test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by herby1620＠yahoo.com

ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) said: > > Not so useful with peripherals though, I find a storage scope is > > invaluable for them, the more traces the better, so I suppose a logic > > analyser would be useful, but does one exists for MINUS 6.3 volt > > logic? I always presumed they were only invented after silicon > > replaced germanium and so only work with positive logic voltages. > > I fail to see what silicon .vs. germanium has to d owith the polarity of > the logic cignals. In general PNP transistors, and for that matter PMOS > fets, imply -ve logic levels, and plenty of machines were built using > those components. Also ECL chips have -ve logic levels (around -2V) wrt > ground. But... Logic levels are different when using PNP transistors. IBM in its SMS series cards used "S" levels (+S and -S) which were -12 and 0volts. Commonly germanium transistors were PNP, and the Vcc rail was a negative voltage (in the case of SMS cards -12 volts). If you have a logic analyzer, you can TRY to use it by connecting the ground level reference to -12 volts and hope that something doesn't blow because the analyzer's ground is now at -12 volts and logic levels go "up" from there. It usually helps to have a NEMA adapter (ground lifter) to isolate the third prong ground on the power connector (it has been known that some people cut off this connection). On PMOS levels (intel 4004 was an example) they used +5 for Vdd and -9 for Vss as I recall. You needed pull downs to -9 on some pins to interface with TTL. PMOS wasn't the easiest to interface with non-PMOS stuff (but it was done). ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

18 years, 1 month

HP 9100 spotted, need value

by innfoclassics＠gmail.com

I found the Holy Grail in a computer thrift shop but they wont sell it to me because they do not know what it is worth and they think it is a lot. A nice HP 9100, fairly clean, some stickers, and complete. Not been fired up and I told them not too. I offered the $60 as it was all I had and they wouldn't take it. I think they are going to want a lot more. So the question is what is a reasonable price for the holy grail sitting on a shelf. Paxton -- Paxton Hoag Astoria, OR USA

18 years, 1 month

New finds

by quapla＠xs4all.nl

Just got back from collecting a few PDP related items. About 30 pocket books 1968 - 1980, a vaxmate with expansion box, software & manuals Microfiches with reseller price lists, a bunch of flip-chips with blue, white, red & greeb handles, apparently for the PFU of a PDP-9, 2 RS-03 (04?) disk platters, one woth groves, the other almost mirror finished a PDP-8/a user manual, a 3 volume PDP-8/e/f/m user , internal bus & external bus maintenance manual and some odd bits & pieces like motor brushes for a TU-10. Ed

18 years, 1 month

"First" (was: Apple ][/II/2

by cclist＠sydex.com

> Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2008 06:27:52 -0500 > From: "Greg Manuel $V$" > > On Mon, 3 Mar 2008, Josef Chessor wrote: > > > Wait! The Chinese and the abacus get first dibs! =D > > > > followed by Antikytheria > > > Never said it was the first, just said I was pretty sure that it qualified > as vintage. LOL I use my fingers for computation. I'd try to guess something earlier, but I have no idea what fish or bacteria use. Cheers, Chuck

18 years, 1 month

COMPAQ bag, 386 SBC, NCR 53c710 development kit, VGA card

by vax9000＠gmail.com

These are available from Ohio, US. If no one wants them in a few days, I am going to throw them away. shipping charge only. The bag is for the Compaq portable. Shipping $10 in the main chunk US. 53C710 development board (ISA) with manual. Detailed information of the 53C710. Shipping $10 in the main chunk US. 386 SBC board is the same as this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/Citadel-Single-Board-Computer-3-Real-Time-OS_W0QQitemZ1… Shipping $10 in the US. I will combine the VGA card with it. For the above items you can choose actual shipping cost or choose the above mentioned fixed charge. Let me know, thank you. best, vax9000

18 years, 1 month

Apple ][/II/2

by roger.holmes＠microspot.co.uk

> From: Jim Leonard <trixter at oldskool.org> > Subject: Re: Apple ][/II/2 > > IIRC, the "][" was only adopted after people saw it on the Apple IIe's > bootup screen. Not true. It was on the case of the Apple ][ years before the lower case 80 column model was introduced. Roger Holmes, Part owner of an Apple dealership since 1980.

18 years, 1 month

Uniplus manual set

by dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu

I have a set of Uniplus manuals (flavor of Unix from circa 1990) that I've run a few times on Ebay. The thing weighs 11 pounds. Whoever wants it can have it for cost of shipping (which by media mail won't be much). -- David Griffith dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?

