Ok, this is a long shot.
Background: DSSI disk controller (KFQSA), two DSSI disks (RF71's), BA213
Chassis, with a three disk active control panel on the front. The control
panel has three "unit number" plug in keys. One labeled "0", one labeled
"1", and one blank. One RF71 is plugged into the top connector and one is
plugged into the middle connector. In this configuration the "ready" lights
under the UNIT1 and UNIT0 plugs light up on power up.
Symptom: The controller only sees one of the two drives. The drive it sees
is the one connected to the control port with plug id '0' in it. If I swap
the ID plugs, the drive that gets talked to also swaps.
Other Data: In the PARAMS program on these disks (or perhaps in the
controller I don't know which) there are several "MSCP" variables
associated with the drive. One of them is "UNITNUM" which defaults to 0.
Both disks initially had unit numbers in this field of 0. I set one of them
to have a UNITNUM of 1, wrote it with the WRITE command and power cycled.
Rerunning PARAMS shows it now thinks it is unit 1, but it doesn't respond
if it is connected to the control panel with the unit 1 plug in it.
There are a few other parameters that I can set one is called "FORCEUNI"
which defaults to 'true'. I've tried turning it off on one of the disks
(where I set the unitnum to 1, but to no avail).
Triva Challenge: One of my thoughts was that perhaps the ID plug was
incorrectly "customized". The "0" plug has one center plug on top and one
center plug on bottom. The "1" plug has the center and right leg in, and
the center leg on the bottom. I'm wondering if it is actually another unit
number.
Misc Note: With the #3 and #4 switches "on" on the KFQSA, the board shows
up both in the Qbus scan and in the SHOW DEV scan as disk controller 0.
Any help appreciated...
--Chuck
I have the manual and several of these controllers. It is actually a Model
650.It sounds like yours has the 655/656 ROMS in location L4 and K4 since it is
responding as a DM: (RK06/7). There is page after page of configuration tables
for jumper settings depending on what drive and RK to emulate.
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: Jacob Ritorto <jritorto(a)nut.net>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 11:19 PM
Subject: xylogics smd interface for pdp11
>Would someone please provide docs or setup info for the following
>scantily-marked unibus SMD controller:
>
>Xylogics #300-101-600 rev B L6
>
>doc. pkg. no. 300-101-902 Rev G serial no. 1103
>
>A few hand-written and typed labels are still attached to the socketed
>chips (presumably geometry/emulation codes):
>[handles forward, components up, edge connector facing you]
>
>along the left side, column of 8 big chips.
>4th down: " 766/BU4 "
>6th down: " 768/BU4 "
>
>six inches in from left; four inches down from handles, by itself
>: " -173E "
>
>slightly right of center; starting three inches down; column of four chips
>: " 242D "
>: " 245C "
>: " 244C "
>: " 243C "
>
>just below those, group of six chips, most missing their labels but top
>right is still there and reads : "799HC "
>
>That's all I can glean. Seems to show up as DM: under rt, but I don't
>know what size/shape of drive it expects or what partitioning it's willing
>to perform...
>
>BTW, Thanks John if you're lurking here somewhere...
>
>TIA
>
>jake
Hi folks, this is not really on topic as the machine in question doesn't
fit the ten year rule. But the list is a way to make first contact with
this query though. Reply off-list if you please.
Assuming one or more of you on the list are well-versed or even expert with
the T4400C, I pose a question to a problem I would like some advice on. The
machine belongs to my uncle and I'm helping him solve the problem.
As you may know this is a 1992 vintage machine: 486DX, 25 MHz, 12 Mb RAM,
120 Mb hdd, VGA color LCD display plus a Toshiba Desk Station IV docking
station. He installed Windows 95 and a sound card and CD-ROM drive into the
Desk Sta. IV.
He got the laptop second-hand and of course the manual was missing. The
D.S. IV was new, fresh outta the box and has a manual. The sound card and
CD-ROM is a Reveal SC400 package he scrounged from an old machine. Driver
disks came with it at least.
Problem is that the CD-ROM drive is not interested in working with the
system. W95 does not see it.
The sound card has the IDE interface meant for the Panasonic CD-ROM (which
is model CR-563-B) and the CD drive is plugged into that. So, BIOS setup
for setting a second IDE device does not work in this case. Looks like
there's no provision in the BIOS for a second IDE (slave) device anyway.
Apparently (and be aware that this is the very first time I've ever fiddled
with a sound card/CD-ROM combination) the drivers for the CD-ROM are part
of the sound card drivers. Well, the drivers predate the release of W95 by
a couple of years and Windows 3.1 and DOS are of course the only operating
systems mentioned in the installation. One of the attempts at installation
seemed to let W95 know there's a CDROM and sound card but the CDROM was not
accessable and the "undocked" mode caused W95 to try to fuss with the
drivers, etc. to get itself running. The CDROM was correctly set to be
present in "docked" mode and not present in "undocked" mode. Same for the
sound card.
Has anybody installed a CDROM and sound card set into their Desk Station IV
and gotten it running okay under W95?
Has anyone even installed W95 onto their T4400C? Results?
Thanks for your experiences.
Regards, Chris
-- --
Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian
Jamestown, NY USA cfandt(a)netsync.net
Member of Antique Wireless Association
Check our redesigned website!
URL: http://www.antiquewireless.org/
<>Quantum D540 is the RD52, 31mb and faster than either of the seagates.
<>Also the 251 has a lousy track record for reliability (heat and skimpy spi
<>bearings).
<
< The Q540 was spec'd at, I believe, 35ms...but the ST251-1 (not 251) was 2
<I do agree about the heat and spindle bearing issues, though, 100%. I hav
<*never* seen a '540 fail. And they made much cooler sounds. :-)
The 8 heads vs 4 makes up for the difference in access as you can see twice
the data before moving the head, in real use acess time averaged better for
the d540. That was especially tue after the 251 dies. Also the D540 is a
servo vs the 251s stepper positioner so that impact reliability. Never
format a cold 251... the tracks move.
< Hmm. I think I'll ask them about the prices. By the "yet", are you
<suggesting that someone is working on it? :-)
Maybe Megan but, not I.
Allison
I know of someone wanting to sell a Wang 2200MVP. Is anyone interested? I
don't know what he's asking for it..
Kevin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It's you isn't it? THE BASTARD OPERATOR FROM HELL!"
"In the flesh, on the phone and in your account..."
-- BOFH #3
Ok, a diagnostic puzzle.
I've got a uVAX with two RF71 DSSI disks in it, before I knew how to talk
to them properly I had netbooted NetBSD and saw that it reported both
RF71s. I tried to talk one of them and the fault light came on (did a
diskinfo kind of thing.)
At the time I figured it was just the lack of a terminator. Now I'm not so
sure.
The other RF71 (which still came up ready) has now been tested formatted
and mounted under netbsd indicating all is well with that part of the world.
So how can I figure out the fault on the other drive? Where to look? I'm
going to try playing around with the internal "DUP" stuff this after noon.
--Chuck
Larry Simonsen (LSimonsen(a)FLOWSERVE.COM) posted elsewhere:
We have a 3000/37 available.
It has 4 discs for a total of 1.65 Gig; 5 port boxes (8 ports per box); a
DDS 1300H, and an open reel tape drive 7974.
Anyone interested?
For collectors, an HP 3000 Series 37 is about the size of a desktop PC
(slightly heavier), and runs MPE V. (No, you can't run Linux on it.)
It's a CISC stack-based machine. The disk drives mentioned are all
external boxes of some kind, connected via HPIB (no, you can't use SCSI).
The machine is in Edmonton , Alberta, Canada.
If interested, contact Larry directly, not me.
Here's an update for the archives so that others might benefit from the
knowledge:
I have a uVAX 3900 (KA655 CPU) with a KFQSA controller in it, the software
didn't "see" it. I had heard that one of the switch settings controlled if
the controller grabbed an address or not, so I flipped the switches (there
are only 4) until I found it, the combination (1,2,4-off, 3-on) was successful.
This vax boots to the chevron (>>>) prompt when the console control switch
is set to the dot inside the circle icon. At the prompt two interesting
commands are your friend. The first is
>>> SHOW QBUS
which shows you the devices that the CPU sees. It will also identify those
it recognizes. At first mine did not "see" the KFQSA, after flipping some
switches it did, and then I could type:
>>> SET HOST/DUP/UQSSP/DISK 1
and it got into the DUP menu that had drive information. Now why DISK 1?
Because DISK 0 is having problems. There is an ID jumper on the disk
somewhere that tells the card what disk it thinks it is I believe.
After getting into DUP I did ERASE and the DRVTST and both seemed to work
so we're off to the races yet again...
--Chuck
Someone is asking me about an NEC 8012A. Anyone know
anything about this system?
-----
David Williams - Computer Packrat
dlw(a)trailingedge.com
http://www.trailingedge.com
Ok, not very classic yet (not for another couple of years), but their
"coolness factor" is pretty high, so...
For a total of about $50, I just picked up three NCR System 3400 series
MCA machines. They're pretty impressive, both in features and in weight,
especially when one considers that not many manufacturers outside of IBM
ever did MicroChannel buses.
One has a pair of Seagate 'Elite' drives (2.9 gig SCSI) along with two
Maxtor 8760S's, and another has dual 486 CPU's, an Exabyte 8200, and a QIC
tape drive. A little digging has turned up that they'll run NT, Solaris,
and a few others. NCR still had all the support disks and files on their
web site, so that's taken care of.
