20 Oct
2007
20 Oct
'07
5:58 p.m.
Hi,
Does anyone have any experience with using a TOP2049 as a TTL 74xxx chip
tester?
How did it work for you? Do you recommend it as a worthwhile piece of test
equipment?
Thanks!
Andrew Lynch
21 Oct
21 Oct
9:25 p.m.
Andrew Lynch wrote:
Hi,
Does anyone have any experience with using a TOP2049 as a TTL 74xxx chip
tester?
How did it work for you? Do you recommend it as a worthwhile piece of test
equipment?
I do not know the TOP2049, but use an ALLPRO-07 for that purpose. It can
also test (some) SRAM & DRAM. You can also define your own testpattern.
It even programs Eproms !
About the only drawback is the need for an ISA slot for the controller card.
Jos
22 Oct
22 Oct
4:24 a.m.
On 22/10/2007 05:25, Jos Dreesen / Marian Capel wrote:
I do not know the TOP2049, but use an ALLPRO-07 for
that purpose. It can
also test (some) SRAM & DRAM. You can also define your own testpattern.
It even programs Eproms !
About the only drawback is the need for an ISA slot for the controller
card.
Do you know if that's similar to an ALL-02? I have a couple of these,
though only one ISA card, and I have the disk with the software, but I
can't get it to run on under DOS on a modern PC -- it looks like the PC
is too fast.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
1:36 p.m.
On 10/23/07, Pete Turnbull <pete at dunnington.plus.com> wrote:
Do you know if that's similar to an ALL-02? I
have a couple of these,
though only one ISA card, and I have the disk with the software, but I
can't get it to run on under DOS on a modern PC -- it looks like the PC
is too fast.
I have that problem with my B&C Microsystems UP600A - I have to keep a
286 maintained to be able to use it (a Compaq 286/SLT laptop with
docking station, in which is the B&C ISA card and an Ethernet card).
-ethan
3:04 p.m.
> Do you know if that's similar to an ALL-02? I
have a couple of these,
> though only one ISA card, and I have the disk with the software, but I
> can't get it to run on under DOS on a modern PC -- it looks like the PC
> is too fast.
Strange. If I'm not mistaken, ALL-02 is almost the same of the ALL-03,
incluiding the same board (SAC201?). I use my ALL-03 into a P3 PC with no
problems
I have that problem with my B&C Microsystems
UP600A - I have to keep a
286 maintained to be able to use it (a Compaq 286/SLT laptop with
docking station, in which is the B&C ISA card and an Ethernet card).
With the price of the TOP 200x programmers, I don't think this option is
still feasible...
2:16 p.m.
On 10/23/07, Alexandre Souza <alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> wrote:
Well... it's a laptop, so it takes up about as much space as the
programmer. It was given to me, so it didn't cost anything to
acquire. If you don't already have one, or your only option is a
PC-XT or PC-AT and space is tight, I can see that being a problem, but
in my case, it works great. When I'm not using it, I close the lid,
then stack the programmer on the closed laptop - not much space at
all.
-ethan
I have that
problem with my B&C Microsystems UP600A - I have to keep a
286 maintained to be able to use it (a Compaq 286/SLT laptop with
docking station, in which is the B&C ISA card and an Ethernet card).
With the price of the TOP 200x programmers, I don't think this option is
still feasible...
3:19 p.m.
On 22/10/2007 23:04, Alexandre Souza wrote:
Hmm... I'll have to go and check the card to see what it is, but the
machine it's in is a P3 or maybe even a P2. I wonder if it would be
worth trying a copy of your software? I'll trade you some SGI/Irix info
for a teledisk image or a zipfile :-)
However, a realistic solution might be to replace the workshop pentium
that's hardly used one a year with the 486DX4 that's currently
preventing the door from moving in the breeze.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
> Do you
know if that's similar to an ALL-02? I have a couple of these,
> though only one ISA card, and I have the disk with the software, but I
> can't get it to run on under DOS on a modern PC -- it looks like the PC
> is too fast.
Strange. If I'm not mistaken, ALL-02 is almost the same of the
ALL-03, incluiding the same board (SAC201?). I use my ALL-03 into a P3
PC with no problems
30 Oct
30 Oct
4:46 p.m.
Hmm... I'll have to go and check the card to see
what it is, but the
machine it's in is a P3 or maybe even a P2. I wonder if it would be
worth trying a copy of your software? I'll trade you some SGI/Irix info
for a teledisk image or a zipfile :-)
Help is on your way :o)
However, a realistic solution might be to replace the
workshop pentium
that's hardly used one a year with the 486DX4 that's currently
preventing the door from moving in the breeze.
