To tell the truth, I can't think of ANY IBM that had a factory reset switch.
My L40sx laptop has a place on the mother board for one, but no actual
external switch.
--
-Jason Willgruber
(roblwill(a)usaor.net)
ICQ#: 1730318
<http://members.tripod.com/general_1>
-----Original Message-----
From: Max Eskin <max82(a)surfree.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Monday, April 26, 1999 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: PC question
>On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote:
>>NO!!!!!
>>Any responsible computer manufacturer of the time included a reset switch.
>>But we are talking about IBM.
>>THERE WAS NO RESET SWITCH ON A REAL UNMODIFIED IBM AT.
>
>Well, the C-64 had no reset switch...or are we talking only about business
>systems? My DECMate III has no reset switch.
>
>--Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com)
> http://scivault.hypermart.net: Ignorance is Impotence - Knowledge is
Power
>
>
>MY first guess (assuming the physical format is identical, which isn't
>absolutely certain) is that there are extra words at the end of each
>directory entry. An RT11 directory entry consists of the filename, date,
>status and number of blocks that it corresponds to (note that the
>starting block is _not_ stored - you have to count the blocks used by all
>previous entries to figure that out). But it's possible at format-time to
>specify that each entry contains a number of extra words for the user to
>make use of. The PERQ interchange disk, while nominally an RT11 format,
>has 1 extra word in each directory entry that stores the number of bits
>used in the last block of the file, for example.
>Maybe early versions of RT11 choke if given disks which contain extra
>words in the directory entries...
But V2C definitely has the support for extra directory entry words. The
number of extra words for an entry is part of the directory header (at
the beginning of each directory segment).
>Most likely the result of someone PIPing to TT rather than TT:
Yep...
Remember, TT and TT: are different... the first is a file called
TT, the second is a device called TT...
The device block used for file operations is 4 words long, with
the first word being the device name (in rad50), the next two
words being the 6 character file name (in rad50), and the last
word is the file typ (extension, in rad50).
If you type TT, the CSI (the Command String Interpreter) will
build the following dblk (as it is called):
.rad50 /DK/
.rad50 /TT /
.rad50 / /
whereas if you type TT:, the CSI creates the following dblk:
.rad50 /TT /
.rad50 / /
.rad50 / /
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>The EDIT.SAV executable you have is probably a rather vanilla version
>of TECO. Just to verify, try this (I use the convention that $ is
>ESCAPE or ALTMODE):
As far as I know, EDIT was never a vanilla version of TECO... EDIT
was EDIT, TECO was TECO. EDIT did, however, look sort of like TECO
in that it had single-character and double-character commands with
arguments, ending with <ESCAPE>. But where, in TECO, you would
do 'LT', in EDIT you do 'AL'.
They are NOT the same program.
>Later versions of RT-11 have an EDIT.SAV that is *not* TECO. (For
>a long time, TECO.SAV didn't come with the distribution media - at
>least as an immediately obvious file - but as of 5.7 it's back.)
>Ok, and putting what I believe are 2 and 2 together,
>In a previous message I listed the contents of a two disk set that claims
>to be RT-11V2C. On those disks were files of the form:
> xxMNTFB.sys
>So to create a bootable volume, you find the one for your device, then
>copy it using PIP onto freshly formatted media as MONITR.SYS and then
>write the boot block using /U. Am I close?
"By George, I think he's got it..."
I seem to remember that you don't even have to rename the file
to MONITR.SYS, but that's typically what we did.
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>Ok, it looks like the only way I have of getting source code from the
>'net on to the disks is to use EDIT and the "stuff text down the serial
>line" hack in hyperterm. Assuming that I set hyperterm to send text
>slowly. What are the minimum commands in EDIT to:
>
> 1) Open a new file.
> 2) Go into Insert Mode
> 3) Exit insert mode and save the file.
There is another way...
.R PIP
*file.typ=TT:
<- at this point you stuff the characters down the
line... when done, type ^Z <CTRL-Z>
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>Ok, does anyone have an extra RQDX3 breakout board? This is the board
>that connects to the controller and then it has connectors for an RX50
>and MFM hard drive(s).
The one which goes into the BA123?
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
>
> >
> > Cleaning the board didn't solve the problem that this PC has. On power on, it
> > says (something like) 2A Keyboard failure. I can boot the machine and get into
> > the setup menu by pressing Alt-Esc. However, the cursor keys and space bar do
> > not work. At the DOS prompt, typing letter keys causes them to print twice
> > (ddiirr, and so on). This is using a known good keyboard to test with.
