test-drb March 2005

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

291 participants
840 discussions

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 08:21 PM 3/7/2005, Jim Brain wrote: >One can't help but wonder if the web forum thread is half-serious, half troll. >Especially considering the list makeup. I probably should feed the troll, >but the stereotyping thing seemed a bit overkill. Yes, not only am I trolling but I'm also playing the devil's advocate because I grow tired of the unending Windows bashing. (I'm plenty capable of that, too, have no fear.) It's not necessary for an enthusiasm for classic computers, so it's off-topic and flame-baiting. But I began to suspect that the bashing was often, at root, bashing against today's entire computer environment: anti-web, anti-GUI, anti-high-bandwidth. Why is it necessary to say that today's technology is bad just to affirm that yesterday's is/was good? At 07:17 PM 3/7/2005, Cameron Kaiser wrote: >> There's also a persistent geek belief-system where, once they >> believe a device is technologically superior, they think it >> should be popular and all those who believe otherwise are idiots. > >The irony is, one person here seems to have precisely that perspective >when it comes to web forums. I wonder who that is. Hmm. For the record, I rarely consult the web version of this list. My earliest message from it is dated November 1997, and all my archives of it are in 'mbox' format. >> To wit, I'll summarize some of the savvy arguments posted so far against >> web-based forums: Web sites are slow. Not all browsers can use them. >> [...] > >And these are bad arguments why? Are these reasons somehow unjustified? >Especially things like connect charges, software incompatibilities, ... For a group (there I go, stereotyping and lumping again to create a Them) that's technologically adept and eager to invest immense amounts of time and energy and even money in obscure archaic technologies, you'd think They'd be wise enough to recognize that today's Web users and developers face exactly the same issues we faced 30 years ago, and they're just as capable of addressing and solving them in their own way, driven by their perceived needs. Surely there are assumptions to be questioned. To wit, a web user is less concerned about hoarding precious ASCII files. They assume the connection will always be "on". They have no need to 'grep' a local copy because they assume it'll still be Out There somewhere. They don't need to 'grep' a local copy because the web site has an index or search engine or they can rely on Google. If it's valuable enough, it'll be mirrored. If they really want an offline copy, they can make it, but it'll be in HTML, and they know how to cut-and-paste to ASCII if they need it. If you want to edit in your favorite editor, just cut-and-paste. BFD. I bop between web, Windows, Mac, Linux and DOS all day long. At 07:03 PM 3/7/2005, Tony Duell wrote: >Well I cetainly can't do any of those. I have never been offered a PC >faster than a 286. I certainly can't afford broadband. I don't know your circumstances. You're in the UK. I suspect broadband is available your area for about $30 a month. If time is worth anything to you, it'll be worth it compared to dial-up. What do you pay for dial-up? Around here in East Bumblefrick USA, clients are begging me to haul away their old 600 Mhz PCs as well as any previous generations. You find them on the curb. Are you truly not using a web browser, ever? >And I don't mind >admitting I am not clever enough to repair modern PCs, I don't have a BGA >rework station You're trying too hard. See above for a source of a new PC. >I much prefer mailing lists to web fora. I prefer large-format film >cameras to digital cameras. And so on. I just picked up a gorgeous Leitz Focomat IIc enlarger for $300, I'm debating whether to keep it or eBay it and get ~$3000. At 10:39 PM 3/7/2005, der Mouse wrote: >I don't dislike reverse video because it's New and Modern; I dislike it >because I've used it and find it significantly more tiring to my eyes >(when used for any significant length of time - reverse video *is* >easier to read for very brief stuff, say a line or two, but gets very >wearing for much more than that, at least on self-luminant displays). Footnote for future-kids reading this in the archives: Note that 'der Mouse' refers to "reverse video" and means "illuminated glyphs on a dark phosphor background" although at this point in history, the vast majority of Web-using computerists considered that mode to be "reverse video" because web and GUI interfaces typically drew non-illuminated glyphs on lighter backgrounds. - John

19 years, 4 months

PDP 11/45 problems.

by jim＠g1jbg.co.uk

Hi, I think I have arrived at pretty much the same point as Jay on my 11/45. Ive stripped it down to the minimum - processor, memory management, memory (UFUM) and timing generator. Toggling in from the front panel, I can see the data lines change, but I'm not getting address data on the Unibus. My next test, is to try and look at the address data between the processor and the memory management module. Does anyone have any other tips? Thansk Jim. Please see our website the " Vintage Communication Pages" at WWW.G1JBG.CO.UK

19 years, 4 months

minor list changes

by dvcorbin＠optonline.net

> You are seriouisly suggesting that I carry a pile of service > manuals, classic computers, and test gear (all of which I've > been known to use in order to answer questions here) to > the local internet cafe? > Of course not.... you set them all up there as an exhibit!!!!

