Due to popular request... I am now uploading some close up pictures of the flipchips in that odd panel to the url http://www.ezwind.net/jwest/1145-whatsit I was told this system was taken from either a naval or air force facility, used in some kind of testing. Definitely was installed in TN. Here are the flip chips in that odd rack wirewrap panel: BFC (big fu... er... flat cable from cpu) to paddle connector in the "whatsit" backplane Some kind of terminator, like the one in the first slot of the cpu - unibus terminator methinks M7821 M7311 M7317 M7317 (2) M111 M302 M102 M113 M205 about 12 or 13 K281 M801 six K581 three K650A M105 Here are also the legends I read off the cards (not in the order as above, just a sampling to give you an idea what's there) Address Selector DC driver Contact Input Filter Relay Board Contact Sense Inverter 10 2-input NAND RT(tm) Input Interface Unibus Driver R(t) DOP1 After flipping a few of the front panel switches, it would appear some of the switches fell off. It seems like the switch cover poles that stick out are not broken, it's the mechanical switch that came apart underneath the cover. They look like CK switches (red & silver, gold bar inside)... I've seen CK switches disintigrate like that before. Looks like I'll be looking for switches too.And MAN I'm starting to hate those people who sell front panels on ebay for hundreds. Leave them on the system would ya?? :) Thats the thing about this hobby I seem to be discovering... with any given system, you're never "done" :) Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh(a)aracnet.com> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2003 6:21 PM Subject: Re: 11/45 pictures & questions it. powers a some look I not Anyone for definitely 11/44? collection of flipchips and such that you mention and the fact that it's only got 8k of RAM, I'm guessing that it was used as some sort of intelligent industrial controller. (Papertape OS). I'm not sure if DOS/Batch would fit on a 8k system as I've not messed with it. I'm fairly sure the RAM boards in your /44 won't work in a /45. Once you get a decent amount of RAM in the system I'd recommend RSTS/E for an OS (it seems the most appropriate to me), and failing that either RSX-11M/M+ or RT-11.

On Sunday 28 December 2003 21:10 pm, Witchy wrote: That's my feeling most days, also. --jc

I'll agree with that! However, a more practical solution is simply not to buy (or own) a modern computer, but to use the old classics... It's _possible_ to do this... -tony

I rarely play games, but... This probably says a lot about me, but I find the enjoyability of a computer game is proportional to its age. The older the game the better. I much prefer the games in the HP67 Games Pac 1 (which run on a calculator with a 1 line numeric display) to the latest blast-the-b*st*rds on a PC... -tony

I have always found restoring and getting the hardware running and learning the op sys a game enough! heh heh! ed! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> Sent: Monday, December 29, 2003 8:04 PM Subject: Re: 11/45 pictures & questions (odd flip chips)

Zane wrote... collection of flipchips and such that you mention and the fact that it's only got 8k of RAM, I'm guessing that it was used as some sort of intelligent industrial controller. Yup, airforce or navy, forget what the previous owner said. Definitely some type of testbed or process control or automated testing yada yada yada (Papertape OS). I'm not sure if DOS/Batch would fit on a 8k system as I've not messed with it. I'm fairly sure the RAM boards in your /44 won't work in a /45. Once you get a decent amount of RAM in the system I'd recommend RSTS/E for an OS (it seems the most appropriate to me), and failing that either RSX-11M/M+ or RT-11. Oh no, I didn't strive so long for a /45 to have it run PTOS (no paper tape reader for it anyways). Unix is my preference for this, failing that, RSTS. But my inability to find semiconductor memory and the segmentation boards may dictate otherwise. We'll see. This will be a very fun project. Maybe I'll put it ahead of my 8E restoration and my 11/44 restoration :) Hey... this machine, like some of the others I've worked on, has some very large bundles of wiring that are virtually impossible to clean when dirt is caked into them. Anyone found a good way to degrease and get the dirt off wiring harnesses? My methods clean the surface but seem to mainly drive the grit inbetween the wires making up the bundle. Anyone have a trick to this? Jay

We haven't got a basement unfortunately. My storage space (it should be our dining room) is full, the garage is full and the computer room where I'm typing now is full. All I need to do is find another job :-/ Bizarre. Has the URL wrapped in your mail reader? I copied and pasted it looking at that page. Come in 212.57.x.x :o) cheers

If you could find it it would make my year! cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o(

