Do any of you fellows know of a ready/reasonable source of the 44-conductor
connectors and cables used with notebook drives? I believe the spacing of
the connector pins is 2mm. I need a limited about of this stuff and a few
of the IDC connectors to be used at each end of the cable. The adapter I
have for this drive type has a typical HD power connector on it along with
an inline pc-mount connector that would also be of interest.
Any suggestions?
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: John Wilson <wilson(a)dbit.dbit.com>
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Date: Monday, March 20, 2000 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: iOpener
>On Mon, Mar 20, 2000 at 09:13:56AM -0800, Ethan Dicks wrote:
>> There's great hack running around where you take a regular 44-pin cable
>> that's long enough and attach a second connector immediately adjacent to
>> the connector on one end. You use the inner pins of the end connector
>> and the outer pins on the new connector to attach to the motherboard.
>>
>> -------------------
>> || ||||
>> ^^ (use these "pins")
>> drive end motherboard end
>
>Cute! Well that sure beats slicing the cable up into 22 pairs and trying
to
>get them stay down in the "twisted" position while you put on a connector.
>
>> ||
>> --------------------
>> ||
>>
>> Wouldn't that simulate having a connector on the wrong side and reverse
>> the effect of the motherboard wiring?
>
>Unfortunately not, IDC connectors don't work that way. You'll just tap the
>same wires in different places, it's as if you took a regular cable and
just
>folded one end over, nothing has changed. I remember confusing the hell
out
>of myself with this the first time I tried to get a DZ11A cab kit
working...
>
>> AFAIK, there is no ready source of 12V. Also, consider the power draw.
A
>> laptop drive pulls 500-700mA (2,5-3.5W), a desktop drive draws closer to
>> 9W-15W. It's even a consideration when choosing a different
>> CPU (ISTR the WinChip180 is rated at ~9W, most Pentia suck around
13-17W).
>
>Yeah actually I was wondering if the laptop drive is already pushing
things.
>The power supply is really tiny (integrated on the main board) and it's
>powered by a puny wall wart transformer, the label says 81VA but even
that's
>hard to imagine given how light it is.
>
>> ObClassic: there's plenty of space on the flash disk to stick a small OS
>> and a variety of apps including Kermit.
>
>I was thinking, making a PCMCIA flash card adapter for the 44-pin cable
>wouldn't be hard at all, that might be another easy way to get stuff in
>and out.
>
>> If you hacked the flash and disabled
>> the hard disk (or had a way to specify the boot order), you could bring
it
>> up by default into a terminal program and use it as a console if it
weren't
>> running some other app. Yes, a dumb terminal is cheaper and probably
more
>> VT100 compliant (double-high characters spring to mind immediately), but
a
>> real DEC terminal is not as portable.
>
>Yeah I *wish* someone was making ASCII terminals like this box, it's
perfect
>for one, at least part time. But the box has too much potential to
actually
>*dedicate* your only one as being just a small/light VT100 replacement,
which
>is sort of a shame.
>
>But I figure, even if the Netpliance folks close the loophole (which seems
>inevitable given all the press it's gotten) and we can't buy these boxes
for
>$99.95 for much longer, the regular users will get tired of them eventually
>and there will be piles of them on eBay in a year or two, probably for even
>less than the $99.95. *That* will be the perfect time to put one on every
>flat surface in the whole house! Meanwhile, gotta get an order out to
Digikey.
>
>John Wilson
>D Bit
--- John Wilson <wilson(a)dbit.dbit.com> wrote:
> Mine just arrived this morning, I had ordered it from Netpliance's own
> 800 # so evidently at least *they* still have stock even if CC doesn't
> (suits me, the nearest CC is 1.5 hours away from me anyway).
Good for you. I didn't want to pay the shipping and I can afford to wait
a week or two.
> In keeping with nerd tradition I've got the thing all in pieces before even
> powering it on for the first time --
Way to go.
> But the 44-pin connector is right there as promised. I'm thinking of maybe
> doing a tiny PCB rather than soldering 44 individual wires on...
There's great hack running around where you take a regular 44-pin cable
that's long enough and attach a second connector immediately adjacent to
the connector on one end. You use the inner pins of the end connector
and the outer pins on the new connector to attach to the motherboard.
-------------------
|| ||||
^^ (use these "pins")
drive end motherboard end
Since one way to view the problem is that the motherboard connector is
on the "wrong side" of the PCB (causing pin 1 to map to pin 2, etc),
couldn't you do make a cable like this...
||
--------------------
||
Wouldn't that simulate having a connector on the wrong side and reverse
the effect of the motherboard wiring?
> I wonder if there's a +12V source in here anywhere so that standard 40-pin
> IDE drives could be used too and not just laptop drives?
AFAIK, there is no ready source of 12V. Also, consider the power draw. A
laptop drive pulls 500-700mA (2,5-3.5W), a desktop drive draws closer to
9W-15W. It's even a consideration when choosing a different
CPU (ISTR the WinChip180 is rated at ~9W, most Pentia suck around 13-17W).
