17 Oct
2015
17 Oct
'15
1:16 p.m.
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
When I put that switch in the other position and press RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
Thanks,
- Henk
17 Oct
17 Oct
2:06 p.m.
I will reply off-list as usual...
Bruce
On 10/17/2015 2:16 PM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help
carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
When I put that switch in the other position and press RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
Thanks,
- Henk
2:50 p.m.
Whilst I have no experience of DG systems I am familar with drives of
that era.
The red label is important. If you did not put the shipping locks in we
must assume it travelled without.
Thats not good. If the journey was not too bumpy then you may be ok.
I have seen floppy drives with shipping locks but its not usual. So the
floppy drive might be a good place to start. The drive may be fine but
disks do not last forever. I would want to be sure the actual disk was ok.
Does it have any kind of power on self test?
As it appears that system does not boot nor do you get any out put on a
terminal.
(You do have a terminal attached) perhaps a good mechanical check of
the floppy drive.
Things like belts and rubber components are worth a look.
Rod
On 17/10/2015 21:16, Henk Gooijen wrote:
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help
carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
When I put that switch in the other position and press RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
Thanks,
- Henk
18 Oct
18 Oct
9:48 a.m.
Thanks Rod,
I feel stupid ... It would have been a simple check to see whether
the floppy drive actually rotates the floppy [dumb, dumb, dumb].
I did transport the disk drive very carefully ... The trip was not
bumpy, and most of it was on a (smooth) highway.
Keeping fingers crossed.
Checking the drive belts is a good idea! May have fallen off,
I have seen that before on DEC drives (RX01, RX02). Whether the
hard disk has a self test, I don't know (yet).
I have the terminal connected that was used with the system,
a Dasher D200. I am pretty sure that the connection is correct,
but now I start having doubts.
Floppy diskette still OK is the big question. Interesting system,
I need to study the documentation!
greetz,
- Henk
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
From: Rod Smallwood
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2015 11:50 PM
To: General at classiccmp.org ; Discussion at classiccmp.org:On-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Data General NOVA 4/C help
Whilst I have no experience of DG systems I am familar with drives of
that era.
The red label is important. If you did not put the shipping locks in we
must assume it travelled without.
Thats not good. If the journey was not too bumpy then you may be ok.
I have seen floppy drives with shipping locks but its not usual. So the
floppy drive might be a good place to start. The drive may be fine but
disks do not last forever. I would want to be sure the actual disk was ok.
Does it have any kind of power on self test?
As it appears that system does not boot nor do you get any out put on a
terminal.
(You do have a terminal attached) perhaps a good mechanical check of
the floppy drive.
Things like belts and rubber components are worth a look.
Rod
On 17/10/2015 21:16, Henk Gooijen wrote:
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help
carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
When I put that switch in the other position and press RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
Thanks,
- Henk
10:24 a.m.
On 10/18/2015 11:48 AM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
Thanks Rod,
I feel stupid ... It would have been a simple check to see whether
the floppy drive actually rotates the floppy [dumb, dumb, dumb].
I did transport the disk drive very carefully ... The trip was not
bumpy, and most of it was on a (smooth) highway.
Keeping fingers crossed.
Checking the drive belts is a good idea! May have fallen off,
I have seen that before on DEC drives (RX01, RX02). Whether the
hard disk has a self test, I don't know (yet).
I have the terminal connected that was used with the system,
a Dasher D200. I am pretty sure that the connection is correct,
but now I start having doubts.
Floppy diskette still OK is the big question. Interesting system,
I need to study the documentation!
greetz,
- Henk
On one of my two hard drives, there is a tendency for the belt to spin
off on startup, too.
JRJ
10:45 a.m.
Ok good
I don't think the heads will load until the floppy disk is turning.
If its a belt driven drive (most 8" drives were) replace the belt anyway.
I have seen plenty of drives where the belt has become sticky and glued itself
to one of the drive wheels. It tries to turn and breaks.
