18 May
1999
18 May
'99
5:25 a.m.
You won't find eBay wanting to "get in the middle" in that way. They get a
fee based on the high bid. They don't really care whether the transaction
is completed. Of course, the seller gets a credit for his fee in the case
where the sale isn't completed, but eBay still gets the money.
Why would they want to change this comfortable arrangement?
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: Philip.Belben(a)pgen.com <Philip.Belben(a)pgen.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, May 18, 1999 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: (fwd) WARNING! New Ebay SCAM! (fwd)
>>>It means that the "dealer" has an item X in their inventory, they
see
that
>>someone else on Ebay is selling an equivalent
X. The dealer follows the
>>auction to completion, when complete, the dealer sends email to the
second
>>highest bidder and asks if they would like to
purchase the item from them
>>for the price they offered the seller.
>>
>>This is a scam? Give it a break guys. If I bid on something and am not
the
>>high bidder I would like a chance to buy. If
you don't then don't reply.
>>Sometimes you can get in a bidding war and end up pay many times the
value
>>of an item, I.E. Imsai or Altec on Ebay, Is it
really that different
than
>>making an offer here to someone who has
something you want? So who looses
if
>>a seller contacts you and you agree on a fair
price? Ebay? Time to face
the
>>facts Ebay, Yahoo, etc., etc. auctions are
going to stay a while.
>
> The above was an explanation of the legitimate practice. The abuse is
where
> a third party pretends to be the seller, contacts
the second etc. bidders
> and requests payment be sent to a blind PO Box, then skips with the funds
> never sending any goods.
>
> BTW I just sent an inquiry to eBay to see if this is rumor, hoax, or
fact.
Oh. I got the impression that it was the highest bidder doing this, i.e.
outbidding the legitimate bidders; then selling his stuff to the failed
bidders;
and only then backing down on the original sale. Very
nasty, because the
original vendor can't sell to the failed bidders until he has definitely
heard
that the winner is backing down...
At a genuine auction in the UK, the auctioneer has the legal power to sign
a
contract of purchase on behalf of either party. So
backing down is very,
very
difficult. But this sort of safeguard has yet to reach
Ebay, I suppose.
Philip.
18 May
18 May
6:07 a.m.
You won't find eBay wanting to "get in the
middle" in that way. They get a
fee based on the high bid. They don't really care whether the transaction
is completed. Of course, the seller gets a credit for his fee in the case
where the sale isn't completed, but eBay still gets the money.
Here is the response I got from eBay this morning, and my question below
it. I considered this a lame side stepping answer and emailed back saying
so.
<some stuff edited>
Thank you for writing.
The best single way to size up eBay members is by judging there feedback
for yourself.
eBay has no control over private email and direct sales are not only not
sanctioned but are a violation of eBay rules and will draw sanctions
from eBay when proven. They are very dangerous.
Especially if the seller
is not an eBay member in good standing. In fact these are
not even "eBay
scams or frauds", they are not eBay at all!
eBay is not a party to the actual transactions that take place between
members. eBay acts as a link between the buyer and seller. We just
provide the automated bidding system. We do not authenticate users, we
do not verify items, we do not guarantee that you will receive payment
or the item. However, we are extremely concerned about our community and
your safety within our community. To that end, we work with third
parties to offer you services to authenticate users, insure and escrow
your transactions.
We hope this helps! :^)
Original message follows:
-------------------------
How do I check on eBay scams or frauds I hear about on newsgroups or
mailing lists? Recently someone reported on a mailing list I follow that
people are contacting second bidders and pretending to be the seller,
requesting payment be sent to a PO Box, then skipping with the money.
How do I find out if this is true or hoax?
11:24 a.m.
Here is the response I got from eBay this morning, and
my question below
it. I considered this a lame side stepping answer and emailed back saying
so.
They're absolutely right. They have no possible way to control this. The
e-mail does not pass through their system. If they DID get involved
suddenly they'd be responsible for all the deals that go bad, and that would
swiftly bankrupt them in today's litigous society.
