1 Dec
2003
1 Dec
'03
1:45 p.m.
Very true that mySQL lacks certain features present in other SQL's. However,
I was under the impression triggers were added a while back, as were foreign
keys (for innodb, not myisam). I will double check!
Jay West
----- Original Message -----
From: "J.C. Wren" <jcwren(a)jcwren.com>
To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 9:27 PM
Subject: Re: Need resources showing deployments for Linux/Apache/PHP
vs.Windows/ISS/ASP
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
mySQL may be free, and it is an excellent product, but
other than in speed
for simple transactions, you can hardly compare them. mySQL does not
support
triggers, nested JOINs (as of about 2 months ago),
proper foreign keys,
nor a
handful of other slightly esoteric but frequently used
database methods.
I use mySQL for all my database work. But then, the DB stuff I do is
pretty
straight forward, and I rarely need anything more than
it offers. I've
messed briefly with postGres, which is verra nice, but was just too
different
to make worth switching.
Oracle is expensive. But it's a lot more database than mySQL will be for
a
few more years.
--jc
On Monday 01 December 2003 21:53 pm, Jay West wrote:
> Sellam;
>
> I wrote a paper for management at one of my clients on exactly this
topic,
> comparing FreeBSD, Linux, and Windows in one
section. Another section
> compared Apache vs. IIS. The third section compared MySQL and MSSQL, and
> the final section compared ASP vs. PHP.
>
> Note - these comparisons were not in great technical detail, although
there
> was a lot of technical meat there. The whole
paper was focused strictly
on
> scalability, performance, and reliability. This
document was about 1/2
inch
> thick most of which was supporting material from
third parties (ie.
facts).
>
> This paper caused a company that grosses well into 8 digits and employs
> many hundreds of people, to get rid of Microsoft from the datacenter,
AND
> from every persons desktop. I believe I have a
copy of this paper still,
> and will forward it to you tomorrow when I get to the office if I can
find
> it quickly before leaving from the NOC. However,
I will give the link
> http://www.mysql.com/eweek/ as being most illustrative. Note that the
link
> I gave IS on the Mysql website, but, after
reading the synopsis there,
note
> the link at the bottom of the page which shows
the full details of the
> study, NOT done by mysql, but eweek. Also interesting to note... MSSQL
> leveled off while mysql and oracle were only half way through their
> performance curve. Mysql and Oracle had virtually identical performance
> curves, and those curves were WELL above the others (MSQL). So, given
two
> almost identical performance curves... lets
see.... MySQL - free.
Oracle...
> HOW much per seat license??? *GRIN*
>
> Oh, and I'll also throw in here... the person who posted that I was
selling
> FUD with regards to linux... I wholeheartedly
disagree with his stance.
I
> stand by my arguments and facts, but I'm not
going to go back and forth
> about it on the list. I voiced my experience, nuff said :)
>
> Jay West
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Vintage Computer Festival" <vcf(a)siconic.com>
> To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
> Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 8:16 PM
> Subject: OT: Need resources showing deployments for Linux/Apache/PHP vs.
> Windows/ISS/ASP
>
> > I have a friend who is a total Microsoft zealot. We repeatedly get
into
> > annoyingly incredibly pointless arguments
over the virtues of Linux
> > vs. Windows. I mean, I know people have religious OS wars all the
time
> > but he's so ignorant of the Linux world
that it's stunning. I mean,
the
> > guy is the smartest person I know, but when
it comes to this argument,
he
> > seems to argue for the sake of arguing
because he has no real
statistics
> > to go off of and talks completely out of his
ass, or he'll quote one
> > article he read somewhere that said one thing (probably not even what
> > he's arguing) to justify his position.
> >
> > For instance, he says PHP is full of holes and is not professional
> > software because it's written by hobbyists on the side, the language
is
> > not clearly defined, and there's no
support for it. He says the same
> > about MySQL. In fact, this is where the argument tonight started. He
> > had a web service that crashed because one of his MySQL tables got
hosed,
> > so he blamed all his woes on MySQL (he
claims he had to use it because
> > the programmer he had do the site only new PHP and not ASP which he
> > would've preferred, claiming that ASP is much more robust, is much
better
> > defined, is way more powerful than PHP,
etc., which may all be true
but
> > his criticisms about PHP and MySQL are so
unfounded as to be
obnoxious).
> > When I mentioned that MySQL DOES have
support (you pay for it just
like
> > you do when you buy MSSQL) he finds some
other nit to pick, which I
then
> > shoot down, so he moves on to another, and
another, and another, then
> > starts throwing out dubious statistics, etc.
> >
> > So I know it's completely pointless, but I just want to throw some
> > statistics from neutral quarters (i.e. not Linux Journal, but like
> > Forbes, Fortune, Network Magazine, etc.) showing how many deployments
of:
> >
> > 1) Apache running on Linux versus Apache on Windows
> > 2) PHP on Apache vs. ASP on ISS
> > 3) Linux servers vs. Windows servers
> > 4) Growth rates, industry trends, etc.
> >
> > No matter what I tell him he thinks that there's no way that Linux is
> > beating MS in any way, shape or form.
> >
> > As an aside, the extent to which he is completely lost is evident in
this
> > anecdote. He's complaining how people
can't code in 64K anymore, and
> > when I point out that this trend of bloat is pretty much directly
> > attributable to MS with its programming paradigms and overall
bloatiness,
> > he shoots that down like I was Satan for
even suggesting it.
> >
> > So anyway, I want charts, graphs, hard numbers, quotes, trends, etc.
Any
articles that can show the actual numbers of
what's going on in the
industry with regards to Linux vs. Windows.
Simple URLs will do.
Thanks for indulging this stupidity.
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer
Festival
-
----
International Man of Intrigue and Danger
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