test-drb November 2001

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

247 participants
886 discussions

In search of...5.25" faceplate & mount for WangDAT 3100 or 3200

by rhblakeman＠kih.net

I figure with the "stuff" people in this group latch onto someone might have one of these. I presently have a WangDAT 3200 (2/4gb DDS1 tape) drive with the narrow faceplate and I want to put it into the external SCSI case I have now with my other 3200. Problem being that it's the 3.5" mount and that it won't really go into a 5.25 to 3.5" adapter as it's as tall as a 5.25" half height drive desoite it being only 3.5" wide. That basically makes it 1.5x as tall as a normal 3.5" floppy drive - no go for a regular adapter. Both Mountain and WangDAT made an adapter for 5.25" for these 2 drives specifically consisting of a 5.25" faceplate and two 3.5" to 5.25" side brackets (about the same as a standard adapter has). If anyone has a JUNK 3100 or 3200 drive around they want to get rid of, parts or left overs from one or even a spare good drive (3100 or 3200) they want to sell cjeap then drop me a direct note or on the list. I will contact you direct. If you have a drive with the 5.25" face and want to swap to the smaller 3.5" then that works too as I have an extra 3.5" faceplate I can mail out in advance. Thanks in advance.

23 years, 5 months

OT: paging MAC expert(s) --- What's a Performa?

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>Right now, I'm pretty concerned about how to crack open the box without >breaking >it, so I can inspect the hard disk to see what it is, physically. Does >anybody >have a recipe for doing that? This is going off memory of upgrading a 6360 (same case design)... if you want exact, I can email again on Monday when I am in front of a 630. To remove the logic board: On the back, there are two plastic tabs, push them lightly, remove the plastic face plate. Remove the two screws on either side under the face plate. Pull on the handle, the board will slide out. To remove drives: Flip the unit over, look at the front, you will see two push tabs holding the front face plate on. Push the tabs, remove the plate. The drives are on sleds, to remove a drive, push the locking tab on the sled, remove sled and drive. >Moreover, I imagine I'll use one of the considerably larger IDE types I've >set >aside from PC use to replace the drives now in the machines. It's safe to >assume, however, that NOT any IDE drive will work, since Apple Computers, >Inc. >didn't like folks buying hardware at a resonable price from someone else >rather >than allowing Apple to gouge them. (part of the MAC culture, I guess) I >note, >also, that the CDROM is SCSI. That being the case, I'd like to see whether >there's room for a SCSI HDD in the box. There certainly is room in the >system >(logically). That would work even better, since I have lots of extra SCSI >drives. Have any of you MAC gurus got experience with replacing MAC IDE >drives? There is no room in the case to add a 2nd internal drive, and running cables to replace the IDE with SCSI will be a bitch. Also, if you use SCSI, you are limited to using Apple approved drives, or you need 3rd party formating software (or a hacked version of apple's software). If you stick with IDE, you can use any drive you want, of any size you want (I am almost 100% positive apple has no problems using drives larger than 8gig on 68k machines... but you might want to double check before buying a 40 gig and hoping to use it... of course there are OS limitations on the size of a partition on older versions of the OS, don't remember details right now). Either way, you are safe to stick an older multi gig IDE drive into the 630 without a problem. Apple's software will recognize it just fine. Just remember that 68k machines can't use HFS+ formatting, so keep your drive partitions under 4 gig, or you will be wasting TONS of space on the drive. >It looks as though the drives in the boxes are 250 MB or so, which might be >adequate for some things, but I doubt it would be adequate for internet >activity. Actually, internet activity is probably what will be happiest on the 250mb drive. I think you are thinking Windows size applications. For Email you can use Eudora or Emailer (both about 3mb), Web can be iCab (about 3mb and actively under development). Fetch 3.0 has a 68k version that is about 2mb for FTP. And a plethora of other 68k friendly internet software (check www.macorchard.com). Throw in a copy of AppleWorks 5, and you have decent office apps. (or go all out with things like Nisus Writer, FileMaker Pro 3 or 4, not sure on spreadsheet but there are good options). If you make a mild attempt to lead a Microsoft free life, you will be AMAZED at the stability, small size, and speed of applications out there... all that are just as good (and in most cases BETTER). If you need to talk to MS documents, just grab a copy of MacLink Plus (although, the latest versions are PPC only, so getting access to the latest MS doc formats on a 68k machine can be a bit trickier... but still doable without too much effort). If you have 1 or 2 gig IDE drives sitting around anyway, why not use them. More important than upgrading the drive in my book would be to deck out the 630 with RAM by adding a 32mb chip. Once you have the ram, you can run OS 8.1 if you would like (in my opinion, it runs smoother and faster than 7.6.1, and is more stable than 7.5.5... but YMMV). OS 8.1 opens you up to even more good 68k software. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 5 months

