- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by mbg＠world.std.com

It's finally been done... after many weeks of talking about it and not having it happen, Allison and I drove up to New Hampshire this morning and drove back with a couple of tall (H960, 6') racks with the following: pdp-8/a pdp-8/e pdp-8/f lab-8/e pdp-11/34a vr14 lps DECwriterII 3 RL01s 1 RX01 3 Diablo RK05-work-similar TU56 DECtape dual drive Funny thing... the pdp-8/e was originally Allison's... she had given it several years ago to the guy from whom I got all of the above... In return for her help, she took the pdp-8/f (smaller unit than the pdp-8/e), a core stack from the -8/e, and a second serial line card. I believe she is pleased... I know I am... I took pictures and hope to document the procedure at some point in the future... Now to get them all wired back up and tested out... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ p.s. YIPPEE!!

26 years, 11 months

1
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Jon Titus / VCF 3.0

by adavie＠mad.scientist.com

Just passing on a message from Jon Titus, the inventor of the Mark-8 Microcomputer (1974)... "I don't remember whether or not I gave you a formal acceptance for the Vintage Computer Festival. Put me down as a Yes. Would you have the organizers keep in touch with me about actual dates, etc? I'll need to do some advanced planning, and maybe I can include the trip as part of a business trip. Cheers, Jon" A

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by edick＠idcomm.com

There were several manufacturers of cards shaped more or less like the S-100. One of the more common ones was the MOTOROLA EXORCISOR series, which were MOT's development system for their 8-bit devices. The way to start figuring out what you've got is to count the contact positions at the edge connector and determine the pin spacing. The S-100 used 100 contacts at 0.125" spacing. It also had on-board voltage regulator(s). Dick -----Original Message----- From: Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, March 28, 1999 1:05 PM Subject: Re: Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest > > >Joe wrote: >> >> RATS! I think you're right! I just brought it in and checked. The slots >> are wider than S-100 and the card sockets are offset to one side so S-100 >> cards hit one edge and won't go in. It also has a switcher power supply so >> it is regulated off the cards. Too bad, it is really a nice box. I may >> modify it back to S-100. Anyway what can you expect for $3? > >I am just curious what the size of the slots are. I have a couple of cards >that I thought were S-100 when I got them, but they are a bit narrower than >an S-100 card, and the fingers are wider. The dimensions of these cards are >8 3/4 " wide, 4 1/2 " high (excluding fingers), 7 5/8" finger width with >5/8" to the edge of the card on left side (component side up) and 1/2" to >the edge of the board on the right. The one I just grabbed says "638493 >Digital Timer" on the solder side of the board.

26 years, 11 months

1
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Kitchener, Ontario, Canada declared safe haven for vintage minicomputers.

by kstumpf＠unusual.on.ca

There are very few computer collectors in Canada, especially those collecting minis. Almost all of March I've been trying to seed the small collector-base in southern Ontario by selling a bunch of DG NOVAs. NOT ONE TAKER nor interested party. Remarkable. Perhaps my prices were too high, but if someone wants something bad enough you would think he or she would at least contact me. Not one phone call or email. Weird. So it is because of this experience I recommend shipping any precious minicomputers to Kitchener. They are safe here. They won't be sold, tinkered with, or cannabalized. They won't even be LOOKED AT. This isn't a last resort pitch because I plan to hold onto the NOVAs. I originally needed the space for twin PDP 11/70s, but the corporate management of the present owners have put a hold on the transaction. Double yikes, eh. Thanks for listening and happy collecting. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------- Kevin Stumpf * Unusual systems * www.unusual.on.ca +1.519.744.2900 * EST/EDT GMT - 5 Collector - Commercial Mainframes & Minicomputers from the 50s, 60s, & 70s and control panels and consoles. Author & Publisher - A Guide to Collecting Computers & Computer Collectibles * ISBN 0-9684244-0-6 .

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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BA Stuff FS (fwd)

by william＠ans.net

Please contact him... ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 23:31:37 -0500 From: don merz <71333.144(a)compuserve.com> To: Old Tube Radios <boatanchors(a)theporch.com> Subject: BA Stuff FS Boatanchor Goodies For Sale CONTACT: Don Merz, N3RHT, 47 Hazel Drive, Mt. Lebanon, PA 15228 71333.144(a)compuserve.com [tube stuff snipped] DEC PDP-8F power supply. Big supply with 2 8" fans. DEC part number 70-13323-00. With AC-cord and output connector panel. This thing supplies +5, -5, -15 and +20, volts DC all at substantial ratings. Seems to be in nice shape. Worked when pulled from service. $30 WANTED Manual copy for Heath IG-1272 Audio Generator Manual copy for B&W Model 400 Distortion Meter CONTACT: Don Merz, N3RHT, 47 Hazel Drive, Mt. Lebanon, PA 15228 71333.144(a)compuserve.com

26 years, 11 months

1
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Kitchener, Ontario, Canada declared safe haven for vintage minicomputers.

by dogas＠leading.net

>So it is because of this experience I recommend shipping any precious >minicomputers >to Kitchener. They are safe here. They won't be sold, tinkered with, or >cannabalized. They >won't even be LOOKED AT. dosen't p1 ensure that? -Mike: dogas(a)leading.net

26 years, 11 months

3
3
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Rebirth of IMSAI

by max82＠surfree.com

>There are games for classic computers as well ;-)... There probably What's the benefit of a person playing PacMan on a classic computer? How would it be different from a modern one?

26 years, 11 months

6
8
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NEED RL11 and cables

by danburrows＠mindspring.com

I know I have some of M7762's and the cab kits to go with them but I won't be able to dig them out until next weekend at the earliest. I am open to swaps $ whatever. Dan > > > I am still looking for a good working RL11 [M7762] card and the >flat cable/adapter set for RL02s. (or two..) > > I will buy it, trade for it, cajole fo it.. whatever. > > If you have just the card itself, I could probably make the >adpaters, but I'd rather just plug the stuff in. > > Also I would like to get the schematics for this card. I have >printsets for the RL02s. > > > Cheers > >John > > >

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by edick＠idcomm.com

Yes, that's probably a chassis for a 9900 system. I once marveled at the similarity to S-100 when it was shown to me in a TI sales office when I was considering using TI's 9940 single-chip microcontroller in a product. I've never seen one of these boxes that wasn't for sale, and the last time was ~20 years ago. They're quite an oddity. I wouldn't hold my breath until I see cards for one, though. This card set was not the same as the 990 card set. You can tell these cards, even with the connectors cut off, from S-100 by virtue of the S-100's on-board voltage regulators, so I wouldn't let that worry me. As little as I do remember about the system, it was quite unremarkable, not "better" than S-100 because of the lack of software, and not more attractive than it was because TI was the only vendor of boards, hence tye owned the market for both software and hardware. I'm not even sure it was appreciably faster than the typically 8-bit processors found on the S-100. It did claim to be a 16-bit architecture. They did claim to have SOME software, though I don't remember much about it. Unfortunately, I recall having tossed out what documents I had about five years ago. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Sellam Ismail <dastar(a)ncal.verio.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, March 28, 1999 9:01 AM Subject: Re: Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest >On Sun, 28 Mar 1999, Joe wrote: > >> Whatta you mean I didn't pick it up? It's sitting in the middle of the >> kitchen floor :-/ Turns out that it's not exactly S-100. The sockets are >> right but they're off set to one side of the card slot so S-100 cards won't >> fit in. Someone else said it was for some kind of TI computer. Too bad. >> It's a super nice box. I'm thinking of trying to modify it to fit S-100. > >Might this be a chassis for a TI9900 system, Allison? > >If so, I'd leave it in tact as bait for the cards that go with it. >Otherwise, if you modify it you'll attract S-100 cards with the edge >connectors cut off. :( > >Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. > > Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 > See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! > [Last web site update: 02/15/99] >

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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NEED RL11 and cables

by jpl15＠netcom.com

I am still looking for a good working RL11 [M7762] card and the flat cable/adapter set for RL02s. (or two..) I will buy it, trade for it, cajole fo it.. whatever. If you have just the card itself, I could probably make the adpaters, but I'd rather just plug the stuff in. Also I would like to get the schematics for this card. I have printsets for the RL02s. Cheers John

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by dogas＠leading.net

Hey Joe, what ham fest was that? ;) - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net -----Original Message----- From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, March 27, 1999 2:46 PM Subject: Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest > Went to another one this morning. Didn't find much except three Lisas >(two Lisa 2s and one Lisa 2/10), two HP 715/50s, two Zorbas and a *NICE* >S-100 chassis made by TI. I managed to get the L 2/10 and the Zorbas. >Pictures and questions to follow. > > Joe > > PS the HPs are still available if anyone wants them. > >

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 06:45 PM 3/27/99 -0800, Sam wrote: >On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Joe wrote: > >> Went to another one this morning. Didn't find much except three Lisas >> (two Lisa 2s and one Lisa 2/10), two HP 715/50s, two Zorbas and a *NICE* >> S-100 chassis made by TI. I managed to get the L 2/10 and the Zorbas. > >You should have gotten the Lisa 2's. They are closer to the original Lisa >than the 2/10. The Lisa 2 is really just a Lisa 1 with the 400K 3.5" >drive and an adaptor board. I didn't have any choice. Someone else grabbed the other two. I was lucky to get this one. Here's the story: I was walking around with another guy and someone we both knew drove in so we stopped to talk to him. He mentioned that he had three Lisas and we nearly had fits. We "persauded" him to go back home and get them. The other guy stood right at the seller's spot for over an hour till he returned. As soon as the seller returned he grabbed the two best looking machines. But I did OK, the machine I got had an internal hard drive, the other two didn't. I also found a complete Zorba system while I was waiting for him to return. > >You saw an S-100 chassis made by TI (Texas Instruments I presume?) and >didn't pick it up? Whatta you mean I didn't pick it up? It's sitting in the middle of the kitchen floor :-/ Turns out that it's not exactly S-100. The sockets are right but they're off set to one side of the card slot so S-100 cards won't fit in. Someone else said it was for some kind of TI computer. Too bad. It's a super nice box. I'm thinking of trying to modify it to fit S-100. Joe > >Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. > > Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 > See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! > [Last web site update: 02/15/99] > >

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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Compaq Deskpro XT

by jolminkh＠nsw.bigpond.net.au

I have found an old Compaq Deskpro that turned out to be an XT. I had thought that the first desktops they made were 286's. Was this just an attempt to tap the cheaper end of the market? It is a very large box for an XT, the same size as the other early Deskpro's. Hans

