- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>> Some options for UNIBUS have a U as the second or third of >> the option name... dhU, dU. But generally, the UNIBUS options >> are two-character names, DL, DH, DZ, VT, etc... As always, there >> are exceptions, like DUP, DMC, DMR... >Is there a guide somewhere that explains what all the codes translate to? Ron Copley's venerable "Field Guide to Q-bus and Unibus Modules" contains, in most cases, the option name as well as the module number in the description. For example: M8053-AA DMV11 Q Microprogrammed controller (needs one of M5930- M5931) (Also M8053-AB, -AC, -ETC) Generally, a "D" at the front means it's some sort of communications option, a "M" means memory, a "K" means CPU, "R" means disk controller, a "T" means a tape controller, an "A" means an A/D or D/A converter, a "V" means some sort of video-related hardware, and "L" means either a line printer or a linear module. I'm sure someone will come up with many options that don't quite fit into this scheme :-). The field guide claims at its top: *This list may always be found on sunsite.unc.edu, in the following *directory: */pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/hardware/field-guide.txt *(Tonnes of stuff here... thanks, Tim!) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

3
2
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Lisp, the machine language. Was Re: Hallelujah!

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>the WD Pascal microengine. Why was it done? In the late 70s Pascal was >emerging as a teaching language and it was highly standardized. Most >small systems had the resources to run it as native compiled but the >authors (UCSD) decided that portable Pcode would allow more platforms >to run it as the Pengine was easier to code than a whole compiler. Not only that, but the P-code was often more compact than the equivalent native machine code. (It's probably even more compact than modern RISCy processor code.) Compactness of code is an enormous advantage in a limited memory-space environment. Tim.

26 years, 11 months

1
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Lisp, the machine language. Was Re: Hallelujah!

by hhacker＠home.com

>Actually, I thought they had microcode or assmebly language. Therefore, >they have a compiler to create the microcode or assembly language. It may >not be well-documented (or advertised) but it's there. > >-- Derek This is a mistaken impression. Actually, microcode is not compiled. For any computer which is microprogrammed, there is a sequence of microinstructions which implements each executable statement of the computer. In the case of the Lisp machine (such as those built by Symbolics - like the 3600), the machine instructions are, in fact, the operators of Lisp. So, there is within the microcode of a List machine a sequence of microinstructions which implements directly the function of a Lisp operator, such as CAR. As it happens, it is easily possible for any of use to obtaine the so-called MacIvory, which is a Lisp machine that operates within the MacIntosh computer. It is a co-processor much like the i860 based board that I bought several years back from MicroWay. The i860 is a single chip implementation of the Cray-1, (you know, Harvard archetecture, and the like), and provides just about the same throughput as the Cray-1. An old high-school buddy of mine worked for Symbolics, and today does Lisp programming at Moffett Field for NASA Ames. He is quite well acquainted with the microcode of the 3600, and it is upon his instruction that I became equally familiar. William R. Buckley

26 years, 11 months

4
3
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Computer busses....

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<This reminds me of the Intersil 6100 which had a special "front panel" mod <designed to hold code and data to run the (presumably flashy) front panel. Same for the 6120 (has EMA interally). IT was presumed due to the micros lack of front pannel you would need startup code or emulation code. <would be getting a 6100). I did the design/layout/prototype of a 6100 CPU They can be found especially the 6120 version. If not a DECMate is a good source(they are hardly rare). Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
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bringing up an 8f...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>> Put boards (all but core) and regulator board in dishwasher and <> dried them in the oven. < <Eek! Really? Does this work? Yep. In the past (over 20 years ago) I used to do it in the sink with a bristle paint brush and some liquid soap. <Were these just the power supply boards, or all of the OMNIBUS <boards too? All but the core plane and front pannel itself. The little cores would not like the blasts of water pusing them around. I didn't want the switches washed out as then I'd have to get some lubricant back into them. I've done this with all sorts of boards to get gunk off them and it's basically how boards are cleaned at factory. HINT, keep the temps below 200f. <I recently got a PDP8/E system (it runs well), with 16K core and <8K solid state memory, and it's really grubby inside, and I've been <thinking about how to clean it all up. Can you share some secrets <on the settings used, ie: do you use any soap in the dishwasher? I put it in and ran standard cycle (short wash). The CORE planes do not ever go in and also if there are switches that can trap water special care may need to be taken. Things must be dry before power up or electrolisys and other bad things happen. Pure water is generally harmless. Soap, I used one of the standard products that seems to work well on glasses. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<have something concrete in mind, too. If one inserts a wire-wrap 62 pin <(8-bit ISA) connector into a DIN 41612 right-angle socket, such as what on <finds on a VME wire-wrap board, but of opposite gender, (remembering that <once sold S-100 wire-wrap boards with a pattern certainly suitable for thi <purpose, and VME wire-wrap cards as well) one can, indeed, host two 8-bit Been there and done that. Also there are no less than two articles on how to go from s100 to ISA. <ISA cards on a single s-100 board. This would certainly be cheap enough i <most cases, to warrant such an effort. The software might get to be a <problem, though. What software problem... since s100 cards tend to be all different anyway it would be the norm that software would have to be created. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<memory mapping would be a mite silly, wouldn't it, given that the HERC use <64K of refresh RAM. I'd say the way to do it is to use a strategy put fort No, you partition in to 16k quads and your off. <by the guys who designed the 6545, the '65xx' version of the 6845. It had <an update register which essentially allowed you to write an address to th <chip and then send a stream of characters, kind of like the cursor <addressing on a terminal. Run a kaypro some time... slower than sludge video. <Some scheme like that would work even in the limited I/O space of a Z-80. <Another option might be to bank the BIOS such that when it's writing to or <reading from the video page, it has a space equal to the disk buffers, whic <works as a window in the display RAM. The refresh of the display would kee <the entire video memory refreshed, while the banking scheme could minimize <the memory consumption of the video device. Full circle. Hence the need for a MMU. Me I'd never use the 6845/herc in graphic modes. For text the Herc cards only need 4k. <The PC certainly has made for cheaper serial/parallel interfaces than we <ever saw for the S-100. It's too bad there were never any truly general Volume will do that. <purpose parallel ports use commonly enough on the PC to make them cheap. <It's only since the adoption of the 1284 standard that bidirectional I/O vi <the printer port has been practical. It's too bad there aren't <i8255-equivalents which can drive something. The problem with my IMSAI <PIO-6 is that it won't even drive an LED directly. That's why things are buffered. the 8255 will drive a few feet of ribbon but generally thngs like ground loops and other anomolies make a buffered interface more robust. At the time of the 8255 heyday the output current was limited by the Nmos process of the time to only a few mA. Now, the CMOS processes can easily do 30-70 mA but... you can still fry them. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
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Hard-sectored 5.25" disks

by fox-1＠aq.nl

Hello everyone, Last week I bought a pile of hard-sectored 5.25" disks. Most are used, but are still in their original plastic box. Most disks have a lable saying: AES diskette, Single Sided, Single Density. Since I'm an Atari 8-bit freak, I don't have a real use for these, however they can be used on 3/4 of my diskdrives since these do not use the index-hole for anything. Someone in an Atari usegroup asked me to write a msg over here before starting to write Atari-data on them. I have some CP/M's laying around, but they seem to work well without the use of hard-sectored disks too, so.... If someone wants them, I'll swap them for anything ATARI-related. If not, I'll just format them, and write Atari 8-bit data on it. Would be nice if someone could pick them up in the south-part of the Netherlands. I have no idea what it would cost to send them by snailmail, cause I have more then 200 of them. please note: I'm not subscribing to this newsgroup, so Email me at: "fox-1 AT aq DOT nl" Sysop Fox-1, Thunderdome, ATARI 8-Bit BBS, +31 416-279990 (21:00 => 8:00 CET)

26 years, 11 months

4
10
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AES 7100

by ds_spenc＠alcor.concordia.ca

Hi again, I conscripted my father to come and help me drag the AES 7100 home today. It doesn't work. The display powers up but nothing is displayed. The drives never turn but their lights shine at the instant the power switch is flipped. I suspect its not working has something to do with several empty sockets on the motherboard, but I can't be sure. Even with it not working, it's an interesting machine. It's a little over 26.5-inches wide, and over 16-inches deep if you include the handles on the back for pulling out the motherboard. The main box is about 4.25-inches high, with a 10.5" green phosphor monitor sitting on top of it, connected with a swivel neck. The top of the monitor sits about 16" above the surface of the table. The disk drive portion of the box is about 10.5" high and 9.25" wide, and is visually disconnected >from the rest of the box in the same way that an Apple III keyboard is visually disconnected from the rest of the III... still built on the same metal frame underneath. The motherboard pulls out on a tray from the back of the machine, with only two screws holding it in. There are numerous holes for ports of various sizes, but most of them have metal plates screwed over them and nothing behind them. Unscrewing the plates usually reveals a picture of a telephone handset beside the hole. There are plenty of post holes in the motherboard in locations that match the holes in the back of the case, so there must have been plenty of options. My own machine only has one small daughtercard sitting on posts, with a 50-pin male edge connector accessible from a hole with a drawing of a printer beside it. There is also a 12-pin female port with a drawing of a printer beside it, with the pins arranged in a 3x4 grid. On the motherboard, there is a Mostek Z80A, probably 4MHz. There are three Z80A PIO chips, and two Z80A CTC chips, and several other large multi-legged critters. There are three 8-chip banks of 4164 DRAMs, with a fourth row left empty. That's quite a bit of memory for a Z80! There is a 24-pin EPROM, with an empty 24-pin socket beside it. There is a set of two other 24-pin chips which might be ROMs. There are two other empty sockets, one with 18 pins and the other with 16 pins. There is a 15.something MHz crytal, and a 24.0000MHz crystal. There is oodles of TTL. Chips range in dates from '79 to '82. The keyboard connector inside the machine is cracked and broken and won't stay in place. The keyboard is larger than it has to be, with lots of photogenic whitespace around the key areas. The area that would normally be a numeric keypad on a normal keyboard has pictograms of unknown function. The key which must be the caps lock lights up when it is hit, but the light doesn't turn off if you hit it again. It only turns off when the keys which must be shift keys are hit. The disk drives are full-height, single-sided. It has a plate with "7100" on the front, but a small plate on the back says "AES Model 203". The monitor has no external controls, but there is what appears to be a trapdoor on the back of the monitor which is screwed shut. Perhaps I should try messing with that before I decide that the machine is definitely dead. There is another machine just like it at the same store, even grimier than this one was. But considering the hassle of hauling and storing this thing, I don't think I'll have the energy to go back for it. -- Doug Spence ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca http://alcor.concordia.ca/~ds_spenc/

26 years, 11 months

8
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Lisp, the machine language. Was Re: Hallelujah!

by hhacker＠home.com

Of course, LISP is also compiled these days... >-- Derek Not if it runs on a Lisp Machine! William R. Buckley

26 years, 11 months

3
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bringing up an 8f...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