HP 3000 No More (legacy)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Nov 17, 16:51, Dave McGuire wrote: > Well, as long as "dead" can be defined as "salespeople don't want to > sell you a new one". For me, it can't. I can pick up the phone and > buy PDP8 equipment from a commercial vendor. How long ago was THAT > architecture discontinued? Real Soon Now, according to people who still have them on support. Or about 1995, (yes, that's two '9's there) according to the copyright on the PCB etch of the memory board in the PDP-8/E I recently acquired :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 5 months

Additional drive and supplemental info.

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

This one is light and small enough to be shipped. It's a 'Gigastore' drive from Digi-Data Corp. Best of all, it includes the operation/maintenance manual(!). The 'Gigastore' is a weird device. What Digi-Data did is take a regular VHS VCR, make some modifications to the transport assembly, and added their own electronics to provide a Pertec interface. The result was a tape backup system that used regular VHS tapes, could store up to 2.5 gigabytes of data, and could interface to any Pertec controller. This one's cheap: $25.00 or best offer, plus shipping. Also, FYI: The HP 9-track drive I mentioned earlier would include the manual. Thanks much. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com "I'll get a life when someone demonstrates that it would be superior to what I have now..." (Taki Kogoma, aka Gym Z. Quirk)

23 years, 5 months

HP 3000 No More

by fmc＠reanimators.org

"Stan Sieler" <sieler(a)allegro.com> wrote: > Re: > > See my earlier post about how they started back in '73; > > 1972, but the actual "start" date is hard to pin down. Was it first > introduction, or the re-introduction (after it was pulled off the market)? Development of Alpha started in 1968 and ran concurrently (if somewhat on a back burner, because everybody thought the 32-bit Omega was a more exciting project) w/r/t Omega until Omega's cancellation in 1970. November 1972 is when the first systems (called HP 3000) were shipped to customers. The re-release (which was somewhat improved hardware and software and also called HP 3000 initially, but later came to be called the Series I) was in October 1973. (Reference for the above: Christopher Edler's "The Strongest Castle" paper) > The 16-bit HP 3000 was never multi-CPU. The HP 3000 Series III, introduced > in 1978, *did* have one instruction that was intended to support > having a second CPU, but nothing was ever done with it. The multiple-CPU > support came with the PA-RISC system, with release MPE XL 3.0 Somebody had ideas about it being a dual-CPU shared-memory system early on. Looking at the HP3000 Computer System Reference Manual from September 1973, I see that locations %10-%13 were reserved for the second processor's current PCB pointer, QI, ZI, and interrupt count. The Series II added two instructions: LOCK and UNLK, which were used to provide a sort of in-memory semaphore. I'm not sure they were present in the Series III. The Machine Instruction Set manuals I have handy have them footnoted with "Series II computer systems only". What I don't know is whether MPE ever had dual-CPU support. If it didn't, I wonder how they worked out that having an in-memory semaphore would be a good idea. -Frank McConnell

