I'm a bit surprised that there hasn't been more discussion about S-100
machines. In particular I would point out the Morrow Decision 1. It's
DJ-DMA floppy controller could handle 8" SSSD thru DSDD, and both
soft-sectored and hard-sectored (NorthStar) 5.25" formats and a separate
hard drive controller was also available of course. Later variations even
had a switching power supply.
Not strictly a CP/M machine (though probably 90+% used CP/M or variation
thereof) and CP/M came standard with the machine. Morrow even provided a
UNIX-like OS, the name of which escapes me at the moment (Micronix maybe?).
With the addition of an 8086 S-100 board it would certainly run a plain
vanilla CP/M-86 system.
Other S-100 systems like CompuPro and Cromemco and even NorthStar were all
versatile and well-built CP/M machines which could aspire to be called 'the
best CP/M machine ever.' In general I would even proclaim the category of
S-100 micros as the holder of that title.
Bob Stek
Saver of Lost Sols
> Personally, I'm partial to the Amstrad PCW line.While it was marketed
> as a dedicated word processor in much of the world, it had gobs of RAM
> (at least 256KB), high-resolution monochrome graphics (720x256) and
> shipped with a very nice CP/M Plus implementation which included a
> better-than-average BASIC as well as DRI LOGO and the GSX graphics
> libraries. The non-standard 3 inch floppies are a bit of a drag, but
> it was fairly easy to add 3.5 inch drives and even hard drives were
> available.
Second-generation PCWs corrected that; they had 3.5" drives. And later
iterations of the BIOS supported loadable device drivers, with all sorts of
possibilities for mischief.
--
John Elliott
I haven't yet tried it but at tapeheads.net you can learn about the use of
a 50-50 mixture of Nu-Finish car polish and naptha as a treatment for
flaking/shedding reel-to-reel tape. (Honest)
>
>
>[Snip]
>Sorry if it was offensive!
>And thanks in advance for your attention.
>
And as some of you have stated, the market these days is MUCH
more difficult than it was a few years ago.
I have been waiting to observe if anyone else mentioned the
following two points:
When you consider that probably every other response has used
more bytes than the original request (including this one - and there
have been at least 20), it certainly seems reasonable to have sent
the request.
In addition, no links were activated when the body of the e-mail
was displayed. On the rare occasions I receive spam these
days, most of the time a link attempts to activate itself - which
is almost always impossible since I try to remember to disconnect
the cable to the router before I start to read any e-mail. If such
a link had been included, that would have been unacceptable!!!!!
Jerome Fine
Has anyone had any success at all recently in recovering data from
Wabash-branded floppies?
I haven't. The binder on these things has gone to Hades and the
oxide will flake off if you so much as touch it with a drive.
Yesterday, I thought I'd try again after swearing off of the things,
as the disks in question were 10-sector rather than soft-sector. I
wondered if 10-sector being rarer than the soft-sector variety might
not be different.
No soap. That grinding sound, accompanied by dirty heads tells me
that *no* Wabash disk is worth touching.
Anyone got any secrets for these?
Cheers,
--Chuck
Hi Rich! Thanks! I really appreciate the support! Here is a little
background information in case anyone was wondering about building your own
home brew CP/M computer.
At the N8VEM home brew computer project there are several boards to assemble
your own home brew CP/M computer.
The original is the SBC V2 which is a Z80 based Eurocard system. It can be
stand alone or act as an ECB bus controller for IO expansion.
Next is the Zeta which is an SBC without bus expansion but several built in
peripherals such as a floppy drive controller, IDE, serial, RTC, etc.
Finally there is the N8 which is a Z8S180 based all-in-one computer with
complete IO suite (FDC, IDE, serial, parallel, video, audio, etc). It is a
bit like the P112 with built in video, sound, and some other peripherals
along with hobbyist friendly components.
All of the N8VEM CP/M computers share a common ROM BIOS (RomWBW) or you can
use your own or someone else's custom BIOS (MSX CBIOS).
What is really neat is a sizable robust community has grown up around the
N8VEM computers and builders are even making their own systems (like the
Zeta) for the group. We don't always agree on things but manage to get
along pretty well. There are many points of view and not everyone sees
things the same way. That's OK -- its healthy.
There is also a fairly complete suite (25+ types) of S-100 boards with
backplanes, serial IO, drive controllers, video controllers, RAM boards, CPU
boards, etc. Really too many to mention here.
