The LISA (1) originally shipped with dual 5 1/4" floppy drives which
were nick-named twiggy drives. I don't have all the gory details but
Apple manufactured these drives and they were a disaster. All the
information you need can be found at Eric Smith's web site entitled
Twiggy Disk information:
www.brouhaha.com/~eric/retrocomputing/lisa/twiggy.html
Marty
______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Re: Lisa battery leakage??
Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet
Date: 8/10/98 3:36 PM
[Twiggy]
What's a twiggy?
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Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 12:33:27 -0700
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From: "Daniel A. Seagraves" <DSEAGRAV(a)toad.xkl.com>
To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers"
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: Lisa battery leakage??
In-Reply-To: <v04011710b1f3f04e4406(a)[207.220.32.133]>
X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN
>Hmmmm, now this sounds ponentially very cool! According to the Field
>Guide this is a "Dilog ST-506 emulation of four RL01/02". Any one have
>info on this, and will it work in a system that has actually RL02 drives
>attached? It would make it a lot easier to get data on to the Hard Drive
>if I can just copy it from a RL02 to a fake RL02.
They should work, but only if you set them up to run at an address
different from the standard address for RLseries disks.
>How well do Boards with Boot ROMs co-exist with systems with another set
>of Boot ROMs? I'm threatening to throw the DQ606 in the 11/23 that I'm
>working on, so I can access the rack of drives that go with the
>controller.
Depending on the boot rom, a standard address is 773000. You can't have
two sets of boards which respond the this address (and there isn't a
standard I am aware of for assigning alternate boot code to an address).
On systems which I have configured which had boot code on the controller
card, the standard boot code had to be disabled.
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of ' ' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
I don't really trust the one RX-50 drive I've got, and I seem to recall
that it is possible to hook up a 1.2Mb floppy from a PC drive as 1/2 of a
RX-50 drive. Is there anything special that needs to be done, or do I just
plug it in?
Zane
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |
Please pardon if this has already been answered... I've been away for
a week at the Worldcon (world science fiction convention)
>I have a really compact "PDP-11/23S" chassis that has an 18-bit Q-Bus
>backplane (4xQuad) in it. Although the circuitry for the Q-Bus is on
>traces of a PC card, there are also wirewrap pins extending out from
>the backplane. Am I naive to assume that I can convert this to a
>22-bit Q-Bus by wirewrapping four or so lines? Any pointers on how to
>do this or on technique?
Not naive at all... I've done it on at least one of my H9270 backplanes
at home... I know of many others who have as well. If I remember
correctly, you need to buss the BC-BF lines (and for Q-Q backplanes,
DC-DF), but I would have to verify this...
Megan Gentry
Former RT-11 Developer
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry zk3.dec.com |
| Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg world.std.com |
| Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of ' ' |
| 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ |
| Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler |
| (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg |
+--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
On Aug 10, 6:42, Ethan Dicks wrote:
> Subject: Re: DQ614 and other Q-Bus questions
> On Sun Aug 9, 15:20, Zane H. Healy <healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com> wrote:
> > Hmmmm, now this sounds ponentially very cool! According to the Field
Guide
> > this is a "Dilog ST-506 emulation of four RL01/02".
Yes, it is. I think I might have been responsible for that highly
informative entry ;-)
> > Any one have info on
> > this, and will it work in a system that has actually RL02 drives
attached?
> > It would make it a lot easier to get data on to the Hard Drive if I can
> > just copy it from a RL02 to a fake RL02.
>
> Presuming that it can be strapped at the alternate address (DLB0 on a
uVAX,
> for example. Dunno the CSR), it should work fine.
It needs a different PROM to switch the address/vector. The standard PROM
at U38 is labelled 91265D (according to my old notes) and the
alternate-address PROM is labelled 91578A (old notes again). YMMV :-)
> > What kind of Hard Drives will work with it?
