26 Apr
2000
26 Apr
'00
4:08 a.m.
I have an Apple II with a Z80 card, and lots of CP/M disks for it but I'm
having a problem opening the .ASM and .BAS files. I thumbed through a book
on both Mbasic and CP/M but neither of these books clearly describe how to
work with these files.
The Mbasic books says to open Mbasic, and at the "OK" prompt type RUN
"B:MAINT.BAS" (for example)but when I do that, it gives me a "Direct
Statement in file" message, and then it goes back to the "OK" prompt.
I don't have a clue how to work with the .ASM files -like SUPRTRK3.ASM or
BLKFRI2.ASM. I can see that they are games by typing TYPE SUPRTRK3.ASM but
the text flies by so fast that I can't see much else.
I have a lot of disks that have nothing but .BAS and .ASM files so any help
that you can give me would be appreciated.
Also, I have one disk that has a single large file called PILOTA.LST. What
do I do with that?
Thanks for your help.
Ernest
26 Apr
26 Apr
4:42 a.m.
In Mbasic try:
LOAD "B:FILENAME.BAS"
then you can list/modify it.
Could also be that the .bas files are written for the other popular CP/M
basic : CBASIC.
The .ASM files need to be compiled to run I think. If I recall the
assembler is called MASM on your system disk.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
5:20 a.m.
In Mbasic try:
LOAD "B:FILENAME.BAS"
then you can list/modify it.
Could also be that the .bas files are written for the other popular CP/M
basic : CBASIC.
Or for a different version of the same BASIC. MBASIC 4.51 and MBASIC 5.03
had changes in their tokenizing. To convert between, the best way is to
find the version of BASIC that's right for the file, load the file, and
SAVE "B:FILENAME.BAS" ,A
to save in full text rather than tokenized. you can then save again
without the ,A from the new version.
Or, there may any of a variety of other corruptions of the file.
"Direct Statement in File" can come up from almost any line in the file
that BASIC can't parse.
The .ASM files need to be compiled to run I think. If
I recall the
assembler is called MASM on your system disk.
<Picky>
It's called ASSEMBLED, although the difference between that and COMPILED
would be of interest to few outside this list.
MASM is the "Macro assembler". Look for ASM.COM on the system disk.
</Picky>
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
27 Apr
27 Apr
2:42 a.m.
It sounds like I'm probably using the wrong BASIC, from the suggestions that
I've received. Thanks, by the way. So my next question would be, is there a
way to find out which version of BASIC I should be using by looking at the
program in a text editor, or something like that? I think that some of these
programs may tell me in the introduction lines but I know that at least some
of them don't.
Also, what would be the reason that someone would distribute their programs
in .ASM form, instead of in .COM form? Is this so that other people can edit
or change them before they use them? That could be good, I guess but it
seems like a lot of extra work for the end user (me.)
These disks were produced by an old CP/M user group, and they are labeled by
disk number (5a, 5b, 28a, 28b for example,) and they are a confusing mess.
Some of the programs have files scattered between numerous disks, mixed in
with bits and pieces of other programs. Sheesh. It's going to take some
time to sort this headache out. I must be out of my mind.
Ernest
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Fred Cisin
(XenoSoft)
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 10:20 AM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Opening CP/M files (.asm/.bas)
In Mbasic try:
LOAD "B:FILENAME.BAS"
then you can list/modify it.
Could also be that the .bas files are written for the other popular CP/M
basic : CBASIC.
Or for a different version of the same BASIC. MBASIC 4.51 and MBASIC 5.03
had changes in their tokenizing. To convert between, the best way is to
find the version of BASIC that's right for the file, load the file, and
SAVE "B:FILENAME.BAS" ,A
to save in full text rather than tokenized. you can then save again
without the ,A from the new version.
Or, there may any of a variety of other corruptions of the file.
"Direct Statement in File" can come up from almost any line in the file
that BASIC can't parse.
The .ASM files need to be compiled to run I think. If
I recall the
assembler is called MASM on your system disk.
<Picky>
It's called ASSEMBLED, although the difference between that and COMPILED
would be of interest to few outside this list.
MASM is the "Macro assembler". Look for ASM.COM on the system disk.
