1 Mar
2005
1 Mar
'05
11:29 a.m.
From: "Vintage Computer Festival" <vcf at
siconic.com>
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005, Tom Jennings wrote:
Hi
There is a table that one stores the step rate
for the drive. You need to alter the value for
slower drives, like your 8 inch. I forget where
is it but it is in that lower area someplace
( 40:xxx or something ). It isn't a problem
of the controller. It should work with any controller,
you just need to find the table and change it.
It has been a while since I've fiddle with it
to make my drives step with less noise ( and wear ).
Dwight
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005, Vintage Computer Festival
wrote:
Um, I'm not sure. I'm not sure I understand the question either. This is
a standard ISA IDE+floppy controller. Should I try an older one? Or hook
this up to an oldr PC from the 1980s?
If I then try to DIR the disk the head backs up a
track or so but can't
seem to recalibrate to track 0. The head vibrates as if the drive is
sending the signals to the stepper to retract the head but it only manages
to move back a track or so each time I issue DIR. If I do it enough it
eventually gets back to the stop position but it still gets sector errors.
Wrong step rate! Poke a new on eint othe chip, or does it use the old
table of junk INT 13h used to supoprt? 
1 Mar
1 Mar
1:09 p.m.
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dwight K. Elvey wrote:
There is a table that one stores the step rate
for the drive. You need to alter the value for
slower drives, like your 8 inch. I forget where
is it but it is in that lower area someplace
( 40:xxx or something ). It isn't a problem
of the controller. It should work with any controller,
you just need to find the table and change it.
It has been a while since I've fiddle with it
to make my drives step with less noise ( and wear ).
OIC.
Are there any drives that don't require such a modification of the stepper
table? I'm not sure what drives I'm using. They're mounted in an
enclosure and I'm too lazy to dismount them to check.
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]
1:57 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
Sellam asks about 8-inch disk drives:
Are there any drives that don't require such a
modification of the stepper
table? I'm not sure what drives I'm using. They're mounted in an
enclosure and I'm too lazy to dismount them to check.
IIRC, half-height 8-inch drives typically supported much faster step rates
than the full-height drives.
Eric
2:16 p.m.
New subject: web page translation tool
http://www.degraeve.com/translator.php
Way off topic.
Hint: You have to use the full address including http:// in the input box
on the page above.
[Religion] Hubbard, L. Ron (1911-1986) If you really want to make a
million . . . the quickest way is to start your own religion. [1947]
Speech to the Eastern Science Fiction association at Newark, New Jersey
--... ...-- -.. . -. ----. --.- --.- -...
tpeters at nospam.mixcom.com (remove "nospam") N9QQB (amateur radio)
"HEY YOU" (loud shouting) WEB ADDRESS http//www.mixweb.com/tpeters
43? 7' 17.2" N by 88? 6' 28.9" W, Elevation 815', Grid Square
EN53wc
WAN/LAN/Telcom Analyst, Tech Writer, MCP, Cisco Certified CCNA
6:26 p.m.
New subject: Vintage Computer Festival Harlem
The next Vintage Computer Festival will be held in Harlem:
Vintage Computa Festival
Duh Vintage Computa Festival be a international event that celebrates the
history uh computing.
Duh mission uh duh Vintage Computa Festival be to promote the preservation
uh "obsolete" computas by offerin' peeps a chance to experience duh
technologies, peeps an' stories that embody the remarkable tale uh duh
computa revolution.
Through our event an' duh Vintage Computa Festival Archives?our publicly
accessible archive uh computa hardware, software, literature an'
ephemera?we promote interest in researchin' an' documentin' duh history uh
duh computa. Above all, we promote duh fun uh playin' wif old computas.
http://www.degraeve.org/cgi-bin/babel.cgi?d=ebonics&url=http%3A%2F%2Fww…
(My apologies to the offended ;)
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]
6:41 p.m.
New subject: Vintage Computer Festival Harlem
Very funny. I commute into New York City daily, and this is a fair
representation of the speech sometimes heard...but not about vintage
computers.
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
[mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Vintage Computer
Festival
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 9:27 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Vintage Computer Festival Harlem
The next Vintage Computer Festival will be held in Harlem:
Vintage Computa Festival
Duh Vintage Computa Festival be a international event that celebrates the
history uh computing.
Duh mission uh duh Vintage Computa Festival be to promote the preservation
uh "obsolete" computas by offerin' peeps a chance to experience duh
technologies, peeps an' stories that embody the remarkable tale uh duh
computa revolution.
Through our event an' duh Vintage Computa Festival Archives?our publicly
accessible archive uh computa hardware, software, literature an'
ephemera?we promote interest in researchin' an' documentin' duh history uh
duh computa. Above all, we promote duh fun uh playin' wif old computas.
http://www.degraeve.org/cgi-bin/babel.cgi?d=ebonics&url=http%3A%2F%2Fww…
tage.org&w=
(My apologies to the offended ;)
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer
Festival
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
International Man of Intrigue and Danger
http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage
mputers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at
ttp://marketplace.vintage.org ]
2 Mar
2 Mar
3:56 p.m.
New subject: Vintage Computer Festival Harlem
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 18:26:55 -0800 (PST)
Vintage Computer Festival <vcf at siconic.com> wrote:
The next Vintage Computer Festival will be held in Harlem:
Vintage Computa Festival
Duh Vintage Computa Festival be a international event that celebrates
the history uh computing.
Duh mission uh duh Vintage Computa Festival be to promote the
preservation uh "obsolete" computas by offerin' peeps a chance to
experience duh technologies, peeps an' stories that embody the
remarkable tale uh duh computa revolution.
Through our event an' duh Vintage Computa Festival Archives?our
publicly accessible archive uh computa hardware, software, literature
an' ephemera?we promote interest in researchin' an' documentin' duh
history uh duh computa. Above all, we promote duh fun uh playin' wif
old computas.
http://www.degraeve.org/cgi-bin/babel.cgi?d=ebonics&url=http%3A%2F%2Fww…
That reminds me of the BBS days when I once ran a whole bunch of
discussion threads through the 'jive filter', deleted the originals, and
reposted it all. This was possible because that particular BBS package
allowed the originater of a discussion thread to delete all 'child'
comments on the discussion thread. Needless to say people were OUTRAGED
at seeing their own entries turned into Jive and I got into a LOT of
trouble. Those were the days. Now I try to be a bit more ethical...
1 Mar
1 Mar
3:01 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Eric Smith wrote:
Sellam asks about 8-inch disk drives:
Ok, now the details start coming out. From the information I could find
on the web and the discussions here, the common wisdom was that you just
make the right cable and everything just works. Ha.
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]
Are there any drives that don't require such
a modification of the stepper
table? I'm not sure what drives I'm using. They're mounted in an
enclosure and I'm too lazy to dismount them to check.
IIRC, half-height 8-inch drives typically supported much faster step rates
than the full-height drives. 
3:28 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Eric Smith wrote:
IIRC, half-height 8-inch drives typically supported
much faster step rates
than the full-height drives.
Half height! 8-inch! What tall tales you tell! Where be these
mysterious "half height" floppies?!
Next you'll be telling me computers can run on batteries!
3:38 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Tom Jennings wrote:
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Eric Smith wrote:
I've got several.
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]
IIRC, half-height 8-inch drives typically
supported much faster step rates
than the full-height drives.
Half height! 8-inch! What tall tales you tell! Where be these
mysterious "half height" floppies?!
3:49 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
I wrote about half-height 8-inch floppy drives.
Tom replied:
Half height! 8-inch! What tall tales you tell! Where
be these
mysterious "half height" floppies?!
Next you'll be telling me computers can run on batteries!
Well, I wouldn't go that far. But someday they might be small
enough that a rich person could have one in their own home.
Eric
4:15 p.m.
New subject: 8' drive on PC troubleshooting
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:49:21 -0800 (PST), Eric Smith <eric at brouhaha.com> wrote:
Pshaw! The next thing, you'll be suggesting that every city should
have a telephone.
-ethan
Next
you'll be telling me computers can run on batteries!
Well, I wouldn't go that far. But someday they might be small
enough that a rich person could have one in their own home. 
4:39 p.m.
New subject: The future of computing/technology
>>
>> Pshaw! The next thing, you'll be suggesting that every
>> city should have a telephone.
>>
Although I can not find the article right now....
One of the last areas in the US finally got phone service in 2004.
The 1 private residence was occupied by an elderly woman.
