- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by mbbrutman＠brutman.com

For the longest time I was stumped about how to get four drives onto a PC 5150. The BIOS supports it, but looking at the cable it just shouldn't work. There was the twist to control drive select and the one motor line - that's not enough to control four drives. I started kicking myself really hard when I rememberd that the other two drives had to go on the external cable, which has it's own motor and drive select line ... Still, mapping out the PC floppy cable compared to other systems was interesting. Even compared to an AT it is different. The AT supports a high density signal line on a previously unused pin. The other systems looked like they had independent drive select lines, but as somebody else pointed out, the motors all ran at the same time. With all of those pins on the interface, why wouldn't the motors be independently controlled? That seems like a waste on any system, never mind the wear and tear on the drives & inserted floppies. Mike

20 years, 10 months

2
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Replacing Old LEDs

by fire＠dls.net

Dear Classic Computers, I regret that my EE knowledge was never deep and is a little rusty now. I am refurbishing some old PC boards and wanted to replace a few of the LED which had become damaged or broken off. Here is my lame question, how do I correctly pick replacement LEDs? I know colors, and size, but how do I make certain that I have picked correct wattage, etc.? If some one with more experience could provide a few sentences of guidance I would be grateful. I can even put a Tektronix scope on it and take measurements if necessary. Bradley Slavik

20 years, 10 months

4
3
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RL01 drive select plug and power supply questions

by dbetz＠xlisper.mv.com

Does anyone have a spare RL01 drive select plug for drive "0"? I recently acquired an RL01 drive (thanks Lyle Bickly and Jon Miles!) but it's missing its drive select plug. This is one of the four lights on the front of the drive that has the number "0" printed on it for drive 0. Does anyone have one they're willing to part with? Also, the PDP-11/73 that I acquired is in a BA11-NC box. Does anyone know how much power the power supply in this box can supply? There is a list of the cards in the box and the power each one consumes and I've inserted an additional card (an RQDX1 controller) that draws 6.4A at 5V and I'm not sure that the power supply can handle it. That would bring the total to 26.9A at 5V where the original total was 22.3A. I could remove a DHV11 card that draws 4.3A to bring the total down to 22.6A if necessary. What is save with this power supply? Thanks, David

20 years, 10 months

1
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Wondering which OS to use (PDP-8/A)

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

Now that I have an apparently functioning PDP-8/A with 16K of core, and (hopefully soon) a working RL02, I am wondering what operating system would be appropriate. Currently I don't have any other input device aside from the programmer's panel and the keyboard, so naturally I need something that can be booted from an RL02... Any recommendations? Will software written for, say, an 8/E or 8/I run on an 8/A without patching? Could I run OS/8? TSS/8? Many years ago I used to have access to a TTY timeshared to an 8/E running Edusystem 50 (TSS/8) and would like that "feel" again... thanks Charles

20 years, 10 months

2
1
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anyone have a DEC RA82 service manual?

by jdrcpeterson＠graceba.net

Anyone have a DEC RA82 service manual? Darren Peterson

20 years, 10 months

4
3
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PC floppy cable twists...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: PC floppy cable twists... > From: "Teo Zenios" <teoz at neo.rr.com> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 14:51:46 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Allison" <ajp166 at bellatlantic.net> >To: <cctalk at classiccmp.org> >Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 2:35 PM >Subject: Re: PC floppy cable twists... > > >> >> You missed the most basic reason. One part, one bin, one stocking number >> and less standing stock. Logistics of warehousing costs and space not >> electrical design. >> >> Everyone seems to forget or even miss that not too long after the PC was >> introduced and clones appeared the costs of producing, stocking and >servicing >> them were under great pressure. Anything that cost, even pennies, could >put >> a vendor at risk. Why did some vendors disappear? >> >> >> Allison > >The original clone makers still had a huge profit margin so a few pennies >would not have mattered until the huge 1989-91 shakeout where pretty much >everybody started competing on nothing else but price (and purchasing power >benefits). I remember advertisements (early 90's ?) where DELL was comparing >its server to Compaq and it was thousands less for the same spec machine. But it did matter. It was only a matter of time that some vendors that were bleeding from the eyes tossed in the towel or were gobbled up. one of the major steps was to move to offshore production to reduce product costs. >From inside the industry it was already apprent by the late 80s that costs were under pressure. The clone companies often had a great advantage as they were smaller and less burdened than IBM, DEC and others. By '91 some were already dead or dieing. Allison

20 years, 10 months

1
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PC floppy cable twists...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: PC floppy cable twists... > From: Jules Richardson <julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:48:04 +0100 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > > >.... discussion about this on another list got me curious - what *was* >the point of that cable twist in a (IBM clone) PC floppy cable, when >every other system on the planet was using straight-through cables? > >1) Great, it means both drives in a system can be jumpered for the same >ID - but someone's still got to go in and jumper/modify the last drive >in the chain so that it's terminated, so it's not like the twist >eliminates messing around with jumpers. Jumpers were not messed with. Drive arrived, plugged in and go. Cost of delivering service was by then high enough that giving the drive away to avoid the call was actually becomming loss avoidence! >2) when the twist was introduced, there were presumably no clone >machines around (it was there from day 1 IIRC) - and wouldn't the >addition of a second floppy drive to an IBM machine have been a field >service call anyway? So it's not like it was the general public changing >jumpers, but a trained engineer... There was no jumper change. All had pullups and they are sized to allow two in parallel without problems. >3) IBM seemed to use a very small range of drives in the PC / XT / 286 >days, so it's not like there'd be a million jumper combinations to >figure out. If a customer tried to add their own drive rather than >buying through IBM, surely IBM couldn't care less if they struggled to >figure the drive jumpers on their 'non-standard' unit out? 2 is greater than 1. Cost to stock two is greater than one. >It's got me curious as it seems like a hack that doesn't completely >solve any kind of problem whilst introducing a difference between IBM >and the rest of the industry. > >cheers > >Jules You missed the most basic reason. One part, one bin, one stocking number and less standing stock. Logistics of warehousing costs and space not electrical design. Everyone seems to forget or even miss that not too long after the PC was introduced and clones appeared the costs of producing, stocking and servicing them were under great pressure. Anything that cost, even pennies, could put a vendor at risk. Why did some vendors disappear? Allison

20 years, 10 months

2
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OT: Tube Audio

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: OT: Tube Audio > From: lee davison <leeedavison at yahoo.co.uk> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:02:33 +0100 (BST) > To: cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> I didn't say nonexistant, only rare. Dynaco was amoung the best >> then. The alternate was a filiment that was balanced to ground to >> minimize the amplitude of AC heater to cathode coupling, also only >> seen on quality gear. > >Another, rarer, alternate used with directly heated cathodes is to >have two cathodes heated by a Scott wound transformer that gives >two phase AC current with a 90 degree phase difference. This >reduced heater generated noise because the noise is a function of >the square of the heater voltage and sin^2 + cos^2 = 1, effectively >a DC component. > >I have only ever seen this arrangement used on broadcast equipment. > >Lee. The other technique is far simpler. Balance, do the same thing only in mirror image. The reduction in hum and some types of noise is substantial and tube engineers understood it well. The common examples were 3A5s, 810s or maybe 813s in push pull pairs (both have directly heated cathodes). Allison

20 years, 10 months

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A BDU's is born every minute ...

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Oct 18 2005, 8:29, John Foust wrote: > At 01:39 PM 10/17/2005, Bob Bradlee wrote: > >With the aid of a paperclip and a prybar, I opened up the drive to fine a > >shattered CD inside. > But I've seen this happen *twice* to a client who wasn't > dunking them in LOX. CDs are spinning quite quickly. I've never actually seen it happen, but a couple of years ago one of the manufacturers who supplies the University issued a warning about fast drives, and IIRC some were recalled. The explanation was that the faster "52x" drives run at a speed which is very close to that at which centrifugal force can make a polycarbonate disk break up, so a defect in the disk can have a profound effect. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

20 years, 10 months

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PC floppy cable twists...

by Richard.Cini＠wachovia.com

Regarding the drive termination, I distinctly remember pulling terminators on the middle drive in a two-drive setup...just like a SCSI chain. I don't know about new drives (because I don't usually have multiple drives in my machines now), but some more modern Teac drives have a termination jumper rather than a resistor DIP pack. -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Chuck Guzis Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 1:19 PM To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: Re: PC floppy cable twists... On 10/20/2005 at 5:48 PM Jules Richardson wrote: >... discussion about this on another list got me curious - what *was* >the point of that cable twist in a (IBM clone) PC floppy cable, when >every other system on the planet was using straight-through cables? It's actually pretty simple--there's only a single "motor on" line for the standard floppy pinout. IBM wanted to control drive motors individually. The only ways to do that are with individual drive cables or using the "twist" (or some modification of it) so that the individual drive motor enables are given different conductors in the cable. Other systems using "straight through" cables switched all drive motors on and off--and many consequently used drives with head-load solenoids. IBM's solution let them economize a bit on power-supply design and use a cheaper (and quieter) drive without the head-load mechanism. FWIW, IBM makes no mention of terminator removal or addition and I don't even recall if the standard 5.25" drive allowed one to play with termination. On one of the ISA floppy/hard controllers--I think it was DTC--you could add a third drive to the string using a special cable and a drive jumpered for DS0. (I'd have to check my doc files to get the rest of the details on the cable construction). Cheers, Chuck

20 years, 10 months

2
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Snoopy calendars/ASCII art

by rcini＠optonline.net

All: There's a listing on eBay for ASCII art TTY printouts (#8707360741) and it raised an interesting question. I remember as a kid going to my father's office (he worked for New York Telephone in New York City) at Christmas and they had various computer systems that they let the kids play on. One of them (I don't remember which) had a program to print calendars. In the eBay listing, there's a Snoopy Red Barron calendar, which I distinctly remember printing out. What program would have made this calendar and is one still available, somewhere, that I could run on Windows or through something like SIMH? Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/

20 years, 10 months

11
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computer speedometer

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

>I was reminiscing to someone about an old GE mainframe > with an analog meter that registered Kops/sec. ... made by Keystone Electronics perhaps? :) -Charles

20 years, 10 months

1
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Bell and Howell "Digital Video Presentation" system

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

>In a message dated 10/19/2005 6:56:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, >julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk writes: >We've just been offered one of these - I'm assuming (awaiting further >details) that it's a rebadged Apple II Plus, as in: >http://oldcomputers.net/bellandhowell.html >... but that doesn't mention the "Digital Video Presentation" side of >it, or even any video extras over and above what the II Plus has. >Anyone know any more details? Did Bell and Howell ever do any other >computer-based systems? >I will get some more info from the owner (and they have the full doc set >apparently), but I'm being impatient :-) That's interesting, I work at B+H (now Bowe Bell and Howell) and I've never heard of any of the old stuff at work. BBH is primarily know for mail processing systems and technologies, neat stuff!

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Tube Audio

by leeedavison＠yahoo.co.uk

> I didn't say nonexistant, only rare. Dynaco was amoung the best > then. The alternate was a filiment that was balanced to ground to > minimize the amplitude of AC heater to cathode coupling, also only > seen on quality gear. Another, rarer, alternate used with directly heated cathodes is to have two cathodes heated by a Scott wound transformer that gives two phase AC current with a 90 degree phase difference. This reduced heater generated noise because the noise is a function of the square of the heater voltage and sin^2 + cos^2 = 1, effectively a DC component. I have only ever seen this arrangement used on broadcast equipment. Lee. . ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

20 years, 10 months

1
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Filters for RL02

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

Gordon recently mentioned that he had a dwindling supply of absolute filters for his RL02 drive. They are still readily available from several sources including Air Filtration Products (airfiltrationprod.com) and isesurplus.com. I just ordered one from The Filter Factory (www.thefilterfactory.com) for $28.95 plus UPS. -Charles

20 years, 10 months

5
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OT: Tube Audio

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: OT: Tube Audio > From: Scott Stevens <chenmel at earthlink.net> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 07:40:01 -0500 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 07:57:58 -0400 >Allison <ajp166 at bellatlantic.net> wrote: > >> > >> >Subject: Re: OT: Tube Audio >> > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> >> > Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 23:08:47 -0700 >> > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org >> > >> >On 10/19/2005 at 10:19 PM Zane H. Healy wrote: >> > >> >>OK, since there seem to be a fair amount of people into Tube audio, >> >>or at least with a knowledge of it. Would someone care to explain >> >>the following to someone that is used to an all in one unit such as a >> >>Sony Receiver. What is the purpose of separate Amp and Pre-Amps. I >> >>think I understand the whole phono pre-stage, but I've yet to find a >> >>decent explanation of the rest, and I'm looking to switch to tubes >> >>for playback of records (primarily Vinyl, but I'm also interested in >> >>78's). >> > >> >Purely from memory, but I believe one generally used a separate pre-amp >> >mostly due to hum issues. The power supply for the preamp could make use >> >of lower plate voltages, better regulation and DC heater supplies. >> > >> >Or so I think I recall. >> > >> >Cheers, >> >Chuck >> > >> >> No. Gads, creating answers revisionistically. Rare back then was a preamp >> with DC heaters. Besides without the oxygen free stabilized cables how >> could you appreciate it. ;) >> >My Dynaco preamp is from the early 60's and has a filtered DC power supply section for the heater filaments. > I didn't say nonexistant, only rare. Dynaco was amoung the best then. The alternate was a filiment that was balanced to ground to minimize the amplitude of AC heater to cathode coupling, also only seen on quality gear. Allison

20 years, 10 months

1
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tapetools and VMS Backup tapes

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

> (1600 bpi), and some report a few hundred records of 16384, then a few > at a smaller number, then more at 16384, etc. I'd think there were > some read problems, but the tape wasn't shoe-shining Are the "smaller sized" records 80 bytes, and have tape marks near them? If so, these are the ANSI tape labels for volume start/end and saveset start/end. Even though you mount VMS BACKUP tapes /FOREIGN on a VMS system, they still have ANSI labels on them. If there are truly damaged records then the redundancy blocks (unless you turned them off) will help you. Tim.

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Tube Audio

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: OT: Tube Audio > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 23:08:47 -0700 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >On 10/19/2005 at 10:19 PM Zane H. Healy wrote: > >>OK, since there seem to be a fair amount of people into Tube audio, >>or at least with a knowledge of it. Would someone care to explain >>the following to someone that is used to an all in one unit such as a >>Sony Receiver. What is the purpose of separate Amp and Pre-Amps. I >>think I understand the whole phono pre-stage, but I've yet to find a >>decent explanation of the rest, and I'm looking to switch to tubes >>for playback of records (primarily Vinyl, but I'm also interested in >>78's). > >Purely from memory, but I believe one generally used a separate pre-amp >mostly due to hum issues. The power supply for the preamp could make use >of lower plate voltages, better regulation and DC heater supplies. > >Or so I think I recall. > >Cheers, >Chuck > No. Gads, creating answers revisionistically. Rare back then was a preamp with DC heaters. Besides without the oxygen free stabilized cables how could you appreciate it. ;) The same preamp could be used with different power amps. Also Not all preamps were the same depending on the source used (mag cart, moving coil or variable reluctance or even ceramic) and the response curve requred. Many amps contained the required preamp, some didn't. Generally the larger ones didn't due to size. As the stereo system could have the preamps, volume and tone controlls for user convenience and the power amp (the large, heavy and hot) located elsewhere. Back in the 60s I knew a few people that were into serious audio and the power amp was in the basement, it produced too much heat, large and was ugly. Back then a good FM (maybe even stereo) reciever was often seperate as well. Component audio was that way. Just like component computers. Allison

20 years, 10 months

2
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Cromemco SCC Eproms/images needed

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Oct 19 2005, 7:49, Joe Abbott wrote: > Sooo... If anyone has a Cromemco SCC board with ROMs, > please check them to see if they are the MCB-216 roms. > There were two 2716 roms in sockets 0 and 1 containing > a monitor program and 3k control basic. We need an > image of these roms or a text hex/decimal/octal > listing would suffice (anything machine or human > readable as long as it's accurate and complete). > > Pete T. and Randy M. on the list were also looking for > these. Yes. I have an SCC but not with those ROMs, and my attempts to find the MCB-216 ROMs have met with no more success than Joe's. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

20 years, 10 months

1
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Apple II Serial Number 2

by swtpc6800＠comcast.net

I wrote up a web page about job at a computer store and getting to evaluate the first production Apple II computers. http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/Apple/allied_computer.htm . I had serial number 2 for a few weeks until the power supply failed. It was sent back to Apple and I never saw it again. I am emailing Bruce Damer about the Homebrew Computer Club event at VCF 8 and sent him a link to that page. He replied back with pictures of the same unit. Jef Raskin had it. http://www.digibarn.com/friends/jef-raskin/apple-II/index.html Here is some information about the Homebrew Computer Club. http://www.digibarn.com/collections/newsletters/homebrew/index.html Here is my page on the HCC http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/Homebrew/Homebrew.htm Michael Holley www.swtpc.com/mholley

20 years, 10 months

1
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OT: Language for the ages

by mtapley＠swri.edu

At 12:00 -0500 10/17/05, woodelf wrote: >Are we tallking real gates as in TTL, or FPGA style design? Forth does >have several advantages >over say fortran since they removed the Sense Switch requirment of >fortran.My worry is that you >may not be able to high-level threshold logic and memory anymore for >industral problems. Either TTL, or in 20 years, whatever the then-current version of FPGA or ASIC is. (To tell the truth, I had in mind re-creating the Harris RTX2010, but that's just me.) The point is, creating from scratch and then verifying a system (hardware, OS, software) to run FORTH reliably would be far easier than the same task for FORTRAN or JAVA, and in 20 years, that may be the path you'd choose to take. I am depressed at how difficult it has become for any one person to really understand either all of the hardware or all of the software (let alone both) in any commodity system, whether controller or desktop. Two more decades in that direction, and who'll know *what* is "under the hood"? Viruses, mal-ware in distribution CD's, Pentium floating-point multiply bugs, cache sync errors, my personal favorite - a compiler that forgot to save the contents of its floating-point registers when it got an interrupt in the middle of a calculation - and so on .... That stuff will all affect "emulators" too. So if your application is mission-critical, you may want/need to re-build the platform system from scratch. Better a simple set of system requirements (a la FORTH) if that's where you end up going. -- - Mark 210-522-6025, temporary cell 240-375-2995

20 years, 10 months

3
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Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Oct 17 2005, 10:50, Bert Thomas wrote: > Doc Shipley wrote: > > Check this out: > > > > http://venhaus1.com/airsine.html > > > > US$700 power cable. I'm not kidding. > > What kind of people believe in this crap? > Do they replace the wiring in their house as well to prevent > micro-movements of the wires? > And after that the cable that delivers electricity to their house? > Or are they generating their own "clean" current with special generators > wounded with golden wires? > Hmmm, with some fantansy I can create a whole new market. One of my cow orkers, Marc, has pointed out that some of it's been done before: http://www.belt.demon.co.uk/ For those who don't want to wade through the drivel, Marc sums it up thus: "Stuff like ensuring all books in the listening room have to have an odd number of pages, sticking bits of foil here there and everywhere...the web site reads like some weird cult, but he made a lot of money from it, so who's the fool ??" -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

20 years, 10 months

10
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Computer speedometers

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Computer speedometers > From: "John Allain" <allain at panix.com> > Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 20:29:41 -0400 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Some IBM 370's had a big galvanometer on the front, >EG the '168 had one even with the massive CRT >up there on the panel. >(photo courtesy the corestore) > http://www.corestore.org/370168-1.jpg > >AIX / RS6000 had a nice set of onscreen meters. > >Old fantasy: working Apollo CM control panel with all > the lights, switches and barberpoles. > >John A. Check out www.spaceref.com/exploration/apollo/acgreplica/ to build your own block 1 AGC. Allison

20 years, 10 months

1
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Thoroughly cleaning an RL02

by fireflyst＠earthlink.net

Hey everyone! I need some help. I have an RL02 disk drive that sat in a warehouse for awhile, and somehow it got spiders (and their webs) in it, and the previous owner contaminated the drive by shipping it exposed in foam and the foam got all over the inside of the drive. What's the best method to disassemble and clean an RL02 disk drive in this situation? There's none in the drive platter area, but it's all down in the cavity below it. Thanks Julian

20 years, 10 months

2
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WTD: Computer Data Systems Versatile 2

by billdeg＠degnanco.com

I live near Newark, Delaware and I am interested in acquiring a Computer Data Systems "Versatile 2" computer. This company was based in Newark, Delaware USA in 1977. I know practically nothing about this company, and the Delaware Historical Society has little more than their old address. As one of the few collectors in the area, I hope to "bring one of these systems home" for a proper preservation. The Versatile 2 was a 1977 Z80-based S-100 system with integrated monitor and keyboard. See: http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=345 I would also be interested in software, CDS disk drive, manuals, documentation, ads, and whatever. Please contact me off list if you can help. I am willing to pay $$. Bill D -- E N D --

20 years, 10 months

1
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Fischer Technik and similar logic-enhanced toys (was Re: OT:Language for the ages)

by henk.gooijen＠oce.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Ethan Dicks > Sent: woensdag 19 oktober 2005 5:25 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > Subject: Fischer Technik and similar logic-enhanced toys (was > Re: OT:Language for the ages) > > On 10/19/05, Tony Duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote: > > > Real nerds use Fischer-Technik. > > I saw that stuff in the early 80s and couldn't come close to > affording it. > > > Fischer Technik has gone down spectacularly since I was a > kid. In the > > old days there were fairly simple elecrronic modules (alas so > > expensive that I couldn't afford enough of them) -- things like a > > double pole changeover relay, analogue voltage comparator, > AND gate, > > OR gate, flip-flop, monotstable, etc. > > I remember that stuff - in particular, I remember enough > logic for an elevator controller and a traffic light. > > I'd _love_ a way to home-brew some sort of snap-together logic toy. > For that matter, I'd love a way to make something like a DEC > Logic Lab from stuff around the house (i.e. - a 2 sq ft board > covered with logic and plug points)... One could use banana > jacks, etc., for the interconnects, but at retail pricing, > that would start to add up to real money real fast. > > -ethan I read a few months ago an interesting article about a virtual building blocks piece of freeware software to be downloaded from http://www.muvium.com/ It is the "link" Virtual Breadboard, but it is already also for months announced with "Coming Soon.." I regularly keep watching this site ... - Henk, PA8PDP. This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. Thank you for your cooperation.

20 years, 10 months

2
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Fischer Technik and similar logic-enhanced toys (was Re: OT: Language for the ages)

by ethan.dicks＠gmail.com

On 10/19/05, Tony Duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote: > > Real nerds use Fischer-Technik. I saw that stuff in the early 80s and couldn't come close to affording it. > Fischer Technik has gone down spectacularly since I was a kid. In the old > days there were fairly simple elecrronic modules (alas so expensive that > I couldn't afford enough of them) -- things like a double pole changeover > relay, analogue voltage comparator, AND gate, OR gate, flip-flop, > monotstable, etc. I remember that stuff - in particular, I remember enough logic for an elevator controller and a traffic light. I'd _love_ a way to home-brew some sort of snap-together logic toy. For that matter, I'd love a way to make something like a DEC Logic Lab >from stuff around the house (i.e. - a 2 sq ft board covered with logic and plug points)... One could use banana jacks, etc., for the interconnects, but at retail pricing, that would start to add up to real money real fast. -ethan

20 years, 10 months

2
1
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Compute magazine (retry)

by holger.veit＠ais.fraunhofer.de

Somewhere my last posting didn't find its way to the list, although there were some downloads of the files below. Retry (with few typo corrections):: Hi, for quite some time I have some magazines of COMPUTE ("Club Of Microprocessor Programmers, Users and Technical Experts"), a newsletter sponsored by National Semiconductor, lying around which I consider worthwhile to be conserved for the past. The date I am talking about is around 1975..1977. Some questions: 1. I have only some issues, namely V2N7...V2N12, V3N4...V3N7. Does anyone have other issues (and is willing to scan or copy those)? I'd be very interested in this epoch. 2. Scanning: You find a sample issue at http://www.ais.fraunhofer.de/~veit/v2n7.pdf (2MB). This was scanned B&W 400dpi, stored as TIF and converted with Acrobat. My problem is that even with this some listing pages are barely readable, see page 5 for example. This is probably because of lack of contrast; the magazine is printed on light brown paper with dark brown text; other issues use blue or green text color which is probably even less readable in a scan. If one scans in color with 600dpi (as in sample http://www.ais.fraunhofer.de/~veit/3x.pdf, 2MB) this will result in much larger files - the raw TIF is 95MB on my disk, which is not a diskspace issue for me, but for downloaders; expect a single issue to be 40MB and more in size. Do the "professional scanners" here, like Al, have a recommendation for resolving this? Regards Holger

20 years, 10 months

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Need volunteers for fun, interesting, and worthwhile project

by vcf＠siconic.com

I'm working on a public service project being funded and hosted by a semi- major internet-based institution (sorry, gotta keep low-key about it in public until the big announcement). The resulting work will be a public domain utility that will be useful for everyone who works with computers, and somewhat directly relates to what we do here as computer and software collectors. If you have a couple hours to spare each week to do minimal research and data entry over the web, please contact me directly and I will fill you in with the details. Thanks! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

20 years, 10 months

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Message for Jay West

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

Hi Everyone, I've been trying to give Jay a link to my PDP11 board, but haven't heard back from him. When I spoke to him in person, he asked I resend him the link, and I have several times and haven't heard back so I figured my mail was getting filtered. Anyway, sorry to spam the list with this, but I couldn't think of any other way to get ahold of him. Jay, that address is http://pdpusers.dyndns.org - title is "PDP-11 User Community" (as I'll be working to get more than just a message board up on it soon) Sorry everyone. Thanks Jay! Julian

20 years, 10 months

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Need Manual for Tektronix 4696

by rmay635703＠aol.com

I have an old Tektronix Colorquick 4696 inkjet printer with the good ol ink wells and I want to restore it. It works with an old Innovion / CASI futura II computer photography system from the 80's. Anyway I need to get the printer to do a clean cycle and I KNOW it had one, I just don't know what dipp switch settings were needed to make this happen. Also a list of the dipp switch settings or a manual would be very helpfull. (right now the unit prints yellow, blue and a strange dark green for black) On the same topic the unit uses a green maintenance fluid, which i'm going to run out of eventually and I am wondering if anyone knows of a good substitute OR better yet what this stuff really is? I would like to get my old futura up and running but it only works with a Balloonjet printer from around 1987 (no idea what that is) or a Tektronix 4696/4695. pictures of said system here @ colortron.tk Also general information on Innovion, CASI tech and their systems is always appreciated. Thank You For Any Information Ryan

20 years, 10 months

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cctalk Digest, Vol 26, Issue 42

by mtapley＠swri.edu

At 18:08 -0500 10/14/05, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > >Suppose you wanted to write an application for a manufacturing process that > >will, in all probability, run for the next 30 years.... Also depends on how inviolate the code must be, and how verifiable the system. If you need to re-create the system, FORTH can be implemented with a lot fewer gates of hardware and a lot fewer lines of code than JAVA - and would therefore be a lot easier to verify, if you need to design/build new hardware to run your legacy code on in 25 years. -- - Mark 210-522-6025, temporary cell 240-375-2995

20 years, 10 months

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Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1" > From: woodelf <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> > Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:58:15 -0600 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Kevin Handy wrote: > >> Steven N. Hirsch wrote: >> >>> Gotta love it when the golden-eared folks apply RF transmission-line >>> theory to speaker cabling. My scepticism towards audiophile >>> snake-oil comes via heredity (my late father spent 40+ years in the >>> industry). >>> >>> >> The snake-oil industry? > >So how many people oil their snakes? It does seem hard to get a good >Hi Fi system nowdays with all the snake oil parts as you have just so cheap >stuff on the low end, and gimics on the high end. With audio nobody gives >any useful specs now days -- THD is done into a dummy load never a >real speaker. What about IM distortion too? PS. I listen to regular music; >classical I find too heavy. Every time I need an amp for audio, I build one. I have no excuse, I did audio consoles and the like. None of the chips have decent specs and reasonable solid state designs with transistor or power MOSFETs are not hard to cook up. What amuses me are the systems that have a wallwart (not switch mode either!) as a PS and claim more than 10-15W of power out. I include those that have a PS inside that is barely a wallwart. A typical wallwart can't provide that and a real amp that can do that needs a better source of power. Computer speakers are amoung the worst with the claims, most are outright fraud. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Language for the ages

by vp＠cs.drexel.edu

Paul Koning <pkoning at equallogic.com> wrote: > C is the obvious choice. In either case, you have to be careful that > you don't wreck the portability by using non-portable I/O. Er, how big is an int? a pointer? **vp

20 years, 10 months

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Insanely OT -- but very funny

by news＠computercollector.com

Attack of the Gaming Grannies http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/content/oct2005/id20051018_173699.htm ----------------------------------------- Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Language for the ages

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: OT: Language for the ages > From: woodelf <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> > Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 10:48:32 -0600 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Gordon JC Pearce wrote: > >>> >>> You're absolutely right. >>> I like those sizes, because they're a good fit with my hardware. >> >> >> ... therefore using an 18-bit int would be silly. If you were using a >> machine with a 9-bit byte length (not parity, actually 9 bits) then it >> wouldn't seem such a bad idea. > >Strange -- my hardware is just like that ( When I get it finshed ) . >The PDP-10 has done that already. >Oddly this homebrew I am working can't do real C, since now C is almost >allways 32 bit code and >I've got only a whoopping 64kb of ram. :( I think a 20 bit int is >also a nice size too and 10 bit bytes. > >> >> Gordon. CDC6000 or was it the Interdata 8/32 used a nine bit char. Funny thing about all this. I see focus on the char, int and longs and pointers with little regard to is the machine Von or Harvard and other considerations such as base machine registers, addressing modes and conditional branch capabilities. All that is needed is enough bits to do the task(s) desired. There is a point where standard C doesnt fit well enough to justify it. That doesnt negate a subset however. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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IBM System/34 with diskettes & documentation available in Iowa

by jplist＠kiwigeek.com

Greetings folks & folkettes; It is with some sadness that I must offer up my System/34 to fellow collectors. I have never gotten a 220v hookup for it, and I need the space it lives in (my garage) for this coming winter. The unit is complete, with four disks. I have some great number of floppy disks for the machine (multi-hundred, although a bunch that came with it are formatted TRS80), 24 disk jukebox cartridges, plus a large selection of documentation and schematics. OS disks are included. For my own pickup information and details pictures of the machine and what comes with it, you can head here: http://www.kiwigeek.com/hjp/comps/IBM_s34/ I expect nothing for it, I am hoping someone will come and pick it up, which I'll certainly be more than willing to help with. We live out of Hampton, Iowa (North-Central). Thanks; JP

20 years, 10 months

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Cromemco SCC Eproms/images needed

by rmu_scada_nw＠yahoo.com

Hi Rich, No, I've never found a source for those roms. What few leads I did get didn't pay off. I think it's been close to 2 years since I last posted anything about them so maybe it's time to bring it up again. Sooo... If anyone has a Cromemco SCC board with ROMs, please check them to see if they are the MCB-216 roms. There were two 2716 roms in sockets 0 and 1 containing a monitor program and 3k control basic. We need an image of these roms or a text hex/decimal/octal listing would suffice (anything machine or human readable as long as it's accurate and complete). Pete T. and Randy M. on the list were also looking for these. It'd be nice to find these before I pass on and my wife and kids get to dispose of my stuff. Keep on keeping on, Joe >Hi Joe, >I was wondering if you ever found the MCB-216 roms, or source code for the >Cromemco SCC board. I am also looking for them. >Let me know if you can help. >Thanks! >Rich __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/

20 years, 10 months

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Bell and Howell "Digital Video Presentation" system

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

We've just been offered one of these - I'm assuming (awaiting further details) that it's a rebadged Apple II Plus, as in: http://oldcomputers.net/bellandhowell.html ... but that doesn't mention the "Digital Video Presentation" side of it, or even any video extras over and above what the II Plus has. Anyone know any more details? Did Bell and Howell ever do any other computer-based systems? I will get some more info from the owner (and they have the full doc set apparently), but I'm being impatient :-) cheers Jules

20 years, 10 months

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Once again slightly OT

by news＠computercollector.com

Memorial service for former HP chief http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/news/editorial/12939854.htm Okay, I'm done now, honest. ----------------------------------------- Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/

20 years, 10 months

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HP 9133

by Phil_Matthews＠DRSOptronics.com

Hi Frank, Thanks for the reply, Joe R responded to me yesterday and told me about it being a hard drive, I sent him back some pictures, which I have attached, in hopes of identifying what I have. If you know what it is, I would appreciate the help, let me know if more picture or anything else would help. Thanks Again Phil -----Original Message----- From: Frank McConnell [mailto:fmc at reanimators.org] Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 10:21 PM To: cctalk at classiccmp.org; Matthews, Phil Subject: Re: HP 9133 Phil Matthews wrote: > I have been looking at your cctalk bulletin board and it appears that > Frank McConnell is someone who knows a lot about old HP computers. I > have been tasked to replace the HP 9133 computer on some of our test > equipment with new PC's. I was hoping to contact somebody who might > know if this is possible and how to do it. So I was wondering if you > knew how I could contact Frank McConnell or somebody who might know. Appearances can be misleading. I mostly wonder why it is that I remember how to take apart a 262X terminal better than I remember what I was working on last month. And, my work with this stuff was in a data processing and office automation environment, so what I remember is mostly terminals and HP150s and some early Vectras and of course classic HP3000s. There are other folks who read cctalk who have more clues than I do about the test-equipment side of HP, so posting to cctalk may get you more help than I can give you. One thing I am sure of, your first step is to take another look at your system. The 9133 is a disc drive; actually it is two of them, hard and flexible. It does have a microcontroller, but its firmware is about being disc drives, not about computing. Something else in there is the computer, and you need to look again and find out what that is. -Frank McConnell

20 years, 10 months

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Best way to ship computers from overseas

by cbajpai＠comcast.net

I need to ship about 200 pounds of computers, documentation and spares from South Africa to Boston. Any suggestions on shipping this economically (and safely). It seems FedEx is quite expensive does not make economic sense for me..are there alternate carriers or methods (e.g. via Ship) that make sense to Look at? How do I deal with customs? Thanks, Chandra

20 years, 10 months

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Best way to ship computers from overseas

by cctech＠retro.co.za

Hi Chandra and all >I need to ship about 200 pounds of computers, documentation and spares from >South Africa to Boston. What? I didn't know we had computers over here that would be worth shipping anywhere... > > >How do I deal with customs? Your side? Should be easier if you could prove that they were originally made on your side of the pond? >Probably the cheapest way to deal with this is to contact the different >Airlines and set up an airport to airport delivery. You might have to settle >for South Africa to New York. Not sure there are direct flights from South >Aftrica to Boston. SAA flies to Atlanta. If you're not in a hurry, stick it on a ship. Takes most of a year, or maybe it just feels like it, but it mostly gets there. W

20 years, 10 months

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Fischer Technik and similar logic-enhanced toys (was Re: OT:Language for the ages)

by henk.gooijen＠oce.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Ethan Dicks > Sent: woensdag 19 oktober 2005 5:25 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > Subject: Fischer Technik and similar logic-enhanced toys (was > Re: OT:Language for the ages) > > On 10/19/05, Tony Duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote: > > > Real nerds use Fischer-Technik. > > I saw that stuff in the early 80s and couldn't come close to > affording it. > > > Fischer Technik has gone down spectacularly since I was a > kid. In the > > old days there were fairly simple elecrronic modules (alas so > > expensive that I couldn't afford enough of them) -- things like a > > double pole changeover relay, analogue voltage comparator, > AND gate, > > OR gate, flip-flop, monotstable, etc. > > I remember that stuff - in particular, I remember enough > logic for an elevator controller and a traffic light. > > I'd _love_ a way to home-brew some sort of snap-together logic toy. > For that matter, I'd love a way to make something like a DEC > Logic Lab from stuff around the house (i.e. - a 2 sq ft board > covered with logic and plug points)... One could use banana > jacks, etc., for the interconnects, but at retail pricing, > that would start to add up to real money real fast. > > -ethan Oops, I feel stupid. I was watching this site for months to find out *now* that at the lower right side there are links to older versions. See "Virtual Breadboard Legacy Versions Home " with links to 1.2 and 1.0. When you click the "1.2" link you get a page which also has tutorials. Going to check that out ... - Henk, PA8PDP. This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. Thank you for your cooperation.

20 years, 10 months

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Slightly OT: Laser printer for sale

by news＠computercollector.com

Back in June of last year, I posted the following message: "It's a DEClaser 3500 with FIVE extra cartridges. Location is central New Jersey. The printer works well." Now it's for sale again but some details changed. Now there are four extra cartridges, not five. Also, it no longer "works well". I gave the printer to my parents, who report that it only works when it's in a good mood, and that many times it leaves a strange streak on the page. But, hey, it's DEC. That ought to interest someone. :) This sucker is HEAVY so I have no idea what it would cost to pack and ship. Anyway, make me an offer. I wouldn't mind trading for a dot-matrix ImageWriter printer/ribbons for my Apple //c. (Yes, Sellam, I know you have 87 of them, but I feel better bartering in a fair manner!) ... Or, as you all know, I'm always looking for interesting vintage handhelds. - Evan ----------------------------------------- Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Language for the ages

by infomagic＠localisp.com

> Here's an interesting problem. > > Suppose you wanted to write an application for a > manufacturing process that will, in all probability, run for > the next 30 years. No direct control of the process itself > is entailed (i.e., you don't need the program to operation > valves or run motors), but you do need this program to > compute manufacturing parameters for each customer. I/O > requirements are very modest, mostly simple keyboard and display. > > What would you write it in? Clearly, you'd want to be > independent of a particular software vendor, so the likes of > Visual BASIC isn't an option. > You'd also want to write in a language that isn't nearing > obsolescence, nor one that's still evolving. "Niche" > languages would be out of the question, as longevity could be > a problem. > > So what would it be? My vote is for FORTRAN. I've been following this thread for a few days now, and I'd like to contribute my $0.02. The original problem statement asserted several presumptions: >you'd want to be > independent of a particular software vendor.. >... > You'd also want to write in a language that isn't nearing > obsolescence, nor one that's still evolving. "Niche" > languages would be out of the question, as longevity could be > a problem. I think a number of people were duped by these presumptions into focusing on the longevity of the language. To me, having seen many good things come and go, I would not speculate on the longevity of anything that we could conclude might have permanence. Many languages have appeared to be "the answer for all time" only to fade into obscurity, not for lack of good qualities, but because of the money behind some other language's marketing department and the heat of passion for the new stuff in the buyer's pockets. But in the stated problem there are larger issues that have mostly gone by without discussion. Given the original problem statement, I would have to ask: - If the app is not "controlling the process itself", then what is it controlling? Given that the process varies per customer but the app does not control the process itself, then I'm going to hypothesize that the app controls information about the process, such as variations in a manufacturer's process "recipe". For example, the process produces a commodity such as gasoline, and different customers each purchase their own formulation. If the output is a custom formulation, then, after any number-crunching, the app could produce a very simple text document. Would such an application require the power of FORTRAN or C? If the I/O is mostly for data entry and display, then couldn't a raw Access databse suffice? At the very least, the data could be more easily forwarded to a newer environment than custom code. - Will the application run on a general-purpose computer or on a specific architecture? If general purpose, then survivabilty of the language (its development and operational environments) would be of primary concern. If on a specific architecture, it would make sense to write it in the machine language of that platform, provided it was fully documented with specs and functional comments. - Is the manufacturing process expected to persist without significant changes for the 30 years? If so, the app could be burned into a stable media (PROM, EEPROM, or the like). But if it would be subject to significant changes, perhaps better to maintain source and compiled versions. Having run a factory for 6 years, I understand the desire for a solution that can be created and left alone. But 20 other years in business and in systems, I know that things change, and often when least convenient and most costly to rectify. It is a good goal to want a system that will run unaltered and survive for 30 years. But will the business still be in business then? Or will the industry have changed, the need for the product in the marketplace have changed, the machinery or degree of meeting customer variation have all gone away? I think the solution to this problem does not lie in having "one right answer", but in having a data-forwarding strategy that is flexible, responsive, updatable, and maintainable. It would be better to change the app several times in the 30 years with reasonable costs than to bet on one solution that could be broken a few short years later. Just depends on what's at risk and how much of a gambler you are... So, I hope that's some food for thought... -John M. Montclair, NJ

20 years, 10 months

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Programmer Poll...

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

Fellow classic'ers, An idea just occurred to me, one that was inspired by a 'group buy' I did several years ago, on behalf of the ClassicCmp community, for Teledisk. Before I can even consider implementing it, though, I need to know how many of the group's members own one or more of the following Data I/O device programmers: UniSite or UniSite XPi, 2900, 3900, or 3980 XPi (in short, any one of the 'UniFamily' programmers). I see no need to clutter the list with responses. Please contact me off-list. If, for whatever reason, you try to reply and it bounces, try my backup address of kc7gr at qsl dot net. Thanks much. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech do/t c=o=m "If Salvador Dali had owned a computer, would it have been equipped with surreal ports?"

20 years, 10 months

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HP 9133

by Phil_Matthews＠DRSOptronics.com

Hi, I have been looking at your cctalk bulletin board and it appears that Frank McConnell is someone who knows a lot about old HP computers. I have been tasked to replace the HP 9133 computer on some of our test equipment with new PC's. I was hoping to contact somebody who might know if this is possible and how to do it. So I was wondering if you knew how I could contact Frank McConnell or somebody who might know. Sincerely Phil Matthews DRS Optronics Inc Electrical Engineer (321) 309-2124 phil_matthews at drsoptronics.com

20 years, 10 months

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tapetools and VMS Backup tapes

by ethan.dicks＠gmail.com

I slapped an AHA 1640 PCMCIA card in my Linux laptop, compiled tapetools 0.4 and 0.6 and started shoving tapes in my TSZ07. I wrote these tapes myself a number of years ago, and have finally gotten around to attempting to extract them. Things seemed to go fine, except that on certain tapes, I saw a page or two of partial records reported - i.e. - these VMS BACKUP tapes were written with a block size of 16384, and some tapes report ~2500 records of 16384 bytes (1600 bpi), and some report a few hundred records of 16384, then a few at a smaller number, then more at 16384, etc. I'd think there were some read problems, but the tape wasn't shoe-shining - it buzzed along at full tilt. Does anyone here have any experience with reading VMS BACKUP tapes with tapetools? Can you share your observations? I haven't yet tried reading the files - I know there were some VMS BACKUP extractors in C years ago, and I've even used them, but I'll probably have to re-find and rebuilt them. I could also fire up simh and VMS, but at the moment, my VMS install CDs are somewhere else. I'm really just after the data for now - it's all the stuff I worked on at Software Results years ago - all the COMBOARD software as well as a wad of personal files (one-off programs, stuff from newsgroups, etc.). I still have the Fuji Eagle that was spun down a few weeks after the backup was made, but I haven't attempted to power that up yet to see if it still works. Thanks for sharing any tapetools stories (and any suggestions about 'modern' VMS BACKUP extractors). -ethan

20 years, 10 months

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battery education sought

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I noticed my HP 262X terminals have a "Duracell TR133" battery in the back to maintain settings when powered off. The battery indicates "Mercury" on the side. Are mercury batteries rechargable? I would have thought they'd use a nicad or something to charge up while the unit was on. The TR133 battery also indicates "4.2V". It seems the Duracell replacement for this battery is Alkaline, and 4.5V. Should I use it? Jay

20 years, 10 months

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HP Journals ( 1979-1987) available

by ss＠allegro.com

Hi, A fellow programmer / collector recently passed away, and I'm helping his widow find homes for some of his hardware, software, manuals, etc. She just wrote to me: I have found another stack of HP Journals, not every month, from 1979-1987 and 1992. Are they keepers? IIRC, I've got a box of HP Journals from her already, that I was planning on taking to the Vintage Computer Festival (www.vintage.org). Anyone here interested in HP Journals should email me for discussions / offers. No, I do not have a list of issues available at this time. I hope to be reunited with the box (making its way from Phoenix) before VCF, but... thanks, Stan

20 years, 10 months

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Someone got their IBM 029 working

by vcf＠siconic.com

Cards punched to your specifications ;) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8709335588 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

20 years, 10 months

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DEC RA82 data recovery

by jdrcpeterson＠graceba.net

Anyone know of a source for data recovery from a DEC RA82 disk drive? Darren Peterson

20 years, 10 months

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Paging Cameron Kaiser

by vcf＠siconic.com

Sorry for the interruption to your normally scheduled off-topic messages. Cameron, I occasionally get the following error when attempting to e-mail you: ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- <spectre at floodgap.com> (reason: 553 5.3.5 system config error) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- 451 4.4.1 reply: read error from mail.floodgap.com. 553 5.3.5 mail.flactem.com. config error: mail loops back to me (MX problem?) 554 5.3.5 Local configuration error It's happened twice this morning, and once about a couple weeks ago. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

20 years, 10 months

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MDB MLSI-DB11 (DB11-H?)

by sandow＠proconsysint.com

Do you still have this board? I think the part number is MLSI-DR11BO Attached are a couple of pictures. Steve Andow Process Control Systems Int'l 11993 Ravenna Rd. Suite 5A Chardon, Ohio 44024 USA Phone: (440)286-4440 Fax: (440)286-8630 sandow at proconsysint.com

20 years, 10 months

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Compute magazine (retry)

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> Do the "professional scanners" here, like Al, have a recommendation for > resolving this? "Why should we pay you, when we get what you do for free?" - John Toole (CHM) It doesn't appear i'll be doing this "professionally" any time soon. -- To answer your question, I scan low contrast color text on a high resolution color scanner and try to maximize contrast before doing the thresholding to black and white. Graphic Converter on the Mac has a number of built-in filters that make it very easy to interactively do this. Once I have the values, I can batch convert the scans using the scripting in GC. There is probably something in the Linux or Windows world that is equivalent, though the tools I've tried there aren't nearly as easy to use as GC. The covers on the Oregon State timsharing system memos on bitsavers was a document that I had to fiddle with to get an acceptable scan. They are brown on dark orange paper, which came out totally black on the IS520 B&W scanner (which uses a green scanning lamp).

20 years, 10 months

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Releasing OS/2

by Richard.Cini＠wachovia.com

All: There was a discussion a while ago about IBM killing OS/2 and why shouldn't they release it under some sort of GNU-like license. Well, I think I confirmed an answer. There is an interview in the October 12th issue of PC Magazine between Mike Miller of PC Magazine and Bill Gates, celebrating the 20th Anniversary of Windows. The interview question is talking about the memory management of Windows compared to OS/2 and how Lee Reiswig (former IBM GM) was crashing Windows in OS/2 demonstrations in the early-'90s. Bill Gates continues, "It's all very ironic, because it's most of the OS/2 code is still our code and we're still selling LAN Manager. Whenever we'd go out and criticize OS/2, that group {within Microsoft} would say 'we just took more friendly fire.'" There's the answer as to why IBM cannot release OS/2. I know we alluded to this fact in the original thread but this is the most positive confirmation I've seen. Rich

20 years, 10 months

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IBM System/34 with diskettes & documentation available in Iowa

by brother_cadfael＠sbcglobal.net

Lets see... The wall calendar has May 31st as being Tuesday, possible years 1982, 1993, 1999 & 2004 Did 'Express Mail' exist/have that logo in '82? Brian >> Does it come with the broad? >> >> Also, I like the period appropriate fake wood paneling :) > I> suspect the picture itself is period, meaning that broad is now, what, 50? > >Gil

20 years, 10 months

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Kaypro boot disk.

by fire＠dls.net

A colleague of mine is looking for a boot disk for a Kaypro 4 '84. He says : "I have a Kaypro 4 (83), Kaypro 4(84), and a Kaypro 10. The boot disks for all three are mutually incompatible. What I still need is a boot disk for Kaypro 4(84)." (These are 5.25 inch floppies, of course. An actual disk would be great, but he says that if somebody wanted to send a disk image, he could work with that, as long as he knew what program was used to create it.) Can anyone email me images of all boot disks or direct me to appropriate web site? I will reimburse postage/disk costs if someone wishes to send physical disks instead of emailing images. Braldey Slavik

20 years, 10 months

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Releasing OS/2

by gstreet＠indy.net

> > >Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2005 18:18:11 +0100 >From: Bert Thomas <bert at brothom.nl> >Subject: Re: Releasing OS/2 > > >Cini, Richard wrote: >> >> Bill Gates continues, "It's all very ironic, because it's most >> of the OS/2 code is still our code and we're still selling LAN Manager. >> Whenever we'd go out and criticize OS/2, that group {within Microsoft} would >> say 'we just took more friendly fire.'" >> >> There's the answer as to why IBM cannot release OS/2. I know we >> alluded to this fact in the original thread but this is the most positive >> confirmation I've seen. > >I disaggree on the argument. M$ contributed no 32-bit code to OS/2 as >far as I can tell. IMO it is the 32-bit code that made OS/2 superior to >Windows. BTW, OS/2 has some features that are not available on any other >OS, such as the immense flexibility of running DOS programs. One can >even write special device drivers that emulate a device in a virtual DOS >machine. There are many settings available for VDMs and features like >detecting polling loops to prevent waisting time I have never seen before. > >Check out "The design of OS/2" > >Bert > > Hi Rich and Bert, Rich, thank you for the reference to the 20-year anniv. issue of PC Mag, but regarding Gates: Gates is so slippery that I have to take much of what he says with multiple grains of salt. In several (perhaps many?) respects he's a classic sociopath. He all-to-often takes credit where none is due. He doesn't speak or write well, and if so many didn't believe that he was some sort of "genius," there would be little reason to listen to what he has to say. I mean, this is the guy who initially dismissed the www for probably 2 years. What a knucklehead he can be... He may also be the asshole who started the "Gary went flying" rumor/classic piece of disinformation (and if it was not him, he was "in on it," and he actively promoted it). Regards, Bob Greenstreet

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for RL02 cable and terminator

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

I did find the tech manuals (from classiccmp's mirror of bitsavers). Tony, IIRC it says the early drives *did not* have brushes and later model ones were equipped with them? Incidentally this drive started life as an RL01 but also has a DEC sticker "changed to RL02 by PCO" just to further confuse things. Do you still recommend I not install them? I think that airflow and centrifugal force might be the only safe way to remove particles rather than "grinding" them across the disk platter surface with a brush, no matter how lightly... I think there may also be a "Fault" if the brushes are not parked? Ethan, thanks for the suggestion about using a 40 pin double-ended-Berg cable from inside the drive. I haven't taken the electronics cover off yet. I only have one 8/A and one RL02 so once mounted in the rack cabinet they'll stay there, connected to each other. The 40-pin cable will be, of course, trivial to make IF the pinouts are the same on both ends. Unless someone has the correct RL8A-to-RL02 cable, and a terminator, they would like to sell me? thanks -Charles

20 years, 10 months

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(no subject)

by hardware＠ees1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu

Dear Community, Does anybody know anything about this Teletype machine: http://ees2cy.engr.ccny.cuny.edu/wwwa/web/hardware/tty/ I can't even figure out what model it is. thanks, -kurt

20 years, 10 months

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Toshiba T100 & T300 Manuals

by dm561＠torfree.net

Cleaning out the library; before they go into the dumpster, anybody need/want some manuals for the Toshiba T100 & T300? T100 Personal Computer Owner's Manual T100 Personal Computer Programmer's Reference manual (CP/M & T-Basic) T300 Personal Computer Owner's Manual (incl. Diagnostics disk) T300 MS-DOS Reference Manual T300 T-Basic16 Reference Manual 5 1/2 x 8 1/2, in 3 ring binders. Reply off-list pls, mike (Toronto)

20 years, 10 months

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Need help with a BA11-K power supply

by fireflyst＠earthlink.net

Well, I decided to take another crack at getting my 11/34 system working again. Currently I've still got some problems with it - firstly though, the power supply. It blew when I hooked one of the front panel switches up to it, though nothing seemed to be wrong as far as what I could tell from all the diagrams. Right now the disassembled BA11-K box is sitting in my living room taking up space. Now, when the PSU blew, I was able to notice that the spark came >from what LOOKED like the portion that the power cord comes from.I looked at the traces under a magnifying glass, and couldn't see anything wrong, and I can't smell anything. I checked all the fuses, those seem to be sound. In any case, when hooked up to nothing, the fans don't even kick on. Can anyone give me a test process I can go through to diagnose the problem, or would anyone here be willing to look at the power supply for me if I shipped it to them? As it is, I have this dead machine doing nothing and my girlfriend keeps pestering me about it every time she comes over because it doesn't work. In any case, I'd appreciate any help that could be given to me! Thanks! Julian

20 years, 10 months

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OFHC Copper, was Re: Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by marvin＠rain.org

Pet peeve ... what does OFHC copper have to do with was the subject line????????????? ISTR that OFHC copper had some benefits for certain copper plating baths that resulted in better ductility with the plated copper. A quick google search indicated that OFHC copper has slightly better purity than standard copper (99.00% vs 99.95%.)

20 years, 10 months

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WTB: Telebit trailblazers

by drb＠msu.edu

Anyone have a pair of Telebit Trailblazer modems they'd be willing to part with? Looking to re-create the old PEP over old tin-cans and string demo for a presentation. T2SAA (TB+) units seem to be fairly common, but I can't find anyone advertising the original model. De

20 years, 10 months

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Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1" > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:20:31 -0700 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >On 10/17/2005 at 1:06 PM Roger Merchberger wrote: > >>OMFG! Freezing CD's makes 'em sound better?!?!? And what the heck is >>Cream-Electret -- nevermind - I don't wanna know after all. <:-O > >Roger, brass musicians of the same mindset have been paying big money for >years to have someone dunk their instrument in a dewar of liquid nitrogen, >waxing euphoric about the way the instrument response changes. Of course, >there's no real basis in science and most of the victims overlook the >"prep" work that's part of the package and really makes the big difference. Actually hardening and annealing with extreme cold or heat has a measurable effect on metals. There is _some_ rational basis there. However.. local temerature changes (environment) affect the metals used to a greater extent through expansion and contraction. FYI: it was tested by dupont years ago that nylon (as in pantyhose) treated with a LN2 dunk had a better wear characteristic. No memory of why that was found to work. >Mark my words--the audiophile fringe will be dunking CD's in liquid N2 any >day now... Did it, they smash far better, louder too! (Those pesky AOL CDs). Can't say that they play better though. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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PDP-11 Message Board

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

Hey everyone, I thought I'd spam the lists again with a link to my PDP-11 board which hasn't had much traffic as of late, in case any of you DECies didn't know about it. http://pdpusers.dyndns.org <http://pdpusers.dyndns.org/> Always, if you have any suggestions, feel free to email me or drop me a personal message on the board. Thanks! Julian

20 years, 10 months

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PDP-11 Message Board

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

Hey everyone, I thought I'd spam the lists again with a link to my PDP-11 board which hasn't had much traffic as of late, in case any of you DECies didn't know about it. http://pdpusers.dyndns.org <http://pdpusers.dyndns.org/> Always, if you have any suggestions, feel free to email me or drop me a personal message on the board. Thanks! Julian

20 years, 10 months

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Public Service Announcement

by brother_cadfael＠sbcglobal.net

Thank you William, Sorry Jay! Brian Hanson <snip> Sorry about the plug, Jay, but he asked! William Donzelli <snip> "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." Theodore Roosevelt (1858 - 1919)

20 years, 10 months

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cctalk Digest, Vol 26, Issue 51

by ken＠seefried.com

From: Roger Merchberger <zmerch at 30below.com> > Allowing the object to return to room temperature very, very > slowly is important. You should perceive an improvement in the sound when > you listen to the object which has been through the freezing process.... Ah...note the crux of the delusion. Anyone who "doesn't perceive an improvement" just didn't let it warm up slowly enough. Thusly, the scam is impervious to outside criticism. Ken

20 years, 10 months

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STDBUS Manuals - 7303 kb/display

by fjahlin＠en.com

Sorry to bother you Everett. I saw you message on-line re: the manual for the Pro Log 7303 Keyboard/Display card. I too have been looking for this document. If you would, please let me know if I can still get a copy from you. Thanks, Frank Ahlin

20 years, 10 months

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Logic Analyzer Recommendations

by Pat_Fitzpatrick＠pmc-sierra.com

Hi All, My current logic analyzers (an HP 64000 system and a Dolch LAM4850) have been forced into early retirement and I'm looking for a replacement. I need around 100 channels, not terribly fast (100-250 MHz -- faster is ok too, obviously) and it might be handy to have the ability to plug in a scope card and/or a pattern generator. I've used the HP 16500 quite a bit (in a past life) but I have not had much experience with other machines (Tektronix TLA7xx, HP 167x etc). There seems to be a lot of 16500 mainframes and cards available -- but they are getting old and they are pretty BIG. OK, so an HP 64000 ain't exactly petite either so maybe size doesn't matter THAT much... Anyhow, I'm looking for recommendations. Something that will give a few years of service, and cost less than $4000 (or thereabouts). I have to keep these poor old computers running somehow -- plus a few new developments from time to time. Advice would be appreciated, Pat

20 years, 10 months

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Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1" > From: Fred Cisin <cisin at xenosoft.com> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0700 (PDT) > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On Mon, 17 Oct 2005, Allison wrote: >> FYI: it was tested by dupont years ago that nylon (as in pantyhose) treated >> with a LN2 dunk had a better wear characteristic. No memory of why that was >> found to work. > >YIKES! >Did they consider the issue of how uncomfortable it must be to wear them >that cold?? They get warmed of course.. Then again I would how those guys understood all this. Hummmm. ;) >> Did it, they smash far better, louder too! (Those pesky AOL CDs). >> Can't say that they play better though. > >I made a handle, and tried using them as pizza cutters. No good. >There is NO known use for them! Actually I found Four uses for them. One of the older versions had some bits of software that was useful outside the AOL framwork. Handy to keep around for regressive uses. Makes a nice disk for an aneometer (wind speed) when combined with those plastic eggs. Made a useful stator and rotor for experiments in power generation using wind. Inexpensive substitute for clay targets in skeet shooting. Love the sound of a 12ga. ;) Allison

20 years, 10 months

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Cromemco C-10 Manuals

by dm561＠torfree.net

Cleaning out the library; before they go into the dumpster, anybody need/want some manuals for the Cromemco C-10 desktop computer? C-10 Personal Computer User's Manual Structured Basic Language Reference Manual WriteMaster Word processing Systems PlanMaster Financial Planning Package Reply off-list pls, mike (Toronto)

20 years, 10 months

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Need a driver: Intel PCMCIA Flash card

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

Fellow classic'ers, I've been all over Intel's site and Google, and have come up empty. I have here a 4MB PCMCIA 'FLASH' card with Intel's name and colors on it. I know it has a standard MS-DOS filesystem on it, and I'm trying to find a driver to read the thing under Windows 2000 Pro. I'll resort to FreeBSD if I have to, but I would prefer otherwise. I've tried the current version of SystemSoft's CardWizard Pro with no luck. Ideas? Declarations? Speeches about how looney the whole idea is? Thanks much. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech do/t c=o=m "If Salvador Dali had owned a computer, would it have been equipped with surreal ports?"

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for a IBM 5110 EMI filter.

by h.j.stegeman＠hccnet.nl

Hi William, >> Who can help me with an EMI filter from an IBM 5110 ? >> Mine has an internal non-repairable short circuit. > Is it the same as the one on the 5100? Yes, see: http://home.hccnet.nl/h.j.stegeman/EMIfilter.jpg > Sadly, I finally junked my stock of EMI filters, simply because in six > years, I did not sell a SINGLE ONE! Normally these robust discrete filters give never a problem, except mine :-( Regards Henk

20 years, 10 months

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Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1"

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Public Service Announcement: AVOID "bobsbid1" > From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:08:59 -0700 > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > > >4 feet of 10 AWG oxygen free copper wire connecting to 14 AWG house wiring >back to the distrubution panel. Why not some 1/2" gold-plated copper >tubing in a fused quartz box filled with argon for the absolutely best AC >sound? Wonder if folks know how noisy the average AC mains supply is? Anyone care to hazard what Oxygen Free Copper Wire is? "It's copper free of the cupric oxide dipole pairs that can cause unwanted rectification and attended mixing of signals resulting in added intermodulation distortion." B#))$^!t (a form of bovine excrement). We did this as a result of the above quote from "The Audio Expert". I did not doubt that said expert was just repeating what he's heard with zero understanding. I actually managed to get a piece of the stuff from the resident audiophile. My boss heard that and as a result of his engineering expertize in materials and my major eye roll and grimace we sent it off with some similar copper wire of the same guage from a local source to a materials lab for analysis. Since the company was in the business or using wire of all types as part of the product there was significant expertize available to analyse the result. Findings were the generic #6 and the OFCW got mixed up that the assay of both looked the same. Not similar, the same as nothing to distinguaish any difference. One came from local hardware store. Owing to the price difference we laughed very hard at the so called audiophilic inane beliefs. Quality copper wire is nominally oxygen free or it would show a distinct resistance variation from standard. Another easy test is to take a known length, measure the resistance at a easily calibrated standard temperature (ice water). Then raise the temperature (boiling water) to a new known point and remeasure with accurate milliohmmeter. Calculate the alpha (rate of change in resistance over temperature) pure copper has a known alpha and they will be the same to meaurement limits. If they differ it's due to impurity in the copper, plating if any (silver is commonly used for TFE coated wires, Nickel is common too) or it's not plain copper (copper clad steel). It's not rocket science. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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Orbis

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

ROBO5.8 wrote: Hi Thom, I don't know where you can find Orbis drives. But if they are the original style single sided drives then you can also look for Remex 8" drives. Remex manufactured paper tape readers and punches and then branched out into Floppy drives. They purchased units from Orbis and relabled them at the time. ROBO Remex also made a series of drives using a plastic base casting. It was a legendary cost reduction and ensured that nobody else would make that same mistake again. The casting would shift enough in normal use to give constant read and write errors. It was a loser then and I doubt it has improved. In my opinion, using Remex with valuble data is where you want to stop being "original or authentic" in your restoration. Install another vendor or don't use Remex for real data. You can use it to make the disk go around, but even just spinning the disk made wierd schreeching noises. In all my testing, I never found one that could read its own written disks more than a few days. It was one of the worst drives ever made and deservedly died an early death. Billy

20 years, 10 months

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DEC RX180 dual floppy?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: DEC RX180 dual floppy? > From: Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia at gmail.com> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 23:58:16 +0800 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >On 10/17/05, Allison <ajp166 at bellatlantic.net> wrote: >> RX180 is for the DEC Robin AKA Vt180 CP/M system (looks like a VT100). >> >> The drives however are generic SA400L or TM100 40 track single sided. >> There is no internal controller, has a nice power supply however. > >Could I connect it to other systems than the Robin? >If so which controller? There is nothing special about the RX180. It's only a DEC styled box with a power supply and two drives. Yes, any system. Any controller. The drives are generic 40tr 5.25" single sided and work ad single, double density as well as hard sector. I've used them with Robin, NorthStar*, TRS80, AmproLB, homebrew (765based) and PCs. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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DEC RX180 dual floppy?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: DEC RX180 dual floppy? > From: Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia at gmail.com> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 22:00:07 +0800 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Hello, >Was wondering which systems can you hook up a RX180 dual floppy unit with? >Which controllers can you match it up with? RX180 is for the DEC Robin AKA Vt180 CP/M system (looks like a VT100). The drives however are generic SA400L or TM100 40 track single sided. There is no internal controller, has a nice power supply however. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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DEC RX180 dual floppy?

by waisun.chia＠gmail.com

Hello, Was wondering which systems can you hook up a RX180 dual floppy unit with? Which controllers can you match it up with?

20 years, 10 months

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Need Silent 700 schematic

by CPUMECH＠aol.com

What specific model do you have? TI has many models of silent 700 series. The silent series is because it uses a thermal printhead.

20 years, 10 months

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Utterly OT: mobile FTP to Yahoo web hosting

by news＠computercollector.com

Since this is so off-topic, please send replies to me only, NOT to the whole list. The problem: I've got a program called VFS-FTP on my Treo 650 (PalmOS 5.x) smartphone. I know it works because I connected to various FTP servers and successfully download and uploaded files. When I try connecting to my web hoster (Yahoo Small Business), I get an error message saying "server did not respond in time" -- this is before the login stage, I think. As you can guess, Yahoo's tech support was a waste of my time. All they said is "our server works" and that they have no higher-tier support for FTP. Bastards. I made sure the FTP client is in "passive" mode and I set the time-out for a very high amount, 120 seconds, although I don't think that is part of the problem. Any suggestions please? Or can anyone suggest a more powerful FTP client for PalmOS? (There aren't any additional config options to pick in this one.) I really need to get mobile FTP working; this isn't just an experiment. Thanks in advance, Evan ----------------------------------------- Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/

20 years, 10 months

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FW: LARGEST COMPUTER COLLECTION IN THE WORLD (?) FOR SALE

by Rinaldo.Eversdijk＠stork.com

Hoi Nico, Ik zit nu al een poosje via het forum aangesloten op alle gerelateerde mail, maar weet niet meer hoe en waar ik mezelf kan uitloggen om van deze mail replies af te komen! Weet jij misschien hoe dit moet, ik krijg nu elke dag meer dan 100 mails waar ik niks meer mee doe! M.vr.gr. Rinaldo -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Nico de Jong Sent: zaterdag 15 oktober 2005 10:18 To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: FW: LARGEST COMPUTER COLLECTION IN THE WORLD (?) FOR SALE Fra: "Nico de Jong" <nico at farumdata.dk> > > Hallo Jos > > Wat is de volle naam van die newsgroup? Ik kan 'm bij mijn provider niet > onmiddellijk vinden > > Nico > Begging your pardon. This should have been off-list -------------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCLAIMER: This e-mail and any attachment(s) sent with it are intended exclusively for the addressee(s), and may not be used by, opened by, passed on to, or made available for use to, any person other than the addressee(s). Stork rules out any and all liabilities resulting from any electronic transmission.

20 years, 10 months

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Unisys, shame on you

by aw288＠osfn.org

While surfing the Unisys websight, I found nearly NO mention of either Burroughs or Univac. One more reason to like IBM. William Donzelli aw288 at osfn.org

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for ancient FreeBSD

by msokolov＠ivan.Harhan.ORG

Hello fellow ClassicCmp'ers, This is almost Classic - I'm looking for a place to download an old version of FreeBSD, specifically the last release of the 2.2.x branch, which I think was 2.2.8. However, it seems to have totally vanished off the net, including of course ftp.FreeBSD.ORG, apparently removed by the dark forces of the evil reptilian conspiracy who want to force everyone to run the modern crap. Has anyone saved a copy of the FreeBSD 2.2.8 distribution or some nearby version? TIA, MS

20 years, 10 months

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OT: Language for the ages

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: OT: Language for the ages > From: Jules Richardson <julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk> > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 02:19:29 +0100 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >>>>Ruled out. >>>> >>>>Gil >>> >>>I missed the OP doing that - what was the reason? >> >> >> Proprietary to a single vendor. I'd agree. I off in its place MACROASSEMBLER, which is fairly old, very flexible and portable. That and a good macro library you too can have something looking almost like C or pseudocode if thats your wish. The only problem is I doubt there many that still know it or use it. I think them small chips that run chevy fuel injection are programmed in C++ crosscompiled, or so they would have us believe. ;) Allison

20 years, 10 months

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Need Silent 700 schematic

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

My Silent 700 has decided to stop working. Some of the time. It won't print anything although it will move the printhead for CR, LF (but not space or any other printing character) and will sound the beeper from Ctrl-G (BEL). The keyboard is outputting all characters properly. I took it apart (easy since almost everything snaps in place), checked the power supply voltages which all seem reasonable, noticed it was working, put the case back on, now it's broke again. Aargh. Must be a cold solder joint somewhere but there's LOTS of parts inside that small case including an 8080 CPU. I removed the three socketed chips and reinserted. Then I incautiously got a finger on either 120VAC or rectified 150 VDC, in an area I was not expecting "hot" voltages. =8^0 At that point I decided not to play with it any more, at least without a schematic. Anyone got one, or a service manual? I can't locate anything online from Googling. thanks Charles

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for RL02 cable and terminator

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

... like the subject line says. Now that my 8/A is up and running it's time to hook up the RL02. I do have the interface board plugged into the Omnibus, the correct boot ROMs on the option board, and the RL02 has the Unit "0" plug but no cable or terminator. I could make my own if someone can tell me where to get the connectors that fit the drive end. Also, I think someone cannibalized the disk brush out of mine :( There is a big open area towards the right rear of the disk compartment and a pin with a snapring groove protruding downwards, but nothing in the empty hole there except two silver-colored tubes down below (air ducts?)... seemed pretty clean inside, as it should. So I left the heads parked (blocked by the transport plate), inserted the disk pack and ran the blower for a while anyway. Fault light was on, load light was not. I didn't hook it up to the interface board (obviously :) but not being well-acquainted with these drives I don't know if it *has* to be connected before the fault light goes off, or the heads free to load, or both... I do have a copy of the "RL01/02 Disk Subsystem User's Manual" but the service manual and parts list looks essential at this point. Hope it's on bitsavers ;) Thanks for any help. -Charles

