10 Jan
2001
10 Jan
'01
7:31 a.m.
On Tue, 9 Jan 2001, Louis Schulman wrote:
Non-Apple drives work quite well with Macs; however, while your
observation about the use of Apple's HD SC Utility is correct,
all non-Apple SCSI drives sold *FOR* the Mac come with their
own SCSI setup utility.
For a SCSI drive *NOT* sold _for_ a Mac, you'd need a third-party
toolkit like FWB' Hard Disk Tools (or whatever it's called). I've
used it to add IBM and DEC SCSI drives to a Mac.
regards,
-dq
OK, here is a very elementary question that has
always
stumped me. Is there any difference between an external
SCSI hard drive made for a Mac and a generic SCSI hard
drive? Can I hook up a Mac SCSI hard drive to some other
computer with a SCSI interface and expect it to work (after
formatting, of course)? What about the other way around?
The first alternative works very well indeed. The second won't, though.
Macs use hard drives with a particular Apple firmware, without which HD SC
Utility won't recognise the drive. Bloody stupid. Another Apple
peculiarity would be its lack of support for remote start in
SCSI, so the hard drives will need to jumpered for automatic start on
power, but this won't affect other systems. 
10 Jan
10 Jan
8:54 a.m.
Non-Apple drives work quite well with Macs; however,
while your
observation about the use of Apple's HD SC Utility is correct,
all non-Apple SCSI drives sold *FOR* the Mac come with their
own SCSI setup utility.
For a SCSI drive *NOT* sold _for_ a Mac, you'd need a third-party
toolkit like FWB' Hard Disk Tools (or whatever it's called). I've
used it to add IBM and DEC SCSI drives to a Mac.
You can also use a version of HDSC Setup which has been ResEdit-hacked to
disable the Apple branding restriction. I have it myself, but a far better
collection is this one:
http://www.accesscom.com/~gamba/superbooter2.html
Although it boots on 68K only, it contains both stock and patched HDSC
7.3.5, Disk First Aid 7.2.2, and an .sea of MicroNet Utility 7.2.7 (unpack it
to a RAM disk, included with the AppDisk 1.6.1 app on the disk) for those
absolutely stubborn drives that can't be formatted or repartitioned with the
other tools. It's now my hard disk toolkit of choice. Use it by itself, or
steal the tools on it for your own personal Disk Tools.
--
----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ --
Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser(a)stockholm.ptloma.edu
-- If you think ignorance is expensive, try education. ------------------------
9:14 a.m.
On Wed, 10 Jan 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote:
Granted, I forgot to mention that there are other SCSI setup utilities,
but why in the world would one need to buy a drive /for/ a particular
brand of computer? A hard drive is a hard drive is a hard drive.
On Tue, 9 Jan
2001, Louis Schulman wrote:
Non-Apple drives work quite well with Macs; however, while your
observation about the use of Apple's HD SC Utility is correct,
all non-Apple SCSI drives sold *FOR* the Mac come with their
own SCSI setup utility. OK, here is a very elementary question that has
always
stumped me. Is there any difference between an external
SCSI hard drive made for a Mac and a generic SCSI hard
drive? Can I hook up a Mac SCSI hard drive to some other
computer with a SCSI interface and expect it to work (after
formatting, of course)? What about the other way around?
The first alternative works very well indeed. The second won't, though.
Macs use hard drives with a particular Apple firmware, without which HD SC
Utility won't recognise the drive. Bloody stupid. Another Apple
peculiarity would be its lack of support for remote start in
SCSI, so the hard drives will need to jumpered for automatic start on
power, but this won't affect other systems. For a SCSI drive *NOT* sold _for_ a Mac, you'd
need a third-party
toolkit like FWB' Hard Disk Tools (or whatever it's called). I've
used it to add IBM and DEC SCSI drives to a Mac.
I've got an Apple-edition IBM drive in a IIcx here. =)
12:42 p.m.
Iggy asks:
Granted, I forgot to mention that there are other SCSI
setup utilities,
but why in the world would one need to buy a drive /for/ a particular
brand of computer? A hard drive is a hard drive is a hard drive.
Although they don't make them now, that wasn't always true for HP drives.
They claimed to have a (patented?) method of ensuring that if power failed
during a wite to a drive, no partial sector would be written. (This feature
as called "sector atomicity".) This was useful on their early/mid-1990s
PA-RISC systems (HP 3000, HP 9000) that had battery backup for the
system memory. A short (15 minutes or less) power outage wouldn't kill
the system. As the bean-counters took over, and dropped the internal
batteries (saving a small number of $$), HP stopped producing this kind
of system (instead, they started selling UPS for the entire system) and
they stopped making that kind of disk drive. Towards the
end, they were using Seagate (and Quantum?) drives with HP firmware.
(Note that I'm not claiming that it *worked*, nor that other drives
were really more likely to write a partial sector during a power fail!)
Now, "sector atomicity" is a forgotten phrase in HP, along with other ideas
like "the HP Way" :(
Stan Sieler sieler(a)allegro.com
www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html www.allegro.com/sieler
7:10 p.m.
Stan Sieler skrev:
Iggy asks:
> Granted, I forgot to mention that there are other
SCSI setup utilities,
> but why in the world would one need to buy a drive /for/ a particular
> brand of computer? A hard drive is a hard drive is a hard drive.
Although they don't make them now, that wasn't
always true for HP drives.
They claimed to have a (patented?) method of ensuring that if power failed
during a wite to a drive, no partial sector would be written. (This feature
as called "sector atomicity".) This was useful on their early/mid-1990s
PA-RISC systems (HP 3000, HP 9000) that had battery backup for the system
memory. A short (15 minutes or less) power outage wouldn't kill the system.
As the bean-counters took over, and dropped the internal batteries (saving a
small number of $$), HP stopped producing this kind of system (instead, they
started selling UPS for the entire system) and they stopped making that kind
of disk drive. Towards the end, they were using Seagate (and Quantum?)
drives with HP firmware.
Now, "sector atomicity" is a forgotten phrase
in HP, along with other ideas
like "the HP Way" :(
The file system I'm using right now, SFS (Smart Filesystem), has got sector
atomicity, but instead, it's handled on a filesystem level as opposed to
hardware. That memory backup thing does seem useful, tough.
--
En ligne avec Thor 2.6.
Schont die Sockel, wenn ihr die Denkm?ler st?rzt. Sie k?nnten noch gebraucht
werden.
--- Stanislaw Jerzy Lec
8772
days inactive
8772
days old
4 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com -
optimus＠canit.se -
spectre＠stockholm.ptloma.edu -
ss＠allegro.com