Onward!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
In einer eMail vom 7/28/99 3:59:31PM, schreiben Sie:
<<
Hi Gang:
I have a Unibus bootstrap/terminator board with 4 ROMs on it. According to
the field guide:
M9301-YF U M9301 with boot for PC11, RP02-6, RS03-4,
RK05-6,
RX01, TU10, TU16, TU56, TS03, TTY, ASCII
console, diagnostics
There's a 10 position DIP switch on the board.
Anyone know how to set the DIP switches to select the various bootstraps?
What diagnostics are in the ROMs? This could be helpful.
Thanks in advance,
Kevin
--
Kevin McQuiggin VE7ZD
mcquiggi(a)sfu.ca
>>
I do have the maintenance manual describing all this, and a software listing.
I will send you that info tonight, when I am where the manual is.
John G. Zabolitzky
Hi Gang:
I have a Unibus bootstrap/terminator board with 4 ROMs on it. According to
the field guide:
M9301-YF U M9301 with boot for PC11, RP02-6, RS03-4,
RK05-6,
RX01, TU10, TU16, TU56, TS03, TTY, ASCII
console, diagnostics
There's a 10 position DIP switch on the board.
Anyone know how to set the DIP switches to select the various bootstraps?
What diagnostics are in the ROMs? This could be helpful.
Thanks in advance,
Kevin
--
Kevin McQuiggin VE7ZD
mcquiggi(a)sfu.ca
Hi, everyone. :-)
I'm looking around for businesses that sell new or used DEC
equipment...and a little bit of help as well, since I don't yet know
PDPs as well as I'd like to. ;-)
I'm in the process of getting a PDP-11/23+ which has no hard disks
or tape drive. The computer itself comes with a few cards, but most of
them I'm not sure what I can do with.
The cards that come with the system are:
M8190 (11/73 processor)
Emulex M8087 (No one has been able to find out what this board
is...wrong numbers?)
Berg M8020 (Single-line serial EIA sync interface)
With that in mind, what do I need to get the system to the point where
it will boot? I know what the processor card will do, but what about
the others?
Thanks in advance,
Chris
> Anyway do the MFM controllers in PROs have the same hard-coded drive model
>restrictions as their Qbus big brothers, like the RQDXn family?
On a PRO, the MFM hard drive is ID'd by the number of heads and
number of cylinders. If you look at, for example, DW.MAC on a RT-11
distribution kit, you'll find the table quite easily. You can add
your own devices to the table - just keep in mind that it has to
be in ascending order by heads, and then ascending order by
cylinders.
OK, the above is a bit of an oversimplification - if the drive in
question happens to be a RD50, the drive might be damaged by the
seek test that counts the number of cylinders. So RD50's
are identified by a bit in the status/init register, and not
by the seek test.
The PRO's MFM controller only allows 3 bits for the head ID and 10
bits for the cylinder ID, so you can only use drives up to 8
heads and 1024 cylinders (aka the RD53).
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
Hi folks,
I'm helping an ex-work colleague with an HP Vectra. It's the very first
model of the Vectra (from ca. 1986) and is commonly called the "Classic
Vectra". It's a 286 running at 6 MHz, 1 meg RAM . . . you know, the
typical AT clone.
The setup floppy disk is now missing and we need to find the setup program
for the machine. About 2 years ago or so I had downloaded the Classic
Vectra setup program from HP's website. I searched HP's site now and cannot
find any setup files for these old machines anymore.
Anybody know if the setup files are still online at HP and if so where are
they? If nothing is on HP's site anymore does anybody have a copy of the
setup file for the _Classic_ Vectra they could email to me?
Thanks for all your help with this!
Regards, Chris
-- --
Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian
Jamestown, NY USA cfandt(a)netsync.net
Member of Antique Wireless Association
Check our redesigned website!
URL: http://www.antiquewireless.org/
Back in the early '80's I had this 14" 20MB Century Data Marksman drive
which I soon gave away. I recently found the interface manual for it, i.e.
a document which is apparently intended for one to interface the built-on
controller/formatter to a Z-80. It includes some code examples, etc.
Would this be of use to anyone?
Dick
>Then wide open space. :-) [meta question, presumably DEC had fill plates
>for the empty slots?]
If you mean the cover plates for the BA213, and not slot fillers, yes...
>When I boot the cpu does all of its diagnostics but it doesn't "see" the
>KFQSA. One of the drives blinks fault the other rattles around a bit and
>then blinks ready.
In my experience, the drives are really flakey... I've got a couple
which have been working one week, then after a power-down, they went
fault, never to work again...
> When I type SHOW DEV to the uvax prompt it show the ethernet and
> tape but NOT the KFQSA. Is that normal if the disks are not
> inited?
It can happen until such time as the KFQSA haas been set to respond to
addresses... there is a switch setting on the board which has to be set
a certain away to be able to program it with at least one address...
when it responds to one address, then the SET HOST command can be used.
> When I type Megan's command "SET HOST/MAINT/QSSP/SERVER 0"
> to access the internal controller on the KFQSA I get
> >>>SET HOST/MAINT/UQSSP/SERVER 0
> ?28 UNK SW
That's because it is /UQSSP, not /QSSP
but it may not work if the board hasn't been seup yet.
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
Some 8" drives, notably those from Shugart, had optional circuitry which you
could install yourself, BTW, to do things like recover clock from the data
stream, hence the SEPDAT and SEPCLK signals, and mask the sector pulses if
you wanted to use hard sectored media in a soft-sectored mode, or whatever.
The signal you are probably going to want is the raw data, which is common
to all of the various versions. Oddly enough, the half dozen or so SIEMENS
drives I have all have this logic as standard.
the use of the same signal as both clock and data stems from the fact that
FM data has the clock embedded in it. Hence, if you don't separate them on
the drive, the controller does that by taking the signals whether they're
separated or not, and feeding them to the respective circuits whose job it
is to process them. They then use the signals either combined or separated,
and process them as they need.
These circuits are the things which got many people into the habit of
referring to a drive as being either single or double density capable.
Without them, they're all capable of either, since the rate at which flux
reversals are written on the medium is still the same. MFM simply
integrates the clock and data in a way which doesn't waste half the
bandwidth on clock pulses.
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Sudbrink <bill(a)chipware.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 4:53 PM
Subject: RE: Cromemco 4FDC, How do you format a disk?
<snip>
>
>According to the docs, you have to tell the controller
>which drive type it is talking to (bit 4 at I/O address
>34 hex). Looking at the schematics, it sure looks like
>it blindly shoots signals to both connectors. FDAT is
>connected to pin 30 on the 34 pin header and pin 48 on
>the 50 pin header. Hmmm... what's going on here? Pin 48
>is SEP DATA, used with hard sectored drives isn't it?
>Pin 50 is connected to FCLK as well.
>
>What gives?
It used to be so nice.
But the dehumidifier hose got clogged while I was gone.
The room filled with mildew.
I came home and rushed to save my stuff, mostly successfully. The TU10
was affected, though. I don't know for sure if the dampness was the
cause, but I'm guessing it was. Here are the symptoms:
under rt11 5.00, it won't init a tape. used to do this w/ no problem. rt
returns "output error on mt0:" The tape spins and tries to init, but
after going back and forth a number of times, it gives up. So the
mechanism and control logic seems fine. I've tried different tapes and
cleaned and degaussed the head. No change. Jiggled all the cards in the
controller and device section to 'assure' a good connection. Nothing. I
even tried using an old copy of ROLLIN, just to see if it'd do a backup,
but it moved the reels and instantly gave a FATAL DEVICE ERROR on MT0.
Unfortunately, my xxdp pack is thrashed (moldy), so until I can
replace it, I'm stuck with trial and error here... help if you can,
please!
The subject pretty much says it all...
I can't seem to figure out how to initialize
a disk with this controller. I'm sure you do
it via the WRITE TRACK command, but I don't
follow what it is that you are supposed to
OUT to the DATA REGISTER. Also, just for
laughs and because I have hundreds of disks
(thanks AOL!), I want to hook up a 3 1/2"
floppy to it. This should be OK, shouldn't
it? How many tracks and sectors-per-track?
What interleave? Finally, I gathered up all
of the CP/M 2.2 stuff I could find on the web...
I've been looking through all of the docs...
They all seem to make the assumption that you
already have a CP/M system disk, on the correct
media, properly formatted and all you need to do
is get your system specific BIOS onto it.
Looking at the BIOS level implementation, it
seems that CP/M doesn't have a native format
command?
Thanks,
Bill Sudbrink
>Anyone know the procedure? Can it be done? Do I need some special
>diagnostic program (do vaxes run XXDP?)
I forget if they can be formatted, but I do know that they can
be erased and scanned... but you need to have something which
speaks DU Protocol (DUP)... if you have a uVaxII or uVaxIII,
you have what you need...
You have to use one of the maintenance commands from the uVax
console...
One of the commands of the form
SET HOST/MAINT/UQSSP/SERVER n
where n is the number of the UQSSP port.
Once the DUP starts up, it will prompt for a command or
filename... type DIRECT and it will give you a listing
of what is available. Some drives have different numbers
of programs available, so try what looks obvious.
BTW - the DUP protocol is essentially a protocol which
causes the VAX and the KFQSA to exchange packets of text.
You type something, it is packetized and sent to the KFQSA
where it is passed to code running in the disk. The output
of that code is passed back to the VAX in a packet.
I don't know of anything else which speaks it (unless there
is something on the user test TK50 under MDM).
