29 Jun
2015
29 Jun
'15
6:04 p.m.
Re: 11/780 as first VAX: no. That's just silly. I restored a pair of
11/785s (one a field-updated /780) for LCM. They're a wonderful machine,
and I really really want one - after I win the lottery and can afford the
power and space for it and can take the time to get and keep it running.
Get a VAXstation of some sort or another. Even if you have a low end
one-lunged 3100, or even a 2000, you can run VMS on real VAX hardware and
have fun. I would actually suggest a 3100 over just about anything else
because you can find expansion cases for it (typically containing SCSI
drives, CDROM drives and even cartridge tape drives) pretty easily and
cheaply, and everything just plugs in. If you want one of the 'good' ones,
you'll fight tooth and nail on ePay, but if your goal is to enjoy running
VMS on real hardware, you can buy one of the 'OK' ones for a lot less.
Then, if the bug bites you and you really want something bigger, I'd look
for one of the pedestal machines - I really love my 4000/300 and, although
you'll pay through the nose to ship it, it's a serious VAX that can Do
Stuff.
Then, if you discover you're totally insane, you can look about for Big
VAXen and subsidize your local power company. -- Ian
On Mon, Jun 29, 2015 at 3:04 PM, Johnny Billquist <bqt at update.uu.se> wrote:
On 2015-06-29 21:35, tony duell wrote:
Yes. But I would never dream of suggesting a VAX-11/780 as a "first VAX"
either... I think most people would not even know what to do if presented
with 500 Kg of computer... Not to mention all the subsystems you need to
figure out, learn, connect and get running...
It's not exactly like a workstation or a PC.
fair enough. I would not consider most of those machines as good first
They are small compared to a VAX-11/780.
The problem with lots of the more modern machines though, are that they
The 11/782 would become very big, and use even more power. Not that an
11/780 are small to start with, but we're talking about roughly doubling
the size and power consumption here... Not to mention being a very odd
machine from a multiprocessor point of view as well. Not something I would
recommend unless you are seriously interested in that specific machine.
The 11/730 and 11/725 are probably among the last machines I would ever
want to have. We all have different dreams... The 8650 is sweet. I could
possibly like a 9000 even more...
Thing about the VAXstations is that there are quite a few about that can
--
Ian S. King, MSIS, MSCS, Ph.D. Candidate
The Information School <http://ischool.uw.edu>
Archivist, Voices From the Rwanda Tribunal <http://tribunalvoices.org>
Value Sensitive Design Research Lab <http://vsdesign.org>
University of Washington
There is an old Vulcan saying: "Only Nixon could go to China."
Well, ok, if your list was intended as a
"first VAX" only list, then
That is what I believe the OP was asking for,
VAXen
either. Although, the 6000 is actually not that hard, nor some of
the small 8000-machines, such as the 8200.
The 6000 series are quite big cabinets and as a first VAX it's hard for
me to
see the great advantage over a microVAX or a VAXstation.
essentially are fine if they work, but if they break, you'll have a hard
time to fix them. That goes both for the 6000 series as well as all the
pizza boxes.
My view is that there are only 2 VAXen series that I would want to run at
home. For me.
That is machines where component-level investigation and repair are very
possible, Those
series are the 11/780 (including the 11/782 and 11/785, of course) and
the 11/730 (including
11/725). As I don't have space for the former, I intend to run the
latter. But my requirements and
interests are likely to be very different from other people's hence my
initial comments.
be raided for spares. There
is a printset for at least one of them on bitsavers, so I would guess
finding a faulty IC is not going to
be impossible. I refuse to actually suggst b***d-sw*pp**g but you know
what I mean....
Yeah. VAXstations makes a lot of sense for someone who just wants to run a
VAX and play around. The fact that you can get spares pretty easy most of
the time has its points.
If you like playing around with the hardware as well as the software, then
maybe there are more interesting machines around than the pizzabox ones.
I have never seen a printset for a 6000, 7000, 8650, etc machine. Do they
exist? I doubt it for the
6000 series.
I don't remember if I have the printsets for the 8650, but we (Update)
sure have quite a lot of documentation for it.
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol