- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

Homebrew projects wanted for exhibit at VCF 3.0

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

How about building an 'information appliance' toaster, like Microsoft wants you to? For purely parody purposes, of course. Maybe I'll do something like that. Maybe it will have a network card, and I'll demonstrate toaster operation with CGI scripting. And put up a toastercam. I'm not kidding, this seems interesting... > >I don't count 'Insert VGA card tab 'A' into slot 'B'' as being 'building >a computer'. When I talk about building a machine I mean from chips and >wire and hand-etched (or wire-wrapped) boards. > >> If its a computer or controller (or something, haven't gotten around to >> laying out the ground rules yet) and you built it from the chip, >> transistor or sand level, its admissable. > >I personally think that you should remember that when homebrewing was a >lot more common (or was at least a larger part of home computing), a lot >of the projects were expansion cards for the Apple ][ etc. And that there >certainly should be a category for homebrewed cards in commerical >machines. > >> > Does it have to be a complete machine, or will an add-on/interface for a >> > commercial computer count? >> >> Probably, but it would have to do something really cool! Like allow you >> to choose the speed on your blender from a radio-button on your computer >> or something. > >You mean a calculator with a colour video display and a robot arm doesn't >count? No I didn't homebrew the calculator, but everything else is >mine.... Details available from HPCC if you're mad enough to want to >build one... > >Seriously, I wasn't thinking of having the expansion cards in the same >group as totally homebrewed machines (including the CPU). But as a lot of >'classic' homebrewing was interfacing, then it should be included somehow. > >Perhaps have several categories. The ones off the top of my head are : > >Homebrew CPU - Anything where the CPU is not a standard commercial >chip/machine. Homebuilt CPUs from relays, transistors, TTL, FPGAs, etc > >Homebrew microcomputer - Using a standard CPU chip (any), make a computer >not using standard PCBs. A general purpose machine which can run user >programs, I think, though. > >Controller - a homebrew embedded control system using just about anything... > >Interface - a homebrew expansion card/interface module for a (classic?) >computer. > >Homebrew == built from chips/transistors/relays/valves. Not plugged >together from standard boards... > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

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Any *really* homebrewing going on?

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>Homebrewing is still going on. Its just not as prevalent any more because >each year the art dies a little more. I think the tales of homebrewing's demise are being a bit exaggerated. Certainly, the character of homebrewing has changed greatly over the past 20 years. It is true that some of today's tools of the trade - for example, a good PAL/GAL programmer - are more expensive than many of tools of 1975. But in real dollars, today's $800 device programmer is much cheaper than, say, an 8080A CPU, which had a street price of US$250 or so in 1975. And many folks are doing very interesting things with programmable devices. You can get into PIC programming for well under $100, and there's lots of really interesting things you can do with that. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

27 years, 9 months

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Any *really* homebrewing going on?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Take a PIC17C42. This chip executes a respectable number of < instructions/sec out of external memory. Link it up to some EPROMs - 16 < bits wide for the PIC instruction and enough extra bits to control the < data path + rest of the homebrew processor. The PIC is not going to I did that in 1980 using a 8048, slower but the same idea. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Any *really* homebrewing going on?

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>Does anyone have really good references on learning basic computer >design and implementation? To put things in perspective, right now >I'm at a "Getting Started in Electronics" and "Introduction to Digital >Electronics" Radio Shack level -- please hold back your laughter :) The classic reference would be Don Lancaster's _TTL Cookbook_, which is still being published in pretty much its original early-1970's version. For a slightly broader view of electronics - and a very solid introduction to both digital and analog techniques - you'll also want Horowitz and Hill's _The Art of Electronics_. Mr. Transistor Man, here you come! -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

27 years, 9 months

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Any *really* homebrewing going on?

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>hard to come by these days, but how about modern equivalents? I think >that's the lowest level I'll personally go, although it would be really >fun to build a 4-bit computer out of transistors, anything more complex >is probably really difficult. Why not go for a bit-serial (aka 1-bit) CPU? It's an extremely classic design, and is certainly the way to go to minimize total transistor count. >I've got some plans of designing a computer this year. I'll probably >get my feet wet with a simple 4-bit design, but I'd like to do a 12-bit >computer (since my "inspiration" is a PDP-8). The PDP-8/S is a -8 done in a bit-serial implementation. 78 microseconds for some instructions! If you don't mind making about a 15-year advance in the electronics you'll be using, you might also seriously consider making a CPU via the state machine route, using an EPROM and some counters. All math and logic operations can very easily be done via table look-up in the EPROM. This is a rather common assignment in lower-level computer engineering courses, as it's something that can be easily wire-wrapped in an afternoon or two, and it is extremely easy to try new microcode revisions. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

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FW: pdp11/44 free to good home in TX

by kyrrin＠my-dejanews.com

My God... as little as six months ago, 11/44's seemed rare. Now it seems like they're coming out of the woodwork! Another free system over in Texas. Contact the fellow directly if interested... -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On 2 Oct 1998 02:01:12 GMT, in alt.sys.pdp11 you wrote: >>From: "Eric" <evb(a)citx.com> >>Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp11 >>Subject: pdp11/44 free to good home in TX >>Date: 2 Oct 1998 02:01:12 GMT >>Organization: http://www.supernews.com, The World's Usenet: Discussions Start Here >>Lines: 13 >>Message-ID: <01bdeda9$0467a840$22a442c6(a)moonpie.citx.com> >>NNTP-Posting-Host: 198.66.164.34 >>X-Trace: 907293672 0R4SAZH0CA422C642C usenet54.supernews.com >>X-Complaints-To: newsabuse(a)supernews.com >>X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 >>Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!spamkiller1.cwix.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!199.60.229.5!newsfeed.direct.ca!Supernews73!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail >> >>11/44 CPU >>TS11 tape drive >>(2) RK07 disk units >>many rk07 packs >>decwriterII >>vt100 terminal >>manuals, service history >>unit operational at de-installation >>deinstalled from a school >> >>30 days and it's going to the metal scrapyard, would rather see her have a >>good home. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies -- kyrrin (at) jps [dot] net Web: http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin "...No matter how we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them..."

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Any *really* homebrewing going on?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< and peripherals together to make a (shudder) PC. I'm talking about < *REAL* iron (or aluminum.) Starting from basic relay, transistor, or I Lessee, I do much of my own bent metal, cases cost! I've been building hardware for far to many years to count. < (SSI or MSI only!) and rolling a machine the "hard way." Recreations o Even the 8008 was considerd LSI! < old machines (i.e. building your own PDP-1) would make a very < interesting discussions. Difficult as well as where down one get core these days? I'd love to build a PDP-8 from the ground up using current (nonFPGA) tech. For the moment I've building up a z80/s100 crate and doing a z280s/CPM project for my self. Allison

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pdp11/44 free to good home in TX

by dburrows＠netpath.net

I was sort of interested but the shipping cost Vs what I have on hand was a debate. I see by a recent posting he has had several offers. If he had some unusual peripherals I would not have hesitated. Thanks Dan -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Lane <kyrrin(a)my-dejanews.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, October 03, 1998 1:08 AM Subject: FW: pdp11/44 free to good home in TX My God... as little as six months ago, 11/44's seemed rare. Now it seems like they're coming out of the woodwork! Another free system over in Texas. Contact the fellow directly if interested... -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On 2 Oct 1998 02:01:12 GMT, in alt.sys.pdp11 you wrote: >>From: "Eric" <evb(a)citx.com> >>Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp11 >>Subject: pdp11/44 free to good home in TX >>Date: 2 Oct 1998 02:01:12 GMT >>Organization: http://www.supernews.com, The World's Usenet: Discussions Start Here >>Lines: 13 >>Message-ID: <01bdeda9$0467a840$22a442c6(a)moonpie.citx.com> >>NNTP-Posting-Host: 198.66.164.34 >>X-Trace: 907293672 0R4SAZH0CA422C642C usenet54.supernews.com >>X-Complaints-To: newsabuse(a)supernews.com >>X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 >>Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!spamkiller1.cwix.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!199.60.2 29.5!newsfeed.direct.ca!Supernews73!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail >> >>11/44 CPU >>TS11 tape drive >>(2) RK07 disk units >>many rk07 packs >>decwriterII >>vt100 terminal >>manuals, service history >>unit operational at de-installation >>deinstalled from a school >> >>30 days and it's going to the metal scrapyard, would rather see her have a >>good home. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies -- kyrrin (at) jps [dot] net Web: http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin "...No matter how we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them..."

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BA123 Power Supplies

by dburrows＠netpath.net

I have some complete BA123 supplies here. I also have 4 BA123 chassis that are on my trailer that is heading for the scrap dealer. The ones on the trailer have been outside for a while but you can have anything you want >from them. I also have numerous BA23 chassis inside - just let me know what fried. Dan Burrows dburrows(a)netpath.net -----Original Message----- From: Zane H. Healy <healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, October 03, 1998 3:04 PM Subject: BA123 Power Supplies If it isn't one problem it's another. Last night I left the PDP-11/23+ (still haven't gotten it to work with a /73 CPU board) running for about 4 hours to see how it handled being left on. The only thing running was "show mem" on the console since I was working on some other stuff. Much to my terror/irritation, about 10pm I noticed a buzzing or sparking sound. I quickly moved it away from the sofa, and started investigating. It sounds as if something in the area where you've got the breaker and the powercord plugs in is 'arcing and sparking'. I've got to take off in a little while, but I plan on looking into this later this afternoon or tonite. Unfortunatly I don't have any docs on the BA123 (just the BA23), so will be having a fun time figuring out how to get it apart. Does this problem sound familiar to anyone, and does anyone have any suggestions? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 9 months

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New to the list

by Aaron_J_Hayden＠student.ferris.edu

Howdy all, My name is Aaron Hayden and I have recently joined the list. Currently in my collection I have a C64, a PC Jr., a Hero robot and my trusty 486-66. I enjoy using the older systems and in some cases I think they're a bit more user friendly (at least for me). I was looking for some info on my PC Jr. and found the list. I'm sure I'll gain some knowledge and hopefully give some too. Which brings me to my first question... I was just recently given the PC Jr. however it seems it doesn't work. I have only plugged it in a couple times but haven't looked at it much more than that. I also do not have any documentation on it so I'm flying blind. When I turn it on the screen turns all grey. Anybody have this problem before? It has been sitting for a while but worked fine until it was boxed up. It came w/ two power supplies so maybe their both bad? Any ideas? thanks in advance. Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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No subject

by Aaron_J_Hayden＠student.ferris.edu

Thanks for all of the responces. They're very much appreciated. At any rate, while attempting to keep my first message short I left out some important info. So we'll see if this clarifies any? I have a 4863 monitor (which does not use the RCA plug). This computer has two floppy drives and two cartidge slots. Which slot is primary? The left I assume. With the machine I got a BASIC cartridge, three DOS 2.1 disks, and a couple DOS 3.21 disks. However, I don't think the computer is trying to boot. That is, it's not reading the drive (red LED doesn't light). I didn't get any manuals with it, although I'm sure I have the monitor plugged in right. It only can go in one plug, one way. The keyboard however, can go in a lot of places, but which one? It came w/ two power supplies and the computer acts the same with either one. (I have not had a chance to check them with the info I've got so far). I do not have a logic analyser (but I do have a RCA signal generator used to work on t.v.'s if that can be used i n any way). Again, thanks for the help and I hope this info helps too. Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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Robot Odyssey

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

> From: "D. Peschel" <dpeschel(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Robot Odyssey? > > I hope I didn't mention this before... > > I'm looking for any versions of a game called "Robot Odyssey". It was written > by The Learning Company and is a very unusual combination of an electronics > simulator and a 2-D adventure game. A two minute search on Yahoo have me this archive directory: http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/mac/apple_II/images/educational/robot_odyssey/ > The Apple ][ version sold especially well; there were three versions (1.0, > 1.1, 2.0). I own an original copy of 1.0. I _had_ an original copy of 2.0 > and sold it, and still feel really stupid. The only pirated copies are 1.0. > > However, there were also versions for: the IBM PC (definitely exists), the > Tandy CoCo (almost definitely exists), and the Commodore 64 (probably exists). > TLC may have promised others (Atari?) which were never released. > > I'm posting here because: > > - The kind of geeks on this list would probably love this game. :) > > - The Apple newsgroups are a waste of time. > > - No one at the VCF had any idea what I was talking about. When I went to school they had PETs... > - Maybe someone knows the authors of the program? The receptionists > at TLC are (obviously) clueless, but I've heard that even talking > to higher-up people there is a waste of time. (This is from a Web > site I found.) So if there's any chance of getting "inside" info > on the program, the authors are it. > > Thanks, > > -- Derek -- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Larry Anderson - Sysop of Silicon Realms BBS (300-2400bd) (209) 754-1363 Visit my Commodore 8-Bit web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/commodore.html -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

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ESDI, MSCP, RSX11M, TK50's, etc.

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>of my parts and tapes. I discovered that I've got two ESDI controllers, >instead of the one that I knew about, one is a Emulex QD21 which I found >the manual online for, the other a "Webster WQESD" which I have the manual >for. Which version of WOMBAT is on your WQESD? You can identify this by either looking at the sticker over the firmware EPROM, or if this doesn't tell you, by starting up the on-board diagnostics. Certain versions of Wombat do not interact well with RSX-11M's DU driver. Very often, older versions will work better than certain newer versions. Most of my systems are running WOMBAT V2.3, which works fine for me with the PDP-11 OS's (but *not* with later VMS versions.) WOMBAT V2.3 does work a little strangely with 2.11BSD's MSCP driver when you do a "shutdown -r", having something to do with the CPU doing a bus reset while the controller is still doing a write. I've never attempted to compile a list of which versions of the PDP-11 OS's do and do not work with various WOMBAT versions, but perhaps it would be worthwhile to build such a table. As it is, I just pop in different firmware EPROM's until it works. It's also worth checking that the WQESD really does respond to the CSR you think you've set it to. The table in your manual is probably correct for the most common address configuration PAL, but there are several dozen different address configuration PAL's that were made for special applications. If you have one of these non-standard PAL's, you'll probably be much better off to put the WQESD at 17772150 and the floppy controller at some other CSR. --- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

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Free racks, DC area

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

Available immediately: Two computer racks. One is a ~7foot tall Sun rack, regular 19" rail spacing, vented top, and nice side panels. The other is a System Industries rack, about 5 feet tall, with regular 19" rail spacing and an additional area to the right holding the power distribution system. The SI rack has a bank of 120VAC fans on top for cooling, too. You pick up in Bethesda, MD. I'll help load them onto your truck. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

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VCF Press Clippings

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Allow me to introduce you to my vanity: http://www.vintage.org/vcf/press.htm VCF press clippings for the past year or so. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 09/21/98]

27 years, 9 months

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Damn

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Came close to finding the cable for my laptop by instead found some audio cables that probably belong to either Rax or Roger. I'll be in SF next so I'll try to bring them and drop them off with Roger since I know about where he lives. Can Rax and Roger please check their audio gear and see if my laptop cable got mixed in with some of theirs? You'll know it when you see it: normal wall plug on one end (three-prong) and a funky three-prong on the other that looks like it can't belong to anything but a stupid Compaq laptop. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 09/21/98]

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Guardian article

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Here's the Guardian article for those who were interested in reading it. Copyright 1998 Guardian Newspapers Limited The Guardian (London) October 1, 1998 SECTION: The Guardian Online Page; Pg. 4 LENGTH: 739 words HEADLINE: Not just any old iron;A festival of vintage computers threatens to rewrite computing history. Karlin Lillington reports BYLINE: Karlin Lillington BODY: Computing history is clear - microprocessors were invented by three engineers at Intel in 1971. Or were they? That notion was disputed in a press conference at the Vintage Computer Festival in Santa Clara, California on Saturday, when an obscure computer consultant from San Jose revealed that he initiated work on a secret onboard computer for the US Navy's F-14A TomCat fighter jet that contained a chipset comprising three microprocessors and three support chips - in 1968 (and completed in 1969). According to 53-year-old Ray Holt, the Navy has only now released documents allowing him to publish the details of his work. Holt read out an analysis >from a former chip designer for Motorola, Russell Fish, which stated his belief that, had the microprocessor design been made public in 1969, it would have advanced the industry by five years. However, two of the Intel engineers involved with the creation of the 1971 microprocessor, Ted Hoff and Federico Faggin, have already disputed the claim in a Wall Street Journal article, centring on the correct definition of a microprocessor (six chips should not qualify, according to the two). Whoever deserves the laurels, the achievement of Holt and his small team was astonishing for its time. In today's world of finicky microprocessors, which overheat easily, the chips in Holt's F-14 could function at the temperature of boiling water - in a range of -55C to +125C. Because of size and weight restrictions for the F-14, the circuit board was an extraordinary 6 by 4 inches for a highly sophisticated flight computer that analysed and controlled altitude, angle, speed, missile systems, positioning of the movable wings, and other functions. Machines of similar power at the time weighed 300-400 pounds. 'I think as computer designers and people interested in history, we need to know this happened,' says Holt. 'That back then, we could do this.' Other hardware at the show at least enjoyed a moment of fame - however fleeting. Who now remembers the MAD Computer, the Sol, the Exidy Sorcerer or the Czech -designed Tesla 780, which used a TV set as its monitor? Most people might see the machines as just back-of-the-garage dust magnets, but hardcore computer buffs were entranced by these footnotes to the history of computing, lovingly displayed at the show. Organised by a Sam Ismail, a goateed, hyperactive young programmer who started his own collection of 200 machines 11 years ago at age 17, the festival attracted several hundred devotees. The kind of person who thrills at the mention of the Altair, the kit-built, embryonic personal computer from 1975. Some came for the computer flea market, others to hear such speakers as computer designer turned Microsoft researcher Gordon Bell (who admitted during his talk on the prehistory of personal computers that he proposed to his wife using a program he created at DEC). But the festival's soul lay in the impromptu museum of geriatric hardware. Sitting among neat rows of his Commodore PCs, exhibitor Larry Anderson explained the motivation for collecting what others send to the landfill: 'Nostalgia. This is the type of computer I went to school and used,' he says, caressing the metal casing of a 1977 Commodore 2001 series PC. The machine boasts 4 kilobytes of memory - in comparison, computers today routinely come with 4,000 times as much. 'Chips were so unreliable that the Commodore came with a spare,' says Anderson, pointing to an extra chip taped into one corner of the box, like an extra coat button. The manufacturer warned that chips frequently came loose and needed to be pushed back down. The Atari manual, he says, actually recommended dropping the machine from three to four inches if it wasn't working properly. Nearly every species of computer basked in visitors' attention: the 1975 prototype Apple I, screwed onto a piece of plywood by Apple founders Steve Wozniak and Steve Jobs; the first IBM PC, and the first Sun micro computer. The crowning event was the Super Nerd computer quiz, covering such categories as computing acronyms, computers in the movies and 'Nerdpourri'. Ismail conducted the entire quiz - to much general admiration - from behind the green -screen glow of an Apple III from his collection. Ray Holt's paper on the F-14A computer's architecture is at www.microcomputerhistory.com The Vintage Computer festival is at www.vintage.org/vcf/ Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 09/21/98]

27 years, 9 months

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Great Find

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

On Wednesday I got a IBM AS/400 model 9404 for free, it is just the CPU unit with the front cover missing. It had two keys with it along a 5 1/4 FD and a tape backup unit installed. I've been trying to get some information about >from IBM's web site but not much luck. Hope to fire it up soon. John

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Can anyone identify this vax for sale on Ebay?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>< IIRC the Pro 325 uses an F11 as well, although I've not seen one. > >The pro325 and 350 are the same machine save for the 325 is floppy only >and the 350 had floppy and hard disk. Right... >< I am not suprised. Although there's a PDP11 CPU in there, the I/O ><system and interrupt structure is nothing like any other PDP11... > >the primary thing was the memory mapped video. the PDT-11 also had >strange IO. The PDT-130 and -150 both used the same device driver (PD), though they would display as different device codes, if I remember. The interesting thing about them was the fact that the firmware knew about RT-11 queue elements, so all the driver had to do was take the queue element and pass it to the ROM, which handled the IO, returning if there was an error, or when the request was satisfied. The driver then returned to the monitor the completed queue element. The PDTs were also interesting in that they used an 8085 (later an 8085A) to handle the IO page. Word accesses were about 90ms, byte accesses were about 180ms if I remember correctly, and we had to avoid any read-modify-write instructions (BIS/BIC) otherwise it would take twice as long as the 90ms/180ms... Finally, an interesting point, the PDT-11/110, which had no storage devices, had code in ROM which understood the same protocol as the GT40 for downloading code... Somewhere I have a program I wrote for use at a science fiction convention (worldcon-1980, in boston) where I used a PDT-11/150 to download a GT40 with various programs like lunar lander or roses, or bowling, etc... (The favorite, of course, was lunar lander) Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 9 months

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FS: Apple Lisa System on Auction

by gmast＠polymail.cpunix.calpoly.edu

I was a member of this list for quite a while but the mail load got to be too much for my school account. I have placed an Apple Lisa 7/7 on the eBay auction recently. The bidding ends on Sunday the 4th of October. It's a nice system and I posted a ton of pictures at my page: http://www.calpoly.edu/~gmast/sfs/lisa/lisa.html The bidding hasn't been that great so I think this system will go for a good price. It will sell regardless. If this post offends anyone, I apologize but I know some people here might want one of these for their collection and this might be a good opportunity. For more info, check out the auction listing at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=32694351 and check out the pictures at the link above. The bidding must take place through the auction now that I've listed it. Bidding is free but you must register with the auction. Thanks, Greg

27 years, 9 months

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Computer Museum of America

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Has anyone been to the Computer Museum of America? It's near San Diego, California. URL is http://www.computer-museum.org/. Looks interesting, but I'm using Lynx at the moment and can't see anything. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 9 months

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VCF mentioned in UK newspaper

by pjoules＠joules.enterprise-plc.com

There was write up of the VCF in todays Guardian, it included a picture of an Altair and a wooden Apple, along with an account of Ray Holt's talk. It also says the it was organised by "...Sam Ismail, a goateed, hyperactive young programmer who started his own collection of 200 machines 11 years ago...". Is this a fair description Sam? ;-) Regards Pete PS Congratulations, Sam, on what seems to have been a very sucessful event.

27 years, 9 months

3
2
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Robot Odyssey?

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

http://members.aol.com/Fractal101/odyssey.htm Kai -----Original Message----- From: D. Peschel [mailto:dpeschel@u.washington.edu] Sent: Friday, October 02, 1998 4:08 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Robot Odyssey? I hope I didn't mention this before... I'm looking for any versions of a game called "Robot Odyssey". It was written by The Learning Company and is a very unusual combination of an electronics simulator and a 2-D adventure game. The Apple ][ version sold especially well; there were three versions (1.0, 1.1, 2.0). I own an original copy of 1.0. I _had_ an original copy of 2.0 and sold it, and still feel really stupid. The only pirated copies are 1.0. However, there were also versions for: the IBM PC (definitely exists), the Tandy CoCo (almost definitely exists), and the Commodore 64 (probably exists). TLC may have promised others (Atari?) which were never released. I'm posting here because: - The kind of geeks on this list would probably love this game. :) - The Apple newsgroups are a waste of time. - No one at the VCF had any idea what I was talking about. - Maybe someone knows the authors of the program? The receptionists at TLC are (obviously) clueless, but I've heard that even talking to higher-up people there is a waste of time. (This is from a Web site I found.) So if there's any chance of getting "inside" info on the program, the authors are it. Thanks, -- Derek

27 years, 9 months

2
1
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Tandy 1000's

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Is there any interest in Tandy 1000's? As far as I can tell, they all look like basic systems with 2 floppies. May have some matching monitors. Local non-profit has a bunch (from a school) and doesn't know what to do with them. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 9 months

1
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DOS Floppy format (Was: Universal drive

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Since this is about DOS, which is >10, I think it's postable. What I'm wondering about is the entire format description, like the FAT, sector headers, everything. >> OK, next question. While I look for weird expansion cards, is there >> any book that I stand a chance at finding which details the DOS flopy >> format? > >Are you looking for the DIRectory structures, track layout (sector >headers and the like), or explanation of MFM? > > >ADMIN Q: Should those items get posted here, or taken private? > >-- >Fred Cisin cisin(a)xenosoft.com >XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com >2210 Sixth St. (510) 644-9366 >Berkeley, CA 94710-2219 > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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FS: Aquarius Personal Computer, Model 5931R

by oajones＠bright.net

I recently aquired a Aquarius computer. http://www.chez.com/samurai/ORDIS/aqua.htm This computer is working and is in good condition. It can be yours for $20 plus shipping costs. I don't have any documentation or software to include--sorry. If anyone is interested in it please send me email. --Alan -- Computing since: 1982, VIC-20, CoCo, PC, CP/M Military Computers: COMTRAN 10, Nida 250 Amateur Radio since: 1971, WN8JEF, KA6EXR, N8BGR, AA4ZI BASIC, dBASE, Assembly, C++ http://www.bright.net/~oajones

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Universal drive

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Nothing universal. Let me break this down by type: CP/M and Related Formats: Teledisk will read most CP/M and related formats on double-density (MFM) diskettes. Standard IBM PC floppy controllers are physically unable to read single-density (FM) formats (for some reason, even though the Western Digital chip they used supported FM, they never connected the pin. The Teledisk folks have some instructions to modify old IBM controllers). Teledisk can also read CP/M and related formats on FM diskettes with an appropriate floppy controller (e.g. CompatiCard, or modified IBM controller). Some CompatiCard versions will also allow connection of 8" drives to an IBM compatible. If you find a CompatiCard for sale, buy it. Non-CP/M Related, Non-Apple Formats: Teledisk does not read other FM formats that are not similar to CP/M (e.g. TRS-80 Model 1). I'm not aware of a solution to read/write formats such as TRS-80 Mod1, Coleco, Atari 8-bit, etc. Later TRS-80's like the Model 4/4P can read TRSDOS diskettes and copy the files to CP/M format which could then be read with Teledisk. Apple II: There is no physical way to read an Apple II diskette on IBM floppy drives. There are 3 solutions: 1) Use a Trackstar 128 card in an IBM compatible; 2) use a //e emulation card in a Macintosh LC series, then copy to PC format if necessary; 3) Copy the 5.25" Apple DOS files to 3.5" ProDOS format on a //e equipped with 3.5" and 5.25" drives, then use an old Apple File Exchange on a Mac to read the ProDOS disk. Macintosh: All Macs with SuperDrive/FDHD drives can read/write PC format. To read Mac dual-density format on the PC, you can either copy the files to PC format on a newer Macintosh (be SURE to keep the disk write protected or the newer Mac will automatically screw it up so it won't read properly on your old Mac!) or you can use a Central Point Copy II Option Board Deluxe on an IBM compatible. Others: Atari ST uses DOS format in the first place. Amiga can be read on the PC by Amiga emulators. C64, I have no idea, but I know at least you could use a C128 to copy files to CP/M format. NOTE that if you don't want to actually access FILES, but just want to COPY the disk, all you need is a Central Point Option Board in an IBM compatible. I use my "Compaq Computer" (a.k.a. Portable I) with an Option Board to copy any SD/DD format, including Apple II. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Max Eskin [mailto:maxeskin@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, October 01, 1998 4:36 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Universal drive Is there a device that would allow _any_ disk, independently of format, including Apple ][ disks, to be read? I know Teledisk can do this for all conventional formats, but not Apple disks. It would be nice to connect one of these and read the disk image into a file. The main reason why I ask is for rescuing messed up floppies... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

6
5
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Robot Odyssey?

by dpeschel＠u.washington.edu

I hope I didn't mention this before... I'm looking for any versions of a game called "Robot Odyssey". It was written by The Learning Company and is a very unusual combination of an electronics simulator and a 2-D adventure game. The Apple ][ version sold especially well; there were three versions (1.0, 1.1, 2.0). I own an original copy of 1.0. I _had_ an original copy of 2.0 and sold it, and still feel really stupid. The only pirated copies are 1.0. However, there were also versions for: the IBM PC (definitely exists), the Tandy CoCo (almost definitely exists), and the Commodore 64 (probably exists). TLC may have promised others (Atari?) which were never released. I'm posting here because: - The kind of geeks on this list would probably love this game. :) - The Apple newsgroups are a waste of time. - No one at the VCF had any idea what I was talking about. - Maybe someone knows the authors of the program? The receptionists at TLC are (obviously) clueless, but I've heard that even talking to higher-up people there is a waste of time. (This is from a Web site I found.) So if there's any chance of getting "inside" info on the program, the authors are it. Thanks, -- Derek

27 years, 9 months

1
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Can anyone identify this vax for sale on Ebay?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< IIRC the Pro 325 uses an F11 as well, although I've not seen one. The pro325 and 350 are the same machine save for the 325 is floppy only and the 350 had floppy and hard disk. < I am not suprised. Although there's a PDP11 CPU in there, the I/O system < and interrupt structure is nothing like any other PDP11... the primary thing was the memory mapped video. the PDT-11 also had strange IO. Allison

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Universal drive

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > this for all conventional formats, but not Apple disks. It would be < > nice to connect one of these and read the disk image into a file. < > The main reason why I ask is for rescuing messed up floppies... Apple used GCR coding for their drives and there are no commonly available chips that do. In fact the apple does not use the traditional floppy disk controller chips at all. The FDC logic on the Apple is rather simple and the CPU provides the brains as a software FDC. It was part of the idea of using software to replace hardware to make the machine simpler and less expensive. < PCs use a disk controller chip based on an NEC 765 design that can not < read ANYTHING other than MFM (some can also do FM), with IBM 3740 style Excuse me! That is patently incorrect! If you qualified that as *most PC controllers cannot read some formats* that would be true. The 765 and all of the chips based on the 765 core can read FM encoded disks. It's not always possible with PC based designs as some are hardware crippled (sloppy data sep circuits) and most of the PC bios code is marginally brain dead. However the 9266, 37c65 and 92c665 have been seen doing FM. In the mean time my S100 card design and the compupro DISK1A both happly read 8" SSSD (FM) disks and even single density 5.25 media. < The Western Digital disk controller chips (179X, before they changed ove < NEC style) could do a reasonably real track read of anything MFM < regardless of sector header structure. Try the 765 read diagnostic command. Hex 02 (fm) or 42 for MFM. <They were used in TRS-80s and a LOT of machines OTHER THAN PC. The TRS80 used the 1771 that was FM only. the WD 177x or WD179x still cannot read an apple disk. Allison

27 years, 9 months

4
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Seeking: ASR-35/37 TTY - trade ASR-33 ?

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

Opening mostly says it all... I'm looking for an ASR 35 or 37 teletype. Offering an ASR-33 as all/part trade. So... if you have one that is just too darn big, and want something smaller, (and are hopefully in the Oregon/Washington area or have a shipper with a sense of humour) lets talk! -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

27 years, 9 months

1
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Need info on Teletype

by g＠kurico.com

Just picked up a couple of terminals. A Teletype 3320 and (from memory here) DECWriter III. Any information on the teletype would be greatly appreciated (like how to interface to it, it has some small centronics type connector on the end of the cable). As for the DEC, I'll give it to anyone who wants to come pick it up in the Central Texas area (Austin specifically). It's untested and the best I'd be able to do anyway is to see if it powers up. I'll give it about a week before I trash it unless someone can convince me otherwise. George

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Xerox 16/8

by Innfogra＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-10-02 13:36:17 EDT, you write: << Answering an ad for a "Xerox 16/8 Computer," I found out that the computer was actually an 820 II that was in possession of a Xerox employee prior to the seller. He (the seller) told me that the 820 was upgraded to be "just like" a 16/8, and judging by the haphazard looking innards (things jammmed into slots, tape holding things together, etc.), I think I believe him. I also got 3 or 4 binders for a 16/8 computer but all the pictures inside show a standard looking PC style desktop case. Which is the "real thang?" >> The answer is both. Most 16/8s that I have seen are 820 IIs that have been upgraded to 16/8s. This explains the tape and wires. At one time I had gotten the upgrade kit myself. I never installed it because I found a factory 16/8. It looked just like my 820 II with a different bezel. When the IBM PC was introduced the market for these dropped considerably. Xerox was selling into the business market at about a $2000 price point. It was adapt or die. Xerox redesigned the case to look like the new PCs. Printed new manuals. They died anyway The winds of change were blowing. If you find one of the PC versions of the 16/8 save it. There are very few of them. Most of Xerox's production run was remaindered. I saw them surplus for a couple of years. I bet most of them were scrapped. I have never seen one with the PC style case. I have manuals with pictures too. You may be right on the drive interfaces although all the drive boxes use the same 50 pin plug. I would have to do some research. Paxton

27 years, 9 months

1
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Fwd: Osborne 01

by Roger＠Sinasohn.com

This is too high for me, especially since I just got one for free yesterday but it sounds like a nice package (with the separate monitor, if it's an Osborne monitor.) Contact the seller, not me; I know nothing other than what you see below. ----------------------------------------- >From: "Don Gatterman" <dgent(a)gte.net> >Subject: Re: Your Internet web page re the Osborne 01 / I still have it,... Haven't gotten back to selling it..... > >It is the Blue-Gray model and I am asking $225.00 , or best offer, plus >shipping if necessary. This would include the computer and printer, and >separate monitor, all cords, software, and periodicals. Thanks for your >note. Please feel free to call me at ( 360 ) 352-1883 if you hear of >anyone who might be interested. > > Thanx Don > > >PS, I am the sole original owner, and it is in excellent condition... > >-----Original Message----- >>>originally purchased through Sears and has a built-in Osborne add-on >modem, >>>Star Micronix printer w/ cable, separate monitor, Kleertex keyboard >>>template for Osborne with Wordstar commands etc. Any interested party may --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 9 months

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Can anyone identify this vax for sale on Ebay?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>The Professional 350 uses a PDP11 CPU (F11 or J11 depending on the >machine). It runs P/OS (== cut-down RSX with a menu shell on top) or >Venix. Oh, I think RT11 as well. The PRO-350 used the F11 (Fonz) chip (same as in an 11/23). The PRO-380 used the J11 (Jaws) chip (same as an 11/73). Oh yeah - and RT-11 sure does run on them! We got it working on the PRO back in 1980... You should have seen some of the things we had to do to get it running, though... Some PRO strangeness - it has a 64hz clock... so, for RT-11 to emulate a 60hz clock, it counts 15 clock ticks and throws one away... :-) The PRO-380 doesn't have cache, but if you *turn off* the non-existent cache (using the cache control register), the machine slows down to 11/23 speed! Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 9 months

2
1
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Universal drive

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< We appear to differ only on the definition of "PC". Apparently we do. To me A PC is any machine fromthe IBM PC on including clones. < The PC disk controller, AS IMPLEMENTED BY IBM, did NOT provide access to < all of the capabilities of the 765. In particular, FM can NOT be done < with that board unless you make a few modifications, or replace it with < any of the better designed after-market boards. Tell me. I worked for NEC Microcomputers then and we sold IBM the 765. We were in shock at what they had done as the standard design we used that the time was far more capable. < With the 37C65 and the like, the switch between MFM and FM can be done < entirely in software, not requiring the extra hardware gate needed for The only dirfference from 765 to 37c65 is that the 37c65 has ALL the logic we'd wished IBM to use back then. My S100 contrtoller runs all the possible fm/mfm formats and was a design that predates the IBM kluge. < > In the mean time my S100 card design and the compupro DISK1A both happ < > read 8" SSSD (FM) disks and even single density 5.25 media. < < An excellent choice for the task. Both run the basic 765A < The TRS-80 model I did indeed use the 1771 (FM). Data separation was po < done, and there were after market boards to patch it. I know I worked for them too. They were always looking at the cheapest worst solution. Remember these are the same guys that brought RAS*/CAS*/MUX across from the main console with bad enough timing that the EI didn't work most of the time if it had ram. < and so did the TRS-80 model 3 and 4. But Radio Shack made some WEIRD < design decisions regarding use of Data Address Marks. Deliberate attempt on their part to keep trsdos on their systems only and part lack of knowledge. < Absolutely correct. But they CAN read some MFM formats that do NOT have < IBM style sector headers, unlike the 765 series. Considering it was never designed for anything else it sorta begs the question... Why blame the cow for soggy cereal? The WD 17xx series FDCs were good chips but several things from that era would scare off people using them... One, they did at times ship known bad chips. Two, some of the support parts like the 1691 were late or didn't work. Three, there werent intel so intel one they had the license and die to sell the 765 as the 8272 would "kit" the FDC with the 8085 or 8088 to lock out WD and other competitors. The other part was people often abused the 1771 such that even the 1791 couldn't read the disks! < There were several add-on boards for PCs for dealing with Apple ][ disks < including the Apple Turnover and Matchpoint. They installed between the Or the trackstar128 which could not only read and write apple disks it could also run apple software. Allison

27 years, 9 months

2
1
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Xerox 16/8

by lfb107＠psu.edu

At 10:11 PM 10/1/98 EDT, Innfogra(a)aol.com wrote: >The Xerox 16/8 is a desktop CPM Computer of the mid 1980s vintage. It has both >8 and 16 bit processors in the cabinet. I believe the original computer was >based on the UK Big Board design. The 16 bit processor is on a propriatory add >on card. It runs CPM-80 & CPM-86. If I remember right it will run an early >version of MS-DOS. Yep, mine came with MS-DOS 2.1 >It has been years since I have run mine. My 2nd computer was a Xerox 820, an >earlier model. I was delighted when I got a 16/8. > > It uses external drives which you may not have gotten. The disks availiable >were dual 8" floppys, dual 5" floppys or a 8" Floppy and 8" HD. You could use >only one set at a time. Brian of Emerald Microware (business no longer in >existance) in Beaverton, Oregon made a data sharer that would alow you to hook >up both 5 & 8" drives at the same time. He supported this family of computers >for many years. It was a nice machine. OK, I'm cinfused. Answering an ad for a "Xerox 16/8 Computer," I found out that the computer was actually an 820 II that was in possession of a Xerox employee prior to the seller. He (the seller) told me that the 820 was upgraded to be "just like" a 16/8, and judging by the haphazard looking innards (things jammmed into slots, tape holding things together, etc.), I think I believe him. I also got 3 or 4 binders for a 16/8 computer but all the pictures inside show a standard looking PC style desktop case. Which is the "real thang?" >There are two styles of keyboards, the original which is bulky and a low >profile which uses a different ROM. The basic computer consists of three >pieces, the Monitor/CPU, a keyboard and a drive cabinet. > >I have docs, drives, cpus and parts if you want to communicate with me >directly. Another note. The seller said that there were a number of different drive interfaces available for this model and that if you plugged the wrong one in it wouldn't be pretty. (I think it depended on which of the above combos you got: fd/hd, fd/fd, etc.) Mine is a SASI interface, i think (8"FD/8"HD) Les

27 years, 9 months

1
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Fall Edition: CP/M Users Group Swap Meet

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

For those in the N.W. Oregon area (or those that need an excuse to be there!) --- The 'n'th Annual Fall edition of the CP/M-UG Computer and Electronics Swap Meet will occur on Saturday October 10th. (n'th annual 'cause we lost track many years ago!) It will be held in the lower level of the Senior Citizens Center on Omera, just south of the Tigard City Hall on Hall Blvd. As always, it's Free, Easy, and Non-Fattening! (except perhaps to your wallet or garage, depening on your approach!) Bring your Junk, your Treasures, and your Wallet! The only rule is... Leave Nothing Behind! (NO garbage service!) Address: 8815 S.W. Omera (Just south of Fanno Creek on Hall Blvd.) Tigard, OR. Hours: 0800 to 1500 or whenever the good stuff runs out! (8am to 3pm for the layfolk) Fees: No charge! (we pass the hat for contributions) NOTE: Tailgating is encouraged! Some of the best deals are made in the parking lot! (Warning: Oregon is entering the rainy season!) A limited number of tables are available on site. Plenty of space to bring your own. "Those who are late do not get fruit cup!" See you there! --- For details, or directions (fairly easy to get to from I-5 or Oregon-8) just drop me a note. -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Universal drive

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

You know, I've been wanting to get one of these 'CatWeasels' so I could make Commodore disks. I've never met anyone who has purchased one of these. If any one here has, I'd like to hear about it. BTW-- DOes anyone know what a Central Point 'TransCopy 3' board does? It's an ISA floppy interface, but that's about all I know about it. I picked up someplace, and I don't even know if there's software for it . . . . Jeff On Thu, 1 Oct 1998 17:04:03 -0700 Paul Kearns <paulk(a)microsoft.com> writes: >> Is there a device that would allow _any_ disk, independently of >> format, including Apple ][ disks, to be read? >> >You can look at http://members.tripod.com/~apd2/catweasl.htm for an >ISA card >that'll (allegedly) read several MFM and GCR formats, including >Commodore, >Amiga, FAT, Atari, Macintosh, and Apple //. > >I haven't ever used one, so I can't comment on its reliability, but it >might >be worth investigating. > >Paul Kearns >paulk(a)microsoft.com > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

27 years, 9 months

3
2
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Ties caught in printers.

by ccm＠sentex.net

Dah. What could be more fun eh. But seriously folks, I have too many email accounts and I consistently bore this august group with my personal replies. Please excuse me once again. And Dougie, you better be kidding... IBM did similar thing at a graphics conference in the early 1980s. Over a week they installed a 3090 on the show floor. I hear there is a time-lapse video of the event. OK, who's got something big enough, close enough, in working condition, and knows how to do a professional install? We know you're out there. >On Thu, 1 Oct 1998, Unusual systems wrote: > >> Here's an idea for 3.0...get somebody close by with a working, large mini >> configuration or small mainframe and have them spend all day assemblying and >> wiring and booting it and demonstrating it the next day. A good full install >> should day all at least. > >There goes Kevin trying to scare off collectors again! Let's demo both >the install and the de-install and simulate a tie getting caught in the >line printer, the 600 lb disk drive dropping on toes, a couple of >high-voltage mishaps, and the disk-drive-as-fly-wheel effect as the truck >drives away and then tips over when it tries to make a turn. :-) > >-- Doug > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------- Kevin Stumpf * Unusual systems +1.519.744.2900 * EST/EDT GMT - 5 Collector - Commercial Mainframes & Minicomputers from the 50s, 60s, & 70s and control panels and consoles. Author & Publisher - A Guide to Collecting Computers & Computer Collectibles * ISBN 0-9684244-0-6 .

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Fried PDP-11 -> Panic Mode Off

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

OK, it just booted. The only difference was I turned the VT420 off, and the BA123 had been sitting powered off while I wrote my panic message. I decided to give it one more try before crashing for the night in dispare. I'm totally confused. Either it needed to sit for a few minutes, or the terminal needed power cycled. Or maybe it was waiting for me to panic and act foolish :^) Argh! Ideas? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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I think I fried a PDP-11

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

OK, I had the PDP-11/23+ board in place, and the system loaded up. I was testing out the memory boards I've got by swapping them in. It didn't seem to like a pair of clearpoint memory boards I've got, and then I put in the M8637-EC board, and NOTHING works. It won't even come up with the info on the /23+ ROM. I've a very bad feeling about having put ECC RAM in it. I went so far as to pull out all the boards, nothing. I swapped the /23+ with a /73 and still nothing! What on earth did I do? The diagnostic LEDs on the /23+ are D1, D2, and D4 unfortunatly the manual I've got on the board doesn't seem to explain what the LEDs mean. It's as if I managed to fry the backplane, but that really doesn't make sense. Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 9 months

1
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Fwd: PCjr's Available in Utah

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

If interested reply to Joseph Kimball instead of me. Zane >Date: Thu, 01 Oct 1998 10:40:14 -0600 >From: "Joseph Kimball" <HPJKimba(a)ihc.com> >To: healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com >Subject: Re: classic computers > >I am in Utah. >I actually have two PCjr monitors, three PCjrs with 128k, and one sidecar >with 512k, and one sidecar with a parallel port, and one sidecar with a >voice synthesizer, and one external floppy drive. >The floppies don't work properly, and will only occaisionally boot to DOS. >- Joseph > >- Joseph Kimball >IHC Health Plans >Service Desk > | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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pdp-11/44, contact poster

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Xref: world alt.sys.pdp11:5205 >Path: world!blanket.mitre.org!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!Supernews73!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail >From: "Eric" <evb(a)citx.com> >Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp11 >Subject: pdp11/44 free to good home in TX >Date: 2 Oct 1998 02:01:12 GMT >Organization: http://www.supernews.com, The World's Usenet: Discussions Start Here >Lines: 13 >Message-ID: <01bdeda9$0467a840$22a442c6(a)moonpie.citx.com> >NNTP-Posting-Host: 198.66.164.34 >X-Trace: 907293672 0R4SAZH0CA422C642C usenet54.supernews.com >X-Complaints-To: newsabuse(a)supernews.com >X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 11/44 CPU TS11 tape drive (2) RK07 disk units many rk07 packs decwriterII vt100 terminal manuals, service history unit operational at de-installation deinstalled from a school 30 days and it's going to the metal scrapyard, would rather see her have a good home.

