6 Oct
2019
6 Oct
'19
8:24 p.m.
A fellow who was putting the air in "Microsoft Tire" (c) is going to
prison. Microsoft claims that the air they give free with the tire is
not free. You can download the air and install the air and use the
air, but noone can help you do it or they will spend 15months in
federal prison and pay 3/4 of a million beans in damages for helping
you and charging nothing for it but a quarter for the electricity it
cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyright-20…
Jeff
6 Oct
6 Oct
10:24 p.m.
*sigh*
This list is really going down the tubes.
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 7, 2019, at 03:24, Jeffrey S. Worley via cctalk
<cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
?A fellow who was putting the air in "Microsoft Tire" (c) is going to
prison. Microsoft claims that the air they give free with the tire is
not free. You can download the air and install the air and use the
air, but noone can help you do it or they will spend 15months in
federal prison and pay 3/4 of a million beans in damages for helping
you and charging nothing for it but a quarter for the electricity it
cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyright-20…
Jeff
10:50 p.m.
On 10/6/19 10:40 PM, Mark Linimon via cctalk wrote:
On Mon, Oct 07, 2019 at 05:24:23AM +0000, null via
cctalk wrote:
But I thought that the Internet was a "series of tubes", so, yesy, this
list really is going down the tubes.
alan
This list is really going down the tubes.
ITYM "Integrated Circuits". Tubes is before the time of most of the
folks on this list, I think.
(ok folks, it's a joke ...)
mcl
7 Oct
7 Oct
8:45 a.m.
Ugh this is old and has nothing to do with what we do
Also is has nothing to do with what anyone is discussing.
The guy make exact copies of restore CDs with Dell and Microsoft
labels, so they were counterfeit.
8:58 a.m.
Ugh this is old and has nothing to do with what we do
Also is has nothing to do with what anyone is discussing.
The guy make exact copies of restore CDs with Dell and Microsoft
labels, so they were counterfeit.
In none of the stories I have read, and I admit I haven't been following this closely,
there has been no mention of labels being copied (i.e. logos, graphics, etc.). If he did
do this then yes he screwed himself royally.
-Ali
9:55 a.m.
On Mon, Oct 7, 2019 at 11:58 AM Ali <cctalk at ibm51xx.net> wrote:
In none of the stories I have read, and I admit I
haven't been following this closely, there has been no mention of labels being copied
(i.e. logos, graphics, etc.). If he did do this then yes he screwed himself royally.
-Ali
https://mashable.com/2018/06/07/microsoft-right-to-repair-eric-lundgren-pr-…
From the article:
"One thing Microsoft and Lundgren do agree on: it was wrong for him to
put a Dell logo on the discs, which he said he did to make the discs'
purpose less confusing to consumers."
"What I?m guilty of is printing a logo on a worthless piece of
plastic," Lundgren said. "But that?s a civil issue," he said, and
worth a fine, not jail time."
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-microsoft-restore-disc-20…
From the article:
"In 2013, federal authorities intercepted shipments of 28,000 restore
discs that Lundgren had manufactured in China and sent to his sales
partner in Florida. The discs had labels nearly identical to the discs
provided by Dell for its computers and had the Windows and Dell logos.
?If I had just written ?Eric?s Restore Disc? on there, it would have
been fine,? Lundgren said."
I think he should not have gone to jail, this is a civil matter.
However what he did was wrong and it badly affected the recycling
business as a whole. Now other people are not wanting to persue
recycled computers
10:40 a.m.
"In 2013, federal authorities intercepted
shipments of 28,000 restore
discs that Lundgren had manufactured in China and sent to his sales
partner in Florida. The discs had labels nearly identical to the discs
provided by Dell for its computers and had the Windows and Dell logos.
?If I had just written ?Eric?s Restore Disc? on there, it would have
been fine,? Lundgren said."
No duh! Why would you fake the Dell/MS Logos? How does that help the consumer, who is so
clueless they can't get restore disk on their own, vs. a label that says "Restore
Disc for Dell Optiplex Blah Blah"
I think he should not have gone to jail, this is a civil matter.