</Picky>
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
3:35 a.m.
Also, what would be the reason that someone would
distribute their programs
in .ASM form, instead of in .COM form? Is this so that other people can edit
or change them before they use them? That could be good, I guess but it
seems like a lot of extra work for the end user (me.)
Exactly, not everyone out there is paranoid of giving away source code.
These disks were produced by an old CP/M user group,
and they are labeled by
disk number (5a, 5b, 28a, 28b for example,) and they are a confusing mess.
Some of the programs have files scattered between numerous disks, mixed in
with bits and pieces of other programs. Sheesh. It's going to take some
time to sort this headache out. I must be out of my mind.
Usually those files are compressed archives, you may need LHA, DELBR,
unarc or other tools to "open" them.
I may add most of the files you'd find are on the WC cdrom (or the online
copies of it.).
The organization of those disks were likely by date of issue.
Allison
10:11 a.m.
New subject: Genuine ADM3/a terminal Available at Computer Parts Barn
The real article. Never laid eyes on one myself until I bumped into one
at CPB.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
10:38 a.m.
New subject: Wordstar
Anyone still remember Wordstar :). I received this URL that has info,
updates, etc. for those people that still use it.
http://www.glinx.com/%7Egrifwood/WordStar.html
7:32 p.m.
New subject: Sun 3/260, Complete. Available at CPB
A sun 3/260 is available at Computer Parts Barn.
The machine consists of the complete computer and chassis, 19" (looks
like) monitor, keyboard and mouse, and SMD hard disk in a separate
enclosure. I'm told SMD hard disks on sun boxes this old is a rare
feature.
Shipping would be steep for this machine. I would guess it at 150lbs or
thereabouts. I might be underestimating a bit as well.
Anyone who needs specifics on the machine can contact Ed Kirby at
EDCPB(a)EMAIL.COM for more information. Ed will not provide the level of
detail you are looking for as far as specifications on a given machine
unless they are immediately at hand. In most cases they are not. I will
gladly go and dissassemble, spec, and test the machine if you like (see
below).
Ed can be slow to get hold of. He is not in town at the moment and it may
be a week before he reads your message. Alternately you can contact me
and when he comes back I'll give him a list of 'hits' for his gear.
I don't make a dime from Ed or anything connected with Computer Parts Barn
or my messages relating to CPB or Ed's property. I like Ed and the
concept of CPB and would like to help both him and the computing community
by disseminating information about gear I see when I visit there.
My role in these messages is to offer my services in helping you discover
exactly what it is you may be/are buying via a hands-on assessment of the
machine(s) in question by a fellow vintage computer enthusiast and
qualified technician.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
7:45 p.m.
New subject: Wierd Motorola Minicomputer available at CPB
Some kind of wierd Motorola Mini in working order is available at CPB.
Details can be had but I'd have to have a hard look at it to tell you what
it's attributes are. Let me know if you are interested and I'll detail it
for you. I think it's a 68k-based machine but that is only a guess and my
conversations with Ed Kirby (edcpb(a)e-mail.com).
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
7:49 p.m.
New subject: AT&T unix Mini available at CPB
I saw an AT&T machine at CPB my last visit. Details if you want. E-mail
me and wait a while. I'll respond to your request but have to wait for Ed
Kirby to return before I can have a close look. Could be 68k, could be
Hobbit, could be....
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
7:54 p.m.
New subject: LOTS and LOTS of Apple machines at CPB
Ed Kirby (edcpb(a)email.com) has untold numbers of Apple machines available.
Quite a few are Mac IIlc's. He also has a number of mac A/UX servers for
sale. I can help with info on the servers and install media if you need
it . A friend here in Asheville bought one and is digging at it. He has
had good success. The IIlc machines are very well pretty obvious.
Monitors and keyboards and mice are available for them as well.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
28 Apr
28 Apr
4:32 a.m.
New subject: Wordstar
On 27-Apr-2000 Marvin wrote:
Anyone still remember Wordstar :). I received this URL that has info,
updates, etc. for those people that still use it.
http://www.glinx.com/%7Egrifwood/WordStar.html
Heh! I haven't used WordStar for a loooooooooooooong time. Since
2.x days, I think. On a PCjr. I fondly remember modifying the executable
in debug to change options. Then a new version came out that had an app
that did essentially the same thing. And then WordStar 2000 came out and
I switched to word perfect 5.1.