Status report: I've rebuilt the power supply. This was done after the following steps: Open PS and remove the bad rectifer bridge and shorted 24,000MFd cap. Vacuum out all the decomposed foam. Put boards (all but core) and regulator board in dishwasher and dried them in the oven. Reassembled and tested power supply in stages. Working. Replaced three fans. No I have the system up and running save for one bit that is stuck (when displaying MD). The display bit is stuck as test programs run verifying it's a front pannel problem. It's bit 1 and only with the switch in the MD position. So far this is good success considering the heaviest test gear used is a multimeter. Also that I don't have a print set for 8E. Allison

26 years, 11 months

3
2
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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by edick＠idcomm.com

What might be fun would be an S-100 card to serve as an interface to a Monochrome/Hercules equivalent card and an IBM-style keyboard, since these can be had complete with the rest of the computer for $5 at nearly any thrift store. That would save the hassle of having an extra keyboard and monitor for your "extra" PC. . . . . you know, the one you stick strange cards in in order to see if they cause the system to "HCF" (Halt and Catch Fire). One of those little switch boxes would serve just fine. The 8.0 MHz Z80 wouldn't be sufficient to drive a VGA, so no need for anything fancy. It could even support two short ISA cards. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, April 03, 1999 6:26 PM Subject: Re: homemade computer for fun and experience... ><IF you can stick the XT keyboard (are keyboards that talk that protocol ><still being made?) then look at the circuit of the PC or XT. The keyboard ><interface is a few TTL chips hung off an 8255. > >At keyboards can be used as well as they are similar (not the same). You'll >have to make a interface as the serial is not compatable with UARTs, also >you will have to convert the key down/Key up codes to something more human. > ><I'd make it modular (in that I'd have expansion slots), but I'd probably ><put the CPU + RAM + basic I/O on the 'motherboard'. For prototyping, ><DIN41612 connectors are easier than edge connectors because you don't ><need special boards with the connector fingers on them. > >An acceptable bus is ISA-8bit and there are plenty of FDC, VIDEO, HDC cards >for that bus that could easily interface to z80. > ><SRAM is a _lot_ easier. And now that 64K SRAM is 2 chips at most (62256's ><are cheap now), I'd use that. DRAM is not too hard until you realise that ><layout and decoupling are critical if you want to avoild random errors. > >Same comment, one proviso, if your doing over 256k consider DRAM and MMU. >a good article for that is at the TCJ site. > ><[For the hardware wizards here : Yes you can homebrew with DRAM - I've ><done it. But not as my first real project]. > >For a z80 system of 64 or 128k static is far easier. Also 128kx8 parts are >cheap so even 256k or 512k ram systems are modest. > >Allison >

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by mbg＠world.std.com

> Wait... will RLV11s go in the 11/44??? That would be major cool, >as well... No, RLV is for Qbus... generally, if you find an option which has a Q or V as the third letter in the option name, it is for Qbus. For example, dlV, dhV, dhQ, dzV, dzQ, vsV, etc... Some options for UNIBUS have a U as the second or third of the option name... dhU, dU. But generally, the UNIBUS options are two-character names, DL, DH, DZ, VT, etc... As always, there are exceptions, like DUP, DMC, DMR... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Zane H. Healy wrote: > >I'e done it with both using the correct backplanes. As I remember the > >SMS1000 is a bit strange in the boot deperatment. Jerome Fine replies: >My box has a single 8" floppy which is DSDD in capacity for a total of >1976 blocks. The drive is also set up the detect SSDD floppy media >as well as DSSD and SSSD media. BUT, the device type is for the >MSCP emulation. AND the DSDD interface switches from side 1 to >side 2 for each cylinder (or track since there is only one double-sided >surface) within the firmware. Since this behaviour is outside the control >of the device driver (MSCP is DU:), the use of DSDD media is quite >a surprise as compared to the RX03 implementation on a DSD >880/30 which uses the same floppy media, but uses the whole first >side of the media followed by the second side of the media as >programmed within the DY(X).SYS software device driver in >RT-11. These block-numbering issues are addressed by Chester Wilson's "DYC" handler, to an extent. To quote from the documentation: *This handler is designed for Sigma/Dilog RX03 controllers, with optional *assembly for DEC, MTI, and DSD ones. It may need minor modification *(notably to the extended addressing and formatting code) for other *manufacturers' boards. *... *In version 4, support for the SMS flavour of RX03 format has been added *(courtesy of discs from Billy Youdelman). Sources to this code are available at http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/rt/bill… This code also knows how to format completely blank floppy disks into DEC-compatible RX01 or RX02 on many third-party controllers under RT-11/TSX. >As soon as I finish my tax returns and clean up a few other >things Don't you have till April 30th up there? (I have to get the Canadian forms for the money I earned in Canada last year, still...) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

1
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Apple stuff....

by roblwill＠usaor.net

>Geez! Trade em some more modern hardware for what you want/need. I've >been giving away lots of Mac IICi's for the last 2 years now, since >the university here keeps throwing em away. Another department here >has been trying to sell mac IICi's for $15 each, and it doesnt look like >they are selling em at that price. > Where are you located? I wouldn't mind getting one of those Macs. My church has also been looking for a couple old Macs for their education center, since there's a Mac guru that goes to my church (anyone need System 7.5 or System 7.5.x updates??) >I dont have any TRS-80's in my collection (except one mutant model 4), >and if they have any REAL apple II's (ie, not a plus model, the real >integer basic II's), it would seem to be a nice trade.. I imagine >they would love a 486 system, or even a good 386, if all they have >are TRS-80's and Apple II series computers. > I think They have a couple that they use (at least they did when I went there) for their card scanner (for bubble-sheet tests). The only TRS-80 that I have is a fried Model III that I've gutted and am trying to convert it using some old Tandy 1000 parts (anyone know how to connect a TRS-80 monitor to a CGA or composite output?) -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> >-Lawrence LeMay >lemay(a)cs.umn.edu >

26 years, 11 months

5
7
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4116's and other memory

by edick＠idcomm.com

If they're Intel parts, I think they're a variation of the 2117, which is an Intel version of the 4116. It may, however, be the other way around, i.e. the 2117 may be the variant. Back in those days, Mostek was the leader in DRAM technology and the 41xx number is essentially theirs, though other manufacturers used it as well. The National numbers differed from this practice. Their equivalent was the MM5290. I'll have to go back and verify all this, but I do believe that they can safely be replaced with 4116's or their equivalent. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 2:58 PM Subject: Re: 4116's and other memory >Dick, > > I have a machine that uses 2116s. What are they? Fortunately I don't >need any at the moment but let me know if you have any so I'll know where >I can get them if I have to. > > Joe > >At 10:57 AM 3/29/99 -0700, you wrote: > >>If you have other "old" memory needs, e.g. 2115's (Intel 1kx1's, 25 ns) or >>maybe something equally out of date, let me know where you would use them >>and maybe I can help you out. >> >>Dick >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Megan <mbg(a)world.std.com> >>To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers >><classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> >>Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 10:43 AM >>Subject: Re: Picture of my latest haul >> >> >>> >>>>Who was the nut who mounted the CPU units near your ankles? Looks like >>>>you're suposed to lie on your belly in order to read the displays and >>>>toggle the switches! >>> >>>Well, the lowest of the machines (the pdp-8/e and pdp-8/f) were >>>actually not even configured for operation... they were simply >>>stuck in the racks, taking up space. The 8/f now has a home with >>>Allison, so there is empty space in the 11/34 rack... which I will >>>probably fill with an RL01 (or RL02 if I can find one). >>> >>>The pdp-8/a, which doesn't have any blinkenlights, was the actual >>>operating machine for the person who owned it before... its >>>backplane can handle a hex board, which was required for the RL8 >>>controller, apparently. >>> >>>The 8/e is currently out of the rack as I figure out what I'm going >>>to do next... >>> >>> Megan Gentry >>> Former RT-11 Developer >>> >>>+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ >>>| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | >>>| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | >>>| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | >>>| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | >>>| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | >>>| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | >>>+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ >>> >> >> >

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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Messed up Apple (clone) video

by ds_spenc＠alcor.concordia.ca

Hi, Along with a dead 4116 (which I recently replaced with a hacked 4164), my Microcom II+ (Apple II+ clone) has a video problem which has kept me >from using it for the past few years. Usually when it's cold, the display is a complete mess. As it warms up, the image becomes clear but in four parts. Each quarter (corner) of the screen is a mini-image of what should be displayed on the whole screen. Out of each group of four pixels of what would be displayed normally, each will be displayed in a different quadrant of the screen. After about 10 minutes, the screen becomes normal, with occasional "zaps" and returns to the quartered screen image. Just about everything in the II+ is TTL, so it's probably just a matter of knowing which piece of TTL to replace. Does anyone know? I'm looking at the schematics (for a _real_ Apple II) now, but I have no idea how to locate the problem because there are several lines leading to the video output, and the problem chip may be farther back into the curcuitry and not connected directly to the output. I know that some of you are fairly expert with Apple hardware. I want to get the Microcom II+ working because it's the only machine I've got that's capable of using my Z80 Softcard or my SMC-II Light Pen. Neither will work in my Apple //e. Besides, it also has a better keyboard than the //e, once it's been worked in to cure the 'bounce'. (As an addition note on the machine's history: The machine was repaired at the Microcom store in early 1987, and it came back with a loose, drifty keyboard. I found out the reason was that the keyboard's curcuit board had been cracked and the keyboard only works if it's not screwed in too tightly. I'll get around to looking at that after the video is fixed. It's just one corner that's folded a bit, but there are traces on there! The keyboard tends to report the wrong characters when it's screwed in properly.) -- Doug Spence ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca http://alcor.concordia.ca/~ds_spenc/

26 years, 11 months

2
2
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4116's and other memory

by edick＠idcomm.com

In the event any of those reading this list are in truly desperate need of 4116's to resuscitate you elderly computers, please let me know. I have a supply of these which though limited is excessive. They're yours for the postage, provided you have an otherwise running system in which to use them. There should be no need for disfuguring an original board in order to make a part foreign to its design work in place of what belongs there. I also, incidentally, have some of the 18 (?) -pin dual DRAMs made for the Apple-III's memory board, and, in fact, have a spare apple-iii memory daughterboard which is serving no useful purpose here. If you've got an apple-III with memory problems, perhaps this is for you. If you have other "old" memory needs, e.g. 2115's (Intel 1kx1's, 25 ns) or maybe something equally out of date, let me know where you would use them and maybe I can help you out. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Megan <mbg(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 10:43 AM Subject: Re: Picture of my latest haul > >>Who was the nut who mounted the CPU units near your ankles? Looks like >>you're suposed to lie on your belly in order to read the displays and >>toggle the switches! > >Well, the lowest of the machines (the pdp-8/e and pdp-8/f) were >actually not even configured for operation... they were simply >stuck in the racks, taking up space. The 8/f now has a home with >Allison, so there is empty space in the 11/34 rack... which I will >probably fill with an RL01 (or RL02 if I can find one). > >The pdp-8/a, which doesn't have any blinkenlights, was the actual >operating machine for the person who owned it before... its >backplane can handle a hex board, which was required for the RL8 >controller, apparently. > >The 8/e is currently out of the rack as I figure out what I'm going >to do next... > > Megan Gentry > Former RT-11 Developer > >+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ >| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | >| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | >| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | >| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | >| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | >| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | >+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ >

26 years, 11 months

4
3
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Apple stuff....

