26 Dec
2016
26 Dec
'16
10:54 a.m.
I am starting to fill a spare H960 with my PDP8/e system. Starting as
in cleaning
up the rack, sorting out the power controller, etc....
This is a somewhat odd question for me as I don't normally care about
such things,
but I might as well try to get it right...
Anyway, I have one of those plastic banner panels for the top front of
the rack. It's
missing the insert (just the black plastic part), but I would guess
(based on what I
know of the history of the rack) it would have been the magenta one for PDP11s.
Was there a yellow/brown one for PDP8 systems?
If so, is a scan available anywhere?
Is there any way I can get it printed (and onto what) in the UK? I don't have a
large enough printer to do this.
Has anyone made said panels before? How did you do it?
-tony
26 Dec
26 Dec
12:07 p.m.
On 26/12/2016 18:54, Tony Duell wrote:
I am starting to fill a spare H960 with my PDP8/e
system. Starting as
in cleaning
up the rack, sorting out the power controller, etc....
This is a somewhat odd question for me as I don't normally care about
such things,
but I might as well try to get it right...
Anyway, I have one of those plastic banner panels for the top front of
the rack. It's
missing the insert (just the black plastic part), but I would guess
(based on what I
know of the history of the rack) it would have been the magenta one for PDP11s.
Was there a yellow/brown one for PDP8 systems?
If so, is a scan available anywhere?
Is there any way I can get it printed (and onto what) in the UK? I don't have a
large enough printer to do this.
Has anyone made said panels before? How did you do it?
-tony
If you have a picture I'll see what I can do
Rod (Panelman) Smallwood
12:09 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 8:07 PM, Rod Smallwood
<rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote:
If you have a picture I'll see what I can do
Thanks for the offer. But as yet I don't have a picture. I don't even
know that the banner existed.
All I've seen (and got) are the PDP11 ones. I _assume_ there was one
for PDP8 systems, but
assumptions can be dangerous.
-tony
12:34 p.m.
It exists
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102666173
I don't know why that particular one is in the wrong colors
also this style:
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102691355
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102666170
on the short racks
On 12/26/16 12:09 PM, Tony Duell wrote:
I don't even
know that the banner existed.
12:57 p.m.
Yea, that is a weird set of colors. I?ll see if I can take
a picture of mine today and figure out where to post it.
TTFN - Guy
On Dec 26, 2016, at 12:34 PM, Al Kossow <aek at
bitsavers.org> wrote:
It exists
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102666173
I don't know why that particular one is in the wrong colors
also this style:
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102691355
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102666170
on the short racks
On 12/26/16 12:09 PM, Tony Duell wrote:
I don't even
know that the banner existed.
12:44 p.m.
Thanks for the offer. But as yet I don't have a
picture. I don't even
know that the banner existed.
All I've seen (and got) are the PDP11 ones. I _assume_ there was one
for PDP8 systems, but
assumptions can be dangerous.
Hi Tony. Are you talking about the banner for the main system? Or the second rack?
The PDP/8e one looks like this:
http://www.employees.org/~kirk/images/pdp8e.jpg
A few years ago I had an insert printed out at a local Fast Signs store. I scanned an
original that was beat up and created some artwork for the PDP-8e, PDP-11, and a
DECSystem10 one (The first 2 were made from actual H960 rack banners. The last one was a
whimsical one I created for fun.) I am not at home right now, but I can look to see if I
can dig up the art work. I don't have one online of my PDP-8e one, but here are the
other ones:
http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3452.jpg
http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3456.jpg
Todd Paisley
10:33 p.m.
Hi Tony. Are you talking about the banner for the main
system? Or the second rack?
I assume the main rack. My system will fit in a single H960 (It's the
PDP8/e processor,
RK05, RX01, TU56 and PC04). FWIW, my 11/45 is a 2-rack system and I only have
'main rack' logo panels for it. I know the second rack should be
without text, but I have
never done anything about it.
A few years ago I had an insert printed out at a local
Fast Signs store. I scanned an
original that was beat up and created some artwork for the PDP-8e, PDP-11, and a
DECSystem10 one (The first 2 were made from actual H960 rack banners. The last
one was a whimsical one I created for fun.) I am not at home right now, but I can look
to see if I can dig up the art work. I don't have one online of my PDP-8e one, but
here
are the other ones:
http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3452.jpg
http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3456.jpg
I wonder if a sign shop over here could make one from the artwork. It
would be worth
asking, although I guess it would be one some kind of plastic
substrate not the original
aluminium.
-tony
27 Dec
27 Dec
6:25 a.m.
