test-drb February 1999

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

178 participants
709 discussions

Tek 4050 series (was:Re: Questions on the days finds)

by Philip.Belben＠pgen.com

>>And also that the command for direct access to machine code level was NOT >>proffered to the customers. Some of the field guys would provide it to >>customers that they liked, but it was not policy to do so. Certainly, >>also, some of the more knowledgeable users hacked it. >> >>Unfortunately, I have long since forgotten it :{ > > Arrggg! I can't believe you forgot that! That's like saying you found > the holy grail, then lost it! > > Joe >> >> - don Don, I'd almost rather you hadn't said that. Were you deliberately trying to raise false hopes? I am going to have a long look through the documentation I have - including several years' back issues of Tekniques, the 4050 series newsletter, and see what I can find out. Meanwhile, if you remember _anything_, PLEASE TELL US! Philip.

25 years, 10 months

AS/400 tape (5763) available

by nerdware＠laidbak.com

Hello, group. Especially you big iron folks..... Going through several piles of surplus stuff at the shop where I keep my workbench, I came across a couple of AS/400 things. One is a tape, still sealed, labeled "System Program V3. 5763 -- PT1 and other programs." The other is a book, still sealed, titled "IBM AS/400 Redbooks Collection Kit, April 1997" If interested, email me off-list. Thank you for your time. We now return you to the classic comp list, already in progress. Paul Braun NerdWare -- The History of the PC and the Nerds who brought it to you. nerdware(a)laidbak.com www.laidbak.com/nerdware

25 years, 10 months

Latest find: Apple ][c+ w/no disks

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 99-02-15 22:08:05 EST, you write: > I just picked up an Apple ][c+ (enhanced ][c, w/3.5" internal floppy > and 4.0Mhz 65C02) with monitor, stand, mouse and two Imagewriter I printers > for the princely sum of $15, but lack modern software. All I have is a > couple of 5.25" DOS 3.3 floppies from my ][+ days. I know this thing works: > it boots and runs DOS 3.3; what I need is something a little newer. > > Did Apple ever post ProDOS to the 'net like they have made older versions > of MacOS available? Does DOS 3.3 support 3.5" 800K floppies (probably not). > Is there a good repository for Apple ][ software on ftp somewhere? > lucky dog! the //c+ is a nice machine and is the only // series model i am missing now. you'll only be able to run prodos on 3.5 although you can always plug in an external 5.25 and use that. nibble magazine used to sell dos 3.3 that was patched to run on 3.5 drives. it split each 800k disk into 2 400k volumes. i dont remember what they called it; have to look in my old magazines. there are two places on the net that are called 'ground' and 'asimov' that i've been told are some pretty good repositories of just about any apple // program. someone will be able to post the URLs, i'm sure. david

25 years, 10 months

Televideo 802 computer?

by edick＠idcomm.com

The 802 is the integrated computer/terminal unit. Call it a super-smart terminal if you like, but it is a relatively convenient version of what wasn't available much of the time back when these were current (early '80's). It is not merely a terminal, though it will fill that function nicely. Dick ---------- > From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Televideo 802 computer? > Date: Tuesday, January 26, 1999 10:18 AM > > George, > > Are you talking about the 802 (which someone said is a terminal) or are > you talking about the computer? (model number ???) > > If you mean the computer then I listed it but I wasn't offering. It's > still at the store. I was hoping they might turn up the computer. If you > need a copy, I'll see about getting it and making you a copy. If I don't > find the computer sooner or later then you may end up with the original. > > If you mean the terminal manual then it's also still at the store but I > don't want it so if you do then let me know and I'll see about getting it > for you. > > Joe > > At 11:12 AM 1/26/99 -0800, you wrote: > >I actually have one of these with no docs... Who was it that was offering > >a manual? > > > >George > > > >========================================================= > >George L. Rachor george(a)racsys.rt.rain.com > >Beaverton, Oregon http://racsys.rt.rain.com > >United States of America Amateur Radio : KD7DCX > > > >On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Richard Erlacher wrote: > > > >> It seems to me that the 802 was a televideo terminal with an integrated > >> workstation. These worked in conjunction with a server unit to run an OS > >> called MOST, I believe, and I have a couple of the server units, the number > >> of which will occur to me when I look at one again. > >> > >> These were fairly late technology, using 64k DRAMS and a 4MHz Z80A. The > >> servers had four or five serial ports using Z80 SIO's and either 10 or 20 > >> MB winchesters to go with their 5-1/4" floppies. They used the > >> WD1000-series HDC, which used an 8X300 microcontroller (I2L technology, > >> Harvard architecture) and the WD1000 5-chip set. I always admired the > >> packaging technology, which was first rate. > >> > >> I have to believe the workstations were up to the same standard in > >> convenient packaging. Televideo was late getting into the desktop > >> workstation market, but did it in a big way with these numbers, as they had > >> all you could want. The OS was purported, by some users I knew, to be > >> quite a bit superior to MPM, which was quite established at that time (late > >> '70's, early '80's). > >> > >> If anyone is interested in the server units, I can make them available, > >> less drives, and possibly a couple of SIO/2's which I scavenged years ago, > >> for the packaging/shipping cost. > >> > >> Dick > >> > >> ---------- > >> > From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> > >> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > >> <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > >> > Subject: Televideo 802 computer? > >> > Date: Tuesday, January 26, 1999 2:35 AM > >> > > >> > Does anyone have one of these? I found a manual for one of these > >> yesterday > >> > and it looks pretty cool. > >> > > >> > Joe > >> > > > >