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Does anyone have (or know where to get) an old (b/w) Apple ImageWriter printer for under $20? I also need a cable to connect an Apple //c to a printer. ThAnX, -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1>

26 years, 11 months

6
5
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Hard-sectored 5.25" disks

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 06:34 AM 3/28/99 -0500, Doug wrote: >Maybe next month I'll drag home something with an 8" drive. :) > Doug, how far are you from British Columbia? I know where there's a Tektronix 4051 AND a 4052 up for sale. Both can use optional 8" drives, I think they have drives but I'm not sure. I'm in Florida, so it's a mite too far for me to go get. Joe

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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New arrivals to the Vintage Computer Festival Archives!

by bill＠chipware.com

> They've gotten bent and misaligned during the journey this thing took from > General Electric's Nuclear Division to my warehouse. Uh... Doesn't glow in the dark does it?

26 years, 11 months

4
3
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by jpl15＠netcom.com

This message is for Zane Healy, but I thought it would maybe help some others on The List. First: Many, Many thanks to Dave Jenner, from whom (in Seattle) I recieved a kilopound of RL02s and related items. I am still sorting thru things, in a desperate pitched battle to reclaim at least part of my house from my 'collection' ;] In a box (from Dave, IIRC) I have found (3) three RLV11 cardsets, the printsets for same, and the printsets and drawings for the RL01 and 02. This is kinda like going thru the pockets of an old coat and finding a couple of hundred-dollar bills (pound notes, Deutschmarks, Rupees, etc...) I know that Zane has successfully attached RL02s to his 11/73, and I wanna do that, too... The 11/73 has an RQDX2 and one RX02 8"... tell me how much more info to provide and I'll do that. I'm going to try to install the boards, but the little backplane is stuffed and I need to re-arrange some things. Wait... will RLV11s go in the 11/44??? That would be major cool, as well... I need so much more doc than I have here right now, and my ISDN line is down (thanks a bazillion, GTE) so surfing the web's a pain... waah waaaahh wahh whiney luser lart lart lart. Cheers and Thanks John

26 years, 11 months

5
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FW: Many older computer books, software manuals, and electronic data books (last chance moving sale)

by kyrrin＠my-dejanews.com

I don't know if this fellow has anything of interest or not, but the documentation hunters may want to contact him directly... -=-=- <break> -=-=- On Sun, 04 Apr 1999 03:41:25 GMT, in comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc you wrote: >>From: Tiger(a)nospam_address.org (Tiger) >>Newsgroups: alt.marketplace.books,misc.books.technical,comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc,misc.forsale.computers.other.misc >>Subject: FS: Many older computer books, software manuals, and electronic data books (last chance moving sale) >>Message-ID: <371bde4e.25263337(a)news.silcom.com> >>X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 >>X-No-Archive: yes >>MIME-Version: 1.0 >>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >>Lines: 56 >>Date: Sun, 04 Apr 1999 03:41:25 GMT >>NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.71.222.92 >>X-Trace: newsfeed.avtel.net 923197029 207.71.222.92 (Sat, 03 Apr 1999 19:37:09 PST) >>NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 19:37:09 PST >>Organization: Avtel Communications >>Path: news1.jps.net!news-west.eli.net!newsbox.grin.net!uunet!ffx.uu.net!in2.uu.net!WCG!newsfeed.avtel.net!not-for-mail >>Xref: news1.jps.net alt.marketplace.books:777 misc.books.technical:28 comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc:95 misc.forsale.computers.other.misc:212 >> >>x-no-archive: yes >> >>I'M MOVING VERY SOON. If these items are not gone in a couple weeks they >>will be donated to charity, or I will keep and pay to move them. >> >>Please see the end of this message for my correct email address. >>------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>BOOKS - I have a couple hundred computer books, programming books, >>electronic data books, and technical books (a lot of reference books are for >>Apple and Amiga, such as the Addision-Wesley series) -- most are from the >>1980's. I also have a few math and physics textbooks. >> >>If someone were to buy all my books I'd probably sell most of them at an average >>price of $2-$3 each (less if you pick them up in person). There are a few, such >>as the Apple and Amiga development/technical books that I'd want more than >>$5 each. >> >>SOFTWARE MANUALS - a couple hundred manuals without the disks for things like >>Borland Turbo products, Microsoft products (C/C++, Visual Basic, FoxPro, etc), >>DBase III+ and IV, Autocad, etc. If someone were to buy all of these, I'd >>probably sell most of them at an average price of $1 each (less if you pick them >>up in person). >> >>Please look at my lists and feel free to ignore the prices and make reasonable >>offers. My main criteria are: I have to get enough money to make the transaction >>worth the effort and the amount needs to be reasonably close to what I think >>I'll get from my charitable donations. >> >>All of my lists are at: >> >>http://www.silcom.com/~tiger >> >>As I mentioned above, if you can come by Santa Barbara, California, and pick up >>a lot of stuff in person we'll work out a really good deal. You don't have to >>buy *everything* to get a great price but it needs to be a signficant amount. >>I'm tired of wasting my time on small transactions. Anything under $50 is small >>in my eyes and barely worth the trouble. I don't start to get too interested >>until the amount exceeds $100. I have a total of about 500 books to thin out >>in less than 2 weeks (all deals need to be worked out by the end of next week). >>Selling a few books here and there doesn't make a dent. I want someone to >>clean me out of most of my books! Aren't there any computer book museum >>collectors? >> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>Send email to tiger(a)silWXYZcom.com - Remove WXYZ to reply. >> >>For other computer hardware, software, and books for Amiga, Apple, Atari, >>Commodore, IBM, Macintosh, and TI-99/4A please visit my web page at: >> http://www.silcom.com/~tiger >> >>I'm requesting a $20 minimum transaction (before shipping). Money orders >>are required because I no longer have time to wait for checks to clear. >> >>This will probably be the last time I post these items for sale. If you're >>interested in something, buy it now or never. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies -- kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech [dot] com Web: http://www.bluefeathertech.com "...No matter how we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them..."

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by edick＠idcomm.com

memory mapping would be a mite silly, wouldn't it, given that the HERC uses 64K of refresh RAM. I'd say the way to do it is to use a strategy put forth by the guys who designed the 6545, the '65xx' version of the 6845. It had an update register which essentially allowed you to write an address to the chip and then send a stream of characters, kind of like the cursor addressing on a terminal. Some scheme like that would work even in the limited I/O space of a Z-80. Another option might be to bank the BIOS such that when it's writing to or reading from the video page, it has a space equal to the disk buffers, which works as a window in the display RAM. The refresh of the display would keep the entire video memory refreshed, while the banking scheme could minimize the memory consumption of the video device. The PC certainly has made for cheaper serial/parallel interfaces than we ever saw for the S-100. It's too bad there were never any truly general purpose parallel ports use commonly enough on the PC to make them cheap. It's only since the adoption of the 1284 standard that bidirectional I/O via the printer port has been practical. It's too bad there aren't i8255-equivalents which can drive something. The problem with my IMSAI PIO-6 is that it won't even drive an LED directly. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, April 03, 1999 8:54 PM Subject: Re: homemade computer for fun and experience... ><What might be fun would be an S-100 card to serve as an interface to a ><Monochrome/Hercules equivalent card and an IBM-style keyboard, since these > >They do exist! Hercules made cards for the s100 machines that ran DOS! > ><Fire). One of those little switch boxes would serve just fine. The 8.0 MH ><Z80 wouldn't be sufficient to drive a VGA, so no need for anything fancy. > >Why not? I'm currently planning to use ISA16 and herc video for a z280 >system. Z280 has a 16 bit bus mode. The only thing needed to support >herc using a z80 is a MMU to allow mapping the display out of the address >space so that you have room for CP/M. I've done some testing to verify >this will work. > ><It could even support two short ISA cards. > >More if you buffer the bus! > >Allison >

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

Floor tiles

by william＠ans.net

Here is a dumb question... Are European floor tiles for computer rooms 2 feet square, like those found in the U.S., or are they smaller? I am trying to find out how big the ETA-10P Pipers are, and I have picture that has a floor tile as a reference. The image, http://www.tno.nl/instit/fel/museum/computer/eta10p.jpg, is rather funny looking, as the people make the box look small. William Donzelli william(a)ans.net

26 years, 11 months

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RL02->11/73 more info

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I have three Sigmas... but 2 DEC 11/23 chassis... [BA11-N] hmmm. BA11N is the box you want to use a RLV11 in! Pop that puppy in with a 11/23 (m8189) and your cooking. Allison

26 years, 11 months

4
3
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Computer busses....

by edick＠idcomm.com

-----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Tuesday, March 30, 1999 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Computer busses.... >> >> You've hit most of the important signals. One I'd add, however, is a data >> bus disable, and perhaps an address bus disable as well. This would allow a >> front panel or other bus mastering device to steal cycles under certain >> circumstances. > >He's got BUSreq/BUSack. That's all you really need for a DMA device (at >least if those signals have similar definitions to the Z80 ones of that >name). When the Z80 gets a Busreq, it tri-states the internal >address/data buffers IIRC, and you can use BUSack to tri-state the >external ones that you should have added. While it's true that's all you'd need, it's not all you might want, and while I agree that you can and probably should do that, I've actually seen it done more by using the processor to do much of the work by jamming a jump to a front-panel-or diagnostic-card-resident monitor. I doubt, however, that I've seen this stuff more than a dozen times altogether. I've seen plenty of front-panels which were connected only to make the lights blink. >A frontpanel can easily be implemented as a DMA device using those signals. > >-tony >

26 years, 11 months

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RL02->11/73 more info

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I flesh out an 11/23, attach the RLV11/RL02s, put in one of the <several OSes that seem to be bootable, and press the big "Go" <button. Now.... < < Doesn't the OS on the disk have to be made specific to the <processing environment it is living in? Like, sysgenned for instance?? < < Excuse what might be an obvious d'oh! but this is how I learn.. Good point... Depends on the OS though. For RT11 it has to be set up to boot from the device and media in use but will after that run with any cpu (I've done it for 11/03 through 11/73). Unix will be fussier. RSTS and RSX-11 configure after boot for the CPU and envirnment it finds. generally if the software is configured for say an 11/23 it will run on the 11/73, 11/83 and 11/93. There is a good change it will also run on the /03 if it RT11 if not the XM (requires the MMU the 11/03 does not have). most of the 11s are very compatable at a general level. < Also I think it is most cool that you folks are taking time to <help get these neat old systems and thier software up and flying again. I have a operating 11/23 in a shoebox (BA11VA) with tu58. An 11/23B in a BA11n and a 11/73 in a ba11s the later two have assorted disks and all. the 11/23b is one I used while at DEC dataing back to 84 in the mill. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<What might be fun would be an S-100 card to serve as an interface to a <Monochrome/Hercules equivalent card and an IBM-style keyboard, since these They do exist! Hercules made cards for the s100 machines that ran DOS! <Fire). One of those little switch boxes would serve just fine. The 8.0 MH <Z80 wouldn't be sufficient to drive a VGA, so no need for anything fancy. Why not? I'm currently planning to use ISA16 and herc video for a z280 system. Z280 has a 16 bit bus mode. The only thing needed to support herc using a z80 is a MMU to allow mapping the display out of the address space so that you have room for CP/M. I've done some testing to verify this will work. <It could even support two short ISA cards. More if you buffer the bus! Allison

