPs first product. Enjoy...
[1] I am not one of those. I have no qualifications in electronics or
computing.
If you are really crazy, use containers of salt
water with suitable
electrodes in them :-). Just don't knock them over and spill the liquid
into the machine under test.
...and do work in a ventilated area. The bubbles evolving off the
salt water will be, er, flammable, yes?
Did this with the kids, 12V supply = jump cables from my car,
You mean you don;'t have a bench supply???
foil "electrodes" in salt water, inverted
test tube on a long holder,
and a candle to verify the type of gas (used the holder to move the
tube over the candle). Lucked out and collected the Hydrogen on the
first try (well, it wasn't really luck. The electrode with twice as
many bubbles had to be the H2.) They were suitably impressed. I was
H2 normally comes off at the -ve electorde too...
It's not uncommon to get Cl2 at the positive electrode. Another reason to
do it in a well-ventilated area.
impressed how fast the aluminum foil went away (into
solution).
-tony
29 Apr
29 Apr
5:53 a.m.
New subject: Dummy loads
Mark Tapley wrote:
At 18:59 -0500 4/26/11, ard wrote:
Yes, but the quantities involved are absolutely tiny. Unless you're
using giant buckets of water, it shouldn't be a problem.
Peace... Sridhar
If you are really crazy, use containers of salt
water with suitable
electrodes in them :-). Just don't knock them over and spill the liquid
into the machine under test.
...and do work in a ventilated area. The bubbles evolving off the salt
water will be, er, flammable, yes?
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days inactive
4988
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