18 years, 1 month

Apple ][/II/2

by cclist＠sydex.com

Cameron Kaiser wrote: >Except, in UNIX, one can have a completely *valid* filename with >slashes in it. Or almost any other character in the system >character-set really. Why all this talk about U**X? CP/M allows pretty much anything in a filename. I'm particularly fond of the file names with backspaces and carriage return-linefeed pairs in them. The problem with using "][" instead of "II" that text-to-speech programs get tonguetied trying to parse it. :) Cheers, Chuck

18 years, 1 month

old monitors

by rtellason＠verizon.net

A guy is offering me a pile of old monitors, he describes as "mono, cga and ega", probably about a dozen or so altogether, and presumably all working. I don't have anything that currently uses any of these interfaces running at the moment. Any interest in anybody taking these off my hands? -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, ?a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. ?--Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin

18 years, 1 month

Q-bus to CF

by bqt＠softjar.se

"Bob Armstrong" <bob at jfcl.com> skrev: > >> Sridhar Ayengar (ploopster at gmail.com) wrote: > >> Or if you're willing to write an MSCP layer into your controller firmware. > > I actually think this is the "right" way to solve the problem in the case > of the PDP-11 and VAX, but then controller is no longer a simple device. I'd say it would definitely be the right way. What people seem to forget (or ignore) is that unless you decide to emulate an existing DEC device, you not only need to write a device driver for the OS, which sure is some work, but doable. But you also need to write some bootstrap code, which needs to be placed in a rom. That will quickly get a bit more ugly... There is a big difference to a PDP-8, which this has been compared to up until now. The PDP-8 is really simple in design, and so is booting one, usually. A PDP-11 is way more complex to boot. Not only do you need the initial boot code, in the boot ROM. You then also need the bootstrap for the OS, which resides on disk. I don't know about RT-11, but for RSX, this is a separate piece of a driver which in no way is related to the device driver that you use once the system is booted. And this piece is tightly integrated with the OS and is embedded deep inside stuff. So, unless you want a disk that you can't boot from, you have a big chunk of work to get it working. So doing an emulation of an existing device makes much more sense. And of all the existing devices, MSCP is by far the best choice when picking something to map to modern hardware. Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

18 years, 1 month

front panel display for a modern PC

by roger.holmes＠microspot.co.uk

On 2 Mar, 2008, at 14:41, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > Message: 12 > Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 23:19:43 -0800 > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > > Well, if I were debugging hardware, I'll take a logic analyzer and a > scope, thank you. I'm not sure how broad the range of hardware > faults is that a bunch of blinking LEDs will indicate. I find that about half of all CPU faults on my 1301 can be found from the front panel, but then it is a remarkable front panel. I can slow the clock rate down to three pulses per second and watch the individual steps in each instruction, watch data shifting through the registers, watch the carry bits in the mill, watch the instructions shifting through the registers etc. I can even run it at one pulse per button press and change the data in the registers and create parity errors and write them to core and read them back and watch the parity checker do its stuff. Not so useful with peripherals though, I find a storage scope is invaluable for them, the more traces the better, so I suppose a logic analyser would be useful, but does one exists for MINUS 6.3 volt logic? I always presumed they were only invented after silicon replaced germanium and so only work with positive logic voltages. Probably out of my price range anyway for home use.

18 years, 1 month

Looking for Quadra 900/950 in Puget Sound area...

by trag＠io.com

> Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 20:50:43 -0800 > From: Josh Dersch <derschjo at msu.edu> > Anyone got one they're looking to get rid of/sell/trade? My venerable > IIfx's RAM has gone bad and rather than pay stupid prices for 64-pin > simms (which are just going to be harder and harder to find) I'd like to > get something that takes standard stuff. And while I'm doing that I > might as well get something large and heavy :). > > Thanks! > Josh 30 pin SIMMs in the 16 MB capacity aren't exactly falling off of trees these days, either. :-) Of course, if you're happy with the smaller capacities, then they almost are. And the Q9xx does have 16 SIMM sockets... I've been making 16MB SIMMs for the IIfx, so one could argue that they are not getting more rare, unless they are being lost by the population faster than I am making them. However, the prices may be stupid. I mainly sold them on Ebay and the prices for a set of four ranged from under $30 to over $250 with somewhere in the $120 - $150 range being typical. Right now I have components for several more sets, but have been overwhelmed with other priorities and have not assembled any more sets. Jeff Walther