26 years, 11 months

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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>RT11 will run in more than 256k (mine has 2mb). The RLV11 however limits >you to 256k, though you could write your one handler... nah. It doesn't really limit RT-11... what it does do is require that any I/O transfers must occur entirely in the low 256kb of memory. This would require you to ensure that all programs which are going to do I/O to the device have their user buffers in the low 256kb of memory. As for writing your own handler... you could instead make modifications to the DL handler such that it 'trampolines' the data from a user buffer anywhere in memory to a system buffer (maybe in the handler) which is assured to be in the low 256kb, and do the transfer from there... That is a technique which other OSes have done to take care of the problem... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

1
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RL02->11/73 more info

by mbg＠world.std.com

>BA11N is the box you want to use a RLV11 in! Pop that puppy in with a >11/23 (m8189) and your cooking. There are a couple of different backplanes which could be in a BA11-N box. Some are Q/Q and some are Q/CD... I've had BA11-N boxes with both. One of my 11/83 systems is in a BA11-N box with a Q22/Q22 backplane... So be careful, check the backplane type first... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

1
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PC Magazine, LA120, PDP-11/34

by mbg＠world.std.com

Jerome Fine <jhfine(a)idirect.com> wrote: >Also, a few cabinets that hold the RL02 drives. I will >probably have to let go of the RL02 drives as well, but >not for about a year. > >This stuff is too heavy to ship and I don't have the facility >to box it in any case. Local Pickup ONLY - Toronto. Darn.. with the 11/34a I got recently, I sure could use an RL02 to put on it... Too bad it is local pickup only... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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RL02->11/73 more info

by mbg＠world.std.com

> The backplane is third-party, not DEC, and has integral >termination (no terminator card per se.) It has 8 quad-height slots. > > 1A-B M8192YB 1C-D MTI MXV22 (RX11 clone) > 2A-B MTI MLV11M HD cont. 2C-D ?? 306 BootRoms etc. > 3A-B M8043 quad SLU (console) 3C-D blank > 4A-B Camintonn MLV11-J 4x SLU 4C-D blank > 5A-B blank 5C-D blank (was Pertec VRG-Q) > 6A-B Camintonn 256KW MOS [4164] 6C-D blank > 7A-B blank 7C-D blank > 8A-B blank 8C-D blank This is surely a strange configuration... the fact that there are individual boards in the CD side of things indicates that it is probably a Q-Q backplane, in which case you surely should NOT plug the RLV11 into it. But the confusuing thing is the fact that you ahve so many blank slots where one would expect a grant continuity card if it were Q-Q... "Is it a puzzlement..." Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by mbg＠world.std.com

Sorry, should have completed that message... the option you need for UNIBUS to run the RL drives is an RL11. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

1
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RL02->11/73 more info

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

> This I can do... electromechanically. I think I know the answer >to the next question, but For the Record: > > I flesh out an 11/23, attach the RLV11/RL02s, put in one of the >several OSes that seem to be bootable, and press the big "Go" >button. Now.... > > Doesn't the OS on the disk have to be made specific to the >processing environment it is living in? Like, sysgenned for instance?? "It depends". RT-11 is pretty versatile, and not awfully picky about being booted on a particular type of processor. (With the exception, oh, of trying to boot RT11XM on a 11/03...!) RSX-11M and M+ will complain if a peripheral specified in the SYSGEN isn't there in the boot process, but generally the base OS will come up all the way. RSTS/E can be very picky about what hardware it'll work on, but as long as you stick to the autoconfigure rules you're OK. Many of the PDP-11 Unices can be quite particular, especially if you're booting a non-Generic kernel. All of the above *can* be made to break on anything except a particular hardware configuration, but generally this takes a bit more effort. One thing you'll have to realize is that your current hard drive controller is emulating a RL02, and you won't be able to use it along with a "real" RL02 unless you do a SYSGEN or otherwise (there are some shortcuts) put a second DL:-type driver into the system. You'll also have to set one piece of hardware and one of the drivers to different CSR's and vectors. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

homemade computer for fun and experience...

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>What might be fun would be an S-100 card to serve as an interface to a >Monochrome/Hercules equivalent card and an IBM-style keyboard Compupro did a similart thing over a decade ago ... it's called the "PC Video" S-100 card. >thrift store. That would save the hassle of having an extra keyboard and >monitor for your "extra" PC. I dunno - to me the most useful possible console interface is a serial port. I can hook a terminal up, I can hook a VAX up, I can hook a PC-clone up, etc. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

HP 88780 9-track tape drive

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Sergey Svishchev <svs(a)ropnet.ru> wrote: > When tape is loaded, both "1600" and "6250" are highlighted on front panel. Looking in the 7979A/7980A/7980XC users's guide (those are other model numbers for the HP drive), I see that means the drive thinks that a "tape of unknown density" has been loaded. That's different than a blank tape, for which it would leave all the density lights off. -Frank McConnell

26 years, 11 months

1
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RL02->11/73 more info

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< The RX02 is a single Mitsubishi 1/2 height 8". It's not an RX02 but one of the workalikes, RX02 (DEC) are control data with DEC boards and are very full height. < Question: Is the RLV11 appropriate and if so, which slots do they <go in? No, not for that box. However the backplane sounds like 18 slots of AB bussing and not the AB/CD bussing you need). The key is the two cards in the right hand slots. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Hmm, if the RLV11's go into a ABCD backplane, and the BA11 is such a <backplane (18 bit all 9 slots have CD connected) could you plug a backplan <into the BA11 using one of those extender ables (two dual connectors on <each end) ? Yes but your still limted to 256k of ram (not a big problem) and you must follow all the bus grant rules! It does work. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<both ABCD. In a BA23 box, the top 3 slots are ABCD. I presume <that if you put the CPU in the top slot and the RLV11 in the 2nd and <third slot, it might work. Has anyone ever done that successfully? NO, Dont! There is a different backplane that would fit and work but the standard (BA23) one is not usable with RLV11. Most BA11 (S or N) boxes have the right one though. <Also, if you are running RT-11, you can still use more than 256 KBytes <in the system, just don't try to do it with the RLV11. PIP can <copy anything from the RL02s to the RD53 and then let you use <the rest of the memory over 256 KBytes. RT11 will run in more than 256k (mine has 2mb). The RLV11 however limits you to 256k, though you could write your one handler... nah. <The RQDX2 allows RD51, RD52, RD53. It is a quad board (a -YB). <Most will not accept an RD52 from an RQDX1 without re-format. RQDX1 and 2 are the same board with different firmware. The later RQDX2 has knowledge of RD50->53 where the RQDX1 only knows the RD50->52. The later RQDX3 (dual width rhater than quad) required the reformatted drives as it's slightly differnt format. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Wait... will RLV11s go in the 11/44??? That would be major cool, <as well... NO! RLV-11 two board set is for Qbus and it must be a Qbus with CD bussing (Q-CD), also that controller can only DMA to 18bits (256k). The later is not much of a problem though as a pdp11 with 256k is a fair system. Allison

26 years, 11 months

1
0
0 0

XCOMP STS HDC

by edick＠idcomm.com

Has anyone seen or managed to get hold of a CP/M 2.2 driver for the XCOMP STS Hard Disk Controller. I've got this controller, and have decided, tentatively, to use it in hooking up one of my antique 8" Shugart hard disks. It handles only one drive and that's what fits in the box, concurrently with an 8" floppy drive. If anyone has machine readables of this stuff, I'd really appreciate a copy. Dick

26 years, 11 months

1
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0 0

PC Magazine, LA120, PDP-11/34

by jhfine＠idirect.com

I have a large number of PC Magazine from 1988 to 1994 and they must go. Also, 2 * LA120 working before last stored about 2 years ago Also a PDP-11/34 was working when I received it about 6 months ago. Also, a few cabinets that hold the RL02 drives. I will probably have to let go of the RL02 drives as well, but not for about a year. This stuff is too heavy to ship and I don't have the facility to box it in any case. Local Pickup ONLY - Toronto.

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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RL02->11/73 more info

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

> The backplane is third-party, not DEC, and has integral >termination (no terminator card per se.) It has 8 quad-height slots. > > 1A-B M8192YB 1C-D MTI MXV22 (RX11 clone) > 2A-B MTI MLV11M HD cont. 2C-D ?? 306 BootRoms etc. > 3A-B M8043 quad SLU (console) 3C-D blank > 4A-B Camintonn MLV11-J 4x SLU 4C-D blank > 5A-B blank 5C-D blank (was Pertec VRG-Q) > 6A-B Camintonn 256KW MOS [4164] 6C-D blank > 7A-B blank 7C-D blank > 8A-B blank 8C-D blank > Question: Is the RLV11 appropriate and if so, which slots do they >go in? Not appropriate - you have no CD slots at all in this backplane. It looks like it's either a serpentine or zig-zag ABAB layout. Is this a Sigma box/backplane, by any chance? If so, it probably has a big yellow warning sticker inside telling you that if you plug in anything that expects to use the CD slots for its own purposes, you'll end up letting the magic smoke out (or something to that effect.) Move the cards to a more conventional DEC backplane and you can probably use the RLV11 just fine. Alternatively you could just go out and spend the bucks for a RLV12 (they were only about $150 a few years back.) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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HP 88780 9-track tape drive

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Yesterday four geeks (including myself) had tried to convince a HP 88780 >9-track SCSI drive (cleverly disguised as Tandem 5160) to accept 6250 bpi >tapes. It works OK at 1600 bpi, but refuses to admit it knows about 6250: >"mt setdensity 3" on a Linux box results in "Incompatible media installed" >error (when the tape written at 6250 bpi is loaded.) You shouldn't have to do the setdensity operation; the drive ought to be able to read the 6250 BPI drive in any event. What happens when you try to read the 6250 BPI tape? Historically, the SCSI commands for selecting tape drive density have been either ignored or misinterpreted by everyone throughout the years. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