And it is a proprietary protocol, so I can't explain the
specifics.
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
<> The 1771 is a single density only controller and not suitable for use wit
<> 3.5" disks. You want a board with a 765 (compupro) or 1793 CCS and a raf
<
<Are you claiming that you can't format/use a 3.5" disk at single density?
<Now, I can't think of a machine that did, but equally I can't think of a
<reason why you can't. The floppy drive really doesn't care how you
One, at the lower data rates the 1771 is running below the 3.5" floppies
720khz rates and the 1771 does not do the faster one! So to be compatable
with a 3.5" drive you need to run the 1771 at the 8" single density rate to
get a something approximating 720k disk. At that rate your running at
250Kbits/Sec wich is the bottom data date for 3.5" floppies.
Personally that is is a lot of effort as you will have to rewrite the bios
for the different tracks/sectors and also allow for sides. OH, forgot that
most SD controllers did only one side. If your going to the effort why not
use a good DD controller and run the dsik up to the 1.44-1.6MB range? At
that amount of storage CP/M feels like your using a slow hard disk.
I know this from putting 3.5" floppies on my Vt180s, Ampro, Kaypro, SB180,
CCS and compupro systems. All use 1793 or 765 DD controllers.
Allison
<According to the docs, you have to tell the controller
<which drive type it is talking to (bit 4 at I/O address
<34 hex). Looking at the schematics, it sure looks like
<it blindly shoots signals to both connectors. FDAT is
<connected to pin 30 on the 34 pin header and pin 48 on
<the 50 pin header. Hmmm... what's going on here? Pin 48
<is SEP DATA, used with hard sectored drives isn't it?
<Pin 50 is connected to FCLK as well.
<
<What gives?
Some 8" drives have data seperation on the disk drive and some boards used
that. NOTE: there will also be raw data from the disk and that may actually
be used. Of the 50 pins there are often many unused.
Allison
Ok, finally got a moment to put together some bits in my uVAX 3900 in the
BA213 cabinet. I've got it built as follows (from right to left)
KA655
32MB Memory
32MB Memory
DECSQA (ethernet)
KFQSA (DSSI)
TQK70 (TK70 contoller)
Then wide open space. :-) [meta question, presumably DEC had fill plates
for the empty slots?]
In the top part I've got a TK70, and two RF71's. The RF71's are connected
to the KFQSA via an internal cable that daisy chains first the rightmost
drive then the left drive and then ends at a bulkhead that has a mini
connector (looks like SCSI2). On that connector I've got a DSSI terminator
plugged in.
When I boot the cpu does all of its diagnostics but it doesn't "see" the
KFQSA. One of the drives blinks fault the other rattles around a bit and
then blinks ready.
Some questions:
The front panel has the disk lights bulkhead configured for
three disks. I connected the small connector of the rightmost
disk to disk one connector and the left disk to the second drive
connector. Is that correct?
When I type SHOW DEV to the uvax prompt it show the ethernet and
tape but NOT the KFQSA. Is that normal if the disks are not inited?
When I type Megan's command "SET HOST/MAINT/QSSP/SERVER 0"
to access the internal controller on the KFQSA I get
>>>SET HOST/MAINT/UQSSP/SERVER 0
?28 UNK SW
Any ideas anyone?
--Chuck
You'll need to spend a bit of time studying out how the controller you're
using handles the drive select or even a cable select if it has separate
selection on the 34 and 50-conductor cables, and whatever it does to
manipulate the clock extraction circuits to derive the appropriate clock for
whatever data rate you're wanting. BE CAREFUL! Some controllers switch the
clock frequency as they make whatever assumptions they may make about the
nature of what's on each cable. In order to drive 3.5" diskettes, you need
to fool the controller and software into believing it's talking to a drive
on the 50-pin cable. Though the 8" drives have only 77 tracks, they have
the 360 rpm spin rate and most other parameters in common with the little
teensy drives. If your controller switched the clock assuming its top data
rate will be 250 kbps, you may have problems.
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 3:29 PM
Subject: RE: Cromemco 4FDC, How do you format a disk?
>At 04:38 PM 7/27/99 -0400, Allison wrote:
>>The 1771 is a single density only controller and not suitable for use with
>>3.5" disks. You want a board with a 765 (compupro) or 1793 CCS and a raft
>>of others.
>
>Which defines, for the most part, the difference between a 4FDC and a
>16FDC. The latter used the 1793 I believe. I've got a copy of the Western
>Digital databook that has these ICs in it if someone needs a copy.
>
>BTW, I wrote the formatter for CP/M on the 16FDC (in Turbo Pascal no less
>:-)) and it simply loaded up a buffer, then did a write track and stuffed
>the buffer with an OUTIR instruction. (the board did wait states so this
>worked.) The process involved creating a buffer and using special 8 bit
>codes for "sector gap" and "index mark" and "sync mark". I've long since
>given away that code but the person I gave it to is lurking on this list...
>
>--Chuck
>
This thing will supposedly execute 'highlighted' Forth and 6800 assembly
code with some (leap)key gyrations... Anyone know?
Thanks
- Mike: dogas(a)leading.net
Yes! I finally scored a Pro380, well, actually it's a "VAX Console", but
hey, same thing right?
Question, does it use the same monitor as the DECmate and Rainbow's? I
know there was a colour and a mono version of the monitor, is do they both
work on the same computer, or do you have to match specific computers to
specific monitors? Having asked that, I should be getting the monitor in
the next few days from the person I just got the computer from.
I know it's got a RD52 in it, and I suspect it's a working system as it is
off a system that is currently being deinstalled (which is why I don't have
the monitor yet).
Yes, it's safe to assume I'm fairly clueless about Pro's.
This is so COOL!!!!
Zane
OK, I'm calmed down now.... NOT!!! :^)
Yep, I'm bouncing :^)
You'd never guess I've been wanting one of these would you? :^)
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
Doug,
At 08:53 PM 8/18/98 -0500, you wrote:
>On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Joe wrote:
>
>> I got another HP toy today. Another HP 9821! I already have one and
>> this is only the third one in existance that I know of. A collector in New
>> York has the other one. Does anyone know where I can find some manuals
>> for a HP 9820 or HP 9821?
>
>So, what's the diff between the 9820 and 9821? You can probably get an
>idea of how rare they are by looking at the serial numbers on the two you
>have. I know a guy with 9820A docs. If you don't find them elsewhere,
>bug me, and I'll bug him for a copy.
>
>-- Doug
>
Can you bug the guy that has the 9820 docs? I still haven't found any.
I'm writing some articles about the 9800 calculators for the upcoming HP
confernce and I need to find out more about the 9805, 9810 and 9820.
Joe
>under rt11 5.00, it won't init a tape. used to do this w/ no problem. rt
>returns "output error on mt0:" The tape spins and tries to init, but
>after going back and forth a number of times, it gives up. So the
>mechanism and control logic seems fine. I've tried different tapes and
>cleaned and degaussed the head. No change. Jiggled all the cards in the
>controller and device section to 'assure' a good connection. Nothing. I
>even tried using an old copy of ROLLIN, just to see if it'd do a backup,
>but it moved the reels and instantly gave a FATAL DEVICE ERROR on MT0.
It's clear from the above that you can't do a tape write, but it's not
clear where the problem is because a write involves both the read and
write channels. What happens when you try to read a known good tape?
If you know the problem is reading, it's straightforward to hook a
scope up to the read channel and trace the head signals through at
least to the formatter. If you know the problem is writing, you trace
through from the formatter to the write heads.
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
I was moving a cart full of HP I/O gear from system to system last night to
do some testing. On top of the cart was a DEC vt220 terminal. The keyboard
fell off, hit the ground and basically disintegrated!
Anyone have a spare vt220 keyboard or know where I might find one cheap?
Thanks!
Jay West
> Believe it or not, I got the system because I want to run POS, but might
> use it for RT-11 also.
RT-11 runs pretty nicely on a Pro. It's no longer officially supported,
but if you buy a RT-11 5.7 RX50 distribution from Mentec you will get a floppy
that boots on a Pro, and it is fully Y2K compliant.
>Am I correct in assuming that POS is also available at the UU.se site? It
>looks like it might be there in Teledisk images.
If you'd rather have "straight block-by-block" RX50 images, look at
ftp://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/pro/
These are a bit easier to use (with PUTR) than the teledisk images.
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
Here's a guy wanting to get rid of an old Olympus printer. Please reply
to him.
Reply-to: lberke(a)bellatlantic.net
Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out.
Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0!
See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details!
[Last web site update: 05/25/99]
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 09:56:34 -0400
From: Lee Berkebile <lberke(a)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: donations
It was an early printer, based on a typewriter mechanism (Olympus, I
believe). I used it with a Commodore 64 (this should help date it) soon
after the Commodore came out. The nine pin dot-matrix printers available
then gave poor print quality. The Daisy wheel printers gave typewriter
quality, albeit slowly, and had all the features such as subscript,
superscript, bolt, underline, etc. The Commodore printers of that era did
not have descenders for the lower case g, j, p, and y letters, for
instance.
I believe the price was $240.00
Cheers,
Lee
John,
Did I ever get payment to you for these?
Jon
>Hello -
>
>I have 2 "Principles of Operation" and 1 "Maintenance Instruction"
>manuals. Free for the cost of shipping. These manuals cover models
>CT-4964, CT-6644, CT-7484.