All the hardware and software design information is free (as in speech and
beer) and publicly posted.
There is a mailing list and wiki available for information and support if
you want it. You are free to use what's there even if you never participate
in the N8VEM home brew computer project. Several other projects have
branched off N8VEM and are now making their own CP/M computers, S-100
boards, etc.
http://groups.google.com/group/n8vemhttp://n8vem-sbc.pbworks.com
Most boards have parts lists in addition to full schematic and PCB layout.
Complete KiCAD EDA files with custom libraries are included as well as full
source code listings, tools, etc.
I try to emphasize the use of free/open source tool sets so literally
*anyone* can build their own systems including making their own home made
PCBs. The PCBs are available through group buys which is a sort of informal
process. I try to keep the cost as low as possible and it more or less
works.
Active community participation is encouraged and expected but not required
since everyone is a *builder*. There are no bosses, management, users,
stockholders, clients, or customers!
So if you have the inclination or ever desired to build your own home brew
computer this is your chance. It is pretty easy to do and a lot of fun!
Please consider this your personal invitation to come to the N8VEM home brew
computer project. You are all most certainly welcome!
Thanks and have a nice day!
Andrew Lynch
PS, if you have questions feel free to contact me at LYNCHAJ at YAHOO.COM
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-
> bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Rich Cini
> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 9:19 AM
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> Subject: Re: The best CP/M machine ever? was Re: Kaypro II
>
> Do you mean hobbyist or COTS? There are several hobby SBCs that can do it,
> including the P112 and N8VEM. There are 68k and 8086 boards as well.
>
>
>
> Rich Cini
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Aug 23, 2012, at 8:56 AM, microcode at zoho.com wrote:
>
> > Are there any modern ready-to-go SBCs capable of running CP/M?
> >
> >
I could not help but become part of the conversation even if people have
already written more 'diligent and competent than me.
My site is http://elazzerini.interfree.it
Originally my disposal clone a Ferguson Bigboard I that I was able to start
charging even CP / M 2.2 to 3.5" diskettes.
Obviously I could not help but come into possession of his descendants: the
Xerox 820-I and the Kaypro-II whose reviews I entered the site and are still
working.
The only board xerox 820-I has been assembled by me in a PC case for making
all the corrections have composite video, and use PS2 interface-parallel
drive with 3.5 ".
The Kaypro II was full of his case but with a full size 5.25" drive out of
service and when buying a separate drive full size 5.25 " is fully
operational.
I'm happy to have just these two machines, but fully functional. I could not
afford them to buy them with the original prices of the 80's.
To assess the selling rate of your Kaypro-II if the goal is to gain much
more money I suggest whether it is fully functional and free of scratches,
it is best to sell it to pieces, only one drive fullsize 5.25 " fully
functional sold separately makes it almost more 'all over the computer
alone.
Probably be able to sell the first pair of drive 5.25 ", then the mainboard
and then the keyboard or the power supply while you remain the case and the
monitor.
I do not think could you sell it in bulk to achieve a fair return if the
product Kaypro-II at that time very popular. At least every three days you
find it for sale on epay.
I am currently looking for other boards like the Ferguson Bigboard II or the
Ampro Little Board based on the Z80 or Z80 based mainboard in general other.
Greetings
Enrico - Pisa (Italy)
>Message: 20
>Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2012 15:31:40 -0400
>From: Allison < ajp166 at verizon.net > >
>
>On 08/23/2012 01:06 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
<snip>
>> Why didn't the Otrona catch on?
>> Charlie Chaplin [clone] carrying a table with computer down stairs wasn't
>> enough?
>>
>Osborne was first, smaller and had a 5" screen.
>
>Kaypro was later, had better screen, keyboard, more IO, and generally
>better.
>I'd agree the Darth Vader lunch box look as less than kool but it was
>durable.
>
>Allison
Regarding why the Otrona did not catch on (other than in some circles, such as the JPL):
1. Price. Much more expensive than either the Osborne or Kaypro. I think I paid over $3500 for my 8:16, with a substantial educational discount.
2. Screen size: 5".
3. Late arrival. The O1 and Kaypro were already established. I saw my first Otrona at a Chicago FOG meeting.
I heard the Osborne described as a Buick, the Kaypro as a Chevrolet and the Otrona as a BMW.
BTW, I still have my 8:16, which I had aftermarket upgraded to 512KB RAM .
Bob