On Mon, Dec 29, 2003 at 08:23:20AM -0600, Tom Uban wrote: I have run 2.9BSD on an 11/24 w/3MB of memory and two RL02s. It was not an easy fit (I didn't have enough room to load the sources and rebuild the kernel). I wanted to try to put 2.9BSD on an RK07 or two, but I lost them when my employer closed years ago (no room to take them with me on top of the four truckloads of VAXen and PDP-11 equipment I _did_ rescue, including an 11/750, an 8200, another 11/24, 2 x 11/34, 2 x 11/04...) At least with 2.11BSD, you can use an MSCP controller without having to resort to patching/retrofitting a driver (I think there is a way to use MSCP w/2.9BSD, but I've never attempted it). There are lots of options for MSCP disks on a Unibus -11, probably the least expensive to aquire is a UDA-50 and an RA81. There are plenty of things cheaper to ship, however. For context, we were using a UDA-50 and RA81 on that same 11/750 in 1984 ($26,000 for the drive, IIRC). If you want something older for your 11/45, you may have to dig harder. Lots of people who shied away from DEC operating systems were attracted to third-party disks. You might hunt down something in an SMD or ESDI subsystem. When we got our first 11/750, we put a Fuji 160MB drive and an Eagle on it, via a MASSBUS interface to a Systems Industries SI9900 box. I wasn't around when it was bought, but ISTR it was more than 30% cheaper than DEC disk, meg for meg (sturdy, too... survived several moves and daily production use for ~10 years). -ethan -- Ethan Dicks, A-130-S Current South Pole Weather at 29-Dec-2003 14:20 Z South Pole Station PSC 468 Box 400 Temp -11.1 F (-24.0 C) Windchill -33.7 F (-36.5 C) APO AP 96598 Wind 8.30 kts Grid 358 Barometer 699.1 mb (9912.2 ft) Ethan.Dicks(a)amanda.spole.gov http://penguincentral.com/penguincentral.html

On Mon, Dec 29, 2003 at 08:39:17AM -0600, Jay West wrote: At the time, I didn't own a Split I&D machine (I have an 11/44 that's awaiting my attention when I return, as well as a pair of 11/70s). Also, way back when (c. 1987), I only had a couple of magtapes with 2.9BSD. These days, of course, all of that stuff is easier to get than it once was. The trick is what one can do with lower-end equipment. With 10MB disks, the answer is, not much. :-( Even a 28MB disk would have helped immeasurably. The 11/780 is a monster, but the 11/750 is not so bad at all. We used to put the console on top, saving some space there, plus, with some sort of 5.25" disk (SMD/ESDI/RA7x), there's room inside the box for a disk as well (I'd use a seperate power supply though). In one cabinet, you can have the CPU, 8MB (or 14MB if you are lucky), a terminal controller or two (Emulex CS21, DZ11, DMF32...), a UDA-50 or Emulex disk interface, a line printer interface (LP11 or DMF-32)... in short... everything you really need inside the cab. We didn't do it that way in the old days, only because the disks wouldn't fit. That will be *plenty* of room for 2.11BSD. Sure thing. I just wish Unibus SCSI interfaces were cheap and plentiful. Every once in a while, I kick around the idea of modding a COMBOARD into a SCSI card, but then the urge subsides and I get back to more productive pursuits. One thing that holds me back is that there's no practical way to turn a COMBOARD into a *compatible* Unibus interface. I could use the 68000 on-board to talk to a Z5380 chip or a WD33C93 or the like (and borrow the SCSI code from a variety of sources, like the Amiga), but there's no way to make the COMBOARD's registers resemble anything like an MSCP controller or old-fashioned SMD/ESDI controller. With Digital's patent's on MSCP expired or nearly so, I wonder what it would take to build a converter to attach to a UDA-50/KDA-50/KDB-50... The interface chips and cables could be scavenged from a dead RA81, but I have no idea what it would take to build a box that spoke SCSI or IDE out one end, and SDI out the other... any takers? It might be easier than the ST506 converter we've been discussing. At least in this case, it's digital in and out, with no sampling required. -ethan -- Ethan Dicks, A-130-S Current South Pole Weather at 29-Dec-2003 15:51 Z South Pole Station PSC 468 Box 400 Temp -11.2 F (-24.0 C) Windchill -31.2 F (-35.1 C) APO AP 96598 Wind 7.5 kts Grid 011 Barometer 699.4 mb (9904.4 ft) Ethan.Dicks(a)amanda.spole.gov http://penguincentral.com/penguincentral.html

Jay West wrote: We run the M-7891 and some Mostek (don't recall the model) boards in the 11/45's at work. Assuming that you have the correct DD11 expansion backplane. There is a 4 slot DD11 that, although it is hex-height, is only wired for quad-height boards. -nick o

Um, You have a fairly complete 11/34a system sitting here still. Its got 2 RL-01's, an aftermarket RX02, A Computer Operations Inc Linc tape drive.... Its got a known-good 256 K Unibus memory board, a single hex module, the one Tony suggested you use. Jay West wrote: