- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

> Joachim writes: >> The R? has gotten a mixed reception 'round here Al writes: > The problem I see with the Cambridge examples is students don't LEARN anything > about what they're programming on. They're given a bunch of magic recipes and > don't learn what they're for. What you end up with is what you > could have done with 10 lines of Z80 assembly talking to a terminal through a > UART, but in the example you have to make your own terminal, talking to a big > blob of USB stack and graphics coprocessor glue. It's ironic that it seems increasingly hard to do anything "bare metal" without a graphical UI IDE on a desktop and a USB stack on the "bare metal". I ran across this (probably inadvertent, possibly sly, but still funny and relevant) quote on Wikipedia: "By the late 1960s change was coming: as operating systems and programming language compilers evolved, software production costs were dramatically increasing."

13 years, 10 months

6
7
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Atlantic Research Comstate manual wanted

by greg_sz＠videotron.ca

Are you still lookin for thaat manual ? I have copy of manual of Interview Comstate 2 and Interview 4600. I can copy it and sent to you if you pay the cost. But they are much more sophisticated than Comstate 1 You should be capable to use it without manual is rather simple. If it works correctly. The manuals I mentioned are almost 1" thick each so cost may be significant. Let me know Regards Greg Szymsiak -- Using Opera's revolutionary email client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

13 years, 10 months

1
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VCF Midwest 7

by silent700＠gmail.com

Three weeks to go until the seventh annual Vintage Computer Festival Midwest! I am told there are still a few rooms left at the hotel for those coming in from out of town. Mention "Commodore Expo" for the $69/night convention rate. And of course, the show is free of charge whether you're there to shop, show or sell. September 22-23, 2012 in Lombard, IL (Western suburbs of Chicago, right off a major highway I-355) More information and updates at http://vcfmw.org

13 years, 10 months

2
2
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GNU and the BSD kernel

by lproven＠gmail.com

I am sure I've found reference to this in the past, but my Google-fu is failing me. IIRC in the fairly early stages of the GNU OS project, they looked at and considered using the kernel from BSD - 4.3 Net/1 or thereabouts, I think. I'm looking for more detail or a web reference. I've even found mention of them considering and discarding the UZI kernel, which is what Allison was mentioning in the thread about CP/M-compatible OSs the other day. Could anyone give me a pointer, at all? -- Liam Proven ? Profile: http://lproven.livejournal.com/profile Email: lproven at cix.co.uk ? GMail/G+/Twitter/Flickr/Facebook: lproven MSN: lproven at hotmail.com ? Skype/AIM/Yahoo/LinkedIn: liamproven Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 ? Cell: +44 7939-087884

13 years, 10 months

12
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sortof-OT: bare metal Rπ

by joachim.thiemann＠gmail.com

The R? has gotten a mixed reception 'round here, but here is something interesting: a tutorial of programming the thing (which makes this sort-of kinda on-topic) in bare-metal Assembly; including talking to the graphics chip as a plain bitmapped framebuffer and input from the USB port (the latter using a library, I think). I haven't received mine yet, but I really want to try that out... http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/freshers/raspberrypi/tutorials/os/ -- Joachim Thiemann :: http://jthiem.bitbucket.org :: http://signalsprocessed.blogspot.com

13 years, 10 months

5
5
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CP/M clones & compatible OSes

by jce＠seasip.demon.co.uk

> Any more CP/M-compatible Z80 OSs? ZCN on the Amstrad NC100 portable. Notable because the NC100 used the Z80 NMI, which you can't normally use on a CP/M system what with it being in the middle of the default File Control Block at 5Ch. So ZCN has to go through some elaborate gymnastics involving saving that byte of the FCB and sticking a RST instruction there instead. -- John Elliott

13 years, 10 months

6
20
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Mystery Motorola Chip SC80951S

by asc135＠gmail.com

Every so often, since the beginning of the "interweb," I've wasted a few hours scouring the vast stores of information for a glimmer of data on the Motorola SC80951S chip. All I find are the part pimps peddling them for sums which they'll only disclose if you file a formal RFQ. No datasheets or even a simple description of the part's function can be found anywhere. I amuse myself by wondering if I had somehow acquired some super secret component that played a crucial part in the downfall of the Eastern Bloc. Eventually reality kicks in and I realize it wouldn't have a Motorola logo on it if that was the case. So here I am, before what probably amounts to the most comprehensive brain trust in vintage compute technology, to ask if any of you folks know what this thing is. Here is a link to a photograph: http://www.aximel.com/files/SC80951S.jpg Though I could not focus close enough to get a picture of the wafer, it appears to have some regions that suggest an EPROM memory array, some smaller regions that might be SRAM, and various other complicated looking shapes that may just be a CPU of some sort. I'm mostly interested in learning what it is. But if you can find me a data sheet I'll gladly share half a dozen of them with you. :-)

13 years, 10 months

6
7
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6809 vs 6809E

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

Does anyone know if Motorola ever made 6809s that could function either as 6809 or 6809E depending on some external signal, or perhaps depending on how they were bonded out? The reason I ask is that I've been playing with an SBC designed around a 6809E. While working on writing the monitor on the first prototype, it died with what looked like a bad CPU. So I ordered a replacement, and while I was at it, ordered the parts to populate another board. Both the board with the replacement CPU and the other freshly populated board behaved the same way. After a little digging it appeared that the E and Q clock signals that should be externally driven for a 6809E were being driven by the CPU like for a 6809. I took a chance and rewired it like a 6809 and sure enough it's working now. But after numerous double checks, the chips definitely say MC68B09E/00TA6/HEQB0014. Has anyone seen anything like this? Did I end up getting a couple of chips that were mismarked? Is there a way to make them behave as 6809Es? Thanks in advance, BLS

13 years, 10 months

3
4
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Teletype

by dareckgorecki＠gmail.com

Hello. I'm looking for a teletype in ontario and was wondering if you could recommend someone here in Canada to speak with. Its a very peculiar interest and came across your thread. Any direction is of interest. Thanks.

13 years, 10 months

7
12
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Power supply capacitor tolerances

by derschjo＠gmail.com

Hi all -- Working on recapping an old (failed) 5V supply in that Microkit machine I picked up last week; the main filter capacitor is rated at 16,000uF 15V, axial. So far in my searches an exact (or even close) match in an Axial form-factor seems to be unobtainium. I can find snap-in or screw-in types but those are going to be clumsy to retro-fit given the space it has to occupy. (plus they're pretty expensive.) How far off the original capacitance value can I stray before it compromises the original design? Thanks, Josh

13 years, 10 months

6
8
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Ideal storage conditions

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

> So I finally have one of them fancy dehumidifiers that has a finely > adjustable humidi-stat in the basement to keep the collection dry. Required listening, the Traveling Wilburys "Cool Dry Place". > What's the ideal setting? I know too dry isn't a good thing, for neither > the collection nor my house. Right now I've got it set to 40% and it's > running pretty aggressively. My basement hovers between 55 and 60 degrees > Fahrenheit throughout the year, and the dehumidifier figures out relative > humidity for you. I think 40% is a little too aggressively low and my dehumidifier would run pretty much continuously May-September if I had it set that low. 60% is a better ballpark and only during the most humid parts of summer does my basement dehumidifier run more than a few hours a day. I will sometimes go as low as 30% setting during the summer but only when I want to demonstrate my Wimshurst machine :-) Tim.

13 years, 10 months

4
4
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Microkit 8/16 info?

by derschjo＠gmail.com

Anyone know anything about the Microkit 8/16 computer? I just snagged one off eBay (item 390461957738) -- it looked too cool to resist. Looks to be from the mid-70s, 8080-based, and all I can find on the 'net is very basic information. Anyone have manuals or software? There were two others on eBay, but they appear to have been snatched up in the three minutes I spent composing this mail... - Josh

13 years, 10 months

5
29
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Teletype

by cfox1＠cogeco.ca

At 11:05 AM 02/09/2012, you wrote: >Hello. I'm looking for a teletype in ontario and was wondering if you could >recommend someone here in Canada to speak with. Its a very peculiar >interest and came across your thread. Any direction is of interest. Thanks. If you find two, please let me know. I am also looking for one. Charlie Fox Charles E. Fox 793 Argyle Rd. Windsor Ont. 519-254-4991 N8Y3j8 www.chasfoxvideo.com

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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COSMAC ROM file

by nick.allen＠comcast.net

Hi everyone, Does anyone have the ROM file for the COSMAC (boots into basic OS with ability to load/write to tape, etc). Which model PROM was used with the original COSMAC?

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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Intel multibus disk and ethernet manuals

by aek＠bitsavers.org

I finally turned up copies of the rare iSBC 215 disk controller and 522 ethernet controller manuals. http://bitsavers.org/pdf/intel/iSBC/144780-002_iSBC_215_Generic_Winchester_… http://bitsavers.org/pdf/intel/iSBC/122141-002_iSBC522_Ethernet_Hardware_Re… The 215 was the basis for the DSD/Qualogy board used in the SGI Iris. From memory, the guys that did the Intel board left and went to work for DSD (it is software compatible with the iSBC 215) http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dsd/040040-01_5215_UG_Apr84.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dsd/040069-01_5217_UsersAdden.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dsd/040074-01_6214-6217_UG.pdf

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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Wanted: DEC PDP-8/A power transformer and backplane

by john.ralb＠gmail.com

Recently I found an incomplete PDP-8/a and need the transformer and backplane to start working on it. If anyone has one or both then please let me know.

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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XT-IDE V2 PCBs are here!

by LYNCHAJ＠yahoo.com

Hi! The XT-IDE V2 PCBs have arrived! They are identical to the previous boards. http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/showwiki.php?title=XTIDE+Rev2 They are $12 each plus $2 shipping in the US and $5 elsewhere. Please send a PayPal to LYNCHAJ at YAHOO.COM and I will send your board(s) right away. Thanks in advance and have a nice day! Andrew Lynch PS, please make sure to mention XT-IDE and your *current shipping address* in your PayPal. Relying on my frazzled memory is hazardous!

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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ISO Viewlogic Workview

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Someone is trying to look at some old schematics from around 1992 and asked me if I had a copy.

13 years, 10 months

4
4
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Micropolis 1203 Re: Reviving a PERQ 1a

by rickb＠bensene.com

The Micropolis 1203 has an epoxy encapsulated 16 pin (IIRC) plug that had jumpers in it that controlled low-level things like sector size and header information and some aspects of the transfers to the host. I believe that Tek used some non-standard settings in this plug for the 85xx MDP systems. Years ago I had a couple of these drives and wanted to make them work with a homebrew system that I had built. I had no success in making them work until I stumbled across some data on the drives on microfiche aperture cards at Tek that documented the nature of what was inside this encapsulated jumper block. Once I had this information, I was able to build a DIP header with jumpers in it that allowed me to make the drives work the way that the generic drive docs said they should work. It appears that Tek had ordered the drives in a non-standard configuration to lock folks into using Tek service and replacement drives. This could be why ex-8560 drives do not want to play nice with other computers like the PERQ. Sadly all of was many years ago and the specifics are long gone from my memory and the prints that I.got out of the aperture card readers that had the data about the plug were long ago thrown out. But, I figured that I would mention it here in that it may trigger more detailed information in someone's memory. Rick Bensene -----Original Message----- From: Al Kossow [aek at bitsavers.org] Received: Friday, 31 Aug 2012, 2:42pm To: cctalk at classiccmp.org [cctalk at classiccmp.org] Subject: Micropolis 1203 Re: Reviving a PERQ 1a On 8/31/12 11:42 AM, Tony Duell wrote: > What sort of drive is it? THe Microposls 1203 (8") was used in the 2T1, > the 1300 series (5.25") were used in soem 2T2s. > It is a 1203. I guess we need to keep an eye out for the 1203 manual, since it sounds like you don't have a copy either. I will probably need this at some point to try to figure out why the 12xx series drives out of the Tek 8550 aren't working. I'll have to look in my email to see if I can find the PAL equations you sent. Sometimes things get forgotten if I get busy dealing with other things.

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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Panasonic HHC technical information

by rrr_lopes＠yahoo.com.br

Hello, I'm trying to understand the intriguing Panasonic HHC. Does somebody have additional technical information beside the contents of the User's Manual? I'm particularlly searching for the SnapFORTH ROM image and manual, any hardware schematics, and the expansion connector pinout. I'm also trying to understand the Cassette Tape audio file format. Any information on that will be nice too. Ricardo P.S. Sorry about my limited English vocabulary and eventual (unnoticed) lack of politeness. I'm from Brazil and not English native.

13 years, 10 months

3
2
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Immutable standards (was Re: CP/M clones & compatible OSes)

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

>> I believe both units were made long befroe there _were_ CF or SD cards, >> so I don't see how they could have used them :-) > They were, yes, but then again, there are SD and CF interfaces for > earlier devices such as the ZX Spectrum now, so it is doable. >> Both have RS232 ports, don't they? Surely you can get text off them that >> way? > As I said - an /easy/ way to move data. As I have said before, to your > bemusement or incredulity, I really detest RS232 and have done for > about 25 years now. [...] I really like USB for this. I would propose, as an immutable standard medium for cctalk-relevant micros and some minis, neither SD, nor CF, nor USB. I would propose 110 Baud ASCII via 20mA current loop. Of course that starts off the religious wars as to whether that key in the left corner of the Model 33 ASR is properly labeled "ESC" or "Alt Mode". Tim.

13 years, 10 months

4
3
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Autofax Corp Imager, backup PC to VCR tape

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

> I've got this old 8-bit ISA card on my "interesting to try out" list. > Corvus had a videotape backup and then later a device called the Bank, > but the processing for what hardware I saw was "dumb" just support > logic. The cpu of the PC did the heavy lifting. > The Bank used a corvus network node, I think to communicate, so there > was only a corvus net card in the backup server and software to support > the bank hardware. > I think Alpha Micro had a product too. Their surplus showed up here in > Orange County for a while when they crashed and burned but no software, > sorry, also they had no coprocessor either. And a little higher up on the mini scale, Digidata had a product called the "Gigastore" that was a VHS tape unit interfaced by a Q-bus card and a variant of the Pertec Formatted (two 50 pin cable) tape interface popular for 9-track and some other drives. I used and recovered data from these way back in the 90's. Tim.

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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Autofax Corp Imager, backup PC to VCR tape

by stephen.hunt＠iname.com

I've got this old 8-bit ISA card on my "interesting to try out" list. It's a z80 based "backup to VCR" card by Autofax Corp Imager. The only problem is I've got no software for it. Can anyone help? Interestingly, a dump of the eprom show the text "'MaBr[2.4] (C) 1983-Corvus Systems". Most of the references on the web for this are just adverts http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=0...page&q&f=false http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=0DsEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA28&lpg=PA28&dq=%22auto…

13 years, 10 months

3
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monitor arcing?

by rampaginggreenhulk＠yahoo.com

nicotine stained fingers? ------------------------------ On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:47 PM PDT Fred Cisin wrote: >> > dark powdery residue around power switch. 1986. Simple arcing or an >> > indication of something worse? >> It might also be dried up contact grease.Dwight > >grimy users? > > >

13 years, 10 months

1
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monitor arcing?

by rampaginggreenhulk＠yahoo.com

dark powdery residue around power switch. 1986. Simple arcing or an indication of something worse?

13 years, 10 months

5
4
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Wall warts (was Re: LPC1768 tiny terminal emulator)

by jonas＠otter.se

On Tue, 28 Aug 2012 20:28:07 +0100 (BST), ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) wrote: > Of course wall-warts are country specfic in that the mains voltage and > conenctor are different in differnet countries. So I've probably never > seen a modern one intended for use in the USA and thus UL listed > > But the ones we get over here have no protective devices at all. No fuse, > no thermal fuse. If you are lucky, the resistors in a swithc-mode wall > wart are fusible, flameproof types. Most of the time they are not. In Europe, mains devices have to be CE-certified and display the CE mark. But the manufacturers certify themselves that their products are compatible with the regulations, nobody actually tests them unless it is necessary to prove that they do not comply, e.g. if a competitor reports them to the authorities as being non-compatible, or they are suspected of being the cause of an accident, or they are suspected of being fake. Devices made in China may show the "China Export" symbol, which is very like the CE mark and may be easily confused with it (= is meant to be confused with it?) http://www.icqc.co.uk/en/china-export.php but does not mean that the device complies with EU regulations. /Jonas

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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Forward Electronics KS1-NCD 123KEY SUN TYPE 5 Keyboard

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

Anyone have any experience with these keyboards? I'd be interested in knowing whether the differ significantly in feel compared to the standard type 5. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Forward-Electronics-KS1-NCD-123KEY-SUN-TYPE-5-Key… Thanks, Mark -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://declegacy.org.uk

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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N8 PCB availability

by LYNCHAJ＠YAHOO.COM

Hi Only one of the N8 PCBs remain. Several builders have their and have them working. It is going well so far. Here are some photos of Martin's N8 build http://n8vem-sbc.pbworks.com/w/browse/#view=ViewFolder <http://n8vem-sbc.pbworks.com/w/browse/#view=ViewFolder&param=N8-2312%20Mart in%20Lukasek> &param=N8-2312%20Martin%20Lukasek and some more general information here http://n8vem-sbc.pbworks.com/w/page/54039670/N8%20announcement If you would like to get your own N8 PCB please contact me. I will be gathering up boards for another PCB order soon. The PCBs are $20 each plus $3 shipping in the US and $6 elsewhere. Please send me an email at LYNCHAJ at YAHOO.COM Thanks and have a nice day! Andrew Lynch

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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Acorn Atom - more ebay craziness

by barythrin＠gmail.com

Of course, you know how using ebay for determining the market goes. First sells for exponentially more than common. Another turns up and watch it end at 57.00. ;-)

13 years, 10 months

1
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Wall warts (was Re: LPC1768 tiny terminal emulator)

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

> For linear wall-warts, the transformer primary is _supposed_ > to burn out in a safe manner if the thing is overloaded. My > (accindental) experience is that they do not. The transformer > can get hot enough to soften the plastic case, but it does not burn out. I thought that many (most?) wall warts were "impedance protected". i.e. the winding resistance + inductance of the device is set such that thing might get hot and buzz in a short circuit but will not catch on fire. Like those small AC motor windings. Some folks think UL rating means that the device is reliable, or well engineered in some hypothetical sense, but really what it means is that it won't start a fire. Impedance protection is one of the reasons why unregulated wall warts have such high delta between loaded and unloaded voltage (often as much as a factor of two). They are designed with high internal resistance to provide the impedance protection.

13 years, 10 months

3
2
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Acorn Atom - more ebay craziness

by jules.richardson99＠gmail.com

http://search.ebay.com/251105620795 Hardly Apple I territory, but 1,100.00 GBP (~ 1700 USD) is an incredible amount for a home computer which occupied the middle ground: not as ubiquitous or famous as the Spectrum, C64, BBC micro etc., but not as rare or desirable as those which came before it (ZX80, Acorn System 1 etc.) It's not as though it's an early release or one of the ones sold in kit form. The lack of serial number on the case raises the possibility that the case and PCB weren't paired at the factory (which surely makes it non-original and a mongrel :-) I can't even begin to make sense of most ebay sales, but what do people think? Just someone with rather deep pockets? Or perhaps the seller buying it back themselves in order to create an inflated sense of 'market value' (and with the intention of re-listing it under a different account in a few months)? cheers Jules

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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MINC DECLAB23 complete system and documentation

by fgara＠comcast.net

Please find pictures of the MINC/DECLAB23 in my possession. I am interested in selling all, preferably, or part of the following: http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/2537/img0020lm.jpg http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/6893/img0022gu.jpg http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/7195/img0025n.jpg http://img571.imageshack.us/img571/4470/img0026tk.jpg Boards in the MINC DECLAB23 Chassis: DEC-LAB 1) MINCAG PREAMP 2) MNCAD A/D CONVERTER 3) MNCAA D/A CONVERTER 4) MNCDO DIGITAL OUT 5) MNCDI DIGITAL IN 6) MNCKW CLOCK CPU 1) M7954 2) M8043 3) M8014 4) M8013 5) M8044DC 6) M8044DH 7) M8186 Extras: SPARE 1) M7071 (Wave Generator) 2) M8659 The complete system includes: 1) VT-105 with Graphic Package 2) RL01 2-Bay Hard Drive (Cartridge Type) 3) LA 120 DECWriter III Terminal 4) All Original Manuals (RT-11 and DECLab23), all software Dispatch documentation 5) No. 20 Software Cartridge Disks, No. 3 New Cartridge Disks (all for RL01) For more information please send inquiries to fgara at comcast.net

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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The fall of CP/M?

by alanp＠snowmoose.com

On 8/27/12 10:00 AM, cctech-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > On Mon, 27 Aug 2012, Jim Brain wrote: >> >Can you cite some sources for this position? Sources I have note that >> >Patterson wrote a new OS to go with the Seattle Computer Products 8086 >> >kit and used CP/Ms API to aid in porting apps, but the internals were >> >significantly different. If true, I'm not sure I'd call that a "port". >> >If so, then Linux is a "port" of BSD or ATT UNIX. > I will concede that "port" is a poor choice of terms. > Patterson wrote it as a placeholder. The intent was that they would go to > CP/M-86 when that was ready, and QDOS ("Quick and Dirty Operating System") > was intended as a temporary substitute until then. So, I'm hesitant to > call it a "new OS" > Could you at least spell Tim's last name correctly? It is 'Paterson'. And a recent code analysis indicates that QDOS was not stolen from CP/M - http://m.spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/did-bill-gates-steal-the-hear… If he didn't copy it from CP/M, why isn't it a "new OS"? alan

13 years, 10 months

16
25
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recreation of a nearly 30 year old environment.....

by quapla＠xs4all.nl

For those who are in an exploring mindset, try 'telnet nexus-core.xs4all.nl 10001' uid/pwd guest1/guest1 Ed -- Dit is een HTML vrije email / This is an HTML free email. Zeg NEE tegen de 'slimme' meter.

13 years, 10 months

5
8
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LPC1768 tiny terminal emulator

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Anyone know of any attempts to turn something like this into a tiny terminal emulator? http://www.ebay.com/itm/271016835321 It might also make a cute little simulated front panel for an emulator.

13 years, 10 months

15
50
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LPC1768 tiny terminal emulator

by feldman.r＠comcast.net

>On 8/26/12 10:08 AM, Al Kossow wrote: > http://www.ebay.com/itm/190702111630 > > for example, is $75 (incl shipping) for a whole computer with 7" LCD > > What I was looking for was something really small to lug around when I have to stick > something on a serial port in the back of a rack. I haven't been following this thread too closely, but couldn't you use an HP palmtop (HPLX 200 or HPLX 95)? IIRC, Tony does that with an LX95. Screen is smaller than 7", but they are definitely something "really small" and easy to carry. Also, no need for external power, as they use 2 AA batteries. Bob

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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Ideal storage conditions

by jbmcb1＠gmail.com

So I finally have one of them fancy dehumidifiers that has a finely adjustable humidi-stat in the basement to keep the collection dry. What's the ideal setting? I know too dry isn't a good thing, for neither the collection nor my house. Right now I've got it set to 40% and it's running pretty aggressively. My basement hovers between 55 and 60 degrees Fahrenheit throughout the year, and the dehumidifier figures out relative humidity for you.

13 years, 10 months

2
1
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DSDD in a Kaypro II

by dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu

I have a Kaypro II whos previous owner swapped the two full-height drives for a pair of half-height units and made the resulting space into a cubbyhole for disks and other things. Last time I had a good look at it, I thought the drives were double-sided. Was it possible to get double-sided drives to work with the Kaypro II? -- David Griffith dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?

13 years, 10 months

5
7
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Netboot (Was: The best CP/M machine ever?)

by abs＠absd.org

On 23 August 2012 23:16, Liam Proven <lproven at gmail.com> wrote: [...] > True about the boot code, but the 9512 has a parallel port as well as > its expansion bus connector. > > I've got a serial port cartridge for mine, which I planned to hook up > to my VAXstation as a terminal - only the eBayer who sold me the > VAXstation kept not only the disk, but also the cradle and cable, > replacing which will cost me 30-40? the cost of the VAX. :?( Is it one of the models which uses a non-standard SCSI connection to the board? :/ You could always netboot the VAX and run it diskless (which may also drop the ambient noise by a couple of DBs depending on the vintage of SCSI drive you have :) Over the years I've been an enormous fan of netbootable hardware, including the 90's when I used to netboot, disk format and os re-install suns from another continent... Of course I'm currently using my VAXstation as a netboot and network file server rather than client, but I guess I'm just a little perverse like that... David

13 years, 10 months

1
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The best CP/M machine ever? was Re: Kaypro II

by FJGJR1＠aol.com

Totally agree, but not earlier !!! Incredible ! Frank In a message dated 8/27/2012 9:04:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, cisin at xenosoft.com writes: On Mon, 27 Aug 2012 FJGJR1 at aol.com wrote: > Kaypro / Non - Linear Systems [NLS] were very well run / well known > international companies, that also provided electronic instruments even to the > military & meeting their so very strict standards.. Great stuff. I also loved my NLS215 scope. As to "very well run", . . . how about the "circus tent inventory" issues?

13 years, 10 months

1
0
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DG Nova 3 front panel levers

by shadoooo＠gmail.com

Hello. I have a Data General Nova 3 computer, unfortunately the front panel is missing all of the yellow plastic levers. Anybody has some spare to sell at reasonable price? In the case I cannot find the original levers, I could try to realize a mold to reproduce it using model-casting resins. I would need however some kind of mechanical drawings, or also some good picture made together with a ruler, so dimensions can be somehow measured on the picture itself. An idea could be to use a scanner as imaging device, as it will not deform the image, and to scan the lever, specially on the side. Anybody can help? Thanks in advance Andrea

13 years, 10 months

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The best CP/M machine ever? was Re: Kaypro II

by FJGJR1＠aol.com

I am late getting to these so voluminous threads on Kaypros and CP/M, since I was very busy on many other projects in retirement. But can add my ? two [2] cents from the extensive info I have, if you are interested. =============================================================== I was surprised I did not find a reference to _WWW.VINTAGE-COMPUTER.COM_ (http://www.vintage-computer.com/) site in these posts. A lot of what these threads presented have already been exhaustively explored on that site. In fact we have a very extensive ? knowledgebase on Kaypros? we developed there. As far as selling Kaypros, you are right, certainly less than $100, some for only shipping, since they weigh almost 30 pounds because of the metal case and many for free + many just going to the dumpster. That site has a ?free? [what a nice ?F? four letter word !] marketplace for sales / buying a lot of vintage items. I think eBay does not hit the specific ?target group? for vintage computers like this site does. But you get a lot of global exposure sure + scams that would be quickly exposed on the vintage site.. You just can do a search of that site for a great deal of specific information on so many related topics. Comparing vintage computers to modern ones may be like comparing the ever so popular Ford Model T?s for the commodity market at that time to modern cars today. I have a free download of just a ? draft ? of my extensive book on the early vintage computer era, including Osborne, Kaypro, etc. and many related topics. My presentation at the 2008 Trenton Computer Festival is based on that book and is on their Festival CD. ================================================================= If you want to use just ? sales ? for determining the best, no other computer is even close for the market segment the Kaypro was specifically designed for ? very large common market personal, portable computer ?complete ? - all you needed right out of the box, including software, for a reasonable price ? ?the ordinary computer user ? ? a commodity product. There were many others, but much smaller, less popular and did not last long. ============================================================== Simply, the issue was ?hypergrowth? that is the title of Osborne?s book. Production for both very popular Ocbornes and Kaypros was one shipped every 5 - minutes ? many already paid for and long backlogged ! CP/M was ?the? system at that time, until Gates came along. The real big factor was Compaq ?legally cloning? the IBM system, including the ever so important operating system. Briefly, in the last year before bankruptcy, despite their incredible best efforts, Kaypro lost 89% of their sales and Compaq set a record of $12 million profit of any computer company at that time. Game over ! A new era of computing took off ? I use the image of the? relay race ? ? passing the baton of success to the next better competitor. ? Very bitter memories ?s of such times for many ! But little could be done. Lifespan of many sci ? tech companies is just very short as better products by others continue to evolve ? e.g. evolution ? survival of the fittest =================================================================! Kaypro / Non - Linear Systems [NLS] were very well run / well known international companies, that also provided electronic instruments even to the military & meeting their so very strict standards.. We continue to discover many incredible Kaypros in countries around the world ? specific country names are even on the back panel - how about the German Kaypro with German language on the Kaypro screen ! Many stories to tell. The all metal, practical & well designed case is one reason Kaypros are still around.. You can even stand on them ! The basic case design did not change very much thru all their CP/M models. This is all part of many patterns of my decades of STS ? NSF research [Science, Technology & Society ? National Science Foundation partial funding].. We are seeing it so dramatically today in so many global ways ? HP, Dell, Lenovo, IBM, Mircrosoft, Apple, etc .just in computing alone. A great time of ferment / change, etc. ! Very expected & predictable. The issues are simply better understanding and managing the process, so you can apply it to your everyday lives. Eventually as downsizing / cleaning out in retirement of a very successful, productive, wide ranging career [ never could have ever dreamed of !], my six [6] Kaypro ?8?s ? will be put up for auction as ?packages? with much extra parts, software, accessories, etc. Whatever they bring, that is the then ?fair market value? ? at least they will not go to the dumpster. I will well promote these auctions so all seriously interested can bid. Best might be a ? group ? who would then just ? part them out ? for those seriously interested. I do not have the time with all my STS-NSF research. So all the best in your continued vintage computing exploration. Frank P.S. Post as GADFRAN on above web site. Just do your own research and post it for the benefit of us all ! There is no ? one ? right answer, but many depending on many factors to such complex issues with so many ?tradeoff? that depend on so many other issues. In a message dated 8/25/2012 9:18:55 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ajp166 at verizon.net writes: On 08/25/2012 05:22 AM, Rick Murphy wrote: > At 11:14 AM 8/24/2012, Allison wrote: >> David Gesswein wrote: >>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 12:21:57PM -0400, Allison wrote: >>> >>>> Unlike many when CP/M came about in the mid 70s I'd experience >>>> with OS/8 and TOPS-10 and wished that CP/M was more. >>>> >>>> >>> I haven't used CP/M. What was the significant items that were better >>> about OS/8 than CP/M? I had thought they were similar in capability >>> (and even shared some command names). >>> >> The biggest difference was OS/8 was multi-task/multi-user. > > OS/8 on the DEC PDP-8 was most definitely single-task, single-user. > There were other PDP-8 operating systems such as TSS-8 (EDUsystem-50) > which were multi-task/multi-user, as well as time-sharing systems that > were multitasking. > > You may be thinking about the fact that OS/8 could be run as a > background job as part of RTS-8. > Indeed it can and also under TSS-8. >> It also existed and was more powerful than CP/M years earlier on >> a CPU (PDP-8) that was more primitive. > > I don't know how anyone could call OS/8 more powerful than CP/M. OS/8 > was a very, very simple system. > So Is CP/M. > OS/8 does just a few things: it allows you to read/write files, has a > command decoder, and a keyboard monitor (command line). It has no > services for critical things like console terminal input/output, has a > rudimentary file system, and basically doesn't do much. > And the difference is? > Now, if you replace the "OS/8" above with "RT-11" I'd be in agreement. > RT11 I could consider that almost true. Save for the file system is actually more primitive as it cannot do scatter gather and CP/M does. A partially used RT11 disk with deleted files needs to be compacted to get back the large contiguous spaces same as NS* dos. But it does many other things very nicely. Allison > -Rick > >