26 years, 11 months

1
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Museums

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Surprisingly good market for $100-200 computers, of the 386/486 variety. >People on Unemployment, Supporting Parent and Invalid Pensions can't >afford to buy $1500 new computers, and typically just want to play a few >games and do a little word processing...... That sounds like part of what I was thinking of as well... a place where people could bring all sorts of random PC parts and help put systems together for people who might not otherwise be able to afford a computer system... We'd be able to do a service for people... >Seriously, I think your concept is good, biggest headache is floor space, >my bet is that you need to set up in a smaller place, a country town, not >too far from a big city, but where the rents for warehouse space don't >look like the NASA budget. I suspect this is why most museums I've >seen/heard of concentrate on desktop stuff, they don't need a huge area >to house it. That is a problem... cost for space. I decided to call around today and see if I could get a ballpark idea of what space might cost. So far I've only gotten through to one place -- an old mill complex in Saxonville, Mass. When I called, I was told that all they had left was a 2500 sq-ft area... at *$8* per sq-ft. That's US$20000 (I believe for a year), $1667/month. If this could be a club formed as a non-profit organization, and if I could get $10/month out of people, we'd need 167 members just to pay for the space... Then we have electric, which I would suspect will be a major part of the cost for such a power-oriented hobby. I know of one group who has space at $3/sq-ft, and a person who posted recently saying that they had space for free... I've got a call into Whittier Partners about space at the Maynard, Mass. mill complex (birthplace of DEC) but have not gotten a call back yet. Does anyone know if there might happen to be any grants or something equivalent that such an organization might be able to apply for? Doing a little more thinking about memberships, I was thinking of a tiered approach (typical) which ranks members on their level of usage of the facilities. And maybe there could be breaks for those who provide help to others... (just some more rambling) Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

11
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Big Commodore PET Haul - trades? for sale?

by thedm＠sunflower.com

I am very interested in haveing a complete PET System, and I don't mind paying shipping. -----Original Message----- From: Doug Spence <ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, March 28, 1999 4:57 AM Subject: Re: Big Commodore PET Haul - trades? for sale? > >Hi! > >I only seem to only have time to catch up with me mail once a week or so. >I just found your post to the ClassicCmp list about the PETs. Are they >all gone yet? > >Where are you located? Toronto area? Shipping PET stuff would be very >expensive, I think. If I had a friend in Toronto I'd send him over to >grab whatever you've got. :) > >The SuperPET is especially nice. A friend of mine has one, with an 8050 >or 8250 (don't remember which) and all the language software and manuals. > >I've been looking for a BASIC 4 system and DOS 2 or higher disk drive for >a while. All of my PET stuff is more antiquated then the stuff you've got >on the list. > >A 4032 and an 8250 would be ideal. I like the small 40-column screens. > > >On Sun, 21 Mar 1999, Chandra Bajpai wrote: > >> This weekend I bought someones entire Commodore Collection. The reason I >> bought the collection was they were unwilling to break it up, so I've got to >> find homes for most of these machines. >> (I only am keeping one) >> >> - 1 Commodore SuperPET >> - 10 CPUs: Commodore 8032, 4032, 4016 >> - 1 Spare part machine, 2 extra motherboards, ROMs etc. >> - 8 Disk Drives: 4040, 8050 and quite a few 8250s (I didn't know these >> existed) >> - Commodore printers + one daisy wheel >> - Commodore Test diskettes, repair schematics + procedures >> (including some stuff that never made it to the market) >> - Lots of manuals...even an original 1976 MOS Technology 6502 programming >> manual in as new condition! >> - Lots of software (even some SuperPet stuff) >> - Compute magazine from 1980-1983 in as new condition >> - Commodore PET Literature >> >> This stuff came out of school computer labs and some stuff when Commodore >> Canada shut down. >> All the machines seem to work OK...pretty good shape for being close to 20 >> years old. >> Need some TLC...they have various school names in marker on the side. >> >> So I need to find homes for these PCs....they are taking up a lot of room in >> my basement. >> I'm need to sell them...This list gets first crack at them...I'll consider >> interesting >> trades too... >> >> My overall want list: >> NeXT, KIM-1, A working S-100 and/or CP/M System, Lisa, Tesla coil, >> telescopes, night vision gear, GPS, Oscilloscope, Lotus Esprit SE, Robotics >> items, or anything other interesting items. > >-- >Doug Spence >ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca >http://alcor.concordia.ca/~ds_spenc/ >

26 years, 11 months

1
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Another Lisa question

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

OK I've done some checking and found out that there is supposed to be a parallel port availble inside the Lisa 2/10 (aka Mac XL). Does anyone know where it is? What's it used for? There are two serial ports on the back of the 2/10. Are they the same and what are they used for or are they standard RS-232 ports? This one came with an anti-glare filter in front of the CRT but the other two didn't. Is this standard or was it an add-on? Thanks for all the replys, Joe

26 years, 11 months

3
2
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Lisa question

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

I picked up a Lisa today but it's missing the "V" key from the keyboard. Is the keytop the same as that used on any of the other Apples or any other computer? I also got a ProFile external disk drive but no connecting cable. Is this just a straight through cable? If not can someone post the pinouts? Finally, I'm getting a memory error when it boots. It shows a picture with MEM 2 folder crossed out and either "70" or "71" shown below it. Does anyone know exactly what this means or how I can fix it? Joe

26 years, 11 months

5
5
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Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Went to another one this morning. Didn't find much except three Lisas (two Lisa 2s and one Lisa 2/10), two HP 715/50s, two Zorbas and a *NICE* S-100 chassis made by TI. I managed to get the L 2/10 and the Zorbas. Pictures and questions to follow. Joe PS the HPs are still available if anyone wants them.

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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Lisa question

by Marion.Bates＠Dartmouth.EDU

Re: memory error. According to the table of memory errors, 70 means read/write error and 71 means parity error. Don't know if that helps at all...the whole error table is here: http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~woz/lisatech/page16_17.html The same board failed in my Lisa 2 last summer. I guess try jiggling it, cleaning the contacts, looking for cracked solder points, etc. Sun Remarketing sells the whole board (unless they've run out), but it's not exactly cheap -- around fifty bucks. And you have to get hold of the right guy on the phone, some of the younger sales reps have no clue that the company sells Lisa parts. -- MB --- You wrote: I picked up a Lisa today but it's missing the "V" key from the keyboard. Is the keytop the same as that used on any of the other Apples or any other computer? I also got a ProFile external disk drive but no connecting cable. Is this just a straight through cable? If not can someone post the pinouts? Finally, I'm getting a memory error when it boots. It shows a picture with MEM 2 folder crossed out and either "70" or "71" shown below it. Does anyone know exactly what this means or how I can fix it? Joe --- end of quote ---

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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Lisa question

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 02:32 PM 3/27/99 -0800, you wrote: >My profile/lisa combonation operates with a straight 25 pin ribbon cable. > >George Rachor Great! Thanks George. Joe

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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Any interest in Windows/286?

by gregorym＠cadvision.com

While browsing at one of my local thrifts, I found a large number (20+) of disk sets for Microsoft Windows/286. Each set seemed to be 3-4 disks (Setup, Build, Options, PC Paintbrush ... can't remember what else). There were no manuals, but the 5.25 disks seemed to be in good shape. Is anybody interested in these? If so, I can pick them up tomorrow and make them available to anybody who has a use for them. Let me know. Mark "Would have bought them on principle but didn't have the cash on me" Gregory

26 years, 11 months

5
6
0 0

Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest

by edick＠idcomm.com

I'm not the guy to ask about the TI line, as I only had contact with it once, in a TI sales office, but, . . . this IS a forum for people with interests in ancient computing hardware . . . Dick -----Original Message----- From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, March 27, 1999 2:50 PM Subject: Re: Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest >Dick, > > RATS! I think you're right! I just brought it in and checked. The slots >are wider than S-100 and the card sockets are offset to one side so S-100 >cards hit one edge and won't go in. It also has a switcher power supply so >it is regulated off the cards. Too bad, it is really a nice box. I may >modify it back to S-100. Anyway what can you expect for $3? > > Do you know anything the TI computer? Is this worth leaving as is in >hopes someone can use it or should I use it for a project box? > > Joe > >At 01:00 PM 3/27/99 -0700, you wrote: >>I bet you're going to be disappointed in the TI chassis, Joe. TI made (back >>in the '70's) a line of their microcomputers which used a connector and a >>card form-factor like the S-100, sort-of, but which wasn't S-100. One easy >>way to tell the difference, I believe is that the TI system, which I never >>inspected, hence can't say for certain, used a global power supply rather >>than the s-100's on-card local regulation. Their power and other supply >>leads were in different places, too. >> >>Let me know if I'm wrong, Joe, as I hope you're getting something you can >>use, but something tells me . . . >> >>Dick >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> >>To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers >><classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> >>Date: Saturday, March 27, 1999 12:51 PM >>Subject: Just another Rinky-Dink Florida hamfest >> >> >>> Went to another one this morning. Didn't find much except three Lisas >>>(two Lisa 2s and one Lisa 2/10), two HP 715/50s, two Zorbas and a *NICE* >>>S-100 chassis made by TI. I managed to get the L 2/10 and the Zorbas. >>>Pictures and questions to follow. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> PS the HPs are still available if anyone wants them. >>> >> >> >

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

[Fwd: Sparc10]

by KFergason＠aol.com

In a message dated 3/27/99 3:20:11 PM Central Standard Time, bluoval(a)mindspring.com writes: > Complete Sun Sparc10 with lots of memory, big color display, tape drive. > email your offer and questions. System currently running UNIX 4.1.2 > Making an assumption he means SunOS 4.1.2, ask lots of questions. Sparc 10's do not run SunOS 4.1.2.