>
> The one I have used to have a Rodime 10 Mb 5.25" full-height MFM drive
> attached to it. I'd love to hear if an ST-251 would work.
Again, it should. It should be capable of using up to two ST-412 interface
drives to emulate up to four RL02s, though I never tried mine with more
than one. IIRC there's a small overhead, so you need slightly more than
20MB to emulate two drives.
> > Is there any kind of setup for it? There is a funky 20-pin connecter
> > marked J3 that might be for jumpers or a ribbon cable though I don't
really
> > want to try to attach a ribbon cable to it, as it's rather wierdly
attached.
>
> It's an ST-506 interface - 20 pin for analog data (one per drive, up to 4
> supported, depending on the exact nature of the controller in question),
> and 34 pin (digital signals) for control (one per controller, including
> up to 4 drive select wires).
Two physical drives, in this case.
> > Does it have any kind of boot ROMs?
>
> Almost certainly not. It is a register-level emulation of the RLV11 or
RLV12
> (don't know which one). It would use the regular DL boot ROM on your
system.
It does have a bootstrap, but I think the emulation is RLV11 (it's to old
to be RLV12, I think). You can switch the bootstrap off, though. The code
will boot either a DY or DL device.
> > Any idea on how well it would co-exist with a DQ606?
>
> No idea.
Me neither. I don't have the full docs, just a pair of layout diagrams,
switch table, and a few bits about formatting. Unfortnately, all the
formatting stuff seems to use a program which I don't think I have handy.
At the back end of the board is either a 34+20 pin connector, or two
individual headers. As Ethan said, the 34-way is the control bus
(daisy-chained like floppies for multiple drives) and the 20-way is the
data. J3 is the second 20-pin data connector (for the second physical
drive). Pin 1 of the 34-way connector is the end nearest the LED, and the
other connectors are fitted in the same orientation.
There are five switches:
S1 ON = ECC used to transparently correct errors where possible
OFF = ECC ignored; used for diagnostics
S2 ON = bootstrap enabled
OFF = bootstrap disabled
S3,S4 Identify the last logical RL unit on physical drive 0. So
the settings are as follows:
S3 S4 Physical 0 Physical 1
off off DL0 Dl1, DL2, DL3
off on DL0, DL1 DL2, DL3
on off DL0, DL1, DL2 DL3
on on DL0, DL1, DL2, DL3
S5 ON = use secondary address for bootstrap ROM: 175000
OFF = use primary address for bootstrap ROM: 173000
Factory setting is all switches off.
There are 10 jumpers:
JP1 (near U22) removed (etch cut) allows data loopback for diagnostics.
JP2 (near U32) removed (etch cut) aborts controller pre-comp logic when
writing, for diagnostics.
JP3,4,5 (near U70) sets interrupt levels:
level JP3 JP4 JP5
4 B-C B-C B-C
5 B-C B-C A-B
6 B-C A-B B-C
7 A-B A-B B-C
JP6 (near U22) "Must be removed"
JP7 (near U22) "Must be removed"
JP8 (near U5) "Must be removed"
JP9 (near U32) "Must be installed"
JP (near U32) "A-B must be installed, A-C must be removed"
There's also a socket for a special (customer) bootstrap at U38.
That's about all I can tell you, I'm afraid. I'll have a look for a copy
of the formatting program (which came on an RT11 floppy, I think) but I'm
not hopeful... I don't have the controller any longer.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
Good Lord... all of a sudden, they're popping up all over the place.
Contact this fellow directly if you'd like an 11/44.