However what he did was wrong and it badly affected the recycling
business as a whole. Now other people are not wanting to persue
recycled computers
I am not sure about that. It does put some more scrutiny on the business and frankly keeps
the unnecessary "creativity" out. As this is a copyright infringement I believe
there are both civil and criminal penalties so jail is possible (and was given). Of course
the sanity of that is a whole other argument.
-Ali
8 Oct
8 Oct
1:21 a.m.
On 7 Oct 2019, at 16:58, Ali via cctalk <cctalk at
classiccmp.org> wrote:
Read this. he bragged that his copies were almost indistinguishable from the real deal:
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/04/25/pc_recycler_lundgren_jailed/
<https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/04/25/pc_recycler_lundgren_jailed/>
--
Adrian Graham
Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest private home computer collection?
t: @binarydinosaurs f: facebook.com/binarydinosaurs
w: www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk
Ugh this is old and has nothing to do with what
we do
Also is has nothing to do with what anyone is discussing.
The guy make exact copies of restore CDs with Dell and Microsoft
labels, so they were counterfeit.
In none of the stories I have read, and I admit I haven't been following this
closely, there has been no mention of labels being copied (i.e. logos, graphics, etc.). If
he did do this then yes he screwed himself royally.
-Ali
7 Oct
7 Oct
1:30 a.m.
Ha. I was recently in PC World (gross) buying my son a laptop for
University.
They tried to sell him (me) a whole load of crap he didn't need. They
tried to sell me an Office 365 subscription that he gets for free from the
Uni. They tried to sell me A/V software you can get free. They tried to
sell me 1TB of cloud storage he doesn't need. They tried to sell me
Windows 10 restore media, for FORTY POUNDS.
Amazing.
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 at 04:24, Jeffrey S. Worley via cctalk <
cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
A fellow who was putting the air in "Microsoft
Tire" (c) is going to
prison. Microsoft claims that the air they give free with the tire is
not free. You can download the air and install the air and use the
air, but noone can help you do it or they will spend 15months in
federal prison and pay 3/4 of a million beans in damages for helping
you and charging nothing for it but a quarter for the electricity it
cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyright-20…
Jeff
--
Yoyodyne Propulsion Systems: "The Future Begins Tomorrow"
Visit us at: http://www.yoyodyne-propulsion.net
--------
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." -- Jonathan Swift
3:51 a.m.
Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would have tried to sell you an extended warranty
as well which is really just an insurance policy....
.. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have student discount
stores?
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk <cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org> On Behalf Of John Many Jars
via cctalk
Sent: 07 October 2019 09:31
To: Jeffrey S. Worley via cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
Subject: Re: Nuke Redmond!
Ha. I was recently in PC World (gross) buying my son a laptop for University.
They tried to sell him (me) a whole load of crap he didn't need. They tried to
sell me an Office 365 subscription that he gets for free from the Uni. They
tried to sell me A/V software you can get free. They tried to sell me 1TB of
cloud storage he doesn't need. They tried to sell me Windows 10 restore
media, for FORTY POUNDS.
Amazing.
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 at 04:24, Jeffrey S. Worley via cctalk <
cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
A fellow who was putting the air in
"Microsoft Tire" (c) is going to
prison. Microsoft claims that the air they give free with the tire is
not free. You can download the air and install the air and use the
air, but noone can help you do it or they will spend 15months in
federal prison and pay 3/4 of a million beans in damages for helping
you and charging nothing for it but a quarter for the electricity it
cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyrig
ht-20180426-
story.html?fbclid=IwAR3v6MDIUWtqyUxcupT7YQOaX5a7bzrKZKAZWK
QFYkdzbg9xvWhvRVkSuq4
Jeff
--
Yoyodyne Propulsion Systems: "The Future Begins Tomorrow"
Visit us at: http://www.yoyodyne-propulsion.net
--------
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that
the dunces are all in confederacy against him." -- Jonathan Swift 
4:14 a.m.