19 years, 4 months

For Trade: SGI software,manuals,keyboards,mice,machines

by ishtar130＠hotmail.com

Hi I noticed on the internet that you or whoever have owners manuals if you still have them I would be intrested in the O2 Workstation Owner's GuideIRIS Software Installation Guide IRIS Workspace User's Guideif you still have these what is the condition and priceThank YouGreg Pishko

19 years, 4 months

NNTP instead of mail

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 8 2005, 17:59, Chris Blackburn wrote: > All the email/news clients I have used support it, these include > > 1) Microsoft Lookout (express) > 2) Mozilla Mail > 3) Mozilla Thunderbird Most traditional ones, like tin, do so as well. > > 3) Some people don't have NNTP access. > > I truly hadn't thought of this one. If it is a problem then we can tell > INN to run on a nonstandard (and usually available) port and tell > people to set up their news clients appropriately. Except that firewalls with a "default drop" policy, ie block everything except that which is "known" to be "safe", are becoming more common -- so using a non-standard port would make matters worse, I suspect. OTOH, you could use port 80 if the NNTP server wasn't also a web server. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

19 years, 4 months

2.5V Lithium "AA" sized batteries: Where to find?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 5 2005, 17:53, Eric F. wrote: > The battery is the size of a regular "AA", but is 2.5V Lithium. The > company who used to manufacture them (SAFT) no longer does so. The SAFT > battery model # is "LCP 6". > > Picture of battery (and a regular "AA" for comparison): > > http://home.san.rr.com/instep/saft-lcp6.jpg (~42KB) Lithium/thionyl chloride cells are 3.6V, and lithium/iron disuplhide are 1.5V per cell, so it's probably lithium/manganese dioxide which is usually described as 3V. Varta make an AA size Li/Mn02 with PCB tags, which you might be able to cut off. Sorry, I don't know the part number, but it's still shown as current in my CPC[1] catalogue. Sonnenschein, SAFT, Maxell, and others also make 3.6V lithium AA cells, if that's any good. They're (or were) used in a few computers, including Compaq Portables and some older Tandon and Toshiba models. Some companies make 1/2-AA size cells. They're usually 3.6V lithium/thionyl chloride and commonly used in Apple Macs, but I think I've seen 1/2-AA 1.2V NiCd or NiMh ones as well (2/3-AA are quite common). [1] CPC, aka Combined Precision Components, is a supplier of electronics and other items in the UK. However, it's part of the Farnell Group along with Farnell Electronic Components and Newark so you might be able to find the same things on Farnell's US web site. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

19 years, 4 months

three and a quarter inch floppy?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 8 2005, 19:18, Jim Beacon wrote: > 31/4 drives were used on the old Amstrad word processing machines (forget > the number - do any of the other UK members know? I think you're thinking of the PCW range, and they used 3", not 3.25". -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

19 years, 4 months

NNTP instead of mail

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 8 2005, 12:54, Randy McLaughlin wrote: > An email is forever if your server lets you keep a large enough back-log or > if you download it to your machine and it never ever fails (who ever hear of > a computer having trouble anyway). > > NNTP is forever through people like google groups. Only for groups on public servers, which peer with other Usenet servers. If we're talking about private servers, google groups doesn't enter the equation. > The true problems with NNTP are: not everyone has access to Usenet will and > those that do would have to talk their Usenet provider into including it. Only if the group(s) is/are public, and propagated through Usenet. They don't need to be; lots of groups are private and restricted to a few servers (eg the local York Uni groups, the tin newsreader groups). > I love NNTP and have several groups I follow on it. I see no practical way > to switch to Usenet. The list works, it may not be perfect [...] Agreed :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

19 years, 4 months

RLL vs. MFM

by eric＠brouhaha.com

Ming_Mae wrote: > No you can't use a RLL with an MFM controller. Similar but not the same. If you're talking about using drives with the ST506/ST412 interface, you most certainly can use an "RLL drive" (e.g., ST277R) on an MFM controller. Of course, you'll only get 2/3 the capacity that you would get with an RLL controller. Using an "MFM drive" with an RLL controller often works, but it depends a lot on the drive. In my experience high-quality drives like the Maxtor XT1000 and XT2000 series always worked fine. Eric

19 years, 4 months

Panasonic HHC Basic on ePay

by news＠computercollector.com

I'll happily split the cost of the BASIC ROM is you can make me a copy. Someone else is selling an EO 440 and the bid is up to $108. Crazy! If it were mint condition with all manuals and accessories, etc., then MAYBE it would be worth $100. But this one is not. >>>>>>>>> --- Roger Merchberger <zmerch at 30below.com> wrote: > It's nutjob-expensive, if you ask me - but the guy's 2 - one he's epaying > alone ($50 USD opening bid, BIN for $75) and he's got another complete > machine with the BASIC ROM in it for $115 BIN, IIRC. No bids on either > one... should I snag the ROM to make backups of it? :-O Evan's personal homepage: www.snarc.net *** Tell your friends about the Computer Collector Newsletter! - It's free and we'll never send spam or share your email address - Publishing every Monday(-ish), ask about writing for us - Mainframes to videogames, hardware and software, we cover it all - W: http://news.computercollector.com E: news at computercollector.com - We're approaching 700 readers: win a prize!

19 years, 4 months

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test-drb March 2005