Her first phone call was from the Governor to congratulate her.
15 minutes later the phone rang again....
(you guessed it)
... A telemarketer....
[possible urban legend, but still on the mark...
6:21 p.m.
New subject: The future of computing/technology
15 minutes later the phone rang again....
(you guessed it)
... A telemarketer....
[possible urban legend, but still on the mark...
About eight years ago, when I was at the big Downers Grove, IL POP (MCI),
the front desk got a call from an MCI telemarketer trying to get them to
switch their long distance sevice. The funny thing was that the poor girl
at the POP's desk (she was one of the technicians, actually) had a hell of
a time trying to convince the telemarketer to give up.
William Donzelli
aw288 at osfn.org
3:19 p.m.
> There is a table that one stores the step rate
> for the drive. You need to alter the value for
> slower drives, like your 8 inch.
OIC.
Are there any drives that don't require such a modification of the stepper
table? I'm not sure what drives I'm using. They're mounted in an
enclosure and I'm too lazy to dismount them to check.
Let me play Mr. Spock for a minute:
There is a step-rate mismatch. You can change the step rate value
in software, or you can change to a drive that is compatible with
the current step rate value.
You do not want to change the step rate value, yet you do not want
to open the enclosure, but indicate a desire to change to a
different brand of floppy disk drive.
That, sir, is illogical.
PS: Step rate is in the datasheet for the drive and determined by
the manufacturer. Persci's were rilly fast, 2-3mS I think, but
those are not ordinary interfaces. One of the later, cheaper,
all-plastic drives were faster than the sluggish, expensive but
reliable Shugarts. That's the forest you're wandering around in.
It'll be vastly easier to poke a new value in.
WAIT!!! Get a vintage IBM PC tech ref. Look in the listings,
around the start of the INT 13h area. There's a little table in
the code that gets copied to lower RAM at boot time. WAIT!!!
There's I think a chart in the RAM MEMORY MAP area that tells you
where the 765 floppy table o'gunk was stored, 10:xxxx or 40:xxxx
or something.
WAIT!! Iff that table is still used -- which it might very well
be since it's one-time config data -- you could run DEBUG, poke a
new value into it and be done with it. You'll have to do that
every time you boot.
If it's currently 07h, or something, make it 20h, or something.
Double what's there. Good Enough (tm).
2:12 p.m.
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dwight K. Elvey wrote:
While the default table is often in low memory,
sometimes it is even in ROM.
It is pointed to by INT1Eh.
To alter values in the table, copy it, alter the copy,
then repoint INT1Eh to point to the new address.
Be sure to restore INT1Eh when you are done,
or INT13h may encounter serious difficulties.
If you've got a copy of the PC Technical Reference Manual,
most of the disk parameter table is documented right after INT13h.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
> Wrong step
rate! Poke a new on eint othe chip, or does it use the old
> table of junk INT 13h used to supoprt?
Hi
There is a table that one stores the step rate
for the drive. You need to alter the value for
slower drives, like your 8 inch. I forget where
is it but it is in that lower area someplace
( 40:xxx or something ). It isn't a problem
of the controller. It should work with any controller,
you just need to find the table and change it.
It has been a while since I've fiddle with it
to make my drives step with less noise ( and wear ).
Dwight
3:30 p.m.
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Fred Cisin wrote:
While the default table is often in low memory,
sometimes it is even in ROM.
It is pointed to by INT1Eh.
To alter values in the table, copy it, alter the copy,
then repoint INT1Eh to point to the new address.
Be sure to restore INT1Eh when you are done,
or INT13h may encounter serious difficulties.
If you've got a copy of the PC Technical Reference Manual,
most of the disk parameter table is documented right after INT13h.
That's it! Better recall than I! My pc tech ref is at home...
If you're doing all this under DOS, you could simply poke a new
value into the table in RAM (or make a new one in RAM) and restore
the old value with a three-finger salute.
7235
days inactive
7236
days old
16 comments
11 participants
participants (11)
-
aw288＠osfn.org -
chenmel＠earthlink.net -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
dvcorbin＠optonline.net -
dwight.elvey＠amd.com -
eric＠brouhaha.com -
ethan.dicks＠gmail.com -
rcini＠optonline.net -
tomj＠wps.com -
tpeters＠mixcom.com -
vcf＠siconic.com