23 years, 5 months

HP 3000 No More (legacy)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On November 17, Stan Sieler wrote: > PA-RISC is dead/dying ... HP has said so. IA-64 killed it. [knee-jerk reaction to a pet peeve follows] Well, as long as "dead" can be defined as "salespeople don't want to sell you a new one". For me, it can't. I can pick up the phone and buy PDP8 equipment from a commercial vendor. How long ago was THAT architecture discontinued? For me, something is "dead" (or "obsolete" or whatever you want to call it) when it can no longer do its job adequately and cost-effectively. When Ford or Chevrolet discontinue a model of a car, does every owner of that model of car go throw them away and buy brand new cars? This industry is absurd, and its practices and philosophies are repulsive at best. I wish I didn't like computers so much. *grumble* > (Indeed, PA-RISC was originally scheduled to be dead by now, but it had to > be extended due to the lateness of IA-64.) > > Do I like this? Nope. But, it's as much "legacy" as Z80, 68000, and > (probably) all x86 chips. ...all of which can be bought new today, and are being built into systems (though not mainstream suits-doing-powerpoint-presentations type of systems, but is that really what this crowd cares about?) every day. "something new came out" != "this is now useless". Now, Stan...I apologize if it seems as if I'm jumping down your throat with this, and believe me I do get the impression that I'm precahing to the choir. But I also believe that the vast majority of the folks here understand that computers don't stop processing data when the manufacturer no longer wants to sell new ones of the same type. This group is likely the most enlightened of any on this subject. So why go along with it? Respectfully, -Dave McGuire -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL

23 years, 5 months

HP 3000 No More

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> According to the press release, they want you to migrate to 9000's or > their PC servers products. > > As for MPE on other platforms.. tempting. They should open source the > whole damn thing. That would be an *interesting* read. fat chance. A group tried to liberate Domain/OS, which they didn't even write, to no avail... I think Bob Supnik had the same response >from them regarding the HP2000/2100 software. Suits. Can't live with 'em, probably couldn't live without 'em. -dq

23 years, 5 months

HP 3000 No More

by dlinder＠uiuc.edu

hey list- Just announced on /., the venerable HP3000 line will join HP calculators in HP's new "we don't want to do cool stuff anymore" business model. Well, maybe that's harsh. But it is still another sad day for computing. - Dan -- Dan Linder / dlinder @ uiuc.edu Graduate Student, College of Engineering, Dept. of Computer Science - Dept. of Computer Science Teaching Assistant - DRES Computer Accessibility Researcher

23 years, 5 months

Cable and connector source

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Nov 15, 10:57, Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> wrote: > > There's a trick to soldering them. Stick the plug in a socket (or, btter > > still, a potato) to solder it. It stops things getting too hot and > > melting. > > I've done the socket thing, but I've never done a potato... wouldn't you > get lots of residual starch on the pins? Not a lot. And it's not corrosive. Don't use an apple :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 5 months

AVAILABLE: 9-track SCSI-SE tri-density tape drives

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

(Cross-posted to: classiccmp, and the port-sparc and port-vax lists at NetBSD.org) NOTE: LOCAL PICKUP ONLY EXCEPT BY SPECIAL ARRANGEMENT: I'm sorry, but these are too big and bulky for me to easily ship unless you want to pay $150 for a special box plus the freight charges. Pickup location is Kent, Washington (southeast of Seattle). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Hi, folks, Due to shifting interests, and a massive cleanup, I'm getting rid of two 9-track SCSI interface tape drives. Both are multi-density, both are standard single-ended SCSI interface, no oddball connectors, and I'd like to ask for $100 OR BEST OFFER on each one. Here's the specific details. HP 88780: Handles 800, 1600, and 6250 density tapes. Front-loading/autoloading, rackmount, and in pretty darn good shape. Originally badged as a Sun drive, and I seem to recall that it ID's as a Sun device. However, it worked just fine with standard SCSI hardware. Includes rack slides, functional when last turned on a few months back. M4 Data Model 9914R (rackmount). Handles all four known densities: 800, 1600, 3200, and 6250. Also front-load/autoload, also in great shape. I can probably come up with a set of rack slides for it as well. Somewhat lighter than the HP in physical terms, and it can be easily converted to a Pertec interface by removing the SCSI interface board and changing one parameter in the NVRAM setup. Thanks much for putting up with my blatant ad. ;-) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com "I'll get a life when someone demonstrates that it would be superior to what I have now..." (Taki Kogoma, aka Gym Z. Quirk)

23 years, 5 months

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test-drb November 2001