2
1
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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Hmm, if the RLV11's go into a ABCD backplane, and the BA11 is such a >backplane (18 bit all 9 slots have CD connected) could you plug a backplane >into the BA11 using one of those extender ables (two dual connectors on >each end) ? It's not exactly clear to me what you're asking, Chuck. If you're asking a general backplane expansion question, the answer is probably contained in Micronote 29, *Q-bus Expansion Concepts*, available over the web from http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/microno… Only the AB slots are continued between backplanes, not the CD slots, in any conventional configuration. Note that there are both 18-bit and 22-bit bus cable-cards; the M9400/01 series are 18-bits, and the M9404/05 series are 22-bits. For more information on 22-bit vs 18-bit options, see Micronote 5, *Q22 Compatible Options*. According to Micronote 5, not only does the RLV11 pay attention only to the low 18 bits, it also uses backplanes pins BC1 and BD1 for purposes other than BDAL18 and BDAL19, so other things are likely to break if its plugged into a 22-bit backplane. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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RL02->11/73 more info

by jpl15＠netcom.com

Thanks to Tim, Jerome and Tony D. so far. I have more info after dragging the little puter out of it's rack. The backplane is third-party, not DEC, and has integral termination (no terminator card per se.) It has 8 quad-height slots. 1A-B M8192YB 1C-D MTI MXV22 (RX11 clone) 2A-B MTI MLV11M HD cont. 2C-D ?? 306 BootRoms etc. 3A-B M8043 quad SLU (console) 3C-D blank 4A-B Camintonn MLV11-J 4x SLU 4C-D blank 5A-B blank 5C-D blank (was Pertec VRG-Q) 6A-B Camintonn 256KW MOS [4164] 6C-D blank 7A-B blank 7C-D blank 8A-B blank 8C-D blank The HD is a Rodime and boots RT11SJ Ver 5.02 The RX02 is a single Mitsubishi 1/2 height 8". The system boots and runs as it is above. LP and LQ are on the second (3rd party) SLU, and the RT11 complains on boot if it's taken out. SHOW DEV shows TT; LD; DL; DY; LP; LQ; NL: VM; and XL. Question: Is the RLV11 appropriate and if so, which slots do they go in? Thanks again for everyone's help Cheerz John

26 years, 11 months

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first DEC machine

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi r, ---------- > From: R. Stricklin (kjaeros) <red(a)bears.org> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: first DEC machine > Date: Saturday, April 03, 1999 8:55 AM > I'm beginning to think that there should be a card to plug into the two 40 > or so pin headers, and that this card is what actually provides the SPX > graphics the machine supposedly had. It's not there. YES ! That should be a good idea. I tried this on my box, removed the color option and i got the same LED configuration. But don't forget : without the color option, you still have a monochrome workstation. Only problem is, if you don't get the color option, you need a different cable for the monitor. (the monochrome signal is not simply on the green one, would be to simple ;-)) So you have the BC19S cable which is the cable for the color option, in the monochrome case, you need the BC19P cable. cheers, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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OT: Classic Bicycles?

by max82＠surfree.com

Well, I found what I was looking for: A lunatic that collects bicycles. He has more bicycles than some of you have computers (certainly more than I do). Check out http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bicycle.html --Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)

26 years, 11 months

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Apple stuff....

by roblwill＠usaor.net

>Depending on where you are ... Business Depot here in Canada still sells >the Apple cables as does the Black Book company. I think BD is Staples in >some parts of the States as well as Canada. > I think I'll try OfficeMax - There's one about 10 miles away. >Try your local elementary school for the printer. Trade your experience >or technology expertise for it. <g> They treasure their Apples like gold. Every room has a //c or ][, they even still have a few TRS-80's. They haven't stepped up to Macs yet. Having them subscribe to this list may ba a good idea - The computer lab consists of 40 Tandy 1000 TL2's. In the Ambridge school district, they won't let a piece of computer equipment go until it either won't turn on, or smoke starts pouring out of it. The High school has a Mac Classic that has the case held together with duct tape because someone knocked it off the table. The picture is crooked on it now, too (I think the yoke somehow got twisted). -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> > Brian Mahoney

26 years, 11 months

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RLV11/RL02 ->11/73?

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

> In a box (from Dave, IIRC) I have found (3) three RLV11 cardsets, >the printsets for same, and the printsets and drawings for the RL01 >and 02. This is kinda like going thru the pockets of an old coat >... >... I know that Zane has successfully attached RL02s to his 11/73, and >I wanna do that, too... You're fine, as long as your 11/73 has less than 248 kbytes in it. The RLV11 won't DMA any higher than 18-bits; if you've got 256kbytes or more of RAM, you want a RLV21. > The 11/73 has an RQDX2 and one RX02 8"... tell me how much more >info to provide and I'll do that. I'm going to try to install the >boards, but the little backplane is stuffed and I need to re-arrange >some things. Oh, yes, the backplane: You need two adjacent slots with the "CD" bus. Depending on what else you have, this may not be possible in a BA23. > Wait... will RLV11s go in the 11/44??? That would be major cool, >as well... No, the RLV11's won't, but a RL11 will. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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classic back ends?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Ok, so the subject is a bit provocative, actually the question isn't that bad. Are there backends for the GCC compiler tools for the 'classic' computers out there? I'm particularly interested in a PDP-11 back end at the moment as it seems that I could easily port uC/OS II to the 11/23 and have something useful without forking over the RT11 dough. In lieu of that, if I compile programs using RT11 under Supnik's emulator can I run them on a "real" 11 legally? --Chuck

26 years, 11 months

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Rebirth of IMSAI

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I doubt that any of the old stuff I have, much of which, incidentally is <older than the 21-year-old to which you referred, will run at that 10MHz It's not as old as the altair or some of the other goodies like the MDS-800 that was part of the VT100 development. What makes it significant is it's still in use! <rate, though I once used an ordinary Z-80A at 12 MHz with a BUNCH of 2147' <(that's power-hungry, basement-heating, fast, static RAM). Unfortunately, Yep, used them also, 2167s (16kx1 45ns) were available to me and they were nicer. <almost no peripherals would talk to it without half a dozen or so <wait-states. That was in a hand-wired application and not in an S-100, <where, although you can interface the processor, RAM, and ROM with just a <gate or two, the bus interface takes about a hundred. (not really, but quit <a few!) On a good day about 14 each board. <If I go the route of hand-wiring something for the S-100, I'll probably us <one of the WD1002-series bridge controllers I still have lying about. I They work well or the old ISA-8bit controllers. <About ten years ago, Someone gave me several of the XCOMP STS board pairs, <but tuned for 8" rather than 5.25" drives' data rate. I imagine they spen <a lot of time in someone's desk drawer, in order to keep the boss from <learning he'd paid for yet another item they couldn't use. Those might be <interesting to try out. They may be interesting if the caps havent died of old age. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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OT: Linux was Steve Gibson's NEWS of a Stunning NEW Search Engine ...

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Hi, I got this from Steve Gipson (author of SpinRite) and thought some of you might be interested since you're Linux fans. I haven't tried the search engine that he's talkng about so I have no idea if his claims are factual. Joe >Return-Path: <mailbot(a)grc.com> >To: <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> >From: Steve Gibson's MailBot <mailbot(a)grc.com> >Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 19:57:16 -0800 >Acct: <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> >Subject: Steve Gibson's NEWS of a Stunning NEW Search Engine ... > >Hello, > >We've all experienced the problem: > >The automated search engines (like Alta Vista) return 54,321 >items "in no particular order" (many of which are porn sites). >But the human-indexed search services (like Yahoo) often can't >find what you want because they're only able to index a small >fraction of the entire web (since they're human.) So you're left >with the uneasy (but probably accurate) sense that what you want >is out there somewhere ... but you're no closer to finding it. > >The truly amazing new solution: > >A couple of extremely bright guys at Stanford University solved >the Web Search Engine Problem once and for all, creating the last >search system you will ever need: http://google.com/ > >What's their secret? They use Linux-based web robots to explore >and index the entire Web. But then they determine the QUALITY of >each resulting link based upon the QUALITY of the OTHER sites >that link INTO that site. So, THE ONLY WAY a site can be highly >rated, under Google, is if other highly rated sites have links >pointing into it! It's brilliant. > >This simple concept works SO WELL that every single person I've >told about Google has switched permanently to using Google as >their Web search engine of choice. It really is that good! > >And of course it's free! ... so give it a shot for yourself!: > > <a href= "http://google.com" >Google</a> > >(NOTE: You received this news because you chose to receive my >notes about "Important PC Industry Happenings". If you're unhappy >about this, you may visit your personal preferences page using >the link below. I hope you've found this information useful!) > >Steve Gibson. > >________________________________________________________________ >You may easily edit your profile, or remove yourself from this >eMail system entirely, by visiting your personal page anytime: ><a href= "http://grc.com/x/ne.dll?-dhyngyd2-" >Edit Profile</a> >Please DO NOT REPLY to this message since it will only be seen >by my mailbot. If you need to contact my office for any reason, >please write to: <a href= "mailto:offices@grc.com" >eMail Us</a> >

26 years, 11 months

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homemade computer for fun and experience...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I have so many TTL's and LSI's and some VLSI's, CPU's of all <kinds (intel, Zilog and others), memories, different crystrals and <oscillators. Should it be single board with everything on it in <stages or do it modular via cards? Check the www.psyber.com/~tcj, there is a lot of info and back issues are available. <SRAM or DRAM? With dense srams (2 62256s is 64k!) that is an easy choice for small memories (64->128k). There are designs out ther ethat are 3.5" foot print and work well with 3.5" floppies and IDE or scsi drives. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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New arrivals to the Vintage Computer Festival Archives!

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

At 09:31 PM 4/2/99 -0800, you wrote: > >Hey, check out the new arrivals to the VCF Archives: > >* IBM 557 Alphabetic Interpreter >* Small-scale Honeywell DPS-6 mainframe > Man, that '557 looks to be in real nice shape! (externally at least) Most cool! -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

26 years, 11 months

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classic back ends?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>In lieu of that, if I compile programs using RT11 under Supnik's emulator >can I run them on a "real" 11 legally? I can't see that running software you developed yourself would be illegal to run on real hardware regardless of where it was built. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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first DEC machine

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi R, ---------- > From: R. Stricklin (kjaeros) <red(a)bears.org> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: first DEC machine > Date: Friday, April 02, 1999 9:25 PM > > I found it; I take it this selects the default console device. Switching > it doesn't make any difference---the result of either is the same: if you really don't have anything on the monitor, pull the switch "up" to use a terminal as a console. That's the one with the printer icon, 9600 baud 8n1. > The ultimate stop of the LED disagnostics is with positions 1 and 7 lit. If you using the enumeration from DEC (76543210) Your machine should be fine. It looks like all diagnostics is done besides of one of the options failed. > I was unable to locate a usable cable today for hooking up a serial > terminal; I'll have one of our VARs try to get one to me next week. > Anything I can try in the meanwhile? open it, and check if something look strange ;-)) And i forgot, what type of monitor you have, but it should have at least 1280x1024 at some graphics options. Sometimes you can change that to 1024x860 via a switch on the graphics option. cheers, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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classic back ends?