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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[Fwd: Sparc10]

by bluoval＠mindspring.com

Thought some might be interested. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Sparc10 Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 11:46:26 -0500 From: "James H. McCann" <jhmcc(a)earthlink.net> Organization: EarthLink Network, Inc. Newsgroups: alt.forsale Complete Sun Sparc10 with lots of memory, big color display, tape drive. email your offer and questions. System currently running UNIX 4.1.2

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Allison J Parent wrote: <> I don't believe OSI ever did a 6100 based design (por any other PDP-8 <> compatable chip). < <Well, they tried to market the idea anyway. I have the document <right here. That may be possible. I never say any Byte/Interface Age/Kilobaud or others advertizing much other than the 6502 pr the z80 based versions. It was a sufficient depature from all the other systems as it's 12 bit and the others were all 8bit data and 16bit address which is a tough fit for a 6100 (12bit data/address) unless the MEDIC was added and then it was 12data 15 address. the 1802, 2650 and a few otehr were a possible fit. The GI part someone was been thinking of is the 1600 series. I do have a copy of Osborne's book _some real microprocessors_. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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Seller's market

by edick＠idcomm.com

You're right on the money with this assessment! I'm convinced of this because when I look at the items you've listed I think, "goodness! Why would anyone want that stuff?" while when I look at the pile of equally esoteric S-100 stuff I have in the corner, I think of it as "good stuff" which of course is a purely arbitrary judgment. I am not a collector and have held onto my "stuff" for two reasons, which I think may be pretty common in the world of computer "junk" ownership. (a) I bought the "stuff" when it was current hardware and I needed or wanted it for some specific purpose and still hope to squeeze the remaining value/utility out of it, and (b) it's a daunting task sifting throught the "archive" to determine what has to "go." This combines itself, quite naturally, I believe, into "Well, one of these days . . ." Auction prices would yield useful informaton IF . . . and only if. . . there were a completed sale to go along with a set of finishing prices published on the web. What's damaging to the usefulness of what we have now, e.g. eBay, is that they allow an auction to run to completion, record the final (winning) bid, and make no assertion whatever about whether the sale actually happened. As a consequence, putting your goods up for auction on eBay or Haggle is pretty chancy, as the only thing you're guaranteed of getting is a bill. That leaves the observer with a big question mark where an answer to the question of "What would someon give for this?" comes up. In the meantime, I, a potential seller, sit here saying to myself, "All I really want is for this stuff to GO AWAY!" When I advertise it as available, I get all kinds of offers to "take it off my hands," which means people will let me gather it up, package it, and ship it to them, on the off-chance that they'll use it for something, provided, of course, that I don't mind bankrolling the whole project, and what's always in the back of my mind is "I wonder what (how much ) this stuff would bring at auction?" If there were just a realistic way to find that out . . . Dick -----Original Message----- From: John Ruschmeyer <jruschme(a)hiway1.exit109.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, March 26, 1999 7:48 AM Subject: Re: Seller's market >> The point that seems to stick with me is that while some people complain >> vigorously about the high prices on eBay, the prices don't seem to be quite >> high enough to get them to part with similar items they have. ie the prices >> are more than they wish to pay, but not what they would be willing to sell >> for. > >My vague feeling is that there is another, nebulous factor involved- something >akin to being purely mercenary versus wanting to see an item go to the >"right" home (with "rightness" being defined by the owner). I think that there >is also a little of the dilemma that any speculator has- What is the best >time to cash in. > >I know I'm guilty of the latter. For a while, I've been considering getting >rid of a couple of my classics that I *never* get around to touching and, >so, every once in a while, I find myself checking the prices on similar >items, trying to decide if now is the time to go ahead and list them. > >For those who are wondering: the two I'm thinking of parting with are: > >1) Osborne 1, blue case, with DD controller and 80-column upgrade. > >2) Lisa 2/10, working, with original manuals (but disk copies). Also has > a Sun Remarketing SCSI board and MacWorks Plus. ><<<John>>>

26 years, 11 months

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Seller's market

by edick＠idcomm.com

The information I got from eBay's site suggests that only 70% of the auctions which are completed result in actual sales. What I get from this is that nearly one in three auctions which result in a fee to eBay don't result in a sale for the seller. I would say that the items with "ridiculous" initial prices are not included in this figure. That situation seems quite plausible to me, as there is no means availailable for "forcing" a sale. The fact that someone bids doesn't obligate them in any real way, nor does the fact that someone lists an item for sale obligate them to sell it if the price isn't sufficient. It seems quite plausible to me that an individual might overbid on an item in order to "queer" the auction, running the price up to where no one would pay that amount, irrespective of the value of the item being sold. This is no different than publishins software with a virus, or spraying graffitti on someone else's building. There's really no penalty. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Mike Ford <mikeford(a)netwiz.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, March 27, 1999 2:03 AM Subject: Re: Seller's market >>Auction prices would yield useful informaton IF . . . and only if. . . there >>were a completed sale to go along with a set of finishing prices published >>on the web. What's damaging to the usefulness of what we have now, e.g. >>eBay, is that they allow an auction to run to completion, record the final >>(winning) bid, and make no assertion whatever about whether the sale >>actually happened. As a consequence, putting your goods up for auction on > >The completion rate figure I have seen for eBay is 70%. Out of that 30% >that don't go through, a lot are from people who choose to list with high >first bids, ala the guy who keeps about 100 auctions going all the time, >each one for a single item like a hard drive sled, or a front bezel with a >first bid amount of $9.95. Only about 20% of those items get any bids, and >many sell with just a single bid. There are other equally harmless reasons >items don't complete, but if you see half a dozen auctions for similar >items, and each auction had a half a dozen different bidders, they final >prices are about as good an indicator of fair market price as I expect you >can find. > >If I am serious about an item, or the price seems odd on some of the >auctions, I follow up and read the ads, or email the people. Many times >prices differences are fully explained by condition or shipping costs >revealed within the ad. > >

26 years, 11 months

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Any interest in Windows/286?

by edick＠idcomm.com

That "old" version of Windows had the infamous problems with SMARTDRV. I'd suggest you proceed with caution. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Lawrence Walker <lwalker(a)mail.interlog.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, March 27, 1999 4:58 AM Subject: Re: Any interest in Windows/286? On 26 Mar 99 at 20:42, Mark Gregory wrote: > While browsing at one of my local thrifts, I found a large number (20+) of > disk sets for Microsoft Windows/286. Each set seemed to be 3-4 disks > (Setup, Build, Options, PC Paintbrush ... can't remember what else). There > were no manuals, but the 5.25 disks seemed to be in good shape. Is anybody > interested in these? If so, I can pick them up tomorrow and make them > available to anybody who has a use for them. Let me know. > > Mark "Would have bought them on principle but didn't have the cash on me" > Gregory > Mark, could you pick up a set for me. I've been looking to acquire a set for some time. Regarding Don's comment, He must have a different distribution since I have a single disk labeled Windows 286 v 2.10 Setup, Build, and Displays 1 Disk and below diskette: 1 of 4 . It's a Microsoft A(merican) R(esearch) C(oporation (sic)) disk . I also have a 7 disk set of win 3.1. They're 1.2 megs. Possibly his is 360. Both come up "unformatted" dialogue box in File Manager. I didn't try them at start-up lest I screw up my win set-up and I didn't have my win-less dos box operating. Possibly also his set is built for install ciao larry lwalker(a)interlog.com

26 years, 11 months

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New content posted yesterday

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Hello, all: I posted some more Altair schematics: the 8800 power supply, the 8800 Display/Control board, and the 8800 (display) Interface Card. I have also scanned the remaining AIM65 manual (the User's Guide) and will begin posting that shortly. Enjoy. [ Rich Cini/WUGNET [ ClubWin!/CW7 [ MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking [ Collector of "classic" computers [ http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ [ http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/pdp11/ <---------------------------- reply separator

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 26, 16:41, Richard Erlacher wrote: > Subject: Re: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) > Yes, I believe you're right. It was a CMOS technology product at a time > when such were less than common. There was a chaper devoted to it in the > old Osborne book(s) about Microprocessors. > > I never saw one in a system, though. > -----Original Message----- > From: Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> > >You're probably thinking of the Intersil 6100, which DEC actually used > >themselves in at least one product. I have one in a WPS78, which is a DECmate-type system, looks like a VT52 with a desktop RX01 unit, sold for office automation. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

26 years, 11 months

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HP equipment

by lemay＠cs.umn.edu

Does anyone recognize these items: HP 9145: appears to be a cake-box size unit, with a cartridge tape drive of some sort. HP 98571X: probably a computer or some sort. has a expansion slot in back, whatever was in teh slot has been removed. rs-232, HP-IB, HP-HIL, thinnet connectors on back. Seagate sticker applied on side of unit claims it is TEST EQUIPMENT, and is called HP 340 CPU serial number 334. PS: I may have a line on a pair of 3B2's (somethingorother/300), and the base unit for an Amiga 2000. -Lawrence LeMay lemay(a)cs.umn.edu

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by bill＠chipware.com

Allison J Parent wrote: > I don't believe OSI ever did a 6100 based design (por any other PDP-8 > compatable chip). Well, they tried to market the idea anyway. I have the document right here.

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Yes, I believe you're right. It was a CMOS technology product at a time <when such were less than common. There was a chaper devoted to it in the <old Osborne book(s) about Microprocessors. It was one of the two CMOS cpus available early on, the 6100 (12bit PDP-8) and the 180x (18xx pair or 1802 8bitters). it would be a while before eithe would be edged out of the market. <I never saw one in a system, though. Intersil and Harris sold a single board, a tiny system and full development systems for the 6100 series. I happen to have the intersil 6960 sampler and would love to find a Intercept JR or an Intercept. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> Subject: Re: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) <> Back in the old days, somebody or other, I'll look it up later (General <> Instruments, I believe), made an LSI which was essentially compatible <with <> the PDP8-E. GI never did the PDP-8 chip. Intersil and Harris (both 6100 and 6120) I don't believe OSI ever did a 6100 based design (por any other PDP-8 compatable chip). <You're probably thinking of the Intersil 6100, which DEC actually used <themselves in at least one product. Wps78 and DECmate series. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by edick＠idcomm.com

Yes, I believe you're right. It was a CMOS technology product at a time when such were less than common. There was a chaper devoted to it in the old Osborne book(s) about Microprocessors. I never saw one in a system, though. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, March 26, 1999 2:22 PM Subject: Re: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) >On Mar 26, 13:14, Richard Erlacher wrote: >> Subject: Re: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) >> Back in the old days, somebody or other, I'll look it up later (General >> Instruments, I believe), made an LSI which was essentially compatible >with >> the PDP8-E. > >You're probably thinking of the Intersil 6100, which DEC actually used >themselves in at least one product. > >-- > >Pete Peter Turnbull > Dept. of Computer Science > University of York

26 years, 11 months

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PS/2s nicer than expected; some questions

by gregorym＠cadvision.com

Over the weekend I acquired some interesting PS/2 machines: a PS/2 P70 386 portable, and a PS/2 Model 95 XP 486 server. This was my first experience with the PS/2 family, and I was pleasantly surprised. From what I remember when PS/2s were new, the media savaged them, mainly due to high price and the incompatibility with all existing ISA cards, RAM, etc. I was impressed with the build quality and design of the machines (the power supply in the M95 XP486 for example: undo one butterfly screw and the whole thing swivels out, allowing easy access to the drive bays) and with the ease of configuration of Microchannel cards - better Plug and Play than with many peripherals on Win 9x machines. Some questions: 1) Why did Microchannel fail so completely? From a user point of view it seems quite nice. 2) Can MFM or IDE drives be used with an ESDI controller, or do the drives have to be ESDI drives? 3) Anybody know if the 486DX33 on the processor board can be replaced with an Overdrive chip to make it at least a 486/66; or, does IBM still run their parts depot in Boulder for old machines? 3) I'm having some trouble with the P70. Originally, it wouldn't boot at all. I ran the diagnostics from the Reference Disk, and all tests were passed. I re-ran the Auto Configuration with no errors. I installed PC-DOS 6.3, and formatted the built-in HD at the same time. Everything seems fine, but the system won't boot from the hard drive alone. If I boot with a floppy in the drive, I can access the HD and run programs off of it. But without a floppy, nothing works. Any ideas? Thanks in advance. Mark.