-=-=- <snip> -=-=-
On Mon, 10 Aug 1998 12:16:38 GMT, in comp.sys.dec you wrote:
>>Message-ID: <35CE15E2.7E89(a)tessellabs.com>
>>From: Asa Wilson <awilson(a)tessellabs.com>
>>Reply-To: awilson(a)tessellabs.com
>>Organization: TesselLabs
>>X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-KIT (Win95; U)
>>MIME-Version: 1.0
>>Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec
>>Subject: PDP 11/44 system available
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>>Lines: 6
>>Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 12:16:38 GMT
>>NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.74.130.98
>>NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 07:16:38 CDT
>>Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!uunet!uunet!in1.uu.net!pulsar.dimensional.com!dimensional.com!news1.i1.net!not-for-mail
>>
>>I am trying to dispose of a complete PDP 11/44 system. A flyer
>>describing the system can be viewed at http://tessellabs.com/decflyrf.
>>
>>Asa Wilson
>>
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272)
http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin -- also kyrrin [A-t] Jps {D=o=t} Net
Spam is bad. Spam is theft of service. Spam wastes resources. Don't spam, period.
I am a WASHINGTON STATE resident. Spam charged $500.00 per incident per Chapter 19 RCW.
Allison,
I'll be there too. Maybe we can talk about S-100 cards then. :)
Tony
> -----Original Message-----
> From: allisonp(a)world.std.com [mailto:allisonp@world.std.com]
> Sent: Monday, August 10, 1998 9:09 AM
> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
> Subject: MIT flea,
>
>
> I plan to be at the MIT FLEA sunday the 16th, with loads of
> goodies for
> older systems and a stack of vax 3100s.
>
> Also over the weekend I scored a pair of compupro boxes one
> with 8085/8088
> and the other 68000 based.
>
> Also a heath HW207 8" disk (dual drive)
> pragmatic designs 20mb sa4000 style disk
> Hard disks mfm
> software, software, software and manuals.
> enough Compupro boards to build another three systems
> A few intergrand disk boxen
> some DD DS 8" drives
> 8" 2S Media!
> A few Telvideo 9xx series terminals.
>
> If people need DOCs for compupro boards (ANY!!!) I have docs for them
> and a few others.
>
> Also I have a line on a ANADEX wide platen (15") printer that has
> serial/parallel interface. I have to many already. It's a
> nice one if
> you need something that takes wide paper. Not shipable (cheaply that
> is, as it would have to be crated to assure "arrive alive".)
> It's not
> that heavy but large.
>
> Allison
>
< To be honest, I think that programming a SLIP interface would be a
< complete waste of time. No service providers I know of allow SLIP
< connections anymore. PPP would be the better choice.
Please, dont say that... all my net access is using slip (actaully slirp).
Allison
< We have heard that the 680 was a failure
< because the 16k memory card for it cost more than
< the computer. Take a look at this list and you
It was a failure because MITS as per their style had a nifty box that
not SS50. By that time SWTP and others had accepted SS50 as the bus for
6800 and later 6809 systems.
The 680 however was without question industrial strength but it's bus
was totally unique to the 680, that type of this was VERY unpopular
concept back then.
Allison
I saw a Tandy 1000 HX at a local once a year flea market friday and was
wondering if the expansion cards it uses (non-standard) are hard to come
by. I'd like to get it and use it as a dial-in terminal with either a 300
or 1200 baud modem, whatever is available. This is one of the one-piece
1000s, and there's no RS-232 port, or DIN serial port connector on it, just
joysticks, ext. floppy, and printer connector, the last two are edge-type
connectors.
Maybe I'll pick it up tomorrow. I love these yearly Hospice Flea Markets:
Everything starts off at full price, Friday and Saturday. Sunday, all the
prices drop by 50%, Monday, you give them a few bucks, and they'll let you
cart off anything that is left. I hope the tradition still stands this
year. I saw a Timex Sinclair 1000 (black, mebrane keyboard) along with some
cassettes and mem expansion boxes for $5.00. If it's still there, I might
pick it up if someone wants it. (What?!? He's not putting it on ebay to get
$500.00 bucks for it? Is he crazy???) Yes I are!
-
- john higginbotham ____________________________
- webmaster www.pntprinting.com -
- limbo limbo.netpath.net -