-ethan
ObClassic: there's plenty of space on the flash disk to stick a small OS
and a variety of apps including Kermit. If you hacked the flash and disabled
the hard disk (or had a way to specify the boot order), you could bring it
up by default into a terminal program and use it as a console if it weren't
running some other app. Yes, a dumb terminal is cheaper and probably more
VT100 compliant (double-high characters spring to mind immediately), but a
real DEC terminal is not as portable.
=====
Even though my old e-mail address is no longer going to
vanish, please note my new public address: erd(a)iname.com
The original webpage address is still going away. The
permanent home is: http://penguincentral.com/
See http://ohio.voyager.net/ for details.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com
I recently ran onto a few 2-1/2" drives of 250 MB capacity and using only 5
volts. These are Quantum drives in case it makes a difference, and claim to
use a maximum of 0.5 Amps. Are these big enough to interest you guys? I
haven't been following this particular thread, hence haven't a clue.
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: Ethan Dicks <ethan_dicks(a)yahoo.com>
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Date: Monday, March 20, 2000 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: iOpener
>
>
>--- John Wilson <wilson(a)dbit.dbit.com> wrote:
>> Mine just arrived this morning, I had ordered it from Netpliance's own
>> 800 # so evidently at least *they* still have stock even if CC doesn't
>> (suits me, the nearest CC is 1.5 hours away from me anyway).
>
>Good for you. I didn't want to pay the shipping and I can afford to wait
>a week or two.
>
>> In keeping with nerd tradition I've got the thing all in pieces before
even
>> powering it on for the first time --
>
>Way to go.
>
>> But the 44-pin connector is right there as promised. I'm thinking of
maybe
>> doing a tiny PCB rather than soldering 44 individual wires on...
>
>There's great hack running around where you take a regular 44-pin cable
>that's long enough and attach a second connector immediately adjacent to
>the connector on one end. You use the inner pins of the end connector
>and the outer pins on the new connector to attach to the motherboard.
>
> -------------------
> || ||||
> ^^ (use these "pins")
> drive end motherboard end
>
>Since one way to view the problem is that the motherboard connector is
>on the "wrong side" of the PCB (causing pin 1 to map to pin 2, etc),
>couldn't you do make a cable like this...
>
> ||
> --------------------
> ||
>
>Wouldn't that simulate having a connector on the wrong side and reverse
>the effect of the motherboard wiring?
>
>> I wonder if there's a +12V source in here anywhere so that standard
40-pin
>> IDE drives could be used too and not just laptop drives?
>
>AFAIK, there is no ready source of 12V. Also, consider the power draw. A
>laptop drive pulls 500-700mA (2,5-3.5W), a desktop drive draws closer to
>9W-15W. It's even a consideration when choosing a different
>CPU (ISTR the WinChip180 is rated at ~9W, most Pentia suck around 13-17W).
>
>-ethan
>
>ObClassic: there's plenty of space on the flash disk to stick a small OS
>and a variety of apps including Kermit. If you hacked the flash and
disabled
>the hard disk (or had a way to specify the boot order), you could bring it
>up by default into a terminal program and use it as a console if it weren't
>running some other app. Yes, a dumb terminal is cheaper and probably more
>VT100 compliant (double-high characters spring to mind immediately), but a
>real DEC terminal is not as portable.
>
>
>
>
>=====
>Even though my old e-mail address is no longer going to
>vanish, please note my new public address: erd(a)iname.com
>
>The original webpage address is still going away. The
>permanent home is: http://penguincentral.com/
>
>See http://ohio.voyager.net/ for details.
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
>http://im.yahoo.com
From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>
> Conclusions for the archives...
> [...] VAXStation 3100/M76 [...]
> On the M76 there is no requirement that the boot disk be smaller than 1GB
> (apparently this is true on earlier models).
It depends on what you mean by required. According to the VMS FAQ
("ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/Digital/dec-faq/OpenVMS.txt", topic VAX5,
"What system disk size limit on the MicroVAX and VAXstation 3100?"):
[...]
Systems that are affected by this limit:
o VAXstation 3100 series, all members. No PROM upgrade is available.
===========
[...]
Generally, as I understand it, the corruption results from the
firmware writing to a too-large disk, as when a crash dump file is
written. As the firmware on these machines mentions both ULTRIX and
VMS, I assume that it is comparably adept at wrapping around at the
1.07GB limit and corrupting a disk with either style file system.
Disks larger than this limit are fine as data disks. (I have a 4GB
disk in my model 38, for example.) They also work fine as system/boot
disks, until something goes wrong, and the corruption occurs. (I boot
my model 38 from a smaller, safer disk.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steven M. Schweda (+1) 651-699-9818 (voice, home)
382 South Warwick Street (+1) 763-781-0308 (voice, work)
Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 (+1) 763-781-0309 (facsimile, work)
sms(a)antinode.org sms(a)provis.com (work)
I just brought one home -- it was an "open box" buy from Circuit City --
$79.95! I haven't plugged it in yet, but I will later this evening...
-- Tony
> ----------
> From: John Wilson[SMTP:wilson@dbit.dbit.com]
> Reply To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Sent: Monday, March 20, 2000 10:40 AM
> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: iOpener
>
> Mine just arrived this morning, I had ordered it from Netpliance's own
> 800 # so evidently at least *they* still have stock even if CC doesn't
> (suits me, the nearest CC is 1.5 hours away from me anyway).
