18 Feb
2002
18 Feb
'02
2:50 p.m.
Thank You everyone for all the Information on my PC Server 500 find.
I found the manual on the IBM site as suggested by a kind soul here.
I may just go ahead and see if I can repair the PS, as it did not smoke when
it went out, it just popped, so it may be possible as someone suggested that
it's just a fuse inside the PS. I now have to locate a special hex screw
driver, as the screws are hex with a tiny post in the middle of the screw.
However is it anything more than just a Intel Pentium 90 that has 6 SCSI
2.25 Gig hard drives on it ? Can it do anything special other than run RAID
?
Thanks again for everyones comments.. Phil..
18 Feb
18 Feb
3:21 p.m.
On Mon, 18 Feb 2002, Musicman38 wrote:
I may just go ahead and see if I can repair the PS, as
it did not
smoke when it went out, it just popped, so it may be possible as
someone suggested that it's just a fuse inside the PS. I now have to
locate a special hex screw driver, as the screws are hex with a tiny
post in the middle of the screw.
Sounds like a tamper-proof torx screw, likely a T15 or T10.
Radio Shack's online store sells a set of bits that contains the bit
you'll need (yes, I know we were all just complaining about RS).
http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fna…
MCM Electronics, Jensen Tools, and a few other companies also sell the
same set, but as strange as it is, Radio Shack seems to have the best
price.
-Toth
3:30 p.m.
On Mon, 18 Feb 2002, Musicman38 wrote:
Thank You everyone for all the Information on my PC
Server 500 find.
I found the manual on the IBM site as suggested by a kind soul here.
I may just go ahead and see if I can repair the PS, as it did not smoke when
it went out, it just popped, so it may be possible as someone suggested that
it's just a fuse inside the PS. I now have to locate a special hex screw
driver, as the screws are hex with a tiny post in the middle of the screw.
However is it anything more than just a Intel Pentium 90 that has 6 SCSI
2.25 Gig hard drives on it ? Can it do anything special other than run RAID
?
Thanks again for everyones comments.. Phil..
Special? It's a PC that's rock-solid stable. I call that pretty special.
Peace... Sridhar
3:36 p.m.
Musicman38 wrote:
Thank You everyone for all the Information on my PC Server 500 find.
I found the manual on the IBM site as suggested by a kind soul here.
I may just go ahead and see if I can repair the PS, as it did not smoke when
it went out, it just popped, so it may be possible as someone suggested that
it's just a fuse inside the PS. I now have to locate a special hex screw
driver, as the screws are hex with a tiny post in the middle of the screw.
Safety Torx is what I think they are called. They aren't really hex are
they? Usually IBM uses Torx. I've heard of people using something very
hard, like a punch, to break the small stud off. They then use a
regular torx bit to unscrew it. I don't worry about it, since I have
the proper bits. I got them at a flee market type thing, However.
However is it anything more than just a Intel Pentium 90 that has 6 SCSI
2.25 Gig hard drives on it ? Can it do anything special other than run RAID
?
Well, it is an all Microchannel machine, it's the "biggest" "best"
IBM
PS/2.
Chad Fernandez
Michigan, USA
11:47 p.m.
Those are security screws. T10 Torx I believe. Many sources sell security
bits/bit sets including some hardware stores, electronics suppliers, etc. I
think you might look around for a surplus power supply anyway in case it's
non-repairable or has a problem that migh make it a fire hazard.
Your biggest mission, should you want 10/100 ethernet, is to locate an
Olicom 10/100 microchannel card. There is a person ont he list that bought a
bunch of them from the same person I bought some from that might contact you
about them, if he wants to let any of them go. It's basically the only one
around for microchannel in 10/100 and they are fast. You can find 10baseT
ethernet in MCA all day for nearly (or sometimes) free.
Also note that while you have a limited number of HD holes, you can attach
an external case with HDs too. Also you can add more SCSI cards to add
non-raid items if you wish. These server units are very flexible.
=> -----Original Message-----
=> From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Musicman38
=> Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 10:51 PM
=> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> Subject: IBM PC Server 500
=>
=>
=> Thank You everyone for all the Information on my PC Server 500 find.
=> I found the manual on the IBM site as suggested by a kind soul here.
=>
=> I may just go ahead and see if I can repair the PS, as it did
=> not smoke when
=> it went out, it just popped, so it may be possible as someone
=> suggested that
=> it's just a fuse inside the PS. I now have to locate a special hex screw
=> driver, as the screws are hex with a tiny post in the middle of
=> the screw.
