test-drb March 1998

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

167 participants
859 discussions

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 15, 8:33, Tim Shoppa wrote: > Subject: Re: What's with the raw HTML? > [ snip ] but to me > the real standard is: > > Flat text should be sent as flat text. I couldn't agree more :-) > The number of MIME-encoded flat text documents I receive every day is > just plain silly. And with this. That's why I don't even bother to read a lot of that stuff, unless the Subject: line and/or From: makes me think I need to. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

26 years, 10 months

What's with the raw HTML?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Mar 15, 10:09, Dan Stephans II wrote: > Subject: Re: What's with the raw HTML? > Umm, HTML is pretty much a standard no matter what platform you are on as it > is most certainly not platform dependent. The standard for 1.1 is specified > in RFC 2068 and for 1.0 in RFC 1945. Sure, but that's not really the issue. In any case, M$ blatantly ignore those standards. > If you mean that there are not standard > tools to read html'ized mail under unix/linux, I say Netscape is available > for almost any linux and most other unices running on sparc/intel/alpha > hardware. HTML is a markup language designed for web pages. Netscape is primarily designed for web pages, not mail. It is a very inefficient tool for mail. And what if you're not running X Windows? I completely agree with Allison and others, that HTML has no place in textual mail. It is completely unneccessary, and wastes both bandwidth and time. I suspect you agree, at least in part, with that. > I don't argue that HTML rich text is fine for mailing lists, > however if you are going to argue that it is not you should formulate a > proper argument. > > Cheers, > > Dan > > Allison J Parent wrote: > > > <Text. If the e-mail that you wish to respond to's in plain text, that's > > <what it'll send. The problem is that if M$ supports it, the WHOLE WORLD > > <suddenly has to all have HTML-ized e-mail readers. It's nice if you hav > > <it, but a pain in the A** if you don't. > > > > There is the little matter of some several million (or more) unix(linux, > > and related cuzins) systems out there where HTML is far from a standard. > > For me and many of the hybrid users HTML means slow, slower and special > > utilities to handle it and for what? What a waste of bandwidth. > > > > Allison -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

26 years, 10 months

What's with the raw HTML?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Aaah, I see! When it comes to system stability, you Linux geeks come >from all over saying how you can DEVELOP patches, but when we have some software that you don't, where is that trusty gcc? huh? huh? But seriously, is it so hard to patch Linux mail for HTML? >There is the little matter of some several million (or more) unix(linux, >and related cuzins) systems out there where HTML is far from a standard. >For me and many of the hybrid users HTML means slow, slower and special >utilities to handle it and for what? What a waste of bandwidth. > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

26 years, 10 months

Update on Sun3 and shoebox

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Well, I was finally able to make two QIC tapes (boot and install) using NetBSD for x86. The tape drive ran fine, with no errors. So then I hooked the shoebox up to the 3/50 that I have, and using the monitor, issued "b st(0,6,0)" to boot from the tape. The 3/50 seems to access the drive (I can see the heads move), but either aborts with a "Device Not Found" error, or the following: scsi getbyte failed invalid status message = FFFFFFFF st: sense key = 6 error = 29 I'm not able to get any further than this. Any thoughts?? Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) ClubWin! Charter Member (6) MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking ============================================

26 years, 10 months

E-mail bloat

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

[Viewing an attached word file on an HP-UX] a)Most people working on PCs with Word have no idea what an HP-UX is b)Most such people have no idea that there is a machine on the planet not running word c)Most such people don't even realize that they are running word or attaching a word format file to email It is a byproduct of things being easy to use. Same reason as many americans have no idea where England is. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

26 years, 10 months

Arrrgh! Micro$h*t again....

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I mean it's "software for the the masses," everything's a black box. If t <Win 95 registry gets hosed, re-install the whole OS (I've yet to remedy It's why win3.1 is the windowing system on my dosbox. It's stable enough for me and my standard is VAX/VMS (24x7x365 and it's no joke!). But I had to work to get it that way. <damaged registry by restoring a backup), then all your apps (10 or 15 in <case); it's a full 10 hour project for me, even with Win95 and most apps <CD, and any install diskettes loaded on a single Zip disk. Windows(3.x, 95, ???) is the only OS that ever needed to reload to fix! VMS files that are that critical can be protected to the stars if need be. <Linux/Unix OTOH, if it's screwed up, just figure out which script to fix While I'm not excited about linux yet, I've never seen it eat itself either. <I think if there were only one target to go after, Gates would have the <"owners" of Linux in his board room tomorrow, trying to pressure them int <selling out so he could eliminate the threat. I wonder if he's tried to <romance Linus yet? Wouldn't do him much as the OS is PD and even if successivve versions weren't it would be hard to lock that market. <>But AFAIK, Gates's BASIC <>interpreter for the altair required a RAM add-on pack! Truly bloatware <>from day one. Why Gates decided to flip the switches on the front <>panel several thousand extra times mystifies me. Maybe that's why <>you're all getting Altairs with worn out switches;) HUH? What? The altairs needed 4k of ram to run 4k basic and 8k to run 8kbasic. Basic8k for altair was only about 6100 bytes. THere were smaller basics but all of them gave up something, like floating point or strings. As to the switch flipping, that was due to the crummy MITS 88ACR that would often require several tries to get a clean load. After it BASIC loaded the switches were an artifact though to could input data via port FFh under program control. To beat the need to pound switches I put a small 64byte bootrom on a board and copied the loaded image to phase encoded digital tape(home brew) to get from the slow error prone 300baud to a zippy and I may add very reliable 4800. Don't blame the cow for soggy cereal. I would say that 8kbasic was the first decent software product from MS though it was soon to change in the early 80s. FYI the Extended BASIC interpreter for CP/M-80 and the BASCOM Compiler for CP/M-80 were excellent products. Neither were bloatware by any standard. Allison