13 years, 10 months

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The best CP/M machine ever? was Re: Kaypro II

by barythrin＠gmail.com

To answer your question regarding an original altair price, an 8800 generally sells around $1800 to $3000 depending on what's included and if its shown to work. Quite expensive. I've heard Grant Stockly (hope I'm not missing an 'e' there) is also going to resume his Altair replicas. They're beautiful systems and exact clones but with that level of work it also demands a higher price tag. I think they were running around 1200? So vince's microaltair was a nice clone and smaller on purpose but also a more affordable price. I'm not sure if cpm was available for the apple 1 but thatd be another cheaper option is a replica-1 running cpm.

13 years, 10 months

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cctech Digest, Vol 108, Issue 47

by jce＠seasip.demon.co.uk

Tony Duell wrote: > Using the 8041 as a boot ROM would be problematic IMHO. There could be > code i nthere to preset the boot ROM bytes one at a time on a noraml read > cycle I suppose -- i nfact that could eb why the PROG pin is conencted to > a signal o nteh SIC alled NBOOT. Readign the ROM directly involves > overvoltaging one of the 8041 pins, I can't eee the circuitry to do that. Jacob Nevins describes the boot process as the Z80 sees it, here: <http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~jacobn/cpm/pcwboot.html> Here's the code the 8041 executes at startup: mov r2, #6 ;6 byte prefix mov r0, #prefix call data2z80 mov r1, #0 write_data: mov a, #0edh call byte2z80 mov a, #0a0h ;LDI call byte2z80 mov a, r1 movp3 a, @a ;Followed by the byte to write inc r1 call byte2z80 djnz r2, write_data mov r2, #5 ;5 byte suffix call data2z80 jmp mainloop ;Start doing printer control things. ; data2z80: mov a, r0 movp a, @a ;Next byte to send to the Z80 inc r0 call byte2z80 ;Transmit it djnz r2, data2z80 ret ; byte2z80: jobf byte2z80 ;Wait for Z80 to read the buffer out dbb, a ;Set the byte to write mov a, #0ffh anld p7, a ret ; ; 6-byte prefix: ; prefix: db 0AFh ; XOR A db 0D3h, 0F0h ; OUT (0F0H), A ;Page in RAM at 0000 db 11h, 02h, 00h ; LD DE, 2 ;Start writing data at 2 ; ; 5-byte suffix: ; db 0C3h, 0, 0 ; JP 0 ;Jump to the boot image in RAM db 0D3h, 0F8h ; OUT (0F8h), A ;And stop reading bytes from ;the 8041 -- John Elliott

