test-drb December 2005

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

235 participants
580 discussions

by dm561＠torfree.net

---------------Original Message------------------- From: "Dave Dunfield" <dave04a at dunfield.com> Subject: Re: Cromemco software available <snip> > I've also got various Cromemco and third-party S/W packages for the > Z80/68000/68010/68020 and Unix systems; will post a list one of these days. > > However, I've been archiving them as MS format ZIP files instead of disk images; > that way it doesn't matter whether you've got 5" or 8" disks (also, I only had some > of them on hard disks). Mind you, you would need a way to copy them back from > MS to CDOS/Cromix/Unix format and of course you'd still need a boot disk > for each O/S. It would be nice to get this material archived, however it will be tough for most people to make use of it. Would it be feasable to make up boot disks with the utilities necessary to peform serial transfers, and provide ImageDisk images of these which could be used to download the remaining software from the PC into the target system? Regards, Dave -- dave04a (at) Dave Dunfield dunfield (dot) Firmware development services & tools: www.dunfield.com com Collector of vintage computing equipment: http://www.parse.com/~ddunfield/museum/index.html -------------------Reply---------------- That's what I had in mind when I started to archive this stuff way back when, at least for the OSs: one or more bootable disk images in both sizes and a ZIP file of either a TAR file of the rest or individual files, depending on whether links and attributes are required. The problem I saw with just imaging is the 5" and 8" disks; for example, how would someone install your 8" image of Cromix on his/her System One? Also, I couldn't be bothered to install an 8" drive on the PC. Finally, at least some of this stuff might also run on non-Cromemco systems so it might be useful to have it in a form that is readable on the (more or less) universal PC. I was really just interested in archiving the stuff and not too concerned with storing it in a directly installable form. This works for me, but I realize it's not ideal. Is there a better way of archiving this stuff? Suppose you had a copy of Cromix+ on 8" disks, one bootable and three others in FTAR format; how would you archive that in a way so that someone with a System One and no 8" drive could install it, keeping the links and attributes intact? Or you find an interesting package installed on your System 3 HD ( If/when you get it working :); how do you archive that, again, keeping links & attributes intact? I'm using Cromix+ to copy & transfer stuff; it would indeed be useful to have a comm program configured for a Cromemco running CDOS or Z80 Cromix that can do xmodem or kermit; Since you'll shortly be getting copies of most of this stuff anyway, I'll gladly leave it in your hands :) mike

18 years, 9 months

PDP 11/73 is ALIVE!

by VAXDECman＠aol.com

Hi, I saw this posting on the web. Thought you might have a version of RSX11M+. I'm trying to get a KDJ11-SD modified so I can run RSX on it. Thanks, Greg Miller Plymouth, MI

18 years, 9 months

Request to mailing list cctech rejected

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

Hey Jay, Whats this?? I cannot corrolate it to any thing I may have sent ow was awake to send. Allison > >Subject: Request to mailing list cctech rejected > From: cctech-bounces at classiccmp.org > Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2005 01:16:35 -0600 > To: ajp166 at bellatlantic.net > >Your request to the cctech mailing list > > Posting of your message titled "Re: Legacy apps in Windows/OS X >was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software" > >has been rejected by the list moderator. The moderator gave the >following reason for rejecting your request: > >"Non-members are not allowed to post messages to this list." > >Any questions or comments should be directed to the list administrator >at: > > cctech-owner at classiccmp.org

18 years, 9 months

A Hobbyist DECnet Network

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: A Hobbyist DECnet Network > From: der Mouse <mouse at rodents.montreal.qc.ca> > Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 03:00:23 -0500 (EST) > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >> Probably there just aren't many hackers out there who know enough >> about DECnet to worry about, > >I suspect there are actually plenty of them - several are probably on >this very list - but most (verging on all, would be my guess) are >honest enough to be no problem. > There's a story of a VAX at DEFCON that was subjected to the hordes and stood well. VMS has good security out of the box, always did. It can be made very tight without much effort and it's also so different >from PCs (Hardend OS and protection in hardware) so security by obscurity doesn't hurt. Allison

18 years, 9 months

Cromemco software available

by dm561＠torfree.net

I've got a few working Cromemcos and could check them out for ya, although Dave D is probably better qualified since he wrote ImageDisk. I've also got various Cromemco and third-party S/W packages for the Z80/68000/68010/68020 and Unix systems; will post a list one of these days. However, I've been archiving them as MS format ZIP files instead of disk images; that way it doesn't matter whether you've got 5" or 8" disks (also, I only had some of them on hard disks). Mind you, you would need a way to copy them back from MS to CDOS/Cromix/Unix format and of course you'd still need a boot disk for each O/S. If that's an IMI 7700 series drive (or two), a couple of tips: a lot of them had problems with the power connectors oxidizing so check those carefully (unless they've been replaced). Also, the older models had locking screws, so check that as well before you spin it up. Is it internal or external, BTW? And are those diskettes really single-sided? Z-2Ds generally had 2 DSDD TM100s and could read & write all four formats. Good luck! mike -----------------Original Message------------------ From: Doc Shipley <doc at mdrconsult.com> Subject: Cromemco software available To: General at mdrconsult.com, "Discussion at mdrconsult.com":On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <4397CA23.6000503 at mdrconsult.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Does anybody have a working Cromemco with 5.25" SSSD floppy drive[s]? I finally made it out to pick up my Z-2D, and it came with a lot of floppy diskettes. As it's going to be awhile before I bring up the Z-2D to boot - it hasn't been powered up in many years, so I'll be cleaning and then powering it up in stages - I thought I'd go ahead and image the diskettes. I've spot-checked a couple with 22Disk and they seem to have valid data, so I'm going to try my hand at Dave Dunfield's ImageDisk. I'd like for someone with a working system to try the images and see if they're bootable. <snip>

