7 May
2010
7 May
'10
6:45 p.m.
Al wrote:
On 5/7/10 1:52 PM, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
> Valtrep is the PREDECESSOR to Fortran
Would you please point me to documentation for this
language prior to the
Fortran document of November, 1954
Al -
I'm beginning to think that Dan Gahlinger is like Andy Kaufman creating the
character Tony Clifton. He creates Valtrep on the Sentry-70, he creates
OS/2 for the PDP-11, just to get us to kick.
Actually, OS/2 for the PDP-11, that is so Tony Clifton. It is funny in
retrospect :-)
Eric had a real funny retort on a NetBSD list, something
to do with buying the first sneaker for sneakernet :-),
I think the Valtrep ruse, I first saw in 2006.
Tim.
7:43 p.m.
On Fri, 7 May 2010, Chuck Guzis wrote:
I wonder if VECTRAN isn't older than Valtrep.
Fortran with array extensions? I can't compare its age with Valtrep
(there seems to be only one person who can discuss Valtrep), but VECTRAN
was based on FORTRAN, in the 1970s?.
Or is Vectran the fancy fiber that was invented at Roswell NM?
Was Valtrep classified? Maybe black helicopters came and retrieved all
but one of all of the people who had ever heard of it.
Of course the discrepancies in the space-time continuum might not be
atributable to Dan. Dan may have been misled. I also once had a boss who
insisted that the company's technology predated the invention of fire.
I think that Dan needs to correct the omissions in the histories of
programming languages at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_programming_languages
and the FORTRAN article in the most authoritative of all references:
http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/FORTRAN
But, not to worry.
A REAL programmer can write a FORTRAN program in any language.
9:35 p.m.
On 7 May 2010 at 19:43, Fred Cisin wrote:
Fortran with array extensions? I can't compare
its age with Valtrep
(there seems to be only one person who can discuss Valtrep), but
VECTRAN was based on FORTRAN, in the 1970s?. Or is Vectran the fancy
fiber that was invented at Roswell NM?
No, FORTRAN with *vector* extensions (slight difference there,
particularly as it concerns sparse vectors and vector arithmetic),
circa 1973. A major source of a X3J3 brouhaha for Fortran 90. IBM
threatened to withdraw from the proceedings unless the VECTRAN
extensions were made part of ANSI Fortran. (I don't think that IBM
VECTRAN could claim to be the first FORTRAN with vector extensions--I
think that honor goes to either IVTRAN for ILLIAC IV or an early
dialect of LRLTRAN.)
...which led to a lot of philisophical discussion about the purpose
of standards committees. Namely, to certify current practice or
create new language elements.
--Chuck
7:54 p.m.
VECTRAN is a spun fiber, according to wikipedia ;)
although you bring up an interesting thought,
from what I recall, "Valtrep" is an
associative name
by that I mean, it's a name that is created by using portions of at least 2 different
words, probably 3.
Like "ForTran = Formula Translation"
Valtrep actually meant something too, not an acronym as far as I recall, but similar.
trying to remember something from so long ago is not easy.
at least I completed my 30+ year project of Trek7 finally ;)
Dan.
From: cclist at sydex.com
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 19:07:31 -0700
Subject: Re: Valtrep is the PREDECESSOR to Fortran (was Lisa C and Lisa FORTRAN)
I wonder if VECTRAN isn't older than Valtrep.
--Chuck
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Dating: Find someone special. Start now.
http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9729707
7:50 p.m.
It's not a ruse.
and All I said about OS/2 on the PDP-11 was that I had a TK-50 for the PDP-11 that had
OS/2 on it.
That is a true, factual statement.
I still have the tape, still willing to provide the info to anyone that can verify what it
is.
No one has ever offered.
It's very daft to say someone is making something up when you don't have any
proof,
and don't offer any way to validate the statements one way or the other.
Dan.
Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 21:45:39 -0400
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Valtrep is the PREDECESSOR to Fortran (was Lisa C and Lisa FORTRAN)
From: shoppa at trailing-edge.com
Al wrote:
_________________________________________________________________
30 days of prizes: Hotmail makes your day easier! Enter Now.
http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9729710
On 5/7/10 1:52 PM, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
> Valtrep is the PREDECESSOR to Fortran
Would you please point me to documentation for
this language prior to the
Fortran document of November, 1954
Al -
I'm beginning to think that Dan Gahlinger is like Andy Kaufman creating the
character Tony Clifton. He creates Valtrep on the Sentry-70, he creates
OS/2 for the PDP-11, just to get us to kick.
Actually, OS/2 for the PDP-11, that is so Tony Clifton. It is funny in
retrospect :-)
Eric had a real funny retort on a NetBSD list, something
to do with buying the first sneaker for sneakernet :-),
I think the Valtrep ruse, I first saw in 2006.
Tim.
9:25 p.m.
On Fri, 7 May 2010, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
It's not a ruse.
and All I said about OS/2 on the PDP-11 was that I had a TK-50 for the
PDP-11 that had OS/2 on it.
That is a true, factual statement.
A statement that "I have a tape for the PDP-11 that is LABELED "OS/2"
would be defensible.
"that has OS/2 on it" is a wild claim.
I still have the tape, still willingJ to provide the
info to anyone that
can verify what it is.
No one has ever offered.
Numerous people asked to see the tape, or even just a directory listing of
its contents.
It's very daft to say someone is making something
up when you don't have
any proof, and don't offer any way to validate the statements one way or
the other.
OTOH, when somebody makes an unbelievable claim, and won't offer any way
to validate the claim, it would be very daft to accept the claim.
8:01 p.m.
On Fri, 7 May 2010, Tim Shoppa wrote:
I'm beginning to think that Dan Gahlinger is
like Andy Kaufman creating the
character Tony Clifton. He creates Valtrep on the Sentry-70, he creates
OS/2 for the PDP-11, just to get us to kick.
and the 1980s Sun computer on which email was invented,
and duplicating alignment disks, . . .
Actually, OS/2 for the PDP-11, that is so Tony
Clifton. It is funny in
retrospect :-)
Eric had a real funny retort on a NetBSD list, something
to do with buying the first sneaker for sneakernet :-),
I think the Valtrep ruse, I first saw in 2006.
Damn, he is good at it!
He had me convinced that he believed in stuff that he didn't have a clue
about!
Has anybody else heard of a Sentry-70, or is that also part of the prank?
WOW!
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
5124
days inactive
5124
days old
7 comments
4 participants
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