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by edick＠idcomm.com

Back in the old days, somebody or other, I'll look it up later (General Instruments, I believe), made an LSI which was essentially compatible with the PDP8-E. The idea was that it was much less of a maintenance headache to have the CPU in microelectronic form as opposed to the ssi-msi implementation commonly seen. These didn't fare to well on the market because of the rapid evolution of the commercial microcomputer industry. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Bill Sudbrink <bill(a)chipware.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, March 26, 1999 12:43 PM Subject: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) >I just got another box of OSI marketing lit. >One of the items is a single sheet glossy >with no date, but showing C1s C2s and C3s. >Since there is no mention of anything else, >I assume it's from 1977. Here's the kicker: >It lists a Model 560Z CPU board with PDP-8 >code compatibility! Has anyone on the list >ever seen or heard of one of these? > >Thanks, >Bill Sudbrink >

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 26, 13:14, Richard Erlacher wrote: > Subject: Re: Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!) > Back in the old days, somebody or other, I'll look it up later (General > Instruments, I believe), made an LSI which was essentially compatible with > the PDP8-E. You're probably thinking of the Intersil 6100, which DEC actually used themselves in at least one product. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

26 years, 11 months

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Ohio Scientific Model 560Z CPU (PDP-8!)

by bill＠chipware.com

I just got another box of OSI marketing lit. One of the items is a single sheet glossy with no date, but showing C1s C2s and C3s. Since there is no mention of anything else, I assume it's from 1977. Here's the kicker: It lists a Model 560Z CPU board with PDP-8 code compatibility! Has anyone on the list ever seen or heard of one of these? Thanks, Bill Sudbrink

26 years, 11 months

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TANDY Keyboard Question

by steverob＠hotoffice.com

On Friday, March 26, 1999 12:00 PM, Mark Gregory [SMTP:gregorym@cadvision.com] wrote: > Steve, one of the thrift stores that I haunt has had a Model 2 keyboard > kicking around for months (since the system itself was nowhere to be > found). If it's useful to you, I could pick it up and mail it to you. Your > cost: about $1 Canadian plus postage from Calgary, Alberta. Let me know if > you're interested. > > Mark. > Mark, I appreciate the offer. Before going to too much trouble, I need to make sure that they are otherwise functional. First, I gotta get them cleaned up and reassembled then try a power on test. If they look like they're work, I may take you up on your offer. I was hoping that a regular PC keyboard would work. That way I could do a complete test with minimal effort. When the teledisk order comes in, I'll have to beg a copy of the OS from someone (hint, hint). ;-) Thanks, Steve Robertson - <steverob(a)hotoffice.com>

26 years, 11 months

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Wanted: H960 rack PDP-8 ID bezels

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>> So... does anyone have a couple of PDP-8 bezels that they might part >> with, or perhaps a decent hi-res scan of one that I could use try to make >> a new decal to stick on a blank one? >I think there is a VERY weathered one in the yard at Apex Electronics in >the LA area. There's a very weathered one of everything at Apex! (Often buried under tons of other stuff, of course...) Tim.

26 years, 11 months

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TANDY Keyboard Question

by steverob＠hotoffice.com

My ever-thoughtful brother-in-law found a couple of TRS-80s in the dumpster and thinking of me, hauled them home (what a guy). So now I have inherited a MODEL 2 and a MODEL 16... These things have obviously been sitting in a dirty shed/garage/chicken-coop so, I'll have to spend a few evenings just cleaning them up. Unfortunately, the keyboards were nowhere to be found. QUESTION: Will a regular PC type keyboard work with these systems? Steve Robertson <steverob(a)hotoffice.com>

26 years, 11 months

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Wanted: H960 rack PDP-8 ID bezels

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

Ok... you know what I'm talking about here (or if not, well...) I'm trying to get (one of) my PDP-8 systems looking nice, (this months project) but the rack(s) are missing the ID bezels from the top of the rack. I've got enough of the PDP-11 bezels, but the two-tone purple color scheme just clashes too badly with the two-tone orange of the 8's. So... does anyone have a couple of PDP-8 bezels that they might part with, or perhaps a decent hi-res scan of one that I could use try to make a new decal to stick on a blank one? Thanks; -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

26 years, 11 months

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TANDY Keyboard Question

by gregorym＠cadvision.com

Steve, one of the thrift stores that I haunt has had a Model 2 keyboard kicking around for months (since the system itself was nowhere to be found). If it's useful to you, I could pick it up and mail it to you. Your cost: about $1 Canadian plus postage from Calgary, Alberta. Let me know if you're interested. Mark. At 07:04 AM 3/26/99 -0500, you wrote: >My ever-thoughtful brother-in-law found a couple of TRS-80s in the >dumpster and thinking of me, hauled them home (what a guy). So now I >have inherited a MODEL 2 and a MODEL 16... These things have obviously >been sitting in a dirty shed/garage/chicken-coop so, I'll have to spend >a few evenings just cleaning them up. > >Unfortunately, the keyboards were nowhere to be found. QUESTION: Will a >regular PC type keyboard work with these systems? > >Steve Robertson <steverob(a)hotoffice.com> > >

26 years, 11 months

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Seller's market

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

>If I sell to you for $50 when someone else offers $500, the blame is on me >for taking less than the highest offer, Keep in mind that money is not the only method of payment. That situation could easily be $500 cash or $50 and a promise to care for it the way you would want it to be cared for. >You've undoubtedly read my comments about the low (70%) completion rate [...] >walk away, having ruined the auction by bidding out the more serious >bidders, when there was no serious commitment to buy. A couple of comments: sellers can (and often do) contact the second highest bidder if the first "walks away". Also, I think there may be other reasons for backing out than the malicious attacks on sellers suggested earlier. Shipping might be one reason (I recently "walked away" from a couple of DEC computers I bought on eBay because of the shipping. (I'm sending the guy the full bid amount plus shipping on the items I *do* want; he was nice enough to throw in a couple other computers to replace the ones I didn't want!)) In any case, a 70% completion rate is not necessarily a sign of people artificially raising bid prices with no intention of following through. >EBay does charge the would-be seller a fee based on the final bid price and >not on the actual selling price. It benefits them to have the prices as >high as they will go. Okay, so yes, the eBay people sit there, rubbing their hands and cackling gleefully as they watch the selling prices for altairs soar through the roof. But what is it that they do (other than provide the service) to encourage the higher selling prices? >My belief on this matter is that the very thing which drives the prices up >is also the thing that causes the high transaction failure rate. but eBay doesn't get paid if the trx falls through, so it would make sense for eBay to prefer a lower commission on a smaller sale than no commission on a sale that doesn't go through. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi Joe, ---------- > From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Question regarding a VAXstation > Date: Thursday, March 25, 1999 11:07 AM > I didn't know you were into Vaxs. I just found a 4000/90 but I've > already promised it to another list meember. If you "find" another one, i would be happy to take it ;-)) (looking already for a while) cheers, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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Old rotting video games

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 09:10 PM 3/25/99 -0800, you wrote: > >The guy whose website the picture of old, rotting video game cabinets >resides on is haynesdl(a)nwfl.net. > >He lives in Cape Canaveral, Florida. Hey, that's close to me! I'm not interested in video games but I'll offer to help anyone tht wants to try and save the stuff. Joe

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Carlos, Good luck getting the VAX stuff. Perhaps you should volunteer to get it out of their way. Grab everything you can, someone will want it. BTW I got the tapes from Dan, lots of interesting looking stuff there. I'll make you copies of some 85 tapes and send them as soon as I can. Which disk drive did you say that you had, a 9121 or 9122? Joe At 09:09 PM 3/25/99 -0500, you wrote: > >Hi Joe; > >I guess I am just beginning to diversify into VAX/VMS :-) . >I had been curious about it always. Here at the office >we have a pile of equipment that we don't want to throw >away, but we are not using. Lately, the space is getting >crowded, and I sense that people a couple of steps higher >in the chain of command are going to do something about it. >Therefore, I decided to test some of this stuff to see if >it works, so I can claim it early before they decide to >throw it away. > > >On Thu, 25 Mar 1999, Joe wrote: > >> At 04:49 PM 3/25/99 -0500, you wrote: >> Ahh! Another lucker finally speaks up! Hi Carlos! >> I didn't know you were into Vaxs. I just found a 4000/90 but I've >> already promised it to another list meember. >> >> Joe >

26 years, 11 months

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Rebirth of IMSAI

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

> I don't know if $500 is the right number either, but I figure that in a >"new" IMSAI 8080 kit in low quantities, there'd be at least $75 in boards, >$100++ for the case, $50 for the power supply, $25 for a silkscreened front >panel and the rest, silicon, passives, switches, and the backplane >connectors. And that doesn't iinclude any re-engineering costs to account >for parts that have been discontinued or marked as "end-of-life." You forgot one vital component: the switches. The 7101 and 7103 series switches used in the IMSAI front panel are still available new from C&K, at $5-$6 each. They start adding up fast! And cost of a full-length (22- slot) backplane would come to around $150-$200 these days. (Though you could easily argue that now that we have memory boards larger than 4kbytes you don't need all those slots, all of my real IMSAI's have 22-slot backplanes...!) A year or so ago I looked at what it would cost to make my "TIMSAI" IMSAI clone into a commercial product. Street price, I calculated, would be about $2000, and most of that was in the metalworking. There was only about $30 in semiconductors in the whole unit (and that included 256K SRAM and an IDE/floppy controller). -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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Old rotting video games

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

The guy whose website the picture of old, rotting video game cabinets resides on is haynesdl(a)nwfl.net. He lives in Cape Canaveral, Florida. Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 02/15/99]

26 years, 11 months

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Need RL11 card

by jpl15＠netcom.com

I would like to find at least one, maybe two, *working* RL11 Controller card(s) [M7762] with accompanying flat cable and adapter to RL01/2 cables. I have many Unibus cards to trade, other things to trade, and/or cash as well. GPIB cables, anyone?? ;} Also fun would be an engineering schematic for it (them). I have nine (count 'em: 9) RL02s, over sixty RL02 packs, and only one controller card. Thanks in Advance.... Cheerz John

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by cem14＠cornell.edu

First of all, let me introduce myself to the list. My name is Carlos Murillo, computer enthusiast and HP collector, though my collection is still pretty small. Many of my choices when it comes to computing are influenced by my addiction to automation and data aquisition. I have been lurking for a few weeks now, and I have learned a lot about classic computing from the members of the list. Thanks to you all. Now, I would like to ask for advice: I have a VAXstation 4000/60 sitting in front of me. I have been told that this ran ok about 8 years ago; I really don't know if this fits the topic of the list (I guess it could be slightly newer than 10 years). The thing is, it won't boot. When it is turned on, it flashes several colors on the monitor, it tests its 16M of RAM and then it aborts and dumps me to some sort of monitor program. This is what the screen shows: KA46-A V1.1-31E-V4.0 08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB 16MB <bargraph representing memory tested here> ?? 003 3 DZ 0112 <---loud beep heard here >>> _ I played with several of the monitor commands; in particular, here are two that seem to give some info about this machine: >>> show dev VMS/VMB ADDR DEVTYPE NUMBYTES RM/FX WP DEVNAM REV ------- ---- ------- -------- ----- -- ------ --- ESA0 08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB DKA300 A/3/0 DISK 209.81MB FX RZ24 4041 ..HostID.. A/6 INITR >>> show config KA46-A V1.1-31E-V4.0 08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB 16MB DEVNBR DEVNAM INFO ------ ------ --------------------------------------- 1 NVR OK 2 LCG OK HR - 8 PLN FB - V1.1 3 DZ ?? 003 0112 4 CACHE OK 5 MEM OK 16MB= SY=8MB, S0/1=8MB, S2/3=0MB, S4/5=0MB 6 FPU OK 7 IT OK 8 SYS OK 9 NI OK 10 SCSI OK 3-RZ24 6-INITR 11 AUD OK Only device number 3, "DZ" seems to be faulty, and is the same device appearing in the original error. What is this device? Thanks for any help, Carlos.