18 years, 9 months

Keep DAA! (was Re: 8086 bugs)

by leeedavison＠yahoo.co.uk

> Now, what's it do? Nibble to hex ASCII probably, similar code can be used on the 6502 and 680x0 processors as well. Lee. .. ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

18 years, 9 months

IBM DASD alternatives?

by ceby2＠csc.com

Folks -- Has anyone tried creating mainframe compatible DASD with commodity components? I now have an S/390, but am trying to pare it back to a fighting weight (one that'll fit the electrical limitations of my flat). The DASD are monster 14" platters with 400MB capacity each -- 9332-Model400. And the system requires 5 of them with its current configuration. I was wondering if there was a way to adapt the system to more modest disk types much way as has been done with some of the recent PDP re-implementations with flash and 2.5" IDE. Any thoughts? While we're at it, I'm still interested in offloading two of my IO cabinets and a bunch of COM controller feature cards. I haven't had any takers so far. Thanks, Colin Eby -- ceby2 at csc.com CSC - EMEA Northern Region - C&SI -Technology Architect -------------------------------------- This is a PRIVATE message. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete without copying and kindly advise us by e-mail of the mistake in delivery. NOTE: Regardless of content, this e-mail shall not operate to bind CSC to any order or other contract unless pursuant to explicit written agreement or government initiative expressly permitting the use of e-mail for such purpose. --------------------------------------

18 years, 9 months

Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software > From: "Michael B. Brutman" <mbbrutman-cctalk at brutman.com> > Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 19:09:22 -0600 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Jim Leonard wrote: > >> >> Here's another dumb question: When I open up one of my XTs, why does >> my 8088-1 have an AMD logo on it? > >That's an easy one ... IBM insisted on two sources for the 8088. AMD >made an 8088 clone under license from Intel, and was the second supplier >used by IBM. Unlike the V20, it was an exact duplicate. > > >Mike >www.brutman.com/PCjr > By that time NEC had the 8088, AMD, And at least one European SGS maybe and a few I may have forgot. in 1981 The 8088 was already three years old! Allison

18 years, 9 months

Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software > From: woodelf <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> > Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 11:25:09 -0700 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > >Chuck Guzis wrote: > >>Hmmm, thought I just said that. One of the more highly-touted performance >>improvements in the V20/V30 was the implemenation of dual internal data >>busses. In practice, I don't know if it made a huge difference in speed, >>but NEC claimed up to a 30% improvement for som operations.. >> >> >> >That was a long time ago ... the XT clone wars. Back then a M$ mouse $100. >No need to gouge the public with windows /85 :) > >>I thought it interesting that the 8080 emulation of the V20/V30 emulated >>the Intel 8080A and not tne NEC 8080A instruction set. >> >> >> >So what instructions did the NEC 8080A have different? > >>Cheers, >>Chuck The early NEC 8080 (round lid prior to 77ish) set the flags wrong I believe it was the sign flag though I'd have to check. After IMSAI and others dumped them for the big they redesigned to exactly match the Intel 8080A, NEC part was 8080AF. Allison

18 years, 9 months

Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Legacy apps in Windows/OS X was Re: Old MS-DOS & Win Software > From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) > Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 18:28:07 +0000 (GMT) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > >> It was quite somethig to take an 8088, 8284(clock gen), 8205 (aka74138), >> 8755, 8155 and have a complete 16bitter in 5 or so chips. However, the > >IIRC there was a Circuit Cellar article in Byte for a 5-chip machine >using the 8088. The other chips were, IIRC, the clock generator, 8155 >(RAM + I/O), 8355 (ROM + I/O) and an Intel RAM chip with multiplexed >address/data buses. The address decoding was done by just connecting the >chip enables to the high-order address lines... Yes, that circuit is straight out of the intel appnote. >Well, I've read the datasbook, I've seen it in use, but have never >designed with it. What's the problem? It always struck me as a lot nicer >than the 8237 + page registers that IBM used in the PC think about it. It's a microprocessor with a flat 20bit address and nothing like the 8088. In some respects is nicer. I had to write a simple debugger for it using the host for the IO. Very ugly and hard to control. Allison

18 years, 9 months

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test-drb December 2005