>
> In keeping with nerd tradition I've got the thing all in pieces before
> even
> powering it on for the first time -- boy they sure didn't skimp on screws!
> But the 44-pin connector is right there as promised. I'm thinking of
> maybe
> doing a tiny PCB rather than soldering 44 individual wires on, I wonder if
> there's a +12V source in hear anywhere so that standard 40-pin IDE drives
> could
> be used too and not just laptop drives? The case is *really* cramped
> though.
>
> John Wilson
> D Bit
>
Does anyone have a working NEC PC-8886? I think this is the model
number. It may very well be an NEC APC. At any rate, it would be a
model with 8" drives.
I have some 8" disks (I believe they are single-sided but the box they
came in says "2D" on it; they are 256 byte sectors) containing some
valuable geological data for the country of Guatemala that I am trying to
recover for a geophysicist working on a project in conjunction with the
UN. They contain graphical maps and textual data that would be very
useful for Guatemala.
If anyone can loan me a working NEC computer that can possibly read
these diskettes I'll be sure you share in any praise heaped upon us by
Guatemala, and I promise to share any villager women they bestow upon
me for my efforts. In the very least shipping costs will be reimbursed.
I have an NEC PC that would probably be able to run whatever is on
these things (providing they are still viable) but it doesn't work. In the
meantime I'm going to go retrieve it from my warehouse and see if I can
fiddle with it and coax it to be reborn.
Please reply directly to me as I am not subscribed to ClassicCmp.
sellam(a)vintage.org
Thanks for any help!!!
Sellam International Man of Intrigue and Danger
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Looking for a six in a pile of nines...
VCF Europe: April 29th & 30th, Munich, Germany
VCF Los Angeles: Summer 2000 (*TENTATIVE*)
VCF East: Planning in Progress
See http://www.vintage.org for details!
On Mar 20, 13:23, John Honniball wrote:
>
> On Sun, 19 Mar 2000 21:28:09 GMT Pete Turnbull
<pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> wrote:
> > One of the MCS6550 RAMs has gone west. Does anyone have a spare, or an
> > equivalent, for sale? It's a 22-pin 1024 x 4 200ns static RAM.
>
> I'll have to check the RAMs in the spare PET that I
> keep in the garage. Can't remember whether they're SRAMs
> or DRAMs in the bigger PETs.
Only the oldest 2001-x PETs use those SRAMs. I guess it's time to build
that upgrade board (a PAL, a pair of EPROMS, and some 6264s, a 62256, or
some cast-off PC cache).
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
Thanks Allison,
It has been a while since this--and I don't even have the
machine anymore, but I guess I can consider this debunked.
At the time it was VMS-5.5.4. I was using the machine as
an X-terminal for want of it running real-X.
(http://www.sporner.com/personal/andy_01.jpg
sitting on it's side next to my big Sequent server).
Thanks again!
Andy
> -----Original Message-----
> From: allisonp(a)world.std.com [mailto:allisonp@world.std.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 20, 2000 4:42 PM
> To: Andy Sporner
> Cc: 'Chuck McManis'; port-vax(a)netbsd.org; classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: RE: New drives in the M3100/M76
>
>
> I tried a quantum SCSI I had (120mb) for laughs and it works
> fine after
> test-75, same for a bunch of other brands, some only needed
> to be "init"
> from VMS to be useable. I have no clue as to the fuss. I have:
>
> 1 3100/m76
> 3 3100/m10e
>
> None seems to have much problem with anything I have floating
> around for
> disks save for the 1gb limit on the /m10s for bootable system disks.
>
> Allison
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, 20 Mar 2000, Andy Sporner wrote:
>
> >
> > > It is entirely possible to put non-DEC third party drives in
> > > the VAXStation 3100/M76.
> >
> > Maybe somebody can clarify something for me. I had an 3100/M38
> > a few years ago and had to buy a disk for it. At the time I
> > bought a Quantum 210 MB drive. In order to use it with VMS
> > I had to get a special utility that I ran from my PC with the
> > drive and had to turn off the "Write-Preallocation" feature
> > off on the drive.
> >
> > Is this strictly a VMS thing?
> >
>
>Oh, and don't get me started on RA60/RA80 cables. Those darn things work
>by magic.
What makes them even more magic is that the white ones are different than
the black ones!
Tim.
Conclusions for the archives...
It is entirely possible to put non-DEC third party drives in the VAXStation
3100/M76. I have recently installed two 2.1 GB "Barracuda" drives in them
and they are working flawlessly. The steps are:
Install the drive, select an ID that isn't being used on the SCSI bus.
Run the PROM based formatter on the drive using "TEST 75" to the monitor.
Install your software on the drive.
On the M76 there is no requirement that the boot disk be smaller than 1GB
(apparently this is true on earlier models).
This looks like it will turn out to be a good NetBSD development machine as
it is reasonably fast (7+ VUPs), and reasonably compact as VAXen go.
--Chuck