To say that WordStar had a very strong effect on me is an understatement.
I *still* use WordStar key bindings in my editor (joe under linux,
quick edit under DOS, tse32 under GameOS). I just don't have the patience
nor the inclination to learn new stuff. Just ^KB ^KK and the rest for me.
-Philip
5:29 a.m.
New subject: Wordstar
Heh! I haven't used WordStar for a
loooooooooooooong time. Since
2.x days, I think. On a PCjr.
I wasn't aware that 2.x was available for MS-DOS. I used 2.x on CP/M (I
even once hacked it over to use the 25th line of my H19 to display the
ruler line), but the earliest I used on MS-DOS was 3.3. I believe there was
a version earlier than 3.3 on MS-DOS (3.0, maybe?), but I never ran across
it.
--
Roger Ivie
rivie(a)teraglobal.com
Not speaking for TeraGlobal Communications Corporation
7:22 a.m.
New subject: Wordstar
On 28-Apr-2000 Roger Ivie wrote:
I probably have my versions mixed up. It's been a long time and I
was very young back then.
-Philip
Heh! I
haven't used WordStar for a loooooooooooooong time. Since
2.x days, I think. On a PCjr.
I wasn't aware that 2.x was available for MS-DOS. I used 2.x on CP/M (I
even once hacked it over to use the 25th line of my H19 to display the
ruler line), but the earliest I used on MS-DOS was 3.3. I believe there
was a version earlier than 3.3 on MS-DOS (3.0, maybe?), but I never ran
across it. 
4:24 a.m.
It's been awhile since I did some real CP/M hacking so my memory of that era
may not be flawless...................
----- Original Message -----
From: Ernest <ernestls(a)home.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2000 4:42 PM
Subject: RE: Opening CP/M files (.asm/.bas)
It sounds like I'm probably using the wrong BASIC,
from the suggestions that
I've received. Thanks, by the way. So my next question would be, is there a
way to find out which version of BASIC I should be using by looking at the
program in a text editor, or something like that? I think that some of these
programs may tell me in the introduction lines but I know that at least some
of them don't.
Could you send me the BASIC program offline so I can take a look at it ?
There have been so many basic versions on the CP/M platform besides
MBASIC like CBASIC, SBASIC etc..... I would hope that it is in ASCII-format
Also, what would be the reason that someone would
distribute their programs
in .ASM form, instead of in .COM form? Is this so that other people can edit
or change them before they use them?
CP/M systems were not very compatible among themselves and some programs
had to be changed a bit before they would function on the target system. This is
especially true if the program needed to access I/O-devices. If you got the
ASM "source code" you could essentially make any alterations you needed for
your system. Sometimes these options would be given in the comments along with
the sourcecode. ASM.COM and the LOAD.COM program were part of
the CP/M packet so assembling the sourcecode was not considered a problem
in those days. A lot of people did assembly language.
The only problem was that ASM.COM would use 8080 assembly language
and ZASM of M80 would use Z80 assembly language. A lot of later CP/M
systems had a Z80 instead of an 8080/8085 chip and although the 8080 is
downward compatible on the objectcode level (the true machine instructions
level) The Z80 assembly language is VERY different from 8080 Assembly
language. So if you have ASM files you still have to determine what kind
of an assembler you would need to "compile"your code. A filename
extension like .ASM would hint in the direction of the standard 8080
assembler. I.E: in register load operations you would see the "MOV" opcode
instead of the Z80 "LD" command.
These disks were produced by an old CP/M user group, and they are labeled by
disk number (5a, 5b, 28a, 28b for example,) and they are a confusing mess.
Some of the programs have files scattered between numerous disks, mixed in
with bits and pieces of other programs. Sheesh. It's going to take some
time to sort this headache out. I must be out of my mind.