=>
=> However is it anything more than just a Intel Pentium 90 that has 6 SCSI
=> 2.25 Gig hard drives on it ? Can it do anything special other
=> than run RAID
=> ?
=>
=> Thanks again for everyones comments.. Phil..
=>
19 Feb
19 Feb
12:18 a.m.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Musicman38
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 10:51 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: IBM PC Server 500
Thank You everyone for all the Information on my PC Server 500 find.
If you need/want to, I now have a way for you to change the NW supervisor
password.......
Cheers
Geoff in Oz
21 Feb
21 Feb
9:47 a.m.
New subject: IBM PC Server 500 parts needed
I just picked up one myself. It's missing the floppy drive and RAM, and
only has 1 hard drive, and th fan unit is detached.
I'm looking for a 2.88 floppy and drive mounting racks for this machine.
12:48 p.m.
New subject: IBM PC Server 500 parts needed
You should be able to use a PS/2 type floppy (I think) with the header
connector and no 4 prong power plug. If that's the case let me know, I have
one I'm sure for $5 and postage. You'll have to locate the racks from a
source like ebay. RAM should be the same spec as for the 95 server and go in
with the same A1 and B1, then A2 and B2, then A3, B3 then A4 and B4
sequence. I assume it has the SCSI adapter?
Also you might sub to the newsgroup comp.ibm.ps2.hardware as there are many
people much into the 500 that can help you with parts and info.
=> -----Original Message-----
=> From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Mike
=> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 5:47 PM
=> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> Subject: IBM PC Server 500 parts needed
=>
=>
=> I just picked up one myself. It's missing the floppy drive and RAM, and
=> only has 1 hard drive, and th fan unit is detached.
=>
=> I'm looking for a 2.88 floppy and drive mounting racks for this machine.
=>
19 Feb
19 Feb
5:22 a.m.
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7:44 a.m.
HEx, or Torx (a more 'rounded' 6 sided hole)?
There is a very common
'tamperproof torx' screwhead that sounds like this (you remove it with a
torx driver with a hole in the centre) amd a much less common tamperproof
hex. You can get tools to fit both (in the UK it's easy to find sets of
'security bits -- 30-odd 1/4" hex bits to fit those interchangeable blade
screwdrivers) that include both types.
And if you have any difficulty finding the right sizes of "security bits",
you can chisel off the post in the middle, or drill a hole in a
"regular" torx or allen to make a "security bit". (20 years ago,
"tamper-proof torx" bits were hard to come by, but used on the 5150 power
supply - but those were exposed enough to be removable with a 5WR
Vise-Grips.)
11:17 a.m.
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11:48 a.m.
On Wed, 20 Feb 2002, Tony Duell wrote:
We love our Foredom Flex tools....
Doc
And if you
have any difficulty finding the right sizes of "security bits",
you can chisel off the post in the middle, or drill a hole in a
Or just hacksaw a slot across the screwhead and use a normal screwdriver ;-)
3:36 p.m.
That would look a little messy, However. Runs the risk of shaving
getting into things too.
Chad Fernandez
Michigan, USA
Tony Duell wrote:
And if you have any difficulty finding the right
sizes of "security bits",
you can chisel off the post in the middle, or drill a hole in a
Or just hacksaw a slot across the screwhead and use a normal screwdriver ;-)
-tony
20 Feb
20 Feb
10:13 a.m.
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21 Feb
21 Feb
2:06 a.m.
[1] Who do they think they're kidding?
Just what I needed to send in my findings today while working for
consumer depot service for my work experience (that's the shop name),
Boss and I talked about what he have seen from college's churning
out students filled with knowledge but very little troubleshooting
skills *especially* at component level and wrong type of skills to
boot! The area students trained with were for peecee area.
1. Newish monitor sent in w/ complaint sheet stating dead. Powers up
fine huh? Now on testing....to see if owner might be wrong.
2. Service manual for samsung 76V under warrenty flowsheet says if no
PSU voltages present check & replace bunch of transistors and
expensive ICs, still not fixed, replace whole board. (!!) That
problem vexed me bec paper doesn't agree w/ what I find then turned
out that poly 100nf capacitor was shorted far down the power chain
(on CRT board) 70V rail for that intergrated tube gun amps in T220
9pin package. PSU was very touchy to current level that how were no
burn marks. I don't like shot-gun swapping chips idea. DMM and CRT
board unplugged from mainboard gave short truth away. Did all
tracking right on the board itself without schematic. I find using
the schematic didn't do good for me and usually slows me down.