So clean off any residue on the drive wheels.
I am short on DG knowledge but the norm was disk present plus door closed would cause
motor start
either as a drive function or via a CPU interrupt.
----Original message----
From : henk.gooijen at hotmail.com
Date :
18/10/2015 - 16:48 (UTC)
To : cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject : Re: Data General NOVA 4/C help
Thanks Rod,
I feel stupid ... It would have been a simple check to see whether
the floppy drive actually rotates the floppy [dumb, dumb, dumb].
I did transport the disk drive very carefully ... The trip was not
bumpy, and most of it was on a (smooth) highway.
Keeping fingers crossed.
Checking the drive belts is a good idea! May have fallen off,
I have seen that before on DEC drives (RX01, RX02). Whether the
hard disk has a self test, I don't know (yet).
I have the terminal connected that was used with the system,
a Dasher D200. I am pretty sure that the connection is correct,
but now I start having doubts.
Floppy diskette still OK is the big question. Interesting system,
I need to study the documentation!
greetz,
- Henk
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
From: Rod Smallwood
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2015 11:50 PM
To: General at classiccmp.org ; Discussion at classiccmp.org:On-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Data General NOVA 4/C help
Whilst I have no experience of DG systems I am familar with drives of
that era.
The red label is important. If you did not put the shipping locks in we
must assume it travelled without.
Thats not good. If the journey was not too bumpy then you may be ok.
I have seen floppy drives with shipping locks but its not usual. So the
floppy drive might be a good place to start. The drive may be fine but
disks do not last forever. I would want to be sure the actual disk was ok.
Does it have any kind of power on self test?
As it appears that system does not boot nor do you get any out put on a
terminal.
(You do have a terminal attached) perhaps a good mechanical check of
the floppy drive.
Things like belts and rubber components are worth a look.
Rod
On 17/10/2015 21:16, Henk Gooijen wrote:
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help
carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
When I put that switch in the other position and press RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
Thanks,
- Henk
11:32 a.m.
Thanks Jay and Rod,
you gave me a lot of pointers to check. I agree that getting
a console working is on top of the todo list. However, I better
put on old clothes for next Saturday. I want to have at least
a look at the head lock and shipping bracket, but do not want
to remove the disk out of the rack again. Although I can lift
it on my own, I did feel my back that evening :-/
So, it will be sliding out the drive and then crawl under it,
laying on the floor removing the bottom cover ...
Haven't thought about looking in the eclipse folder on bitsavers!
Gonna look for that Virtual Console. The papers that came with
the system tell about a single letter to start the application,
not xxxxxL, so there might be a console ROM.
I can probe the header pins on the "multiplexer" paddle board
to which the terminal connects with a "BERG" header. There are
just 3 wires, so that must be RxD, TxD and GND.
tnx!
- Henk
1:26 p.m.
On 10/18/2015 1:32 PM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
Thanks Jay and Rod,
you gave me a lot of pointers to check. I agree that getting
a console working is on top of the todo list. However, I better
put on old clothes for next Saturday. I want to have at least
a look at the head lock and shipping bracket, but do not want
to remove the disk out of the rack again. Although I can lift
it on my own, I did feel my back that evening :-/
So, it will be sliding out the drive and then crawl under it,
laying on the floor removing the bottom cover ...
Yup. I know that drill only too well.
Haven't thought about looking in the eclipse
folder on bitsavers!
Gonna look for that Virtual Console. The papers that came with
the system tell about a single letter to start the application,
not xxxxxL, so there might be a console ROM.
I can probe the header pins on the "multiplexer" paddle board
to which the terminal connects with a "BERG" header. There are
just 3 wires, so that must be RxD, TxD and GND.
tnx!
- Henk
10:40 p.m.
Hi
If the terminal is rs232 get a break out box if you don't already have one.
If terminal plug is a 25way D type connect pins 2 and 3 then see if you get an echo back.