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by cem14＠cornell.edu

Thanks to everybody for the information. Indeed, the missing mouse was the culprit. The next time it loaded VAX/VMS V 5.5; it started by asking for the date, and I made the mistake of actually providing the current date; as it loaded, I got about a hundred instances of "license has expired for XXXXXXX", with XXXXX being a bunch of installed software, including FORTRAN and Pascal compilers and a lot of things that looked like networking stuff. Oh, well, I guess that by booting the machine I have stripped it of a lot of software. Finally, a login screen popped up, but nobody around here remembers any user name or password. It is the first time that I have seen a machine boot VMS. Nice. Carlos. On Thu, 25 Mar 1999, emanuel stiebler wrote: > So plug in the keyboard, > > and type: > > B DKA300 > > and wait what happen ... > > cheers, > emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi Carlos, ---------- > From: cem14(a)cornell.edu > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Question regarding a VAXstation > Date: Thursday, March 25, 1999 6:56 PM > it of a lot of software. Finally, a login screen popped up, > but nobody around here remembers any user name or password. The answer to this is in the OpenVMS FAQ ;-)) > > It is the first time that I have seen a machine boot VMS. Nice. YES !!! cheers, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 04:49 PM 3/25/99 -0500, you wrote: > >First of all, let me introduce myself to the list. My name >is Carlos Murillo, Ahh! Another lucker finally speaks up! Hi Carlos! >I have a VAXstation 4000/60 sitting in front of me. I have I didn't know you were into Vaxs. I just found a 4000/90 but I've already promised it to another list meember. Joe

26 years, 11 months

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Rotting away

by gareth.knight2＠which.net

John Amirault >You say about 1.5 miles away from home, how about a clue as to where >HOME is. No, the person who uploaded the picture says it's 1.5 miles from home. I believe it is in the US somewhere. All we need is a good sniffer dog and we should find it in no time =) -- Gareth Knight Amiga Interactive Guide | ICQ No. 24185856 http://welcome.to/aig | "Shine on your star"

26 years, 11 months

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Partial OS/8 Software Support Manual online

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

Having been blessed with a bit of a lull at the office this week, I've typed in and HTMLized a chunk of the OS/8 Software Suport Manual. The parts I have so far are the introduction through Chapter 5. Web on over to http://cc.usu.edu/~ivie/ and click on "The OS/8 Software Support Manual". The copy I have is a copy of a copy and no one bothered to copy the back of the title page, so I don't know the date or version of this particular copy of the manual. I also don't know when I'll get to the appendices. The appendices, of course, give the really exciting details such as the directory format. The part I have done so far may be interesting to that fellow who complained a while ago about having a DECmate III and not knowing how to program anything on it. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi Carlos, ---------- > From: cem14(a)cornell.edu > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Question regarding a VAXstation > Date: Thursday, March 25, 1999 2:49 PM > > I have a VAXstation 4000/60 sitting in front of me. I have > been told that this ran ok about 8 years ago; I really don't > know if this fits the topic of the list (I guess it could > be slightly newer than 10 years). The thing is, it > won't boot. When it is turned on, it flashes several colors > on the monitor, it tests its 16M of RAM and then it aborts > and dumps me to some sort of monitor program. This is what > the screen shows: > > KA46-A V1.1-31E-V4.0 > 08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB > 16MB > <bargraph representing memory tested here> > ?? 003 3 DZ 0112 <---loud beep heard here So plug in the keyboard, and type: B DKA300 and wait what happen ... cheers, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by mbg＠world.std.com

>So, it appears that if you have a demountable cartridge drive and you >change the air filter, you have to bring it up to the latest standards. >That's refurbishing. If you wait for it to headcrash and fit new heads >and filter, well, that's a repair and is OK. Go figure. It's all how you view it... an air filter can go 'bad'... requiring repair (replacement). Logically should be no different from heads which go bad and require repair (replacement). Otherwise there could be an argument made for replacing the heads being a refurbishment, and this requiring bringing it up to standards.. depends on the definition of refurbish... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by mbg＠world.std.com

>I have a VAXstation 4000/60 sitting in front of me. I have >been told that this ran ok about 8 years ago; I really don't >know if this fits the topic of the list (I guess it could >be slightly newer than 10 years). The thing is, it >won't boot. When it is turned on, it flashes several colors >on the monitor, it tests its 16M of RAM and then it aborts >and dumps me to some sort of monitor program. This is what >the screen shows: [screen contents edited out] >Only device number 3, "DZ" seems to be faulty, and is the same >device appearing in the original error. What is this device? The DZ is programatically similar to the DZ for UNIBUS and the DZQ/DZV for Qbus. It is a multiple asynchronous serial line multiplexor (I don't know how many lines on Vaxstations...) I'm not familiar with the 4000/60... but if it is anything like other Vaxstations... the DZ is usually connected to the keyboard and the mouse. If you don't have these, then it may report an error (missing the mouse may be enough). Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by danburrows＠mindspring.com

Yes That is what I am using on mine. Dan > >Thanks for the info; I do have an LK401 keyboard, but >did not plug a mouse yet. I have located a model VSXXX-GA mouse; >I don't know if it came with this machine or with some >of the other DECstation 5000/33 laying around; should this >work? > >

26 years, 11 months

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KIM-1

by channum＠earthlink.net

Hi, Do you know where i could get a kim 1? or do you have one? if so are you willing to sell it? Corey

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Only device number 3, "DZ" seems to be faulty, and is the same >device appearing in the original error. What is this device? DZ represents the serial ports - including the mouse and the keyboard. If you don't have a mouse (like the VSXXX-AA) and a keyboard (like the LK201 or LK401) plugged in, you'll get this error. Tim.

26 years, 11 months

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Question regarding a VAXstation

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Hi Carlos, You can netboot NetBSD on that puppy (see www.netbsd.org/vax/) Does it have a keyboard? DZ errors are usually keyboard problems. --Chuck At 04:49 PM 3/25/99 -0500, you wrote: > >First of all, let me introduce myself to the list. My name >is Carlos Murillo, computer enthusiast and HP collector, though >my collection is still pretty small. Many of my choices when >it comes to computing are influenced by my addiction to automation >and data aquisition. > >I have been lurking for a few weeks now, and I have learned a lot >about classic computing from the members of the list. Thanks >to you all. Now, I would like to ask for advice: > >I have a VAXstation 4000/60 sitting in front of me. I have >been told that this ran ok about 8 years ago; I really don't >know if this fits the topic of the list (I guess it could >be slightly newer than 10 years). The thing is, it >won't boot. When it is turned on, it flashes several colors >on the monitor, it tests its 16M of RAM and then it aborts >and dumps me to some sort of monitor program. This is what >the screen shows: > >KA46-A V1.1-31E-V4.0 >08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB >16MB ><bargraph representing memory tested here> >?? 003 3 DZ 0112 <---loud beep heard here > > >>>> _ > > >I played with several of the monitor commands; in particular, >here are two that seem to give some info about this machine: > >>>> show dev > > VMS/VMB ADDR DEVTYPE NUMBYTES RM/FX WP DEVNAM REV > ------- ---- ------- -------- ----- -- ------ --- > ESA0 08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB > DKA300 A/3/0 DISK 209.81MB FX RZ24 4041 > ..HostID.. A/6 INITR > > >>>> show config > >KA46-A V1.1-31E-V4.0 >08-00-2B-2A-F8-AB >16MB > >DEVNBR DEVNAM INFO >------ ------ --------------------------------------- > 1 NVR OK > 2 LCG OK > HR - 8 PLN FB - V1.1 > 3 DZ ?? 003 0112 > 4 CACHE OK > 5 MEM OK > 16MB= SY=8MB, S0/1=8MB, S2/3=0MB, S4/5=0MB > 6 FPU OK > 7 IT OK > 8 SYS OK > 9 NI OK > 10 SCSI OK > 3-RZ24 6-INITR > 11 AUD OK > > >Only device number 3, "DZ" seems to be faulty, and is the same >device appearing in the original error. What is this device? > >Thanks for any help, > >Carlos. > > >

26 years, 11 months

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FREE apple hard drive Re: Apple question

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Hi! Does it have the cable to connect it to the computer? ThAnX, -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> -----Original Message----- From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 9:16 PM Subject: FREE apple hard drive Re: Apple question >I have an Apple 20SC hard drive that is in unknown condition that I'd be >happy to give away for the postage. Email me off list. >--Chuck > >At 08:41 PM 3/24/99 +0000, you wrote: >>I picked up an Apple Harddisk 20SC and an Apple tape backup 40SC today. >>Which Apples will these work on? Do you need any specail software or >>hardware to use them? >> >> Joe >> > > >

26 years, 11 months

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Fwd: Dec5000/20 needs a home

by Mzthompson＠aol.com

Found on comp.unix.ultrix. Please reply directly to: Rick_Compton(a)siebestc.co Mike Subject: Dec5000/20 needs a home From: Rick Compton <Rick_Compton(a)siebestc.com> Date: Thu, Mar 25, 1999 13:42 EST Message-id: <36FA837A.FF4A1791(a)siebestc.com> I hate to just throw the old gal away but I'm not willing to invest a lot of money in shipping it around the world either. The DEC and I reside in Richmond, VA. Does anybody want it bad enough to come after it? Any suggestions?