I use mine in a P3/1000, there is no why it would not work there
22 Oct
22 Oct
3:05 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
Well, seems that now is my time...
I have the oportunity of - at least - putting my dirty hands into a SGI
indigo! :oD
My questions:
- How fast is it?
- What can I run on that?
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
Thanks
Alexandre
(yes, in Brazil these are R A R E !)
2:20 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On Mon, 2007-10-22 19:05:41 -0300, Alexandre Souza <alexandre-listas at
e-secure.com.br> wrote:
Well, seems that now is my time...
I have the oportunity of - at least - putting my dirty hands into a SGI
indigo! :oD
My questions:
- How fast is it?
Slow. It's a 32bit R3000-based machine IIRC.
- What can I run on that?
Irix 5.4 is IIRC the last version running on the Indigo. (There is, by
the way, a clone built by Siemens Nixdorf namend RW320.) If memory
serves me correctly, there was also a Plan9 port at some time, but I
won't bet on it to still work.
Linux won't run on that box, but there are references for NetBSD on
this hardware.
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
It does.
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
You cannot. You need to use a SGI keyboard and mouse. You can, of
course, access the box via serial console connected to a PC. But keep
in mind that it uses a mini-DIN 7pin connector (somewhat uncommen.)
Also the serial line driver isn't all that well-protected for
electrostatic discharges. I killed one and it was hard to find a new
driver chip...
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern
PC monitor?
They aren't. It's sync-on-green, so you either need a good monitor and
you definitively need an adaptor.
MfG, JBG
--
Jan-Benedict Glaw jbglaw at lug-owl.de +49-172-7608481
Signature of: Zensur im Internet? Nein danke!
the second :
2:24 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
In article <20071022212033.GE16774 at lug-owl.de>,
Jan-Benedict Glaw <jbglaw at lug-owl.de> writes:
OK, good to know! There is a guy who sells adapters on ebay for $40.
(it connects to a standard PC kbd/mouse and adapts the signals for
the SGI). I haven't used one of these.
Also good to know! (And the version of IRIX I'll need to hunt down.)
Thanks for the info!
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download
<http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html>
Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>
- Can I use
a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
You cannot. You need to use a SGI keyboard and mouse. - Are the
monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
They aren't. It's sync-on-green, so you either need a good monitor and
you definitively need an adaptor.
3:10 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On 22/10/2007 22:20, Jan-Benedict Glaw wrote:
I think Jan means 5.3 (there is no 5.4). However the R4K version can
run 6.2 and IIRC versions of 6.5 up to 6.5.22, same as an R4K series Indy.
As for applications, a lot of the later Irix freeware (and all the stuff
you'll find on Nekochan) was compiled for later architectures and won't
run on the Indigos. However, there's still stuff to be found on the
net, and I'm sure other list members have copies of things, like me.
The frequencies are OK, and many modern monitors are fine. There are
several graphics variants for the Indigo, and most of them will drive an
SVGA-type monitor with no problem. We used to use Iiyamas a lot.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Mon, 2007-10-22 19:05:41 -0300, Alexandre Souza
<alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> wrote:
Unless of course you have an R4000 Indigo, which is 3-4 times faster
than the 33MHz R3000 ones. Still slower than a 200MHz Pentium, though.
However, it's subjectively not as slow as you might expect if you run
a sensible version of Irix, rather than the bloat that may be found in
some other OSs for other architectures.
Well, seems that now is my time...
I have the oportunity of - at least - putting my dirty hands into a SGI
indigo! :oD
My questions:
- How fast is it?
Slow. It's a 32bit R3000-based machine IIRC. - What can
I run on that?
Irix 5.4 is IIRC the last version running on the Indigo. (There is, by
the way, a clone built by Siemens Nixdorf namend RW320.) If memory
serves me correctly, there was also a Plan9 port at some time, but I
won't bet on it to still work. Linux won't run on that box, but there are
references for NetBSD on
this hardware.
9-pin miniDIN, actually.
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
It does.
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
You cannot. You need to use a SGI keyboard and mouse. You can, of
course, access the box via serial console connected to a PC. But keep
in mind that it uses a mini-DIN 7pin connector (somewhat uncommen.)
Also the serial line driver isn't all that well-protected for
electrostatic discharges. I killed one and it was hard to find a new
driver chip... - Are the
monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
They aren't. It's sync-on-green, so you either need a good monitor and
you definitively need an adaptor. 
5 Nov
5 Nov
3:46 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
- Can I use
a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
You cannot. You need to use a SGI keyboard and mouse. You can, of
course, access the box via serial console connected to a PC. But keep
in mind that it uses a mini-DIN 7pin connector (somewhat uncommen.)
Also the serial line driver isn't all that well-protected for
electrostatic discharges. I killed one and it was hard to find a new
driver chip...
22 Oct
22 Oct
2:22 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
In article <00bc01c814f7$c8515470$f0fea8c0 at alpha>,
"Alexandre Souza" <alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> writes:
My questions:
- How fast is it?
That would depend on the processor installed. Check the manuals here:
<http://techpubs.sgi.com/library/tpl/cgi-bin/listdocs.cgi?coll=hdwr&prods=Indigo>
- What can I run on that?
You should be able to run any MIPS based/IRIX software for SGIs. I
don't know what IRIX release you'll need; perhaps someone else can
provide that info.
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS. See:
<http://techpubs.sgi.com/library/tpl/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?coll=hdwr&db=bks&srch=&fname=/SGI_EndUser/Indigo_OG/sgi_html/ch03.html>
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
I *think* the answer to these is yes, but check the usual web sites
(futuretech, Ian Mapelson's SGI site, etc.) for info.
I got 2 Indigos sans hard drives recently but haven't had a chance to
explore more in depth than unpacking them.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download
<http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html>
Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>
3:15 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On 22/10/2007 22:22, Richard wrote:
They're proprietary SIMMs with a completely different form-factor to
anything you'll find elsewhere. They also have a control ASIC on the SIMM.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
You should be able to run any MIPS based/IRIX software
for SGIs.
Sadly, not. Most of the later software was compiled for MIPS2 or
MIPS3/4 and that definitely won't run on an Indigo. MIPS2 would run on
an R4K machine, but only MIPS1 on an R3K.
- Does it
use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS. 
28 Oct
28 Oct
8:06 a.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On Mon, 22 Oct 2007, Richard wrote:
Bzzzt! Not so. As was typical for workstations of that vintage, it seems
as if every model produced by SGI used a different form of proprietary
memory. They are a "SIMM like" form factor, although shorter in length
than anything sold for PCs. I was fortunate enough to score a bag full of
them at one of the MIT flea markets and expanded mine to the full 96MB.
Steve
--
- Does it
use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS. See: 
7 Nov
7 Nov
10 a.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS. 
2:49 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On 2007-11-07 19:00, der Mouse wrote:
Bzzzt! Not so. As was typical for workstations of that vintage, it
seems as if every model produced by SGI used a different form of
proprietary memory.
That's not to say they aren't SIMMs, though admittedly in context "uses
SIMMs" is awful close to "uses SIMMs of some very common type".
Quite.
Although the Indigo (R4000), Indy and Indigo2 all used bog standard 72-pin
ECC SIMMs, as has been pointed out several times already (but, apparently,
it bears repeating).
,xtG
.tsooJ
--
If a mute swears, does his mother wash his hands with soap?
--
Joost van de Griek
<http://www.jvdg.net/>
- Does it
use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS.
3:25 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On Wed, 7 Nov 2007, der Mouse wrote:
Bzzzt! Not so. As was typical for workstations of that vintage, it
seems as if every model produced by SGI used a different form of
proprietary memory.
That's not to say they aren't SIMMs, though admittedly in context "uses
SIMMs" is awful close to "uses SIMMs of some very common type".
Yup. I realized after posting that message that 'SIMM' can simply be
viewed a general form-factor. However, more commonly it's applied to the
30pin or 72pin PeeCee variety.
I've seen SIMM adapters that allow you to stack multiple 30pin modules on
a a 72pin socket. Did anyone ever make a converter for any workstations
that would support using garden variety memory in, e.g. an older Iris?
Steve
--
- Does it
use any kind of special memory?
Its my understanding that it uses SIMMS. 
22 Oct
22 Oct
2:39 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
Alexandre Souza writes:
Well, seems that now is my time...
I have the oportunity of - at least - putting my dirty hands into a SGI
indigo! :oD
My questions:
- How fast is it?
- What can I run on that?
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
Thanks
Alexandre
(yes, in Brazil these are R A R E !)
Depending on the model, it's either a 33Mhz R3000, a 100Mhz R4000, or a
150Mhz R4400. You should be able to run IRIX up to 6.2 on an R3000, or 6.5
on the R4k models. There are likely Linux & NetBSD ports that will run, but
those are no fun to run on an SGI :).
You'll need a special Indigo Keyboard & Mouse. The connector looks like
PS/2, but it's not, unfortunately. It's possible to buy an adapter (for
about $40) which will likely be easier to find than the real thing. See:
http://ckcomputersystems.com/ckcs/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=87&a…
Csid=64f39e3c9aced887b829c8bd540f36be
R3000-based Indigos use proprietary (hard to find) memory, but the
R4x000-based ones take standard 72-pin, fast-page ECC SIMMS.