3. 12 years old TV playing but soundlessly. 36V for audio has track
break, leapfrogged across length of that track w/ dmm till I found
the break (right at one solder pad crack is invisible). But didn't
brother being dainty w/ it, quickly patched in one piece of long
patch wire, making 3 connections with minimum amount of wire since I
don't like loops. Got sound in minutes. Oh yeah, blackened crumbly
glue scraped off.
4. Newish monitor under warrenty, CRT socket partly plugged in from
factory, Samsung uses crt board unit clamp w/ silicone grommet around
CRT neck, very nice idea but that gromment was stuck against edge of
thick flame-proof tape. Worked crt thing over that tape's edge and
clamped down, now fixed.
Cheers,
Wizard
getting into things too.
True. But if I am taking the cover off a PSU, presumably I want to work
inside it. In which case I can clean out the swarf.
-tony
10:18 a.m.
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12:47 p.m.
At 12:18 AM 2/22/02 +0000, you wrote:
I have a theory about this. Hardware hacking (meaning anything
hands-on) is like learning to drive a car. You don't do it before
you're 17 -- you never learn to do it properly :-/ . And of
course, most ee majors meet hardware in their first lab course after
they're too old.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo(a)nospammers.ieee.org
Boss and I
talked about what he have seen from college's churning
out students filled with knowledge but very little troubleshooting
skills *especially* at component level and wrong type of skills to
boot! The area students trained with were for peecee area.
Oh, don't get me started on this (it's off-topic anyway...). I've met
graduate engineers who presumably are great with some complex equation
that I wouldn't have a clue about, but who are totally clueless when it
comes to anything practical. They're the sort of people who ask for 362.8
ohm resistors to use as LED current limiters, who can't estimate
component values for a simple RC filter, who can't solder anything
properly, and so on. Oh well... :-(
-tony
12:48 p.m.
Yeah give me some of those 62.8 ohm resistors, been searching for some of
them for a while :-)
=> -----Original Message-----
=> From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Tony Duell
=> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 6:18 PM
=> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> Subject: Re: IBM PC Server 500
=>
=>
=> > Boss and I talked about what he have seen from college's churning
=> > out students filled with knowledge but very little troubleshooting
=> > skills *especially* at component level and wrong type of skills to
=> > boot! The area students trained with were for peecee area.
=>
=> Oh, don't get me started on this (it's off-topic anyway...). I've met
=> graduate engineers who presumably are great with some complex equation
=> that I wouldn't have a clue about, but who are totally clueless when it
=> comes to anything practical. They're the sort of people who ask
=> for 362.8
=> ohm resistors to use as LED current limiters, who can't estimate
=> component values for a simple RC filter, who can't solder anything
=> properly, and so on. Oh well... :-(
=>
=> >
=> > 1. Newish monitor sent in w/ complaint sheet stating dead. Powers up
=> > fine huh? Now on testing....to see if owner might be wrong.
=>
=> I guess it's got a pwoer-saving standby mode. Maybe the owner powered it
=> up without giving it a valid sync signal or something.
=>
=> >
=> > 2. Service manual for samsung 76V under warrenty flowsheet says if no
=> > PSU voltages present check & replace bunch of transistors and
=> > expensive ICs, still not fixed, replace whole board. (!!) That
=>
=> I've learnt to ignore fault-finding charts. They are rarely, if ever,
=> helpful. The useful bits of a service manual are the schematic (actually
=> I could manage with this alone if I had to), the theory-of-operation
=> section (if it's complete or even present), and the parts list
=> (if I have
=> to order parts it helps to have the right part numbers).
=>
=> > problem vexed me bec paper doesn't agree w/ what I find then turned
=> > out that poly 100nf capacitor was shorted far down the power chain
=> > (on CRT board) 70V rail for that intergrated tube gun amps in T220
=> > 9pin package. PSU was very touchy to current level that how were no
=> > burn marks. I don't like shot-gun swapping chips idea. DMM and CRT
=>
=> Nor do I. I like to make measurements, look at the schematic, and change
=> the single faulty component. It's normally faster in the end, but of
=> course it requires a working brain...
=>
=> > board unplugged from mainboard gave short truth away. Did all
=> > tracking right on the board itself without schematic. I find using
=> > the schematic didn't do good for me and usually slows me down.
=>
=> No, I love schematics. I don't like working on things without a
=> schematic. I find that if I am probing around with no idea what I am
=> really looking at, then I am wasting my time.