26 years, 11 months

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<OT> Free stock shares

by Anthony.Eros＠digital.com

The other gotcha on this one is that it's not Monsterboard, the well-known online job search company, but Monsterbook -- anybody ever heard of it before? Sort of an online version of getting a swell Alphine car stereo or Panaphonic VCR at your local discounters -- close, but no banana... -- Tony -----Original Message----- From: Jim Strickland [SMTP:jim@calico.litterbox.com] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 1999 12:27 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: <OT> Free stock shares Um no. What it SAYS is: "As a special promotion, MonsterBook.com has announced that if and when it files for an Initial Public Offering of shares in the future, within 1 month after the Public Offering of shares it will give you $10 cash (US Currency) for every friend you referred to MonsterBook.com who subscribed before May 1, 1999. Should you earn a Referral Bonus under this promotion, you will be able to choose to receive your Bonus as a cash payment, or to apply it toward the purchase of stock in MonsterBook.com. See agreement below for details " Which means after the stock has gone through its IPO gyrations, THEN they give you your 10 dollars toward stock. AND, according to the fine print, "This offer is limited to the first 1 million people to subscribe to receive the free MonsterBook Internet Directory in the mail, and the maximum Referral Bonus to be paid to any one person will be $500. " It's not a BAD deal, assuming the company lasts long enough to issue stock (and considering they're offering to flush capital down the toilet like that I wouldn't hold my breath) but it sure as heck isn't free stock. > > A US company is giving away free shares (like Yahoo did > at its beginning). They're called Monsterboard and are pretty big. > go to : http://www.monsterbook.com/SignUp2.asp > and sign up, all they want is your demographics. If you don't mind, > please give them my referral No. ( 277673 ). Hurry, they are only > taking the first one million people. They will probably have that > many within about 24 hours. > > If this is an imposition, don't bother with my referral No. If you > wish, register all by yourself. They just want name and address > and e-mail address. Since many of you already make that available, > on this list, I doubt they would have any more information. > > Sincerely yours, > > Jerome Fine > -- Jim Strickland jim(a)DIESPAMMERSCUMcalico.litterbox.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Vote Meadocrat! Bill and Opus in 2000 - Who ELSE is there? -----------------------------------------------------------------------

26 years, 11 months

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sellers market

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 09:36 AM 3/22/99 -0800, you wrote: >> to too high. Some firm's engineer will probably guess right, but >> that firm won't win the auction. The winner will be the firm whose >> engineer was the most overoptimistic. The winning firm won't >> ultimately get as much oil as their engineers promised, meaning the >> firm paid too much. In short, the auction "winner" is Right. But, on eBay, nobody bids on "*Rare* Old computer! Could be an Altair, could be a C-64! Bid first, find out later!". >> This is a particularly clear example because the thing being >> auctioned will have a definite value in the future that is >> unknowable at present. But the winner's curse afflicts auction eBay is not selling futures. It's selling objects which (at least in terms of classic computers) are not being purchased (by us, anyway) with plans to resell at a profit. So for us, if we think an altair is worth $10, and we're outbid, we lose nothing. The guy who bids $10K and wins, may feel it is worth that much to easily and quickly obtain something they want. Again, no problem. The guy who bids $10K and wins, hoping to sell later for more money is either a) a shrewd investor and we're all just jealous, or b) an idiot who is going to lose his shirt. In the case of the latter, all it means is that we have to wait to get the altair for $10 until the fad dies down and we see naked guys wandering the street carrying altairs. (anyone see that beyond.com ad during the oscars? That's me. Only not so thin or good looking, unfortunately.) It's called Delay of gratification. Learn to be patient, all will come to you in its time. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 11 months

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Floppy drive Jumper question

by af-list＠lafleur.wfi-inc.com

Hi, Does anyone happen to have, in some vast catacombs of old manuals/docs, the jumper info for a Panasonic JU-475-2GRJ 5 1/4" floppy drive? Or maybe you can shed some light on what the following sections/jumpers might do? DS/MX DO/DC LR/RD DD/IX/SP AT/AX BX/CX HM/HS/HL MS/MM/HA/OA/DA I'm trying to get this drive working with my ATR8000 (recently resurrected >from the dead) and am not having much luck formatting disks with it. Any help would be much appreciated. Aaron

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by geoffrob＠stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au

--------- > From: Ward D. Griffiths III <gram(a)cnct.com> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Museums > Date: Thursday, March 25, 1999 1:14 > (The FCC stepped in because of complaints > from the close neighbors of folks running TRS-80 Model Ones (or Apple IIs > or Commodore Pets or S-100 boxen) on the other side of an unshielded wall > from a television with rabbit ear antenna in apartment buildings). Our Spectrum Management Agency (or whatever it's called this week) has a less enduser friendly attitude towards dipsticks in fringe areas that think they should be able to watch marginal signals on "rabbit ears" inside a substantial building. It amounts to "Get an outdoor antenna." No outdoor antenna, no valid grounds for complaint. There are no specific regs regarding emf emission >from computers, they have put the onus on the RECEIVER manufacturer to ensure adequate filtering & shielding from unwanted signals. The CB fad of the 70's was a direct cause of this, after it was discovered that perfectly functional CB's would drive certain televisions berserk because of stupid choices of IF frequencies (Amongst other "They did WHAT!" type design, um, features.) If you have a properly installed external antenna (Yagi of some kind - cut for the channels you are trying to receive) and proper coax feed into the set, and you are STILL getting interference, only then will they look into it. This attitude has cured enormous numbers of problems. Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Systems Manager Saint Marks College Port Pirie, South Australia geoffrob(a)stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au

26 years, 11 months

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Dayna File II

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

I found a couple of these surplus. They're external 5 1/4" floppy drives and appear to have a SCSI connector. Does anyone know what system they're for? Are they SCSI? What voltage and polarity is the external power supply? Any details appreciated. Joe

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by dogas＠leading.net

-----Original Message----- From: Eric Smith <eric(a)brouhaha.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Museums >John Lawson wrote: >> So, okay.. I volunteer to hold a DEC-oriented 'open house' (my >> house...) once a month after the TRW swap meet here in Southern >> California. If anyone is interested, let me know. > >Well, geez! You rotten &*$%! :-) ok, now how close are you to an airport again? :) - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net

26 years, 11 months

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Dayna File II

by jruschme＠hiway1.exit109.com

<pre> I found a couple of these surplus. They're external 5 1/4" floppy drives and appear to have a SCSI connector. Does anyone know what system they're for? Are they SCSI? What voltage and polarity is the external power supply? Any details appreciated. </pre> They are SCSI and with the appropriate software would allow one to read PC-format disks on a Mac. Not sure about the adapter, but I *think* one can still find the software at: ftp://ftp.dayna.com/Pub/Macintosh/DaynaFile/ A couple of notes: 1) They've been discontinued for quite a while, so I don't know how well it will work with newer OS releases. 2) Apparently, they equipped them with different types of drives as I've seen ones with 360K, 1.2MB, and even 1.44MB floppy drives. I have to confess that I wouldn't mind finding a cheap one to play with. Unfortunately, the ones I've seen always seem to be out of my range. <<<john>>>

26 years, 11 months

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Dayna File II

by PB14＠leicester.ac.uk

On 25 Mar 99 at 12:21, Joe wrote: > I found a couple of these surplus. They're external 5 1/4" floppy drives > and appear to have a SCSI connector. Does anyone know what system they're > for? Are they SCSI? What voltage and polarity is the external power > supply? Any details appreciated. These probably come under the ten year rule. The oldest ones could be about twelve years old but they were made for several years. They are for reading DOS format 5.25" floppies on a Mac. Dayna made several variants for reading 360K and 1200K disks. I think that you'l need a system extension as well as the hardware itself.The drives should work on virtually any SCSI capable Mac, but they are >from the Mac II generation so don't be surprised if they're incompatible with recent system software. Dayna don't have a great record of supporting older hardware, alas. However these things do pop up rather a lot and the power supply pin outs have been posted on the comp.sys.mac.* news groups in the last year or so, so check out DejaNews. Phil ************************************************************** Phil Beesley -- Computer Officer -- Distributed Systems Suppport University of Leicester Tel (0)116 252-2231 E-Mail pb14(a)le.ac.uk

26 years, 11 months

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Mark-8 microcomputer - interview with Jon Titus

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

On Fri, 26 Mar 1999, Andrew Davie wrote: > Hi Guys and Gals. > No, I'm not "back" but thought you might like an interesting read. > I've been working on interviewing Jon Titus, the creator of the first "home" > computer, the Mark-8 Minicomputer - which was featured in the July 1974 > issue of Radio Electronics. Very nice! Hope this might inspire more people to efforts like this. It is a part of the history that really needs to be documented! > ... One image, of > the RE front cover - was sent to me or I grabbed it from some website - but > alas I can't remember where or by whom. So, if it's yours please contact me > and I'll talk to you about copyright/image theft, etc. Well... judging from the file name, and the (not always subtle) Photoshop cleanup work... B^} It came from my site. You are welcome to it regardless. (at least as much as I can say that, not being a legal representitive of Gernsback Publications) ;^} Only thing I might suggest, would be the addition of a copyright attribution. (which I do in the 'alt' fields of the image link) > Without further ado, point your browser to > http://www.comcen.com.au/~adavie/weird/mark8b.html > I'd really like some feedback on this one - it's taken a fair bit of work! I tried to reply but the mail bounced... In any case... THanks for your efforts! A valuable insight! Regards; -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

26 years, 11 months

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Free stock shares

by jhfine＠idirect.com

A US company is giving away free shares (like Yahoo did at its beginning). They're called Monsterboard and are pretty big. go to : http://www.monsterbook.com/SignUp2.asp and sign up, all they want is your demographics. If you don't mind, please give them my referral No. ( 277673 ). Hurry, they are only taking the first one million people. They will probably have that many within about 24 hours. If this is an imposition, don't bother with my referral No. If you wish, register all by yourself. They just want name and address and e-mail address. Since many of you already make that available, on this list, I doubt they would have any more information. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine

26 years, 11 months

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Victory! (was: seller's market)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 11:47 PM 3/21/99 -0600, you wrote: >I can summarize this whole affair in four statements: You left out a few: >4. The {vultures|speculators} take over and pick the {carcass|hobby} > clean. 5. The fad dies out and the market collapses. 6. The {rubes|investors} begin to bail, selling their {collectibles|investment} for whatever they can get. 7. The poor guys from the beginning buy up the now plentiful supply at rock-bottom prices. In the end, the vultures and poor schmoes are happy, the suckers get fleeced, and all is well with the world. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 11 months

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Next monitors

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Jules, I'm in Orlando, Florida. Joe At 10:19 AM 3/25/99 -0000, you wrote: >>> Anyone need any of these? I found two pallets of them at a scrap place. >>> Looks like 16", 19" and 21" MegaPixel models. > >erm... where are you? I might know a few people in the UK who'd want >these, but don't think they'd want to pay overseas shipping :) > >cheers > >Jules >> >

26 years, 11 months

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sellers market - firearms

by Watzman＠ibm.net

E-Bay banned fire arms for two reasons: First, they couldn't do the background checks or check for stolen weapons. A legally valid reason, but likely an excuse. Second, if someone were assaulted with a weapon bought on E-Bay, the way things are going, E-Bay could be sued, and lose, BIG TIME. That's probably the real reason.

