I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for
the BBC micro using a 6809.
I found it again recently and here's a photo...
http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/CNXT0053.JPG
You can see the Tube (furthest), CPU (next to it), boot rom
(left of the CPU), 64K DRAM, and two custom chips; one is an
8-bit counter for dynamic ram refresh, and a PLA for address
decoding. I forget what the other small TTL chip did; it may
have been a couple of inverters to create a signal delay?
I found this today which I think is the logic table for
the dynamic refresh and address decode PLA:
{
Ras' = (Eclk + Qclk)'
RomCS = A15.A14.A13.A12.A11.A10
TubeCS = A15.A14.A13.A12.A11.A10'
Cas = Q.(RomCS' + TubeCS')'
Count' = Q.(RomCS' + TubeCS')
TW' = E' + R/NW
TR' = E' + R/NW'
}
IN A10, A11, A12, A13, A14, A15, Eclk, Qclk, R/W'
X X X X X X X X 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 0
X X X X X X X X 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0
X X X X X X 0 X X 0 0 1 1 0 0 0
X X X X X X 0 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
X 1 1 1 1 1 X 1 X 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
X X X X X X 0 0 X 0 1 0 0 0 0 0
1 1 1 1 1 1 X X X 0 0 0 0 0 1 0
0 1 1 1 1 1 X X X 0 0 0 0 1 0 0
X X X X X 0 X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
X X X X 0 X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
X X X 0 X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
X X 0 X X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
X 0 X X X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
OUT Count', RAS', TW', TR', TubeCS, RomCS, CAS
{
Ras' use as is.
Cas invert with 30ns <= delay <= 60ns
RomCS invert
TubeCS invert
Count' feed directly into counter, counter clocks on falling edge
TR' use as is
TW' use as is
}
I also found an HP Plotfile which *may* be the layout of this
chip that I'd love to see again - if anyone has a utility to
convert HP plotter codes into something more readable that they
could run this through in a few minutes (don't put a lot of
effort into it, I can write my own utility if I need to) I'ld
love to see what it looks like again...: http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/plotfile.txt
The chip was laid out in my own layout language called the
"Tiled Orthogonal Abutment Language" ;-) - it was basically a
crude tiling system with no overlap, pretty much like the
way the very first release of M$ Windows worked:
http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/megaroute.toal
The two empty sockets originally contained 2 32K static
rams with battery-backup built-in, instead of the 64K SIL,
eprom, and counter. Unfortunately you had to pre-load it
with boot rom contents on another system then transfer
the ram without the battery falling off :-) (glued on,
kinda hacky!) I prototyped it with the static ram and
then got it working with dynamic ram when the chips were
returned from fab.
The custom chips weren't strictly necessary; I was working in
the VLSI CAD group and they needed some test chips when trialling
a new production line, so all the programmers got the chance to
design a chip if they wanted to. I took the chance to do these
for the 6809 as I'ld always liked that CPU in preference to
the 6502 in the BBC systems. I think if I had needed to I could
have used off the shelf chips that would have done the same
job.
Anyway it was a nice small & cheap system to build in either
incarnation; I was disappointed that Acorn didn't pick it up.
(The primary reason being that Roger was a speed freak and
that the 6809 was obviously not going to be pushed as far as
the 6502 was being improved)
I also wrote a compiler for it because I had no luck at all getting
the only company I could find that wrote a C compiler (Introl)
to reply to my letters (http://www.gtoal.com/athome/tmp/c.letter)
asking about the possibility of bundling it with our processor,
although they were quick enough to send brochures for sales of
a single unit when they thought I was an end-user at first.
My compiler is here if you're interested; it was no great shakes
but it worked for me...
http://www.gtoal.com/athome/edinburgh/skimp/skimp-6809/
- and as a result of the Edinburgh history project resurrecting
Imp, I've been able to get it running again, with the intention
of perhaps writing some Vectrex games with it... (You can see
the output of the compiler in this article:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/compilers101/message/187 )
An early (unfinished) source of my boot rom (I lost the
final one) is here: http://www.gtoal.com/athome/tmp/kernel.txt
- I guess the final working binary is still in the eprom - it
does still boot up!
Graham
> I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for
> the BBC micro using a 6809.
> [...]
nice job!
> [...]
> - I guess the final working binary is still in the eprom - it
> does still boot up!
Any chance you'll be able to get the code from the eprom?
Cheers,
Eelco
As I picked up from the reactions it would be best to put a PDP11 on-line
with UNIX on his disks to make usable images of the tape
Are there somewhere on the web unix distributions for PDP11?
And how do I get it on a tape?
Luc
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens SP
Verzonden: maandag 1 september 2003 21:32
Aan: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Onderwerp: Re: Digital DSM Disribution tape
The way would be to do one copy of the tape contents in one virtual tape
available to use with one of the PDP11 simulators availables. I use SIMH
and I should like to manage DSM some time :-)
Cheers
Sergio
----- Original Message -----
From: "Luc Vande Velde" <luc(a)e2t.be>
To: <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 9:21 PM
Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape
> Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution
> tape.(9track 1600bpi)
> I found it back this afternoon (by accident in a search for some other old
> stuff)
> To make it clear - this is the native version of DSM (Digital Standard
> Mumps) version 3.3
> and it runs only on PDP11 not on vax or other PDP's
> Min. machine on UNIBUS = 11/40 on QBUS = 11/23
> If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears wide open;
or
> if someone is willing to do that's even better
>
> gr.