Some times the terminal looks for a control signal but 99% of the time pins 2,3 and 7
(ground) are all you need
Speed, parity and stop bits are probably ok if the terminal was part of the system
The BOB will tell you if the CPU serial port is alive. LEDS on pins 2 and 3 should be on.
Once the terminal is running then you should get some kind of response from the system.
Rod
----Original message----
From : cube1 at charter.net
Date : 18/10/2015 -
20:26 (UTC)
To : cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject : Re: Data General NOVA 4/C help
On 10/18/2015 1:32 PM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
Thanks Jay and Rod,
you gave me a lot of pointers to check. I agree that getting
a console working is on top of the todo list. However, I better
put on old clothes for next Saturday. I want to have at least
a look at the head lock and shipping bracket, but do not want
to remove the disk out of the rack again. Although I can lift
it on my own, I did feel my back that evening :-/
So, it will be sliding out the drive and then crawl under it,
laying on the floor removing the bottom cover ...
Yup. I know that drill only too well.
Haven't thought about looking in the eclipse
folder on bitsavers!
Gonna look for that Virtual Console. The papers that came with
the system tell about a single letter to start the application,
not xxxxxL, so there might be a console ROM.
I can probe the header pins on the "multiplexer" paddle board
to which the terminal connects with a "BERG" header. There are
just 3 wires, so that must be RxD, TxD and GND.
tnx!
- Henk
20 Oct
20 Oct
12:45 p.m.
With thanks to Bruce, Jay and Rod, good news, although something
has gone wrong first. Learned a few things! Long story ...
As I did not see anything on the Dasher D200 terminal screen, I first
checked the cable, assuming that the terminal did not develop issues
in the years being stored in the attic.
The cable checked out fine, and thus I now know which wires are RxD
and TxD (the cable is just 3 wires, no hardware handshake).
After connecting TxD to RxD anything typed on the keyboard appears on
the screen. So indeed, the terminal is OK.
Moving to the "UNIVERSAL LINE MULTIPLEXER PADDLE BD". Lots of wires are
soldered to this paddle board, but as far as I can see none of those
wires goes to any pin of the card edge connectors of slot #1, the NOVA
processor. I figured that perhaps traces on the backplane lead from
slot #1 to another slot, so I had a better look at the paddle board.
It has 5 identical rows of pins. Each row is 13 pins with pin 4 (or 10
depending where you start counting) removed.
Long story short, I did not see any signals on any pin when the NOVA is
reset.
Using the doc that I got from Bruce (tnx agn!) I tried to find signals
or voltage levels that might be something "RS-232-ish".
Hooked up two thin test wires (with small hooks). One on GND, the other
on the pin that would carry TxD. Stepping to the front of the computer,
where I could press the RESET button, and look at the scope screen.
RESET ... nothing, bummer.
Back to the rear side of the computer to hook up another pin ... smoke!
Smoke was coming from the GND test hook. Power off!
The hook plastic was molten and that produced the smoke. I could remove
the hook from the pin, but the hook is gone and the test hook is gone.
What went wrong?
After a few minutes I came to the conclusion that the pin that I assumed
to be GND was not GND, but something else, and most likely a power supply
pin. Looking again at the schematic drawing, I saw my error :-/
The NOVA has two card edge connectors, seeing from the rear, the left
connector is "A" and the right connector is "B". Further, each
connector
has two rows of pins. In my ignorance of DG, I thought that the top row
of pins was "A", and the bottom row of pins is row "B". And each row
has
100 pins ... dumb, dumb!
A simple count from 1 up, would have shown that one row has only 50 pins!
Each connector has all *odd* pins on the upper row and all *even* pins on
the bottom row.
Soooo, what I thought to be B99 (=GND) is actually pin A98, and that is
+5V. It is a good thing that my test leads and hooks are small, so in
case of high currents the power supply will "win", the hook/wire
"loose".
As the computer did not do anything "different", I hoped the power supply
could handle the "semi" short circuit.
