> I'd like to keep the costs as low as possible and am trying to keep the
> EPROM at or below $5 each.
How much of the megabyte of space have you ACTUALLY used?
A meg of EPROM seems insane to me for a low-cost SBC.
(E)PROM, PAL, GAL, CPLD, etc. programming
Seth Morabito sethm
<mailto:cctalk%40classiccmp.org?Subject=%28E%29PROM%2C%20PAL%2C%20GAL%2C%20C
PLD%2C%20etc.%20programming&In-Reply-To=> at loomcom.com
Thu Jun 5 19:33:59 CDT 2008
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_____
Hey folks,
I'd like to get some advice on getting a general-purpose (E)PROM
burner. I've never burned a PROM in my life, but as I get more into
digital design and home-brewing logic, I'm finding myself wishing I
had access to a burner. I am a helpless newbie on this front, so
perhaps someone can show me the light.
I'd ideally like to be able to dump and burn PROMs, EPROMs, and PALs
of various flavors. Bonus points would be GAL and CPLD programming
capability, but I don't know how common it is to find both of those in
the same box. Is it? Or is programmable logic typically handled by a
totally different device?
Availability is important -- I'd prefer to find one I can buy soon
rather than waiting for just the right one to show up on eBay.
And yes, just to prove that this is more or less on topic: I have
been given a box of early 80s EPROMs I would like to try to get dumps
of!
Thanks much,
-Seth
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Hi Seth,
As you can probably tell from the responses so far your choice in EPROM
programmers is a highly personal one.
Certainly the Data IO is a nice programmer. I have a Data IO 29B and use it
frequently for older EPROMs like 2708s and such.
There probably isn't the perfect EPROM programmer that does everything for
everybody. I have managed to get several for various needs.
For very low cost but limited in that it can only program fairly recent
EPROM, Flash, EEPROM, SRAM, etc, I would go with an eBay special Willem
programmer. At $20 plus shipping they are hard to beat and are good for the
vast bulk of requirements. They do not do GALs, PALs, CPLDs, but do PICs
and AVRs.
http://search.ebay.com/willem-programmer_W0QQdfspZ32QQfromZR40QQfsooZ1QQfsop
Z34QQsbrsrtZd
If you need GALs, PALs, CPLDs as well and can spend a little more go with
the EasyPro 90B or Top 2007
http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?sofocus=bs
<http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?sofocus=bs&sbrftog=1&from=R40&sati
tle=easypro+90B&sacat=-1%26catref%3DC6&sargn=-1%26saslc%3D2&sadis=200&fpos=4
5429&sabfmts=1&ftrt=1&ftrv=1&saprclo=&saprchi=&fsop=34%26fsoo%3D1&coaction=c
ompare&copagenum=1&coentrypage=search>
&sbrftog=1&from=R40&satitle=easypro+90B&sacat=-1%26catref%3DC6&sargn=-1%26sa
slc%3D2&sadis=200&fpos=45429&sabfmts=1&ftrt=1&ftrv=1&saprclo=&saprchi=&fsop=
34%26fsoo%3D1&coaction=compare&copagenum=1&coentrypage=search
http://search.ebay.com/top2007_W0QQcatrefZC6QQdfspZ32QQfromZR40QQfsooZ1QQfso
pZ34QQftrtZ1QQftrvZ1QQsabfmtsZ1QQsacatZQ2d1QQsbrsrtZd
You can shop around for various models online but here is a good place to
comparison shop. The prices aren't too bad either and pretty convenient:
http://www.mcumall.com/comersus/store/LeftStart.asp?idCategory=27
If all you want to do is get started with EPROM programming and maybe read
some old EPROMs, I would just get the Willem and use it until you determine
what you really want and need.
My guess is the Willem will do practically everything you'll need until you
get some specialized requirements like 2708s/1702s/GALs/PALs etc.
Thanks and good luck!
Andrew Lynch
PS, When buying an older EPROM programmer, be sure to check the socket size.
Some older programmers only accept up to 28 pin devices. Many newer DIP
memories are 32 or 42 pin chips and even larger.
> Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2008 20:02:22 +0200
> From: Oliver Lehmann
I don't have any experience with your particular compiler, but from
what you say on your web page, it makes me wonder if an additional
temporary variable isn't involved.
Something like:
x = (caddr_t)(((long)uap->linkname));
x &= 0x7F00FFFF;
u.u_dirp.l = x;
Of course, the intermediate variable would have to be register-
resident.
Just a guess...
Cheers,
Chuck
The batteries in my MicroVaxen need to be replaced. A couple of questions:
What's the best way to clean up corrosion damage caused by these batteries? With Alkaline batteries, I usually use vinegar (since alkalines leak a base, not acid). What about NI-CD?
What types of batteries can these be replaced with? I'm assuming that this is a NI-CD battery pack. I went to Radio Shack expecting to simply find a cordless phone battery that I could use to replace it - the pack appears to be nothing more than three AAA NI-CD cells in series. Unfortunately, the only sort of phone batteries they carry are either too big (AA's) or NIMH. I wouldn't imagine that it would work, but is it possible to use NIMH batteries to replace the original pack? I ended up buying a small pack at Target, it's a small, three cell (half or third AA, it appears), phone battery pack. NI-CD, 400mAh. But, you know, I'd like to know what my options are for the other MicroVaxen...
Thanks!
-Ian
Time again for a stupid question. Why replace the original?
