On Tue, Dec 30, 2008 at 6:41 AM, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote:
Since there have been a few discussions about the
memory/cache of the 11/70
now, I think I might make a few comments as well.
When we talk about the MK11 memory, you need to remember that it's a
separate memory box, and is not at all transparent to the 11/70.
.
.
.
However, the 11/70 cache and memory controller
presents quite a lot of
overhead and slowdown. If you really would like to speed the 11/70 up (and
you can, believe me), you would want to replace the cache and memory
controller all together.
I see what you are getting at. I didn't understand how the MK11
interacted with the CPU itself.
Now, after reading a few comments here, I've
finally understood the
relationship between the SETASI PEP-70 and HC-70.
The PEP-70 is 4 megs of memory. You can connect that to the 11/70 memory
bus.
The HC-70 replaces the cache and memory controller in the CPU. This makes
the whole 4 Meg of memory look like cache. You hook the PEP-70 to the HC-70
instead. Nice solution actually. I wonder if (in theory) you could hook any
memory box to the HC-70, or if the PEP-70 can work in two modes. One as a
device on the memory bus, and one as a cache memory for the HC-70.
Ah ha! I've heard of the arrangement but didn't know that it was the
combination of the PEP-70 and the HC-70 that did it.
Anyway, if someone were to design a memory system for
the 11/70, the way I'd
recommend is to go the whole way, since that's where the real gains are.
Now that I understand it better, I completely agree.
Skip the memory bus and the original cache. The
original cache is just 2 KB
of 2-way associative memory. If you set up a 4 MB cache, the CPU can run at
full steam the whole time, with a cycle time of about 150 nS, if I remember
right.
Handy, since 70ns SRAM is easy to find.
It is more complicated, though. You'll have access
paths from CPU, Unibus
and four massbus controllers to deal with. But it should definitely be
doable (heck, SETASI have already done it once).
I might be interested in such a project myself, since the 11/70s we have
around here still are on MK11 boxes. I could deal with PCBs and design, but
I'm very short on time, as usual... :-(
No experience at all with FPGAs or any such fancy stuff.
If such a thing were to be designed (I could participate in the design
phase, but not drive it), I'd probably be interested in two,
especially if the blank board was only a few hundred dollars. If it
came closer to $1000, I'd really have to think about passing on the
second one (I used to order multi-layer DEC backplane boards, and at
the time, $500 was a good price for orders between q10 and q100, but
things in the PCB market have changed radically).
I'm in no hurry - my 11/70s are in storage and I won't be able to even
pull them out to look at them in the next 90 days.
-ethan