With the new insight of how you should count the pins, I had another look
at the BERG header. The GND, RxD and TxD aligned with appropriate pins on
the top row, last series of pins of connector A. It could well be that
the connector (as it was hooked up when I picked up the machine) was not
correct! Also, I seem to remember the system originally had *two* D200s,
but I got only one terminal. Possibly the hooked up terminal was "the
other terminal", not the console terminal ... and the console terminal
would have been connected on the pins of connector A slot #1.
Hmmmm, let's try that. The signals would match as the RxD pin of the
terminal would connect to backplane pin A85 which is TxD, etc.
Another long story short ... :-)
Terminal on, waiting until the screen shows some background light, then
NOVA on (the rest stays off). Hurray! I see an "O" appearing on the
screen and a second or so later, the letter "K" and on the next line
"!000000" and another line with "!" This is exactly what should
happen.
Getting bold now. Trying to boot from disk. So, I switched on the disk
drive. With my ear against the front panel, I can hear a sound that could
be a spindle drive. Then a rather loud "humming", a "click", the
humming
stops and then I can still hear the spindle ... but the READY LED is on.
So, I RESET the NOVA. "OK !000000 !", but that's all, no joy.
"OK", let's
try the floppy disk. I removed the front panel to switch the floppy drive
to be the boot device ... it already is the boot device! No wonder that
nothing happened, because I had no floppy in the drive! Inserted the
"startup" floppy ... nope, no good. As the front cover was removed and
the disk was spinning (I assumed), I set the switch in the other position
so that the hard disk is boot device. RESET the NOVA again. The READY
LED flashes a few times and I get the text "FILENAME ?" on the screen!
I guess that the startup automatically starts the accounting application
as that program asks for a (customer) account file to be opened.
I had a glance over the doc that came with the system, so I "knew" a file
name that I could enter ... DOSINIT. That worked! However, the program
asks for a drive identifier. Not knowing what could happen (wipe disk...)
I aborted the program and switched off the disk and then the NOVA.
All in all a well-spent evening. With good feeling I closed my "museum"
and went back home (to type this).
- Henk
2:54 p.m.
On 10/20/2015 2:45 PM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
With thanks to Bruce, Jay and Rod, good news, although
something
has gone wrong first. Learned a few things! Long story ...
As I did not see anything on the Dasher D200 terminal screen, I first
checked the cable, assuming that the terminal did not develop issues
in the years being stored in the attic.
The cable checked out fine, and thus I now know which wires are RxD
and TxD (the cable is just 3 wires, no hardware handshake).
After connecting TxD to RxD anything typed on the keyboard appears on
the screen. So indeed, the terminal is OK.
Moving to the "UNIVERSAL LINE MULTIPLEXER PADDLE BD". Lots of wires are
soldered to this paddle board, but as far as I can see none of those
wires goes to any pin of the card edge connectors of slot #1, the NOVA
processor. I figured that perhaps traces on the backplane lead from
slot #1 to another slot, so I had a better look at the paddle board.
It has 5 identical rows of pins. Each row is 13 pins with pin 4 (or 10
depending where you start counting) removed.
Long story short, I did not see any signals on any pin when the NOVA is
reset.
Using the doc that I got from Bruce (tnx agn!) I tried to find signals
or voltage levels that might be something "RS-232-ish".
Hooked up two thin test wires (with small hooks). One on GND, the other
on the pin that would carry TxD. Stepping to the front of the computer,
where I could press the RESET button, and look at the scope screen.
RESET ... nothing, bummer.
Back to the rear side of the computer to hook up another pin ... smoke!
Smoke was coming from the GND test hook. Power off!
The hook plastic was molten and that produced the smoke. I could remove
the hook from the pin, but the hook is gone and the test hook is gone.
What went wrong?