25 years, 10 months

Floppy/Parallel Ports

by Roger＠Sinasohn.com

Does anyone know of any early (pre-1990) computers, other than the early Toshibas, that used the parallel port to access an external floppy drive (or other external storage device)? Thanks!

25 years, 10 months

Intergraph Clipper hardware

by cube＠msn.fullfeed.com

What you want is an Intergraph InterPro. Stay away from the InterVue (huge cabinetry, with motors for the monitor platform and digitizing surface, etc) and InterActs. (I have an InterPro 2000, dual screen machine). The first InterPro was actually based on National 32000 chips. But after that, they were all Clippers. Intergraph ended up bying the Clipper part of the business from Fairchild, then a few years later went NT/Intel. An InterPro 2000, 2020, etc. would do nicely. Although many were dual screen, you can actually operate them with just one screen (and it might be possible to disable the 2nd screen hardware -- I have never tried that with mine though). Wisconsin DOT has been unloading quite a few of these of late, and they show up at the U. Wisconsin "SWAP" sale (every Friday -- they moved recently to the East side of Madison, WI) occasionally from that source. I paid about $50 for mine (but got a PS/2 server loaded with SCSI drives as part of the big box of stuff I got). Their Unix operating system, CLIX, was largely System V based, with TCP/IP networking from Lachmann and Assosciates. Intergraph recently released Y2K software for the beasties. Best of luck. Jay Jaeger At 01:57 AM 2/9/99 -0800, Kevan Heydon wrote: > >Hi, > >I would like to get a Clipper CPU based workstation but know very little >about what models were made. Does anybody have any information on what >machines Intergraph made. I do know that some models were huge dual >display + tablet systems. I don't have the room for these but if they did >smaller deskside or even desktop systems then these would be of interest. > >Many Thanks > >-- >Kevan > >Collector of old computers: http://www.heydon.org/kevan/collection/ > --- Jay R. Jaeger The Computer Collection Jay.Jaeger(a)msn.fullfeed.com visit http://www.msn.fullfeed.com/~cube

25 years, 10 months

FS: *SEALED* IBM DOS 3.30 sets/5.25 AND 3.5" disks included

by rhblake＠bigfoot.com

I have just gotten 5 copies of IBM Disk Operating System Version 3.30 with 2-5.25" 360k and 1-3.5" 720k disks included. These are like brand new, never opened. Asking $6.50 per unit, plus $5 priority mailing in the lower 48 US states. AK and HI as well as APO/FPO may be more, will have to see on a case by case basis. First come, first served. Money orders only, please! I bought the box of 6 sets to get one copy for myself at $40.00 and $6.50 is about what each copy cost me, so I won't make any money at all on this. I know there are those that would love to have this for that classic, or to have with other verions of DOS. These are the small format manuals, not the encased notebooks so you don't have to worry about pages getting torn out later. I have calculated shipping from me to California, Chicago, NYC and Tampa to come up with a rate that is within a few cents of actual, hence the $5.00 shipping. All of the locations yielded a $5.40 priority mailing and regular rate is real close to that. If you want a copy email me directly at RHBLAKE(a)BIGFOOT.COM so I can give you a mailing address for payment. Not sure of my reputation? Many of you have bought and traded with me on eBay and on the lists so my reputation for delivering what I post preceeds me. I'm not doing this to get rich, just to fulfill my own nasty habit and spread the wealth among other with the same "disease".