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Ok, so the subject is a bit provocative, actually the question isn't that bad. >Are there backends for the GCC compiler tools for the 'classic' computers >out there? I'm particularly interested in a PDP-11 back end at the moment >as it seems that I could easily port uC/OS II to the 11/23 and have >something useful without forking over the RT11 dough. The PDP-11 backend for GCC is a decade out-of-date with the rest of the changes in the compiler. Updating it ought to be straightforward, but nobody's stepped up to do it. Alternatively, you can use the PDP-11 backend with the matching version of the GCC front end, but I don't see any decade-old versions of the front end at the traditional GNU distribution sites. You also have to keep in mind that GCC doesn't come with a PDP-11 C run-time library. Not a problem if you're writing an OS from scratch and will be writing all the libraries too. Too bad you're giving up on RT-11 so quickly - there's several hundred megabytes of freely-distributable code available for it in the DECUS collections. >In lieu of that, if I compile programs using RT11 under Supnik's emulator >can I run them on a "real" 11 legally? I don't see why not - especially if you're using (for example) the free PDP-11 DECUS C compiler - as long as you anything you use the code for would come under "hobbyist". The DECUS C compiler is quite capable, and many major packages have been written in it. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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FW: Old VAX, VMS documentation going via Ebay (or landfill)...

by kyrrin＠my-dejanews.com

There's been way too much good stuff dumped in landfills already. Get in contact with this fellow directly if you want to help stop yet another load from such an ignoble fate... -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On 2 Apr 99 14:42:00 CST, in comp.os.vms you wrote: >>From: SMS(a)Provis.com >>Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >>Subject: Old VAX, VMS documentation going via Ebay (or landfill)... >>Message-ID: <199904022043.OAA00504(a)stroke.provis.com> >>Date: 2 Apr 99 14:42:00 CST >>Organization: Info-Vax<==>Comp.Os.Vms Gateway >>X-Gateway-Source-Info: Mailing List >>Lines: 11 >>Path: news1.jps.net!news-west.eli.net!newsbox.grin.net!pants.skycache.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.mathworks.com!mvb.saic.com!info-vax >>Xref: news1.jps.net comp.os.vms:1018 >> >> Just a quick notice that we're cleaning out old VAX and VMS (paper) >>documentation via Ebay. Some of these things are classics. Search for >>seller "ss1" for details. >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> Steven M. Schweda (+1) 612-785-2000 ext. 16 (voice) >> Provis Corporation (+1) 612-785-2100 (facsimile) >> 5251 Program Avenue #100 sms(a)provis.com (e-mail) >> Mounds View, MN 55112-4975 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies -- kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech [dot] com Web: http://www.bluefeathertech.com "...No matter how we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them..."

26 years, 11 months

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New arrivals to the Vintage Computer Festival Archives!

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Hey, check out the new arrivals to the VCF Archives: * IBM 557 Alphabetic Interpreter * Small-scale Honeywell DPS-6 mainframe To see images, jump over to: http://www.siconic.com/newstuff/ Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 02/15/99]

26 years, 11 months

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first DEC machine

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Switched the machine on, and waited. And waited. Nothing. No lights on the <keyboard, nothing on the display. The LED status whatsis at the rear <wibbled around a bit but I didn't pay close attention to what it was <doing. The disks never spun up. There is a nearly hidden switch between the leds and the MMJ connector, try both positions. Also DEC spins the drives up after the boot starts not at powerup. The monitor if there is no disks(at all) should display a countdown as it does self test. The monitor can be interacted with for diagnostic uses. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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OT: Classic bicycles?

by max82＠surfree.com

Does anybody here know of an old bicycle mailing list/message board? Does anyone here use or have old bicycles? The reason why I ask is that I found an old English bike, several decades old, and would like to know when it was produced, etc. It's certainly a lovely bike, black with gold trim, in perfect condition after I washed off the dust. My two functional questions: 1) Can I use WD-40 on non-moving parts to keep them from rusting? 2) The thing has one of those 3-speed in-hub gear shifters but the cable and handle are missing. Therefore, the little chain is retracted into the hub. Is it in 1st speed or 3rd speed? Does anyone have any extra 3-speed switch handles :) --Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

-----Original Message----- From: Merle K. Peirce <at258(a)osfn.org> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, 3 April 1999 11:18 Subject: Re: Sickening Documentation >Hmmm...non compos mentis, isn't it? You may be right, it's been a while. Mentis sounds better now that I think about it.. Cheers Geoff

26 years, 11 months

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off-the-wall question (possibly OT)

by fauradon＠pclink.com

I thought the Robot sounded more like "Danger Will Robinson" or something like that. >Has anybody here ever heard a relay machine running, like one >of the early Zuse machines or the Harvard Mark-1? It occurred >to me (please don't ridicule me too much for this*) that the >sound of the robot in the old "Lost in Space" TV series may >have been intended to sound like a relay machine. I've heard >descriptions of them sounding like a thousand women knitting, >which could sort-of describe that robot sound-effect as well... > > Cheers, > Bill. > >* I guess you should ridicule me just the right amount. :-) >

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation

by geoffrob＠stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au

-----Original Message----- From: Derek Peschel <dpeschel(a)u.washington.edu> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, 3 April 1999 7:21 Subject: Re: Sickening Documentation >Well, "decus" is a Latin word. (I forget what it means -- it's part of a >motto, "decus et tutamen". One translation could be "an ornament and a >safeguard", though I thought "an ARMAMENT and a shield" was the translation.) >So there's an angle that would encourage keeping the old name. Compus is also latin. IIRC, it means "sound" in the the sense "non compus mentus" (literally, "not of sound mind") Cheers Geoff Roberts

26 years, 11 months

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HP21MX 12531C?

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

I have two HP 12531C interface cards, one known bad the other unknown. I'd like to test them out, but I need some info on jumper settings, etc.... Would anyone happen to have docs on the 12531C? Jay

26 years, 11 months

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sinclair computer kits

by lemay＠cs.umn.edu

Does anyone know if the timex sinclair computers were ever sold in kit form by other companies? Long ago I purchased a MicroAce computer kit, and it sure looks like a timex sinclair 1000 (or probably an earlier model). This was sold by a company in Santa Ana, California. -Lawrence LeMay

26 years, 11 months

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decitek reader

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

Does anyone have any docs on the decitek paper tape reader? Full docs would be fantastic, but initially just two items: 1) The unit appears to be set for 220v. Is there some simple strappings to change it to 110V? 2) I have no power cable for the unit, and it uses a (to me anyways) rather unique power cable. Any ideas where I might find a power cable (Digikey, etc?)? Thanks in advance! Jay West

26 years, 11 months

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Nicolett NPC-764 CP/M machine & logic analyzer.

by jlewczyk＠his.com

I have an old Nicolett NPC-764, which is CP/M machine (8085 based) with built in Logic Analyzer hardware (its main function). The logic analyzer software was stored in 48K of ROM, and you could boot CP/M from there. Its a "luggable" computer (which means that they put a handle on it and bolted down all the boards ;-). One thing I do not have is any 5 1/4" floppy disks for it. Because of this, I can't boot CP/M and I don't have any of the software that came with the unit that assist in using some of the logic analyzer's abilities. Do have any idea on how I could get some of this software? Nicolet hasn't been any help. Thanks! - John Lewczyk - IO Consulting - 401 Queens Row Street - Herndon, Virginia 20170-3131 - jlewczyk(a)his.com

26 years, 11 months

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Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI)

by edick＠idcomm.com

I take extra care with my prototypes because they not only prove the concept, but they have to serve as a development tool. In reality, wire-wrapped circuits are more likely to survive mishandling than a PCB would be. Whereas you could break a pin or a wire, that's normally quite apparent to visual inspection. I've got a whole paper-box full of perfect-looking PCB's which don't work because of some intermittent open or short due to an overetched or overstressed circuit board. Where space was a problem, I've been known (rarely) to ship prototypes which were hand-wired with point-to-point soldered #30 wire. This is much like wire-wrap, except it require much greater care to cut the wires to just the right length and strip just the right amount of insulation. It makes for plenty of wasted wire. BTW, TechAmerica now sells sheets of 0.100" matrix wire-wrap card with low-impeance ground/Vcc plane on top/bottom, similar to what I used to build into my wire-wrap boards. This is really handy, because you can isolate one section of ground plane from another with a Dremel tool and connect them with a bypassed ferrite bead or low-value resistor. This makes for realtively quite regions if you take sufficient pains. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, April 02, 1999 11:23 AM Subject: Re: Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI) >> >> This strategy is pretty popular with analog work being tried for the first >> time. I prefer to wire-wrap my digital stuff, and I've shown that wire-wrap > >Yes, dead bugging takes far too long for most digital stuff. I still >think you need a groundplane for anything with dfast edges (which means >just about anything using modern chips). > >> between digital and analog circuitry can be mde to work as well. I prefer > >I've been known to screw a piece of copperclad as a 'dead bug' >groundplane to the edge of a board containing wire-wrapped circuitry. It >might not look all that neat, but it's solid, and it works. > >> my prototypes to be really rugged unless there's a specific reason why one >> can't be, and I'm always afraid to play with those "spiderweb-technology" >> circuits, so once built, they never get any improvement from me. > >There is rarely any excuse for sloppy construction, even in prototypes. > >> >> Now, I've learned a few tricks from those analog weenies who use this kind >> of stuff all the time. I'll certainly never forget watching one guy track >> down a 4MHz clock from a processor getting into the analog section of his >> circuit by using a divider with points sharp enough to penetrate the solder >> mask and a spectrum analyzer. He found the section of ground plane which >> needed bypass, then fixed it with a couple of capacitors bypassing the >> unwanted signal to just the right place. No mean trick if you ask me. > >Another trick worth knowing is that sometimes cutting a slot in the >groundplane can isolate a noise source (like that processor) from the >sensitive input circuitry. You want to prevent digital ground currents >from getting anywhere near the analogue side. The impedance of a >groundplane can cause problems. > >-tony >

26 years, 11 months

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first DEC machine

by red＠bears.org

Howdy; Several years ago while I was at UW I promised myself that one day I'd get a VAX and learn how to use VMS. That day came yesterday, when a VAXstation 3100m76 showed up on my doorstep. So in the immortal words of Zane, "I can't get it to boot." (: I realise I may be making an entirely faulty set of assumptions about what I'm doing so here's where I'm at. I received also an LK201 keyboard, the wondrous "hockey puck" mouse, and the video cable (15 pin D-sub on one end, 3 BNC plus what look to be keyboard and mouse connectors). The machine supposedly has SPX graphics. I connected the video cable to the appropriate port on the rear of the VAX, and plugged the keyboard and mouse into the connectors on the cable, and the 3 BNC to a NEC 5fge, which supports composite sync-on-green and I'm fairly sure should sync up to whatever the VAX puts out. Switched the machine on, and waited. And waited. Nothing. No lights on the keyboard, nothing on the display. The LED status whatsis at the rear wibbled around a bit but I didn't pay close attention to what it was doing. The disks never spun up. I tried again with the keyboard and mouse plugged into the connectors on the back of the machine, and got keyboard lights, but aside from that had the same luck as before. What should I be looking at first? I'll try to borrow from work a cable I can use to connect a serial terminal to the box to see if anything useful happens then. ok r.

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation

by mbg＠world.std.com

>I don't mind the "Compaq" where the "digital" used to be, it's the >"Compaq OpenVMS" I find sick! How egotistical! What about DECUS?... I received my booklet announcing the next DECUS, and it says 'DECUS, A Compaq Users Group'. ugh. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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first DEC machine

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi r, Tell us the signature of the LED's. Probably, something is wrong with your motherboard, memory, graphics ... Another idea is to plug in a terminal in the printer port. probably you get a message there.And don't forget to put the little switch "up" that is left to the 8 LEDs. If it is already "up" you have the terminal as the console already, so you don't get anything on the Monitor. You told that you have a Lk201 ? Which of the LEDs are on ? (they displaying some errors from the box too) hope it helps, cheers, emanuel ---------- > From: R. Stricklin (kjaeros) <red(a)bears.org> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: first DEC machine > Date: Friday, April 02, 1999 2:22 PM > > > Howdy; > > Several years ago while I was at UW I promised myself that one day I'd get > a VAX and learn how to use VMS. That day came yesterday, when a VAXstation > 3100m76 showed up on my doorstep. BTW, the name for my is "godot" simply because I waited so long ... > I received also an LK201 keyboard, the wondrous "hockey puck" mouse, and > the video cable (15 pin D-sub on one end, 3 BNC plus what look to be > keyboard and mouse connectors). The machine supposedly has SPX graphics. nice !!! > Switched the machine on, and waited. And waited. Nothing. No lights on the > keyboard, nothing on the display. The LED status whatsis at the rear > wibbled around a bit but I didn't pay close attention to what it was > doing. That's bad .. > The disks never spun up. Usually they spin up, IF the system tries to boot from them, or you execute a "show config" > I tried again with the keyboard and mouse plugged into the connectors on > the back of the machine, and got keyboard lights, but aside from that had > the same luck as before. which lights ?