After a few minutes I came to the conclusion that the pin that I assumed
to be GND was not GND, but something else, and most likely a power supply
pin. Looking again at the schematic drawing, I saw my error :-/
The NOVA has two card edge connectors, seeing from the rear, the left
connector is "A" and the right connector is "B". Further, each
connector
has two rows of pins. In my ignorance of DG, I thought that the top row
of pins was "A", and the bottom row of pins is row "B". And each row
has
100 pins ... dumb, dumb!
A simple count from 1 up, would have shown that one row has only 50 pins!
Each connector has all *odd* pins on the upper row and all *even* pins on
the bottom row.
Soooo, what I thought to be B99 (=GND) is actually pin A98, and that is
+5V. It is a good thing that my test leads and hooks are small, so in
case of high currents the power supply will "win", the hook/wire
"loose".
As the computer did not do anything "different", I hoped the power supply
could handle the "semi" short circuit.
With the new insight of how you should count the pins, I had another look
at the BERG header. The GND, RxD and TxD aligned with appropriate pins on
the top row, last series of pins of connector A. It could well be that
the connector (as it was hooked up when I picked up the machine) was not
correct! Also, I seem to remember the system originally had *two* D200s,
but I got only one terminal. Possibly the hooked up terminal was "the
other terminal", not the console terminal ... and the console terminal
would have been connected on the pins of connector A slot #1.
Hmmmm, let's try that. The signals would match as the RxD pin of the
terminal would connect to backplane pin A85 which is TxD, etc.
Another long story short ... :-)
Terminal on, waiting until the screen shows some background light, then
NOVA on (the rest stays off). Hurray! I see an "O" appearing on the
screen and a second or so later, the letter "K" and on the next line
"!000000" and another line with "!" This is exactly what should
happen.
Getting bold now. Trying to boot from disk. So, I switched on the disk
drive. With my ear against the front panel, I can hear a sound that could
be a spindle drive. Then a rather loud "humming", a "click", the
humming
stops and then I can still hear the spindle ... but the READY LED is on.
So, I RESET the NOVA. "OK !000000 !", but that's all, no joy.
"OK", let's
try the floppy disk. I removed the front panel to switch the floppy drive
to be the boot device ... it already is the boot device! No wonder that
nothing happened, because I had no floppy in the drive! Inserted the
"startup" floppy ... nope, no good. As the front cover was removed and
the disk was spinning (I assumed), I set the switch in the other position
so that the hard disk is boot device. RESET the NOVA again. The READY
LED flashes a few times and I get the text "FILENAME ?" on the screen!
I guess that the startup automatically starts the accounting application
as that program asks for a (customer) account file to be opened.
I had a glance over the doc that came with the system, so I "knew" a file
name that I could enter ... DOSINIT. That worked! However, the program
asks for a drive identifier. Not knowing what could happen (wipe disk...)
I aborted the program and switched off the disk and then the NOVA.
All in all a well-spent evening. With good feeling I closed my "museum"
and went back home (to type this).
- Henk
Excellent!
DOSINIT is the DOS disk initialization (file system setup, if you will)
program, so it is good that you stopped. ;)
FILENAME? is the normal DOS prompt, asking for what system file to boot
from disk. It is not coming from the accounting
program.
Instead, try just hitting return in answer to the FILENAME ? prompt -
that will boot DP0:SYS.SV - the default generated operating system.
Responding to the prompt with just "SYS" (no quotes) would do the same
as would DP0:SYS .
See appendix E of 093-00201-00 available on bitsavers (see below).
I have quite a few manuals as well. Versons of some/many of them can be
found on bitsavers in the directory: .../pdf/dg/software/
001035 DG 069-000002-00 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL Introduction to the Real
Time Disk Operating System (RDOS) P BASEMENT 1978
001043 DG 069-000022-01 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL Learning to Use Your
RDOS/DOS System P BASEMENT 1979
001112 DG 093-000075-08 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL Real Time Disk Operating
System (RDOS) Reference Manual P BASEMENT 1979
001125 DG 093-000105-02 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL RDOS User's Handbook S
BASEMENT 1975
001131 DG 093-000109-01 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL RDOS/DOS Command Line
Interpreter User's Manual P BASEMENT 1978
001166 DG 093-000188-02 NOVA, Eclipse MANUAL How to Load and Generate
Your RDOS System P BASEMENT 1979
001190 DG 093-000201-03 NOVA MANUAL Disk Operating System (DOS)
Reference Manual P BASEMENT 1979
001199 DG 093-000222-01 NOVA MANUAL How to Generate Your DOS
System P BASEMENT 1979
So at least now you have some manual numbers (093-......) to hunt for.