At 05:51 AM 10/7/2019, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would have
tried to sell you an extended warranty as well which is really just an insurance
policy....
.. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have student discount
stores?
University student discount stores? You mean those state-sponsored
computer shops that put all the private computer shops out of business?
Only 1.2 :-), as for example in a nearby (10K student) university town,
there are no longer any private computer repair shops that a non-student
can go to as far as I can tell, so I'm actually picking up more business
because I'm one town away.
- John
5:49 a.m.
Ok the original topic.
I think what screwed the guy selling the 25 cent computer disks is that Microsoft,
according to the article ,sells $25 replacement restore disks. So technically he is
counterfeiting a current Microsoft product, the physical restore disk they sell. The
whole argument that there were original disks provided with the system or the software can
be downloaded for free is meaningless to the actual case. Not saying I agree with the law
they got him on as there should be some exceptions but facts are the facts. Btw. This was
the first version of the story I read that mentioned that Microsoft sold replacement
restore disks to computer refurbish shops themselves.
To put this in another way. You are allowed to make a personal backup your own stuff.
So for example I own a DVD of raiders of the lost ark, I?m allowed to make a backup for
myself. If I didn?t make a backup or lost the disk but had the packaging/case, you can
order replacement disks by contacting paramount by providing your original packaging or
damaged DVD. I have done this in the past.
Now if I made a copy of Raiders for someone else or copied it off a free TV transmission
and sold DVDs of that, it would be a crime since there still is a way to buy a replacement
DVD or watch/DVR it on free TV when it happens to be on.
Cheers,
Corey
corey cohen
u??o? ???o?
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 7, 2019, at 7:15 AM, John Foust via cctalk
<cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
?At 05:51 AM 10/7/2019, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would
have tried to sell you an extended warranty as well which is really just an insurance
policy....
.. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have student discount
stores?
University student discount stores? You mean those state-sponsored
computer shops that put all the private computer shops out of business?
Only 1.2 :-), as for example in a nearby (10K student) university town,
there are no longer any private computer repair shops that a non-student
can go to as far as I can tell, so I'm actually picking up more business
because I'm one town away.
- John
7:54 a.m.
downloaded for free is meaningless to the actual case.
Not saying I
agree with the law they got him on as there should be some exceptions
but facts are the facts. Btw. This was the first version of the story I
read that mentioned that Microsoft sold replacement restore disks to
computer refurbish shops themselves.
I thought Microsoft would refer you to Dell, and Dell would be the ones to
sell them.
Had the discs not looked like the original restore discs then he might of
gotten away with it? Trademark infringement and all. Fake Louie.
It's stupid. It really is a mess trying to restore the OS when the hard
drive dies on machines that ship with recovery partitions and no media.
I mean, the fact the restore media is on a CD/DVD just says that it's for
old crusty computers.
New machines have the license keys baked into the BIOS, the Windows tax is
built in.
But the Netflix Bill Gates docuemntary says he is cool so the young people
trust Microsoft. And of course the beautiful machines Apple was making
kind of went to hell as they focus on telephones, which are declining.
Pretty much trapped.
- Ethan
Now if I made a copy of Raiders for someone else or
copied it off a free
TV transmission and sold DVDs of that, it would be a crime since there
still is a way to buy a replacement DVD or watch/DVR it on free TV when
it happens to be on.
But that is different as Windows is protected by a software key, so the
restore disc is useless without it.
Cheers,
Corey
corey cohen
u??o? ???o?
Sent from my iPhone
--
: Ethan O'Toole
On Oct 7, 2019, at 7:15 AM, John Foust via cctalk
<cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
?At 05:51 AM 10/7/2019, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would
have tried to sell you an extended warranty as well which is really just an insurance
policy....
.. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have student discount
stores?
University student discount stores? You mean those state-sponsored
computer shops that put all the private computer shops out of business?