> >
> > Does anyone have an idea as to what the problem might be? If it's in some
> > custom-programmed keyboard controller or other custom chip, obviously the
>
A "standard" PC keyboard outputs two messages for each key. One for the
key-down, and a second for the key-up. The key-up code is the same as the
key-down code with 0xF0 in front of it. This could be the cause of the
double letters.
clint
>Maybe early versions of RT11 choke if given disks which contain extra
>words in the directory entries...
No, *shouldn't* happen. This is said about PIP in the first version
of RT-11:
"The /Z switch clears and initializes the directory... the form of the
command is: /Z:n where n is an octal number specifying the number
of extra words per directory entry."
All the RT-11 utilities have always gone to great pains to be compliant
with directory entries that have extra words. On the other hand, some
third party software hasn't been so kind, and my experience with HT-11
has been that there are some intentional and some unintentional
incompatibilities.
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
>Ok, it looks like the only way I have of getting source code from the 'net
>on to the disks is to use EDIT and the "stuff text down the serial line"
>hack in hyperterm.
Well, that's not the only way. There are a number of ways to get
a PDP-11 directly on the net, and there's a wide variety of network-
connectible machines that can read and write 8" floppies.
> 1) Open a new file.
> 2) Go into Insert Mode
> 3) Exit insert mode and save the file.
Seeing as how you'll be "stuffing text down the serial line", the
easier way is probably to use PIP to make the source file. For example:
.R PIP
*MYSORC.MAC=TT:
(at this point you stuff the text down the serial line, probably with
a delay between characters and lines)
<Control-Z>
*<Control-C>
You now have the text you want in MYSORC.MAC.
The EDIT.SAV executable you have is probably a rather vanilla version
of TECO. Just to verify, try this (I use the convention that $ is
ESCAPE or ALTMODE):
.R EDIT
*EWTEST.MAC$$ (this opens TEST.MAC for output)
*I
This is some text.$$
*V$$
This is some text.*
EX$$
.R PIP
*TT:=TEST.MAC
This is some text.
*^C
Later versions of RT-11 have an EDIT.SAV that is *not* TECO. (For
a long time, TECO.SAV didn't come with the distribution media - at
least as an immediately obvious file - but as of 5.7 it's back.)
--
Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com
Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/
7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917
Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927
>Using a DEC RX01/02? if not RT-11 format will NOT owrk on the H11 disk.
>You must use the heath H11 formatter (or I think the switch must be in
>RX01 mode). In either case the H11 disk system is very different from
>the DEC save for RX01 media compatability.
Good point...
>Alsi did you "init" the disks? the didks need to be init'd to establish
>the RT-11 directory. The command in .INIT DXn:
As we've been mentioning, V2C was too early in RTs life to have either
CCL or DCL, so there is no init command (which would run DUP, but there
is no DUP). Running PIP and issuing 'ddn:/Z[/N:n]' is the correct way
to lay down an RT file structure on a volume which has been formatted.
Aha... found the problem with the boot command I gave earlier... it
should have been
.R PIP
*DX1:A=DX1:MONITR.SYS/U
*This* writes the bootstrap... /O actually does a boot.
Just for completeness, the options for V2C PIP (and I would suspect
V2B as well) are:
/A Ascii file transfer
/B Formatted binary
/C Only include files with current date
/D delete specified file
/E list directory, include empty space
/F list directory, short form (filenames only)
/G Ignore input errors during file transfer
/I Image mode (default)
/K For bad block scan, list absolute block numbers
/L list directory
/M:n File position for magtape or cassette tape
/N:n Number of segments (used with /Z)
/O Bootstrap the specified device
/R Rename file (new=old)
/S Compress (squeeze) device - not the same as a
file compress, which encodes the file, this simply
moves the files to the beginning of a volume, and
all the empty space toward the end (remember, RT-11
file structure uses contiguous files)
/T Extend number of blocks allocated for a file
/U Write bootstrap to volume
/V Print version number of PIP
/W Include absolute starting block number for directory
listings
/X copy files individually without combining...
/Y Must be used to perform operations on .SYS and .BAD files
/Z[:n] Zero directory (with 'n' extra words per directory entry)
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