13 years, 10 months

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Not so classic Compaq keyboard help

by trash80＠internode.on.net

Apologies if this is not classic enough :-) Very quick story - I'm a rather eclectic collector and have a range of very nice early Compaq server gear (couple of servers, a KVM and a hub etc) which go back a way and thought it would all look good sitting in a rack. Recently got lucky and picked up a Compaq rack for free. More recently got even luckier and a friend said her work was throwing out some stuff including a keyboard in a tray. I said I'd have it (like any collector, without knowing exactly what it was - better I have it than its find its way into a bin) - turned out to be a Compaq keyboard (158649-001) in a 1U rack mount keyboard tray - bonus. But when they removed it from the rack instead of removing it gracefully they just cut the cable. Grrrrr - how often does that happen when people are "removing" stuff! The keyboard has a single cable coming out of it with a Y piece that's splits into to 2 PS2 plugs. They cut off the Y piece and the plugs so I'm left with a single cable and no ends. Have been scouring the net for quite a while looking for any specific info on this keyboard to see if I can repair it but no joy. Be most grateful if anyone can point me somewhere I may not have covered. Thank you!!! ++++++++++ Kevin Parker ++++++++++

13 years, 10 months

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identification

by dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu

Can anyone identify any of these unidentified computers at http://starringthecomputer.com/help.php? Sometime a year or two ago we identified a bunch. Let's try it again. -- David Griffith dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?

13 years, 10 months

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relatively recent IBM crt monitor conundrum

by rampaginggreenhulk＠yahoo.com

it's just bugging me. They may not have used them for close to 10 years, but I always used to see these relatively large, I think, 17" IBM monitors at the customer service desk at Walmarts (here in NJ anyway). I don't believe I've seen them anywhere else. Anyone have a clue as to the specifics?

13 years, 10 months

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Need Older PDP-8/I Schematics

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

> From: Vincent Slyngstad <vrs at msn.com> > Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2012 02:00:35 -0700 > Subject: Re: Need Older PDP-8/I Schematics >> >> We are debugging an interrupt problem with the PDP-8/I at the RICM. >> Today we found that the INT RQST signal is not routed through the M117 >> module in slot F11 as shown on page 7 in the >> PDP8-I_CPU_blueprints_1969.pdf. >> >> Does anyone have a set of prints where page 7 is older than revision L? > > > Yes. I have a schematic in which INT_RQST goes to F21D1, F_SET goes to F21E1, and the result from F21F1 goes to the flip-flop at E33J1. > > The ECO added KEY_LAEXDEP_L to the NAND, which required the M117 instead > of the M113. > > The PDF is called "dec-8i-hr2a-d-pr (PDP8i Schematics -- OLD).pdf" on my box, but I'm not sure where I got it. > > Ah. I found it here: > http://pdp-8.org/scans/highgate/pdp8i-docs/dec-8i-hr2a-d-pr.pdf > > Hope that helps! > > Vince Perfect. Thanks! -- Michael Thompson

13 years, 10 months

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New S100 mini front panel project

by rich.cini＠verizon.net

Fellow vintage computing hobbyists -- Don Caprio and I have been working for a few months on a project that's an S-100 card size front panel. Styled after common front panels from the day, it's scaled to fit a standard S-100 card format (5.3" x 10") and includes the usual switches and blinkenlights. Eventually we will open-up the project page (http://fpmini.pbworks.com/w/page/39529866/FP%20Mini) once we clean it up a bit. We just received the latest prototype boards and are going to be building and testing them shortly. We're planning on selling boards and possibly a "switch package" that are miniaturized versions of IMSAI-style paddle switches from NKK. Our goal is to get enough orders to get the board cost down to the $20-25 range. We're also trying to work a deal on switch sets. Although the base of the required switches are pretty common, the bat handle colors aren't (blue and red) and require large minimum order quantities. This is something we're trying to work through with the vendor. In volume, we expect that a full switch set will be in the [$100] range or possibly lower. More info to come on this. So that we can get an idea as to how many boards we may need to make during the initial production run, we'd like to gauge people's interest. There is no commitment at this point ? only an expression of general interest so we can gauge demand and board order quantities. If anyone is interested, please contact me off-list and I'll keep your emails handy. You can also check out the project page (shown above) to get updates. Rich -- Rich Cini Collector of Classic Computers Build Master and lead engineer, Altair32 Emulator http://www.classiccmp.org/cini http://www.classiccmp.org/altair32

13 years, 10 months

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Need Older PDP-8/I Schematics

by michael.99.thompson＠gmail.com

We are debugging an interrupt problem with the PDP-8/I at the RICM. Today we found that the INT RQST signal is not routed through the M117 module in slot F11 as shown on page 7 in the PDP8-I_CPU_blueprints_1969.pdf. Does anyone have a set of prints where page 7 is older than revision L? -- Michael Thompson

13 years, 10 months

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