>
>john
>
>--
>
>***********************************************************************
>* John Ott * Email: jott(a)saturn.ee.nd.edu *
>* Dept. Electrical Engineering * *
>* 275 Fitzpatrick Hall * *
>* University of Notre Dame * Phone: (219) 631-7752 *
>* Notre Dame, IN 46556 USA * *
>***********************************************************************
>
>
Bill:
Ask your friend if he'll be willing to hang on to it for a few
of weeks-- I'm in Kansas, and I could come a pick it up! (But
can't do it right away).
Thanks!
Jeff
On Tue, 27 Jul 1999 04:01:29 GMT bill_r(a)inetnebr.com (Bill Richman)
writes:
> A friend of mine has rescued the following equipment. (I don't know
> HP
> stuff, so I'll give a general description and some numbers.)
>
> Two big, _heavy_ boxes about the size of 2-drawer filing cabinets:
>
> Box 1 contains modules marked-
> HP 9000/300
> HP 9000/300
> HP 98720A
>
> Box 2 contains modules marked-
> HP 7958B
> HP 9000/300
> HP 98720A
>
> There is also a large RGB monitor, HP #98751A, at least two (HPIB,
> so
> I'm told by an HP-head) keyboards and mice, video cables, etc.
>
> He offered it to me but I have no use for it. It's big, bulky, and
> heavy, so if you're interested in it, you'll have to arrange for
> transportation from Lincoln, Nebraska. A few bucks thrown in his
> direction for dragging the stuff home from the brink of destruction
> wouldn't be out of line either - maybe $50 or $100 if the stuff is
> worth
> anything to you. If you want any/all of this stuff, let me know by
> Wednesday, because I'm sure he'll be tired of dragging it around in
> his
> van by then. He'll probably have used up the $50-100 in extra gas!
>
>
>
> -Bill Richman (bill_r(a)inetnebr.com)
> http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r - Home of the COSMAC Elf
> Microcomputer
> Simulator, Fun with Molten Metal, Orphaned Robots, and
> Technological Oddities.
>
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In a message dated 7/26/99 9:43:45 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com writes:
>
> Does ANYone have, or know where I can get, the original Reference and
> Flash diskettes for the NCR 3450 series system? I don't have a lot of faith
> that NCR can provide, and their web site downloads are USELESS without the
> original to work from!
i havent played around with my NCR MCA machine yet, so i dont know the fun. i
know most of the 95xx IBM PS/2 machines had an IML partition accessed during
a warm boot by pressing ctrl-alt-insert. have you tried that to see if it
would work?
Hi all,
As promised, I have posted some pics of a recent retrieval of a Vax 6000
cluster at
http://www.stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au/vax/
if anyone is interested. I will add more stuff as I get time.
Cheers
Geoff Roberts
Computer Systems Manager
Saint Mark's College
Port Pirie, South Australia.
Email: geoffrob(a)stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au
netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au
ICQ #: 1970476
Work Phone: 61-8-8633-8834 (1100-1800 Mon-Thurs)
Hi, I have a DEC VAX II System. 2 separate large (2' X 4') racks 1 with a
CPU and Power supply and the other only power supply cables etc. $40 anyone
interested? In L.A. Area, <Torrance, CA> Owner is going to scrap if no one
interested.
-----Original Message-----
From: KENNETH S HALEY <haleyk(a)okstate.edu>
>
>As a finale, self-replicating CA structures were invented by a guy in a
>LANL working group (see 'artifical life') with an Apple.
>
Wrong! Christopher Langton (who organised the first Artificial Life
Conference, September, 1987, Los Alamos National Laboratory) invented a
simple example of a self-replicating structure for a cellular automata
system based not too loosely upon the work of E. F. Codd. The reference
is a book entitled Celluar Automata. The work of von Neumann is collected
in a volume by Arthur Burks entitled Essays on Cellular Automata.
Codd's CA has eight states and the neighborhood function of von Neumann.
It has the curious characteristic of providing a model of brain cell
function, i.e. neurons.
William R. Buckley
A friend of mine has rescued the following equipment. (I don't know HP
stuff, so I'll give a general description and some numbers.)
Two big, _heavy_ boxes about the size of 2-drawer filing cabinets:
Box 1 contains modules marked-
HP 9000/300
HP 9000/300
HP 98720A
Box 2 contains modules marked-
HP 7958B
HP 9000/300
HP 98720A
There is also a large RGB monitor, HP #98751A, at least two (HPIB, so
I'm told by an HP-head) keyboards and mice, video cables, etc.
He offered it to me but I have no use for it. It's big, bulky, and
heavy, so if you're interested in it, you'll have to arrange for
transportation from Lincoln, Nebraska. A few bucks thrown in his
direction for dragging the stuff home from the brink of destruction
wouldn't be out of line either - maybe $50 or $100 if the stuff is worth
anything to you. If you want any/all of this stuff, let me know by
Wednesday, because I'm sure he'll be tired of dragging it around in his
van by then. He'll probably have used up the $50-100 in extra gas!
-Bill Richman (bill_r(a)inetnebr.com)
http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r - Home of the COSMAC Elf Microcomputer
Simulator, Fun with Molten Metal, Orphaned Robots, and Technological Oddities.
On Sat, 24 Jul 1999 19:20:56 +0100 (BST) Tony Duell
<ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Other keywords to look for would be 'chording keyboard' or 'Microwriter'.
[ ... ]
> I got a Microwriter Agenda (a later model) at a radio rally, and have
> played with a it a bit.
An AgendA isn't really a later version of a Microwriter. The Microwriter
is just an input device, to be attached to any normal computer/WP. It's
about the size of a paperback book. An AgendA is a personal organiser
(akin to a Psion) which happens to have a Microwriter-style set of buttons
as well as conventional keys. Well, if you call an "A B C D ..." layout
"conventional". It's actually smaller than a Microwriter keypad, about 2/3
the size, and is landscape-layout rather than portrait.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
Ok... I've been ping-ponged between NCR tech support and their IPP
(publications) dept. so many times today, I'm beginning to feel round,
small, and white!
Does ANYone have, or know where I can get, the original Reference and
Flash diskettes for the NCR 3450 series system? I don't have a lot of faith
that NCR can provide, and their web site downloads are USELESS without the
original to work from!
Anyone? Thanks in advance.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
In a message dated 7/26/99 12:02:35 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
ware(a)xtal.pharm.nwu.edu writes:
> The moving companies that I have contacted to obtain estimates have said
> that the computer equipment is no problem - "just box it up". It sounds
> easy enough, but I don't know what the reaction will be to 150-pound boxes
Heavy boxes and or crates are no problem to movers, just let them know of the
weights so they can bring the right equipment to move them. Racks will
usually require a forklift or a loading dock on both ends of the move. Use
heavy doubleweight cardboard for 150 pound boxes.
> (or crates) that contain a single item. I'm planning to remove the front
> panels from the lights-and-switches equipped minis for transport and may
> remove boards and/or PSUs to lighten individual machines if necessary.
> Does anyone have other suggestions for dealing with unwieldy items such as
> rack-mountable equipment and workstation monitors in a long-distance move?
Consider a company that specializes in moving computer equipment. They use
"air ride" trailers that are more shock absorbent and their drivers are
trained in computer friendly driving. I have been able to ship equipment in
racks with just a blanket thrown over it with these specialty movers.
Request an "air ride trailer" anyway. Use padding and cardboard to protect
front panels. Park all hard drives, check their mounting bolts and check
their slide mounting bolts to the frame. It is especially important to check
the rack mounting bolts and screws. We lost 30% of an Amdahl drive array when
the drives shook loose of the frames due to a rough stretch of Interstate
I-5. It tripped their shockwatches. This is where an "air ride " trailer
would have been valuable.
Two complete layers of large bubble wrap is sufficient for heavy plastic
printers and terminals (i.e., TI 810s, Wyse 50s, etc.) when contained in a
box. If you have a lot to ship consider buying a large roll of bubble wrap at
a commercial packing supplier. I get a 48 inch wide roll of large bubble
(about 5 feet in diameter) for $80 from a supplier of discount cardboard box
supplier. I like the stuff that is perforated every 12 inches if they have it
in stock. Put a stick through the core and hang it from the ceiling so it
unrolls easy.
If you just rent space in a trailer sit down with a pad of graph paper to
sketch out your layout in advance. Measure all the racks, boxes and pieces so
you can fit them on the floor of the trailer. Some people like to cut out the
pieces to make the easier to rearrange. Make note of top-heavy racks. These
will be need to be lashed to the side walls of the trailer. After rolling in
any equipment on wheels, lower the adjustable levelers so they won't roll.
Protect with cardboard and tie each to the walls. If you use commercial
movers they will do all of this. You do need to tell them about top-heavy
racks.
Consider packing the workstation monitors upside down in a box with large
bubble. Cut a collar of bubble wrap to fill the space between the base and
the monitor in any case. If you have several consider packing them in a
cardboard Gaylord. This is a heavy cardboard box the size of a pallet,
approximately 40" X 42" X 4' to 6' height. These are usually available from
the same place I get bubble wrap. Put the box on a pallet before you pack it.
Strap it to the pallet after you fill it.
Remember Force = Mass X Acceleration. Also that Mass wants to travel in a
straight line. Both of these are germane to packing a trailer.
Good luck
Paxton
Now, cellular automata is my field. John von Neumann invented cellular
automata at the suggestion of Stanislav Ulam, when the two worked at the
Los Alamos National Laboratories in the 1940's. See von Neumann's work,
The Theory of Self-Reproducing Automata, and the book by Arthur Burks,
Cellular Automata.