Only 1.2 :-), as for example in a nearby (10K student) university town,
there are no longer any private computer repair shops that a non-student
can go to as far as I can tell, so I'm actually picking up more business
because I'm one town away.
- John
8:13 a.m.
I'm fairly sure that the (near) future will be OSaaS, and you will be paying monthly
for your Windows Vi... er... OS. Not just your office productivity and LOB software.
8:15 a.m.
I'm glad retirement is now only 15 years away... no make that 17, soon to
be 20?
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 at 16:13, jwest--- via cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
wrote:
I'm fairly sure that the (near) future will be
OSaaS, and you will be
paying monthly for your Windows Vi... er... OS. Not just your office
productivity and LOB software.
--
Yoyodyne Propulsion Systems: "The Future Begins Tomorrow"
Visit us at: http://www.yoyodyne-propulsion.net
--------
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." -- Jonathan Swift
8:28 a.m.
Its been a while but same game and I'm not a player.
I just don't run windows. I jumped that ship back in 06 when
burned on NT. Since then its Linux. If you play in the swamp
of M$ then your run all the risks and costs. Its just not good
enough to be worth the pain. Any new machine I might buy must
be bare or come with Linux and in the past Asus did a few that
I still run. If not I default to ITX/miniITX boards/boxes as
they are easily gotten bare.
It also reminded me of Micro$soft Roads, a few of us likely
remember that one too.
Wait till M$ AI on your car decides some roads do not meet the
terms of service and refuses to go there.
Since schools and Uni's all seem to be M$ based maybe the terms
of service are in effect there.
And tubes... I'm like one of the few here that knows how to design
with them because I did.
Allison
On 10/7/19 10:54 AM, Ethan O'Toole via cctalk wrote:
downloaded for
free is meaningless to the actual case.? Not saying I
agree with the law they got him on as there should be some exceptions
but facts are the facts.? Btw. This was the first version of the story
I read that mentioned that Microsoft sold replacement restore disks to
computer refurbish shops themselves.
I thought Microsoft would refer you to Dell, and Dell would be the ones
to sell them.
Had the discs not looked like the original restore discs then he might
of gotten away with it? Trademark infringement and all. Fake Louie.
It's stupid. It really is a mess trying to restore the OS when the hard
drive dies on machines that ship with recovery partitions and no media.
I mean, the fact the restore media is on a CD/DVD just says that it's
for old crusty computers.
New machines have the license keys baked into the BIOS, the Windows tax
is built in.
But the Netflix Bill Gates docuemntary says he is cool so the young
people trust Microsoft. And of course the beautiful machines Apple was
making kind of went to hell as they focus on telephones, which are
declining.
Pretty much trapped.
??????????? - Ethan
Now if I made a copy of Raiders for someone else
or copied it off a
free TV transmission and sold DVDs of that, it would be a crime since
there still is a way to buy a replacement DVD or watch/DVR it on free
TV when it happens to be on.
But that is different as Windows is protected by a software key, so the
restore disc is useless without it.
Cheers,
Corey
corey cohen
u??o? ???o?
Sent from my iPhone
--
: Ethan O'Toole
On Oct 7, 2019, at 7:15 AM, John Foust via
cctalk
<cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
?At 05:51 AM 10/7/2019, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would
have tried to sell
you an extended warranty as well which is really just an insurance
policy....
.. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have
student discount stores?
University student discount stores?? You mean those state-sponsored
computer shops that put all the private computer shops out of business?
Only 1.2 :-), as for example in a nearby (10K student) university town,
there are no longer any private computer repair shops that a non-student
can go to as far as I can tell, so I'm actually picking up more business
because I'm one town away.
- John
10:26 a.m.
On 10/7/19 8:28 AM, allison via cctalk wrote:
Its been a while but same game and I'm not a
player.
I just don't run windows. I jumped that ship back in 06 when
burned on NT. Since then its Linux. If you play in the swamp
of M$ then your run all the risks and costs. Its just not good
enough to be worth the pain. Any new machine I might buy must
be bare or come with Linux and in the past Asus did a few that
I still run. If not I default to ITX/miniITX boards/boxes as
they are easily gotten bare.