26 years, 11 months

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Real Hackers, tools of the trade (was Re: Vector Graphic range...)

by danburrows＠mindspring.com

> >A tip I saw in a magazine a few weeks back (and haven't tried) for >sharpening dull reamers was to run a carbide-tipped lathe tool (about >\pounds 5.00 if you don't have one) along the flutes of the reamer (up >under the flutes I guess). Apparently, this will put the edge back on. Someday I will have to try that. > >Were you saying that Xcellite used to do them in the 99 range? They're >now listing tamperproof Torx in a couple of sizes. > I have gotten rather frustrated with Xcellite over the last 10+ years because they are so slow to come out with new stuff. All of my tamperproof bits are other MFG. Dan

26 years, 11 months

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Real Hackers, tools of the trade (was Re: Vector Graphic range...)

by danburrows＠mindspring.com

>> In the toolbox that I use every day I think there is every 99 series tool >> that is avail. There are also some that they don't make anymore. Also you > >What has been discontinued? I remember seeing a stubby handle once. And >magnetic nutdrivers (although the magnetic 1/4" one is in the 99MP kit). >Anything else? There were 2 sizes of reamers and only one now is the primary one that comes to mind. The one I use the most is the one they discontinued - of course since mine is dull. >>'Tamperproof' Torx drivers are almost essential if you work on SMPSUs >(many manufacturers seem to like them). I've got all sorts of strange >drivers (Torq, Tri-wing, etc), but I've never seen them in computer >equipment. Tamperproof allen and brain fade due to lack of sleep lately. Dan

26 years, 11 months

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LT33?

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

I'm looking at the required hardware listed on a SPD I got today, and it lists a "LT33 terminal with low speed paper tape reader". Is that the same thing as a ASR33? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

26 years, 11 months

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Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<What I do if I can stand the stray capacitance (and I often can) is take <a piece of copperclad for the groundplane. I then stick (double-sided <tape is strong enough) little 'islands' of stripboard, track side up onto <the groundplane. Solder the ICs to the stripboard. Then solder the ground <wires from the strips to the groundplane (as short as possible). That <will anchor the stripboard in place. Decoupling caps go from the power <strip straight to the groundplane, etc. That happens to be an effective way to do it. Works well for RF too. As to proto, I have a few peices of equipment that were deliberately built that way with over 15years on them. With a little care it can be very rugged. Allison

26 years, 11 months

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Real Hackers, tools of the trade (was Re: Vector Graphic range...)

by danburrows＠mindspring.com

>An expensive set, but WELL worth the money! Of course my set is actually >made up of two or three smaller sets. Xcellite are tops in my book! Of >course I'd rather have the set the size of a small suitcase! I have found that the 99MP is good as a starting base and then add the rest. In the toolbox that I use every day I think there is every 99 series tool that is avail. There are also some that they don't make anymore. Also you need to check out the security bit sets that Jensen offers. They have the most complete set I have found. Dan

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation (OT)

by mbg＠world.std.com

>>I doubt the RT-11 also > >The RT-11 5.7 SPD has been out for over half a year now, and begins: > >* COMPAQ >* >*Software >*Product >*Description Oh... "Never mind." Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

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New uses for old toys!

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

My boss has come up with a good use for all my old toys! We're an ISP here, and I play BOFH. So, we're moving to a new building, and all the customers are wanting to see our internet toys when they sign up. So, the new machine room is being constructed as follows: 1. It'a a large room, raised flooring, and it has an observation window. The idiots can look thru the window, but not come in the door. 2. The room is also decently air-conditioned. It'll (obviously!) have fast 'net access. Meaning: 3. We aim to get our hands on all the boxes we can with flashing lights or interesting buttons on the panels. These will be visible from the window. All the real gear will be on the other side of the room. Basically, this means all my boxen get a fast 'net wire, and a nice room to live in. All they need to be able to do is look complicated and/or impressive. Is this sort of thing legal? Sounds too good to be true to me... -------

26 years, 11 months

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Collectors list

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi Bill, ---------- > From: Bill Yakowenko <yakowenk(a)cs.unc.edu> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Collectors list > Date: Friday, April 02, 1999 12:17 AM > > I guess I'm not advertising enough! Would anybody object if I > posted this announcement periodically, like maybe once every two > weeks, or once per month? YOU SHOULD, If you simply mail a pointer to it, should be enugh. > The "Classic Computer Rescue Squad" web page lists people's location, > classic computer interests, and contact info. If you aren't on it, > you are missing out. And if you want to find nearby classic computer > geeks, this is the obvious spot for one-stop-shopping. I thought about, why i haven't found this before. Sorry, no offense, but "its the name". ( seeing the "RESCUE" i saw already one of this SAR helicopters around my head ;-)) I just was on your site, and this is probably exactly what i tried to do. I would only suggest, to put the "collector" somewhere in the name. thanks a lot for your work, emanuel

26 years, 11 months

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H740 Bridge Rectifier

by mcquiggi＠sfu.ca

Hi Allison: I have the schematic in front of me, mechanical drawing too. It's on my web site if you _really_ need it after this, or send me your fax number and I'll get it to you that way. Looking at the mechanical drawing, if you look at the rear of the 8/f, with the H740 installed, the bridge rectifier is at the top, right hand side of the supply, above the large heat sink fins, to the right of two large transistors. Ascii art for pin orientation: (top edge of board, as you face component side with H740 installed) --------- | + AC| (Large Trans) (Large Trans) | | |AC -| --------- ----------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------- (Heat Sink Fins) ----------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------- (Large Trans) (Large Trans) (Large Trans) (Round connector) (bottom edge of board) The rectifier is labelled only "NSS3514", no ratings indicated in the specs, just "bridge rectifier". Input is 28VAC. Good luck, Kevin --- Kevin McQuiggin VE7ZD mcquiggi(a)sfu.ca

26 years, 11 months

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Help finding software for Nicolet NPC-764 logic analyzer (8085 CP/M)

by jlewczyk＠his.com

I recently obtained an old Nicolett NPC-764, which is a CP/M machine (8085 based) with a built in Logic Analyzer, with software for the logic analyzer built into ROM. Its a "luggable" computer (which means that they put a handle on it and bolted down all the boards ;-). One thing I do not have is any 5 1/4" floppy disks for it. Therefore I can't boot CP/M and I don't have any of the software that came with the unit to assist in using the logic analyzer. Do have any idea on how I could get some of this software? Nicolet hasn't been any help. Thanks!

26 years, 11 months

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Looking for 8008 language software (PL/M, MASM, BASIC,...)

by jlewczyk＠his.com

Hi. I'm new to the list and this is my first posting. I am looking for PL/M cross compiler that Intel produced for the 8008 CPU. I have the Intel manual, but no source or object for the language compiler, which was written in Fortran by Gary Kildall when he worked for Intel back in ~1973. I have source for an 8080 version of PL/M from Intel which went into the public domain at some time, but I do not believe that it will produce 8008 code (that ability is not mentioned in the documentation). Any help or information on this would be appreciated. Also, a macro assembler or a basic interpreter would also be appreciated! Anything would be better than hand assembling and jamming in bytes via switches. Thanks, John - John Lewczyk - IO Consulting - 401 Queens Row Street - Herndon, Virginia 20170-3131 - jlewczyk(a)his.com

26 years, 11 months

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Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI)

by edick＠idcomm.com

This strategy is pretty popular with analog work being tried for the first time. I prefer to wire-wrap my digital stuff, and I've shown that wire-wrap between digital and analog circuitry can be mde to work as well. I prefer my prototypes to be really rugged unless there's a specific reason why one can't be, and I'm always afraid to play with those "spiderweb-technology" circuits, so once built, they never get any improvement from me. Now, I've learned a few tricks from those analog weenies who use this kind of stuff all the time. I'll certainly never forget watching one guy track down a 4MHz clock from a processor getting into the analog section of his circuit by using a divider with points sharp enough to penetrate the solder mask and a spectrum analyzer. He found the section of ground plane which needed bypass, then fixed it with a couple of capacitors bypassing the unwanted signal to just the right place. No mean trick if you ask me. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 7:24 PM Subject: Re: Kits vs ready-made (was RE: Rebirth of IMSAI) ><What I do if I can stand the stray capacitance (and I often can) is take ><a piece of copperclad for the groundplane. I then stick (double-sided ><tape is strong enough) little 'islands' of stripboard, track side up onto ><the groundplane. Solder the ICs to the stripboard. Then solder the ground ><wires from the strips to the groundplane (as short as possible). That ><will anchor the stripboard in place. Decoupling caps go from the power ><strip straight to the groundplane, etc. > >That happens to be an effective way to do it. Works well for RF too. > >As to proto, I have a few peices of equipment that were deliberately built >that way with over 15 years on them. With a little care it can be very >rugged. > >Allison >

26 years, 11 months

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Vector Graphic range...

by fauradon＠pclink.com

Is the Vector3 also an S100 machine? If so: WOW I have an S100 machine and didn't know about it! There is a small picture of it at the Sanctuary site in the Miscelaneous part of the museum. Francois --------------------------------- Visit the oh so neglected sanctuary at: www.pclink.com/fauradon >Vector Graphic made a range of machines starting with the Vector I. I am not >familiar with all of them, but I believe they were all S-100 machines. The >machines I have are the Vector 1, 3, 4, and MZ. I am not familiar at all >with the Vector Graphic B; I would pick it up just out of curiousity. All of >the machines I have run CP/M. Are you talking about the UCSD P-System? If >so, I didn't think that was an operating system, but rather something more >like an interpreter. >

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>I got the Base Set of OpenVMS 7.2 doc's that I ordered today. How >disgusting! On the spine, it says "Compaq OpenVMS", and the spines are ALL >white, so they aren't colour coded by type. The "traditional" DEC way of dealing with this is to have pockets on all the spines and put cardboard identifiers in each one indicating which volume it is. If you go to a well-stocked office supply store, you'll find similar sized pockets that are self adhesive and which you can stick to the spines of your new manuals, and them label everything appropriately. All the way back to white, eh? My old TOPS-20 manual set (from mid-to- late-70's) is in white binders... >I don't mind the "Compaq" where the "digital" used to be, it's the "Compaq >OpenVMS" I find sick! How egotistical! Within a day or two of the announced merger, all the faxes I got from DEC began reading "Compaq" at the top! >Oh, well, I've got doc's that match the version I'm running now at least >(though the V5 "System Managers Manual" will continue to be the most used >manual). Now if the two Cluster manuals that I ordered at the same time >would ship, I'd be almost happy. Still need up-to-date DECnet manuals >though. Incidentally, there are several places on the net where the OpenVMS documentation is browsable. For starters, you can go to http://www.openvms.digital.com/ and click on "Documentation". It looks like the Cluster manuals and DECnet manuals are there. Of course, electronic docs are not nearly as satisfying as a "grey wall" (or, as it seems to be now, white), but it can come in handy in a pinch. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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Collectors list