26 years, 11 months

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Mark-8 microcomputer - interview with Jon Titus

by steverob＠hotoffice.com

> http://www.comcen.com.au/~adavie/weird/mark8b.html > I'd really like some feedback on this one - it's taken a fair bit of work! > Cheers > A > adavie(a)mad.scientist.com > Very nice! Steve Robertson - <steverob(a)hotoffice.com>

26 years, 11 months

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Mark-8 microcomputer - interview with Jon Titus

by adavie＠mad.scientist.com

Hi Guys and Gals. No, I'm not "back" but thought you might like an interesting read. I've been working on interviewing Jon Titus, the creator of the first "home" computer, the Mark-8 Minicomputer - which was featured in the July 1974 issue of Radio Electronics. Jon was kind enough to spend a considerable amount of his time typing up memories of the machine and how it all came about. I've placed this on my site, along with a few images. One image, of the RE front cover - was sent to me or I grabbed it from some website - but alas I can't remember where or by whom. So, if it's yours please contact me and I'll talk to you about copyright/image theft, etc. Without further ado, point your browser to http://www.comcen.com.au/~adavie/weird/mark8b.html I'd really like some feedback on this one - it's taken a fair bit of work! Cheers A adavie(a)mad.scientist.com

26 years, 11 months

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pdp-11/83 looking for a good home

by mbg＠world.std.com

As usual, I'm simply forwarding thing along... contact the person in the post... - - - - - We have a PDP-11/83 system (BA123 worldbox, 2 DHQ11, RD54, TK50, LA120, LA324) that is looking for a home. It's running MicroRSTS and is working. We are located in northeast Ohio. Call or email me. Thanks, -- Joe Matuscak Rohrer Corporation 717 Seville Road Wadsworth, Ohio 44281 (330)335-1541 matuscak(a)rohrer.com

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by mbg＠world.std.com

>One rumour was that they took the _last_ complete PDP6 and sold it off >like that :-(. What on earth were they playing at? That's what I had heard... and it had been a working pdp-6 donated by Stanford (I believe)... what a waste... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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PS/2s nicer than expected; some questions

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 24.3.1999 16:47:20 Eastern Standard Time, CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com writes: > That's an extremely confusing statement, as MCA is quite common in > many small-to-medium RS/6000's from just a few years ago. How can > MCA compete against RS/6000's when it's part of many RS/6000's? > > I'm also confused by your statement that "MCA was discontinued", as IBM > continues to sell RS/6000's (both the R50 and the SP system 9076 are listed > in their February 1999 sales brochure) with MCA busses and MCA > cards and MCA peripherals. well, the person I asked didnt expound on his answer. Remember that big blue has different brands and I can only assume that the R6K division didnt like the PC company giving it competition. correction: for CONSUMER machines, MCA was discontinued unfortunately.

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Next monitors

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> Anyone need any of these? I found two pallets of them at a scrap place. >> Looks like 16", 19" and 21" MegaPixel models. erm... where are you? I might know a few people in the UK who'd want these, but don't think they'd want to pay overseas shipping :) cheers Jules >

26 years, 11 months

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Floppy drive Jumper question

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 24, 19:24, Aaron Christopher Finney wrote: > Does anyone happen to have, in some vast catacombs of old manuals/docs, > the jumper info for a Panasonic JU-475-2GRJ 5 1/4" floppy drive? Or maybe > you can shed some light on what the following sections/jumpers might do? > > DS/MX > DO/DC > LR/RD > DD/IX/SP > AT/AX > BX/CX > HM/HS/HL > MS/MM/HA/OA/DA I had a similar problem with my Panasonic drive. It's a slighlty different suffix, but here's what I got when I phoned their tech support: ============================================================================== Panasonic JU-475-2.AGG 5.25" DD/HD (Tech.Support 01344 853508, head office 01924 821010) MX DS multiplex/drive-select DS1..DS4 Drive Select AT AX dual density control: AX latches it on DSn BX CX dual speed control: BX = 2-speed, CX = 360, open = 300 IRD Internal READY signal DD IX SP indicate DISK CHANGED on DSn/Index/Step HM HS HL head load with motor-on/select/in-use MS MM motor start with select/motor-on HA OA DA UA activity LED with (select and in-use)/(select or in-use)/select/(latch function, in-use) 1M force 1MB size (ie, not HD) JX force high speed only HH head load with select GX enable true READY on read-data FX enable true READY on index DR ready enable on select DO ?? door open ?? DC disk changed LR RDY READY NO AR (no)Auto Recall (factory testing) PR factory test 44 64 cylinder precomp for factory test MN factory test MSE factory test ============================================================================== And for interest (OK, mostly mine!) here's some other drive info from my meagre file. If anyone cares to expand upon it for my colection, I'd be grateful for any recieved wisdom: ============================================================================== Teac FD-55-BVU 5.25" set DS1, U2, FG. Remove READY, link XT. ============================================================================== Teac FD55-FB for XT 5.25" DS1 HM SM IU cut READY; MSDOS uses this for DISK-CHANGED ============================================================================== Teac FD55-GFV-17 5.25" DD/HD DS1 FG HG II DC U2 for 360K use DS1 FG LG I DC U2 and remove R19 ============================================================================== Mitsubishi MF504C-310MP 5.25" DD/HD PC-AT/386 link settings; names are conjecture IP no pins SG SB closed 300/360 rpm SS 300 rpm only NO DS0 DS1 closed DS2 MX DS3 DD HR IL IS MM closed motor start with MotorOn MS motor start with Select IR internal Ready? IU In Use? RI closed RD closed Ready? DC closed Disk Changed? then why RD and DC both made? SR Speed Ready? ============================================================================== M4854-35 5.25" DD/HD use DS0-3 as usual; MX = always selected HS HM HC HL : HEAD LOAD with select/motor-on/normal/in-use MM MS : MOTOR START with motor-on/select DC 2S : link both for DISK CHANGED SS SB : SS = 360 rpm; SB = 300/360 rpm I think FG is FRAME GROUND DC DISK CHANGED (instead of READY?) 2S double sided ? ============================================================================== NEC FD1055 5.25" HD/DD -- settings for BBC Micro DCG: 2 USE: 2 HDE: 2 LUS: 1 Note LUS, MON, HS, LED : unclear which pins the labels refer to HS: 1 LED: 1,5 ============================================================================== NEC FD1138H 3.5" HD/DD No jumpers visible ============================================================================== Unmarked 5.25" 40-trk Asia Commercial FD108 solder joint for READY has 2 LEDs 6-way shunt, ??/DS0/DS1/DS2/DS3/MUX set 101000 for AT ============================================================================== Fujitsu M2551A.28 5.25" 40-trk RDY link ============================================================================== Fuji FDD5883AOK (Toshiba) 5.25" HD/DD TM (made) PS (made) LD D4/3/2/1 MUX (link on interface pin2 to GND forces DD, disables HD) DE/DX (made DX) speed fixed-at-fast/depends-on-pin-2 (low=slow) SR DC (made) ============================================================================== TEC ND-352-TH-A 3.5" DD-only has 0-ohm link for RDY/DC DS0/1/2/3 selection OK on BBC Micro ============================================================================== Brother FB-620V 3.5" DD-only (OK side 0; won't write side 1 but reads OK) ============================================================================== TEC ND-356-TA 3.5" DD/HD OK on BBC with DS0 and pin2/?? don't care links DS0/DS1/TZ/?? TZ connects to pin2 (open seems to be OK for DD on BBC) 0-ohm link for RDY/DC ============================================================================== YE Data YD-702-6037 3.5" DD/HD DS0/1/2/3 slide switch P1 closed:LED with inuse or select; open: LED with select and motoron P2 closed disable LED? JP1 connects pin 2 ============================================================================== TEAC FD235-HF 3.5" DD/HD HHO OP LHI pin2 low = HD, high = DD ?? HHI pin2 low = DD, high = HD ?? normal setting seems to be OP and HHI closed; works on 286/386/486dx/BBC or OP closed; works on Carole's 386 and my Intel 486sx tends to give verify hiccups on tracks 9/19/29 etc on BBC OP+LHI works on 286 BBC: pin2 to GND else set LHI ============================================================================== -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

26 years, 11 months

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Apple question

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

I picked up an Apple Harddisk 20SC and an Apple tape backup 40SC today. Which Apples will these work on? Do you need any specail software or hardware to use them? Joe

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Museums

by geoffrob＠stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au

-----Original Message----- From: Mike <dogas(a)leading.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, 25 March 1999 5:13 Subject: Re: Museums >I would also imagine the museum brick and morter will have to be >electronically shielded to allow things like trs-80 mod 1s to operate in a >commercial zone. You're kidding, right? I can't believe even US silly rules are that silly. Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Systems Manager Saint Mark's College Port Pirie, South Australia. Email: geoffrob(a)stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au ICQ #: 1970476 Phone: 61-8-8633-8834 Mobile: 61-411-623-978 Fax: 61-8-8633-0104