Any decent PC monitor that supports Sync-On-Green should be able to work
with the Indigo without problems.
Good luck!
- Josh
3:57 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On 10/22/07, Alexandre Souza <alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> wrote:
Well, seems that now is my time...
I have the oportunity of - at least - putting my dirty hands into a
SGI
indigo! :oD
My questions:
- How fast is it?
- What can I run on that?
- Does it use any kind of special memory?
- Can I use a PC mouse/keyboard with that?
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
Thanks
Alexandre
(yes, in Brazil these are R A R E !)
It really depends on the version of Iris Indigo you have. They come in
various flavors from the above mentioned R3000 to an R4000 version that can
support the R4400 up to 150mhz. The R3000's do require special ram while
the R4000/4400 use standard 72 pin SIMMS. All Iris Indigo's need the
special keyboards (9500801 Indigo Keyboard (beige), 9150800 Indigo Mouse
(beige)) or the PS2 adapter you mentioned. They also came in several levels
of graphics sophistication from the LG1/2 Entry boards to the Elan with 4
Geometry Engines, 24bit video memory and a Z buffer.
The R3000 units will run Irix to 5.3 with XFS and the R4400 wil run up to
the R6.5.2x versions. Support for the Iris Indigo was dropped from Irix
above 6.5.22 as I recall. But at 6.5.22 you can run most freeware and
commercial software.
Omne thing to keep in mind, the tOD battery will probably be dead in your
Indigo. Some are soldered on the motherboard, some are plug in. The
proper part number is a Tadiran TL-5186.
If you find a keyboard and need some odd bits, let me know as I have 8 Iris
Indigo's and a couple of bins of spare parts. I also have some Sgi freeware
on my ftp server at blackcube.org.
James - Blackcube
--
www.blackcube.org - The Texas State Home for Wayward and Orphaned Computers
4 p.m.
New subject: An old dream come true: Iris Indigo!
On 10/22/07, Alexandre Souza <alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> wrote:
- Are the monitor frequencies suitable for a modern PC monitor?
If you have an Indigo with the Entry boards, either LG1 or LG2 (the "Song
and Dance Board") it will have a VGA port and a standard VGA monitor will
work. I even hooked up a cheap LCD panel to mine and it worked pretty well.
James
--
www.blackcube.org - The Texas State Home for Wayward and Orphaned Computers
30 Oct
30 Oct
2:55 p.m.
Do you know if that's similar to an ALL-02? I
have a couple of these,
though only one ISA card, and I have the disk with the software, but I
can't get it to run on under DOS on a modern PC -- it looks like the PC is
too fast.
I have an ALL-03, it has the SAC201 card. It runs in everything I put it
on, but not on windows XP. There are two pages that says a lot about these
old hi-lo programmers:
http://www.danbbs.dk/~rmadrm/sunshine.htm
http://matthieu.benoit.free.fr/
Other I didn't know:
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/wgeeraert/eprom.htm
The sunshine programmer is the same of all-01/02/03/etc
Good luck!
3:17 p.m.
On 30/10/2007 21:55, Alexandre Souza wrote:
I have an ALL-03, it has the SAC201 card. It runs
in everything I put
it on, but not on windows XP. There are two pages that says a lot about
these old hi-lo programmers:
http://www.danbbs.dk/~rmadrm/sunshine.htm
http://matthieu.benoit.free.fr/
Other I didn't know:
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/wgeeraert/eprom.htm
The sunshine programmer is the same of all-01/02/03/etc
Thank you! That's really useful, and I might be able to get it going
now. I was interested to see the mention of some Altera CPLDs on one of
the pages, as I just happen to have a boxful of those.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
31 Oct
31 Oct
8:32 a.m.
Thank you! That's really useful, and I might be
able to get it going now.
I was interested to see the mention of some Altera CPLDs on one of the
pages, as I just happen to have a boxful of those.
Altera chips are easier to program. Just look for "byteblaster cable" on
the net, you'll see that you'll need only a '245 and some resistors.
6037
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24 comments
13 participants
participants (13)
-
alexandre-listas＠e-secure.com.br -
derschjo＠msu.edu -
ethan.dicks＠gmail.com -
james.rice＠gmail.com -
jbglaw＠lug-owl.de -
jos.mar＠bluewin.ch -
jvdg＠sparcpark.net -
korpela＠ssl.berkeley.edu -
legalize＠xmission.com -
lynchaj＠yahoo.com -
mouse＠Rodents.Montreal.QC.CA -
pete＠dunnington.plus.com -
snhirsch＠gmail.com