20 Jul
2001
20 Jul
'01
12:01 p.m.
Today at the UW-Madison surplus sale, a favorite haunt,
I found a box containing eight or nine software boxes.
Sure enough, it looked like a complete set of all the
software from IBM that shipped with the original IBM PC
circa 1982: DOS 1.1, 2.0 and the full UCSD p-System, including
FORTRAN, the assembler and Pascal. Everything pristine.
All disks in place. The shrinkwrap was still around a
few of the boxes.
No price on the box, so I search for the Pricing Guy.
"Sorry, we can't sell software." I knew about this
policy - the University destroys all the software it
can no longer use. I'm sad that I found the item on
the sale floor but can't buy it. He refers me to Boss #1.
He says "we can't sell that, how did that get out here?
Go talk to Boss #2." Boss #2 says "Three dollars."
Back to Pricing Guy. I say, "Boss #2 said three bucks."
Boss #1 is still within earshot, he says "Boss #2 can't
do that." (So why did you send me to him?)
Boss #1 takes the box and heads for the back room,
where the disks will be "recycled" and the manuals
shredded.
- John
www.threedee.com/jcm
1:45 p.m.
Boss #1 takes
the box and heads for the back room,
where the disks will be "recycled" and the manuals
shredded.
Time to write a few letters. Where does this destroy all old software
mentality come from? Does it have a basis in fact?
6:09 p.m.
On Fri, 20 Jul 2001, Mike Ford wrote:
Time to write a few letters. Where does this destroy
all old software
mentality come from? Does it have a basis in fact?
It's no doubt related to the same sort of foolish mentality that
exists in the Maryland government, where our esteemed idiot governor,
Paris Spenddenning (quite possibly with the help of associate guvner
Kathleen "Chappaquiddick" Townwrecker) has discouraged junkyards from
keeping any cars over 10 years old in stock for more than a few days;
the old cars are scrapped quickly so that heavy taxes can be avoided.
Of course, we all know the real reason for all this, right? It has
nothing to to with being good to the environment... the purpose is to
help biz droids sell new cars and new computer software, etc. that
people might not otherwise purchase.
--
Copyright (C) 2001 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals:
All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature &
rdd(a)rddavis.net 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such
http://www.rddavis.net beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.
12:56 p.m.
On Fri, 20 Jul 2001, John Foust wrote:
He says "we can't sell that, how did that get
out here? Go talk to
Boss #2." Boss #2 says "Three dollars." Back to Pricing Guy. I say,
"Boss #2 said three bucks." Boss #1 is still within earshot, he says
"Boss #2 can't do that." (So why did you send me to him?)
Boss #1 takes the box and heads for the back room, where the disks
will be "recycled" and the manuals shredded.
Lame. Lame, lame, lame.
You should've taken the box and made a bee-line for the door ;)
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
2:13 p.m.
On Fri, 20 Jul 2001, John Foust wrote:
Boss #1 takes the box and heads for the back room,
where the disks
will be "recycled" and the manuals shredded.
Next time, ...
FIRST, separate the disks from the manuals. Now, stop calling them
manuals!, and ask them how much for the "books".
Then, separately, find a functioning machine with 6.00 or above or WIN9x,
do a FORMAT B: /Q , and ask them how much for the "BLANK" diskettes.
The p disks will require more than a simple UNFORMAT, but still reasonably
doable.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
<A HREF= "http://www.xenosoft.com/dogears" >DogEars</A>
5:55 p.m.
On Fri, 20 Jul 2001, Sellam Ismail wrote:
Lame. Lame, lame, lame.
You should've taken the box and made a bee-line for the door ;)
Yes, he could have just quickly paid the $3 and run with the box. If
that didn't work, then more drastic methods, like, convincing someone
else to shout "fire!," would create the necessary level of distraction
necessary to save that box of software and documentation from
destruction...
--
Copyright (C) 2001 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals:
All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature &
rdd(a)rddavis.net 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such
http://www.rddavis.net beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.
21 Jul
21 Jul
3:41 a.m.
At 10:55 PM 7/20/01 -0400, R. D. Davis wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jul 2001, Sellam Ismail wrote:
I forgot to mention that the Big Boss is at the door, Wal-Mart style,
checking receipts against goods.
A number of scenarios went through my mind... hiding the disks,
claiming they were manuals (although I suspect they can't sell
the manuals, either) etc., but I just chalked it up to
experience. I wasted a good 20 minutes arguing (pleasantly)
about a $3 box of software, and that makes less sense to me.