I hear you--I've been on Linux for day-to-day stuff for quite a few
years, but keep a copy of XP on VirtualBox just in case.
Some of the older systems that I have legacy peripherals in also require
Windows, but it's all old versions.
I recently convinced my lovely wife to make the leap to Linux. She
really likes it.
--Chuck
7:01 p.m.
On 10/07/2019 12:26 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:
I hear you--I've been on Linux for day-to-day stuff for quite a few
years, but keep a copy of XP on VirtualBox just in case.
Some of the older systems that I have legacy peripherals in also require
Windows, but it's all old versions.
I recently convinced my lovely wife to make the leap to Linux. She
really likes it.
I've been using Linux since 1998 when I started using the
EMC program for CNC machines, which ran on a real time
version of Linux. I quickly saw I could do most normal
things better on Linux.
I now use Win XP and Win 7 for just a FEW programs which are
not available on Linux. One is an old but VERY good
electronic CAD package (Protel 99 SE, the 99 kind of gives
away the vintage!)
and my yearly tax filing program, which now required Win 7.
I run these as needed in a virtual machine. First I used
VMware, but later moved to Virtual Box.
My family used Linux when here, but they have all moved out
now, one daughter has a Dell laptop that I set up with
Linux, and my wife uses Linux and they both find it works
quite well for them.
Jon
8 Oct
8 Oct
12:12 a.m.
Unfortunately, I have to use Windoze as most medical software is M$
centric. Also, started using VB in about 1991 which allowed me to
create windows easily rather than using Hypercard on Mac. As with
most M$ programs, they decided to replace a perfectly functional VB6
which allowed one to incoporate assembly code (Hardcore VB was an
excellent resource for getting as close as one could to hardware in
windoze) with VB.NET which is a POS.
Stuck with a huge codebase of VB6 programs that I use daily and still
haven't yet succeeded in getting VB6 programs to run under Wine on my
Linux machines. Wine, however does run all of my old 16 and 32 bit
programs. Have XP running in VirtualBox and run my old Mac code in
BasiliskII. Soon as get VB6 running under Linux, will say goodbye to M$ crap.
There's a huge number of old machines out there and have systems
ranging from original XP's to 80486 based laptops which are very nice
as dedicated machines for data acquisition. In typical M$ fashion,
they came out with PenWindoze in 1991 or so, when got my first tablet
PC, and then totally changed digital ink format when they came out
with their *new and improved* version in 2000 tablet PC's. Have a
number of these old machines and M$ was actually helpfull in
providing details of their new ink format and wrote some neat drawing
programs where one can time every stroke and alter the drawing. Of
course, when I asked for the initial ink format it appears that they
"lost" it, likely because it was "too old". Have lots of drawings
that I did in early 1990's that I can see as long as the laptops they
were done on continue to function, but porting it to "new and
improved" ink format is something I don't have time for.
Planned obsolesence seems to be standard M$ policy as well as the
assumption that no person in their right mind would use hardware
that's very ancient, like 10 years old.
On 10/07/2019 12:26 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:
I hear you--I've been on Linux for day-to-day stuff for quite a few
years, but keep a copy of XP on VirtualBox just in case.
Some of the older systems that I have legacy peripherals in also require
Windows, but it's all old versions.
I recently convinced my lovely wife to make the leap to Linux. She
really likes it.
I've been using Linux since 1998 when I started using the EMC
program for CNC machines, which ran on a real time version of
Linux. I quickly saw I could do most normal things better on Linux.
I now use Win XP and Win 7 for just a FEW programs which are not
available on Linux. One is an old but VERY good electronic CAD
package (Protel 99 SE, the 99 kind of gives away the vintage!)
and my yearly tax filing program, which now required Win 7.
I run these as needed in a virtual machine. First I used VMware,
but later moved to Virtual Box.