=>
=> What I typically do is make some measurements (see the effect of user
=> control as well...), then sit down with the schematic and think about
=> what I've measured. And then possibly go back and make some more
=> measurements. And then think again. And then go straight to the faulty
=> component.
=>
=> -tony
=>
1:23 p.m.
=> comes to anything practical. They're the
sort of people who ask
=> for 362.8
=> ohm resistors to use as LED current limiters, who can't estimate
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Russ Blakeman wrote:
Yeah give me some of those 62.8 ohm resistors, been
searching for some of
them for a while :-)
Those were 362.8 ohm resistors. You'd need to put 5.777 of them in series
to get 62.8 ohms.
1:32 p.m.
=> comes to
anything practical. They're the sort of people who ask
=> for 362.8
=> ohm resistors to use as LED current limiters, who can't estimate
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Russ Blakeman wrote:
> Yeah give me some of those 62.8 ohm resistors, been searching for some of
> them for a while :-)
22 Feb
22 Feb
2:48 a.m.
I was being sarcastic Fred...guess maybe you are too.
=> -----Original Message-----
=> From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Fred Cisin
=> (XenoSoft)
=> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 9:32 PM
=> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
=> Subject: RE: IBM PC Server 500
=>
=>
=> > > => comes to anything practical. They're the sort of people who ask
=> > > => for 362.8
=> > > => ohm resistors to use as LED current limiters, who can't
estimate
=> >
=> > On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Russ Blakeman wrote:
=> > > Yeah give me some of those 62.8 ohm resistors, been
=> searching for some of
=> > > them for a while :-)
=>
=> addendum:
=>
=> ... or you could add a -300 ohm resistor to get the 62.8
=>
6:48 a.m.
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8:27 a.m.
> Those were 362.8 ohm resistors. You'd need
to put 5.777 of them in series
> to get 62.8 ohms.
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, Tony Duell wrote:
I hope you meant in parallel....
Well, _I_ would.
But the guy who is trying to figure out how to connect 5.777 of them
doesn't know the difference.
=> addendum:
=> ... or you could add a -300 ohm resistor to get the 62.8
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002,
Russ Blakeman wrote:
I was being sarcastic Fred...guess maybe you are too.
I was ridiculing the same strawman that you were.
("strawman": a hypothetical/imaginary/apocryphal/possibly exaggerated
caricature of one's opponent)
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
7 Mar
7 Mar
8:26 a.m.
--- Russ Blakeman <rhb57(a)vol.com> wrote:
Yeah give me some of those 62.8 ohm resistors, been
searching for some of
them for a while :-)
Sorry... just ran out. All I have are these 125.6 ohm resistors...
:-)
-ethan
__________________________________________________
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19 Feb
19 Feb
3:35 p.m.
Drill the bit out? That would be interesting to see.
I don't think I have ever seen the tamperproof bits in a store.
Although, I don't know if I've ever looked. When I saw the ones I
bought at the flee market, I bought them immediately, because I figured
I'd never find them again.
I think I used Vise Grips on my 5150's PS too :-)
Chad Fernandez
Michigan, USA
"Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" wrote:
And if you have any difficulty finding the right sizes
of "security bits",
you can chisel off the post in the middle, or drill a hole in a
"regular" torx or allen to make a "security bit". (20 years ago,
"tamper-proof torx" bits were hard to come by, but used on the 5150 power
supply - but those were exposed enough to be removable with a 5WR
Vise-Grips.)
4:19 p.m.
On Wed, 20 Feb 2002, Chad Fernandez wrote:
Drill the bit out? That would be interesting to see.
Well, that's what I did....
It was one of those 2:00am "I _will_ see this thing boot!" jobs. With
a Flex-Shaft and a watercooled 1.75mm diamond ball, it wasn't too hard,
just tedious. This is a Mac brand torx driver, good carbide. Slow
drilling.
If Necessity was the mother of invention, Obsession is the father.
Doc
I don't think I have ever seen the tamperproof bits in a store.
Although, I don't know if I've ever looked. When I saw the ones I
bought at the flee market, I bought them immediately, because I figured
I'd never find them again.
I think I used Vise Grips on my 5150's PS too :-)
Chad Fernandez
Michigan, USA
"Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" wrote:
And if you have any difficulty finding the right
sizes of "security bits",
you can chisel off the post in the middle, or drill a hole in a
"regular" torx or allen to make a "security bit". (20 years ago,
"tamper-proof torx" bits were hard to come by, but used on the 5150 power
supply - but those were exposed enough to be removable with a 5WR
Vise-Grips.)