I've visited this place on and off for at least fifteen years,
spent lots of money, and hope to do it in the future. I wouldn't
want to be accused of shoplifting because of some old PC disks.
- John
Lame. Lame, lame, lame.
> You should've taken the box and made a bee-line for the door ;)
Yes, he
could have just quickly paid the $3 and run with the box.
6:13 a.m.
On Sat, 21 Jul 2001, John Foust wrote:
A number of scenarios went through my mind... hiding
the disks,
claiming they were manuals (although I suspect they can't sell
the manuals, either) etc., but I just chalked it up to
NOT "MANUALS"!!!
"BOOKS"!
In many such situations, "Manuals" can not be sold. But "Books" can.
There is something incomprehensibly mystical about the "laws" regarding
software and even manuals. But "everybody knows" that used books are
transferrable.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
6:44 a.m.
My guess would be that the university does not want to make the
mistake of selling software they don't 'own', but had licensed.
I beleive that some operating systems (like from DEC) are never
'sold', and cannot be transfered to a third party.
"Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jul 2001, John Foust wrote:
A number of scenarios went through my mind...
hiding the disks,
claiming they were manuals (although I suspect they can't sell
the manuals, either) etc., but I just chalked it up to
NOT "MANUALS"!!!
"BOOKS"!
In many such situations, "Manuals" can not be sold. But "Books"
can.
There is something incomprehensibly mystical about the "laws" regarding
software and even manuals. But "everybody knows" that used books are
transferrable.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
6:49 a.m.
On Sat, 21 Jul 2001, Bob Shannon wrote:
My guess would be that the university does not want to
make the
mistake of selling software they don't 'own', but had licensed.
I beleive that some operating systems (like from DEC) are never
'sold', and cannot be transfered to a third party.
That is apparently what is going on.
But what _I_ was pointing out was that referring to the docs as
"manuals" merely solidifies that position. Calling them "books" is
the
way to question whether they should be classified as non-resellable.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
"Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" wrote:
--
Fred Cisin cisin(a)xenosoft.com
XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com
PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366
Berkeley, CA 94701-1236
On Sat, 21 Jul 2001, John Foust wrote:
A number of scenarios went through my mind...
hiding the disks,
claiming they were manuals (although I suspect they can't sell
the manuals, either) etc., but I just chalked it up to
NOT "MANUALS"!!!
"BOOKS"!
In many such situations, "Manuals" can not be sold. But "Books"
can.
There is something incomprehensibly mystical about the "laws" regarding
software and even manuals. But "everybody knows" that used books are
transferrable.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com 
3:48 a.m.
You
should've taken the box and made a bee-line for the door ;)
Yes, he could have just quickly paid the $3 and run with the box. If
that didn't work, then more drastic methods, like, convincing someone 
20 Jul
20 Jul
1:20 p.m.
Hmm sounds like you could have just walked out with them and no one would
know what to do - is it shoplifting if it wasn't for sale? Would they even
know if it was theirs? The wonders of the learned beauracracy.
-> -----Original Message-----
-> From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
-> [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of John Foust
-> Sent: Friday, July 20, 2001 4:01 PM
-> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
-> Subject: Sad experience
->
->
->
-> Today at the UW-Madison surplus sale, a favorite haunt,
-> I found a box containing eight or nine software boxes.
->
-> Sure enough, it looked like a complete set of all the
-> software from IBM that shipped with the original IBM PC
-> circa 1982: DOS 1.1, 2.0 and the full UCSD p-System, including
-> FORTRAN, the assembler and Pascal. Everything pristine.
-> All disks in place. The shrinkwrap was still around a
-> few of the boxes.
->
-> No price on the box, so I search for the Pricing Guy.
-> "Sorry, we can't sell software." I knew about this
-> policy - the University destroys all the software it
-> can no longer use. I'm sad that I found the item on
-> the sale floor but can't buy it. He refers me to Boss #1.
->
-> He says "we can't sell that, how did that get out here?
-> Go talk to Boss #2." Boss #2 says "Three dollars."
-> Back to Pricing Guy. I say, "Boss #2 said three bucks."
-> Boss #1 is still within earshot, he says "Boss #2 can't
-> do that." (So why did you send me to him?)
->
-> Boss #1 takes the box and heads for the back room,
-> where the disks will be "recycled" and the manuals
-> shredded.
->
-> - John
-> www.threedee.com/jcm
->
8404
days inactive
8405
days old
12 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
bshannon＠tiac.net -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
foo＠siconic.com -
jfoust＠threedee.com -
lemay＠cs.umn.edu -
mikeford＠socal.rr.com -
rdd＠smart.net -
rhblake＠bigfoot.com