18 years, 1 month

Is there a program to analyze a mag tape

by sieler＠allegro.com

Re: > I a have a lot of mag tape/cartridge tape that I would like to analyze. I may have misinterpreted your post. Are you trying to analyze the data currently on the tapes, or analyze the quality of the tape (trashing any data currently on the tape)? For the latter, I've got one (TAPECHK) for the HP 3000 which I'd be happy to send you ... but it's not readily portable to other platforms, unfortunately. (I originally called it TapeAnal, for "tape analyzer", until I re-read that name one day :) Stan -- Stan Sieler sieler at allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html

18 years, 1 month

Is there a program to analyze a mag tape

by sieler＠allegro.com

Re: > I a have a lot of mag tape/cartridge tape that I would like to analyze. > > I there a program that would write the whole tape then read it back, > logging the retries and the errors. Eric Smith has "tapecopy", which copies tapes to disk in a simple format. I think a number of people use that ... but I don't recall it logging error information. I've got my own TAPEDISK, which does something similar. My format allows me to record which records had errors or retries, where setmarks are (for DDS), and optionally internally compress the data (using open source zlib). If anyone's interested in my format, I'd be glad to open it up. At present, I use it mostly to read/save tapes on HP 3000s (where tape blocks can exceed 64 KB). Stan -- Stan Sieler sieler at allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html

18 years, 1 month

HP 87 computer/calculator?

by dbetz＠xlisper.com

When I was at the VCF in Mountain View this past fall, someone in the concessions area had an HP 87 computer/calculator for sale. Does anyone remember who that was? I find I'm getting interested in the HP 8x series. Thanks! David Betz

18 years, 1 month

cctalk Digest, Vol 55, Issue 10

by mtapley＠swri.edu

At 22:32 -0600 3/3/08, "Merch" wrote: >Now you've given me one heckuva reason to spark up the latest Vcc (that's >not +5v, it's the latest virtual CoCo[1] from David Keil) & try it on OS-9. > >[1] http://vcc6809.bravehost.com/ Dang it! Somebody needs to donate a Mac or linux box to David Keil, because I really like CoCo3's but I really don't ... <flame-bait deleted> -- - Mark, 210-379-4635 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Large Asteroids headed toward planets inhabited by beings that don't have technology adequate to stop them: Think of it as Evolution in Fast-Forward.

18 years, 1 month

Craigs: Apple // 80-col cards

by silent700＠gmail.com

Not mine, just spotted them here locally: http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/sys/594539036.html

18 years, 1 month

Looking for Quadra 900/950 in Puget Sound area...

by derschjo＠msu.edu

Anyone got one they're looking to get rid of/sell/trade? My venerable IIfx's RAM has gone bad and rather than pay stupid prices for 64-pin simms (which are just going to be harder and harder to find) I'd like to get something that takes standard stuff. And while I'm doing that I might as well get something large and heavy :). Thanks! Josh

18 years, 1 month

VCF East 5.0

by evan＠snarc.net

Since Pat F. is holding VCF Midwest early this year, we decided to balance things out by holding VCF East later this year. So, VCF East 5.0 will be the weekend of September 13-14. Same place as the last two years -- InfoAge Science Center in Wall, New Jersey. This year there's no special theme, but there will be a special event -- the beta opening of our computer museum. We're going from the current 12x10-foot "preview" room into 800 sq. ft.! Details to be announced later. - Evan

18 years, 1 month

*nix & slashfilenames

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

From: Roger Merchberger <zmerch-cctalk at 30below.com> > > Rumor has it that Tim Riker may have mentioned these words: > >timr at slop:~$ touch \/path > >touch: cannot touch `/path': Permission denied > >timr at slop:~$ uname -a > >Linux slop 2.6.24-timriker #1 SMP Sun Feb 17 01:36:19 MST 2008 i686 > >GNU/Linux > > > >which *nix are you on? just curious. > > I was too, because it didn't work on this either: > > Linux mail.30below.com 2.4.20-8 #1 Thu Mar 13 17:18:24 EST 2003 i686 athlon > i386 GNU/Linux > > Maybe 2.2? Taking a look at the ext3 source (it's in my mental cache from the book project), there's no escaping of the '/' character. In __link_path_walk(), it clearly splits on '/' and doesn't look at the previous character at all. To bring it back on topic (and because I was curious), I just pulled out my copy of Lions and in 6th edition namei(), it's the same thing. It definitely loops looking for '/' with no regard to the previous character. So, the old and the new both do not recognize a file with '/' in the name. I'm not sufficiently motivated to look through the BSD FFS :-) BLS

18 years, 1 month

RSTS/E DECNET installation guides / pointers / tips?