My family used Linux when here, but they have all moved out now, one
daughter has a Dell laptop that I set up with Linux, and my wife
uses Linux and they both find it works quite well for them.
Jon
12:27 a.m.
Heh. I'm a Microsoft Admin (in addition to doing all the other IT stuff
around here)... and I hate Microsoft too, but somehow I don't want to
convert the entire company to Linux (the most important system here, the
manufacturing system, runs on Linux).
I think that would make my life, not worth living.
On Tue, 8 Oct 2019 at 08:13, Boris Gimbarzevsky via cctalk <
cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
Unfortunately, I have to use Windoze as most medical
software is M$
centric. Also, started using VB in about 1991 which allowed me to
create windows easily rather than using Hypercard on Mac. As with
most M$ programs, they decided to replace a perfectly functional VB6
which allowed one to incoporate assembly code (Hardcore VB was an
excellent resource for getting as close as one could to hardware in
windoze) with VB.NET which is a POS.
Stuck with a huge codebase of VB6 programs that I use daily and still
haven't yet succeeded in getting VB6 programs to run under Wine on my
Linux machines. Wine, however does run all of my old 16 and 32 bit
programs. Have XP running in VirtualBox and run my old Mac code in
BasiliskII. Soon as get VB6 running under Linux, will say goodbye to M$
crap.
There's a huge number of old machines out there and have systems
ranging from original XP's to 80486 based laptops which are very nice
as dedicated machines for data acquisition. In typical M$ fashion,
they came out with PenWindoze in 1991 or so, when got my first tablet
PC, and then totally changed digital ink format when they came out
with their *new and improved* version in 2000 tablet PC's. Have a
number of these old machines and M$ was actually helpfull in
providing details of their new ink format and wrote some neat drawing
programs where one can time every stroke and alter the drawing. Of
course, when I asked for the initial ink format it appears that they
"lost" it, likely because it was "too old". Have lots of drawings
that I did in early 1990's that I can see as long as the laptops they
were done on continue to function, but porting it to "new and
improved" ink format is something I don't have time for.
Planned obsolesence seems to be standard M$ policy as well as the
assumption that no person in their right mind would use hardware
that's very ancient, like 10 years old.
--
Yoyodyne Propulsion Systems: "The Future Begins Tomorrow"
Visit us at: http://www.yoyodyne-propulsion.net
--------
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." -- Jonathan Swift
On 10/07/2019 12:26 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk
wrote:
I hear you--I've been on Linux for day-to-day stuff for quite a few
years, but keep a copy of XP on VirtualBox just in case.
Some of the older systems that I have legacy peripherals in also require
Windows, but it's all old versions.
I recently convinced my lovely wife to make the leap to Linux. She
really likes it.
I've been using Linux since 1998 when I started using the EMC
program for CNC machines, which ran on a real time version of
Linux. I quickly saw I could do most normal things better on Linux.
I now use Win XP and Win 7 for just a FEW programs which are not
available on Linux. One is an old but VERY good electronic CAD
package (Protel 99 SE, the 99 kind of gives away the vintage!)
and my yearly tax filing program, which now required Win 7.
I run these as needed in a virtual machine. First I used VMware,
but later moved to Virtual Box.
My family used Linux when here, but they have all moved out now, one
daughter has a Dell laptop that I set up with Linux, and my wife
uses Linux and they both find it works quite well for them.
Jon 
7 Oct
7 Oct
1:43 p.m.
Hello all,
The problem as I see it are all of the sheep that buy
pre-configured boxes from the likes of Dell and other such providers.
They don't get the OS disc. They only receive restore discs. Most of
these users only know how to turn on the power and operate the keyboard
and/or mouse. They have no understanding of how the system works just
like most people who drive have no understanding of how an automobile works.