John Horton Conway invented life as an alternative example of von Neumann's
work. There is also the cellular automata invented by E. F. Codd. The
game of life was first described in the October 1970 issue of Scientific
American.
William R. Buckley
-----Original Message-----
From: Hans B Pufal <hansp(a)digiweb.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Sunday, July 25, 1999 6:55 PM
Subject: Re: Conway's "Game of Life" ... when invented?
>ss(a)allegro.com wrote:
>
>> I was wondering if anyone knows when John Conway invented "life". The
>> best I've found on the web is "1960s".
>>
>> But...I just saw a movie, "Ocean's Eleven" (starring Frank Sinatra and
the
>> rest of the Rat Pack) ... and I'd swear that the start of the credits
looks a lot
>> like a run of life (i.e., several generations of display in the cellular
automata
>> game) at the beginning, which then segues into pseudo-Vegas neon signs.
>>
>> The movie is credited as being in 1960.
>
>>From <http://home.earthlink.net/~hilery/life/intro.htm#The Game of Life>
>:
>
>"In the early seventies, the only references to Conway's work were those
>originally given in Martin Gardner's "Mathematical Games" column in the
>October 1970 and February 1971 issues of Scientific American."
>
>I think that Conway developed the game just prior to its publication in
>Scientific American so seeing it in a film dated 1960 is unlikely. What
>you saw may have been a different cellular automatom, these were
>investigated if not discovered by von Neumann in the '50's.
>
>Regards,
>
>_---_--__-_-_----__-_----_-__-__-_-___--_-__--___-__----__--_--__-___-
>Hans B Pufal Comprehensive Computer Catalogue
><mailto:hansp@digiweb.com> <http://digiweb.com/~hansp/ccc>
Thanks to all who responded to the memory parity problems I was having on
the 2100. I have gotten further...I'll share the info in case anyone else
runs across this... basically all memory needs to be cleared. Note - this
applies to the 2100's, not the 21MX's.
Take off the front panel cover by removing the 4 allen head screws. Turn on
the power, and select the M register. Press clear display, then hit memory
display and clear display again (ie. set location 0 to 0) <grin>. On the
lower left of the front panel board is a switch, move it right. Then move
the switch on the upper right of the front panel board right too. Finally
hit the INC M switch. This clears all 17 bits of all memory present in the
system (16 data + 1 parity bit). Move the two switches back left and button
her up. I believe the two switches are instruction lock and step lock IIRC.
Suddenly the memory test is working well now. I'm swapping 8k boards one at
a time to locate any bad ones.
Back on the 4070 punch..... The standard HP punch (I forget the model, 2785
or something comes to mind) used an 8 bit duplex register board. If the guy
I got this facit 4070 from really did use it on the HP at least, I wonder if
it was hooked up to the 8bit duplex board like the normal HP 2748B paper
tape reader was. Just a thought....
Thanks for all the help folks!
Jay West
Car boot sale (flea market) yesterday.
Someone wanted 80 pounds (about $125 US) for an Amstrad NC200 laptop. Manual is
copyright 1992, CE mark on case dated 1993, so not quite a classic, but...
Rather a nice machine - screen looked like about 80*8 (I didn't count) or 80*10
characters, all pixels addressable. Processor probably Z80 (*) - the manual
wasn't very informative, and the owner wouldn't let me dismantle it :-(
Has a strange custom spreadsheet, a word processor, a VT52 emulator and a port
of BBC BASIC in ROM, and 128K bytes of RAM.
Since the owner wouldn't take offers, I didn't buy it - L80 is far too high; I
would have offered L50 absolute max - can anybody tell me what I've missed, and
what sort of market price it has (I'd guess thrift store $10, Ebay $100 but I
don't know)
(Owner's daughter pointed out that another potential purchaser or two had looked
at it and said it was v. cheap. Since they lost interest as soon as I told them
it wasn't PC compatible, I didn't read too much into that. Heck, you can get a
386 laptop for L80 without difficulty...)
Philip.
(*) I finally found that the port of BBC BASIC includes a Z80 assembler instead
of the usual 6502. Thus my guess as to CPU. BASIC ran "FOR A=1 TO 10000:NEXT"
in 6.75 seconds as measured on the internal clock, so I'd guess at 4 MHz, but
that's just guesswork...
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Aye, I had the NeXT Cube and some other workstations on the list, as well a
whole list of proto-PDAs like the Newton MessagePad, Casio Zoomer, NCR 3125
PenPad, AT&T Eo, GridPad, but nuked 'em all since they're too new.
I love the NeXT Cube as much as the next techno freak, but once we start
down that road, suddenly we've got BeBoxes, 20th Anniversary Macintoshes,
Cassiopeia WinCE handhelds, Monorail PCs, the iMac, and pretty soon we're
buying "collectible" stuff new off the shelf at CompUSA.
About the newest thing on the list is the PS/2 80, and I had to think about
that for a while. I left it on, because it represents IBM's fall as the
dominant force in microcomputing.
Kai
-----Original Message-----
From: Zane H. Healy [mailto:healyzh@aracnet.com]
Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 7:01 PM
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
Subject: Re: Top 150 Collectible Microcomputers
>Hey, this is a great idea. Thanks, Kai!
>
>I'd add the NeXT cube to the list. For sheer sex appeal, little can beat
>a black magnesium cube.
YES, I'd not noticed that NeXT Hardware was totally missing from this list.
Although as a Workstation that might be intended. However, I personally
thing that both because of asthetics, and NeXTstep that at a very minimum
the NeXT Cube should be listed! Personally I think the whole line should
have at least a one line mention!
Zane
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
I have just got back from a 680 mile round trip to collect a free Sun 3/110 along with various external drives and a monitor (which may be reepairable). I will post full details when I have got it all out of the car and found out exactly what it all is. I am also going to have to dive into my SunOS manuals to find out how to boot to single user mode and reset the root password as it has been forgotten by its prevoius owner.
Regards
Pete
Tony Duell wrote...
>These pull out towards the back of the punch - on later models
>there's a little metal rod that retains them. Loosen the screw that
>clamps that and slide it up out of the way.
I must have a later model, mine has the metal rod you mentioned... However,
the rest seems different from what you described.
When I remove the baseplate, the first board visible does have some stuff on
it, but certainly not a uart. This first board is almost (within 1/2 inch)
as long as the board underneath it. This first board is virtually empty,
except there was one row of 13 small transistors top to bottom, then a row
of approximately 3 resistors and 1 diode for each transistor. Then there's a
fair amount of traces taking the signals to the edge connector. It would
appear that the sole purpose of the back half of this board is to bring two
test points to the rear of the unit (6v and gnd).
The board underneath this appears to be the main logic board you referred
to, as there are a number of power transistors on the board. As a point of
reference, there are also a set of hardwired jumpers, labeled 1 through 8 on
the board too. Next to this is a set of small transistors marked off as 1
through 9.
Then there is a metal plate (3 screws remove the top half of it) revealing a
final small PCA, obviously power related (theres a few 7 watt resistors, and
what appears to be some yellow coils).
The guy I got this punch from swears it hooked up to a standard rs232 serial
port, but at this point I'm skeptical. Is any further info available?
Thanks in advance!
Jay West
I have been looking for quite a while to try and find a
framebuffer for my sun 2/120. I have everything I need for a working
system, including monitor,kb,mouse,cpu,etc etc etc but I have _no_
framebuffer! I even have OS tapes.
The card cage and system works, as I used it with a vt100 terminal
for a while.. I couldn't get my tapes to install, though, and I am not
sure why. Anybody have any advise?
Also, is there a good place to go for pinouts and such? I was
looking around for some pinouts, but found a hard time of finding only the
pinouts for a VGA connector. Is there a place that just has pinouts for
things that might be useful to classic people? ie- MCA bus, crazy kb
connectors on old workstations, etc etc?
Thanks,
Greg Linder
fluke(a)mcs.net
Hah!
How'd you avoid getting sniped?
I'm 0 for 6 on e-bay myself.
I could just spit.
Jeff
On Tue, 13 Jul 1999 02:03:16 GMT Lawrence LeMay <lemay(a)cs.umn.edu>
writes:
> Well, I went and purchased a 8K core memory board on ebay, mainly
> because I recognized it as a G646C core memory plane from a
> pdp8/e or /f.
>
> If someone has the G111 and G233 boards that should go with this,
> but not the core memory, then perhaps i can trade you something
> for them.
>
> -Lawrence (That core plane will work in a Muniac computer too???)
> LeMay
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Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
>>> (Artificially Intelligent Cybernetic Systems),
>>
>>Wow. Impressive name. Betch'a they did not live up to it.
>
> I like the idea of artifical stupids.
The natural ones are quite bad enough!
But seriously, look at the way robots are portrayed in Clifford Simak's novels -
good at getting jobs done, and even at making decisions, but not good on
creativity. I suspect the first truly thinking AI will be a bit like that...
> Anybody else ever read the sci fi book Tik Tok?
Sladek, isn't it? I've read it, but I didn't enjoy it much. Too much
gratuitous violence, and robots too human physically.
Philip.
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Hi,
I was wondering if anyone knows when John Conway invented "life". The
best I've found on the web is "1960s".
But...I just saw a movie, "Ocean's Eleven" (starring Frank Sinatra and the
rest of the Rat Pack) ... and I'd swear that the start of the credits looks a lot
like a run of life (i.e., several generations of display in the cellular automata
game) at the beginning, which then segues into pseudo-Vegas neon signs.