JRJ
21 Oct
21 Oct
3:12 a.m.
Well done Sir!!
Knowing the terminal is OK is a real booster.
Regards Rod
On 20/10/2015 20:45, Henk Gooijen wrote:
With thanks to Bruce, Jay and Rod, good news, although
something
has gone wrong first. Learned a few things! Long story ...
As I did not see anything on the Dasher D200 terminal screen, I first
checked the cable, assuming that the terminal did not develop issues
in the years being stored in the attic.
The cable checked out fine, and thus I now know which wires are RxD
and TxD (the cable is just 3 wires, no hardware handshake).
After connecting TxD to RxD anything typed on the keyboard appears on
the screen. So indeed, the terminal is OK.
Moving to the "UNIVERSAL LINE MULTIPLEXER PADDLE BD". Lots of wires are
soldered to this paddle board, but as far as I can see none of those
wires goes to any pin of the card edge connectors of slot #1, the NOVA
processor. I figured that perhaps traces on the backplane lead from
slot #1 to another slot, so I had a better look at the paddle board.
It has 5 identical rows of pins. Each row is 13 pins with pin 4 (or 10
depending where you start counting) removed.
Long story short, I did not see any signals on any pin when the NOVA is
reset.
Using the doc that I got from Bruce (tnx agn!) I tried to find signals
or voltage levels that might be something "RS-232-ish".
Hooked up two thin test wires (with small hooks). One on GND, the other
on the pin that would carry TxD. Stepping to the front of the computer,
where I could press the RESET button, and look at the scope screen.
RESET ... nothing, bummer.
Back to the rear side of the computer to hook up another pin ... smoke!
Smoke was coming from the GND test hook. Power off!
The hook plastic was molten and that produced the smoke. I could remove
the hook from the pin, but the hook is gone and the test hook is gone.
What went wrong?
After a few minutes I came to the conclusion that the pin that I assumed
to be GND was not GND, but something else, and most likely a power supply
pin. Looking again at the schematic drawing, I saw my error :-/
The NOVA has two card edge connectors, seeing from the rear, the left
connector is "A" and the right connector is "B". Further, each
connector
has two rows of pins. In my ignorance of DG, I thought that the top row
of pins was "A", and the bottom row of pins is row "B". And each row
has
100 pins ... dumb, dumb!
A simple count from 1 up, would have shown that one row has only 50 pins!
Each connector has all *odd* pins on the upper row and all *even* pins on
the bottom row.
Soooo, what I thought to be B99 (=GND) is actually pin A98, and that is
+5V. It is a good thing that my test leads and hooks are small, so in
case of high currents the power supply will "win", the hook/wire
"loose".
As the computer did not do anything "different", I hoped the power supply
could handle the "semi" short circuit.
With the new insight of how you should count the pins, I had another look
at the BERG header. The GND, RxD and TxD aligned with appropriate pins on
the top row, last series of pins of connector A. It could well be that
the connector (as it was hooked up when I picked up the machine) was not
correct! Also, I seem to remember the system originally had *two* D200s,
but I got only one terminal. Possibly the hooked up terminal was "the
other terminal", not the console terminal ... and the console terminal
would have been connected on the pins of connector A slot #1.
Hmmmm, let's try that. The signals would match as the RxD pin of the
terminal would connect to backplane pin A85 which is TxD, etc.
