5 Feb
2007
5 Feb
'07
11:17 p.m.
I have a Mac 128 and I want to duplicate the system disk. Probably a stupid
question, but how do you make a copy of a disk on that computer (single internal
disk drive.) Needless to say, I am not a Mac person. Thanks!
5 Feb
5 Feb
11:41 p.m.
On 2/5/07, Marvin Johnston <marvin at rain.org> wrote:
I have a Mac 128 and I want to duplicate the system disk. Probably a stupid
question, but how do you make a copy of a disk on that computer (single internal
disk drive.) Needless to say, I am not a Mac person. Thanks!
Hmm... if you have a 128K Mac, I'm guessing you are using an older
version of the Finder (1.1g, perhaps?) I don't recall off the top of
my head what the newest version of the OS fits into 128K, but I'm
guessing it's 3.5 or older. I mention this because I think there were
some changes made later, once single-drive systems were somewhat rare.
If I am remembering correctly, older systems can't format during a
copy, but later ones can. What I seem to think was the single-disk
copying procedure is to eject the System disk (Flower-E or Flower-1?),
then insert a previously formatted target floppy, eject _that_ one,
which should leave its icon on the desktop, but grayed out, then drag
the System disk icon over the target disk icon. The machine should
slurp up 20%-25% of the System disk, spit it out, prompt you to swap,
write out what's cached, spit the target floppy out, ad nausem, until
all 400K passes through memory to your destination disk. While doing
this, you will be subjected to your internal drive playing a little
tune as the drive changes speeds through at least 4 zones. After a
while, you might learn to listen to how far the copy has progressed,
but hopefully you won't be doing this often enough to have it drilled
into your head.
It's all quite tedious, but possible. If there's anyway you can
borrow a second 400K floppy, you will find this somewhat trivial. You
can also copy 400K disks in more modern Macs, so don't think you are
limited to using a 128K Mac to copy single-sided MFS disks. I can't
say for certain how new the gear can be, but at the very least, I'd be
surprised if a Mac SE or SE/30 running System 6 couldn't still do it.
Of course, you might only have that 128K handy with no way to
find/borrow an external drive, but unless this is the case, or unless
you are attempting a masochistic experiment to drive a Mac like it was
still 1984, you may find this activity much easier on friendlier
hardware, even an unexpanded 512K Mac.
-ethan
11:49 p.m.
Marvin Johnston wrote:
I have a Mac 128 and I want to duplicate the system
disk. Probably a stupid
question, but how do you make a copy of a disk on that computer (single internal
disk drive.) Needless to say, I am not a Mac person. Thanks!
Just copy it as you normally would: Format a 2nd disk, then copy one
disk onto the other (if memory serves, it's been a long long time).
The one thing I do know for sure is that you will swap disks no less
than 20 times making the copy. After Finder is loaded, there's about
40K free on a 128K system. That's 10 operations of "read
chunk"->"write
chunk" right there. So be patient; the machine is not intentionally
torturing you.
--
Jim Leonard (trixter at oldskool.org) http://www.oldskool.org/
Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
A child borne of the home computer wars: http://trixter.wordpress.com/
11:57 p.m.
On Monday 05 February 2007 23:41, Ethan Dicks wrote:
If I am remembering correctly, older systems can't
format during a
copy, but later ones can. What I seem to think was the single-disk
copying procedure is to eject the System disk (Flower-E or Flower-1?),
From memory of my junior and high-school days :),
Shift-Apple-1 will
eject the disk without removing the icon from the finder.
"Eject" or
dragging it to the trashcan ejects the disk and removes its icon.
Pat
--
Purdue University ITAP/RCAC --- http://www.rcac.purdue.edu/
The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org
11:57 p.m.
Ethan Dicks wrote:
unless
you are attempting a masochistic experiment to drive a Mac like it was
still 1984
Hey now... I do that intentionally from time to time. It's not
masochistic, it's nostalgic :-)
I tried to explain to a younger person why I still have an Apple when
every disk under the sun has been dumped to image files, and Apple II
emulators are 99.99999% perfect. I told him it's because there is a
certain flavor of experience that can't be emulated when using the real
thing. The noise of the disk drive (*), the long wait times, etc.
contribute to the experience. An Apple II emulator which silently loads
programs in one second isn't right. (And arcade emulators that don't
even make an attempt at reproducing scanlines also irk me.)
(*) How many of you did this internally when you read that:
"Brrrrrrrrrrrr-RATDATDATDATDATDATDATDATDAT!" :-)
(Or, for anyone who has booted an Electronic Arts game on a PC more than
ten times: "chunk. chunk. chunk. chunk. chunk-chink-chink-chink-chunk!"