> A few years ago I had an insert printed out at a
local Fast Signs store. I scanned an
> original that was beat up and created some artwork
for the PDP-8e, PDP-11, and a
> DECSystem10 one (The first 2 were made from actual H960 rack banners. The last
> one was a whimsical one I created for fun.) I am not at home right now, but I can
look
> to see if I can dig up the art work. I don't have one online of my PDP-8e one,
but here
> are the other ones:
>
> http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3452.jpg
> http://www.willys-overland.com/rack/100_3456.jpg
I wonder if a sign shop over here could make one from
the artwork. It
would be worth
asking, although I guess it would be one some kind of plastic
substrate not the original
aluminium.
They did it for me in plastic. It was the same thickness as the aluminum. As others have
said, the aluminum is extremely hard to remove from the header. Once it is in the header,
you can't tell if it is plastic or aluminum.
Todd.
28 Dec
28 Dec
4:49 a.m.
On Tue, Dec 27, 2016 at 2:25 PM, paisley at erols.com <paisley at erols.com> wrote:
Does anyonre know what the thickess is? I do not want to try to prise
(pry) the aluminium
panel out of one of my PDP11 header panels and put a micrometer on it.
I wonder if a
sign shop over here could make one from the artwork. It
would be worth
asking, although I guess it would be one some kind of plastic
substrate not the original
aluminium.
They did it for me in plastic. It was the same thickness as the aluminum. As others have
said, the aluminum is extremely hard to remove from
the header. Once it is in the header,
you can't tell if it is plastic or aluminum.
I am sure it would be a lot better than a blank panel, and if I ever
get the right aluminium one,
I could always replace it.
This, of course, is not urgent. I can get the complete system
assembled, debugged, etc. I can
have a blank header for the moment. And if/when I get the banner it's
only 2 screws to take the
header panel down to fit it. And I have other jobs to do...
What I mean by that is that if there is going to be an order for
aluminium ones at a sensible
price then I will hold out for one of those. If they turn out to be
too expensive, then I will see
about a plastic one.
-tony
26 Dec
26 Dec
2:21 p.m.
On 26/12/2016 20:09, Tony Duell wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 8:07 PM, Rod Smallwood
<rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote:
As soon as the girls get back from the Christmas break I'll have a word.
I remember there's way from artwork to high grade decal. The sample I
saw looked like it had been printed.
It wasn't glossy and did not look like a photograph. A suitably shaped
aluminium panel, put your sticky backed decal on it, run it throught a
mangle (a pair of rubber rollers) to get rid of the air and there you go.
Of course I could just use the normal silk screen process as per front
panels. Just change the substrate and off we go.
Rod
If you have a picture I'll see what I can do
Thanks for the offer. But as yet I don't have a picture. I don't even
know that the banner existed.
All I've seen (and got) are the PDP11 ones. I _assume_ there was one
for PDP8 systems, but
assumptions can be dangerous.
-tony
2:28 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 10:21 PM, Rod Smallwood
<rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote:
As soon as the girls get back from the Christmas break
I'll have a word.
THanks.... Needless to say this is hardly urgent. Heck the complete 8/e
system will take time to get sorted out, and that's not urgent. Of course
the banner can go on at any time.
But it would be interesting to know what's possible...
I remember there's way from artwork to high grade decal. The sample I saw
looked like it had been printed.
It wasn't glossy and did not look like a photograph. A suitably shaped
aluminium panel, put your sticky backed decal on it, run it throught a
mangle (a pair of rubber rollers) to get rid of the air and there you go.
That's going to be 'fun'.. I can see myself making rollers and a frame to
hold them. And then tryng to get a bit of sheet aluminium, cut it, round
the corners etc.
-tony
2:48 p.m.
On 26/12/2016 22:28, Tony Duell wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 10:21 PM, Rod Smallwood
<rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote:
I'm a bit better resourced. I already have access to whats needed. Price
could be interesting.
Rod
As soon as the girls get back from the Christmas
break I'll have a word.
THanks.... Needless to say this is hardly urgent. Heck
the complete 8/e
system will take time to get sorted out, and that's not urgent. Of course
the banner can go on at any time.
But it would be interesting to know what's possible...
I remember there's way from artwork to high
grade decal. The sample I saw
looked like it had been printed.
It wasn't glossy and did not look like a photograph. A suitably shaped
aluminium panel, put your sticky backed decal on it, run it throught a
mangle (a pair of rubber rollers) to get rid of the air and there you go.
That's going to be 'fun'.. I can see myself making rollers and a frame to
hold them. And then tryng to get a bit of sheet aluminium, cut it, round
the corners etc.