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

I guess I'm not advertising enough! Would anybody object if I posted this announcement periodically, like maybe once every two weeks, or once per month? The "Classic Computer Rescue Squad" web page lists people's location, classic computer interests, and contact info. If you aren't on it, you are missing out. And if you want to find nearby classic computer geeks, this is the obvious spot for one-stop-shopping. E-mail addresses on it are mangled to make it more difficult for spammers (though I have an idea for a better anti-spam measure), and pretty much all the decisions about what info to list are made by the Rescue Squad volunteers themselves. I've even been pretty good about maintaining it. Requests usually get handled in less than 24 hours. Here's the URL: http://www.cs.unc.edu/~yakowenk/classiccmp/ccrs_list.html Be there, or be a rectangle in which each side is one fourth of the total perimiter. Bill. On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Sellam Ismail <dastar(a)ncal.verio.com> wrote: ] ] On Wed, 31 Mar 1999, Jerome Fine wrote: ] > So, if you are willing to give your zip/postal code, in effect that is ... deletia ... ] ] I think the rescue list on Bill Yakowenko's site (don't have the URL ] handy) can serve the purpose of knowing where generally other fellow ] collectors are located. Aside from privacy concerns, its a swell idea. ] But I guess it would be on a voluntary basis. ] ... more ...

26 years, 11 months

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Osborne PSU

by a2k＠one.net

Hello, I recently aquired an Osbourne Model I luggable.. I have system disks for it and I can't wait to fire it up.. unfortunately it has a bad power switch (a little flaky; works occasionally, usually not), which is not big deal as I can change that out.. the problem is when I was working on the panel that has the wires attached (wrapped around those posts) I accidentally ripped them all off (grr).. does anyone have a pinout of which colored wires go to which pin? thanks, Kevin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- After sifting through the overwritten remaining blocks of Luke's home directory, Luke and PDP-1 sped away from /u/lars, across the surface of the Winchester riding Luke's flying read/write head. PDP-1 had Luke stop at the edge of the cylinder overlooking /usr/spool/uucp. "Unix-to-Unix Copy Program;" said PDP-1. "You will never find a more wretched hive of bugs and flamers. We must be cautious." -- DECWARS ____________________________________________________________________ | Kevin Stewart | "I am a secret | | KC8BLL ----------| Wrapped in a mystery -Milford High School | | a2k(a)one.net | Wrapped in an enigma Drama Tech Dept. | |jlennon(a)nether.net| And drizzled in some tasty chocolate stuff.| --------------------------------------------------------------------

26 years, 11 months

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DEC cables

by kees.stravers＠iae.nl

>I have some DEC cables that I peicked up. Does anyone know what they're for? >Marked "BC-022D-10" also "82351-000" DB-25F on both ends estimate 10 >foot long >Marked "BC22D-50" also "71065" DB-25F on both ends, estimate 50 foot long >Marked "BC22D-25" also "71065" DB-25F on both ends, estimate 25 foot >long,NIB >Thanks, > Joe BC22D is a RS-232 null-modem cable, used to connect terminals to RS232 terminal ports on a VAX or PDP. See the DEC cables page at: <http://www.digital.co.uk/info_uk/Tech/cables.htm> <http://www.vaxarchive.org/hw/cables.html> Kees -- Kees Stravers - Geldrop, The Netherlands - kees.stravers(a)iae.nl http://www.iae.nl/users/pb0aia/ I'm Sysadmin and DEC PDP/VAX preservationist - Visit VAXarchive! http://www.vaxarchive.org/ (primary) http://www.sevensages.org/vax/ (mirror) http://www.coyote.org/mirrors/vaxarchive/ (mirror)

26 years, 11 months

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Terak software

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 12:40 AM 4/2/99 -0800, Sell 'em @ eBay wrote: >On Thu, 1 Apr 1999, John Foust wrote: > >> port, where I capture it using the venerable Pro-YAM telecom package. >> (Now there's a guy who belongs on this list <http://www.omen.com/>.) > >Ah, Chuck Forsberg, a.k.a. TeleGodzilla? Yup. He's the one. Quite the god of telecom, judging by the level of detail in his manuals, and the power and reliability of Pro-YAM. My POTS dial-up has diminished ever since I got a T-1, but Pro-YAM's certainly one of the oldest yet original programs I've got on my PC. The other is Brief. Well, actually, BEEP.COM, SQ.COM, USQ.COM, BOLD.COM and SWEEP.EXE are still on my path, and they date to first-quarter '84. - John

26 years, 11 months

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Rescuer's list vs Collector's list was Re: Collectors

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

On 2 Apr 99 at 10:27, Joe wrote: > At 02:17 AM 4/2/99 -0500, you wrote: > >I guess I'm not advertising enough! Would anybody object if I > >posted this announcement periodically, like maybe once every two > >weeks, or once per month? > > Hi Bill, > > Do it! But I don't think the collector's list is intended to be a > rescuer's list, just a list of people with old computer interests so that we > can locate others with similar interest that are nearby. > > Joe > > Exactly. Those on the collectors list would not necessarily be willing to go to extent of arranging transport etc. For example, altho I have done rescues of old equipment, I don't even have a vehicle to do so and as with most of us very limited and rapidly dwindling storage space. It just makes it easier to find collectors in your locale who might have similiar interests. It's a good start but please keep the names coming. Only those collectors who wish to be included on the list and who send the data will be listed. ciao larry lwalker(a)interlog.com Collectors info http://members.xoom.com/T3C

26 years, 11 months

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PAGING: Joe Rigdon, Mike McManus

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

(Posted to the list, CC: to both recipient's E-addys) Will Joe Rigdon and Mike McManus please get in contact with me regarding their participation in the Teledisk group buy? Joe, I've seen your posts to the list so I know you're still around. However, you've not responded as yet to ANY of the E-mails I've sent you. Mike, I've just not gotten any responses from you at all. Please contact me ASAP. Thanks to you both. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies http://www.bluefeathertech.com Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905) "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."

26 years, 11 months

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off-the-wall question (possibly OT)

by edick＠idcomm.com

Not quite . . . those stepping relays had quite a bit more energy as they had to move something more massive than the little relay contacts. It's more like what the room full of stepping relays sounded like from down the hall. You were only barely aware of it, but you were immediately aware of a change in the pattern. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, April 02, 1999 7:32 AM Subject: Re: off-the-wall question (possibly OT) >Bill, > > I've never heard a relay machine in operation but I've heard lots of >telephone co switch rooms with the old stepping relays in opertation. I >imagine the sound must be similar. > > Joe > >At 02:27 AM 4/2/99 -0500, you wrote: >>Has anybody here ever heard a relay machine running, like one >>of the early Zuse machines or the Harvard Mark-1? It occurred >>to me (please don't ridicule me too much for this*) that the >>sound of the robot in the old "Lost in Space" TV series may >>have been intended to sound like a relay machine. I've heard >>descriptions of them sounding like a thousand women knitting, >>which could sort-of describe that robot sound-effect as well... >> >> Cheers, >> Bill. >> >>* I guess you should ridicule me just the right amount. :-) >> >> >

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation (OT)

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>> *Compaq recommends that all other customers purchase Compaq's In- >> *stallation Services. These services provide for installation of the >> *software product by an experienced Compaq Software Specialist. > >> If you want to see how much a "Compaq Software Specialist" knows about >> the PDP-11 OS's, just look at some recent postings to vmsnet.pdp-11 where >> a Compaq employee is trying to ask how to run BRU under RSX-11. >Hell, my office didn't know how to install and sysgen RT11 in 1986. For quite some time, when DEC decides that they fired/laid off/re-assigned the personnel that knew how to do the job, they've been going to outside sources (such as Mentec), and these outside sources often been hiring outside consultants. The markup after going through this chain of "resellers" is truly amazing; in some cases the customer has ended up paying $10K just for installation of a RSX11M+-with-TCPIP upgrade, for example. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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Sickening Documentation (OT)

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>>we'll see manuals labeled "Compaq RT-11" or Compaq VMS"). >I doubt the RT-11 also The RT-11 5.7 SPD has been out for over half a year now, and begins: * COMPAQ * *Software *Product *Description * *___________________________________________________________________ * *PRODUCT NAME: RT-11, Version 5.7 SPD 12.01.41 * (Single-User Operating System) * *DESCRIPTION * *RT-11 is a software product of Mentec, Inc. and is licensed under Com- *paq Computer Corporation's Standard Terms and Conditions. If you browse down a bit further, you see: *This very fast, multi-volume backup/restore facility supports the stream- *ing capabilities of Compaq's TK25, TSV05, TSU05, TK50, TU80, and TU81+ *tape drives. And to top it all off: *Compaq recommends that all other customers purchase Compaq's In- *stallation Services. These services provide for installation of the *software product by an experienced Compaq Software Specialist. If you want to see how much a "Compaq Software Specialist" knows about the PDP-11 OS's, just look at some recent postings to vmsnet.pdp-11 where a Compaq employee is trying to ask how to run BRU under RSX-11. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 11 months

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1
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Sickening Documentation

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Farzino, just about everything OpenVMS runs on Linux runs on. (I doubt >we'll see manuals labeled "Compaq RT-11" or Compaq VMS"). As for RT-11, you're right... because it is handled by Mentec now. But for VMS... don't be so sure... At work yesterday I saw a box of VMS manuals which was being distributed to the VMS support group... they clearly had "Compaq OpenVMS" on them... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 11 months

1
0
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off-the-wall question (possibly OT)

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

Has anybody here ever heard a relay machine running, like one of the early Zuse machines or the Harvard Mark-1? It occurred to me (please don't ridicule me too much for this*) that the sound of the robot in the old "Lost in Space" TV series may have been intended to sound like a relay machine. I've heard descriptions of them sounding like a thousand women knitting, which could sort-of describe that robot sound-effect as well... Cheers, Bill. * I guess you should ridicule me just the right amount. :-)

26 years, 11 months

3
2
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Timonium Hamfest

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 3/31/99 8:42:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, rigdonj(a)intellistar.net writes: > That's exactly right. A lot of the vendors have sold their stuff and > left by 1:30. That why you found piles of trash that they'd left. I > usually register as a vendor and pay the extra fee just so I can get in > ahead of the public. I can tell you for a fact that the BEST deals happen > long before the public gets in the door. If I couldn't get there before > 1:30 I would bother going even if it was across the street! agreed. there's a hamfest thats coming up in two weeks here and a friend and i are going as vendors with a small cache of junk to sell. the best deals can be found the night before when everyone is still setting up. still havent gotten over being 30 seconds too late buying a small robot...

26 years, 11 months

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