I hate the idea of batteries inside equipment where the electrolyte
goo can leak all over sensitive components. If I had your MicroVAX,
I'd get a bunch of primary cells in a battery holder and place them
outside of the case, so the goo will leak out onto the floor.
A diode in series with the battery pack should disable the charging
circuit and drop the pack's voltage to near-optimal. (3x1.2 NiCD =
3.6v; 3x1.5 primary = 4.5v - 0.7v for the series diode = 3.8v; pretty
close). If the battery's function is to keep the clock and some RAM
alive, 3 "D" cells will probably last a year or two. Make them
Lithium-iron cells and you'll probably get 10 years of service.
Cheers,
Chuck
Hey folks,
I'd like to get some advice on getting a general-purpose (E)PROM
burner. I've never burned a PROM in my life, but as I get more into
digital design and home-brewing logic, I'm finding myself wishing I
had access to a burner. I am a helpless newbie on this front, so
perhaps someone can show me the light.
I'd ideally like to be able to dump and burn PROMs, EPROMs, and PALs
of various flavors. Bonus points would be GAL and CPLD programming
capability, but I don't know how common it is to find both of those in
the same box. Is it? Or is programmable logic typically handled by a
totally different device?
Availability is important -- I'd prefer to find one I can buy soon
rather than waiting for just the right one to show up on eBay.
And yes, just to prove that this is more or less on topic: I have
been given a box of early 80s EPROMs I would like to try to get dumps
of!
Thanks much,
-Seth
> From: "Mike Hatch" <mike at brickfieldspark.org>
>
> TM4's were on the SDS9300, six of them, as I recall they were 10
> track but
> something also says 9 track, after all it was 35 years ago !..
Thanks for that. Yes a long time ago.
> There were also TM4's fitted to an ICL (I think a 1901) machine up
> in London
> but I only visited for service once (dirty contacts on the tape arm
> switches).
More likely a 1301. When the 1301s were being phased out they had to
connect a pair of 7 track decks to the 1301s to transfer data to
1900. If they'd had 1900s with TM4s they would surely have chosen
that route instead.
I presume you mean the contacts with the dash-pot attached, not the
switches at the end of arm's travel as these are fairly bullet proof.
Now I've said that, they will of course fail next week!
I was chatting to a friend who was an ICT field engineer yesterday
and he said 'we must clean the vacuum chambers sometime'. I asked him
how often they should be cleaned and he said at the start of every
morning shift. This made us both grin because they have not been
cleaned since about 1977 and they are still not causing any problems,
we can read tape last written at that time too, though the writing
logic 'runs away' for some reason.
> There were also TM2 drives on a LEO3 #26 at Charles House in London
> maintained by ICL for running gas bills. I gather quite a number of
> the Leo
> machines used TM drives.
They were popular on 1301s too, though no TM2 equipped 1301s have
survived. They had four times the throughput of the TM4 decks as they
used 8 data bits per frame plus 8 cyclic redundancy check bits. The
tape moved as 150 inches per second too compared with just 75 on the
TM4s giving 90k digits per second compared to 22.5k on the TM4. Still
300 bits per inch on each track though, seems very low density by
today's standard.
Roger Holmes.
>
>Subject: Re: powering up older machines - is it safe?
> From: Steven Hirsch <snhirsch at gmail.com>
> Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2008 09:00:15 -0400 (EDT)
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" <cctech at classiccmp.org>
>
>On Mon, 2 Jun 2008, Allison wrote:
>
>> Generally yes in my exerience. The PS is a ASTEC switcher in the drive
snippage...
>Allison,
>
>Do you recall anything about the semi-mythical Corvus interface for the
>VT180? It's mentioned in the Corvus technical literature, but I've never
>talked to anyone that's actually seen it in the wild. I'm curious if it
>ever actually existed.
>
>Steve
Nothing mythical. There was a version of the corvus interface that
was a board that went under the Z80 and therefor allowed most any
Z80 system to accept the corvus hardware. It wasn't however sold as
a uniquely Robin thing.
FYI the Robin does not have any for of external bus. If you want
access to the bus you have to jack up the Z80 and grab it there.
I ahve a Vt180, Vt185 (VT125+VT185 board) and maybe 4 VT180 boards
rigged as standalone and a dozen more if I need a Z80, 8k of shadow rom,
65K of ram, 4 serial ports and a FDC on one nice board.
Allison
Hi,
I'm the program director for a non-profit in Colorado and I am looking for a PDP-11 that we could use to introduce students to the early IT beginnings. I am hoping you may still have a surplus PDP-11 that we could pick up and cart away. You ad on http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2008-February/091447.html is perfect for me, if it's still available.
Dave Mynatt
=====
http://sciencecenter.no-ip.org
SID ID: S-0258
APRS UI-View
KA0SWT
LAT: 38'16.278" N
LON: -104'40.537" W
Alt: 4780ft
DM78
> Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2008 17:23:03 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mr Ian Primus >
> The batteries in my MicroVaxen need to be replaced. A couple of
> questions:
>
> What's the best way to clean up corrosion damage caused by these
> batteries? With Alkaline batteries, I usually use vinegar (since alkalines
> leak a base, not acid). What about NI-CD?
They still use a strong base (potassium hydroxide), so vinegar is
still a good idea. KOH is nasty--keep it off your skin and out of
your eyes. Rinse well; follow up with methyl alcohol.
Cheers,
Chuck