The movie is credited as being in 1960.
thanks,
Stan Sieler
sieler(a)allegro.com
First, never heard back from the guy posting for sale...
<> with the T800. I basically call it a mutant T800 :-) It is a new "linea
<> the transputer tree.
Despite all this my knowledge of what a transputer is hasn't greatly
improved. It would be interesting to have a discussion as to it's
archetecture and all.
Allison
"Jay West" <jlwest(a)tseinc.com> wrote:
> When I remove the baseplate, the first board visible does have some stuff on
> it, but certainly not a uart. This first board is almost (within 1/2 inch)
> as long as the board underneath it. This first board is virtually empty,
> except there was one row of 13 small transistors top to bottom, then a row
> of approximately 3 resistors and 1 diode for each transistor. Then there's a
> fair amount of traces taking the signals to the edge connector. It would
> appear that the sole purpose of the back half of this board is to bring two
> test points to the rear of the unit (6v and gnd).
First I want to say that Western Numerical Control sells copies of the
technical
manual for the Facit 4070. The cost is $25 and if you order, ask for
the free
mylar sample and they will send you about 50 feet of 1" mylar tape. The
Facit
4070 punches mylar just fine.
OK now, the manual calls the first or bottom board the "matching
board". And
says "This board can be supplied without components, to be used by the
customer
for his own interface electronics".
This board in my 4070 was originally blank but was then hand wired
with one
74LS04 and one 74LS00 to invert the 8 data bits, and one 74LS123 to
provide
the right length pulse for the punch start signal. I also have a HP
9884A
(which is the same thing) that has a HP PCB with transistors in this
first
slot.
> The board underneath this appears to be the main logic board you referred
> to, as there are a number of power transistors on the board. As a point of
> reference, there are also a set of hardwired jumpers, labeled 1 through 8 on
> the board too. Next to this is a set of small transistors marked off as 1
> through 9.
>
> Then there is a metal plate (3 screws remove the top half of it) revealing a
> final small PCA, obviously power related (theres a few 7 watt resistors, and
> what appears to be some yellow coils).
These punches come standard with a parallel interface, but they make
RS-232
interface and a "Multi Interface" board which is a parallel,RS-232,and
current
loop interface. This multi interface has a toggle switch to select the
interface
and a DB-25S on the board for RS-232 and current loop operation. (For
parallel
operation the DB-25 on the rear of the punch is used). This multi
interface
also has two 8 switch, one 5 switch, and one 4 switch dip-switches on
the board.
So without seeing your board I would bet that it is a parallel board.
Here is the information that Tony sent me before I ordered my manual
(hopefully
it will save him from typing it all in again :)
> Here's the jumper board info - it's very simple.
> First find pin A1 on the option card connector. This is linked to pin 1
> on the DB25, so an ohmeter will find it.
> The pins on that side of the connector are A1-A22, those on the other
> side are B1-B22
>
> The jumper board links :
> A1-B1
> A2-B2
> A3-B3
> A4-B4
> A5-B5
> A6-B6
> A7-B7
> A8-B8
> A9-B9
> A10-B10
> A11-B11
> A12-B12
> A13-B13 (maybe, the manual is unclear here, but unless you need the
> timing pulse output it doesn't matter)
>
> That's it. 12 or 13 through-board links.
>
> ---------------------------
>
> Cable Wirelist : IBM Printer Port -> Facit 4070 Punch
> PC Punch
> Strobe (1) o----------------o PI (11) [Punch Instruction]
> D0 (2) o----------------o Ch1 (1) [Channel 1]
> D1 (3) o----------------o Ch2 (2) [Channel 2]
> D2 (4) o----------------o Ch3 (3) [Channel 3]
> D3 (5) o----------------o Ch4 (4) [Channel 4]
> D4 (6) o----------------o Ch5 (5) [Channel 5]
> D5 (7) o----------------o Ch6 (6) [Channel 6]
> D6 (8) o----------------o Ch7 (7) [Channel 7]
> D7 (9) o----------------o Ch8 (8) [Channel 8]
> Busy (11) o----------------o PR (12) [Punch Ready]
> Gnd (25) o----------------o Gnd(25) [Ground]
> +---o Ch9 (9) [Channel 9 - Sprocket]
> +---o +6V(24) [+6V output]
>
> -----------------------
>
> [This bit applies to a special application that I used it for - hence the
> reference to punching card. Some of the rest of it might be useful, though]
>
> Facit 4070 Notes
> ----------------
> [Circuit references apply to TTL logic board version 1]
> Increase the 1K pull-down (R54) on the PI line to about 10K since the pull-up
> on the IBM printer port is otherwise too high to turn on VT11.
>
> Increase the monotime of IC23 to give a bit more punch-pin drive for reliable
> punching on card. Set R97 to 27K and remove R129
>
> Make sure the punch solenoids are correctly set up as per the Service Manual.
> (Procedure 5.1E)
> ------------------------
> Here's the Pascal program fragments to talk to the punch. Call init_punch
> at the start of the program (before turning on the 4070!) and then
> punch_byte for each character to be punched
>
> const port_base=$278; {port were 4070 is connected}
>
> procedure init_punch;
> begin;
> port[port_base+2]:=1; {Set PI low}
> end;
>
> procedure punch_byte(ch:byte);
> begin;
> repeat; until (port[port_base+1] and 128) = 0;
> port[port_base]:=ch;
> port[port_base+2]:=0;
> repeat until(port[port_base+1] and 128) > 0;
> port[port_base+2]:=1;
> end;
> ---------------------------------
I started building a PC to 4070 interface cable, with a 'C' version
of Tony's program, but I got to the point of senting a punch signal
to the 4070 and the punch's power supply would shut down. I stepped
away for a few days and I have not gotten back to it to determine
what I was doing wrong.
I hope that helps,
--Doug
P.S. WNC also sells a RS-232 interface for the Facit 4070. Price new
$695.00,
used $495.00 :)
====================================================
Doug Coward dcoward(a)pressstart.com (work)
Sr. Software Eng. mranalog(a)home.com (home)
Press Start Inc. http://www.pressstart.com
Sunnyvale,CA
Curator
Analog Computer Museum and History Center
http://www.best.com/~dcoward/analog
====================================================
Well, I gave up on the MIO for a while. Tony's explanation,
while good, was making my head spin! Also, I don't have any
26 pin card edge connectors. So I started looking at the
Cromemco 4FDC documentation and, lo-and-behold, it has a
serial port. The documentation on the serial port is clear
and simple, and I now have toggled in a short program to
initialize it and echo characters (also, put them on the
front panel lights). According to the docs, the EPROM on this
board contains a monitor which operates through the serial
port, but, and it is quite emphatic about this, it is Z80
code. Is anybody out there using one of these? With an
8080A? Maybe could send me an alternate monitor to burn
on an EPROM?
Thanks,
Bill Sudbrink
Al Kossow has scanned a couple of manuals that I've had sitting around
for a while and put 'em up on the net. He's not on the list but says
it's OK to tell y'all.
He'd also like to know about Varian 620/L software and documentation.
If you have some or know something about it, send him e-mail at
aek(a)spies.com. Feel free to cc: me, I'm interested too but not real
knowledgeable.
OK, on to the Corvus manuals.
Note each file is a 9MB PDF and these may not be the ideal manuals for
you to learn about the Corvus Concept. Read the following descriptions
before downloading.
The Service Manual is just what it says it is; if you have a broken
Concept or want to know what to do about one this manual will probably
be of interest.
The Hardware Reference includes the theory of operation document for
the Concept hardware, a section on how write code to talk to the
Omninet interface, and a section on the Corvus hard disk interface
which addresses both the electrical signals on the interface and the
communication between the computer and hard disk. Reading the latter
made me think that it should be possible to talk to a Corvus hard disk
(at least at a disk-block level) with a sufficiently bi-directional
IBM PC flavor parallel port or similar interface, a (passive) cable,
and some software that I haven't got around to writing yet.
http://www.spies.com/aek/Corvus/ConceptHWRef.pdf
- Corvus Concept Hardware Reference manual
http://www.spies.com/aek/Corvus/ConceptServiceMan.pdf
- Corvus Concept Service Manual
Thanks for doing the work of scanning may be directed to
aek(a)spies.com. Flames about PDF format can be sent to me. I won't
really care either but sufficiently good flames might move me to ask
Al whether he has raw files that I can do something with in my copious
free time (ha ha).
-Frank McConnell
Hi All:
The excellent site, http://theref.c3d.rl.af.mil/, seems to no longer be
available.
It had a ton of useful info on hard drives and controllers.
Anyone know if the site has moved, and where to?
Thanks,
Kevin
---
Kevin McQuiggin VE7ZD
mcquiggi(a)sfu.ca
<pallette on the standard, and the + is dual session (I think, will
<have to check on that). I've got a + here hooked to one of the machines
<in my cluster. Somewhere I have a couple of manuals, too. Can't send
<them, but will be glad to copy some pages if you let me know what you
the + has more cart fonts and maybe more color pallette. Both are dual
session.
Allison
Would anyone like a copy of 'Getting Started with your Domain System' from
Apollo Computer, Inc.? Published around 1983-84, it appears to be a basic
user's guide for the Apollo Domain box.
Whoever wants it (and I'll be going by time/date stamp on the responses),
first-come, first-served for $5.00 (covers postage, etc.)
If you're local (Seattle area), and you choose to pick it up instead, it's
a freebie.
