From: Jos Dreesen <jos.mar(a)bluewin.ch> electronics. hobbyist Ok, so you say. I just got done building two 50mhz frequency counters using SMT parts. The board is 1.8x2.1 inches and the display is 4 digit module with .375" 7 segment leds. The assembly includes 6 transistors (SOT) and a 74HC4017 (SMT) plus the Amtel (20pin dip) micro and associated chip resistors, caps and diodes. The resistors were the large 1206 (.11x.06") parts. There were a total of 5 through hole parts if you count the crystal and display. With a low power magnifier, standard weller 3/64" tip, .022 silver bearing solder, and a pair of #3 tweezers it went together quite fast. The last time I built an equivelent frequency counter it was 4 74192, 2x74273, 4x7447, 4x man3a leds, 2x74390, 2x 7400 plus all the caps, resistors and transistors and if didn't fit on a 2x2" board or only draw 60mA! At that time (1984) that cost me nearly 40$ in chips alone and I had to make the board. If anything, for those willing to adapt I'd say there are possibilities available now that never were. Lets face it, back in say '84 the thought of using a micro for a trivial task was sorta over the top, they weren't all that cheap or all that flexible. Now with basic stamps, PICs, amtel and the like a really good selection of flash rom parts at attractive prices and fast enough to do serious tasks or cheap enough to do dumb thing like PC keyboard to serial or parallel ascii. One of the things going on in the ham (amateur radio) community is packing PICs, DDS and a simple transceiver in an altoids tin (3.5x.75x2.25"). Oh and people still build boat anchors too. Allison