27 years, 9 months

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New to the list

by Innfogra＠aol.com

It would have to be PC-DOS 2.10. Version 2.11 was MS-DOS i think. I have a copy of 2.10 on the shelf with the book. I don't know anything about PC Jrs though, with the exception of a thrift store here in Portland, OR that has a monitor for one. If you are interested in the SW contact me directly. I was actually looking for DOS 1.XX to see if I might have it. I don't but I ran across the book set marked 1.01 for the 3270 PC. I got excited but what was inside was PD-DOS 3.0. Oh well, such is life. I have lots of versions of PC-DOS 3.0 & 3.1, and a couple of MS-DOS 2.11 for other computers that I am interested in unloading. Any interest out there. Paxton Whoagiii(a)aol.com

27 years, 9 months

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VCF mentioned in UK newspaper

by kstumpf＠unusual.on.ca

Nice going ace! Here's an idea for 3.0...get somebody close by with a working, large mini configuration or small mainframe and have them spend all day assemblying and wiring and booting it and demonstrating it the next day. A good full install should day all at least. >On Mon, 31 Aug 1998, Pete Joules wrote: > >> There was write up of the VCF in todays Guardian, it included a picture >> of an Altair and a wooden Apple, along with an account of Ray Holt's >> talk. > >Oh good! Is there a pointer to this article on the web? If not, could >you PLEASE transcribe it for me and e-mail it along? (PS. the wooden >Apple would probably be the Apple 1). > >> It also says the it was organised by "...Sam Ismail, a goateed, >> hyperactive young programmer who started his own collection of 200 >> machines 11 years ago...". Is this a fair description Sam? ;-) > >Pretty much. Except it understates the total number of machines in my >collection :) > >> PS Congratulations, Sam, on what seems to have been a very sucessful >> event. > >Thanks! > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Ever onward. > > Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 > See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! > [Last web site update: 09/21/98] > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------- Kevin Stumpf * Unusual systems +1.519.744.2900 * EST/EDT GMT - 5 Collector - Commercial Mainframes & Minicomputers from the 50s, 60s, & 70s and control panels and consoles. Author & Publisher - A Guide to Collecting Computers & Computer Collectibles * ISBN 0-9684244-0-6 .

27 years, 9 months

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Apple <> Orange 386?

by Innfogra＠aol.com

Hi Joe; Nice find. Almost any NEC multisync momitor will work. There is a adapter that goes from 9 pin to apple for the older multisync monitors and another 15 pin to Apple for later monitors. I can get them here in Portland, Oregon at Oregon Electronics. You should be able to find a cable house in your neighborhood that has the adapter or a cable that would work. Other monitors like the Sony should work also. Paxton

27 years, 9 months

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Xerox 16/8

by Innfogra＠aol.com

The Xerox 16/8 is a desktop CPM Computer of the mid 1980s vintage. It has both 8 and 16 bit processors in the cabinet. I believe the original computer was based on the UK Big Board design. The 16 bit processor is on a propriatory add on card. It runs CPM-80 & CPM-86. If I remember right it will run an early version of MS-DOS. It has been years since I have run mine. My 2nd computer was a Xerox 820, an earlier model. I was delighted when I got a 16/8. It uses external drives which you may not have gotten. The disks availiable were dual 8" floppys, dual 5" floppys or a 8" Floppy and 8" HD. You could use only one set at a time. Brian of Emerald Microware (business no longer in existance) in Beaverton, Oregon made a data sharer that would alow you to hook up both 5 & 8" drives at the same time. He supported this family of computers for many years. It was a nice machine. There are two styles of keyboards, the original which is bulky and a low profile which uses a different ROM. The basic computer consists of three pieces, the Monitor/CPU, a keyboard and a drive cabinet. I have docs, drives, cpus and parts if you want to communicate with me directly. Paxton Whoagiii(a)aol.com

27 years, 9 months

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New to the list

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 10/1/98 9:33:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time, wpe101(a)banet.net writes: > Hello Aaron, welcome to the list.. I dealt with a PC jr a few years ago, > and iirr, it didn't boot itself, you had to insert a dos (gawd help me > what version) floppy to get it to boot. No clue as to whether that's the > problem, but I'd suggest you try it. it's just like a standard pc in that if you have a boot floppy, preferably dos 2.1, it should load. or, if a cart is in one of the two front slots, it should load off of that. the disk drive in it is the same as the slim height floppy drives the portable pc used. david

27 years, 9 months

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FW: 1 Meg uVax memory boards $10

by kyrrin＠my-dejanews.com

If anyone needs a couple of memory boards for their MicroVAX, here's a fellow offering a couple of 1 meggers dirt cheap. -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On 1 Oct 1998 22:42:23 GMT, in comp.sys.dec.micro you wrote: >>From: neil(a)skatter.usask.ca (Neil Johnson) >>Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec.micro >>Subject: 1 Meg uVax memory boards $10 >>Date: 1 Oct 1998 22:42:23 GMT >>Organization: University of Saskatchewan >>Lines: 13 >>Message-ID: <6v10gf$84k$1(a)tribune.usask.ca> >>NNTP-Posting-Host: hydrus.usask.ca >>X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0] >>Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!uunet!in5.uu.net!newsfeed.xcom.net!newsfeed.cwix.com!192.26.210.166!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!canopus.cc.umanitoba.ca!tribune.usask.ca!not-for-mail >> >>I have two M7607 memory boards for sale. I believe they are >>1 Meg boards for a microVax. They have a connector near the >>handles for data/control signals; my understanding is that >>they are unusable for a normal PDP11 Qbus system. >> >>Asking $10.00 each or $10.00 for two -- I just want to >>avoid throwing them out, and also want it to be worth my while >>to package them up. Sorry, no documentation available. >> >> >>Neil >> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies -- kyrrin (at) jps [dot] net Web: http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin "...No matter how we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them..."

27 years, 9 months

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