Another long story short ... :-)
Terminal on, waiting until the screen shows some background light, then
NOVA on (the rest stays off). Hurray! I see an "O" appearing on the
screen and a second or so later, the letter "K" and on the next line
"!000000" and another line with "!" This is exactly what should
happen.
Getting bold now. Trying to boot from disk. So, I switched on the disk
drive. With my ear against the front panel, I can hear a sound that could
be a spindle drive. Then a rather loud "humming", a "click", the
humming
stops and then I can still hear the spindle ... but the READY LED is on.
So, I RESET the NOVA. "OK !000000 !", but that's all, no joy.
"OK", let's
try the floppy disk. I removed the front panel to switch the floppy drive
to be the boot device ... it already is the boot device! No wonder that
nothing happened, because I had no floppy in the drive! Inserted the
"startup" floppy ... nope, no good. As the front cover was removed and
the disk was spinning (I assumed), I set the switch in the other position
so that the hard disk is boot device. RESET the NOVA again. The READY
LED flashes a few times and I get the text "FILENAME ?" on the screen!
I guess that the startup automatically starts the accounting application
as that program asks for a (customer) account file to be opened.
I had a glance over the doc that came with the system, so I "knew" a file
name that I could enter ... DOSINIT. That worked! However, the program
asks for a drive identifier. Not knowing what could happen (wipe disk...)
I aborted the program and switched off the disk and then the NOVA.
All in all a well-spent evening. With good feeling I closed my "museum"
and went back home (to type this).
- Henk
18 Oct
18 Oct
10:23 a.m.
On 10/17/2015 3:16 PM, Henk Gooijen wrote:
I picked up the NOVA 4 last Thursday. I had help
carrying all the stuff
(disassembled) downstairs from the attic. At home I had to unload the van
single-handed. Went well, although I felt my back that evening ...
Today, I cleaned the rack, as all boxes were still on the floor. There
was little dust, the machine was well taken care of.
After the cleaning I mounted the hard disk drive on the slides. The hard
drive is a model 6101-S2 (12.5 MB fixed disk). On the top plate of the
hard disk is an 8" Qume floppy disk drive mounted. The hard disk and
the floppy disk form one unit, never seen this construction before!
The colored twisted-pair flatcable from the floppy drive goes to the
hard disk and another colored twisted-pair flat cable goes to the
NOVA 4/C computer, connecting on a paddle board using an edge connector.
My Nova 4 and Eclipse S/140 have a 6100 DG winchester hard disk with the
floppy on a hinge sitting over the hard disk, as a single unit. I think
it is the same family as yours (DG calls them "ECHO" in some of the
docs). Mine (I have one on my Nova 4 and one on my S/140) are labelled
"6100" for the model. My controller is labelled "DISC LOGIC NOVA"
10700089102 (you might have to slide the board out to see that
107........ number, but often a flashlight will allow you to see it
while it is still fully in the machine).
See my website: www.pdp-11.nl/dg/nova4/nova4.html
After everything was connected I applied mains. The fans start to run,
so far so good. Then I switch on the NOVA and then the hard disk unit.
The POWER LED on the NOVA and on the hard disk is lit. I can hear the
hard disk "hum", and when the humming sound stops after a few seconds
the READY LED is lit.
If that is the case, then your hard disk is likely pretty functional (it
may not be fully functional, but the READY light is a very very good
sign). If the spindle or head lock were present, then I would not
expect that the READY light would come on.
The humming is the spindle startup. If you hear the disk spinning, then
the spindle is not locked. ;) If the drive is 100% quiet after the hum
part, then there is probably something not right. ;)
However, when I press RESET on the NOVA and then
PR.LOAD, the READY LED
on the disk flashes momentarily (brief), but nothing further happens.
See below regarding the Virtual Console.
On the disk drive are (behind the panel) two small
switches. One has
the text "NORM" and "PROT", the other has several texts (forgotten),
but with that switch you can set the hard disk as device 0 and the
floppy drive device 1, or the hard disk as device 1 and the floppy
disk as device 0. Basically you can set the boot device, as the machine
starts from device 0. I have this from the accompanying documentation.