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Seller's market

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:58 AM 3/21/99 -0800, you wrote: >You first need to think about how the ebay >auction format results in higher than reasonable prices (since you seem to >have ignored all the arguments I've made to this point) and then see if I seem to have missed the reasons why eBay intrinsicly results in inflated prices. As far as I can tell, the reasons mentioned so far for high prices on eBay are: 1) idiots who don't know they can or are too lazy to find computers cheap at out-of-the-way places only open on Fridays 2) idiots who have too much money 3) too many idiots who want the same stuff as us geniuses 4) bidders who maliciously bid excessively to artificially raise selling prices so that the hated seller has to pay higher fees to eBay 5) eBay wants items to sell for higher prices 6) unsrupulous sellers who shill bid to increase prices (raising the bids of the folks mentioned in #2) Anything I missed? >at least 3 years know that what something sells for on ebay is ridiculous >compared to what its really worth. Well, I've been involved with various collectibles for nearly 30 years, and I have to agree. I bought two Chein tin wind-up Donald Ducks last fall through eBay for ridiculous prices -- about 25% of what I could have turned around and sold them for at any antique show. And the Sharp PC-5000 I got for $15 was pretty ridiculous, considering the significance of the machine. >Think of it this way: if a toy stuffed with beans that cost a couple >dollars to manufacture were to be made for sale in a way which makes >people perceive a scarcity, and that toy was then subsequently priced up >to $1000 because of dealers and price speculators feeding on the perceived >scarcity of that toy, is it really worth $1000? Don't answer that yet. >Now fast forward a couple years in time and the market runs its course, >people are fed up with this toy and don't care about it anymore. The fad >is over, the bottom of the market drops out, and the last sorry asshole to >pay $1000 for a toy stuffed with beans is left holding an item worth maybe >$50 to the person who still hasn't caught on that it was all just an >irrational frenzy to begin with. Hmmm... Sounds like numismatics in the 80's, gold and silver at various times, collector plates, etc., etc., etc. And your point is? Speculators who buy based on fads are idiots. "Buy the book before you buy the coin." Smart folks do their homework before spending a lot of money. No matter what the "investment opportunity!" is, those that get in before it hits big and get out at the peak make a lot of money. Those that don't, don't. (Think back to around 1929...) Btw, I still don't have a Commodore SX-64, one of the few portable versions of an 8-bit home machine, in my collection. There have been a lot up for bid on eBay, but they all seem to sell for just over $100. (The same price as they were going for at VCF 2.0, btw.) That's more than I'm willing to pay for a Commodore 64, no matter how portable. On the other hand, I put out close to $300 for 2 Zorba's (with Shipping from the east coast) that I got through eBay. I don't think that that's a ridiculous price to pay for a rather uncommon machine. (Especially since I'm getting manuals and software, plus a couple of Kaypros, an IBM portable, and a couple of other goodies to go with it.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 11 months

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Apple question

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>> I picked up an Apple Harddisk 20SC and an Apple tape backup 40SC today. >> Which Apples will these work on? Do you need any specail software or >> hardware to use them? > >SC means SCSI so will work on mac plus and later. you'll need sw for the TBU. >for hard drive, just set the ID and termination if needed, and go. if the >hard drive is set to boot id, (0, IIRC) and has a system folder, the mac will boot >from it. '0' is the id Apple traditionally uses for the internal hard drive, though it doesn't have to be. A Mac can boot from a SCSI HD with and id setting (eg. I've booted a Mac Plus off a Zip drive, which can only be set to id 5 or 6). If the hard drive doesn't have a System Folder, you should be able to just copy one off a boot floppy. This will usually work, though you'll have a very minimal system. Tom Owad

26 years, 11 months

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Next monitors

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Anyone need any of these? I found two pallets of them at a scrap place. Looks like 16", 19" and 21" MegaPixel models. Joe

26 years, 11 months

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Apple question

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 99-03-24 19:37:05 EST, you write: > I picked up an Apple Harddisk 20SC and an Apple tape backup 40SC today. > Which Apples will these work on? Do you need any specail software or > hardware to use them? > SC means SCSI so will work on mac plus and later. you'll need sw for the TBU. for hard drive, just set the ID and termination if needed, and go. if the hard drive is set to boot id, (0, IIRC) and has a system folder, the mac will boot >from it. david

26 years, 11 months

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Sellam's market

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 05:35 PM 3/19/99 -0800, Sam wrote: >On Fri, 19 Mar 1999, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > >> 2) boot disk for a Diskon (sp?) It's a CP/M (I think) system built into >> a Televideo terminal housing. It's primary claim to fame is spport for a >> LOT of alternate disk formats (my specialty) > >Is this the same as the Televideo 802? It sounds exactyly as you >describe. I just picked up the computer but no disks came with it >unfortunately. I don't think so. I have a service manual for the 802 and it lists the parts for both the 802 and 806 and none of the major parts are the same. I'm still like to find a 802. Joe

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Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI)

by edick＠idcomm.com

Kits appeal to a much smaller segment of the market. Here in the US, selling kits offers a way to avoid having to meed stringent FCC specifications for electromegnetic interference, among other things. For that reason, if I were going to get into the business of selling a product, I'd let the initial kit sales pay for getting past the FCC testing/approval procedures. That way there would already be kit users out there to assist and teach ready-built product users so I would not have to do that. Kits are often more costly than ready-built products because kit builders fix their mistakes, while you can't expect the user of ready-made stuff to fix your mistakes. Tech support is a necessity, yet most kit builders don't need it. Tech support is what costs when you're selling a ready-built product for the home computer market. What scares me about the notion of resurrecting the really old IMSAI product line is that some of the designs, and this is more true of ALTAIR than of IMSAI, by the way, took the characteristics of the logic family they were using, mostly standard TTL, into consideration and would probably suffer >from glitches and other timing race conditions e.g. metastability if current-generation and available pin-compatible HCMOS or LSTTL logic were substituted. This probably wouldn't be too common, but I've done this (long ago) when these logic families were new, and had mixed-to-poor results. Mostly this was the result of placing a fast decoder where a slow one had previously been specified, and mostly the result was not serious except where one-shots (YUCHK!) and clocked logic were driven by it. This was particularly true in DRAM circuit interfaces. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 5:01 PM Subject: Re: Rebirth of IMSAI >> That's exactly why people don't build kits any more. The price so the >> individual parts is higher than the cost of the commercaily assembled > >There are plenty of reasons for building kits other than the fact it >might be cheaper than a finished product (and I agree, that's unlikely >these days) : > >1) Most kits come with _much_ better documentation that the finished >unit. It's rare to get an electronic kit without a schematic, for example. > >2) Since you assembled it, you know how to take it to bits for repair. > >3) You also know it was assembled correctly. Many finished devices that >I've seen recently were full of dry joints, misfitted parts, etc. > >4) It's a lot easier to modify a kit. > >5) You probably learn something from making a kit. > >6) It's fun :-) > >In case you hadn't guessed, some of us _do_ still build kits, and do >plenty of other things that make no financial sense at all ;-) > >> finished product. You need to find a surplus case that you can use. That >> would save a lot of money. Ditto the power supply and as many other parts >> as possible. > >If I ever produce a computer kit (unlikely, as in the UK, kits have to >meet the same EU directives as the finished unit..), I'd probably offer >at least 4 versions : > >1) Docs only (you get to find all the components, etch PCBs, etc) > >2) Complete kit, including case, PSU parts, connectors, fixings, etc. > >3) PCB + components only. Everything that goes on the PCBs and nothing >else. Well, I might include the mating parts for the connectors, but no >off-board components, metalwork, etc. > >4) 'Rare parts kit'. PCBs + programmed ICs (EPROMs, PICs, etc) + any >other chips that are hard to get. > >-tony >

26 years, 11 months

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CBM bonanza!

by black＠gco.apana.org.au

As anyone who follows any of my posts knows, I'm a dedicate Commie collector-freak. Well, today I scored the jackpot. Went to Glenorchy Tip Shop, one of the women that works there grabbed me & took me out the back (no, my luck hadn't changed) & said "I've been keeping something for you". Some business that had been holding old Commodore inventory dumped 12 removalist boxes (tea chest size) on 'em.... For $50 I scored 6 1571's, 3 1581's, 4 Commodore 128D's, three more 64C's, several CBM modems (1670's), around 40 cartridges, two more MPS 803 printers, two VIC 20's, two Xetec CBM to Centronics adaptors & a multitude of VIC, C64 & C128 software.... everything was still boxed & plastic wrapped.... This'll keep me happy for ..... ohhh.... a week or two :-) (Time to open a Commodore museum I reckon, the house no longer has any room ....... & my partner is threatening to move out.... oh well, the 'puter are more entertaining anyway.....) cheers, Lance

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> I was thinking that the important part of all this is just to get <> SOMETHING started. Don't worry about all the costs of going all out to <> create a computer museum type organization. Just start out with what yo <> can to begin with. Even if that means a garage party every month among <> local collectors then that's a good start. From there, people will get Therein lies the essence of getting going. Inspired comment. Right now Megan and I seem to be the most voluminous collectors on the eastern MA area and we are close to each other. To get something going needs critical mass greater than two. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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Museums

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I hear there are some of the Rt 128 DEC buildings are sitting empty, <perhaps they will give you a discount if you only run DEC equipment in them Even more in the 495 rim, DEC vacated a lot of buildings. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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Rebirth of IMSAI

by edick＠idcomm.com

That's exactly what Todd Fischer was writing about building. I certainly hope he doesn't do it. Those cases or, for that matter, any cases, in low volume, meaning fewer than, say 5000 per week, would be the bulk of the cost of nearly any computer. When you can use the most sophisticated machinery to make a simple product, however, the cost comes back down around $3 per pound. That's why, although I can't buy a decent fan for my power supply for under $40, though I can buy a power supply for $35, I can buy the case, with power supply and a fan, though still not a "decent" fan, for $27. It's the economy of scale. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 4:09 PM Subject: Re: Rebirth of IMSAI >On Wed, 24 Mar 1999, bluoval wrote: >> Why not just build a kit w/out the case, or sell the case seperate? I'd gladly >> buy a kit like that and install it in a metal file cabinet. That'll cut the >> costs, if metalwork is that expensive. > >The separate sales of the case could be the big money maker! I would >think that a lot of the clueless yuppies that overbid for them on e-bay >would be even happier with an "IMSAI" case containing a current Pentium >motherboard. (How many here are familiar with Excalibur cars?) > >-- >Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com ><A HREF="http://www.xenosoft.com">XenoSoft</A> >

26 years, 11 months

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PS/2s nicer than expected; some questions

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>there is info on family 1 and ps2 products. I got from a good source that the >reason MCA was discontinued was because if the bus speed was increased in >order to keep up with PCI, that would have started encroaching on the RS/6K >machines. That's an extremely confusing statement, as MCA is quite common in many small-to-medium RS/6000's from just a few years ago. How can MCA compete against RS/6000's when it's part of many RS/6000's? I'm also confused by your statement that "MCA was discontinued", as IBM continues to sell RS/6000's (both the R50 and the SP system 9076 are listed in their February 1999 sales brochure) with MCA busses and MCA cards and MCA peripherals. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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Rebirth of IMSAI

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

Eric Smith wrote: >Tim Shoppa wrote: >> You forgot one vital component: the switches. The 7101 and 7103 series >> switches used in the IMSAI front panel are still available new from C&K, >> at $5-$6 each. >Hmmm... does that include the handles? Yep. The relevant part numbers for the switches are C&K 7101-J4-Z-Q-E and 7105-J4-Z-Q-E. >Are the correct colors available? C&K was the OEM for the IMSAI switches, and the colors will match what your IMSAI switches looked like when new. (If you've had yours exposed to sunlight, it's possible that the colors have faded.) NKK makes a very similar line of switches, but the colors are very slightly different. >My IMSAI switches are all intact (and factory-original AFAIK), but it wouldn't >hurt to get some spares. If you only need a few, Jim Willing is the guy to buy them from. When I was building TIMSAI's, I needed a few hundred and got a considerable price break by buying from a C&K distributor. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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