-tony
10:10 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 10:48 PM, Rod Smallwood
<rodsmallwood52 at btinternet.com> wrote:
Price is one reason for doing it myself. I can see this banner ending up as
the most expensive part of the system (so far that 'honour' goes to an
RX8e board I bought from a reseller about 20 years ago). Another reason
is that having rebuilt just about everything else myself, I am not going to
be beaten by a decorative panel...
-tony
That's
going to be 'fun'.. I can see myself making rollers and a frame to
hold them. And then tryng to get a bit of sheet aluminium, cut it, round
the corners etc.
-tony
I'm a bit better resourced. I already have access to whats needed. Price
could be interesting.
12:55 p.m.
On Dec 26, 2016, at 10:54 AM, Tony Duell
<ard.p850ug1 at gmail.com> wrote:
I am starting to fill a spare H960 with my PDP8/e system. Starting as
in cleaning
up the rack, sorting out the power controller, etc....
This is a somewhat odd question for me as I don't normally care about
such things,
but I might as well try to get it right...
Anyway, I have one of those plastic banner panels for the top front of
the rack. It's
missing the insert (just the black plastic part), but I would guess
(based on what I
know of the history of the rack) it would have been the magenta one for PDP11s.
Was there a yellow/brown one for PDP8 systems?
Yes, I have one sitting on my PDP-8/e system. Just like the PDP-11
panels, they?re ?printed? on an aluminum sheet that?s glued into the
plastic header panel. I haven?t found it easy to remove them from
the plastic header panel without bending the aluminum so it?ll probably
be difficult to get a reasonable scan but others may have better luck
at removing them than I have had.
If so, is a scan available anywhere?
Is there any way I can get it printed (and onto what) in the UK? I don't have a
large enough printer to do this.
I would imagine that the best way to do this would be to have the
image silk screened onto the appropriate material and then insert
that into the header panel.
TTFN - Guy
1:03 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 8:55 PM, Guy Sotomayor Jr <ggs at shiresoft.com> wrote:
OK, at least I am not asking for something that never existed :-)
That sounds non-trivial to do....
-tony
Was there a
yellow/brown one for PDP8 systems?
Yes, I have one sitting on my PDP-8/e system. Just like the PDP-11 panels, they?re ?printed? on an aluminum sheet that?s
glued into the
plastic header panel. I haven?t found it easy to remove them from
the plastic header panel without bending the aluminum so it?ll probably
be difficult to get a reasonable scan but others may have better luck
at removing them than I have had.
I hadn't realised that they were printed on aluminium. Ouch!. I also
don't know how they are fixed to the plastic header panel, my plastic
panel is 'empty' and I don't see any adhesive residue. Maybe some
kind of double-sided tape?
I wonder if something could be done with a good photograph of the
panel?
Obviously I am not asking anyone to damage or risk damaging their
machines for this.
If so, is a scan available anywhere?
Is there any way I can get it printed (and onto what) in the UK? I don't have a
large enough printer to do this.
I would imagine that the best way to do this would be to have the
image silk screened onto the appropriate material and then insert
that into the header panel. 
1:07 p.m.
On Dec 26, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Tony Duell
<ard.p850ug1 at gmail.com> wrote:
No, the aluminum is adhesive-backed (with a rather potent adhesive). It's similar to
what you see in serial number plates on machinery. I have somewhere a PDP-11 banner plate
by itself, with the wax paper backing covering the adhesive still in place. If your
plastic bracket is clean looking, it may never have had the panel stuck to it in the first
place.
paul
...
I hadn't realised that they were
printed on aluminium. Ouch!. I also
don't know how they are fixed to the plastic header panel, my plastic
panel is 'empty' and I don't see any adhesive residue. Maybe some
kind of double-sided tape?
1:14 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 9:07 PM, Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net> wrote:
Odd...The chap who gave me the rack removed the panel (and the fan,
and the stabiliser feet) for transport and gave me a box with them in. He
commented that as I was putting a PDP8e in it, I'd probably not want the
banner that was there (I am pretty sure that the original contents of this
H960 was some kind of PDP11 system).
Anyway, spend the day cleaning dust off parts, stripping the fan and power
controller, etc. I did not notice any adhesive residue on the plastic header
panel. And I think I would have done.
So perhaps the header was blank, or the banner just pushed in (perhaps
somebody forgot to remove the backing paper...).
-tony
On Dec 26, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Tony Duell
<ard.p850ug1 at gmail.com> wrote:
No, the aluminum is adhesive-backed (with a rather potent adhesive).
It's similar to what you see in serial number plates on machinery. I
have somewhere a PDP-11 banner plate by itself, with the wax paper
backing covering the adhesive still in place. If your plastic bracket is
clean looking, it may never have had the panel stuck to it in the first
place. ...