>
> Luc
Hi Everyone, My company builds the Decservers adn we are the original
networking division otherwise known as DNPG.
I noticed there are a lot of Dec users out there and I am sure they would
like to know what we have designed lately.
We have a brand new Decserver 708 with 8 ports of DB-9 and full modem
control encase in metal and ready to deliver.
We have the new 90M+ which has replaced the Decserver 90M, 90L and 90L+.
We have the 716 and 732.
We have a brand new switch family known as the Compass Family. 24 ports
10/100 with 2 uplink slots for fiber or copper in Gigabit or 100 base. These
also do upto 128 VLANs at the closet level. The other switch in the family
is 4 ports fixed copper gigabit and has 4 uplink slots to be configured as
you wish.
Now this is the first time we will mention our brand new Console Servers,
Cservers which are linux based and are due out in September.
We have also partnered up with Console Works and TDI offering out of band
management for all of the devices that you want to watch and deem important
in real time.
This solution lets you oversee and proactively manage in real time from
anywhere at anytime. Reboot a workstation in Paris from a blue screen from
your bed with a laptop. That is power and management
Thank you,
dwhipple(a)dnpg.com
Dave Whipple
Account Manager
direct dial: 603-216-6044
fax:603-216-0778
toll free: 877-341-9594 X6044
DNPG, LLC
Digital Networks
20 North Wentworth Ave
Londonderry, NH 03053
Fred, I have piles of this AUI cables (in nice blue color even)
Im sure I can spare a few
And Belgium is a bit closer for you then the us ;))
gr.
Luc
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens David Woyciesjes
Verzonden: woensdag 3 september 2003 15:46
Aan: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org; waltje(a)pdp11.nl
Onderwerp: Re: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout !
"Fred N. van Kempen" wrote:
>
> DELNI ethernet hubs (yes, I need more AUI cables... anyone?)
I think I can help out here, I have a bunch here in New Haven, CT, USA.
And 2 DELNIs I want to get rid of also...
--
--- Dave Woyciesjes
--- ICQ# 905818
Guys,
You are right on. I sent some info to Jim privately. I still have a plasma GRIDCASE 1520 running on
my bench, using DOS to exercise some obsolete equipment that I repair. The Cmos battery is gone so it
can't remember its hard drive type, but as long as I can boot to floppy or the ROM it runs fine. I just don't
see putting the time into the battery issue right now. It was limited, 1520 anyway, to 40M tops as I recall,
the accessable COM port was 2 instead of 1, the internal modem used COM1. The BIOS is machine code
and was NOT user accessable. The closest you could get was a utility called GRIDSCAN, which would show
the various settings, but you couldn't change them.
The startup routine would get so far and you hit "F" for floppy, "H" for hard drive, "E" for external pack.
The machine would look for ROM (2 slots) at reboot, so if you were lucky enough to have the DOS 3.3 ROM
then it would come up in DOS and you could go from there.
I had used it in the field a lot. It has a metal case and is near indestructible. Plus the equipment I
used it on was usually located in dark areas, so the plasma display was nice.
Also in reference to the water damaged manual, the professionals suggest nothing for after the
fact restoration from adherence. They claim freezing it at -15 to hold then freeze drying seems to be the
answer. Look at www.mcfoa.org/disasterplan.pdf . Sounds like its time to make coffee!
Kev
Indeed... So, what qualifies at "on-topic?" Who's the "Chief Mugwump of
the Wizengamot" who can
Ed Tillman
Store Automation Tech Support Specialist
Valero Energy Corporation
San Antonio, Texas, USA
Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048
Email: edward.tillman(a)valero.com <mailto:edward.tillman@valero.com>
-----Original Message-----
From: Lance Lyon [mailto:llyon@commodore.thebbs.org]
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 3:09 AM
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Dec or Digital Networking
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tillman, Edward" <Edward.Tillman(a)valero.com>
To: <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 PM
Subject: RE: Dec or Digital Networking
> Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap
our arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a
> version of Windows was off topic.
Indeed, in another 2 years Windows 95 will fall into the 10+ year range.
cheers,
Lance
On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote:
> Hello Antonio,
>
> > And the original definition of on-topic was something like
> > "not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that
> > definition this would clearly fail.
>
> There are a whole lot of items that most would consider on-topic that
> third party commercial dealers are still selling. A better definition might
> be items that haven't been sold by the original equipment manufacturer
> for 10 years.
>
> Best Regards
Or, why not simply items that apply/relate to equipment at least
10 years old?
- don
> At 06:06 PM 9/3/03 +0100, you wrote:
> > > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic)
> > > your fans,
> >
> >It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming
> >about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the
> >HUB90 stuff and friends).
> >
> >Antonio
> >
> >[*] And the original definition of on-topic was something like
> >"not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that
> >definition this would clearly fail.
> >
> >
> >--
> >
> >---------------
> >Antonio Carlini arcarlini(a)iee.org