I have never bought a pre-configured box. I always built my own. I
started with a VIC-20 that I add a lot of extras to. I then went to a
C-64, a C-128, an Amiga 1000, Amiga 2000, Amiga 4000 and Amiga 4000T. I
modified all of these systems in lots of ways. I finally gave in because
of game availability and built my first PC clone and installed Win-95 on
it. I also had MS-Dos installed on it. I continued to use my A4000T in
conjunction with the Win 95 box. I networked my A4000T box with the Win
95 box using ARCNet. I also went the upgrade route with MS. WinNT,
Win2000, WinXP, and now Win 8.1 Pro. I have also dabbled in Linux but
the games always brought me back to Windoze.
So I have some knowledge and ability concerning computers and how
they work where most users have almost zero knowledge and ability.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!
On 10/7/2019 10:28 AM, allison via cctalk wrote:
Its been a while but same game and I'm not a
player.
I just don't run windows. I jumped that ship back in 06 when
burned on NT. Since then its Linux. If you play in the swamp
of M$ then your run all the risks and costs. Its just not good
enough to be worth the pain. Any new machine I might buy must
be bare or come with Linux and in the past Asus did a few that
I still run. If not I default to ITX/miniITX boards/boxes as
they are easily gotten bare.
It also reminded me of Micro$soft Roads, a few of us likely
remember that one too.
Wait till M$ AI on your car decides some roads do not meet the
terms of service and refuses to go there.
Since schools and Uni's all seem to be M$ based maybe the terms
of service are in effect there.
And tubes... I'm like one of the few here that knows how to design
with them because I did.
Allison
On 10/7/19 10:54 AM, Ethan O'Toole via cctalk wrote:
downloaded for free is meaningless to the actual case. Not saying I
agree with the law they got him on as there should be some exceptions
but facts are the facts. Btw. This was the first version of the story
I read that mentioned that Microsoft sold replacement restore disks to
computer refurbish shops themselves.
I thought Microsoft would refer you to Dell,
and Dell would be the ones
to sell them.
Had the discs not looked like the original restore discs then he might
of gotten away with it? Trademark infringement and all. Fake Louie.
It's stupid. It really is a mess trying to restore the OS when the hard
drive dies on machines that ship with recovery partitions and no media.
I mean, the fact the restore media is on a CD/DVD just says that it's
for old crusty computers.
New machines have the license keys baked into the BIOS, the Windows tax
is built in.
But the Netflix Bill Gates docuemntary says he is cool so the young
people trust Microsoft. And of course the beautiful machines Apple was
making kind of went to hell as they focus on telephones, which are
declining.
Pretty much trapped.
- Ethan
Now if I made a copy of Raiders for someone else
or copied it off a
free TV transmission and sold DVDs of that, it would be a crime since
there still is a way to buy a replacement DVD or watch/DVR it on free
TV when it happens to be on.
But that is different as Windows is protected by a
software key, so the
restore disc is useless without it.
Cheers,
Corey
corey cohen
u??o? ???o?
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 7, 2019, at 7:15 AM, John Foust via cctalk
> <cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> ?At 05:51 AM 10/7/2019, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
>> Must be the USA PC World. In the UK they would have tried to sell
>> you an extended warranty as well which is really just an insurance
>> policy....
>> .. but the question is why PC World. Don't US universities have
>> student discount stores?
> University student discount stores? You mean those state-sponsored
> computer shops that put all the private computer shops out of business?
>
> Only 1.2 :-), as for example in a nearby (10K student) university town,
> there are no longer any private computer repair shops that a non-student
> can go to as far as I can tell, so I'm actually picking up more business
> because I'm one town away.
>
> - John
>
--
: Ethan O'Toole
8:21 a.m.
I think what screwed the guy selling the 25 cent
computer disks is that
Microsoft, according to the article ,sells $25 replacement restore
disks. So technically he is counterfeiting a current Microsoft
product, the physical restore disk they sell.
I am not sure about the veracity of that. I.E. If you call Microsoft or Dell and tell them
you have a 486 PC you bought 30 years ago with Win 3.1 license they would be willing to
provide you with a restore disks at any price. That aside - his biggest mistake was
CHARGING for the discs, even if it was a nominal 25 cents, especially if he could not
verify original license holder being the purchaser. If he had given the discs away with a
refurbished system, even if he worked the price into the system price, with a license I
think he would have been fine.