I hadn't realised that they were
printed on aluminium. Ouch!. I also
don't know how they are fixed to the plastic header panel, my plastic
panel is 'empty' and I don't see any adhesive residue. Maybe some
kind of double-sided tape?
paul
1:51 p.m.
On 12/26/2016 04:14 PM, Tony Duell wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 9:07 PM, Paul Koning
<paulkoning at comcast.net> wrote:
Odd...The chap who gave me the rack removed the panel (and the fan,
and the stabiliser feet) for transport and gave me a box with them in. He
commented that as I was putting a PDP8e in it, I'd probably not want the
banner that was there (I am pretty sure that the original contents of this
H960 was some kind of PDP11 system).
Anyway, spend the day cleaning dust off parts, stripping the fan and power
controller, etc. I did not notice any adhesive residue on the plastic header
panel. And I think I would have done.
So perhaps the header was blank, or the banner just pushed in (perhaps
somebody forgot to remove the backing paper...).
-tony
Sounds like the banner plate for my 11T (Qbus 11 in a 50inch rack) the
banner holder was such that it could slid in from the end if you took
off the plastic end stop. It has the PDP-11 in in the older reds scheme
on thin maybe .040" aluminium.
Allison
On Dec
26, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Tony Duell <ard.p850ug1 at gmail.com> wrote:
No, the aluminum is adhesive-backed (with a rather
potent adhesive).
It's similar to what you see in serial number plates on machinery. I
have somewhere a PDP-11 banner plate by itself, with the wax paper
backing covering the adhesive still in place. If your plastic bracket is
clean looking, it may never have had the panel stuck to it in the first
place. ...
I hadn't realised that they were
printed on aluminium. Ouch!. I also
don't know how they are fixed to the plastic header panel, my plastic
panel is 'empty' and I don't see any adhesive residue. Maybe some
kind of double-sided tape?
10:35 p.m.
On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 9:51 PM, allison <ajp166 at verizon.net> wrote:
Sounds like the banner plate for my 11T (Qbus 11 in a
50inch rack) the
banner holder was such that it could slid in from the end if you took
off the plastic end stop. It has the PDP-11 in in the older reds scheme
on thin maybe .040" aluminium.
No, this is the normal plastic banner plate from the H960. It seems to be
a one piece moulding and the banner would be stuck into the recess on
the front. There's no end stop to remove.
-tony
27 Dec
27 Dec
7:15 a.m.
Tony D. wrote:
I hadn't realized that they were printed on
aluminium. Ouch!. I also don't know how they are fixed to the plastic header panel, my
plastic panel is 'empty' and I >don't see any adhesive residue. Maybe some
kind of double-sided tape?
I wonder if something could be done with a good
photograph of the panel?
Obviously I am not asking anyone to damage or risk
damaging their machines for this.
I am in the same situation as Tony with my PDP 8/e system. My system originally came with
a blank black panel at the top, that had a rotary switch placed in the center which would
allow remapping of the three RK05 drives to different unit numbers. It also came with an
additional "blank" black panel (no sign of any adhesive residue either).
I'd love to have the correct insert for the blank panel to put at the top of the
rack.
If anyone (Rod S. (aka Panelman) seems a great possibility) ends up making something that
is reasonably accurate and looks good, I'd sign up to buy one straight away.
-Rick
---
Rick Bensene
The Old Calculator Museum
http://oldcalculatormuseum.com
8:02 a.m.
On Tue, Dec 27, 2016 at 3:15 PM, Rick Bensene <rickb at bensene.com> wrote:
I am in the same situation as Tony with my PDP 8/e system. My system originally
came with a blank black panel at the top, that had a rotary switch placed in the center
which would allow remapping of the three RK05 drives to different unit numbers. It
also came with an additional "blank" black panel (no sign of any adhesive
residue
either). I'd love to have the correct insert for the blank panel to put at the top
of the rack.
Replying to various comments all at once....
I've had another careful look at the black plastic panel. There may be
a little adhesive residue
on it but not much, and if it is, it looks like the sort of glue on
double-sided tape. So perhaps
a non-DEC banner was put there by a previous owner.
The recess measures 18+1/2" by 3+5/16". Just so we all agree on what
is needed. That
was measured with a steel tape measure, nothing more accurate.
If anyone (Rod S. (aka Panelman) seems a great possibility) ends up making something
that is reasonably accurate and looks good, I'd sign up to buy one straight away.
I would too, unless the price is _ridiculous_. Any idea what the price would be?
-tony
2922
days inactive
2924
days old
20 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
aek＠bitsavers.org -
ajp166＠verizon.net -
ard.p850ug1＠gmail.com -
ggs＠shiresoft.com -
paisley＠erols.com -
paulkoning＠comcast.net -
rickb＠bensene.com -
rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com