So Caviet Emptor. If you don't get the note from e-bay saying "you won
acution foo, contact bar(a)wherever.net to close the deal, and someone sends
you e-mail offering you the same thing, treat it like anyone else e-mailing
from the cold. Verify the address. Get a phone number
and talk to them,
maybe. The most e-bay could do is throw them off E-bay if they
were members
anyway.
To be honest I'm getting tired of the "ebay sucks because" threads, of
which
this is clearly a part. The original note was a valid "heads up", I agree -
it's a scam I hadn't thought of, but I think we've worn it to death now.
--
Jim Strickland
jim(a)DIESPAMMERSCUMcalico.litterbox.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Vote Meadocrat! Bill and Opus in 2000 - Who ELSE is there?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
11:39 a.m.
On Tue, 18 May 1999, Mike Ford wrote:
eBay has no control over private email and direct
sales are not only not
sanctioned but are a violation of eBay rules and will draw sanctions
from eBay when proven. They are very dangerous. Especially if the seller
is not an eBay member in good standing. In fact these are not even "eBay
scams or frauds", they are not eBay at all!
eBay is not a party to the actual transactions that take place between
members. eBay acts as a link between the buyer and seller. We just
provide the automated bidding system. We do not authenticate users, we
do not verify items, we do not guarantee that you will receive payment
or the item. However, we are extremely concerned about our community and
your safety within our community. To that end, we work with third
parties to offer you services to authenticate users, insure and escrow
your transactions.
Oh, OK. I see. They don't even guarantee auctions played out within
their construct, so they are just as at risk as sales done outside of
eBay, yet they claim direct sales are "very dangerous". ANY eBay sale is
dangerous. Feedback can be faked, but is at least one good way to size up
a seller. I say more power to the people who leech ebay to find willing
buyers to their crap, bypassing ebay altogether.
Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out.
Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0!
See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details!
[Last web site update: 04/03/99]
1:02 p.m.
Mike,
Isn't there a discussion group hosted on E-bay? If there is, then you
should try posting a question there asking users if they've been hit by
this kind of scam. You could also try posting the same question to some the
news groups such as the antique radio groups. It would be interesting to
see the results. I'm sure you'd never hear about these scams from E-bay.
Joe
At 08:07 AM 5/18/99 -0700, you wrote:
You won't
find eBay wanting to "get in the middle" in that way. They get a
fee based on the high bid. They don't really care whether the transaction
is completed. Of course, the seller gets a credit for his fee in the case
where the sale isn't completed, but eBay still gets the money.
Here is the response I got from eBay this morning, and my question below
it. I considered this a lame side stepping answer and emailed back saying
so.
<some stuff edited>
Thank you for writing.
The best single way to size up eBay members is by judging there feedback
for yourself.
eBay has no control over private email and direct sales are not only not
sanctioned but are a violation of eBay rules and will draw sanctions
from eBay when proven. They are very dangerous. Especially if the seller
is not an eBay member in good standing. In fact these are not even "eBay
scams or frauds", they are not eBay at all!
eBay is not a party to the actual transactions that take place between
members. eBay acts as a link between the buyer and seller. We just
provide the automated bidding system. We do not authenticate users, we
do not verify items, we do not guarantee that you will receive payment
or the item. However, we are extremely concerned about our community and
your safety within our community. To that end, we work with third
parties to offer you services to authenticate users, insure and escrow
your transactions.
We hope this helps! :^)
Original message follows:
-------------------------
How do I check on eBay scams or frauds I hear about on newsgroups or
mailing lists? Recently someone reported on a mailing list I follow that
people are contacting second bidders and pretending to be the seller,
requesting payment be sent to a PO Box, then skipping with the money.
How do I find out if this is true or hoax?
9193
days inactive
9193
days old
4 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
dastar＠ncal.verio.com -
edick＠idcomm.com -
jim＠calico.litterbox.com -
mikeford＠netwiz.net -
rigdonj＠intellistar.net