Thanks!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
>How hard should I be kicking myself for not snagging an HP 9000/236 for $30
>at a hamfest in Timonium, MD? Did any of the other folks on this list pick
>it up?
I've been wondering the same thing. I passed on it, too. I talked to
the guy, though, and he said it couldn't boot completely and needed the
OS.
I made out pretty well at the show, though. Purchased:
Outbound Laptop
Franklin ACE 500 w/manuals & Franklin monitor
Mac 128k
Stack of Apple Dealer CD's
TRS-80 Model 2
Imagewriter LQ
Rasterops 21" Grayscale display
Lots of old Mac software (including ][ in a Mac!)
A bunch of Mac accessories (MacNifty, 128k/512k accelerator)
Zenith Data Systems Luggable
Two Apple Tape Drives
One bottle of Apple Juice
Total amount spent was $65. I collect Apple clones, finding two makes
for a very successful hamfest.
Tom Owad
---------------------------Applefritter---------------------------
Apple prototypes, Apple II & early Mac clones, and the Compubrick.
------------------<http://www.applefritter.com/>------------------
>I found the above box recently and would like to get it up. Can anyone
>help me with info on this? The ram has been pulled as has the cpu so I
>need to know what its chip settup was. Seems to be Intel stuff
>otherwise. There are numerous adds on the net re; ram for this but
>virtually no other info. Other than that, the information I've collected
>is that it ran off of Dos (!?!) and was used in a token ring.
>Interesting layout inside.
I believe there are multiple 433 systems... if the type you have is
a table-top unit about two inches thick with the 3.5" floppy on the
right side of the unit, I might be able to help... contact me off-list.
> I also need to know if there was anything special about the floppy
>drive as I'd need to replace that as well. Last, is there anyway to rig
>a harddrive into one of these?
Again, if it is the one I mentioned above, yes, you can have a hard
drive -- but it has to be a notebook-type 2.5" drive. I think the
floppy is a standard RX23... though you might be able to put in an
RX26 (2.88Mb).
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
At a regular Ham Radio Trash and Treasure sale I went to today there was a
HP7910 disk drive at the bottom of a big pile of slow moving stuff that
seems to be there every time.
I didn't grab it because it was too deep, no time etc. Maybe next time.
What system/era would this have been from?
Hans
Re:
> > (Artificially Intelligent Cybernetic Systems),
>
> Wow. Impressive name. Betch'a they did not live up to it.
>
> William Donzelli
> aw288(a)osfn.org
In some respects:
Recent paper by founder of AICS:
http://www.aics-research.com/research/notes.html
Bio/recent work by student associated with AICS:
http://www.natural-selection.com/people/dbf.html
AICS' main work for the last 20 years hasn't been in cybernetics, but in
more general purpose programming (on the HP 3000).
SS
Greeting to all,
I picked up a Commodore 128d (manufactured Sep 1985) yesterday and found
out the CP/M System User Utilities Disk and CP/M Plus Version 3.0 disk is
bad. Anybody out there got another disk that I could get a copy of it from?
Robert Patton II
Lakewood, WA
PATTON2R(a)aol.com
Joe Rigdon has claimed the Apollo manual I offered earlier.
Thanks much.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
Two quick questions for the list:
1) Does anyone know the difference between a VT340 and a VT340+?
2) Does anyone have a manual for same, that I could purchase/borrow/copy etc.
Thanks,
--Chuck
Sorry for the sales ad people but I need to move these quick...
I just picked up a dozen Dell 425s/NP machines last night in place of
payment for work done for someone. They all work great and look like
new. Each has 4 mb ram and most have 213mb hard drives, some 120mb. A
cdrom can be installed as there is a closed off 5.25" baywhich can be
used by opening the cut out in the front bezel. They run a 486SX-25
processor and are in a very durable low profile steel desktop case. Each
has built in serial, parallel, mouse, keyboard and video ports. You use
a PS/2 style keyboard or an adapter, and use either the PS/2 style
mouse port or one of the serial ports. They each have 3 spare ISA slots
as well and a 3.5" floppy and IDE hard drive interface. All onboard
jumpers are plainly marked and onboard video can be disabled to
accomodate a separate video card. BIOS is easy to get into as well and
very easy to work with. RAM is 72 pin SIMMs. Beige in color, good
condition.
Most had DOS and Windows 3.11 and many had OS/2 originally. Win95 will
function well on them with added RAM. These would make excellent linux
boxes as well, or even a low buck machine for those odd tasks or for
the kids. Each has been tested and loaded with MSDOS boot only. Add your
own operating system, monitor, keyboard and mouse for a sweet little
machine. They've been tested with both mono and color VGA monitors.
I can add one of the 2S/2P cards I have if you desire additional ports,
for $3.00 more. Will include setup docs.
I traded these for a $300 debt long overdue so $300 * 12 is $25 each.
That's what I need from each plus the shipping via USPS (insured). They
weigh roughly 22 lbs each for shipping.
Drop me a line at RHBLAKE(a)BIGFOOT.COM if interested. if I'm able to get
my video capture back in use soon I can send out clips of one of them.
I'm located in central KY (zip 42726) and if someone is nearby and would
like to pick one up they can contact me to arrange a daytime meeting.
These need to go soon so contact me quick so I can hold one for you. I
prefer to get payment by money order but personal checks are fine if you
don't mind wating an additional 8-10 days for it to clear.
Yup, shure do!
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: jeff.kaneko(a)juno.com <jeff.kaneko(a)juno.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Saturday, July 24, 1999 9:16 PM
Subject: WD-1002-05
>Guys:
>
>Anybody have the docs for this?
>I know it is a combination floppy/harddisk
>controller, but I need some particulars . . .
>
>Thanks.
>
>Jeff
>
>
>___________________________________________________________________
>Get the Internet just the way you want it.
>Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
>Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
>I picked up a Qualstar 1052 9-track drive at a hamfest this morning. Has
>anyone used one of these?
What interface is it? Two 50-pin edge connectors (Pertec Formatted)?
A SCSI 50-pin connector? Something else?
>Do I have any hope of using it to read old RSTS, VMS and MUMPS-11 tapes?
Sure, with the right controller/host adapter. What sort of system do you
want to put the drive on?
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
Hi folks,
Am new to this list, hope I post this msg correctly.
I have two working Epson computers, a I (an 8088) and a II+ (a 286). Both
have hard drives, I believe a 20 and a 40, respectively. I have original OS
disks, manuals, etc.
They are solidly built, classics (I guess they meet that definition!) and I
got them cuz I thought Epson printers were so well-built (still have an
MX80, btw, maybe someone wants that). Turns out the Epson computers were not
100% IBM compatible, they had some proprietary features as in the keyboard,
floppy controllers I think, and maybe a couple of other items.
I cut my computer teeth on these guys, and miss the days when you could get
under the hood of a computer and fix 'em yourself!
Anyway, I've been advised to chuck 'em in the alley but I really hate to do
that. Would like to find 'em a good home. Are they worth anything to anyone,
and if so how much? I will trust the fairness of the group here in
establishing their worth... maybe they're not worth that much, but they'd be
a pain to pack. I don't have the original cartons :( but maybe someone would
pay what it would cost me to dump 'em (gently) on the counter at the local
MailBox and say to the guy "pack 'em up".
TIA!
... Paul
--------------------------
Paul Whiting
Full Circle Communications
Billings, MT
I found the above box recently and would like to get it up. Can anyone help
me with info on this? The ram has been pulled as has the cpu so I need to
know what its chip settup was. Seems to be Intel stuff otherwise. There
are numerous adds on the net re; ram for this but virtually no other info.
Other than that, the information I've collected is that it ran off of Dos
(!?!) and was used in a token ring. Interesting layout inside.
I also need to know if there was anything special about the floppy drive
as I'd need to replace that as well. Last, is there anyway to rig a
harddrive into one of these?
TIA
colan
____________________________________________________________________
Vintage Computer Collectors List and Info: http://members.xoom.com/T3C
Mail us at: T3C(a)xoommail.com
Hi,
I'm looking to find a speech synthesizer card for the Altair,
built in 1975 or 1976 by AICS (Artificially Intelligent Cybernetic Systems),
in Las Cruces, New Mexico).
If you have one, even if you want to keep it, please drop me a line.
thanks,
Stan Sieler
sieler(a)allegro.com
Guys:
Anybody have the docs for this?
I know it is a combination floppy/harddisk
controller, but I need some particulars . . .
Thanks.
Jeff
___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
Do you have a mailing list for classic computers, and if so, may I subscribe
to it? Please send instructions...
Thank you!
... Paul Whiting
--------------------------
Paul Whiting
Full Circle Communications
Billings, MT
Anyone on the list familiar with the memory subsystem on HP 2100s?
I'm getting parity errors on both 2100s. Each one has 32k, so my idea was to
switch to an 8k configuration, swapping till I isolate which boards are bad.
The CE goldbook talks about this a small amount, but even with that info all
eight 8K boards appear bad. I find this hard to believe, so I must be doing
something wrong.
Can anyone help???
Jay West
You're right, it's a 4070. Any clue how to tell if it really is serial vs.
parallel?
Thanks!
jay West
-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Friday, July 23, 1999 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: New Acquisitions! (HP2000)
>> A Facit RS-232 paper tape punch (don't recall the model offhand, but it's
>> rackmount)
>
>Probably 4070s. They are used on just about all old minis...
>
>Are you sure they're RS232, though. There is an RS232 interface for the
>4070, but it's not common. Most of them have a parallel interface also on
>a DB25-S connector. It's close to Centronics, but some of the signals are
>inverted.