26 years, 10 months

What's with the raw HTML?

by cgregory＠lrbcg.com

I don't want to be the skunk at the lawn party here, but it should be pointed out that e-mail is fast becoming the communication medium of choice for both business and pleasure. I suppose you could argue that there is no need for a company to have a fancy letterhead, nor a mass mailer to have colored brochures, nor ladies to have flowered and/or scented stationery, yet we do have all these things, and more. Consider how boring text-only, fixed-font mail would be. Or did Henry Ford have it right when he proclaimed that all we really "needed" was black automobiles? Yes, I understand the argument that in the case of snail mail, the sender pays for all the frills, but in the case of e-mail, the recipient more than likely pays with longer download times, disk clutter, etc. A very valid and not trivial point. Nevertheless, technology marches on, and as cable modems (or whatever) become the norm rather than the exception, "waste" of bandwidth and its associated costs will cease to an issue with the computing public at large. If my wife wants to embed scanned newspaper clippings or a kid's picture in an email to her cousin across country, who am I (or anyone) to object? I don't disagree with much that has been said here on the subject. I don't use HTML formatted e-mail, and don't especially like receiving it, nonetheless I accept that sooner or later it will become the norm (I don't like the term "standard") rather than the exception. Formatted email may never be, nor probably should be, appropriate on a classic computer mailing list; yet, who knows, in ten years or so the definition of "classic computer" may change as well. Cliff Gregory cgregory(a)lrbcg.com -----Original Message----- From: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> To: Cgregory <Cgregory> Date: Sunday, March 15, 1998 3:14 PM Subject: Re: What's with the raw HTML? > >You missed the point. There is no argument. As far as I'm concerned, >there's absolutely no point to sending e-mail as HTML. > >Allison said it best though... > >> What a waste of bandwidth. > >And how. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- >Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass > > Coming Soon...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > >

26 years, 10 months

IIGS

by francois.auradon＠worldnet.att.net

>> Also it was connected to an Apple IIe via a super serial port on the GS and >> an I/O controller on the IIe side. Is that some sort of "Networking"? There >> was no disk drive attached to the IIe. > >Either someone's idea of a joke or thrift shop ignorance. Well actaully the guy pointed to the IIe when I asked about the keyboard. They probably thought the the IIe WAS the keyboard! BTW what kind of problems can I expect with the ROM 01 (wich is the one I have)? ------------------------------------------------------------- Francois Visit the Sanctuary at: http://home.att.net/~francois.auradon

26 years, 10 months

Getting bent (ON topic if not thread)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<And in my experience, IC's are not that easy to damage by overheating. <I've soldered and desoldered hundreds of chips and never once overheated <one. Yes I do use a temperature controlled iron, etc. FYI in the old days when people would salvage chips of old unmarked cards a popular way to remove them was a propane torch and pliers! Obviously the board would get toasted but you could get the chips off fairly clean and fast. Though once I seriously over did it on the heat. The result is a old 7400 that is bent some in the middle...it still worked! I also made copper heads with the right shape for round, 16pin and even 40pin footprints that I would use a ungar element to heat and desolder chips cleanly from the board. I've also lifted chips by passing the board through the wave solder machine that put them down to start with. No majik, just carefull application of heat. The trick is heating all of the pins or finding a way that doesn't require all of them to be heated at once. Allison

26 years, 10 months

Hitachi 2.8" (was Re: Preserving old floppies, fixed disks...)

by adavie＠mad.scientist.com

I have some disks from an unreleased drive for the Radofin Aquarius II computer - but, unfortunately, I have no drive. "Hitachi 2.8 inch drive" is mentioned in the leaflet I have - can anyone shed any light on this drive, and the possibility of obtaining something which might read the disks? You can see the disks and drive @ http://www.comcen.com.au/~adavie/weird/aquarius/aqdisk.jpg http://www.comcen.com.au/~adavie/weird/aquarius/floppy.jpg A

26 years, 10 months

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test-drb March 1998