25 years, 10 months

Books

by Philip.Belben＠pgen.com

> I still program for the PET, but these days, for speed of developement, I > use VICE and emulate the PET on my SPARCstation. I did finally manage to > port Zork I from the C-64 to the 40-col BASIC 2 PET. Something about > BASIC 4 is clobbering bits of memory, but I don't know where (could be the > DS/DS$ stuff; it s very convoluted). I can't remember about DS and DS$, but these may use some formerly unused page 0 locations. I do recall though that the 8000 series used the former table screen line status bytes (whether the first or second half of an 80-character line), which was not needed when screen lines were 80 character anyway, for a lot of things used in the new screen management routines. The Fat 40, however, did need the screen line status bytes, and stuck the screen management junk at the end of the 2nd cassette buffer. So Cassette #2 can only be used for loading and saving programs on the fat 40. Other data gets corrupted. Anyway, West should contain it all, so best of luck when you get your copy... Philip.

25 years, 10 months

Australian resuce

by dburrows＠netpath.net

The following is one of the type of instruments I have serviced for many years and it normally came with a PDP8 and many were upgraded to a PDP11 data system. If anyone is interested in details contact them directly to find out more. With the info they have on their configuration I would be able to give some help on details. Dan Newsgroups: sci.techniques.mass-spec From: Carl Braybrook <carl(a)rsc.anu.edu.au> Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 13:30:31 +1100 Subject: VG 70/70 FREE TO GOOD HOME Organization: Australian National University Hi We have an old 70/70 system sitting in a back room taking up space. If we can't find anyone interested in taking it off our hands we will be forced to junk it. Anyone with a real interest, please contact me at the Research School of Chemistry, Austarlian National University, Canberra Australia. tel # 02 6249 3570, or e-mail me on carl(a)rsc.anu.edu.au

25 years, 10 months

Questions on the days finds

by Philip.Belben＠pgen.com

>> Yes but what's interesting is that the bit-slice 4052 is software >> compatible with the 6800 powered 4051!!! The 4052 is a 16 bit machine. I'm >> guessing that Tektronix used the bit slice CPU so that they could retain >> the same software but gain the power of the 16 bit system. > > From what I recall (looking at Philip's 4052 service docs), the > instruction set is not identical. There's at least one 6800 instruction > missing on the 4052. And there are (of course) some extra instructions on > the 4052 that aren't on the 6800. That's why some ROMs are 4052 and later > only. IIRC, the only 6800 instruction not present on the 4052/54/52A/54A was DAA - decimal addition adjustment. Since the 6800 has no decimal subtraction adjustment, it was pretty useless anyway. The main difference is the 128K byte address space. Two bits in the processor status register were used for the 17th address bit (most significant) - one for instruction fetches (default 1) and one for data load/store (default 0). Most of the additional instructions manipulated these. Nice features included: if you changed the bit for the instruction fetches, it didn't actually change until the next ALUOUT -> PC microcode instruction, i.e. branch or jump. > At the hardware level, the 4052 is 16 bit. But the microcode implements > an 8 bit processor - the 16 bit operations are used for calculating > addresses only. IIRC there are hardware features (like separate odd and > even ROMs) that would make it easy to make it a true 16 bit machine. But > it wasn't. Almost exactly. And it's not just separate odd and even ROMs - it has separate odd and even address buses! These hardware features do speed it up, though. The other main application of the 16 bit data path was that 2-byte instructions were fetched with a single memory cycle, and this happens quite often. The odd/even address logic meant this could be done at an odd or an even address and still work. My guess is that the hardware guys put a lot of work into that architecture, wanting to make it both nice and 16bit and like the 6800. Unfortunately, this took rather a long time, so the software guys just wrote a 6800 near-emulator in microcode so as to speed the software migration process. But this is just a guess. Philip.

25 years, 10 months

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test-drb February 1999