--
Jim Leonard (trixter at oldskool.org) http://www.oldskool.org/
Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
A child borne of the home computer wars: http://trixter.wordpress.com/
11:58 p.m.
Jim Leonard wrote:
Just copy it as you normally would: Format a 2nd
disk, then copy one
disk onto the other (if memory serves, it's been a long long time).
Sorry, that should have read "drag one disk onto the other"
--
Jim Leonard (trixter at oldskool.org) http://www.oldskool.org/
Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
A child borne of the home computer wars: http://trixter.wordpress.com/
6 Feb
6 Feb
12:12 a.m.
On 2/5/07, Jim Leonard <trixter at oldskool.org> wrote:
Marvin Johnston wrote:
As I just wrote, that's my (faded) memory, too.
I have a Mac 128 and I want to duplicate the
system disk. Probably a stupid
question, but how do you make a copy of a disk on that computer (single internal
disk drive.) Needless to say, I am not a Mac person. Thanks!
Just copy it as you normally would: Format a 2nd disk, then copy one
disk onto the other (if memory serves, it's been a long long time). The one thing I do know for sure is that you will swap
disks no less
than 20 times making the copy. After Finder is loaded, there's about
40K free on a 128K system. That's 10 operations of "read
chunk"->"write
chunk" right there. So be patient; the machine is not intentionally
torturing you.
Ah... you are probably correct about 10 swaps - I was thinking there
was between 64K and 96K free, but that's probably way too optimistic.
Perhaps it's 3-4 swaps on a 512K?
-ethan
12:16 a.m.
On 2/5/07, Patrick Finnegan <pat at computer-refuge.org> wrote:
On Monday 05 February 2007 23:41, Ethan Dicks wrote:
Right... that's what I was attempting to convey - that you *don't*
drag the disk to the trash can as that will eject the disk _and_
remove the icon from the desktop.
You need to have both icons handy so you can drag one onto the other.
I'm also reasonably certain that as such, you must copy onto a
previously formatted floppy - the copy with the old finder can't
format on the fly, neither will you have an icon to drag onto.
-ethan
If I am remembering correctly, older systems
can't format during a
copy, but later ones can. What I seem to think was the single-disk
copying procedure is to eject the System disk (Flower-E or Flower-1?),
From memory of my junior and high-school days :),
Shift-Apple-1 will
eject the disk without removing the icon from the finder.
"Eject" or
dragging it to the trashcan ejects the disk and removes its icon.
12:34 a.m.
On Tuesday 06 February 2007 00:16, Ethan Dicks wrote:
Right... that's what I was attempting to convey -
that you *don't*
drag the disk to the trash can as that will eject the disk _and_
remove the icon from the desktop.
Yeah, I know. I was just pointing out what the keystroke should be. :)
You need to have both icons handy so you can drag one
onto the other.
I'm also reasonably certain that as such, you must copy onto a
previously formatted floppy - the copy with the old finder can't
format on the fly, neither will you have an icon to drag onto.
Yes, but if you shove an unformatted disk in, it should prompt you to
format it, before it does anything else. (At least, that was the case
with every version of MacOS that I used.)
Pat
--
Purdue University ITAP/RCAC --- http://www.rcac.purdue.edu/
The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org
12:58 a.m.
Ethan Dicks wrote:
Perhaps it's 3-4 swaps on a 512K?
2 swaps (400K disk fits entirely into memory).
--
Jim Leonard (trixter at oldskool.org) http://www.oldskool.org/
Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
A child borne of the home computer wars: http://trixter.wordpress.com/
1:17 a.m.
On Mon, 5 Feb 2007, Jim Leonard wrote:
I tried to explain to a younger person why I still
have an Apple when
every disk under the sun has been dumped to image files, and Apple II
emulators are 99.99999% perfect. I told him it's because there is a
certain flavor of experience that can't be emulated when using the real
thing. The noise of the disk drive (*), the long wait times, etc.
contribute to the experience. An Apple II emulator which silently loads
programs in one second isn't right. (And arcade emulators that don't
even make an attempt at reproducing scanlines also irk me.)
(*) How many of you did this internally when you read that:
"Brrrrrrrrrrrr-RATDATDATDATDATDATDATDATDAT!" :-)
It's not the same unless the table shakes while the drive does its thing.
--
David Griffith
dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
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dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu -
ethan.dicks＠gmail.com -
marvin＠rain.org -
pat＠computer-refuge.org -
trixter＠oldskool.org