My 6100 is the same.
When I put that switch in the other position and press
RESET and then
PR.LOAD on the NOVA, the floppy disk LED is lit for a few seconds,
but I do not hear a head load ("clunk"), nor head stepping sounds.
Of course, the floppy drive is loaded with a floppy disk. The label
on the floppy says "opstart" (Dutch for start up). As the floppy disk
access LED turn on, I guess that I can say that the NOVA itself is OK.
As far as I know, I have the BERG connector put back on the pins
where it was before I did the disassembly. That cable connects to the
terminal. The question might be whether it was on the correct pins
for starters. I do not get any character(s) on the Dasher D200 terminal
that came with the system. For that reason, I assume that the terminal
settings match the settings for the NOVA.
My NOVA/4 has a console ROM (DG calls it a Virtual Console - VC) that
works over the serial port. That you are seeing no characters is NOT a
good sign.
The Virtual Console on the Nova/4 is very similar to the S/140, so you
can look at bitsavers .../pdf/dg/eclipse in the S140 Programmer's
Reference for guidance.
So, you might start by seeing if the VC is operating. If it isn't, then
you should presumably fix that first and just leave the disk drive
turned off.
Naturally, the VC "Cells" are different for the S/140. For the NOVA 4:
0-3 AC0 - AC3
4 Return address
5 Stack pointer
6 Frame pointer
7 Bit 15 (LSB) Interrupt enable
10 MAP Status word
11 Switch Register
12 Bit 15 (LSB) is the carry bit
My boot sequence from the virtual console on the S/140 goes like this
(the "!" is the Virtual console prompt - see below)
!11A xxxxxx 1000dd<nl> [<nl> is newline - this loads the switch reg.]
!1000ddL
where "dd" is the device: 33 for the hard disk or floppy (depending upon
the switch setting) and 22 is mag tape. The leading "1" indicates a
"channel" (DMA) device. PR Load presumably does essentially the same thing.
One more remark. On the hard disk is a red label glued. The text on
it says "remove 2 shipping brackets before operating unit unlock
pivot arm (see over)". On the rear side of the label is a drawing
that shows the "front left corner". At the side is a screw (???) to
lock/unlock the head(s). However, I just don't understand the drawing
and cannot localize that screw.
I mailed the previous owner whether he remembers something ...
The spindle lock (shipping bracket, I suppose) is underneath the drive -
where the belt is. You have to take the bottom cover off of the drive.
It has two screws on it. The locked position faces towards the spindle
motor and (I think) a hole in the bracket fits over a locking pin. The
unlocked position is towards the spindle towards the center of the drive.
The head lock is also underneath the drive - where the belt is. You
have to take the bottom cover off the drive. If you follow diagonally
from the motor, past the belt over to the the spindle
and keep going
you will see a little plastic arm, one end of which is on a pin (the
pivot) and the other has (I think) a screw. The locked position (at
least on a 6100) is toward the middle of the drive, and the unlocked
position is towards the edge of the drive.
Anybody has info on the 6101-S2 disk drive? A drawing
of those
shipping rackets, and more info about head locks?
I have doc on the 6100 series, including a copy of the Field Maintenance
manual I can scan it (being a copy, the scan quality won't be as good,
but I'd have to saw my original to scan that in).
I also have a Nova 4/S 4/X field replaceable maintenance manual which
has more info in it than one might think from the title, and probably
has at least some info that would be useful for you (except for the CPU
card itself of course). This is unbound and would not be difficult to scan.
Finally, I have a Nova 4 programmers reference, but those are bound and
would have to be scanned page by page.
Thanks,
- Henk
3350
days inactive
3354
days old
12 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
Bruce＠Wild-Hare.com -
cube1＠charter.net -
henk.gooijen＠hotmail.com -
rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com