20 years, 10 months

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battery education sought

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: battery education sought > From: "Jay West" <jwest at classiccmp.org> > Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 13:30:35 -0500 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >I noticed my HP 262X terminals have a "Duracell TR133" battery in the back >to maintain settings when powered off. The battery indicates "Mercury" on >the side. Extinct due to envromental concerns. Common use these days are the 3V lithium coin cells for the same uses. >Are mercury batteries rechargable? I would have thought they'd use a nicad >or something to charge up while the unit was on. Do not attempt to charge. Bad things can happen. Mercury batteries were used for many reasons, high energy density, extremely long shelf life at near zero power consumption and very stable voltage over life. Lithium cells have replaced them in most apps where battey drain is low and extremely long stable life is desired. >The TR133 battery also indicates "4.2V". It seems the Duracell replacement >for this battery is Alkaline, and 4.5V. Should I use it? > >Jay I'd expect that would work just fine. If your really uncertain add a shotkey rectifer in series (Vf about .3V). My bet is the logic they keep alive is a CMOS RAM and in operation that device Vcc is 5V. Allison

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for RL02 cable and terminator

by tradde＠excite.com

I think I have a few of the RL02 cables that have the funny ends. But I only have one of the ribbon cable that goes from the inerface card with a berg connector to the bulk head. I am sure I could scrounge one of those spares if you don't get one elsewhere. I only have one good working RL02 drive, but many parts drives. --- On Sun 10/16, Curt @ Atari Museum < curt at atarimuseum.com > wrote: From: Curt @ Atari Museum [mailto: curt at atarimuseum.com] To: General at smtp3.suscom.net, Discussion at smtp3.suscom.net(a)excite.com, UNEXPECTED_DATA_AFTER_ADDRESS at .SYNTAX-ERROR. Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 16:17:37 -0400 Subject: Re: Looking for RL02 cable and terminator I have a half dozen terminators if you need one, I don't have any spare cables though. Curt Charles wrote: >... like the subject line says. > >Now that my 8/A is up and running it's time to hook up the RL02. I >do have the interface board plugged into the Omnibus, the correct >boot ROMs on the option board, and the RL02 has the Unit "0" plug >but no cable or terminator. I could make my own if someone can >tell me where to get the connectors that fit the drive end. > >Also, I think someone cannibalized the disk brush out of mine :( >There is a big open area towards the right rear of the disk >compartment and a pin with a snapring groove protruding downwards, >but nothing in the empty hole there except two silver-colored >tubes down below (air ducts?)... seemed pretty clean inside, as it >should. > >So I left the heads parked (blocked by the transport plate), >inserted the disk pack and ran the blower for a while anyway. >Fault light was on, load light was not. I didn't hook it up to the >interface board (obviously :) but not being well-acquainted with >these drives I don't know if it *has* to be connected before the >fault light goes off, or the heads free to load, or both... > >I do have a copy of the "RL01/02 Disk Subsystem User's Manual" but >the service manual and parts list looks essential at this point. >Hope it's on bitsavers ;) > >Thanks for any help. >-Charles > > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.12.1/136 - Release Date: 10/15/2005 _______________________________________________ Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web!

20 years, 10 months

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HP 9133XV jumper query

by vp＠cs.drexel.edu

"John S" <john_a_s2004 at hotmail.com> wrote: > J?rgen Keller recently cracked how to access his 9133XV combined hard drive > and floppy drive unit from his HP-85 - see full article here: > http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/articles.cgi?read=562 > > I would like to check with other 9133XV owners if their drives also had the > same A/B/C jumper, I suspect this was only present on certain revisions of > the drive. Actually all 9133V and 9133XV should have the same controller (09133-69508) at least that's what the book says: http://bitsavers.org/pdf/hp/disc/09134-90032-Aug-1983.pdf page III-1-2 (9133V/XV & 9134XV Theory of Operation). Regarding the jumper settings for selecting between 4 volume (HP-85 compatible) vs 1 volume configurations, Section II of the manual which refers to the 9133A/B, 9134A/B and the 9135 drives, shows the J6 jumper settings on page II-1-9 [1], while Section III has a table on page III-1-1. BTW this manual provides a wealth of information about all the Amigo compatible members of the 913X family. It is beautifully scanned in B&W (pictures in greyscale) and produces high-quality printed output. If you have an early version 913X, this manual is a must-have. **vp [1] early versions of the 9133A, 9134A and 9135A drives used a different controller which does not appear to be configurable (see page II-1-2).

20 years, 10 months

1
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Looking for RL02 cable and terminator

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Oct 15 2005, 22:47, Charles wrote: > but no cable or terminator. I could make my own if someone can > tell me where to get the connectors that fit the drive end. RL01 and RL02 cables have those funny connectors at both ends. It sounds like you haven't got the ribbon cable for the interface end either; that would be a short 40-way ribbon with a Berg connector on each end with one of the opposite-gender funny RL0x connectors plugged into one of the Bergs. I've never seen those connectors elsewhere, but on the inside of the drive, they're 40-pin headers like a Berg connector, so you could, as a last resort, use something else to get you going. > Also, I think someone cannibalized the disk brush out of mine :( No, only early RL01s had brushes. There's a field change order to remove them, and AFAIR RL02s never had brushes at all. > Fault light was on, load light was not. I didn't hook it up to the > interface board (obviously :) but not being well-acquainted with > these drives I don't know if it *has* to be connected before the > fault light goes off, or the heads free to load, or both... It has to be connected and terminated before the fault light will go off. > I do have a copy of the "RL01/02 Disk Subsystem User's Manual" but > the service manual and parts list looks essential at this point. > Hope it's on bitsavers ;) Look for the Pocket Service Guide -- that will give you what you need. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

20 years, 10 months

5
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IRIS failure point-beware paper caps!

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

I took the IRIS over to Ray's to see if we could get it working and pull anything of interest off the drives, and the power supply died. If you have one of the Motorola IRISes be sure that you check out two paper caps (C7 is one of them) on the 5v rail board (on the fan side of the P/S). Had a failure in one or both that caused a (hypothesized) spike to the rectifier bridge and smoked a MOV/resistor link to ground. Fortunately there doesn't seem to be any logic damage, but watch out if you've got one of these! Later research with an electronics book revealed that paper & electrolytic are the most failure-prone of the capacitors. I'm going to replace with mylar (I know they're not original, Tony, but it's a terrible job to get that P/S out, and I don't want anything to die the next time). Scott Quinn

20 years, 10 months

1
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Cromemco SCC Eproms/images needed

by RCamarda＠aol.com

Hi Joe, I was wondering if you ever found the MCB-216 roms, or source code for the Cromemco SCC board. I am also looking for them. Let me know if you can help. Thanks! Rich

20 years, 10 months

1
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HP 7970 power supplies available

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Not sure if I posted these before or not, sorry if it's a repeat. I have a fair number of HP 7970E and 7970B power supplies available (about 10 or 15). I keep meaning to take them to the dump but just haven't made it yet. If anyone wants one (or two or three) let me know ASAP. Jay West

20 years, 10 months

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Looking for RL02 cable and terminator

by pete＠dunnington.plus.com

On Oct 17 2005, 0:39, Ethan Dicks wrote: > On 10/16/05, Pete Turnbull <pete at dunnington.plus.com> wrote: > > RL01 and RL02 cables have those funny connectors at both ends. > > Drive-to-drive cables certainly all do, and _most_ interface-to-drive > cables do, but some do not. > > In particular, I have seen a 40-pin-Berg-to-RL-drive cable (no ribbon > cable whatsoever) > in two situations; with an RLV12 in a MicroVAX-II, and my own RL8A. The RLV12 comes with a cabinet kit as I described. Sounds like yours is unusual. I suppose it's possible, even likely, that DEC didn't do that for the RL8A, but they certainly made cabinet kits consisting of a short ribbon cable with a Berg connector and transition connector on a plate for RL11, RLV11, and RLV12. > > It sounds like you haven't got the ribbon cable for the interface end > > either; that would be a short 40-way ribbon with a Berg connector on > > each end with one of the opposite-gender funny RL0x connectors plugged > > into one of the Bergs. > > The rig I think you are describing was typical of the RL11, for example, with > a 40-pin ribbon cable to a black connector mounted in a mountable metal frame > that accepted a drive-to-drive cable. Yes, but also for RLV11 and RLV12. I've never seen one without that. > That black transition connector, BTW, is > identical to the transition connectors on the back of the disk drive > units. Worst > case, you can steal/borrow one from a scrap drive. Indeed. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

20 years, 10 months

2
1
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Friden EC-130 calculator schematics?

by brian＠quarterbyte.com

Hi This is a bit off-topic, since the device isn't programmable, but... does anyone have a set of schematics and/or a service manual for the Friden EC-130 electronic calulator? Google isn't coming up with anything but others' requests for the same. Thanks Brian

20 years, 10 months

6
7
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Compute magazine

by holger.veit＠ais.fraunhofer.de

Hi, for quite some time I have some magazines of COMPUTE ("Club Of Microprocessor Programmers, Users and Technical Experts"), a gazette sponsored by National Semiconductor, lying around which I consider worthwhile to be conserved for the past. The date I am talking about is around 1975..1977. Some questions: 1. I have only some issues, namely V2N7...V2N12, V3N4...V3N7. Does anyone have other issues (and is willing to scan or copy those)? I'd be very interested in this epoch. 2. Scanning: You find a sample issue at http://www.ais.fraunhofer.de/~veit/v2n7.pdf (2MB). This was scanned B&W 400dpi, stored as TIF and converted with Acrobat. My problem is that even with this some listing pages are barely readable, see page 3 for example. This is probably because of lack of contrast; the magazine is printed on light brown paper with dark brown text. If one scans in color with 600dpi (as in sample http://www.ais.fraunhofer.de/~veit/3x.pdf, 2MB) this will result in much larger files - the raw TIF is 95MB on my disk, which is not a diskspace issue for me, but for downloaders; expect a single issue to be 40MB and more in size. Do the "professional scanners" here, like Al, have a recommendation for resolving this? Regards Holger

20 years, 10 months

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