5:04 p.m.
On Wed, 20 Feb 2002, Chad Fernandez wrote:
Drill the bit out? That would be interesting to see.
It's not a big deal with decent tools. (It is NOT a task for a hand drill
:-) I destroyed a drill bit doing half a dozen of them. If I ever need
to do it again, I might try using a cheap diamond coated point. I might
also try chucking up the torx bit and holding the drill bit stationary.
20 Feb
20 Feb
10:09 a.m.
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11:50 a.m.
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tony Duell wrote:
If you get a really cheap Torx bit, you can often
soften the metal by
heating it to red heat (ish) and cooling it slowly. Decent tool steel
will not soften when you do this. However, a carbide or diamond drill
would probably do it.
Huh??? *Any* steel can be annealed. Granted, though, annealing
really high-grade alloyed steel is a very relative thing. Also,
other-metal alloys -- steel-tungsten, manganese alloys or whatever --
may need a completely different annealing process.
Since these bits tend to have a 1/4" hexagonal
body, I'd clamp it in the
3 jaw chuck of a lathe, put the drill on the tailstock, and slowly feed
it in. Should be (easily) accurate enough.
I just put my torx driver in a mixing-bowl of water, eye-balled center
(since I don't have a centerpunch harder than a Mac Tools Torx driver)
and went to town with the diamond ball. It was accurate enough.
For you non-tool-freaks, that's a 1.75mm medium-coarse diamond-in-
nickel-matrix ball on a tapered 1/8" stub bit, driven by a
Foredom Flex-Shaft tool. The mixing bowl of water compensates for my
lack of a coolant feed. It works. My use of her cooking utensils does
sort of irritate root^H^H^H^H Grace....
Tony, did anyone ever explain Swiss-Watch Syndrome to you? ;^)
Doc
21 Feb
21 Feb
5:32 a.m.
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3:40 p.m.
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tony Duell wrote:
"As long as the kitchen doesn't stink this time...."
As in "G**D**n it, Doc! We're not building Swiss watches here. This
is a DRILLING RIG! That's close enough!"
It's never close enough.
I made silver jewelry for a few years, and one of my reference books
has a quote that I love.
"A true atrist never finishes a piece. He merely abandons it."
I grew up welding in fab shops all over West Texas. The foremen
would gripe for the first six weeks because I was slow. After they
figured out that my fabs took a third the normal time to install, they
would quit griping and give me a raise.
Olin Anthony, the owner of a crew I worked on, had some snapshots done
of a seed-chute complex I designed and built. The last time I was in
his office was some 4 years after he fired me. He had those photos
blown up, matted and framed, on his office wall. I'm as proud of that
as any work I've ever done.
Doc
I think you'd have difficulty softening 'high
speed steel' very much.
Maybe not....
That's what I meant by "very relative".... The big problem is
determining the alloy content. Different additive metals can change the
optimum process a LOT. IIRC, nickel is one of the most problematic.
Foredom
Flex-Shaft tool. The mixing bowl of water compensates for my
lack of a coolant feed. It works. My use of her cooking utensils does
sort of irritate root^H^H^H^H Grace....
Ah, somebody else who has problems putting computer bits in the
dishwasher, baking out transformers in the oven, and so on :-) Tony, did
anyone ever explain Swiss-Watch Syndrome to you? ;^)
No... Is it something to do with what is commonly called 'overkill' and
what I simply consider to be doing the job properly?
22 Feb
22 Feb
6:58 a.m.
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7:08 p.m.
Hi,
ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) said:
> >
> > No... Is it something to do with what is commonly called 'overkill'
and
> what I simply consider to be doing the job properly?
>
> As in "G**D**n it, Doc! We're not building Swiss watches here. This
> is a DRILLING RIG! That's close enough!"
> It's never close enough.
My views exactly....
"The Better is often the enemy of the Good, and the Best can be the enemy
of both, as it is always too late."
Arthur C. Clarke
Read his short story "Superiority"....
--
Cheers,
Stan Barr stanb(a)dial.pipex.com
The future was never like this!
8094
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33 comments
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participants (14)
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ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
cmurillo＠emtelsa.multi.net.co -
doc＠mdrconsult.com -
erd_6502＠yahoo.com -
fernande＠internet1.net -
geoffrob＠stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au -
jpero＠sympatico.ca -
kenziem＠sympatico.ca -
musicman38＠mindspring.com -
rhb57＠vol.com -
stanb＠dial.pipex.com -
tothwolf＠concentric.net -
vance＠ikickass.org