On 5/31/16 1:53 PM, Al Kossow wrote: also, came across this today I had forgotten about "product factoring" at the end, some machines were saved in the bay area. I have a rather large pile of 8010/8090 boards and four 8090s that another list member saved when he lived in Santa Cruz in the late 90's. -- http://www.jerrypournelle.com/archives2/archives2mail/mail147.html Jerry, I've been chasing a subject around the 'net via web pages and e-mails for a couple of weeks and have had no luck finding what I'm looking for. You're fond of saying that we're now in an era when most every question has an answer, but my answer is probably still locked into a human brain. So I though I'd try the tap at your web site to see if any of your readers are able to help me. For research and personal reasons, I am trying to obtain a functioning Xerox GlobalView system. Now this kind of system is admittedly out of date, but it's far from obsolete. A functioning system can take one of several forms that would be useful to me: a) A functioning 'max-config' 6085 (pref a 6085-2 or a Fuji Xerox model) workstation with a live hard drive. monitor, kbd, and mouse. All the bells and whistles so to speak. b) A complete copy of the GlobalView install media for either WinTel (win32) or Solaris/Sparc. I'd also need a complete set of product factoring numbers (software license keys) for the Xerox software. The above will make 'perfect sense' to many of your readers, I hope that one of them will actually be able to help me out. Considering how influential the Xerox STAR and it's follow-ons were, you'd think that someone, or some company somewhere would be able to help. Or that there would be archival information and possibly materials available from Xerox. Wrong. After exchanging a number of e-mails with current and former Xerox employees, it has become clear to me that Xerox would rather pretend that they didn't "Fumble the Future" and let the Personal Computer revolution slip away from them. Even archives you might normally expect to see at PARC were purged. There are several ex-Xerox employee groups trying to establish a functioning set of workstations and software at museums, but materials, hardware, and software are almost non-existant. And those few who have operable systems are loath to let anyone near to them knowing full well that replacement parts are not to be had. As far as I'm able to deduce, Xerox has (nearly successfully) tried to bury all memory of the STAR. When Xerox 'converted' to MS based networking and commodity-priced personal computers, those "ahead of their time" workstations and software were rather abruptly (one correspondant used the word forcibly) removed from user and engineering desktops and then physically destroyed. Not even put up for employee or surplus sale. Simply Destroyed. Market forces take some of the blame for this as did the need for Xerox to join the late 20th Century. But simple pig-headness on the part of EDS (a contractor to Xerox) and a no-longer-there CIO helpd to kill off the memory and archives of a most remarkable design and software product. Well, rather than (further) rehash the sad, sorry story of Xerox, STAR, the Alto, 8010, 1186, 6085, ViewPoint, and GlobalView, I'll just hope that one of your readers or their company will be able to help me out. Thanks, take it easy, good luck in Hollywood, and keep working on Jannisaries and The Burning Tower. All the best Chuck Kuhlman ckuhlman at mn.rr.com ckuhlman at uswest.net