by glen.slick＠gmail.com

Just out of curiosity I installed RSTS/E 9.6 on a SIMH PDP-11 and thought I'll try to install DECNET 4.1, but I've come up empty trying to find any info on how that is done. I know almost nothing about RSTS/E yet but I'm trying to slowly learn. I figured out that I could RESTORE INSTAL.BCK from the DECNET 4.1 tape image and that resulted in just a few files, one of which was DECNET.COM. That appeared to be an installation script, but it is not clear if that is something that is intended to be manually invoked, or if something else invokes it. I tried invoking it manually with some guesses for the parameters, but that didn't get me anywhere. Is there an installation guide on the net somewhere that I haven't been able to find? Does anyone have a sample SIMH session transcript showing the proper way to install DECNET 4.1 on RSTS/E 9.6?

18 years, 1 month

Apple ][/II/2

by roger.holmes＠microspot.co.uk

On 3 Mar, 2008, at 22:19, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > > Message: 30 > Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 22:16:03 +0000 (GMT) > From: Andrew Burton <aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk> > > > If the name is printed on the machine (as is normally the case), > then use that version! :) I just got one of mine off the shelf and the lid of the case is labelled "apple ][ plus", without even a capital 'A' as the curve of the lower case 'a' fits into the bite in the apple logo. I think the titles on the cover of the four main manuals also said "][" on them, but I have not checked them. I can't actually remember what they were all for, there was the main reference manual with the circuit diagram in the back which was very useful for the odd machine which misbehaved when first delivered before being shipped to customers - in several instances I traced IC leads which had missed their sockets which were either bent underneath or down the side. There was a manual for DOS 3.3 and its utilities . I think there was an Applesoft manual. I can't remember what the other one was. It was not integer Basic, I never saw a manual for that. Of course there were the also manuals for UCSD Pascal, but they weren't one of the main four.

18 years, 1 month

seven segment display history

by dm561＠torfree.net

Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 13:21:51 -0800 From: Brent Hilpert <hilpert at cs.ubc.ca> Subject: Re: seven segment display history >Don't know why that web page refers to the Sperry/Beckman displays as Panaplex, >my understanding was Panaplex was a Burroughs trade name for their 7-seg >gas-discharge displays. --------- Nixie, Panaplex and Self-Scan were all registered Burroughs trademarks for those respective products and technologies AFAIK. m

18 years, 1 month

Q-bus to CF [was: IOmega]

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Q-bus to CF [was: IOmega] > From: der Mouse <mouse at Rodents.Montreal.QC.CA> > Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 02:00:53 -0500 (EST) > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> Generally IDE and CF (compactflash) are the same interface and for >> Qbus-11 fairly simple. It's been done, however, the problem is the >> driver as bare IDE or CF is NOT MSCP not is it DL, DX, DY or RK so a >> driver is needed and noone has apparently stepped up to do it. > >Not quite true. > >Some time back (years), someone was working on an IDE interface for a >Qbus MicroVAX and I was doing the driver. (This was not bootable; the >idea was to netboot to get the kernel onto the machine.) > >We never got it working, and it is not clear to me, now, why not. I'm >not sure whether this is because it wasn't clear why then or because my >wetware memory has bitrotted - what memory I have indicates that there >were hardware issues, but I had no physical access to the hardware, so >I'm not sure that that's right even aside from bitrotted memory. the likely reason is PDP-11 and VAX does read before write and IDE does not like that. The fis is to make the READ address different >from the write addresses, even DEC did that with interfaces. It is otherwise straightfoward with the usual observance for timing and the like. Allison >I once was one of two people who built a one-off Qbus board out of >wirewrap, so I feel I ought to be able to build such a thing myself. >Perhaps someday I'll gather the parts and try it. (Anyone have a Qbus >development board looking for a home? :) > >/~\ The ASCII der Mouse >\ / Ribbon Campaign > X Against HTML mouse at rodents.montreal.qc.ca >/ \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B

18 years, 1 month

Apple ][/II/2

by josefcub＠gmail.com

On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 10:34 AM, Zane H. Healy <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote: > Here is an odd question for everyone. In a printed article, which > would be more accurate? "Apple ][", "Apple II", or "Apple 2" > > Zane > I sense an impending flame war. Everyone uses every kind of moniker for the A2 platform. I personally use mostly "Apple II", plus "Apple //". There's the Apple //, the Apple II Plus (II+), Apple IIe, the Apple IIc (and IIc Plus or IIc+), and the Apple IIgs. Josef

18 years, 1 month

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