There are quite a few decent CP/M emulators for the PC. like MYZ80 and
others. If you could transfer your disks to a PC then you could start
to reorganize and test those programs on your PC with the added benefit of
a large HD with directories to sort things out. You won't see these directories
when in CP/M emulation mode but you can always go back to DOS or
WINDOZ and reorganise the stuff. An added benefit would be the fact
that you would also have a backup of those disks.
This is also practical with regard to the availability of nice ASCII-editor
on the MS-DOS platform.
I don't know from the top of my head where to get these emulators but
it should not be difficult to find them. Also look for a "22dsk144" utility
that
could
read (and maybe write) various CP/M floppies (provided you'll hook up an 1.2 MB
or 360KB 5.25" Floppydrive to your PC)
Sipke de Wal
sipke(a)wxs.nl
10:04 a.m.
Cp/M was a cross-platform operating system with several layers to provide
support for any platform for which the base functions of CP/M were
compiled. In other words, if your machine boots cp/m then you can run the
vast majority of CP/M programs. Some you won't. A good example of a
situation in which a program cannot run is if it takes advantage of
non-standard system calls to access the video subsystem. There are quite
a few of these programs but most are commercial such as CPT system
accounting, spreadsheet and word processing. The CPT had a very custom
full-page physical display.
Elsewise most all programs should compile and run but do need to be
compiled on YOUR particular architecture machine to function.
Probably the most important setting in CP/M is your terminal settings.
CP/M software will run on anything but does have to be informed as to what
termninal type (ie ADM3a, Soroc, Televideo, Etcetera) in order to operate
correctly. --
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
26 Apr
26 Apr
4:47 a.m.
New subject: Packard Bell dead?
I keep hearing rumors that Packard Bell is out of business. As a tech I
can say I haven't seen any really new ones in a while. Never a PB PII or
K6-2 machine. Whats the deal? Thier website is up and makes no mention
of any trouble.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Jeffrey S. Worley
Technical Services
Bits & Bytes Computer Services Inc.
1979B Hendersonville Road
Asheville, NC 28803
828-684-8953 - voice 0900-1700 five days
828-687-9284 - 24hr fax
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?
Technoid(a)Cheta.net
-----------------------------------------------------------
5:12 p.m.
New subject: Packard Bell dead?
From: technoid(a)cheta.net
Date sent: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:47:56 -0400
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Packard Bell dead?
Send reply to: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
I keep hearing rumors that Packard Bell is out of
business. As a tech I
can say I haven't seen any really new ones in a while. Never a PB PII or
K6-2 machine. Whats the deal? Thier website is up and makes no mention
of any trouble.
Thankfully, PB is now officially dead. They had an auction a month
or so back, and the entire Califonia plant/office was liquidated. This
included inventory, components, chairs, lights, desks......
They tried to buy some reputation a couple of years back when
they bought NEC, but a PB by any other name........
NEC continues on, I believe.
Paul Braun
NerdWare -- The History of the PC and the Nerds who brought it to you.
nerdware(a)laidbak.com
www.laidbak.com/nerdware
5:44 a.m.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ernest <ernestls(a)home.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 6:08 PM
Subject: Opening CP/M files (.asm/.bas)
I have an Apple II with a Z80 card, and lots of CP/M
disks for it but I'm
having a problem opening the .ASM and .BAS files. I thumbed through a book
on both Mbasic and CP/M but neither of these books clearly describe how to
work with these files.
The Mbasic books says to open Mbasic, and at the "OK" prompt type RUN
"B:MAINT.BAS" (for example)but when I do that, it gives me a "Direct
Statement in file" message, and then it goes back to the "OK" prompt.
See if you can edit the .BAS file with an editor (Only a ASCII .BAS file
can contain a direct statement) Then edit out the offending statment and run
it. I don't see how a tokenized .BAS file could be saved with a direct
statement.
For .ASM files you need an assembler and linker/loader program to generate
the object code (usually a .COM file). Look for another program like ZASM.COM
that may be the assembler.
8964
days inactive
8966
days old
19 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
allisonp＠world.std.com -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
ernestls＠home.com -
jhfine＠idirect.com -
liste＠artware.qc.ca -
marvin＠rain.org -
nerdware＠laidbak.com -
rivie＠teraglobal.com -
sipke＠wxs.nl -
technoid＠cheta.net