-Ali
p.s. I am not a lawyer I only play one online! :)
8:25 a.m.
original license holder being the purchaser. If he had
given the discs
away with a refurbished system, even if he worked the price into the
system price, with a license I think he would have been fine.
US Customs looks for items with trademarks of certain protected brands and
then you get in trouble.
If they were shipped via DHL there probably wouldn't have been the same
issue. ;-)
- Ethan
--
: Ethan O'Toole
12:21 p.m.
On 2019-10-07 08:49, corey cohen via cctalk wrote:
So for example I own a DVD of raiders of the lost ark,
I?m allowed to
make a backup for myself.
Just beware I don't believe there has been a DMCA challenge that
validates your claim yet. Fair-use is always subjective. And truth
often drops to the bottom of reasons for prosecutions. I can't afford
your bail bond Corey :( So be careful and don't call Evan as a
character witness!
"Initially, federal prosecutors valued the discs at $299 each..." That
wasn't because of un-willful ignorance. It is not in the prosecutions'
best interest to counter a weak claim that bolsters their case - even an
erroneous one. That's the defense's job. Most prosecutors inflate
initial damage claims to untruthful absurd levels because there is very
little procedural opportunity for the defense to challenge. And doing
so will slow down a trial bearing considerable cost. A common way
prosecutors pressure pleas - literally starve them out. It's a bit
unsavory at best and unethical at worst; but legal.
We have a great criminal justice system. But it's run by people who can
be flawed - or motivated by politics such as their own elections. And
it predicates success on both sides opposing at full force with equal
resources. That is not the reality in nearly all proceedings. My view
refined significantly when I stood in a court room on the other side
potentially facing 9 years on new computer related statutes that no one
understood - including my lawyer.
-A
2:32 a.m.
Note:- This storey is a year old...
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk <cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org> On Behalf Of Jeffrey S. Worley
via cctalk
Sent: 07 October 2019 04:24
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Nuke Redmond!
A fellow who was putting the air in "Microsoft Tire" (c) is going to prison.
Microsoft claims that the air they give free with the tire is not free. You can
download the air and install the air and use the air, but noone can help you do
it or they will spend 15months in federal prison and pay 3/4 of a million beans
in damages for helping you and charging nothing for it but a quarter for the
electricity it cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyright-
20180426-
story.html?fbclid=IwAR3v6MDIUWtqyUxcupT7YQOaX5a7bzrKZKAZWKQFYkdzbg
9xvWhvRVkSuq4
Jeff
3:19 a.m.
It is.
He ended up serving 15 months in prison for making rescue disks that were
based on downloadable software that required licence keys that the PCs that
he refurbished already had.
It's a complex.case and the judge didn't understand the actual value of the
media which was zero.
Sadly technically he did breach copyright.
So lesson to learn.
Stay away from software giants who have bigger bankrolls than you do.
On Mon, 7 Oct. 2019, 8:33 pm Dave Wade via cctalk, <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
wrote:
Note:- This storey is a year old...
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk <cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org> On Behalf Of Jeffrey S.
Worley
via cctalk
Sent: 07 October 2019 04:24
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Nuke Redmond!
A fellow who was putting the air in "Microsoft Tire" (c) is going to
prison.
Microsoft claims that the air they give free with
the tire is not free.
You can
download the air and install the air and use the
air, but noone can help
you do
it or they will spend 15months in federal prison
and pay 3/4 of a
million beans
in damages for helping you and charging nothing
for it but a quarter for
the
electricity it cost to put the air in.
https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-microsoft-copyright-
20180426-
story.html?fbclid=IwAR3v6MDIUWtqyUxcupT7YQOaX5a7bzrKZKAZWKQFYkdzbg
9xvWhvRVkSuq4
Jeff
1685
days inactive
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