>
>-tony
>
>
Yeppers, it's time for me to clean out my garage now. August 28th/29th,
12641 SE 277th Place in Kent, WA. I expect to be clearing out a bunch of
computer and electronics stuff, including some DSD-880s, various parts,
DECish boards, PC stuff, etc.
If you're looking for something specific, drop me a note. Other than that,
drop by from 10-16:00 and see what you can find.
Thanks much, and hope to see you there.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio:(WD6EOS) E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
SysOp: The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272, 253-639-9905)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
In a message dated 7/24/99 9:45:16 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rhblake(a)bigfoot.com writes:
> http://popularmechanics.com/popmech/elect/9904EFCOCP.html
>
>
for those of us who are too lazy to open up a browser session, can you tell
us what it's all about?
<complete (Templates, for example). I have also briefly seen OS/2 3.0 Warp,
<which ran faster, IIRC, but again, I didn't develop a liking for it.
I have that kit and I can't use it on the 286 laptop, requires 386 minimum.
It does run real well on one of my 386/25s, screams on a 486dx2/66.
What I've found though is some of the drivers are slow and if you have some
oddball hardware it's not a good match. I've seen a PS/2m50z running
2.0 and I was impressed. Then again I've seen dos run poorly on machines
due to configuration errors.
Allison
Hi,
>....The problem with apple/Mac drives is that the are still very
>much in use and generally the owners want too much because
>they are Apple branded/certifed....
Actually....does anyone here in the UK have an 80Mb Apple branded hard drive
they'd be willing to part with (it's a Quantum LPS80 with Apple ROM) or could
anyone anywhere possibly send me a ROM image of the ROM from said drive; I've
got a drive with a bad ROM which I desperately need to fix and/or replace
(preferably fix as I need to retrieve the data from it)?
Could also do with a 1 or 2Gb SCSI drive, the usual vendors at radio rallies
etc want silly money for them considering the cost of new 4/8/bigger drives
these days.... :-(
TTFN - Pete.
--
Hardware & Software Engineer. Sound Engineer.
Collector of Arcade Machines, Games Consoles & Obsolete Computers (esp DEC)
peter.pachla(a)virgin.net |
peter.pachla(a)vectrex.freeserve.co.uk |
peter.pachla(a)wintermute.free-online.co.uk | www.wintermute.free-online.co.uk
--
Hi all,
Jackpot system for the week. Hyundai Super-lt3, a 286 laptop. Neighbor
put it out for garbage, works, with adaptor and the battery is even good.
I consider this at the hairy edge of classic but it's a useful tool.
I plan to replace the 21mb drive with a spare 80mb and use it hard.
Oh for those neighsayers. I took out the company W3.1 floppy set
and installed it, it doesn't scream as it's only a 10mhz 1mb system but
I did it for laughs. Later I'll install Minix, CCPM, OS2, DR-dos anything
but MSdos.
Allison
I just added the following HP stuff to my collection! Looks like I'll be
spending a fair amount of time testing all this stuff out!
2100A cpu, fully decked out with all options (32K core, dma)
2100S cpu, fully decked out with all options (32K core, dma, FPP, FFP)
13037C rackmount disk controller (with interface PCA, controls both MAC AND
HP-IB drives)!
Two 2748B paper tape readers
A Facit RS-232 paper tape punch (don't recall the model offhand, but it's
rackmount)
A bevy of I/O cards, including the following:
Two 12920B Async. Mux controllers (two 3 card sets)
Two 12597 8-bit duplex register cards (for the paper tape readers)
CPU interconnect kit (actually four 12566 cards, two for each machine)
Two 12539 time base generators
Two 12531D high speed terminal interfaces
One 13210 disc interface for 7900A drives (two card set)
One 13183 Mag Tape interface for the HP 7970E drive (two card set)
Tons of cables, rackmount brackets, documentation, etc.
A 7900A disc cartridge containing the complete HP diagnostic library
A box of various paper tapes, including the load tapes for Timeshare Basic
(2000E)
The load tape for Timeshare Basic (2000 Access, 1600bpi magtape for 2100)
The load tape for Timeshare Basic (2000 Access, 1600bpi magtape for 21MX)
A carrier tray with the special IOP roms for 2000 Access
Maybe there *IS* hope for getting an HP timeshare basic system up and
running!
Jay West
Hi all,
the blower motor in one of my RK05J disk drives (DEC PDP-11/34a system)
burned out. I would like to obtain (buy/trade/anything) a replacement, either
the motor
or the entire blower assembly. Of course, if you have a RK05J where the motor
could be salvaged from I would be happy to do the removel.
Part numbers are
DIGITAL BCO8R-01 UA Rev. M ECO 007 MFG.N.S. 733
Motor is KOOLTRONIC, Inc., No. 7162-0407
115 V 60 Hz 0.47 A U.L. File No. E 40513 Type U62 3000 rpm
By the way, Kooltronic still exists but they do not have any stock left.
In the shops you find lots of 1560 rpm motors, but no 3000 rpm.
Thanks and regards
John G. Zabolitzky
Munich, Germany
<>I did it for laughs. Later I'll install Minix, CCPM, OS2, DR-dos anythin
<>but MSdos.
<
<Which version of OS2 would run well on that thing? OS/2 2.0 doesn't run
<well on a pentium...
I have 3.0, so that's what I'd try. The comment was anything but MS!
However, I have run 4.0 OS/2warp on a p166 and it was pretty nice compared
to W95. 2.0 would run poorly on Pentium as it's 16bit code and the pent
is far from optimum in that mode.
What I need to find for the Hyundai is there are 8 switches near the handle
in the front... what do they do???
Allison
In a message dated 7/23/99 9:33:56 AM EST, ckaiser(a)oa.ptloma.edu writes:
<< does
anyone out there have any old SCSI drives they might be persuaded to part
with? Like I say, the capacity doesn't have to be "large". >>
We've got a junk bin full of good 50MB-100MB SCSI drives which you (or anyone
else on the list) can have (all or part) for the shipping.
Glen Goodwin
0/0
Hi all,
I found an original MS disk today labled Windows/286. It says that it
contains Setup, Build and Displays 1. Does anyone know how many disks are
supposed to be in this set? I was thinking of installing it on one of my
old 286 systems just out of curiousity.
Joe
In einer eMail vom 7/23/99 1:56:25PM, schreiben Sie:
<<
Could a local electric shop rebuild the motor for you? (Assuming a
replacement is not in prospect)
>>
Of course that would be possible; however, that would be quite some expense
since it involves a lot of manual labour, very expensive here in Germany !
John
In a message dated 7/22/99 9:57:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
allisonp(a)world.std.com writes:
> Despite all this my knowledge of what a transputer is hasn't greatly
> improved. It would be interesting to have a discussion as to it's
> archetecture and all.
>
> Allison
I agree. Can those of you who are intimate with this hardware please
enlighten those of us who are not? This stuff sounds pretty cool but without
more information it's rather hard to tell . . .
Glen Goodwin
0/0
In a message dated 7/22/99 9:36:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
allisonp(a)world.std.com writes:
> <os/2 version 1.3 requires at least 2 meg when configured for dos and native
> <apps. i'd suggest 2.0 or higher since it has the workplace shell. if you
> <can't get os/2 running well on a pentium, you're not doing something
right.
>
> Well in my case it's a 286/10 with 1mb ram if it needs more I'm cooked.
> But there is Minix, DR-dos, CCPM to try.
what about that GEOS/newdeal app? its not really an os, its more like a shell
like win3.1 but runs on old machines and would give you a GUI.
<os/2 version 1.3 requires at least 2 meg when configured for dos and native
<apps. i'd suggest 2.0 or higher since it has the workplace shell. if you
<can't get os/2 running well on a pentium, you're not doing something right.
Well in my case it's a 286/10 with 1mb ram if it needs more I'm cooked.
But there is Minix, DR-dos, CCPM to try.
os/2 version 1.3 requires at least 2 meg when configured for dos and native
apps. i'd suggest 2.0 or higher since it has the workplace shell. if you
can't get os/2 running well on a pentium, you're not doing something right.
In a message dated 7/22/99 7:25:59 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
max82(a)surfree.com writes:
> On Thu, 22 Jul 1999, Allison J Parent wrote:
> >I did it for laughs. Later I'll install Minix, CCPM, OS2, DR-dos anything
> >but MSdos.
>
> Which version of OS2 would run well on that thing? OS/2 2.0 doesn't run
> well on a pentium...
>
> --Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)
No. Byte Magazine first used the term "laptop" in reference to a production
computer, after viewing the Epson HX-20 at a trade show in November 1981.
The Model 100 came out in March 1983.
Kai
-----Original Message-----
From: Max Eskin [mailto:max82@surfree.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 1999 2:54 PM
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
Subject: First laptop?
Hi,
I walked into Radio Shack today, and was delighted to see a row of posters
on their wall with photos of old Radio Shack stores and equipment from the
beginning of the chain to now. They mentioned that the TRS Model 100 was
'the first laptop in the industry'. Is this even marginally true?
--Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)
http://scivault.hypermart.net: Ignorance is Impotence - Knowledge is Power
Hi,
All of the stuff as of today, thursday 7/22, is all sold. Thanks for your
quick response. I will be away for two weeks, and will unsubscribe from
the list for that time.
--Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)
http://scivault.hypermart.net: Ignorance is Impotence - Knowledge is Power